matter. >> life seems more precious now? >> it's encouraging us to do a lot of things. i think is still pushing us. >> that is off at this edition of dateline. i'm craig melvin. thank you for watching. welcome to the show. and zerlina maxwell. the supreme court this week and to determine that will likely go down in history as one of the most consequential and most destructive ever. this hour, we'll look at all of the repercussions for some of its far reaching -- including immigration, and reproductive freedom. we start by taking a step back to consider our country is different now from when this

began. and where the conservative majority, super majority, frankly, on this court, is taking us. we all know our country has three branches of government. each branch is supposed to restrain the others from exercising too much power their checks and balances. that is actually how all this is supposed to work, but the supreme court is acting as if it has no restraints and as if it is the sole decider with its decision in west virginia versus -- , which on thursday, limited the epa's ability of regulating emissions that cause climate change. as justice elena kagan's dissent, the court does not know how to address climate change, but the quarter points itself, instead of congress or the expert agency, as a decision-maker on climate policy. i cannot think of many things more frightening. unquote.

also can't think of anything more frightening than a rogue supreme court whose ruling has run roughshod over the role of congress, the executive branch, prior to court precedents. and, of course, most important, the fundamental rights of americans. it is dangerous to our democracy. it is also arrogant. as hillary clinton said thursday, at the festival, about the ruling about roe v. wade. >> it's the most arrogant, misreading of history and law that you could ever find. it is so narrow and baseless. >> i found that it was not only ignorant, but almost dismissive to the point of contempt for women's lives and women's choices. if you want the government making these decisions, if you want a state telling women were going to watch, you were going to track you, we're not gonna let you leave the state if you

are pregnant. how might we know that? we might know that they're social media, counselor google searches. think about the level of surveillance and intrusion that we are about to experience. >> joining us now, a journalist from amicus podcast, also president of pro-choice america. dalia, you wrote that this court is showing, quote, a new kind of lawlessness. that is frighteningly untethered from facts, science, and objectivity. unquote. are we the definition of privacy and allows meant to be at home and women should be at peace nowhere. i feel like you can drop the mic there. well that oh for us for the folks at home, in terms of just how extreme and rogue this supreme court. >> do you have a couple of hours? it is a doctoral dissertation.

i think, you know, your initial framing is correct. any one of the seven, eight, nine, 12 major cases that the court decided and it maximalist way this year would have been enough, in a normal term, in a normal term we have one big abortion case. we have one big church state case. but to have every single hot button issue decided, decided as we just heard secretary clinton say with disk contempt, contempt for signs, contempt for precedent and rooted in cherry picked bad history. i mean, been enormity of it, it's almost breathtaking. maybe i'll say we have a think that is shocking. it's that the court was at 25% approval rating. the lowest since polling has begun. hearing the american people shouting, standing outside. saying everything you're doing is hateful and hurtful.

pushing on the accelerator, going more, doing more, furthermore contempt. that part of it is actually scary to me. >> yeah. that's part of this that bill's ex essential. it feels like with the people, the citizen, the person are on the street protesting, as a result of this decision, or voting in upcoming elections, you know, they want to make sure that their voices are heard. but the polling is out on this. right? a culture war is won by this side of choice. but the protests that they're continuing the week after the ruling, despite the fact that public opinion supports abortion rights in this country. the supreme court said, we don't care. folks are getting arrested and acts of civil disobedience. talk about the moment where in terms of the role of activists and stakeholders and pushing our government officials to, at

least, do with they can to respond to with the court trusted. >> especially one of the people that got arrested yesterday. you know, sounds, yeah, a lot of reporters are asking, why. dolly just laid it out. you brought it home. look, we are the majority. we're not functioning as a representative democracy. we're just not. i think we have serious questions about what lawmakers are to do about. that were engaging a very robust discussions are now about white court reform would look like. at the end of the day, we are dealing with a rigged system. we have jury commander just tricks. we have been able to pass rights reform. there are a lot of challenges in the way of our functioning democracy. you know, i say the into the day, all the decisions, i was just on a call with the leaders. we were talking about the continuum of all decisions this week of being really devastated for the decisions we advocated

for. we're going to force pregnant people, birth in the society while we are completely burning the planet. just talking about yesterday's decision. everything is coming out is really extreme. it hurts everyone, as a community. we have to collectively ally with other progressive groups that represent the majority of americans and fight back. you know, we could be in an electoral immediately after the case. that is where we see her sweet spot, at the moment. we really have to challenge the american people. i know it's a hard message to say but when we have the house, the senate, and the white house. but we also need to make sure folks understand who the bad actors are here. with the villains are in the scenario and what is going on with this extremist court. >> i've heard more and more democrats actually adding on to vote. we need two more senators. they've been a little bit more specific in their message. dolly, one thing i've been thinking about is this isn't

the way the founders set this up. as much as this court in the conservatives on the court like to say the founders are all knowing beings. they didn't even set this up this way. the congress and executive branch are failing their obligation to rain in the other branch of government, or at least be a check and balance here. supreme court is behaving as if a path check in balancing is an issue here. so, what can be done in the short and long term to unrig the system, as she said? >> well, i might take issue with one tiny point, zerlina. there -- wishes to massively give disproportionate power to white, world states by way of electoral college that says we can talk about, or the abortion senate saying that places are suppressed. it's time, white this-ism is working exactly as it was

intended. the fact that women and people of color are being clobbered suggests, to me at least, but this is not far from the original dream was. that said, i think where you started it's exactly the place we have to think about. we have a supreme court that just told biden administration, the executive branch, that it does not know how to regulate the clean air. then, if usurped the legislatorssgoing back to many' we need to see people looking around saying, unless we want to live under emperors, these unelected people, it's really the only check left is to start

bickering about whether or not we need to senators are filibuster and get out there and change the system. >> both of you, it's sober to have you. you make an important point. in some ways, this is how they intended her to work. it's not what i think. but, i believe in regional democracy. they did not have me you and you in mind when they were coming up with the plan. thank you, again. please stay safe. >> coming up, how a state attorney general is enforcing or ignoring, in some cases, their states newborn laws in a -- i'll talk to the attorney of john role of delaware what she's doing in her state. in her state alright, limu, give me a socket wrench, pliers, and a phone open to libertymutual.com

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down roe v. wade, states and cities have begun to be a new battleground for reproductive freedom. on the show, we've been speaking to mayors and other officials, people that are taking action at the local level and state level to protect reproductive rights. the state attorney general still -- ag paxton -- to michigan ag nestle, despite pre roe -- delaware ag jenning, who just won a lawsuit requiring the burial or cremation a fetal

remains from abortions or -- so, how aggressive and creative can states and cities be over reproductive protecting reproductive rights? >> thank you for having me on. the answer to that question about how aggressive attorney general should be, the answer is very. democratic attorney general are using every tool we have to protect protect reproductive freedom in our states and across the country. as you mentioned, here in delaware, where abortion rights aren't protected, i just won a lawsuit by brought against the city of seaford to protect its residents and visitors from a cruel, antiabortion ordinance. we are making sure that delaware remains a safe haven for abortion access and reproductive freedom. but no matter how big or smaller state is, the attorney

general has a significant role to play. fighting back against draconian laws that take away your rights. and that is why, as you mentioned, we must reelect democratic colleagues in battleground states like michigan and wisconsin, where ages nestle and call are refusing to defend decades old abortion bans. this is why we must elect pro-choice torney general candidates i es like orgia, arizona and texas. candidates who have vowed to fight against unpopular and restrictive abortion laws. selina, to me, this fight is deeply personal. because for the balance of my career, i have been a prosecutor prosecuting violent crimes. in particular, right cases. rape cases involving adults and rape cases involving children. i know this is an issue near and dear to you as, well.

i will say this, a state banning abortion, even in the case of rape, is troconis unconscionable. children, the majority of children who are survivors of sexual abuse, are sexually beuse by a family member. yet, in the states banning abortion in the case of rape, those children, children's illness 13, 14, 15 years old are forced to carry until the end of their pregnancy trauma in rape cases israel. it is deep and it is enduring. it is unconscionable for any state to add to that trauma. in fact, it is cruel. by banning their right to abortion in those circumstances. and so, i say to everyone.

you have the greatest power football. you have the power to vote in november. we will keep fighting. i know my attorney general colleagues, zerlina. the band together. we are a force of nature. but it is going to take your vote in november, which is critical to elect democratic candidates who will fight to defend your rights. we know, right now, that although we live in the united states of america, that we are country divided. this really has divided us ever more some. but your vote can bring us back together. the majority of americans want women to have this reproductive freedom. and it has been taking away from you by a court and not by the majority. only you can bring it back,

along with, us as we fight this good fight. >> well we have one more minute here. one of the questions people have been asking is the role of 80s and prosecutors and ensuring people are not prosecuted, or criminalized under some of these new bands. speech irresponsibility and how you see your role in preventing prosecutions of medical providers, or even patients in some cases, where there are bands. >> our legislature just took the right action to protect people coming to our state for abortions because we are an annex state. but banning extradition out of our state. it is unclear hump and upon us, attorneys general, to make sure people know their rights. that is why i am convening law firms across our state to help provide pro bono legal counsel to people who come here and providers who provide abortion services to make sure they are

protected. >> ag kathy jennings, thank you so much for being here today. it is important to understand what the attorney generals and states that are access points, as you said, for people traveling from states where abortion is now banned. what you can do to practically protect people. thank you for being here. police say safe. coming up, it's been a really tough week when it comes to the supreme court. as we've been saying. it's not all that bad news. next, we'll talk about the supreme court's decision outlined by administration to and trump's -- remain-in-mexico policy. next.

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t ouour juryry aorneneys hehelpou administration, the supreme court ruled on thursday that in may and a trump era policy that requires asylum seekers arriving at the southern border to wait in mexico while their claims were decided. the policy known as, remain-in-mexico, has been in effect since 2019. since then, thousands of people have been forced to wait for their immigration hearings in unsanitary camps where there has been widespread reports of sexual assault, kidnapping and torture. joining me now to discuss, she's a cofounder of -- maria, what is your reaction to this ruling? i, mean it is the glimmer of good news in a week of bad news. but why was this trump era policy put in place? why is the scene is a good

thing that it is not longer in place? >> basically, what trump did with say -- part of it was because the pandemic. they want to make sure people were processed on the mexico side. but making that like an argument, it takes away from the power the presidency regardless of his holding office to negotiate appropriately with foreign powers. that was the basis over the dismissal from the supreme court. it vacated the remaining mexico policy. sends it back to laura cards. saying that the courts should not decide what power the president of the nine states has when it comes to negotiating with foreign entities. and everyone can agree on. that i think the challenge though is that still need to create some more movement broadly around immigration. the challenge that we're seeing at the border is that it is convoluted. asylum seekers on the border with 11 -- who have lived for more than 20 years. what we're looking for is how the administration now g coupled the crisis of the border, at the same time,

recognizing that 11 million undocumented, half 1 million of them are dreamers. what are we going to deal with these individuals that by all intents and purposes have been pay taxes, i've grown up, you're lived here for at least 15 to 20 years. that is what we need to do. with ministration instead has done is allowed the right to create one group of people. one of that we're talking about two separate populations. >> one of the questions that i have is, there's so much pulling coming out about how democrats or republicans are polling with latinx voters, seen as one big group of people that all think the same thing. looking at this polling data. people are trying to announce this. as we just -- desperately as a people, different goals and circumstances. talk about the political impacts of a decision like. this reversing the policy. where some of these other issues related to immigration like dreamers and how do you think that plays into an

election year? are all of these different groups paying very close attention to these specific issues that impact them directly? >> they remain in mexico policy is going to impact very few voters, quite frankly. again, we're talking about silence years. it just frees up his mission to do the right thing. to follow asylum laws. make sure there is flexibility. however, but we are seeing, and we just recently pulled latinos in eight battleground states. these are red states. talking about georgia. we're talking about arizona, texas. north carolina, pennsylvania. what we found, when they were pulled along the issue of abortion access and guns, they disproportionately believe that people should have access to. it just on the abortion front, for example, the majority of latinos close to 60% of latinos, believe there should be abortion here in this country. that is a private issue. when it comes to guns, it is closer to 81%. this is ruby red states.

i presented this is some folks in administration. they were surprised by it. we latino, we're not surprised. oftentimes, there are tropes that people try to put on our community to basically create some sort of self dealing of why the latino community is more odds with the progressive movement. that is not the case. if anything, this doubles down that there is a lot of alignment. but the challenge, once again, certainly the whodunnit campaigns, there's a failure to invest properly in our communities until the very last minute. and that is when it comes. and that's when the elections [inaudible] >> how to demystifies some of those. even when we look at it, but we've been covering on the show, what's happening in latin america. in some plant american countries that have historically been very conserved on this issue of abortion, they are moving towards expanding abortion access, legalizing abortion. we are going in the opposite direction. i think people are surprised by some headlines like that.

help demystify some misconceptions and rips that we might have in our brain about these communities. and what the truth is. >> selina, do you have time for a drink? >> drinks on me. [laughs] one of the reasons that latinos are so effective at the way that we do our work, we are not surprised by this data we have identified young latinos in particular who believe that they should have agency over their bodies. we believe that climate change is real and we should address it. we also believe everybody should not have a gun. part of it is because we are high victims when it comes to this type of deregulation when it comes to guns. it comes to the challenges of the environmental reality. brown and black people are at the forefront of the suffering

from that. who is a chance to be economically free because we choose who we love, the agency of our bodies, those are all issues that are on the forefront because 60% of latino voters are under the age of 33. we are talking about a generation of difference between white voters and latino voters. they are all living in the present. and people are surprised, i am surprised that they are surprised. we don't have enough conversations around this that can basically dispel these myths. they are absolutely ginned up in many cases by the right, because that is all that we hear in the media and in our headlines. part of it is the democratic political class think it's a lot of currency if they say latinos are too hard to invest, and because they're a lot more comfortable in their own little sandbox. >> yeah i has some thoughts

about the political class. we are definitely getting a drink, maria teresa, thank you so much for being here. we will continue to have this conversation all of the time, because this is my show and i have conversations people aren't having. that's what we're doing here. [laughs] thank you for being here, please stay safe. coming up, my body my choice has barely been a phrase that applies to black women, friday's decision makes that even more true. next i will talk to a lot decision about the decision and the lack of a bodily autonomy that black women have over their bodies. we will be right back. l be right back. we're talking artisan italian bread, made fresh daily! the only thing fresher than their bread is the guy reading this. subway keeps refreshing and refreshing and refreshing and re- your record label is taking off. but so is your sound engineer. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates

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woman being mine has not always been true. it was not even in the original version of the constitution. it had to be added and later. it may be naive to think that as we lived through this moment, where the constitutional right

to an abortion and to bodily autonomy has been taken away from us. it would be impossible for the u.s. to continue reversing women's rights. in the new york times op-ed, -- lays out the argument that the supreme court will ignore the intent for bodily autonomy for black women in the 13th and 14th amendment. additionally, she argues that the horrors inflicted on black women during slavery have been all but wiped from cultural and legal memory. -- joins me now, she is a professor at the university of california irvine. i am so excited to have this conversation. professor, you also know in your piece that black women's force pregnancies were a part of slavery. use a quote -- force reproduction was queen. help us understand how black women historically have never

had the right to bodily autonomy, at least up until the reconstruction amendment. >> thank you so much for having me on your show, and it is a grave error in how we have interpreted history that we fail to take into account what everybody knew. that is, as a foundational matter, black women with a subject of kidnap, labor trafficking, of sex trafficking that was a part of white american slavery was. it was explicitly the denial of bodily autonomy and liberty to make decisions about whether one wanted to labor in a certain way. very specifically for black women, it was not just about picking cotton or working in the fields with sugar cane, but it was expression -- explicitly sexual assault and

forced to be reproducing against their choice. it was spoken about by members of, dissent and black women are particularly -- how oppose they were to this. famously in her speech, -- said that i bore 13 children and i saw each of them is not for my arms and nobody heard my cry. but god, ain't by a woman? >> it is really important to have all of that in your mind as you think through the moment that we are currently and. and you consider some of these arguments that are put forward by the justices in the majority. do you consider forced birth a form of involuntary servitude. i think people have made the point that you are forcing people to go into labor, literally. >> that is absolutely right. some would say that with they could see in the 13th amendment

is opposed rape. explicitly in the tests, it abolish slavery, and involuntary servitude. that means mandated pregnancies that black woman did not want. it wasn't just the rage themselves, but it was also understood that black woman's reproduction was maximizing for people who did not care for their lives and who, in fact, fought to keep them designated as property. the biggest states -- debates that took place in the 13th and 14th amendment is -- in these very same states with these abortion laws. it keeps black women designated as property. that's exactly what they wanted, that's the only status that they wanted for black women. as, such the property was that their wombs would be property. black women were essentially seen as higher and status then

a pig, sheep, or a cow in the fields. this is why it was being written about. >> it is so important, american history in that vein. you make a connection between the ruling back of american history and the attacks against critical race theory. the fact the people of misunderstanding in misinterpreting what the supreme court decision means. how it relates to the history. >> it is unfortunate perfect one that we see. that is on the desire to pay over these critical aspects of american history. it can inform us so much about this very time today. it is a tragedy for our democracy that we see not only the attacks on the new jim crow where there is a free state and

not free states, but we also see attacks on the first amendment, people not supposed to talk about history than evolves indigenous people, black people, and the suffrage movement. at the same, time we see such great ignorance as it relates to our history. one point that i will make that stitches so much of this together, when we think about the story of margaret garner, she is the subject of the book called beloved, written by tony morrison. i can tell a lot about the time that we are in. she escaped from slavery, kentucky, a place that is an active antiabortion legislation, and she did it in the middle of the night and the thick of winter and she crossed a river by foot. they had mules with them, and with her children, she began trying to kill her children when she heard the hounds and dogs coming with her and the air. she began trying to fill the man herself. she was later charged with murder, and the question around

the world it was debated all around the world, was she human? if she was human, she could stand trial for murder. if she was just property, then she could be returned to slavery. the result after asking that question was that she is just property. the systems could continue because if margaret -- were deemed a human being, that would mean black women would be free and free of this subordination. >> this is why i love talking to professors. professor michelle goodwin, thank you so much for helping us understand american history and the context of this moment. please stay safe. coming up, you might remember this texas high school valedictorian who went viral after she change her speech talk about abortion rights. i will ask her next how she

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♪ [jingle] it -- valedictorian delivered a speech that went viral. here's some of what she said. >> i have dreams, i have hopes, i have ambitions. every girl graduating today

does. we have spent our entire lives working towards our future and without our input, without our consent, our control over that future has been stripped away from us. i am terrified that if my contraceptives fell, i am terrified that if i am raped, that my hopes and aspirations and efforts for my future will no longer matter. >> following her speech, i spoke with the texas team paxton smith to learn more about why she changed her speech at the very last minute to address the abortion ban in her home state. when you later, abortion rights and not only the state of texas, but in the entire country have been upended by the supreme court. i want to welcome back to the show, abortion activist paxton smith, the valedictorian. excellent, how have you've been processing the courts ruling to overturn roe. you obviously understood the

importance of the moment when you made your speech. >> honestly, it's been a lot of fear on my side and sadness on my side. looking at the world that we've just stepped and to really. my home state is criminalizing abortion within the next 30 days, which means the people who provide abortions can be spending up to life sentences and present, neighboring states are banning abortion as well, and states are trying to pass laws so that you can't make it -- make it so that you can't travel to other states to get abortion care. the passing laws to make it so that medication, abortion cannot get mailed to you. it is a very scary time to be looking at. to see that even the options that we thought we had open to us before, they are completely gone. for everyone. >> i'm really curious what kind of conversations you have been

having in the last week with your peers, other people who are in your age group. one of the facts about this moment is that there is nobody alive of reproductive age who knows a world without the right to legal abortion. one of the discussions you've had amongst your peers and friends in the past week. >> people are very angry, they are coming out of the disbelief that the overturning of roe v. wade was not a possibility. but i've seen a lot of as well is that a lot of my peers are wanting to step up and get more involved in the movement. there's also some of my fears we are coming out of the shells and environments where they did not necessarily feel like it would be socially accepted for them to step up and fight for these rights. they are coming out of their shells and fighting for them even with the social backlash that comes with it. >> in a state like texas, i think that is a really

important point. and a conservative state where you have a mixed bag of conservative people, it could be socially ostracizing to come out and say no, i support the right to choose. but even telling a friends that may express some hesitation and as you said, stepping up and getting involved on this issue. also, other issues that are important to your generation. >> well, i just think at this point in time, it is absolutely essential that we step up and then we get involved. i think a lot of people have been sitting on the sidelines and just watching and hoping for the best to come with what happened with roe v. wade. that many people fighting for their rights, -- i don't think it's very surprising that the right got taken away in the first place. i think it is essential that if people want that right back, that they are willing to get out and fight. if we do not, it is not going to fall and our laps. that is not how it is going to

work. >> paxton smith, great to have you on again, please stay safe. >> coming, up in a week of life-changing supreme court opinions, i will talk to a young climate activists about how the nation's top course -- court dealing with the epa will impact our efforts to reduce climate emissions, we will be right back. (other money manager) different how? you sell high commission investment products, right? (fisher investments) nope. fisher avoids them. (other money manager) well, you must earn commissions on trades. (fisher investments) never at fisher investments. (other money manager) ok, then you probably sneak in some hidden and layered fees. (fisher investments) no. we structure our fees so we do better when clients do better. that might be why most of our clients come from other money managers. at fisher investments, we're clearly different. the unknown is not empty. it's a storm that crashes, and consumes,

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dealt a major setback to the biden administration's ambitious climate agenda, limiting some of the environmental agencies abilities to -- under the clean air act. the court decision was -- and some fear their ability to regulate emissions from individual fire plant -- our plants, but climate activists are turning to businesses and states to help combat climate change. this decision is a very big deal and i'm joined by -- who is the founder of the youth lead climate activist groups. you tweeted that the supreme court is a deadly threat to our earth and all life on it. how are you feeling after thursday's ruling. >> i agree with what congresswoman aoc and many others have said, which is that this is a judicial coup at this point. the judicial branch is

absolutely overreaching in their power. they are completely overturning with the majority of people want and what is good for the people, but it's the will of the people with the decisions that roe v. wade, with wet goes against basic common sense safety and majority decisions. overrning things, taking away basic rights and progress to the points where this is a clear dissent and to fascism if we don't take serious action. i study fascism a lot. my grandpa was a world war ii veteran and my dad side were jewish, and i grew up learning a lot about nazi germany and other fascist regimes and things like that because of how the people in my family have lived through and seen and state history so well. the important things to remember that it can happen here. everybody is like oh, but never us. the united states, but we are

already seeing this fucontrol over our own bodies, bodily autonomy, health care. this pro-life supreme court is killing people. people are going to die because of these decisions. not just because of the roe v. wade overturning, but because of the ruling against gun control, because of a ruling against -- who rules against something against something called the clean air act? that's gonna kill people! for millions of people die of air pollution and other types of pollutants and diseases caused by them. these pro-life people have blood on their hands. >> it's a really good point about who is against the clean air and clean water act, and one of the things that i'm thinking a lot about as well is that even how we frame this decision, there's a lot of headlines that are sort of like, a loss for the biden administration, or a loss for climate activists, or aoc is a

big loser. i could think about the fact that, protecting the planet is not about politics. speak to this idea that your generation is looking beyond partisan spectrum, the partisan debate about climate but at the end of the day, it is about the science and protecting the planet. >> this is absolutely ridiculous, and these people who also breathe air and drink water, i am assuming that they also do not want that water to be contaminated and cause diseases. these people are, like big loss for the activists, this is aoc hurting right now. so is everyone who breeze air. if you breathe fair, then i suggest you be concerned. do you drink water? do you eat food? the worst thing that the climate -- climate crisis is how it impacts farming, resources,

diesel prices for everything has been going up? inflation and all of these things? that's only going to get worse and worse as resources become one more scarce. violence only goes up as resources get more and more scarce. the combination of this with this fascist fundamentalist fearmongering is very dangerous because dictatorships, fascist leaders, autocrats, all of these people take power when things are unstable, when the people are panicking and they're like, i will be your savior. a lot of that comes with resource depletion which causes more violence, causes more economic insecurity, people are more desperate and afraid. people are going to give up any freedom just to be safe. >> it is all connected, what we need is the ability to effect change, and otherwise you don't have democracy, thank you so much for being here and is great to have you. that does it for me, i'm zerlina, you can find me monday through friday streaming on peacock and the msnbc hub, be sure to follow us on facebook,

twitter, tiktok, and youtube, and more news is coming up right here on msnbc. this is the katie fang, show live from miami florida. we have lots of news to cover, and lots of questions to answer, so let's get started. nbc news confirming cassidy hutchinson was one of the witnesses contacted by trump. in an apparent effort to influence her january six testimony. new details about who urged her to, quote, do the right thing. and whether this is a clear case of witness tampering. msnbc legal analyst barbara mcquade is standing by. plus, liberals still reeling from the supreme court's stunning decisions from this