consequences of the supreme court's decision. since the court handed down insulin on june 24th, we've seen access to abortion shrink across the country. these are the states that have already, or likely will soon, ban abortion, the nine states you see there in the dark, that's what's already been done. abortion care is no longer provided at all. legal abortion is nearly nonexistent in most of the south. additionally, there are now six states, with new restrictions that have gone into effect since roe is overturned. six-week abortion bans are not alone for those states including ohio, with the case of the ten year old rape victim, has drawn national attention. a six-week ban is a near total ban, many people would not even know they're pregnant at that stage. ohio's near total abortion ban does not include exceptions for victims of rape or incest, which meant that the ten-year-old girl had to travel to indiana for an abortion. since speaking out about this

case, dr. caitlin bernard, the indianapolis-based physician who took care of the young girl, she's been the target of threats and smears including from indiana's republican attorney general, who said he'll be investigating her. none of this is new to dr. bernard, or to many other abortion providers. they've been the targets of threats for years, back in 2020, doctor bernard stopped offering her services to a clinic after the fbi alerted her employers that a kidnapping threat had been made against her daughter. there is in fact a long history of violence against abortion providers in this country. according to the national abortion federation, there have been 11 murders, nearly 500 assaults, 42 bombings, and 196 artisans directed at abortion clinics and at volunteers since 1977. the threat of violence has been increasing for years. last week, tammy coleman oscar, the director of north dakota's

last remaining abortion clinic spoke of the threats that her clinics have recently experienced. >> people are scared, our staff are concerned. escorting, we have amazing escorts, but we've seen an uptick in protesting outside of red clinic. we had some people say that the escorts fingers should be cut off. we had a man sitting across the street in a truck for hours on end. the only way i can describe him is he looked like someone who participated in the january 6th insurrection. so, there's real fear there for our safety. and we're just being as careful as we can. >> beyond the threats from involving antiabortion activists, the supreme court's decision is affecting medical treatment. sometimes resulting in delayed care. according to the associated press, one abortion clinic in ohio, quote, received calls from two women with up topic pregnancies, who said their doctors wouldn't treat them.

and ob/gyn in texas also told the ap that doctors whose patients developed pregnancy complications are struggling to determine whether a woman's, quote, sick enough, sick enough, to justify an abortion. joining me now is -- she is the senior correspondent for new york magazine and coauthor of the book, notorious rpg, the life and times of ruth bader ginsburg. thank you so much for joining me. i appreciate it. yesterday you tweeted about specifically about the women in ohio, the up topic pregnancies, whose doctor wouldn't treat them in a thread related to that you wrote, quote, every predicted worst-case scenario has already shown up in the reporting, plus a few i never even heard anyone warned of. that line kind of caught me. i've been reporting on this for a while. what's caught you by surprise and what were you referring to in that we? >> well, sam, you know, i

didn't know, i knew the third we impacts on non abortion related medical care, because anybody who has a reproductive system, who can get pregnant, knows that these are many of the same treatments, whether you have what's called an elective abortion or whether you need emergency medicare for pregnancy may want to keep. you know, i didn't know that the most common medication for auto immune disease, like lupus, would suddenly be denied to people who are not even pregnant, just because they could become pregnant someday. i knew that for years pharmacists have used their own conscience rights, tried to replace them with medical judgment and denied people who have miscarriages, certain medications because they think they might be self inducing abortions, that i knew. i think the tentacles of this opinion have been so widespread, there is so much fear out there, it's pharmacists, i'm urgency medical providers, the boards of hospitals that make these

kinds of decisions. when it comes to this kind of emergency care, you, know the seconds make a difference. the reporting in the ap in the washington post and local publications shows that even the time people are spending worrying about whether they're in compliance with these laws, it's delaying urgency care to people who become gravely ill, including being put on a breathing machine, because there is fear and ambiguity in what is allowed and what isn't. >> yeah, i mean, a woman bleeding out for ten days after a miscarriage is dramatic and terrifying, honestly. it's gonna probably result in the death at some point. let me switch a little bit to the politics of this. so, politically, the antiabortion, their mo is that they refrain from proposing any laws that would punish the pregnant person, that was what they said, we're not gonna punish the pregnant person. instead, these laws were crafted with the intent of punishing the provider.

but, you know, in essence, it's a lose lose situation, right? if you're punishing a doctor, you create things, you create instances like what we saw on wisconsin. which in turn punishes the patient. so, is this the design, essentially? is the design, essentially, to intimidate the doctor and the patient from even entertaining abortion because of the spectrum of having something like, you might bleed out for ten days? >> so, i think there's two things that are important here from a certain policy making, lawmaking, and political perspective. yes, absolutely, there's a chilling effect on the medical providers that people need access to in order to whether they want abortion, whether they need emergency medical care, up topic pregnancy, another conditions that require the same medications. yes, you can't find $1 -- doctor willing to help, you on paper you are not allowed to be prosecuted. the other aspect is that even before roe v. wade, women have been prosecuted, individual men

have been prosecuted because they are suspected of intentionally ending a pregnancy. it happened in indiana, multiple times women attempted to commit suicide or tried to end the pregnancy on their own, they were prosecuted, they went to jail. so, it takes one prosecutor, even if down the road you could say, wait, that's not the law. i think what we're seeing here is that, you know, with these cases of emergency medical treatment, i've been seeing a lot of antiabortion writers and activists saying, this is wrong, ectopic pregnancy -- emergency miscarriages have a -- i think it's important to drill down on what it is they mean. on paper, the law may say one thing, but when is somebody critically ill enough to qualify? how comfortable does the doctor feel going out on a limb when the attorney general of indiana's going on fox news threatening to prosecute someone who, as far as we know, followed every required regulation? again, as you say, not only

will this created chilling effect that will impact and already is impacting individual medical care, but it also, it stretches beyond. the second thing i think is really important to point out, is that these laws are not written this way by accident, there is a long move in the anti-abortion movement to have the narrowest possible exceptions, not just the ones that are politically contentious like rape and incest, very young children, in which many americans instinctively say, wait a minute, how is that not covered? also the scope of the emergency requirements. for the longest time, there's been a belief that if you have a health exception to an abortion ban or an abortion regulation that is able to go into effect before roe, women are just gonna go crazy and have abortions whenever. they'll say, oh, my mental health. john mccain, in the 2008 presidential debate, put women's health in scare quotes. paul ryan said that an

exception for women's health in the so-called abortion ban, he said it was an exception so wide you could drive a mack truck threat. so, these laws, they had plenty of time to drop them, they intentionally made these extremely narrow exceptions because they wanted, they thought that women would, quote, take advantage of these loopholes in order to get abortions. >> well, the flip side of this, which i think was demonstrated in a congressional hearing this week, is that the anti-abortion movement has been caught a little flat-footed about what's happened in the post-roe landscape. about what'we had a witness tet in the case of the ohio girl, that she did in fact qualify for the exceptions, in reality. not only thy, they didn't qualify that as an abortion because her health was at risk. it leads to an obvious question, okay, if you believe that for a ten year old, why not an 11 year old, why not a 12-year-old, went out a 13-year-old, when all cases of rape? i guess my question for you,

are you surprised, a little bit, yes, you're right that they crafted these laws with extreme specificity, are you surprised a little bit by how caught off guard they've been trying to have to defend and explain these laws? >> it's a good question, i mean, i think, to be honest, the 15-week abortion ban that came before the supreme court, they thought they could focus on stigmatizing later abortions. i don't think they thought until the last year and a half of the everything that they wanted all at once. i also think that they haven't had to explain their most unpopular views yet. again, they've been focusing on wedge issues that pole particularly well with the majority of americans. i have to say, things i haven't seen, yet she not only claims that that child could've gotten abortion, this is the president of americans united for life, sam, you know this is one of the most significant anti abortion groups, they write the laws, they write the model playbook, this is not some random person on the street who happened to end up before congress, she's a powerful

leader and anti-abortion movements. she said that it's not an abortion. i think that the politics of that are her trying to say it's not an abortion because most people think that that ten year old should've gotten the medical care that she needed. i just don't know how to deal with this, when they said it's on abortion. that was new to me. usually those it's not abortion if it's, you know, there's fetal demise, there needs to be -- or something like that. this was an abortion that somebody needed. all abortions, an individual needs them if they choose that. so, you know, i do think that, one, they were not ready to get everything they wanted so quickly, the supreme court handed it to them. to, they are not used to explaining the most difficult parts of the consequences of their actions, the most politically unpalatable ones. also, i get that question, it may matter at the margins, but the supreme court has handed the anti-abortion movement on such a broad mandate, and continues to find ways to inflict them from political

accountability, whether it's reading political rules or giving them a blank check. i do think it's a moment of sunshine to say, it's not that there is no rape exceptions, is that emergency medical care is being threatened here. this is something that people warned about before, and they were told they were hysterical. unfortunately, people who need emergency medical care are paying the price right now. >> thank you so much for walking us through these incredibly complex and difficult issues, we appreciate your time today. thank you. i'm joined now by dr. -- she is the ob/gyn at maternal fetal medical doctor at a center in ohio. which as we just noted, is the epicenter of one of the most high-profile cases currently in a post-roe landscape. doctor, thank you so much for being here. it's been a little over three weeks since roe is overturned, how enacted its six-week band, i guess the simplest question is, were you prepared for that? it happened pretty abruptly, we

knew it could be coming. did you and your colleagues consult with lawyers ahead of the supreme court ruling? yeah, are you prepared? were you prepared? >> thank you for having me, sam. as a high-risk pregnancy physician, we had seen this coming for a while, we didn't exactly expect the impacts to come so fast. when roe fell on friday morning at ten, we thought we had a few weeks before the injunction on espy 23 would be reversed. we didn't, it went into effect that night. so, we didn't have as much lead time as we did. we wanted to think about what exactly would happen, how the chips would fall before we started making plans. we didn't know exactly how the supreme court was going to rule, even though we had seen the leak, things could change. so, since then, it has been, it's been chaos is not the right word, it's been very difficult to provide care and to provide, to just go to work

every day and fear. these bras written by people who have absolutely no knowledge of medical care are endangering our patients. it is very difficult every day to face our patients and tell them that. >> let me, we just went through a couple articles about the granular disruptions that are happening for people who are providing maternal care. i am actually very curious, how you have changed your operations, do you literally consult with lawyers? are their lawyers on staff who in realtime are saying, no, you can't do this, yes, this might be kosher under the law? is that now how you operate? >> that's exactly how we're operating. things that three weeks ago i was making my medically sound evidence based decisions on, things i knew where the correct way to proceed to care for a patient, now, when we know that's the right way to make a

decision, we are calling the lawyer first. saying, hey, we need to do this, is it okay if i proceed? we're not lawyers, were physicians. we are very educated on medical matters, but not on the law. so, because of the confusion created by a, we have to call the lawyers before we can make any decisions now. >> have you seen a similar situation like the one described in wisconsin, where a woman has a miscarriage, the doctors do not feel they can legally help her because of the new bans on abortion? therefore she's bleeding out for ten days, have you seen something like that in ohio yet? >> i have not directly seen something like that, but i am not surprised. these laws are written so vaguely that they, and they do not allow for the nuance of medical care. you know, they talk about being able to take care of patients if there is imminent threat, they did that with that ten-year, -old they said, oh, she could've had it in ohio. but at baseline, pregnancy has a threat, right? in ohio, it is 19 per hundred

thousand births is gonna result, 19 per hundred thousand births will result in deaths. so, at baseline there's a threat. can i do abortions or provide abortions or firfer portions for all of those patients? does the threat have to be 30%? 50%? does it to be dying in front of me? there is just no clarity on that whatsoever. our medical judgment will not suffice, because they've clearly told us in these laws that are medical judgment does not suffice. we have to follow their laws. >> this is a little bit of a downstream effect, but i'm curious for your response, i guess, in the spirit of transparency i should reveal that my mom is a gynecologist, was an obstetrician, i have some familiarity with this. as a career, you know, recruiting future people to the profession, strikes me that with this type of legal uncertainty, the potential for criminal prosecutions, it's gonna be a lot harder to convince people to enter the

profession. i'm wondering if younger gynecologists and obstetricians are already professing that they feel uncomfortable and are maybe looking to leave? or if you are fearful that you'll have essentially what is amounting to a brain drain where people just don't want to deal with this, they don't bother the coming ob/gyn's? >> yeah, everything you just said. i think we're hearing all of that, we're hearing my colleagues say that they're gonna move out of this day, or start working in other states, at least part time. i am definitely hearing from medical students and residents choosing not to come to the restrictive states. it's not just about, you know, personal professional safety, or get into that in a second. it's also about the training they're going to receive. they need to be able to have the full scope of medical education and obstetrics and gynecology to be able to work in all the places and have all the options available to them. coming to ohio and other states

with such restrictions, it will limit their ability to get the education, to get that training. whether you're doing it for a patient who wants an abortion for, you know, their personal reasons, or you're doing in an emergency, the procedure is the same. if it's not taught, they don't know how to do it regardless of the circumstances. as far as professional uncertainty goes, medicine is a stressful career, as you probably have heard from your mother. there's things that were considering all the time is caring for patients. add to the stress of now the care that i'm supposed to give my patients, they might lend me in jail, and by making the right decisions? i am constantly balancing my oath, my oath to do no harm with my safety of ending up in jail. that is a lot to ask of physicians. >> extremely stressful, i can imagine. doctor, thank you so much for joining us. really appreciate you walking us through this very delicate and difficult time. good luck going forward.

>> thank you. >> all right, we've got a lot more ahead. the january six committee has one member on its agenda, it's 187, that's the number of minutes that trump was notably quiet as a violent mob bombarded the capitol. and, the nation is already bracing for a trump 2024. oh my god, 2024, what to expect for the next run for the white house, that's ahead. plus, right after the break, president joe biden wrapped up his first presidential trip to the middle east yesterday. garnered widespread criticism back home, especially from that greeting, will discuss all of that next. , will discuss all [whistling] o that next.

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comcast business. powering possibilities. every search you make, every click you take, every move you make, every step you take, i'll be watching you. the internet doesn't have to be duckduckgo is a free all in one privacy app with a built in search engine, web browser, one click data clearing and more stop companies like google from watching you, by downloading the app today. president biden is back in duckduckgo: privacy, simplified. washington after failing to secure any major commitments during a trip to the middle east. criticism often overshadows progress. on the final day of his trip, he attended a regional summit held in --

jeita, saudi arabia, where he met with several arab heads of state. well there's not much talk of american efforts to increase oil up, it responds to russia's war in ukraine, biden also focused on china and vowed to limit its expanding influence in asia. >> the united states is going to remain an active and engaged partner in the middle east. as the world grows more competitive and the challenges we face are more complex, it's only becoming clear to me that how closely the interests are with the successes of the middle east. we will not walk away, and leave a vacuum to be filled by china, russia, or iran. >> now, president biden caught the most criticism back home for his meeting with saudi crown prince mohammed bin salman, mbs for short. he greeted mbs with a fist bump

on friday. he appeared to fall short on his promise to hold the kingdom accountable for the gruesome murder of washington post journalist and saudi critic, jamal khashoggi. not to mention a litany of other human rights abuses committed by the saudi kingdom. joining me now to discuss this all is democratic representative, -- she's a member of the foreign affairs committee, congresswoman, thank you so much for joining us. really appreciate it. you've been a vocal critic of saudi arabia. sort of curious what your thoughts were when you saw that president brighten was going to meet with envious. what did you make of both the greeting and the meeting? >> well, thank you so much for having me, sam. going from calling mbs a pariah toughest bumping him, it was really disappointing. this whole trip sends the wrong message to human rights defenders and to the values

that we say we have in upholding human rights. the president ran on an agenda, a foreign policy agenda that said we were going to center human rights. now, to be meeting with mbs, who really is a human rights violator, who has tortured, killed, descendants and dissidents and anyone who advocates for democracy and for human rights, especially for women's rights, who has waged a brutal war in saudi arabia, who blockaded, starved, and, you know, is currently causing devastation to millions of yemenis, it's really devastating big. you know, we have to stop this

process of saying we are going to do one thing on foreign policy and then doing the opposite. it messes with our credibility, it sends the wrong message. i think it changes the way people view us around the world. >> yeah, i want to read you a quote by the saudi political analyst, -- who summarizes what he sees as the purpose of the biden trip. the quote is this, the other parts of the trip were just putting out the real reason biden came to the middle east, which is the meeting, which is meeting prince mohammed. biden has realized that saudi arabia isn't just reliant on america anymore, as important relationships with china and russia to. those countries saw weapons and have influence on iran that the u.s. doesn't have. the fact remains that if you want anything done in the middle east you can't just ignore saudi arabia. so, let's take that to a

logical extension. you know, is that real-ism? is what biden did a realist foreign policy saying, look, i don't like saudi arabia, i believe they're a pariah state, i don't believe mbs is a good faith actor, i believe he committed or ordered the murder of jamal khashoggi, but this is the world i have to operate on me? >> i can understand that sentiment. i don't think it is realistic for us to give credibility to mbs as the president has promised to make him a pariah. we have to be willing to take stances, even if they are difficult in doing the right thing. we want to be a country that has moral standing when it comes to the defense of human rights, as we've said with ukraine and other places. we have to be a country that is

interested in advancing democracies. none of those things were accomplished with this trip, none of those things are accomplished with the message this trip sends. none of those things were accomplished with this merck that the saudis now have on their face as they look at this as a country who is vulnerable and willing to do anything to appease the saudis. >> right, the other thing that biden did on his trip, among other things, he went two and visited the west bank. he made this interesting historical parallel, he talked about the similarities to the irish, in his words, subjugation by the british. he compare that historically with what's happening between the palestinians and the israelis. announcing some economic relief and help for hospitals. i'm kind of curious what your thoughts were on that quote from biden and whether you think he sufficiently addressed

the plight of the palestinians with that visit? >> it just shows like that but may be helpful sentiments for folks who are struggling. but i think that palestinians are interested in concrete actions toward their self determination. i don't think that, you know, lip service alone is helpful. are, we have more, we have allowed, truly, for the occupation to continue for settlements, to expand, the fact that the president did not go to israel and the west bank and make it very clear that we are going to be pushing for palestinians to have self

determination for their rights to be restored, for the occupation to end, for settlements to stop, i think is a disappointment to the palestinians. it's a disappointment to those who care about advancing the rights of palestinians. >> congresswoman, a very quick question. totally different topic. i want to get your thoughts to the scuttling of a major climate deal by senator joe manchin. all but assuring that climate will not be addressed in this congress, and perhaps for years and decades to come, until democrats get another trifecta congress in the white house. >> i mean, it's really disappointing, not surprising. we knew when the build back better agenda was decoupled that this was ultimately going to happen. i don't know why senator, senate majority leader chuck

schumer still allows for manchin to be the chair of the energy committee. i don't know why our party hasn't decided to, you know, make the case and pressure manchin to do the right thing. advancing the democratic agenda and the presidents agenda. i think we ultimately have to come to terms that what we are doing at the moment, and the way that we are dealing with manchin isn't working in advancing the democratic agenda and the presidents agenda. so we must change course. >> all right, democratic congresswoman from minnesota, thank you so much for joining me this morning, i really appreciate it. >> thank you. >> now, you can do a lot and 187 minutes, 187 minutes, yes. but if you're donald trump, you can do nothing at all, january six committee plans to get to the bottom of what the former president was doing as an angry and violent mob stormed the

capitol. and violent mob stormed th capitol. what do you want to be remembered for? that's your why. it's your purpose, and we will work with you every step of the way to achieve it. ♪♪ turning now to the january 6th

investigation. or just days away from the eight and potentially final public hearing from the house select committee investigating the attack. primetime hearing is set to focus on what's, liz cheney, calls the 187 minutes that donald trump did nothing while the insurrection is ongoing. everything bringing together with the committee has laid -- out thursday's hearing will take place just over a week over the last public hearing. which focused on the far-right extremist groups that participated in the insurrection. also, the direct and indirect coordination between those groups and several of the former presidents people. that hearing also featured video testimony from former white house counsel, pat cipollone. comes as the secret service says it is cooperating with the

select committee. friday, issued a subpoena to the agency after is revealed that the secret service erased text messages from january 5th and january 6th. chair, benny thompson, also said that the committee is still discussing whether they will subpoena trump and vice president mike pence. joining me now, olivia troye, she's a former senior adviser to then vice president mike pence and chief political strategist for the renew america movement. olivia, thanks for joining us. let's start with those little secret service techs. the agency says, nothing was done nefariously, it was part of a process to shift over communications. i'm curious, do you have any insight into what to make of the situation? does it seem normal to you? >> look, i think this whole thing seems abnormal. i've worked in the government, i've worked with engineers who are responsible for -- and these migrations are very well planned, out especially

when you're dealing with government records. i can't imagine that when you're dealing with possible presidential records as well and a very critical time period for our country. so, i don't know how you randomly a race the phones and this disappears, it's either gross incompetence on behalf of the secret service on the technical people there, or there's something more on this, i think that's important. >> it would be extremely coincidental, let's put it that way. there is someone else, there's something else that was revealed during last tuesday's hearing, it was revealed by representative liz cheney, all play the audio for you right now. >> one more item, after our last hearing, president trump tried to call a witness in our investigation, a witness you have not yet seen in these hearings. that person declined to answer or respond to president trump's

call. instead alerted their lawyer to the call. their lawyer alerted us. this committee has supplied that information to the department of justice. let me say one more time, we will take any efforts to influence witness testimony very seriously. >> all right, to partner for you. first, what does it say about donald trump's mindset that you do something like that? second, this is something that we will speak to, what is it like if you're a young age or someone who is caught up in the thick of this and you get a call from donald trump saying, don't talk? that must be a level of intimidation. >> first and foremost, i think donald trump -- there's been a lot of information here that the january six committee has investigated that is very damning to his actions and what he did to stop the peaceful transfer of power, which is really what is the most egregious thing about all of this. i think that's what makes the

committees important work so important, it's really getting to the bottom of this. it's scary, it was a culture of fear in the white house for those of us that work there. we're pretty much, people watched her every move, they watch what you are communicating, figure out how we were gonna deliver briefings on topics that they were not necessarily gonna receive well. so, this is intimidation. it wasn't surprising to me, which is actually more upsetting. i think that two americans it should be. i wasn't shocked that donald trump would call someone and try to intimidate the witness in the sense, he kind of has the mob mentality. we know this about donald trump and this entire inner circle. so, you know, it's interesting. why did he feel like he had to call this person? what does this person know? what can they cooperate about the scenario, what happened in those days to the lead up to january 6th? i think they're looking around, and they're saying, who else might talk after, you know, cassidy hutchinson bay gravely

came forward? >> sticking with that and the issue of cassidy and witness intimidation. politico, my colleague meredith, describing this informal support network, essentially, of the young female former trump aides. you are part of this group, take us through how it either organically or in organically came together and why it has been so necessary in these current times? >> look, i think it's been, for me, especially, i was one of the first to come forward and talk about the dangers of the trump administration and what it would mean to have donald trump leading our country, still very concerned about that going forward. we know he's potentially gonna run. i think this remains a very big danger to our democracy, so it's a lonely space. i think what happened, it is very panicked, when we saw these other women, cassidy hutchinson, i spoke with alyssa

-- we were really worried about the safety and the loneliness that comes with this. i think there's a lot of assumptions made, getting attacked by people, why did you choose to work there? the fact of the matter is, they did their jobs, they did them royally, we know what it means to come forward and take on someone like trump's inner circle. they're dangerous. you also get the rat, you get the rat from the maga roofs, you get threats to your life. really, it is letting them know that you're not alone, will help you get through, this will help you get the resources you need. it's going to be a very hard and lonely time. especially for someone like cassidy hutchinson, who is very young, she's early in her career. we just want to make sure that there is a circle there to say, you know, you can lean on, us we'll do our best to help get you through this. >> all right, olivia troye, thank you so much for coming on and sharing my. i really appreciate it. still ahead, republicans and democrats can agree on one thing, a deep-seated dread about the 2024 presidential

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heading to the beach or just finding a little time at home to open up a book after you finish scrolling on twitter, get your kids down to bed, we all need some summer reading suggestions, we do. on top for the next two weeks for the banned book club are classics. the adventures of huckleberry faehn by mark twain, never heard of it. and the award brown girl dreaming by jacqueline woodson. it's the autobiographical story with two to string backdrops, i grated greenville, south carolina, and new york city. it's a poignant and beautiful must read book. then there's huckleberry finn, who knows with that is? i'm just kidding. in a little introduction. perhaps most members of the book club have not opened a copy of it since your high school english course.

give it a try. might change your mind with fresh reading, reinvigorate her love of the classic. familiar questions, comments, and reactions, to my story at velshi dot com. that's my story out velshi.com. tune in next week for the next meeting of the velshi banned book club. still ahead on velshi, imagine you are sitting president and only a quarter of your own party wants you to run for election. welcome to joe biden's reality. we'll talk about everyone who has already started running 2024 and why. that's coming up next. 2024 and why 2024 and why that's i can disrupt eczema with rinvoq. rinvoq is not a steroid, topical, or injection. it's one pill, once a day, that's effective without topical steroids. many taking rinvoq saw clear or almost-clear skin while some saw up to 100% clear skin. plus, they felt fast itch relief

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magic eight ball, because people still have those. people still have those, right? and ask whether the 2024 presidential election will be an enjoyable, civil experience. the response he would guest

would be, outlook not so good. an interview in the new york magazine, donald trump made it clear that he is all but certain to launch another white house bid in 2024. that's a matter of whether he will do it before or after this year's midterms. when is a critical piece for the republican party about which they have big concerns. gop leaders are concerned that trump could be a drag on 2022 candidates and would be blamed if republicans underperformed. new polling from the new york times shows that nearly half of republican voters don't even want him back in office. if we turn to the left, things are looking even worse for president biden, as his party -- according to that same poll, the democratic voters were asked whether the party should re-nominate joe biden in 2024, only 26% said he should be the nominee again. where is 64% said a different candidate should be selected. msnbc political analyst list,

peter, summed up white biden's problem could be. quote, biden is not up to this moment, he's too wedded to the old assumptions about how american politics should work. these assumptions enable the very authoritarianism he claims to oppose. after the break, peter, and amy ellison, will join me to discuss the impending jet on both sides of the aisle surrounding 2024. f the aisl surrounding 2024 , so it was a happy ending... for almost everyone. as a main street bank, so it was a happy ending... pnc has helped over 7 million kids develop their passion for learning. pnc bank: see how we can make a difference for you. this is the sound of better breathing. fasenra is an add-on treatment for asthma driven by eosinophils. it helps prevent asthma attacks, improve breathing,

and lower use of oral steroids. fasenra is not a rescue medication or for other eosinophilic conditions. fasenra may cause allergic reactions. get help right away if you have swelling of your face, mouth and tongue, or trouble breathing. don't stop your asthma treatments unless your doctor tells you to. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection or your asthma worsens. headache and sore throat may occur. ask your doctor about fasenra. every search you make, every click you take,

every move you make, every step you take, i'll be watching you. the internet doesn't have to be duckduckgo is a free all in one privacy app with a built in search engine, web browser, one click data clearing and more stop companies like google from watching you, by downloading the app today. -- duckduckgo: privacy, simplified. fountain president of xi to people, noticed -- thank you for joining me, peter, i quoted your latest newsletter, before the break. you can thank me for the traffic bump. where you say biden is not up for his moment right now, you also say, it is up to him to

save democracy. those true demands, seem incompatible. are they? >> no, i think what has really become clear, with this, is that unless there are reforms made, and unless the reforms are made to the senate, particularly abolishing the filibuster, it will be impossible to pass the voting rights bills that we need to ensure, access to the vote, particularly to -- especially in the south. it will be impossible to pass any progressive agenda, to restore abortion rights, and to do something against climate change. biden cannot snap his fingers and do those things, evidently. but he needs to rally progressives, and rally americans to that effort. because otherwise, i think our democracy is really in great peril, heading to 2024. he has not been doing that. >> according to a new york times poll, 20% of democratic women, think this country is moving in the right direction.

you think biden grasps the severity of those numbers? is he up for the challenge? >> the numbers are, really concerning. if you break that down into, you look of women of color, 90% of women of color voted for joe biden, two years ago. it's really important, and what i am hearing though the country is, what are the democrats doing to assert the power, they currently have? are they fighting? and doing everything they can, to protect the rights we have, and like peters said, to make sure that, they use their power? in this critical time? to secure democracy? and expand our rights? i think, it is a really tough sell for us right now. those of us who talk to voters. particularly in states that are going to really matter, along the sun belt, that is in the south. we are saying, look.

we argued in 2020, for you to vote for the administration. because, we believe, that america is, and this democratic experience, we are fighting for, here is what we have to say two years later. that we did not secure voting rights. that we did not protect abortion rights. that we did not pass the george floyd policing, we did not raise the minimum wage, it is a tough sell this year, in a midterm here that is already going to see lower voter turnouts. and, we have such deep crisis, that underscore all of these issues, that we are really facing, a really significant challenge, i don't know if the country, and the white house, in congress, that people are seeing, what will happen, if we do not stop operating, and take bold action. >> let me push back a little

bit. maybe not pushback, but let me get at one point, i think it's worth addressing. i will start with you. you can't snap your fingers, and undo these things. but the white house would say look, he has called for getting rid of the filibuster, to codify road. he's called for the same for voting rights. he has been openly critical of the supreme court. he has pushed a dramatic domestic legislation initiative. but they have a 50/50 senate, and there is one or two votes, on the democratic side, that do not want to do any of these things. and so, you cannot do these things, if you are in the white house, and you see for instance, this past week, senator manchin, saying he is not even going to do climate initiative as part of his agenda, what tools do you have at your disposal? are just setting people up, for disappointment, when manchin gets in the way? >> i think one of the most powerful tools, the president has, is the ability to speak to americans, particularly to your

base, to speak to their fears, but also lay out a vision, on how to overcome them, and rally people. it is critically important, as we head towards this election. this is something that i think, particularly in the wake on abortion, joe biden really profoundly failed to do. i think it's not because his heart is in the right place, let's be honest. this is a guy who has never had, who does not have a strong connection to begin with, with the democratic party base, in a way that barack obama, or even bill clinton has. he is not i think, stepped up to this moment. i think that is part of what you are seeing, reflected in these polls. sense of demoralization, not just because, an authoritarian republican party, they are rolling back peoples rights, but because they do not see the american president speaking to them, and rallying to -- it may take longer than his entire presidency, of essentially saving and restoring american democracy. i'm not sure he's capable of doing that. >> let me pick it up there with

you, amy. is it enough that the conditions can produce the turn up? the overturning of roe? logically, it would induce a massive amount of a political participation, from people who say, we need to elect more people, who would codify this into law? the potential of trump to return. could theoretically, encourage a lot of progressives, to turn to the polls, and say you can't stomach the poll that democracy might fall. is that enough? or does biden have to use the bully pulpit, to rally these people, to go to the polls? >> we need the pulpit. and it is not enough. fear of a trump election, is not enough. in states like pennsylvania, and texas, and florida, and north carolina especially, where, there are very strong democrats running in the top of the ticket, for the senate, who

could expand secure and expand democratic majority in the senate. that is who we need to be knocking doors, and talking to voters. the challenge we have right now, is that without the investment, and the kind of voters, when we fall back on a false promise, of bipartisanship, when it has been demonstrated, that that is not functioning, working, delivering, for the base, midterms are based elections. but the challenges that we currently have, require us to turn our attention to the most critical voters, in this case, the base of the party. particularly in the key states. are women of color, majority, democrats, let's talk directly, how the white house, the voters will make a difference. >> all right. thank you both for joining me on this conversation, we appreciate it. that does it for me. thank you for watching this week, you can watch velshi

every saturday, and sunday morning, from 8 am to 10 am eastern. happy sunday. don't go anywhere just yet, because the sunday show, with a great jonathan -- starts right about now. >> ready for primetime? january six committee is set to focus on what donald trump did, and did not do, during the insurrection. but first, they want to see those secret service text messages. the ongoing danger of political violence. congresswoman joins me live, to talk, for the first time, about the july 9th arrests, of a man accused of threatening her life. and, in the fight to protect abortion rights, republicans, get more ridiculous. >> is there any instance? of a woman giving birth to something that is not a human