for my friend the one, the only, ali velshi. it is saturday, july 23rd. we begin this hour with the latest fallout from another explosive public hearing from the january 6th elect committee. committee produced a meticulous and damaging account but donald trump did as a mob of his supporters, sent to the capitol on his command, violently stormed the building and threaten the lives of everybody inside. including his own vice president. during the 187 minutes between and trump spoke to the supporters, and the time we find it released a halfhearted video statement asking him to go home. really was not an official white house record of what the president was doing. as the committee revealed, or hour-long gaps in the presidential call logs and the presidential daily diary. the chief white house photographer was told not to take photos. some phone records to access from that timeframe, people trump was speaking with. this includes at least two calls with his personal attorney, rudy giuliani.

several calls with several republican senators. >> if president trump was not calling law enforcement or military leaders, whether president trump spent his time doing that afternoon? while he for settled into the dining room? he was calling senators to encourage them to delay or object to the certification. here is kayleigh mcenany, his press secretary to explain. >> all, right back there and he wants the list of senators. that he is calling bill would buy, one to know youth color? >> to buy recollection, though. >> there is a searing made a strong case that trump did not fail to act to set the bounds, he refused to this by police from the top aides and family members. if he was not a failure to act or ineptitude it was a strategy. he was not feeling to stop interaction about waiting to see if it worked. as the camera field, when the

attack failed to stop the certification of the election, there was one person to home trump directed his eye at. >> on the screen is the last photograph of the president that, night as he went into the residence. as he was gathering his things in the dining room to leave, president sharp reflected on the day's events of the white house employee. this was the same employee who had met president trump in the oval office after he returned from the ellipse. president trump said nothing to the employee about the attack. he said only quote, mike pence let me down. >> and then, even the next, day when trump finally relented, recorded a short speech about january six, even then he would not say the election was over. as this extremely revealing outtake of that speech shows. whenever you are ready sir. >> i would like to begin by

addressing the heinous attack yesterday. and to those who broke the law, he will pay. you do not represent our movement, you do not represent our country, and if you broke the law. can't say that, i already said you will pay. the demonstrators who infiltrated the capital have defied the seat, defiled right? i cannot see it very well. i will do, this i will do this. let's go. this election is now over, congress has certified the results. i don't want to say the election is over, i just want to say congress has certify the results. without saying the election is over, okay? >> congress has turned, now congress >> i did not say, over

let me say this. go to the paragraph before. t me say this. all of this brings us to yesterday, less than 24 hours after the eight public hearing concluded, former white house chief strategist, steve bannon was found guilty by a federal jury on two counts of contempt in congress. for failing to comply with the select committee. he is said to be sentenced on october 21st. joining me now to discuss all of this, msnbc legal analyst barbara mccabe, former u.s. attorney in michigan. professor at the university of michigan law school. national correspondent for the washington post philippe bump. barbara and philip, thank you for joining. the filibuster with you. yesterday in a piece for the post, it brought down the trump optic video. where we are seeing the day after the insurrection, sort of refusing to say the election is over. he can't do it, why do you think that moment tells us about both trumps awareness and sort of his own sense of culpability about the

insurrection? >> well the video was released to try and smooth some of the tension he had been getting by that point for the capitol riot. it was also smooth over, old flow so the big message to the american people that he understood that the stinger stopped. he understood how things were going and biden will be president. when i see when i see that though and this is all like representative kinzinger said, when i see the president who understands he is doing when he needs to do in the moment. but still kind of -- you are saying in the moment, the best person that i could think of us after the -- he released a statement apologizing for it and then immediately went on the attack. i feel like he internalize the same attitude on january 7th, he was saying when he knew he had to say the advisers were at the site. the penis, heart he had to press forward with the fight. that is what representative kinzinger highlighted and they said this course is still out

there. the same motivation that is for the riders, this is still being pushed today. >> at least leave enough ambiguity about how he felt the supporters then not feel disheartened right? barbara, i want to get to the one thing trump defenders are saying here. they argue that look, it may be damning there is not actually a smoking gun. here i think the fact that they said it is heresy, then corrected it and said it is hearsay. and it's all hearsay. and now let's take their case, a lot of contempt rving the culpability. is there an actual text or any email for trump ordering anyone to sort of literally breached the capitol and go time lawmakers. and if, not how crucial is that for trump as he faces the prospect of additional trials and scrutiny from the doj going forward? >> well, it's important to separate the two admissions. the one of congress which is to

tell the whole story, that one idiot today which is to prove the crimes. i have not heard the direct link that could make the case for seditious conspiracy for donald trump. certainly lots of circumstantial evidence. i also think it does not matter, if they can prove other crimes, that will do the job. conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding it's a 20-year felony. it's a very serious crime. , thursday i did hear additional elements that advances the ball. their doj has to go in and investigate all of the facts, they have to look at the other side and anticipate the defense. they have to disprove the negative that there is some explanation for all of this. when we are at the years is really looking to advancing that crime. previously, it had been framed as a failure to act. in a dead, nothing and the way adam kinzinger framed it was so important which was to say, he did not fail to take action. he chose not to take action. the pentagon was calling any had an opportunity to talk to them. as mark milley the chairman of the chief staff said he is a

commander in chief of the armed forces. he did not call up the national guard. people were pleading with him to go off the television recorded video or to tweet, or asked the crowd ought to be. you chose not to. asked the combine that with oth, his effort to pressure mike pence to throw out certain electors and delay the vote, to me there is evidence a at least evidence right now of conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding. another thing to note is that, it's not the end point of that committee. there have been more concerns among democrats that they will abruptly call that -- they made clearly on thursday that they will have another round of hearings in september. so you know i guess my question for you is, if you are on the committee, do you feel like there has to be tension? right we have more information coming in, these have been a

success. steve clark, we will get to that line. republicans can clearly win back the house in november. talk a bit about what that tension was feel like and how much longer you think the investigation can go on? there's a simply have to wrap up by delaying dark? >>, well good question. i think the committee members of unaware of this for sometime i remember writing back and probably the middle of last year. iran attack, lock it seem like in the normal amount of time. i think it's really important to know that the committee has to really long holes. but clear goals. what is to provide enough evidence the doj -- i think the more important goal in the goal they've been working towards much more effectively is, the goal of keeping donald trump out of power and the future. that's an english genius into that many times and she said as much basically at the end of the hearing on thursday. they were trying to make the case the american people that

you cannot let this man near power again and you cannot look at what he did. we followed the discussion about whether he meets a criminal standard, extremely obvious and that has been since january 7th. would happen in that donald trump did nothing to prevent what happened and he's been extremely obvious. they are building this case in a political case against donald trump. i think all they're doing at this point is adding additional frosting to the outside of the cape. and i think we are starting to see an effect. there are felonies were like look, i love trump, i love his policies put i want to go to this fight again in 2024? no. >> yes you are picking that up and barbara want your thoughts on something liz cheney said. about the witnesses who has come forward in those who have not. we have the syllabus, let's see if we have this out on that? >> you have seen bravery in honor in these hearings and miss matthews and mr. pottinger both of you will be remembered for that. as will cassidy hutchinson.

she sat here alone, texaco than testified before millions of americans. she knew all along which should be attacked by president trump and by the 50, 60 and 70-year-old man who had themselves behind executive privilege. unlike our witnesses today, she has courage and she did it anyway. >> strike question to you barbara, what are your thoughts on liz cheney's point there? >> it's really tactical, she is inviting people in and shaming other people. she wants to get witnesses out of this. it works with pat saponi and we will see if it works with others. >> philip thank you both very much and now, joining me are former chairman of the rnc, the man, the man michael steele. also the host of the michael steele podcast. msnbc analyst, michael what a pleasure on my end. thank you for joining us.

some talk about this potential being the last public hearing. we put that to rest. she said this will be a thing that we pick up in september. let's take a listen to the. >>, new subpoenas have been issued and the dam has begun to break. and now, even as we conduct the ninth hearing, we have considerably more to do. we have far more evidence to share with the american people and more to gather. so our committee will spend august pursuing, from urging information on multiple fronts before convening for the hearings in the september. >> that began to break, coming forward, more information is being unearthed in the investigation. my question for you those that's an investigative shot. do you think dame will break in the terms of the political track. in terms of trump's hold on the

republican party's phillips, it looks a little tenuous because of what is happening by this committee? >> yes first let me say stein and so first on a saturday morning is a dangerous combination america. already i'm saying i think they are ready. . think the dam is beginning to break. there are some weeks in the. some serious cracks with leaks. republicans have will actually strategically put on the defense by the way liz cheney's position and the work that they are doing. number one in number two there are combinations that you know from your reporting, inside of the caucus for failure to actually put republicans on the committee to present that counter narrative. so you know mccarthy is taking

his. the work of this committee because the american people are taking it seriously. and they don't see. , there's not that you can take them to make them believe anything other than told them to believe. that is not america, the problem republicans actually tuned in dialed into this conversation. very disturbing what we are hearing and seeing. , especially along the way. , the 70-year-old man coming don hard on this woman, these women for telling the truth. one again, for there's a political narrative that these guys are just punks on the real americans are the ones we're starting to come forward.

there is more to come and i would be surprised sam, until the point i guess if the rig says look. we are meeting every other week between now and january. we will have a hearing every other week, live to get the rest of the story out, knowing what the political endgame potentially could be if they lose the house. >> right, let me push back. maybe not pushback but let me ask your thoughts on this. my take is that trump has been damaged by this. and then people are in the republican party or you know that want the drama anymore. i think the people who actually have been really damaged by it or those who have been sort of secondary characters. but that i mean kevin mccarthy for instance, who has been exposed as you know deeply concerned at the moment and willing to go to mar-a-lago the next day. --

those people will suffer the most damage were damage compared to trump. curious for your thoughts on that. >> we will see with damage trump ultimately suffers. the hollies of the world are not necessarily caught up in legal wrangling's with potential problems with department of justice. trump. is trump's under investigation in georgia. then you know, in new york, trump has a whole different set of prompts. i would not put them together, and there is a difference. when it means when the hollies of the world get excoriated the way that they did, and i've never seen such a beautiful scene well done emasculation of the united states senator. and what a particular someone like to talk about manhood. there you, go see mascot alike, anyway. those folks, they will be living in a different space anyway. they really believe being in a

way because of trump. if the trump piece does get taken down a notch or two, watch those, those pillars of salt crumble. and the reality then becomes very different in the house. >> look at your last quick thoughts on the direction of the party, ultimately back. we have yesterday, trump and pence holding dueling rallies, in arizona for rival gop candidates for governor. to preview it in essence about will be the central argument of the primary. pence's message is summed up by this quote, the streak that he puts out. the republican party allows itself to become consumed by yesterday's grievances, we will lose. and yesterday could be literally, the hearing biden basically is saying yesterday, and here's trump from yesterday consumed by yesterday's grievances.

>> iran twice, i won twice and did much better the second time tonight that the first time. getting millions of more votes. and 2020 than we got in 2016. and likewise getting more votes than any sitting president and the history of our country by far. and now, we wait to do it again. we >>, clearly a man not chastened by the sound bike. what do you think about all of this? >> really quick, trump is a full living in the past. the republican party is foolish because it has no future. and as a platform, it has no direction, nothing to say that the country except for give us power and we may tell you what we will do. that is the bottom line right now for this gop, they have a problem going into the fall, they know it, they're trying to play off in the numbers that they think they can win. we will see. >> all right michael, still what a pleasure, thank you so

much. we have a lot more about she coming up. kansas has been ground zero on the abortion wars for decades. now there is a new battle brewing over the future of reproductive rights, and what is now considered a safe state for abortion rights. whether or remains that way will depend on what happens at the ballot box in ten days. and president biden remains in isolation after testing positive for covid-19. he is far from the only one, omicron sub variant cases are on the rise all across the country. and breaking, news the u.s. state department has confirmed that two americans have died in eastern ukraine. a live report on the ground is next. you are watching velshi on msnbc. e watching velshi on when you have technology that's easier to control... that can scale across all your clouds... we got that right? msnbc.

[whistling]

we have some breaking news out of ukraine this morning. u.s. state department has confirmed that two more u.s. citizens have died in the donbas region. and the eastern part of the country. state department inclined to provide any further details as to the identity of the two americans or the nature of their deaths. abc news foreign correspondent holly is live for us in kyiv. ali, what more can you tell us about these american casualties? >> all right, so we don't know a lot about it as you said, the state department has confirmed the death of these two americans on the eastern front of the donbas region. some of the most fierce fighting in this country is

doing on. the region the russians are very focused on taking right now. that brings the total number of deaths on america in this country, before and at least another three captured and alexander directly and andy nguyen who are two fighters. and there wasn't fight in here, -- we are being held by separatists unoccupied territory's. and i just underscore with the safe department -- americans should and travel to ukraine, and any capacity. because of the dangers they face tear being killed. or a captious on the front lines, you got more on the information on the identity or exactly where they were killed, we will bring that to you. >>, ali separate element of the story is that there had been a significant rain deal reached between russia and ukraine. that will essentially allow the exports to start coming, out of ukraine of grain. but on this morning we get

reports of missile strikes in odessa. can it tell us at least what is happening on the ground there? >> it is really quite incredible sam, only yesterday, they signed a deal to allow grain to be exported on the black sea. the ink can even try on that agreement and the russians hit the port of odessa and is very specifically written in that agreement that you know, places where grain will be exported and would not be targeted. that is exactly what they did. we have seen time and time again, since the beginning of the conflict. what they seem to be worlds apart. it is really unclear, while they hit it, and that the terms of the deal themselves. and then ascertaining-y injected a large scale of and security of commercial and branches that are planning on leaving there in the next couple of days. >> the stakes are extremely

high, potential for world food crisis if these grants will come out. -- ali eruzione, grant thank you so much for reporting stay safe. coming, up president biden is still in quarantine after testing positive for covid. status update from the white house is straight ahead. this is fauci. house is straight ahead. house is straight ahead. this i i mean, "riders" is cool, but "bikers"...is really cool. -seriously? -denied. can we go back to meeting at the rec center? the commute here is brutal. denied. how do we feel about getting a quote to see if we can save with america's number one motorcycle insurer? should flo stop asking the same question every time? -approved! -[ altered voice ] denied! [ normal voice ] whoa. jaycee tried gain flfauci. the other day and forgot where she was. you can always spot a first time gain flings user.

subway's drafting 12 new subs for the all-new subway series menu. take the new subway club turkey, ham and roast beef. marshawn your analysis? relax chuck. i'm eating! alright, moving on. the new subway series. what's your pick? make your home totally you. the new subway series. i did with wayfair. sometimes i'm a homebody. can never have too many pillows. sometimes i'm all business. wooo! i'm a momma 24/7.

seriously with the marker? i'm a bit of a foodie. perfect. but not much of a chef. yes! ♪ wayfair you've got just what i need. ♪ seen this ad? it's not paid for by california tribes. it's paid for by the out of state gambling corporations that wrote prop 27. it doesn't tell you 90% of the profits go to the out of state corporations. a tiny share goes to the homeless, and even less to tribes. and a big loophole says, costs to promote betting reduce money for the tribes, so they get less. hidden agendas. fine print. loopholes. prop 27. they didn't write it for the tribes or the homeless. it is now the second full day they wrote it for themselves.

of isolation from president biden after he tested positive for covid-19 on thursday. they are reporting he is experiencing mild symptoms and being treated with the anti viral medication, packs paxlovid. tell an offer is 99 point fever. and albuterol inhaler as needed for his cough. president biden has no public events scheduled this weekend, he had voted meetings yesterday with economic advisers, focused on falling gas prices. facing oil productions and cost.

president joins the 129,000 americans, 129,000 americans on average. who test positive for covid daily, as -- rapidly spread through the nation. hospitalizations have claimed 17% over the last two weeks. and deaths have also increased by 38%. nbc's barrett joins us live from the white house. laura, what do we know about the presidents condition today? do we have anything new from the doctor? how closely is the white house monitoring's close contacts? >> well the president doctor ochero has released each, day until today we haven't got it a day letter -- we did hear from dr. fauci in an interview on cnn. he said that he spoke with dr. o'connor at 10 pm last night. these are the president

symptoms were and -- he continues to do very well. he also reminded that the facts of the president does have asthma, he's used inhaler in the past. decently and baylor today and about the past few days is not necessarily new. the president is breathing, well he's not having any trouble breathing so doctor fauci clarifying that point and the last time we saw the president as you can see on your screen was at this personal meeting with economic advisers yesterday. he had a big smile, give a thumbs up when asked about how he was feeling. so anticipated getting another doctor's letter to be like today, in the meantime, the white house told us -- they have identified 17 get but close to the president that are close contacts, none of them have tested positive. sam? >> embassies more aboard at the white house, thank you so much we appreciate it. joining me now is dr. peter, he is the co-director of the center for vaccine development at texas. children's hospital, the dean national school of tropical medicine at baylor college of medicine. thank you so much doctor for

joining, us the white house is, adamant is not changing any protocols. for how they operate internally, it's also not really changing its recommendations for wet society at large should do. even as a sub variant ripping through the nation. let me, ask you it's a missed opportunity with the spread of this ba.5 to encourage better safety measures nationwide. >> tear encourage better safety measures also sam to encourage people getting their second booster because the reason why the president appears to be doing as well as he is this because he's had to boosters. only about 23% or 25% of the u.s. population over the age of 65 has taken advantage of those second boosters. that is what is keeping them out of the hospital more than anything else. certainly the paxlovid is helping. emphasizing access to paxlovid, emphasizing access to the second booster. needs to be the number one

priority. and then you know you mentioned 125, 129,000 new cases a day. that is an underestimate by factor of 7 to 10. we are talking probably 1 million new cases a day. most of them are getting diagnosed that home and not being sent to state labs and sent to essential facility at the cdc. so this is as high a wave as in terms of members of new cases, as much as the omicron wave back in january. and the deaths are significant, okay not a 2 to 3000 deaths per day like we saw in and the wave in 2021 or even the omicron wave. still the third or fourth leading cause of death in the united states of america right now. all of that needs to be put in front of the american people so that they can take appropriate measures. >> do you think the white house has given up on preventing spread because they're not asking your pushing for increased indoor masking. they're pushing for enough people to adopt greater

therapies on the back and should they get it. and preventative treatments in the form of vaccines. have they basically throw their hands on the air instead we can stop the spread? >> bo, i will fictive gouda. have the kyoto for up to, maybe a little more aggressive and pushing on that message. still a lot a lot of that can be saved a lot of icu admissions that could be prevented. by the, way a lot of long covid, cases nobody's even talking about that. the impact of long covid that we will see because of this current wave in the last omicron wait. it will haunt the nation for months if not years. omicron wait itone thing i notice in the statement the initial statement announcing the presidents diagnosis, they were very deliberate. they were going to go above and beyond the cdc guidance, in terms of when biden can come out of quarantine. doing five this minimum of isolation, and it will make them test to come out of isolation. that is not what the cdc guidances. i'm wondering from your vantage, point is that sort of an

implicit emission, that they don't think the cdc guidance is good enough. are you surprised they are not just sticking to the cdc guidance? >> well you, know a lot of the guidelines came out brio macron and they were basing it on the behavior of the way the virus was acting. in terms of the level of transmission and how vaccines are working. that is why for, instance they still cling to the idea that to immunization constitutes full immunization. not even close, you need that booster, you probably need that second booster if you are over the age of 50. i think it is time to revise a number of guidelines because the amount of virus that is circulating with both omicron and now this be a five sub variant is higher than we've ever seen before. so yes i think we should be testing before we return people into the workplace. if they are out there, maybe should be ten days because the japanese have shown studies the

live virus is still being excreted. not just the pcr revolt but the live virus not eight or nine days after infections. and then we need to look at this with the ba.5 lines. >> all right doctor peter hotez, thank you so much. appreciate. it it has been one but since the supreme court overturned roe v. wade. and a legal crowd continues to cause fallout with life or death consequences for people who need reproductive health care across the country. coming, up we take you to one so-called safe state. where anti abortions are trying to essentially trick their citizens and devoting away their own rights. nd devoting away nd devoting away their ow feel the difference with downy. kids donn always take the best care of school supplies. so save money shopping back to school on amazon.

while they... 0oh... uh... figure their stuff out.

(dad) we have to tell everyone that we just switched to verizon's new welcome unlimited plan, for just $30. (daughter) i've already told everyone! (nurse) wait... did you say verizon for just $30? (mom) it's their best unlimited price ever. (cool guy) $30...that's awesome. (dad) yeah, and it's from the most reliable 5g network in america. (woman) for $30 a line, i'm switching now! (mom) yeah, it's easy, you can keep your phone, and verizon helps you with the costs to switch. (geek) wow... i've got to let my buddies know. (geek friend) we're already here! (vo) the network you want. the price you love. only from verizon. ali velshi maybe after the weekend but the velshi banned book club shout proceed. back tomorrow, featuring a major first. vandeberg of poetry nigher shakespearean it.

intense grade english, rondo dreaming tells a story of other jacqueline woodson's childhood split between new york city and segregated rural south carolina. against the coming of age backdrop, -- confront significant issues including religion, sexual identity and race all inverse of course. black old rooming as received numerous awards including the national book award. of, course it has earned the distinction of being targeted by would be book bans and towns and schools across the nation. joining velshi tomorrow morning, to hear the author speak with ali velshi, about the power of poetry, banned books in america it's so much more. if you are interested it finished reading brown girl dreaming, you have a favorite moment, strong reaction or even just a question for jacqueline woodson, send it our way. they have my story abel she dot com finishing off my copyright of the story today. before, we have a lot more on

velshi ahead so please stay with us. with u it's easier to do more innovative things. [whistling]

♪ ♪ this is the moment. for a treatment for moderate-to-severe eczema. cibinqo — fda approved. 100% steroid free. not an injection, cibinqo is a once-daily pill for adults who didn't respond to previous treatments. and cibinqo helps provide clearer skin and less itch. cibinqo can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. before and during treatment, your doctor should check for infections and do blood tests. tell your doctor if you've had hepatitis b or c, have flu-like symptoms, or are prone to infections. do not take with medicines that prevent blood clots. serious, sometimes fatal infections, lymphoma, lung, skin and other cancers, serious heart-related events,

and blood clots can happen. people 50 and older with heart disease risk factors have an increased risk of serious heart-related events or death with jak inhibitors. this is the moment. but we've only just begun. speak with your doctor about cibinqo today. an innovation from pfizer. tomorrow ox monmouth says [whistling] with technology that can scale across all your clouds... it's easier to do more innovative things. [whistling] supreme court overturned roe v. wade. and that time, abortion carries became extremely difficult to access for millions of people. large parts of the country. of the 26 states that were considered certain or likely ban abortion, seven states

already have laws that ban abortion completely. an eight state, with constant the law remains unclear. poses enough legal reset all provider suspended abortion services in late june. on wednesday, a federal appeals court allowed her to start enforcing its near total, six-week ban. seven state to put into effect a restriction, that bans abortion much earlier than with a lot before roe was overturned. abortion is now almost completely banned or so heavily restricted, it might as well be banned throughout the entirety of the south. with louisiana as the only exception, at least for now. these laws have already radically reshaped abortion rights around the country. and, yet more states are enact bans in the coming days. barring a court order, trigger bans in north dakota and wyoming are expected to take effect in the next week. on monday, indiana state legislature will convene for a special session to consider a new abortion ban.

and this year's election, a record number of abortion related measures will be on the ballot in at least five states. several of those are proposals to amend state constitution to address abortion rights directly. on august, second that is ten days from now, voters in the state of kansas will consider animate. opposed by republicans, seeks the carroll fly that stay constitution does not protect abortion rights. this will be the force abortion related measure that americans will vote on a post-roe era, the most recent polling indicates it will be a close one. even in kansas. when we come, back i will talk about the president and the future of a post roe america. i'll be joined by a sapphire chrysalis, a doula, and activists and elizabeth nash. her track state abortion laws for the institute and do not go away. they're not going to miss this. not g away away they'r

it's easier to do more innovative things. [whistling]

[whistling] as promised, i'm now joined by with technology that can scale across all your clouds... it's easier to do more innovative things. [whistling]

sapphire garcia, least president of the kansas burst just to society. elizabeth, nash principle policy associate of state issues at the guttmacher institute. thank you both for joining, elizabeth start with you. some states we have seen quickly, easily, enforcing your abortion laws. the restrictions. many others know have been tied

up in legal challenges, give us a state of play about abortion access across the country right now in the post-roe a period. >> sure, thank you for having me. we have 11 states that have nearly banned abortion or have early abortion bans on the books unforced right now. then we have a bill they're two states led a bed abortions at 15 weeks, these abortion bans are not simply like flipping the switch. we think about louisiana, that abortion ban has been in effect twice and now it is not an effect. this legal back and forth around one bands go into effect and will they don't is causing huge chaos and confusion for patients. and provider, states like louisiana, another nine or some states in that same boat. where we are seeing abortion band be caught up in court. we are waiting to see what will happen with them, we are expecting the number of states

with bans to increase traumatically. much accuracy and around indiana, special session and why wyoming sugar band going into effect. >> one of those days could be kansas, a fire, there is some confusing and deceptive things happening with this ballot measure in your state. and for one thing is my understanding is that the vote happening and the voter stuff really happening in the primary. you would expect kind of a lower turnout in the general election was a little tricky is that the wording of the amendment on the ballot can be confusing. the voting for the amendment, your voting is actually voting against abortion rights. -- if we're all confused, i have to imagine that voters stayed are confused. is that your understanding? has this been a real problem? >> it has been a real problem and it was done with purpose and detention. they want voters to be

confused. and also has no accident that this was on the primary ballot. instead of the main ballot. it is a huge issue and it is impossible to read that ballot and get a clear picture of what you are actually voting for. i think that's a travesty. >> elizabeth, you expect more states to simply get what's going on in kansas and put amendments to the state constitutions on the ballot that would directly impact abortion rights? >> yes i do. you know before kansas we had four states, alabama, louisiana, tennessee, and west virginia adopt similar ballot initiatives. and kentucky is coming up this november. we are seeing states not only banned abortion, but then take the next step to change the constitution so it does not protect abortion rights. on the flip side though we, have states that are looking to do the opposite. protect abortion rights,

california, michigan and vermont all of ballot and issued have to do and protect rights all coming up in november. we are going to see a lot of back and forth. in state constitutions around abortions. and to sapphires point. it's incredibly confusing for voters, it takes a lot of education to help them understand really what is at stake. >> let me quickly follow up with elizabeth. sort of a high risk and high reward proposition if you make a ballot initiative right? quite possible that we could be surprised by the result in kansas. i know, abortion rights obviously polls are incredibly well. if you put it to the will of the voters's are not a vehicle for actually securing and caught defying abortion in a state potentially? >> absolutely. efying abortion in a state potentially? >> and kansas, they are really hitting the. road this is not theoretical

anymore. and i think it does take a lot of education, for voters to know that especially when it is on a primary ballot, when the language is confusing. there is a lot and not only at stake but a lot for voters to know. >> sapphire, pick up there. what is the sort of educational campaign that groups are doing in kansas to make sure that people understand just redaction the amendment entails. how to vote and so on and so, fourth has anybody surprised to whether respected the momentum around the ballot initiative. >> you know, i see people energized. i see people ready to go out and vote. some of, that many of them for the first time. because then you see the attention behind this and the fact that they are going to attempt to place an abortion ban, probably an emergency session if they get this amendment push through. we are having to inform people that they are already over 20 restrictions on abortion in

kansas. they value them both sides, spotting misinformation. that we want abortion up to 38 weeks. and it's hard to fight blatant misinformation. because that's what it, is it is lies. until we are countering that with truth. >> elizabeth, there is a few components here. one's voter will. the other states law, the other's law, the enforcement of the law. in indiana, we saw for instance the republican attorney general publicly say he was going to investigate an abortion provider for this girl. ten year old girl from ohio who came to the state to get a procedure after she was raped and impregnated. i am curious, though how much power do you imagine state attorney generals will have and the post-roe landscape to essentially decide whether or

not abortion laws will be enforced in the state. and states with democratic governors and or attorney general theoretically, they can say will not enforce these laws. and abortion will be de facto legal because you can get it and will not feel punishment. >> while we are facing illegal can not jump here. and, that we are seeing states where the attorney generals are actively looking to prosecute providers. like what we are seeing in indiana. that's a huge scare tactics for other providers right? do you want to be at risk of being prosecuted and perhaps arrested or convicted? and then the more progressive states, say like wisconsin, the attorney general may say we won't enforce the ban. what will happen to a local prosecutor, who does decide to enforce it? it's a very scary type. >> sapphire, quickly to you, the most recent polling in your state shows that this vote will

be close. 47% are likely voter said they planned to vote for the amendment. 43% say they plan against the amendment. what are your thoughts on these numbers? do you think you can make up that margin? that 4% margin and the ten days that you have left? >> i think that we can. i need everybody was listening today who is from kansas to go out and vote. the polls are open for early voting. we have a lot of ground to make up and a lot of information to get out. to counter the misinformation that folks are keurig. -- -- they believe that abortion is a human right and that it is health care. and i fades and my fellow candidates. i think that we can do this. >> sapphire, garcia lease and elizabeth nash, thank you both for joining minute discussion.

i appreciate. it now does it for me. thank you for watching, i will be back tomorrow morning. eight to 10 am eastern filling in from my good friend ali velshi. don't worry, don't worry he's back from vacation soon enough. you won't deal with me anymore. the cross connection with charles blow and for tiffany cross begins right about now. cross begins right good morning, welcome to the cross connection. i am charles blow and for tiffany cross. we have a packed show but we start not with news on steve bannon who messed around and found out the longtime trump confidant and adviser was found guilty on two counts of contempt of congress for ignoring a subpoena for the january six committee. each count carries up to a year in jail and a fine of up to $100,000. --