who have resigned in disgrace, you look at rod blagojevich, and he came out attacking and andrew cuomo, former governor of new york, and paul manafort, former president trump's campaign manager, all of them speaking on behalf of the former president. >> andrew cuomo, disgraced governor of new york and democrat taking a step back on the political stage this way. eyebrows up for that. alayna treene, thank you for being up this morning. and thanks for you for getting up "way too early" on this wednesday. "morning joe" starts right now. trump supporters think biden knew about the raid beforehand but the white house said he didn't. biden one day he's completely senile, the next, he knows

everything. and trump was pretty upset about the search and he put out a statement that said "they even broke into my safe." they even broke into my safe [ laughter ] trump is like, dammit, i knew i should have flushed that safe down the toilet, i knew it. all right. 6:00 on the east coast, there are new developments on the justice department investigation of donald trump including confirmation that the fbi search of his florida home, mar-a-lago, was related to the handling of classified information. we will have the outlandish claims from his attorneys. desperate for some sort of defense here, i guess. plus, the former president is set to be deposed in new york state's investigation into the trump organization today. and a sixth trump-backed candidate wins the republican primary for governor, this time in wisconsin. we'll have the latest on that

election and others. also, the very latest from ukraine. new information this morning on how ukrainian forces are pulling off some pivotal attacks against russian targets. good morning. and welcome to "morning joe." it is wednesday, august 10th. with us, we have u.s. special correspondent for bbc news katty kay. former aide to the bush white house and state department, elise jordan. and white house editor for politico, sam stein is with us this morning. od to have you all. joe, i thought we'd take the morning off, because we've been talking a lot about not just what happened at mar-a-lago and the fbi search but the response to it. sort of the strange and dangerous ironies of trump's republican party so to speak. >> well, and you look at how republicans doing right now, whether you're looking at the ballot, you look at how they're doingn special elections,

they're underperforming, by what was done in 2020 by five or six points, in a lot of these special elections. they continue to ll. when you look at what happens in polling, you look in the senate races. they're underperforming. i mean, a year that should be massive for the gop, and they just can't seem to connect the dots. and now, there all rushing to defense of a guy who likely broke the law. and who's going to be brought to justice. they keep careening closer a closer to a cliff of political oblivion. and americans can see it. they can see hypocritical this republican party is. i understand people are upt, because they're -- they're so extreme.

and they're hypocritical. d americans can see through this grift. you see there shocked by for legal search of classified documents, a leg search. you read hugh hewitt's page in "the washington post." of course, presidents can be searched i agree with hugh on that, but they're shocked by the legal search of a residence. and but they're just fine with the violence that donald trump let loose on the u.s. capitol. they claim they need law enforcement. but now they're screaming about needing to defund the most important law enforcement body in america that protectsou. and your family. and all of us. these republicans, they attack any kind of investigations that

look into trump's activities. mccarthy promises, if you elect us, we're going to once again launch our own witch hunts against law enforcement agencies. who were trying to do their jobs, trying to enforcehe la and trying to keeamericans safe. it's tortured logic. these twisted actions, all meant to defend a failed reality host. at the cost of harming ameri and its constitution and its promise that no man is above the law. that's not radical. that's not a radical concept. it's sort of at the core of who we are as a nation. and the fact tt the republican party of whington, d.c. are melting down the way they are,

it shows why they're in politica trouble right now. and that's going to continue. if theyontinue to look back for inspiration in their future. it's bad news, mi. >> it is tortured logic. that's a really good way of putting it. andhey're preying upon people who don't have the time or have too much on their hands to deal with whether it's true or not. taking advantage of people. >> well, the jim and tammy faye baker routine, except, they're not exploiting jesus for fame, for money, for power. they're exploiting people's -- well, their sense of patriotism. and lying to them every day, exploiting them for money, for power, for the big grift. anyway -- >> what i see here, what concerns me about what they're doing andlso those who echo

it, or trying to torture that logic even more for hours and hours every day, is that this will promote violence. and unnecessary, untrue hatred based on lies. >> right. >> and could roil up evenore what we've already seen. andt is responsible irresponsible, whether you're a politician or a member of the media. >> well, if you can't look back to see what happened on january 6th, and i you can't look back to see how their words led to january 6th inspired people to go up and riot, if you can't see that -- well -- well, then, guess what, you're going to face the same problems that so many people, unfortunately, are facingow that took part in the riots onanuary 6th. when are they ever gng to arn. >> let's get to the news on this. we have the latest developments on the fbi search ofonald

trump home. urces familiar with the matter told "the washington post" tha federal authorities were kerneled that trump had not returned to the national archives all of the material that he had improperly taken to mar-a-lago after leaving the white house in 2021. he returned 15 boxes about seven mohs ago. you might remember that reporting and the video of the boxes lving r-a-lago. 12 more boxes were seized in monday's search. trump's attorney chrtina bobb says the fmer president's legal team has been in discussions with the justice department since the spring about whether additional records were being stod at mar-a-lago. she says trp's attorneys met with federalfficials at mar-a-la on ateast two occasions. sources tell nbc news, at some poin during the probe, trump personally showed investigators the room where the materials were sted. here's what he heard from trump's legal team sterday, including christina bobb, the

attorney who was on the property during the fbi search. >> i don't think that there was actually anything there that's worthwhile. we'll see what they come up, you know, if they did. it will be interesting, especially since they precluded me from actually watching what they did. but at this point i don't necessarily think they would even go to the extent of trying to plant information. i think they just make stuff up and come up with whatever they want. that's the way they will have to proceed in order to actually try to indict the president. because they don't have anything. there's nothing there. >> this is a joke. thisis memento, quite nestly, i'm concerned they may have planted something, at this poin who knows. >> the investigati is being led by the justice department national security division. trump and his attorneys do have a copy of the warrant that explains the probable cause of the search. >> why won't they release the

warrant? like donald trump -- isn't that the you who said yesterday, donald trump can release the warrant. he should release the warrant. if it's such a scam, donald -- hey, donald, i know you watch -- if it's such a scam, listen to me, release the warrant. >> they would rather actually leave it hanging out there. it's the logic. >> you got the warrant, okay? stop the scam, stop the grift, release the warrant. let us see why they came into mar-a-lago. let us see what they're looking for. let us see what illegal actions they believe you're taking. you got the warrant in your hands. let us see it. i think it will be good for america. and, by the way, if it's a scam, we'll be able to tell on the face of that warrant.

just releaset now. >> search is prompting strong criticism from top republican leaders. a statement from senate minority leader mitch mcconnell yesterday reads, quote, the country deserves a thorough and immediate explanation of what led to the events on monday. attorney general garland and the department of justice should have already provided answers to the american people and must do so immediately. >> let's stop right there. i want to sto right there, here's mitch mcconnell. i'm sure a lot of people see this and go, oh, my god, that' horrible. how can mitch mcconnell say that, worst thing ever that mitch connell would say such a thing. that's what walter isaacson said yesterday, katty kay. that's what walter isaacson said yesterday. by the way, i agree with huge

hewitt. and is katty kay here -- fantastic. i thought i was talking to a wall. so, katty, the doj needs to be transparent. this is a historic moment when you're going to a former president. we don't need to be in the dark. like last night, i'm reading through the latest "the new york times" article trying to read between the lines. trying to figure out who was leaking what. trying to figure out what they really had on donald trump. two things can be true at one time. donald trump, they -- they could have probable cause with donald trump and the doj as walter isaacson said needs to be transparent. we still really don't know what's going on here. >> yeah. we live in an age of crazy conspiracy theories. and crazy conspiracy theories thrive in darkness when there is not transparency.

this is a huge step that caused an uproar. much of it predictable. we knew the trump base was going to fly off the handle when this happened but it's very quickly leading to threats of violence and things that are dangerous to the american public. one way -- i'm not saying all the way -- to stop the violence but one way to help would be as much transparency as possible. so the doj to be completely transparent. for donald trump to release that warrant. for us to know what the facts are, why the fbi went in. why this big step was signed off on. because that would help mitigate some of the craziness that is flyi around on the internet right now. we just need -- we need daylight on this as much daylight as possible. to minimize the risks of violence of something crazy happening in the country. >> a lawyer, an elder lawyer told me early on, if you have a jury to think the worst of your client, they will think the worst of your client.

so you put everything out there right up front in the opening statement, let them know everything and then proceed from your case from there. now, listen, i understand, mika, already, even if merrick garland comes out and when he explains all of this, the haters are going to hate, the liars are going to lie, the grifters are going to grift. we get that. but this is for the media. this is for reporters. this is for people of good faith on both sides of the aisle, to understand why what was behind this historic search of a former president's property. he needs -- again, i agree with walter isaacson. he needs to be transparent. >> can i just -- i agree with you, transparency is what i'm pushing for, no matter what it is, that's what we do we want answers. that's what we're built to do. but in this case, i know that we

know, everybody knows, that no matter what comes out, no matter what happens, the far right and trumpists are going to torture logic. to twist the truth. to jump all over things, perhaps -- perhaps even incite a riot. i'm only talking about the things we know. we have witnessed our capitol, our u.s. capitol -- >> right. >> -- get desecrated. vandalized. people died on the steps of the u.s. capitol. >> right. >> people were traumatized for the rest of their lives and people have gone to jail and yet, there are republicans who still won't come clean what happened that day with an assault on our democracy. >> right. >> so it's very difficult, i think, if you're trying to investigation a former president who is a cult leader who can stir up the chaos that he stirred up on january 6 who has a bunch of idiots, a bunch of

idiots, cult followers who megaphone his voice across america, whether it be steve nnon oembers of thedia respected mbers othe mia who are at major cable networks that americans watch all day every day and they listen. and they don't tell the truth, or they don't hold back and wait for the truth. >> right. >> they go where they want to go with it. it is very tough, i think, to find a way to investigate wrong and not create more of a scene or a problem. i mean, we're 24 hours out of this. >> right, mika. >> three weeks from now, i'll be screaming the same thing. >> no, no, no, here's, the thing, like i said, you're going to have, no matter what he does, you are will have these people -- >> it's scary. >> -- who have dedicated their

lives defending a failed reality tv host over all. you'll have them hating. you'll have them grifting and raising money and doing other things that you just said. >> storming. >> but we're a 50/50 nation. i don't really care anymore what conspiracy theorists, idiots, yahoos if they want to to that, stir up those, what can we do that -- that's up to her loved ones to bring them back to create. but i think for those of us, whether it's walter or a lot of people watching today that are concerned about transparency, that are concerned about what the other two-thirds of americans think, it's important. it's important to do this right. because we've seen the consequences of what happens when it's done wrong.

>> yeah. >> and i can bring up several things that went wrong in past investigations of donald trump. like the -- like the dossier. like the steele dossier, by the way, on the first day we said was a lie, actually. but things go wrong in investigations, you need to be transparent. you need to be straightforward. not for the conspiracy theorists, everybody take a deep breath and don't tweet at me. we're talking about the two-thirds of americans and more importantly, the 10% of americans who are going to decide who runs this country over the next two years. those are the peoplehat the doj need to be transparent. >> ll, former vice president mike pence who trumble reported said deserved to be hanged on january 6ths also calling on the doj to explain

his actions. in a tweet, pence wrote that he shares the deep concerns of millionsf americans about the search that is undermines public confidence. >> first o all, that's nonsense. that's absolute nonsense. again, just wanti to be clear here. there's not a deep concern among conspiracy theorists and people who want because of donald trump. so there's a deep concern for mike pence because he thinks, sam stein, this might help him. and lindsey -- we're not talking about what lindsey graham says, always kissing donald trump's -- wee not going to do it. i'm just saying, sam, do you think what the fbi did was within the realm of what they legally needed to do? we have classified documents that donald trump refused to

turn over. classified documents that obviously have to do wh national security. it's just sometng if anybody else in america had ten all of these classified documentso their home after leaving public officethey'd already be in jail. >> yeah. and look, i'm sort of with mika and you, right, obviously, we need more transparency from the justice department here, for the public benefit, i'm a journalist. i'd love to see what's going on, i would love to know what the documents are, for instance. the department position on this is that it's procedure not to talk about these cases and you can get in trouble when you talk about these cases. so the most prominent example would be james comey coming out in the midst of the 2016 campaign in that press conference in a letter announcing he had don anthony

weiner's live shot and we go from there. and that's probably where they're coming from but to your point, joe, someone else can be transparent, too, which is trump who has a copy of the warrant. >> exactly. >> they can talk about what the materials were they believe were taken only to suggest that evidence was planted as the lawyers have. and i guess i would end on the sort of larger picture of what you're getting at earlier, there's an amazing split scene happening right now, trump is going to be questioned by the new york attorney general's office. his campaign yesterday released all of the stats from the mbas. the house ways and means yesterday was granted access to trump's tax forms. and we have the fbi search of mar-a-lago. at the same time, this is all this, at the same time last night, a slate of trump-endorsed candidates won their nominations for critical offices across the country. we have an ex-president under

siege, having multiple front where is he's taken by this. and yet the grift of the republican party remains incredibly strong. i just don't know how tenuous that is for the republican party. >> yeah, this grip remains strong. look at this guy -- please take trump off the screen. please, what have i ever done to you -- look at this guy! this guy brought the republican party in georgia so they won, so democrats won the senate two years ago. this is the guy that has given republicans dr. oz in pennsylvania. >> oh, my god. >> a man with negative ratings. higher than any negative ratings i've ever seen in a competitive setup race and it's not even that competitive anymore. this is the guy that gave republicans in ohio butters,

butters, a guy that said i love silicon valley, i hate silicon valley. i love san francisco. i hate san francisco. this is the guy that's done that. and you look at what's happened in arizona. we've got hope and change, kari lake in arizona. he's table the swing states that he lost an he's back. the craziest wackos. and in georgia, herschel walker, god help us, i need an ovaltine to help figure out what he's saying at all times. this guy is driving the republican party over the cliff. john thune knows that, mitch mcconnell knows that -- they won't say it publicly -- well, said it publicly. and yet this is pulling them

even closer to him. my god, when will they ever learn? elise, i want to follow up on what sam stein said, by the way, sam stein is in the harold ford because he said i agree withoe and i agree with mika. it's being very diplomatic. but there is, there is this need for transparency. and at the same time, you know, democrats don't need to apologize. others don need to apologize. it's the department of justi is doing what the department of justice is supposed to do. going after classified documents th a former public official refuses to turn over. >> which is just insan that boxes of documents we hauled out of the white house. i remember when i worked at the white house as a low-level staffer, in speech writing.

and before i left that time, and before i came back to work at the nsc. i had to be so detailed to make sure anything i'd written on in a meeting with a top official that that was submitted. and really, they did a good job of scaring the death out of me if you broke that law that you would not be right with the authorities. and just to take those documents so cavalierly down to mar-a-lago, it still is just jaw-dropping. said that, how many years is it going to be before we really know what's in the documents that they're classified? i do think the content of the documents is going to matter in terms of how it's going to shape public opinion. and i am a longtime proponent of changing the way the government overclassifies everything over everything, because so much of it is antiquated and unnecessary

for the standards of how we classify. and i wonder if there isn't a big boom or a big there there, that yet again it's going to be another story that donald trump does not face the consequences that anyone else who had committed the act that he did would face. >> yeah. and you're exactly right. it's a couple things, elise, though. first of all, let's follow up also with what sam said about james comey. decided newt indict hillary clinton then held a press conference to explain it. he was rightly criticized. he was roundly criticized from going out. remember we said on the show, you either indict somebody and go after them. or you don't indict somebody, and you shut up. so, i guess it is a little hypocritical to say that merrick garland should be telling us everything today when we actually were critical before of james comey from going out and

worrying about the political nature of the case and talking too much of it by doj standards. so, elise, there is no doubt, as we keep talking about he needs to be more transparent, there is no doubt, there's a balancing act here. >> definitely. and i just -- you read some of the rhetoric that's coming out of the far right, and i feel like the january 6th commission had had political impact, you know, turning the 4% to 5% that needed to turn away from donald trump. and if there's not a big there there i worry that those supporters could see this as yet another example of donald trump the victim. and return to him. >> well, if you're going to go in and execute a search warrant on a former president's residence and business, there better be a big there there. let's just say that now. there better be a big there

there. because it was a very significant act. and there better be a significant concern by the fbi and doj to do that. the more transparent they are, the less questioned they'll have about that. finally, katty kay, i want to, as we talk about the republican water going mad. i want to bring up my favorite tweet yesterday from political hacks who were crying because of donald trump. who will say if this can happen to the president of the united states, it can happen to you. which will i think is the most patriotic thing -- they mean it, what they mean as an insult is actually the greatest compliment to america's rule of law. if you can be found guilty of something, if the fbi can come search your house, they can search a former president's house. to me, that's really reassuring. and it means -- what does it

mean republicans -- >> here we go. >> -- no man is above the law. no woman is above the law. no one is above the law. and katty, how bizarre they don't seem to get that. >> as merrick garland saide was serious that no one is ave the law, not even the arage voter. and i think the thing about this, i agree there has to be a there there because this is an unprecedented step. ifhe white house were involved would they havehosen the week that they were talking about their spending bill victory? i think what's remarkablet really shows that the justice department was independent. and the justice department was functiong in a way perhaps we didn't see during the trump administration in exactly t way it was meant to be functionin no one is above the law. and when they hav something theyave to act on they don't

take the white house's political calendar into account. they did it on their own basis. on the issue of whether is worth the transparencyr any minds are changed, member, these are states that won by 10,000 votes. you don't have to change very many minds but clearly, you don't want to give ammunition to those 4% to 5% that elise was talking about, who are persuadable and swamped by a deluge of outrage when perhaps there is something searched for in the mar-a-lago. we'll continue to cover the developments. as we go to break, some sorry stories making headlines. president biden has signed a bipartisan bill that aims to strength u.s. competitiveness with china. the bill coined the chips and science act will unveil billions

of dollars in science and research. >> it's a good idea. a lot of republicans wanted to kill the bill. >> it will set aside $52 billion to bolster the u.s. computer chip sector. the white house yesterday began touting the immediate impacts of the legislation saying multiple companies spurred by the chips bill have announced $40 million in new investments. and there is some relief at the pumps for millions of americans as gas prices are falling across the country. for the first time since march, the national average yesterday was below $4 a gallon, according to gas buddy. that's down more than a full dollar per gallon from their height earlier this summer. analysts say u.s. gasoline inventories have risen in recent weeks, leading to less demand contributing to the price drop. and another wave of airline cancellations. >> oh. >> and delays taking a toll on passengers across the country. more than 1,000 domestic and

international flights were delayed. and over 100 cancelled yesterday. that's according to the flight tracking website flight aware. those figures are down from monday which saw nearly 7,000 flight delays and hundreds of cancellations. that they're still probably recovering from that. >> horrible. >> on that note, joe -- >> excuse me -- >> joe -- with all of the airline cancellations, we heard you, urging transportation secretary pete buttigieg to take some commercial flights to see the problems first hand. the cabinet secretary may or may not have been watching and he's going to be joining us live to talk with you. >> i can't wait to see him on the commercial flights. plus as sam mentioned, former presidentrump is in new york and ready to testify. we'll get you caught up on the long running civil investigation

in his business dealings in the big apple. plus, a top trump ally gets a visit from the fbi. what agents seized from the pennsylvania congressman. also, the ukrainian army appears to strike deep into occupied territory. we'll have expert analysis on this new development in the war. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. : as families struggle with inflation... congress and president biden are doing something about it. the inflation reduction act will reduce costs for millions of families. it lowers the cost of drugs and ramps up production of american-made clean energy. that means lower energy bills it lowefor families,f drugs jobs for our communities, and the boldest plan to take on climate change we've ever seen. the inflation reduction act will “bring relief to millions of people”

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32, we'll be stronger than ever. stronger than ever. >> you know, mika, it is the sort of thing that americans going day to day, worried about gas prices. >> i know. >> worries about grocery prices, worried about inflation, seeing what's happened with donald trump. they don't really focus on these sort of things. presidents, you know, generals, national security advisers for decades to come will look back at this moment and be grateful for what joe biden, with the help of some republicans in the senate and the house have done to strengthen the nato alliance. when donald trump. wanted to destroy it and adding sweden and finland, my god, again, these are benefits that presidents coming up in the future, whether they're republican or democrat will be grateful for. >> yeah. >> going to make a huge difference. >> he's done an incredible job

with the situation in ukraine. and navigating and trying to ward off potential world war iii, nuclear crisis, and all the things in between, pertaining to nato. and transatlantic security. it's been -- it's been really -- i mean, there are not many leaders on the world stage of democracies and burgeoning democracies who aren't grateful to joe biden for what he has done on the world stage leading into this war. >> by the way, starting with president zelenskyy. >> correct. >> and again, i just want to say president biden has done a masterful job. we all should be grateful. freedom-loving people should be grateful for what he's done. and i want to add, democrats and republicans, have worked together in a bipartisan matter. and that has made a great difference as well. >> yeah. >> and changes in ukraine. more news coming out in war.

really interesting developments. >> they are not giving up. in fact, they're digging in. in ukraine. a series of powerful explosions rocked an air base in the russian-controlled crimea region, killing one person and injuring several others. of course, russia took crimea from ukraine in 2014, i believe. the attack, if conducted by ukraine, would amount to a dramatic escalation in the nearly six-month-old war. "the new york times" reporting that ukrainian loyalists, residents inside ukrainian-controlled areas have been credited with this strike and recent others. it follows widespread phrase from western analysts who say ukrainian forces are reportedly putting western weapons and training to good use. meanwhile, russia's defense ministry insisted that the base was not attacked. >> hold on, baghdad bob lives and he's working in russia.

>> yeah. >> baghdad bob. oh, fire -- fireworks display went terribly wrong. >> in the past, russia has warned kyiv that any attack on crimea which russia annexed in 2014 which i mentioned would trigger a massive retaliation. >> that's a problem, if you're committing war crimes against a country every day, you're taking away the show of strength. >> joining us, former commander james stavridis and also analyst for nbc news and msnbc. and michael wide, correspondent for yahoo! news joins us as well. good to have you both this morning. >> admiral, let's begin with you. we talked with you about the importance of a campaign in the south before weather sets in. i wasn't talking about this far south, but i suspect you may think it's a pretty good idea, strategically. >> it's incredibly good idea.

we can't give russia a pass on, oh, won't attack crimea because you annexed. that's ridiculous. and, by the way, someone needs to tell the russian defense ministry that there are these things called satellites that look down. so, everything that happens on that base is totally clear, including the destruction of some nice tasty number of jets and helicopters. this is a very good move by the ukrainians. and it just shows how well they are burning in, adapting. using the weapons systems that were provided to them. and the second point to be made here, joe, geographically, this shows the ukrainians pushing towards a city called kherson, just north of crimea, controls the water supplies to crimea. that will put more pressure, indeed. the final point, this will cause

the kremlin to have to move troops away from wre they've been blinding it out up to the northern part of that map, showing they're going to have to bias against potential ukrainian gains in the south. overall, very good day for the ukrainians. by the way, joe, one quick point on sweden and finland. look, i know those militaries extremely well. they deployed over my command in afghantan. they're turnkey alliance. great cybercapability. land forces,artillery, ope up a whole new front for the kremlin. it's a good day around the european security search. >> fantastic. michael, i was going to ask you about khern, i saw you talking about it yesterday. let's talk about crimea and the move towards kherson. >> first, joe, is this a

remarkable data point for this idea we must be fearful of calating the war with russia. the russian defenve insisted this was an accident caused by cigarette smoking. it's been a remarkable day. i've been following ukrainian social media, they haven't been this ecstatic since the sinking of the "moskva," the cruise ship. and they had suggested perhaps this was in place in crimea which is also remarkable. this is southwest of the peninsula. about 180 miles from any ukrainian-held territory in the mainland. if this was a sabotage operation, that's pretty impressive. now, if they used ammunition that's even more interesting, again, 180 miles away from any ukrainian launchpad suggests

that ukraine now has long-range capability. precisely what the u.s. has been reluctant to provide. you remember james sullivan a couple weeks ago was asked about the weapons known as attack 'ems, saying we don't want to do them. and maybe the ukrainians have developed their own equivalent to these systems perhaps with u.s. technical support. the whole part of the assistance is what we've talked about on the show, quote-unquote, solutions, right? we don't want to antagonize the russians too much, we find work arounds and finding a rubric of spare parts. another thing we can do is send technicians to ukraine and help them develop their own long-range systems. a senior official of ministry of defense called me yesterday in response to the strike in

crimea, quote, it's just getting warmed up. so as that admiral just pointed out, this is a key strategic move for the confrontation in kherson which is directly north of crimea. >> and more things, i heard the reports talking about the possible u.s. weapons system. and then we started hearing reports of sabotage. i'm a little skeptical, sabotage, that far behind enemy lines could that be a smoke screen to avert away from russian systems? >> oh, absolutely. saying the ukrainian forces are all over us which i think they probably are. it's probably a combination of those two things. militarily, the best situation you can have is special forces on the ground forward, bringing their capability, their

targeting. then add to that drones, unmanned and long range fires, as michael points ou overall a very good day. one thing worth pointing outside that gets to this difficulty that putin is going to have finding the troops to prepare in the south. the russians are evidently going into their prison system and recruiting prisoners, offering them commutation of their sentence if they will go and fight in the front. as well as a cash bonus. boy, that's a country in serious need of manpower. and it ties to the reporting of 70,000 to 80,000 casualties. that's half the force that went in laid out by the pentagon a couple days ago. >> admiral, can we switch gears a bit a look at another subject that you're also looking at. you've got a new piece in "bloomberg" titled the

u.s./china war over taiwan isn't happening anytime soon." there's a lotf speckation that xi may want to move on taiwan rapidly particularly after nancy pelosi's visiterhaps enflamed tensions. you have a different political view, why? >> i'll give you a couple different reasons, katty, number one. president xi is watching and saying and wondering i wonder if my generals are as bad as the russian generals, pretty good question. number two, he's looking at a charismatic leader in zelenskyy. i believe they will fight, madam tsai is very steel, she could be a zelenskyy, in my view. number three can xi is asking himself, gosh, these sanctions, maybe my economy is too big to sanction. well, maybe. certainly a targeted sanction have to have, shall we say, a clarified effect on the chinese

mind. and finally, you know this as well, katty, later this fall, president xi is going to stand for, if you will, re-election. he'll be anointed as the next third-term ---five-year term to leave china. he's not looking for a significant dustup will the united states. so, i look for tensions to kind of come down. and in fact, china announced yesterday they are concluding the military drills around taiw. >> hey, michael, it's sam sin here. i want to think about somethi you said. why couldn't that have been cigarette smoke -- no i'm just dding. wanting to know about the end game theory created in russia. now, obviously, we're months in, tensions continue to boil, what are the actualiplomatic options? are there any? we saw with turkey in exploiting green which seems to be the next

green shoot of optimism. and you picking up any broaching a diplomatic crisis? >> that's a very easy answer and it's no. i think what we're seeing at play here is an attempt to essentially increase ukraine's lerage for any very far away diplomatic solution or attempt to strike. you know, ukraine wants to do at thend of a bayonet that a lot of people have suggested that united states do at the negotiating team. retaking kherson is one way to lift the blockade that russia has imposed. russia has been clear, famine, starvation, hunger, particularly african countries is their way to force the west to lift sanctions. i think the west responds if i'm reading the tea leaves correctly in terms of the latest security package, the kind of things that ukrainians are now able to do

that they weren't weeks ago to say, you know what, don't worry about sanctions relief. we'll lift the blockade ourselves through military means. you know, i was in kyiv just a few weeks ago, every ukrainian official i talked to said that the battle for the south is coming. it's going to start before the end the summer and carry into september. and the crucial thing for us, ukrainians, is to show the west, not only can we hold our ground very well, not only can we take out logistics using high and long range artillery, but we can recapture our own land. remember, at the start of the campaign, february 24th, russia was in control of 80% of ukraine's territory. as of today, russia controls 20%. if ukraine can push that down to 15%, 10%, then they're about where they several months ago. and that puts putin in a very awkward position. >> all right. retired four-star navy admiral

james avridis, thank you. and michael weiss, thank you as well. coming up, we'll go live to wisconsin where a trump-backed election denier has won the republican nomination for governor. >> that should go well. >> plus, steve kornacki will be at the big board to break down the race and across four states. also ahead, we're watching out for new data on consumer prices that could show inflation is coming off its peak. "morning joe" will be right back.

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all right. it's just a few minutes bore the top of the hour. a live look at new york city. sunny and clear this morning over the big apple. welcome back. we're going to get the very latest on the fbi's search of mar-a-lago in just a moment. but first, two oth big developments involving the former president, donald trump has cfirmed that he will testify today in new york state's civil investigation into his own real estate dealings. posting yesteay on his social media website tha he's, quote, in new york city tonight seeing racist new york state attorney general tomorrow -- >> he just wants everybody to know that the attorney general is black -- he just called a black attorney general racist. by the way, don't you love the fact that it's not the doj releasing information about the search. >> wow. >> it's donald trump. it's donald trump putting out

racist statements about other investigations that are going on. i mean, he knows -- like i said, he can release the worth. instead of the statements that appeal to the lowest condenominator. >> really do, both of his children testified, by the way in that probe last week. meanwhile the u.s. circuit court of appeals for washington, d.c. has ruled that donald trump's tax returns can be turned over to the house ways and means committee. first requested back in 2019, the release of the former president's tax returns have been tied up in the court system for years. a federal judge in december tossed out trump's lawsuit which sought to block the house panel from obtaining the returns. so, sam, these new york investigations, the tax returns, what are your thoughts on where

those stand as it compares to the fbi search? >> well, they're not good for trump, right? he's been fighting all this stuff on various fronts, you know, took the tax issue to the supreme court. obviously doesn't want to talk about his businessdealings, he's been incredibly secret from those. i will caution, we're not going to get information on this stuff, at least immediately, they've been turned over to the house ways and means committee. but they're prohibited from publishing them. his deposition if he sits down for it is not going to be published anytime soon. but on the broader scheme, the walls are closed in on this man. he also have to turn over 2016 campaign stuff from the mbas. and if you're trump, it's like one thing after another, yet remarkably, although not that

markably, he still has a tight grip on the republican party and candidates are winning race after race after case. it's cross-currents that i just dot know how tenle they are. >> yeah. we'll be following it all. it's beginning to happen. things are getting real. we are just about at the top of the hour on this wednesday, august 10th. and we're following new developments in the justice department's investigation of donald trump's handling of classified documents and the extremely hypocritica action from the republican party, diurbing really. we're also awaiting a peak inflation expect report expected to give new look into the ecomy. and just in a bit, transportation secretary pete buttigieg will join us to explain why he thinks air tral getting better when major problems continue t perst. katty kay and elise jordan a still with us.

adrienne elrod, she was senior aide to the hillary clinton and biden presidential campaigns. d founder of the conservative website the bulwark, charlie sykes joining us and the reverend al sharpton. good to have you all this hour. a lot going on, joe. >> a lot going on. and a member of the "morng emaile me tay he did not ree wh everody. in fa, he digreed with m a great deal. he said, hey, joe, i disagree with you in transparency regarding trump. there's very good reason, doj poli has always bno not diuss ongoing investigion. the departmentpeaks only aft chgesr a declarion. the reans are whatomey did twice is so -- i'll clean it

up -- screwed up. it's widely unfair to target the instigation to disss the investigation before charges are filed, if ty are filed. th doj didt tell the world about the mar-lago search. trump did. and he did s precisely f this ason, t stir up, a i quote him here, all this shit. >> oh, come on. >> transparency should come if trump is charged, n before. what the doj needs to do is something fast to crgerump or not. and charlie sykes, i take it you likely agree with that as well? it is, again, the important thing to remember here, donald trump has the document. donald trump has the warrant. >> right. >> as hugh hewitt said in his "washington post" comment yesterday, donald trump should release the warrant, all of it,

so we can see what the search is about. what do you think? >> you know, i'm having flashbacks when bill barr frame the mueller report, remember, he came out and did his own summary of it but he did not release the whole report. i think one of the things donald trump has realized there's a certain asymmetry here. he knows that the department of justice will not comment. he's going to come out and frame the issue the way he wants. he saw that bill barr did it with the mueller report. so far, it's working. the problem is asymmetry between the department of justice which has a long-standing tradition of not commenting on the investigation. but you're absolutely right. look, donald trump is holding that warrant. he has the return sheet. he could release that, if he has nothing to hide, he could put that out. so, in terms of the pressure of transparency, that's the easy one. putting -- asking trump, okay, why don't you show us what you

have, rather than the department of justice which at this point, look, is probably gauged in a grand jury investigation. and there are very strict rules about what you can reveal and what you can't reveal from a grand jury investigation. >> so, charlie in your new piece for the "bulwark" you focus on the fbi search writing in part this, they, the fbi, also must have known that by raiding trump's home the doj would be crossing the rubicon. there's no going back now. ifnything, i think i understated the case bause it is about do get very ugly. elected republicans who frequently reminds that you they are the party of law and order, could have, one, adopted a posture of strategic silence. or, two, given the fbi the benefit of the doubt while they conducted a court-sanctioned investigation. instead, they gave us this sort of thing -- end quote. take a look.

threats to defund the fbi. threats to the attorney general himself. claims designed to chip away at trump's institution it goes on, claiming illegal fbi search is the weaponization of government, paul goes on saying. we mustestroy the fbi. i mean, these guys, joe, are a joke. they're a joke. >> well, charlie, they're a joke, a dangerous joke at that. i'll be the first to admit because i guess i at times are a bit too optimistic. before january 6th, i was concerned but i didn't think that what happened on january 6th would ever happen. that people who claimed to love america would ever brutalize police officers and beat them up with american flags. i never thought that they would go in and jam police officers' heads indoors and wipe ex

all over. and showing that absolutely nothing was learned by the insurrection of january 6. >> no, you're right. i mean, this is what is so dangerous about this rhetoric. i mean, we are seeing this massive uptick in violent rhetoric onsites that have been used to foment the juary 6th insurrection. look, we are in a very dangerous situation. it's a very grave, dangerous moment. and this would be a moment where e gwn-ups would exercise a little bit of restraint. would dial down the rhetoric. instead, from kevin mccarthy on down, they are joining in this. delegitimizing the instigation, attacking law enforcement, by the way, awful ironic from the party that made a big issue of defunding the

police. now embracing defunding t fbi. annow this politics of paranoia has so deeply affected the republican party that you are seeing, you are seeing leading republicans who are willing to engage in what amounts to a cover-up. willing to go along with the obstruction of justice in kevin mccarthy's case threatening the debt of justice. and buying into the idea that if e department of justice enrces the rule of law, they will retaliate against them. so we are in a dangerous, dangerous moment here. and for people who think, well, you know, you are exaggerating the danger of political violence, we have already seen the political violence. you have to be in serious denial not to see the kind of rhetori that's going out there. and the kind of rhetoric that is being, i'm sorry, encouraged by electedepublicans who ought to know a better who are creating a permission structure to go along

with this bizarre conflation of a court-sanctioned investigation with the stazi of the gestapo and known regime. thiss the kind of rhetoric, if you saw it coming from progressives, republicans would lose their minds. their hair would be on fire yet now you look at e twitter feed of republican united states senators it's almost indistinguishable. >> so, reverend al, i'm curious, your thoughts about what's going on today in new york city. president trump hself will be taking part in this investigation in the new york attorney general' office into trump's personal situation, real estate holdings. you know, there's been talk in new york for decades about donald trump and what he really owns and doesn't own. but nothing has ever com of it. is this different? >> well, we will not know

because i won't be public. i think it's interesting, though, that he attacks the attorney general as a racist because she's a black woman. sot wasn't a black woman that authorized the raid on his house in mar-a-lago. so, what is that all about? and what about the investigation in georgia? andhat about oer lauits? i rllym aaid thot o usre msing tacthat th man has brought dow what is perceived as worldwide as the diity o the predency othe unitedstates we hav ner had a psident thatas beingraid, su, vestiged all at the same ti. and wre begning that like like a reality show. at's happening in the georgia investigation. what's happening with the attorney general in new york, oh, his house was raided. this is not a banana republic. we should not be talking abo a

ad of state and trying to kee up with his investigation and o's gng toet m. we ought to talking about h we ve ts yr in e mterm election i to 2024 to return the dignity to the office no matter that officeholder is republican or democr. i'm worried that we normalized some kind of low-level of character in the highe offices inhis country. and i think donald trump has unfortunatelyucceed in bringing us on that downslide that we need somebody to bring back up the other side of that mountain. >> well, let's talk about how all of this has impacted our politics. adrian elrod, the results are in. nbc news projects tim michels has won wisconsin's primary for governor. he's the trump-endorsed candidate. he beat out the lieutenant governor rebecca kleefisch who had the support of mike pence. michels has embraced former

president trump's debunked claims that the 2020 election was stolen. michels has also said he's open to efforts to decertify president biden's win in the state. there's no legal way to do that. >> what a clown car. >> yeah. >> he also came out against the so-called raid of mar-a-lago, just like all of these other clowns did. michels will face democratic governor tony ers this fall in what will be one of the top battleground state showdowns of the year. athe same time, three other trp-backed republicans won their primaries and house races in wisconsin. so, he's the scorecard. the six republicans won their imaries for governor with trump's backing. none have said they would have certifie president biden's win in theirespective states in 2020. look at this, across the country. that calls into question whether they would certify their state' results in 2024, if biden or

another democratic presidential nominee were to win in their state. so, adrian, is this threat to democracy? or do you think democrats wl have it together for the midterms to be able to frame what exactly is going on here? >> yeah, mika, it certainly is a threat to the democry. because the map that you just showed, there are at least four swing states on there with competitive states in 2024 in the presidential. if those states are governed by election-denying republicans at the seat of the governor's office in those states that's going to create a very difficult problem for democrats. especially those races that are close. if democrats win, if president biden should he be our party nominee, assuming he will be, if he comes within five or six points, if he wins pennsylvania within five or six points that's a different story. but if the races are close like

they have been traditionally in the past election cycles, pennsylvania wisconsin and michigan if those are governed by elections with republicans that's a difficult hold. i will also say, mika, the republican nominee that won last night in wisconsin wants the state to create a state election board that is governed by political -- essentially political appointees. he wants one person from each congressional district to be on that board. and the way wisconsin is weighted is a heavily republican state in terms of congressional districts. so he wants to politicize the state board of elections which also creates a lot of problems for the way we would make sure that our results in 2024 are tabulated accurately and fairly. so, this is what we're dealing with. it's not necessarily oh, is it a republican going to win or is a democrat going to win? it's more about are we going t protect the democracy, and are we going to have governors and attorneys generals and

secretaries of states to ensure that the integrity of sour electis are protected. and if a lot of these republicans win we're going to have real problems on our hands in 2024. >>elise, over the years, we've heardt's the most important election of our lifetime. people rightly said that in 2020. bu here to 2022, we have a slate of the most republican nominees in our lifetime who are anti-democratic who have said they wouldn't have certified a legitimate win that the courts and evebody else have legitimized. and so the stakes are absolutely massive. i, of course, again, perhaps being too optimistic, beg to think that the republicansave already set themselves up to lose in a historic manner in a lot of these statewide races. but who nose if the republican way is big enough. could have election deniers running these swing states. and the threa of democracy

would be extraordinarily eat. >> well, joe, as aienne just said, you look at that board that we saw there, for states that are up for grabs that an election denier could win, it's really not even about getting yo partisan majority so you can get your policy preferences in congress. it's about pserving american mocrac at this point. so ma locations acrosshe nation. and, specificly, with wisconsin, what i'm curio out is democrati enthussm. and, charlie, d you have any insight, it's going to matter so much if demrats are charged up in wisconsin. it's really make or break. and mandela barnes is a more progressive candidate. so it's going to be tgher for him in a general election but ron johnson was always unpopular. so potentially could that be a democratic pickup? >> i could be. it is going to be difficult, but, you know, there are three

factors that might drive democratic turnout in wisconsin. and you're absolutely right, he needs big votes out of madison. he needs big votes out of milwaukee. number one is donald trump, if donald trump announces for the midterms that's all democrats need to do to rile up their base number two, i think you wl see -- the overtuing of roe v. wade is just a big wildcard in wisconsin because the governor's race becomes a binary choice, we either will been abortion or remain legal. there's no doubt about who will control the legiature. those two things, i think, are significant, as well as, of course, ron johnson continuing to say bizarre things like medicare and social security should be made discretionary spending. so it's going to be a very, very close election here. once again, you saw last night, donald trump's clout, you know, it's the candate-backed by

scott walker and mike pence and virtually the entire business community. the law enforcement community. republicanstablishment was defeated by basically a carpetbagging election denier who was -- had the one thing going for him that he was supported by donald trump. well, that's goi to be an issue in the fall, tony evers is a vulnerable incumbent but he's able to tie michels to donald trump. >> think about this, a carpetbagger -- this is crazy, you got a carpetbagger now in wisconsin. >> yeah. >> you got a carpetbagger in georgia. who herschel walker -- where's he in? not georgia -- texas, that's right. you got a carpetbagger in pennsylvania, dr. oz, let's see, did he -- no, he voted in turkey. that's right. you got a carpetbagger in ohio who says he loves san francisco, he loves silicon valley. he loves venture capitalism, and

he's wearing -- oh, so cute, he's wearing his little venture capitalism vests at one of those conferences -- i love silicon valley -- then he goes to ohio, takes off the silicon valley vest and grows a beard and says, i hate silicon valley. so, you got all of the carpetbaggers in all of the states, all of the election deniers. if democrats ten years ago could have put together a plot to destroy the modern republican party and find a guy who could win in 2016, but then lose the house and lose the senate and then lose the white house. go over backwards, bent over backwards to lose the state of georgia, two senate races in georgia with two progressives, and then two years later, pick

carpetbaggers who are crazy kooks who are not going to do well in the general election. nobody could be that smart. trump is doing more to destroy the republican party than teddy kennedy ever imagined doing, ever dreamed of doing. >> no i think that it is very clear that donald trump is the gift that keeps on giving. the question, a really, the main queson, as i see it, is whether or not t democrats can rise to this occasion and take advantage of it. if what all you just laid out and it is so correct how you laid it out, if the democrats cannot defy history, in the midterm elections and stay in plac and maybe gain and march into 2024, given all that you st laid out, and givenhat

trump has now gone to ts whole questions of one investigation after another and that biden has now been able to pas a major piece o legislation, and able to get a founderf al qaeda killed i the same week, on and on, some victories. solid victories biden has had. if the democrats can't operate with this hand then my judgment of them will be even lower than that of the republican kook that are running around in various states it would be the most incompetent political party in american history. >> all right, reverend al, stay with us, adrienne elrod, thank you so much. charlie sykes, you as well. still ahead on "morning joe" it's been a rough year for airline travelers. a rough couple of years. we've already had more cancellations and delays than all of 2021. transportation secretary pete

buttigieg is standing by to talk about saul of the issues and what's being done to evolve them. plus, the futures board is moving high. and a key economic report could have a huge impact on the markets. cnbc joining us live to break down what's ahead for wall street today. we'll be right back. age is just a number. and mine's unlisted. try boost® hh protein with 20 grams of protein for muscle health. versus 16 grams in ensure high protein. boost® high protein also has key nutrients for immune support. boost® high protein. shingles. some describe it as pulsing electric shocks or sharpstabbing pains. ♪♪ this painful, blistering rash

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>> tech: when you have auto glass damage... choose safelite. we can come to you and replace your windshield. >> grandkid: here you go! >> tech: wow, thank you! >> customer and grandkids: bye! >> tech: bye! don't wait, schedule now. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ explain something to me. if you're flying a plane up in the air and you run into this kind of bad weather, what do you do? you know, well, he said, we try and go around it. i said, well, why can't we try and go around this? i also had a carry-on. so, i'm schlepping that all over the place. you know, they're making you run

from this terminal to that terminal. >> oh, my gosh. frustrated traveller in florida, reacting to yet another weekend of major disruptions at united states airports. and, joining us now, u.s. secretary of transportation pete buttigieg. >> i'm very excited to see how this week of flying on commercial aircraft has gone. >> now, stop it, joe. >> secretary, pete, thank you for being with us. so, let me first ask you about the bailouts. and the airlines. we, taxpayers, give them billions and billions of dollars in bailouts. they decide to use that opportunity to push pilots and flight attendants out. all right. we understand, right, corporations are going to do what corporations do. they're going to try to make money. covid, once in a 100-year pandemic. we get all of that. my question is, secretary pete, what are we doing -- what are you doing to make this situation

better so people like that woman aren't going to be stranded in airports in september? >> well, that's right. look, a lot of passengers, including me, right, i'm on an airliner if not every day, several times a week, have seen the kind of breakdowns across the system. that are incredibly frustrating when we have supported the airlines in order to keep them in business. now, don't get me wrong, i strongly believe that keeping the airlines in business was the right thing to do, preventing mass layoffs and preventing the actual collapse to the airlines during the worst days of covid but they took and accepted a huge amount of taxpayer support. a lot of people are saying, okay, the american people did our part to keep the planes in the sky. why is this system, why are these airlines often not prepared to service the tickets that they're selling. that they're collecting revenue on right now? the rules of the bailout said

that you couldn't fire anybody. you had to keep people on your payroll. but what they did do was see a lot of pilots into early retirement. and now, they don't have enough pilots. and sometimes, there are other staffing or crew issues. so there's several things going none my department to hold airlines accountable. we've got a new rule out right now, which one expert described as the largest expansion of passenger rights in decades. it's out for comment, you can go into regulation.gov, that's actually the website, regulation.gov to weigh in and we'll get comments from the passenger experience. we've got a consumers complaints division. they're getting more complaints coming in than we've ever seen, at one point, triple the normal level. by the way, you should know, if you have an experience where your flight gets cancelled. that happened to me, for example, on friday. and the airline does not offer

you a refund, you can't get a refund, we will enforce the requirement that they do provide you with that refund. we just issued last year the biggest fine in the history of the program from an airline that wasn't doing the right thing. we've got a number of action investigations right now. you know, when the right thing to do is to roll up our sleeves to bring the airlines to the table and work with them. i prefer to do that. we're also going to use our enforcement powers to make sure paengers have a better experience. >> well, let me askyou, mr. secretary, have you talked to t ceo of american, of southwest, of united, jetblue, delta. i'm looking at yesterday, 399 domestic flights cancelled. over 6,000 delayed. almost 1 in 3 of american's flights delayed. 1 in 3 of southwest flights delayed. 1 in 3 of jetblue's flights delayed. before the pandemic, i led jetblue. now, i know it's as much chance

of a boston red sox plar getting a good hit as there is of my jetblue flight taking off. it's absolutely --ou know the thing is, pete, you know, if i don't make my flight, you know, nbc will figure it out. we got people whose livelihoods depend on getting on those flights. or who have kids, have minors, trng to get back from visiting grandmom that are stuck in an airport that missed three flights. i have somebody whose 14-year-old had three flights ncelled on them. you talk about them having to scramble. here's the thing, mr. secretary, we hear it ery day from our friends and from our relatives. and from people who are aren' as fortunate enough as us to be able to figure out a way, and you, out of the crisis. like, we need relief. what are the ceos telling you about what they're going to do? >> yeah. so, i've been talking to them a

lot. brght them all in after the memorial day weekend whi you might remember had an unacceptable level of cancellations and delays. here's what we talked about. first of all, we talked about realistic schedules. we have to make sure you got schedules on the book that you can actually serve with the staf that you do have. don't let somebody get to the airport before you figure out that you never actually had the right means to service that flight. we're talking about customer service, right? there are some times where there's severe weather that can't be avoided and can be has cancelled their delay. at least get people on the phone, we've seen people waiting four, six, eight hours in order to get to a human being. and talking about stfing. now, that's not new, i've been looking at that since we got here. but looking at how the airlines can step up to make sure they can do that including the classic way to deal with the shortage of something which is to pay properly

>> right. >> since that time, we've seen a number of step, s regional carriers making dramatic improvements in pay. i think that is going to make a big difference. we've seen a thinning out of the schedule. obviously, last weekend, we saw more than 4% of flights cancelled. that might not sound like a t-if you get anywhere north of 2%, tt's enough to mess with the entire system >>ight. >> you're seeing that the system is so brittle that with blue skies, the weather is fine, still not making it happen. the entire system blinds to -- i wouldn't say a halt, but it stops wking and that is a consequence of them not being ready, not being prepared. and we need to have more fluid system. so many of us, in addition to addition to frequent business travel or people, you know, trying to get home to see their kids, we as have a lot of

pent-up demand, people who haven't taken that trip, vacation or family reunion in two years. it's a good thing that the band is back, but the airlines have to be ready to meet that demand. >> it's very clear that you understand the problem, but i guess the question for these airlines is, is there a deadline that you are giving them for peak performance? and if so, when that is? i mean, at what point can american travelers feel like things are going to be back to normal and expect only the normal things, the normal cancellations and delays that you usually have to deal with, with regular airline travel? when can airlines get back to peak performance? are you giving them a deadline? and what are the consequences if they don't meet it? >> yeah. so, the right time for this to happen obviously is yesterday. the number i'm most looking at is the daly cancellation rate and watching that get back to below the level we saw before the pandemic. not at but actually below what

we were seeing before. now if an airline looks for -- the deadlines for some of the things we require of airlines are very quick. for example, a turnaround on the refund if they can't get you to where they got to go is a quick one. and ifthy don't meet that, we will fine them and enforce on that. at the end of the day, these are private businesses that are selling tickets and they need to meet the obligations of their customers. so, we're going to continue to make sure there's a framework of rules to hold them accountable. they need to step up and service the tickets that they sell. >> mr. secretary, we have to get through the end of the summer. and then presumably, there's going to be a dropoff in demand. and that should ease some of the pressure in the system. people won't be traveling so much for the holiday. then we head into thanksgiving holiday and christmas holiday. what are the guarantees that the airline industry doesn't breathe a sigh of relief. after the summer crush is over saying we've got this figured pout. and then the next time the

holiday hits the airline pielt are still retired? >> i think they're feeling the pressure and the heat is on. they're experiencing pressure from us and policymakers saying what's going on here and from the press. i do think you're right, we're going to see it level out coming out of summer but then the holidays are just around the corner. and again, so many of us didn't take that trip last year or the year before that and are ready to go this time. i do think over time that gives the pilot training pipeline a chance to catch up. obviously, training a pilot, getting them safely in the cockpit, not something you can do overnight. they need to make sure they have that pipeline coming and ready. and we're looking and continuing to visit facilities and places that train people and support people in earliest part of their career. that's also going to give us a chance to optimize things with air traffic control that we've been working on with the faa

that can also play a role here but i do think the winter holidays will be a test. because we will have gotten out of this summer season. and the airlines will have had more time to make adjustments that they have assured me that they are making right now. we're going to be all among the millions of air passengers to see h they did. >> mr. secretary, lete ask you about this, about the age limit on pilots. i gue it's 55 right now. >> yeah. >> we have to look at raising it -- we've got presidents, last two presidents have been in their 70s. we've got a speaker of the house who, i think, most democrats think is doing a great job in her 80s. we have supreme court justices that go well into their 80s. i mean, maybe 65 is retirement back in the 1960s and 70s but it doesn't make sense anymore. why can't we raise that retirement age from 65 to, say, at least 69? >> so, here's what i'll say. the job requirements for certain

workers, surgeons, pilots, members of the military, are different than the job requirements for other roles. and every rule that we have around pilot qualifications is around safety. i do want to make sure we don't forget something. the number of passenger deaths in airline crashes last year was zero. and the year before that, zero. and the year before that, zero. and we got to remember that that is a big deal. 40,000 people die on our street it's every single year. by the way, i consider that to be a crisis and we're working on that. but the fact that a form of transportation that involves taking dozens, hundreds of people, putting them in a medal tube, shooting them through the sky at the speed of sound and returning them safely to the ground, and millions and millions of passengers every single year with zero, at least recently, do not take that for granted, but zero crashes resulting in airline deaths. that's not just something that just happens.

that's something that happens because every day, the faa, my department and all of the professionals in this field work to make sure it's absolutely safe. so, in order to be open, look, we want to be a factor, of the administration, we're always interested in ideas. but in order to be open to anything affecting the qualification or readiness of air crews or pilots, we have to be absolutely confident that there will be no impact on safety. as of right now, all of these rules related to pilotsre there for very good reason. >> secretary pete, you saidhat these airlines are private businesses, and that is absolutely true. but i don't necessarily believe that just goodwill is what drives people in big business. what penalties can you say that you're telling airlines if they don't reach targets that you just discussed, that they will

suffer? what is it that the government can do, when you have millions of people, as you know, i travel a lot, millions of people being stranded, disrupted that will not get this summerback, what penalties wil an airline say we must gethis done by end of septemr or beginning of december, whatever it is. >> yeah. >> wt does the government say that you will be penalized? >> yeah, you'r right. look, these are private profit-making businesses. they're not goi to do some of these things just because or just because someone asked them nicely. that's why the rules have to have teeth. so, there are three things that i would point to in terms of what gives us the backing to enforce. first of all, fines. direct fines that assess that they will need to pay up, multimillion-dollar fines, if they are caught in unfair deceptive practices. or failing to meet their obligations to passengers and consumers. secondly, being forced to pay

the consumers. so it's one thing for them to have to write a check to the treasury in the form of a fine what we think is usually the best thing to happen to make sure the passenger, the customer is made right, made whole. and the third is, often airlines are asking for consideration in various policy things that are important to them. and to the extent that the law provides for it, you know, we have a responsibility to make sure that's in the public interest. part of how you can tell, if some of these things that the industry wants permission to do might be in the public interest is look at how they're treating passengers. our passengers that are off because of what has happened in the airlines so far. are they better off after all the mergers and confirmation and consolidation that's happened? that's something that we take very serious look at. anytime that they're coming through. and the best data on that, of course is what happened to prices. and what happened to the passenger experience. but, yeah, this is not just us wringing our hands saying that's

every step we take with the enforcement power that this department has. >> all right. u.s. secretary of transportation pete buttigieg. thanks very much for coming on this morning. we'll have you back in, and we'll be watching. thank you. coming up, it's been about one year since the u.s. began its withdrawal from afghanistan. but our next guest has new details about the chaos on the ground during the taliban's takeover of kabul. marine veteran eliot ackerman joins us with his account of america's end in afghanistan. "morning joe" will be right back.

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really want to say, everyone in that condition. i pray for you too much. because you're the first and last hope for us. and especially for my kids, for

my family. i also pray for you, sir. i don't care about myself. my only worry is my kids, my family. yesterday marked one year since the u.s. began its withdrawal from afghanistan. and this morning, we're learning more about just how chaotic it was on the ground. our next guest is a journalist who served in afghanistan, as a marine and cia officer until 2011. and last summer he worked by text message to help afghans who worked with the u.s. to escape the country as the taliban came back to power. this video reel shows what he received from one family as they literally fled for their lives to the kabul airport. it's all part of abrand-w book eitled he fifthact: amica's end to afghanistan."

joining us the author of tha book, ellt ackerm, thank you for joining us this morning elise jordan has the first yes. elise. >> elliot, i had a friendho helped ahans fleen those ments of terror, momts of terror that still exists for our afghan friends who weren't able to leave the country. how do you think america did? what grade would you give us how we answered our moral obligation to help those who believed in americans and did so much to keep americans working in afghanistan safe over the years? >> well, i think i wouldn' necessarily gives a particularly good grade with how the withdrawal from kabul went. you know, i sort of struggle at times, you know, what is the appropriate word. and the word i certainly end on is collapse. in many ways there was a collapse of american morals and

our ability to kind of adhere to our own idealistic standards. and sort of tried to be dragged back in to help the afghans out. and it was a level of competence. not the competence of service members at the airport by all accounts were doing a heroic job under incredible a difficult circumstances but more a collapse of broader american confidence over 20 years of war. because afgnistan at the end of the day it was unequivocal defeat for the united states. >> elliot, do you have any sense of afghans who did make it out, being supported now in the u.s.? my sense from having helped a couple there's not a whole lot of support here.

they're given work permits and then they're pretty much left on eir own. for those who came out by themselves, it's not easy to find a way to make a living, to get the kind education you need and the pull that you need. have you gotten a sense that the dod has tried t help the people that managed to get out afterwards? >> thanks so much for that question, katty. >> there are absolutely challenges. we have thousands, now, of afghans resettling here in the united states and making their lives here. and the support structures are being built, but they're not adequate right now. and that's why it's so important to support measures of the afghan adjustment act which is winding its way through congress at the moment which would give many of these recently resettled work families the work status they need to get jobs a ply for citizenship and make their lives here in the united states. it's one of the reasons why it's so important that we don't forget last summer.

we don't forget the enduring obligations we have to all the afghans now here in america and hopefully will soon be american citizens. >> all right. you know, this is something that always has been so difficult, a debate, over the past decades and years and years, but also how we did is going to go down history. the new book is "the fifth act: america's end in afghanistan." ellio ackerman, thank you for writing the book. we appreciate your reporting. just ahead, the gig grift never misses an opportunity for more money. how trump world is trying to cash in on the fbi's search of mar-a-lago. "morning joe" is coming right back. (vo) you can be well-dressed. you can be well-mannered. (man) oh, no, no, after you. wahoooo! (vo) you can be well-groomed.

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sportsmanship at a little league competition. bc news correspondent gabby schwartz reports. >> oh, look out. a heart-stopping moment at that, during a playoff game and a heartwarming displ of sportsmanship. it started when a fastball from the pitcher hit the batter. i sayial jvis with a sign to the head. jarvis dropped in pain. >> i felt the pain. >> to the relief of players and fans recovering quickly. >> wow, that's a tough kid right there. >> meanwhile, pitcher kaolin shelton visly shaken. unexpected curvebl, striking moment, jarvis going to the pitcher and holding him in a hug. >> i wanted make sure he was all right. i wanted to make sure that he knew that i was all right. >> we felt bad for even other.

he felt bad for me. he felt bad that i was crying. he came and hugged me. >> the crowd gave a standing ovation. >> this is the best thing i've ever seen in little league baseball. >> to be completely honest, he started walking to cayden, the thgs tha he sd toayden and the w he hugged him, isiah, you're a great kid. you're amazing. >> and ty started to cry. it's a hightakes game. obviously it's a w o go home at thatmoment, tt whatame t of him was to be a big person. just overwlmed with pride for him. >> and of course, the ge was stilon, and then beati tulsa aded t t little lgue world series. at that one moment, sportsmanship and a trophy and new friendip tha players say ll endure. you guyset a few ds ag do y tnk thefrndship is gointo stay alive.

>> yeah, i think so. >> good luck. >> thanks! oh, my gosh, we needed that. the fbi search is a reminder that trump has always been a national security reat. th dailyeast iere to explain that. "morng joeis comg right back. back shingles. the rash can feel like an intense burning sensation and last for weeks. it c make ur workday el impsible. the virus that causes shingles is likely alrey inside of you. 50 years or older? ask your doctor about shingl.

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it is the top of the third hour of "morning joe." welcome back to "morning joe." it's wednesday, august 10th. donald trump is set to be deposed in new york state's investigation into his business dealings today. just days after the fbi seized about dozen boxes from mar-a-lago. in its investigation over his handling of presidential records. as things heat up for theormer president on the legal front, his grip on the replican party remains as strong as ever.

in sconsin, a trump-endorsed candidate for governor moves on to the general election, while decrats pick their candidate to challenge senator ron johnson. we'll get a live report from this key state in the battle to control the senate. katty kay and elise jordan are still with us joining the conversation we have the host of "way too early with jonathan lemire" and wte house bureau chief at politico and best-selling author of "the big lie" jonathan lemire. columnist for the daily beast david rothkopf joins us this hour. and president and ceo of the leadership council on civil and human right, maya ley joins us this rning. good to ve you all this hour. let's start with the latestn the search of donald trump's florida ho. the fbi seized about a dozen boxes from mar-a-lagon monday. trump returned 15 boxes to the national archis several months ago. but sources familiar with the matter tell "thwashington

post" officials were concerned theyad not yet received all of the white house material that was improperly ten to mar-a-lago. trump's attorney, christina bobb, said the former president's legal team, has been in discussions with t justice department since the spring about whether additional records were being stored at mar-a-lago. >> i don't think that there was actually anything there that's worth while. we'll see what they come up. you know, if they did, it will be interesting, especially since they precluded me from actually watching what they did. but at this point i don't necessarily think they would go to the extent of trying to plant information. i think they just make stuff up and come up with whatever they want. that's the way they will have to proceed in oer to actually try to indict are the president because they don't have anything. there's nothing there. >> "the new york times" reports the investigation is being led by the justice department national security division. and, joe, your thoughts on this,

and trump's attorney sing they have nothing. does that add up? to what a search warrant usually requires. >> they have nothing if trying to overthrow the federal government they have nothing. well, there's that. >> which leads thi question, we have that evidence that we all saw tell play out on janua 6. donald trump does everything publicly. >> right. >>e have all of the trumpers that work for him, that supported him through impeachment. that defended him on the senate floor coming out and saying that this guy was trying to overthrow an election. he committed sedition, you got all of these working class, middle class people, going to prison. for following donald trump's lead. wenow he -- we know he's guilty of that. we just do. it's out there. and it' going to be up to the

justice department to connect the dots. here's the thing, though, mika, i just -- iannot believe that yesterday's raid was just about documents. i cannot believe when you have the evidence -- >> was it really a raid? >> well, not a raid. the search. i can't believe that yesterday's legal judiciallyanctiod arch o his premises is a about docunts. it was just abo documents. this is, again, it' an awfully dramatic step to take when this is one of the smaller pts of a posited case against a former president who tried to overthrow the federal government. so, we'll see what happens. i certainly take john heilemn's correction to heart

when he does remind us of everything james comey did wron when he smed to talk hi way through the hilry clinton case. this is something we don't want e justice department -- we don't want the justice dertment toimpede. it's just it would be helpful to as much transparey as ssible. and, of urse, that could all stt with donald trump releasing his warrant and letting us know exactly wt they searchedfor, exactly what they're concerned out. instead of issuing these statements that he throws out like meat to rabid dogs. >> well, david, let's rea then from your piece from the daily beast which is entitled "the fbi search of mar-a-lo is a reminder that trump has already been a national security threat. "the flaws in trump's character, his ignorce and contempt for

our laws and institions and his dubious loyalties made h the most dangerous and powerful ma in the world. and that thrt remains, as he seems like to run for president for a third time. in many ways, he's even more brave, as trump and his supporters vote increasingly brazen in their embrace of ideas that could render the nation unable to protect itself against him in the future. republican howls of protests in the wake of the fbi's search of trump's florida residence were as loud as they we cynical, hypocritical and irresponsible. perhaps the most significant is the gross irresponsibility of the gop defenses of trump. their complete renunciation of any claim ty once had on being a party that stood for strong u.s. national security. trump has been a multifaceted national security threatince he arrived on the national

stage. it would be bad enough to see democracy fall, but if it falls to trp, inevitable consequence would be that the u.s. would become weaker. our enemies stronger, and the danger to each and every american would grow both from home and from abroad. and, joe, it wou be our doing, woulde theoing of the complicit republicans, to a known moron, idiot, fascist -- i mean, there are a million different facts that i can attribut to those words. getting dirt from a political rival, on a political rival from ukraine. acting in a racist way. you know, pushing pple to come to the capitol and urging them to go and do something big time. everything he does is either stupid or cruel. >> well, i mean, let's jus call it what it is.

it's fascism. and it's been fascism. january 6 was fascism. his violent imagery, fascism. telling pple to go back to where they came from. men who were members of congress. and these cls to violence, proud boys, stand back, standby. >> my god. >> everything leadingnto january 6. scism. and, david, it's also seditious behavior. it's clear cut. listen, i'm a lawyer, i'm not a good lawyer, but i'm a lawyer, and you look at the u.s. code and it fits all four corners of sedition. he was deliberately trying to stop congress from following through. but a constitutional action. it's just -- it's that simple. >> it is that simple, but that's only one of the crimes that he committed. you know, i don't want to

minimize january 6th. i don't want to minimize the coup attempt. but what will w see -- just saw in the past week, we saw with the revelation about trump and his war with his generals and that he wants them to treat them like the hitler's generals treated them through to this raid, is that in addition to everything else, trump is a national security threat he was a national security threat when he reached out t the russians to help him win the election. he was a national security threat when he handed over classified information to them, both in the white house and then, you know, handed over other classified information at parties at mar-a-lago. when he gave his kids national security clearances against the advice of people. when they put unqualified people in the head of our intelligence agencies. and i think we have to keep an eye on this, because this is a man who wants to become president again.

and so, yes, he wants to undermine our democracy. but after he undermines our democracy, what's he going to do with that. who's he going to serve? >> right. >> and how are we going to suffer? >> yeah, maya wiley, there's been a lot of questions being raised about the search and warrant. which donald trump refuses to release. he releases instead statements by crank. so there's been a bit of debate back and forth on how transparent the doj needs to be, gimp the historic nature of this search. war your thoughts of that balancing act that merrick garland and the doj should walk? >> well, here's the thing, this is a criminal investigate. criminal investigations are not done in public. that's why you'll so often here federal agencies, local law enforcement, if it's a local issue, saying we can't comment. and the reason for that is two-fold.

one is you don't want to create a debate about what the evidence is. or isn't, when you're still collecting it. and secondly, you don't want to expose how you're investigation or what you're investigating so that you don't tip off anybody else that you may be going after. a subpoena, or in this case, a search warrant in and of itself is not a claim that the person is guilty of a crime. and we should all remember that. in this case, i think to your point, and to david's, what we have is a pattern of behavior by donald trump then out publicly, subject of two impeachments, when we want to talk about national security, but also the obstruction of a process of uncovering what he has done as one of the most powerful people in the country. that all of that, including 15 boxes of records owned by the federal government, not by the

person donald trump, including national security classified documents, documents that the national archives said, and i'm paraphrasing here but essentially said had contents, some of which had contents that would be extremely dangerous in the united states if exposed. right. national security. in the hands of what is now a private citizen in a vulnerable location. that all of those are publicly known. all of those are things that are quite transparent. and yet, so all we really need to understand here is that in order to get the search warrant in the first place, the federal bureau of investigation had to be able to back that request up with sufficient evidence and sufficient credibility that they had probable cause to get a judge, who, by the way, does not report to the white house, does

not report to merrick garland and reports to no one else but the judge himself. has to decide whether or not it's legally sufficient. that's called a check and a balance in our system. that's what we need to know and understand. and every person out there attacking this is essentially attacking nonpoliticized and independent law enforcement. and that's what we have to be aware of. >> yes. and jonathan lemire, let's talk about the politics of this, especially the republican side, as one trump candidate after another trump candidate wins -- wins these elections. mark halpern's wide world of newsletter this morning had a quote from a republican operative who said, we had trump in the corner. we had desantis in our sights. everything was lined up. and they have gone -- and i don't know who "they" is, they've gone and thrown this guy

another lifeline. now, republicans are forced to go to bedminster, now republicans are forced to show their loyalty, their fealty, to donald trump. i'm just curious, are you hearing those frustrations, too, from rem can leaders on the hill? who understands donald trump calls from the white house. donald trump caused them control of the united states senate. and donald trump caused them control of the house of representatives. >> yeah. and this is a moment where many in the party were quietly ready to move on. we know there are some republicans who are moving ahead wi the 2024 bid, whether or not or trump declares his own candidacy, at minimum, there are republican leaders who want trump to stay as far off stage as he can this year, before the midterms and deal with them next. but it does seem, though, there's been a jolt of energy around trump right now. that speaks volumes, not good

volumes, about the republican party wheret is. but they're still responding to him in this way. and, yes, in fact, trump according to my reporting and others, trump has told people in recent days that he's been very heartened by how many republicans have come to his defense. even someone like mitch mcconnell who has opposed to him since leaving office. and mitch mcconnell saying last night they needed an explanation asap as to what happened. trump is there and the republicans are rallying with, going to bedminster, some talking about going to mar-a-lago to have some protest there. there is a sense, they're rallying around him at least for now. now, could that change oe we learn the contents of these documents? once we learn why the fbi really went in there? and sources tell me there's a reason. they wouldn't g in there if it wasn't really signifant, if they weren't really concerned about the nate of the

classified information that trump had. what he might be doing with it. who he might be showing it to. these are real national security concerns. so perhaps those overwhelm the politics of the moment, at least for this parcular minute. this has sengthenedhe party, all insiders agree. >> david, to jonath's point, we see that viewpoint reflected in "the wall street journal" opinion page, the editorial, which represents a certain elent of the republican donor class, y could say, as more establishment thinking. and they're just citing, they've been pretty tough on donald trump and his complicity january 6th, regarding this and merrick garland and fbi going to mar-a-lago, they're saying, well, hillary clinton mishandled classified information but she was never prosuted. what he did may be politically

despicable to january 6 there has to be criminal liability. is what they've done made a case for criminal liability? >> for donald trump? >> with january 6th. >> oh, january 6th, i think they have a strong case for liability. this was his plan, his plot. people working for him executed the plot. the plot was seditious, as joe said. and, you know, i think there are many points along the way that they did that. and i'm not even talking about efforts that trump has undertaken to obstruct justice or to cover up the disappearance of records and other kinds of things that are associated with it. so, i think his criminal liability is great there. but there's another point that i'd like to make which ties to, you know, joe's earlier point about fascism. one of the responses of the republican party, of donald trump, of leaders across the party, in the wake of this fbi search, is let's get rid of the

fbi. let's get rid of the doj. let's fire people across the government. this ties to trump's call for this section "f," you know, right to fire 50,000 people in the government. why? because when he gets back into power, what he wants to have is a government full of people who are loyal to donald trump. loyal to the republican party. and who place inecond place their oath to the constition and to the country. and that is the groundwork for authoritarianism that we're going to have to dea with. and it's not just trump. every republican majoreader right now is saying we've got to get rid of this guard rail because it's causing us too much trouble. >> let's actually pause this conversation and turn to the primaries which really reflect trump's grip on the republican party. and, you know, new people coming on the state level.

reflecting some of the problems that we've already experienced as a country. nbc news projects tim michels has won wisconsin's republican primary for governor. the trump-endorsed candidate beat out the state's former lieutenant governor rebecca kleefisch who had the support of former vice president mike pence. michels will face democratic governor tony evers this fall in what will be one of the top battleground state showdowns of the year. at the same time, three other trump-backed republicans won their primaries in house races, in wisconsin. an nbc news projects withes with's lieutenant governor mandela barnes has won the state's democratic senate primary. nbc news correspondent shaquille brewster is live for us in madison, wisconsin. shaq, break it down for us. what more do you know? >> reporter: hi there, mika, well, the general election battle in one of the nation's

most crucial battleground states is now set. that field is now clear. and on the republican side it will be tim michels taking on democrat tony evers. and michels won despite the fact that his opponent lieutenant governor or former lieutenant governor rebecca kleefisch was the early favorite in the race. she was only the lieutenant governor for eight years but served under scott walker and was backed by vice president pence and many of the local groups in the state because of how early she got into this race. but it was that endorsement by former president donald trump that michels said help boosted him over the finish line. you see the margin, it was five percentage points that he won in this battle. that's the governor's race but then there's also the senate race. well that was the race we expected to be more competitive. that we expected to be a true nail-biter. but one in which you saw the democratic field completely clear out in the past two weeks. the race to take on republican

ron johnson, one of the most vulnerable senators in the country. there you see mandela barnes, the lieutenant governor of this state, winning that primary. i want you to listen to a little bit of what we heard of mandela barnes last night and how he set up this battle against ron johnson. >> while ron johnson continues to stack the deck against us, i'm going to tell you that we're not going to give up. because in our greatest challenges, our greatest opportunities, we have the opportunity to bring back good paying jobs to wisconsin and to rebuild this middle class. the middle class that gave me an opportunity to stand in front of you today. >> reporter: now, it was not a clean sweep for those who former president trumpndorsed here in this state. theongest serving assembly speaker robin vos. he did win his primy. he hung on to his seat by a couple hundred votes, mika.

>> all right. nbc's shaquille brewster, thank you very much. >> maya, let me bring you back in here. mika will tell you i always preach against catarocizing, saying it's going to be okay. we've taken a detour, wre going to be fine. don't worry. in fact, i've bn telling my parents, obama, and telling relatives, friends to the right, what you read, on somebody on the west side when the tea party wins, we'll get through this too. there are elections every two years. i find myself sounding like edge i've bn telling to calm down my whole life. because it sounds like an overstatement, but whe you have election denying people, some of them fascists, that are sweeping

through republican primaries, they're anti-democratic, and have told us they will onl support winners in eltions, like orban and putin, if their side wins, then suddenly, democracy does -- please forgive me for catastrocizing, democracy does seem to be on edge, does it not? >> it does, joe. i'm going to say this as a black woman, it is not always okay. and so, i want to marry this to david's very important point about democracy and the threats to democracy. because and wisconsin is a great example of this, you know, the great lie, as we call it, that led to the second impeachment of donald trump also centered on something we've seen in wisconsin that is barring people from voting. and particularly in places like milwaukee, where we have seen

election officials threatened because of lies around voter fraud. and a state that has actually made it much more difficult for people to vote, particularly people of color, that is a threat to democracy. that is why we need voting rights and we all need it. and we have to pay attention to that. donald trump has been one of the biggest attackers of that very important principle. and the republican party for the first time went along with it. in refusing bipartisan support for voting rights. we must remember that. and we must look to change that. >> yes. and point taken, as a black woman versus a white guy born in the suburbs of atlanta, georgia, in the middle of the american century. that said, david rothkopf, you know, there's a quote that martin luther king would always quote. along with jon meacham, he likes this quote, too.

talking about the universal law towards justice, we've been averted if that is in fact what reverend king and so many other people have believed for some time. we have been diverted over the past five years. and we seem to be taking a radical, radical turn to the far right. and now, when you look again at these nominees not for local city council race, but actually for governor of pennsylvania. governor of arizona. governor of wisconsin. important positions, secretary of state of arizona, election deniers, they're anti-democratic. and they believe that the only thing that matte is winning. >> yeah. well, i take some comfort, as i i think y do, from the fact that the republican party has decided to turn to the island of lost and broken toys for tir

candat. you know, you've got people who are unqualified. people who are clearly not up to the job. people who an't even from the state they're from, running for office. with wildly extreme views. andt may have served them in republican primaries. but when you get into the election you're going to get the result tt donald trump gets when he runs for office. he lost the popular vote when he ran the first time. he lost the popular vote when he ran the second time. and he's republican needs in coress. i look at herschel walker and hmet oz and kari la and some of these others, this is going to happen again. and it's too far and irrational and undoing of the trumpist movement of the republican party. >> david rothkopf, thank you. we'll be reading your latest piece in the daily beast.

>> maya wiley, thank you for being ahead. still ahead on morg, explosions rock a russian air base in annexed crimea. it could mark a significant escalation in the war if ukraine was behind the attack. plus, the search of mar-a-lago isn't the only problem facing the former president. there is that pesky new york probe into the trump organization and his tax returns are in the spotlight again. we'll have the very latest. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. a "ponzi scheme." the women and men i served with in combat, we earned our benefits. just like people earned their social security and medicare benefits. but republicans in congress have a plan to end so-called "entitlemes" in just five years. social security, medicare, even veterans benefits. go online and read the republican plan for yourself. joe biden is fighting to protect social security, medicare and veterans benefits. call joe biden and tell him to keep fighting for our benefits.

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♪♪ we've been talking a lot about not just what happened at mar-a-lago and the fbi search. but the response to it. sort of the strange and dangerous ironies of trump's republican party, so to speak. >> well, and you look at how republicans are doing right now, whether you're looking at the

generic ballot, you look at how they're doing in special elections, they're underperforming, like what was done in 2020, by five, six points in a lot of these special elections. they continue to fall when you look at what happens in polling. you look in the senate races. they're underperforming in a year that should be massive for the gop. and they just can't seem to connect the dots. and now, they're all rushing to the defense of the guy who likely broke the law. and who is going to be brought to justice. they keep careening closer and closer to a cliff of political obvion. and americans can see it. >> yeah. >> they can see how hypocritical this republican party is, s, i understand people are upset because they're gng out -- that's just war.

the root here, it's so extreme, ey're hypocritical. and americans can see through this grift, you see they're shocked by a legal search for classified documents. a legal search. you read hugh hewitt's column yesterday in "the washington post." very good column that spelled it all t. he said, of course, a former president can be searched we need trsparency. i agree with hugh on that. but they're shocked by a legal search of a residence by law enforcement authorities. but ty're jut fine with riots that donald trump let loose on the u.s. capil. they claim to support law enfoement but now they're screaming about needing to defund the most important federal law enforcement body in erica that protects you. and your family. and all of us.

these republicans, they attack any kind of investigations that look into trump's un-american activities. his un-american actions. and they call it a witch hunt. mccarthy promises, if you elect us, we're going to once again launch our own witch hunts against law enforcement agencies who wererying to do their jobs. trying to enforce t law. and trying to keep americans safe. it's tortured logic. these twisted actions, all meant to defend a failed reality host at a cost of harming america, its constitution and it's promise that no man is above the law. that's not radical. that's not a radical concept. it's sort of at the core of who we are as a nation. and the fact that the republican

party of washington, d.c. are melting down the way they are, it shows why they're in political trouble right now. and that's going to continue. if they continue to look back for inspiration in their future. it's bad news, mika. >> it is tortured logic. that's a really good way to put it. and they're preying upon people who don't have time or too much on their hands to deal with whether it's true or not. taking advantage of people. >> they're the jim and tammy faye bakker routine. except, they're not exploiting jesus for gain, for money, for power. they're exploit people's, well, their sense of patriotism. and lying to them every day. exploiting them for money, for power, for the big grift. anyway -- >> what i see here, what

concerns me about what they're doing and as those who echo it, or trying to torture that logic even more for hours and hours every day that this will promote violence. and unnecessary, untrue hatred based on lies. and could roil up even more than what we've already seen. and it is responsible irresponsible, whether you're a politician, or a member of the media. >> well, if you can't look back to see what happened on january 6th, and you can't look back to see how their words led to january 6th, inspired people to go up and riot, if you can't see that -- well -- >> we're starting in the wrong place. >> -- well, guess what, you're going to face some the same problems that some people unfortunately are facing now that took part in the riots on january 6th. when are they ever going to

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today, we see all too clearly under the remains of indefensible alliance for the world of today. and for the world of tomorrow. our alliance is closer than ever. it's more united than ever. and with finland and sweden, bring the number of allies to 32, we'll be stronger than ever. stronger than ever. you know, mika, it is the sort of thing that americans going day to day, worried about gas prices. >> i know. >> worried about grocery prices. worried about inflation. seeing what's happening with donald trump, they don't really

focus on these sort of things. presidents, you know, generals, national security advisers for decades to come will look back at this moment. >> yeah. >> and be grateful for what joe biden, with the help of some republicans in the senate and the house, have done, to strengthen the nato alliance. when donald trump wanted to destroy it. and adding sweden and finland, my god, again, these are benefits that presidents coming up in the future, whether they're republicans or democrats will be grateful for. >> yeah. >> going to make a huge difference. >> he's done an incredible job with the situation in ukraine and navigating and trying to ward off a potential world war iii nuclear crisis. and all of the things in between pertaining to nato. and transatlantic security. it's been -- it's been really -- i mean, there are not many

leaders on the world stage of democracies and burgeoning democraies who not grateful to joe biden for what he's done. >> by the way, starting with president zelenskyy, he's done a masterful job, i want to add, democrats and republicans have worked together in a bipartisan manner and that has made a great difference as well. >> yeah. >> and more changes in ukraine. more news coming out on the war. really interesting developments. >> they are not giving up. in fact, they're digging in in uche. a series of powerful explosions rocked an air base in the russian-controlled crimea region. killing one person and injuring several others. of course, russia took crimea

from ukraine in 2014, i believe. the attack, if conducted by ukraine would amount to a dramatic escalation in the nearly six-month-old war. "the new york times" reporting that ukrainian loyalists residents inside kremlin-controlled areas have been credited with this strike. and recent others. it follows widespread praise from western analysts who say ukrainian forces are easily putting western weapons and training to good use. meanwhile, russia's defense miniry insisted that the base was not attacked and just blew up. >> yes. >> hold on, baghdad bob lives and he's working in russia. >> yeah. >> baghdad bob, oh, fire, fireworks display went terribly wrong. >> in the past, russia has warned kyiv that any attack in crimea which russia annexed in

2014 would create massive retaliation. >> you mean like war crimes. that's a problem if you're committing war crimes against a country every day you really take away their incentive to show strength. >> joining us, former nato commander admiral james stavridis, contributor for nbc news and msnbc. and michael weiss, correspondent for yahoo! news, good to have you both with us. >> admiral, let's begin first with you, we talk about the importance of a campaign in the south before winter sets in. i warranty talking about this far south, but i suspect you may think it's a pretty good idea strategically? >> it's an incredibly good idea. we can't give russia a pass on, oh, we want to attack crimea because you annexed it. that's ridiculous. by the way, someone needs to te the rub defense ministry that there are these things called satellites that look

down. so evething that happens on that base is totally clear including the destruction of some nice tasty number of jets d helicopters. this is a veryood move by the ukrainians. and it just shows how well they are burning in, adapting, using the weapons systems that were provided to them. d the second point to be made here, joe, is geographically, this shows the ukrainians pushing toward aity called kherson, jus north of crimea. controls the waterupply to crimea. that will put more pressure indeed. final pot, thats will cause the kremlin to have to move troops away fro where they've kind of been grinding it out up to the north part of that map. showing they're going to have to bias against ukrainian gains in the south. overall, very good gain for the ukrainians. by the way, joe, just one quick point on sweden and finland.

look, i know those militaries extremely well. they deployed under my command in afghanistan. they're turnkey operations for the alliance. and simply, massive tenology, great cybercapability. land forces, artillery, opening up a whole new front for the kremlin. nothing but good. it's a pretty good day around the european security search. >> that's fantastic, michael, i was going to ask you about kherson because i saw you talking about it yesterday. let's talk about crimea and the move on kherson by the ukrainian forces. >> yeah, the first thing i have to say, joe, this is a remarkable data point for the idea that we must be fearful of casey lating the war with russia. the russian defense ministry suggested this was an accident caused by cigarette smoking. so they're saying that simply didn't happen, but in fact it did happen. and it's been a remarkable day.

i've been following ukrainian social media, they haven't this ecstatic since the sinking of the "moskva," the cruise ship a few months ago. the real question, how did the ukrainians do it? with them in place in crimea which would be remarkable this is southwest in the peninsula, about 180 miles from any ukrainian-held territory in the mainland. if this is a sabotage operation, this is pretty impressive. now if they used ammunition, that's en more interesting because 180 miles away from any ukrainian launchpad suggests that ukraine now has lo-range artillery capability. precisely the thing that u.s. has been reluctant to provide. remember, jake sullivan, national security adviser, was asked about the things called attack weapons. maybe the ukrainians have

developed their own equipment systems, perhaps with u.s. technical support. you know, one of the hallmarks of western security assistance has been as we talked about on the show, quote-unquote, creative conclusions, right. we don't want to antagonize the russians too many. we have work arounds and dismantling ukraine under the rubric of assembling them. another thing to , send engineers to ukraine and help them to develop their own homegrown long-range systems. a senior official of defense called me yesterday in response in response to crimea, quote, it's just getting warmed up. as the admiral just pointed out this is a key strategic move in preparation for the coming offensive in kherson which is directly north of crimea. coming up, one of donald trump's attorneys tells nbc news that the former president's legal team has had previous

discussions with the justice department about records stored at mar-lago. nbc's ken dilanian joins us with his new reporting ahead on "morning joe." my asthma felt anything but normal. ♪♪ it was time for a nunormal with nucala. nucala is a once monthly add-on treatment for severe eosinophilic asthma that can mean less oral steroids. not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactio can occur. get lp rig away r swelling of ce, mouth, tgue, or trouble breathi. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don'stop sroids unle told your ctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic inction. macause adache inction te reaions, backain, a fatigue. ask your asthma specialist about a nunormal with nucala.

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two other big developments involving the former president. donald trump has confirmed that he will testify today in new york state's civil investigation into his own real estate dealings. posting yesterday on his social media website that he's, quote, in new york city tonight seeing racist new york state attorney general tomorrow. >> he just wants everybody to know that the attorney general is black. he just calls a black attorney general racist. don't you love the fact that

it's not the doj releasing information about the search, it's donaltrump. it's donald trump putting out racist statements about other investigations that are going on. like i said, he can release the warrant. he can show it instead of this stupid statement that appeals to the lowest common denominator. >> they really do. both of his children testified in tt probe last week. meanwhile, the u.s. circuit court of appeals for washington, d.c. has ruled that donald trump' tax returns can be turned over to the hse ways and means committee. first requested back in 2019, the releasef t former president's tax returns have been tied up in the crt stem for years. a feral jge in december tossed out trump's lawsuit which

sought to block the house panel from obtaining the returns. the new york investigations, the tax returns, what are your thoughts on where those stand as it compares to the fbi search? >> well, they're not good for trump. he's been fighting all this stuff on various fronts, took the tax issue to the supreme court. obviously doesn't want to testify about his business dealings. i will caution we're not going to get information as the public from this stuff, at least not immediately. the tax returns will be turned over to the house ways and means committee, but they're prohibited from publishing them. on the broader theme of it, it's the walls closing in on this man on a host of fronts.

he also has to relieve all of his 2016 campaign staff from their ndas. it's one thing after another. yet, rarkably he still has this tight grip on the republican party and candidates are winning race after rac after race. >> coming up, in the gop primary race for wisconsin governor, donald trump's preferred candidate not just a win over mike pence's pick. steve kornacki joi us live from the big board to break dow the results and what they mean for the midterms. d what they men for the midterms republicans in congress call them "entitlements." a "ponzi scheme."

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