jdbalart. be sure to follow the show online @jdbalart on msnbc. alex witt picks up with more news right now. a very good monday morning to all of you. i'm alex witt here at msnbc world headquarters in new york. as we come on the air, some new urgency around threats of violence towards federal law enforcement after the fbi search of donald trump's mar-a-lago home. two senior law enforcement officials tell nbc news the fbi and department of homeland security have issued a joint intelligence bulletin, warning of a spike in threats since the search. sent out of an abundance of caution, it calls on authorities to be vigilant and to be aware of issues surrounding domestic violence extremists. we have seen online forums explode with violent rhetoric since the search, and just last week, a man who was at the capitol on january 6th was killed in a confrontation with

police after firing a nail gun into the fbi's cincinnati field office. while on saturday, armed protesters gathered near the fbi's office in phoenix, arizona. and in the last 24 hours, just checking the ex-president's truth social account, he is still releasing statements criticizing the fbi and justice department, just as his explanations for why he even had classified documents at mar-a-lago keep shifting. as "the new york times" lays out, first, he says that he was working and cooperating with government agents, who he claimed had inappropriately entered his home. then, when the government revealed that the fbi had recovered nearly a dozen sets of documents that were marked "classified," he suggested the agents had planted evidence. finally, his aides claimed he had a standing order to declassify documents that left the oval office for his residence and that some of the material was protected by attorney general/client and executive privilege. the evolving arguments are

exposing fissures in his own party, while some republicans are calling to defund the fbi, others are trying to turn down the heat against the fbi, but calling on more transparency from the attorney general. so we are starting this hour with fallout from the former president's handling of classified documents, as well as the fbi search of mar-a-lago. joining me now, nbc's ken dilanian, betsey woodruff swann, national correspondent for politico. joyce vance, a former u.s. attorney, and michael steele, former rnc chairman. all three are also msnbc contributors of those. so welcome to all. ken, with you first here. as we consider this incident in ohio last week, and then the armed protest that was outside of the phoenix fbi office, that happened this weekend. what more can you tell us about that bulletin, warning of a spike in threats to federal law enforcement officials? >> good morning, alex. it's important to understand that we're not just talking about ranting on social media here. this bulletin describes specific, credible threat to federal agents. and it reflects the reporting

that we did here last week, where private firms were telling us that they were seeing the exact same thing in the darker corners of social media. an absolute spike since the search at mar-a-lago in specific, credible, detailed threats to fbi personnel and fbi facilities. and this joint intelligence bulletin we're reporting on even says in some cases, people posting threats are also posting names, identifying information, names of facilities, very specific. the kind of threats that you would call the police if you heard about that, not just people saying things on social media. and as we saw with that cincinnati attack, there was a very direct progression here in a matter of days, between rhetoric by mainstream politicians, who were comparing the fbi to the gestapo, to threats on social media, to an attack if an fbi office, alex. >> it's pretty sobering, to say the least. betsey, for your report, you've been reporting on how the former president's shifting explanations, we'll call it, for

these documentses is putting pressure on republicans. they're trying to twist themselves into pretzels to defend him. so explain how they're closing ranks, but also how this is exposing some fissures within the party. >> part of what's really challenging for republicans is that they don't have the full story yet. so it's a little bit difficult to enforce message discipline. what we've seen from republicans, who are the most outfront on this, besides, of course, a cohort that's engaged in extremely incendiary rhetoric, are basically calls for more information. one line republicans have used is saying, this was an unprecedented step, and it needs an unprecedented justification. until that affidavit that was filed in court, presumably by an fbi agent, laying out the evidence that the fbi had accrued to prove to a judge that they had probable cause to execute this search warrant, until that affidavit becomes public, there's going to be some

mystery for the public in terms of why exactly this search warrant was carried out. that's standard practice for the way these types of investigations work. but politically, it puts, republicans, of course, in a bit of an uncomfortable position, because they don't know exactly what they're trying to rebut. and when it comes to the position republicans are in at this moment, one thing that i would just add from this joint intelligence bulletin, which you've mentioned, is that it specifically says that the fbi and dhs believe the threat environment will become more intense and live look escalated as there's further, if there's further law enforcement activity related to the mar-a-lago search warrant. in other words, as the doj takes more steps, perhaps engages in more actions connected to people near and close to the former president, fbi and dhs will be on an even higher level of alert

about the possibility of spirals violence. >> what's so interesting is the word "unprecedented," that you used, that republicans are using to describe this. and yet, they failed to ever use the word "unprecedented," when it is applied to describing the kind of president that donald trump was. so, michael steele, you have now a favorite weapon of the right that has been hitting the left for calls to defund the police, somewhat unprecedented, as well, considering where it's coming from. you have far-right lawmakers calling for the fbi to be actually defunded. so here is how two current outgoing republican governors are pushing back on those calls, within the gop. >> the gop is going to be the party of supporting law enforcement, law enforcement includes the fbi. we need to pull back on casting judgment on them. >> it's absurd and it's dangerous, because we saw the one incident already, but there are threats all over the place and losing faith in our federal

law enforcement officer and our justice system is a really serious problem. >> which begs this question of you, michael. how did the gop go from the party that paints itself as one of law and order to some republicans calling to defund the fbi? >> they followed trump. it's a direct bread trail. there's no other question about it. they've abandoned all pretense that they give a damn about the blue. it's just, you know, if it seems to hurt trump, they're going to defend against it, as hard as they can. so with all due respect to my governor friends who are leading and said the correct thing, this -- we're past this at this point. we now own defund the fbi. so all of this hot rhetoric about the left and defund the police, just stow it. because, you don't really believe it. you don't really care enough about the blue, giving your response to the police officers on capitol hill, who were killed

and injured during the insurrection that was stimulated by the president and defended by these various same politicians and republican politicians on capitol hill. so. this is the new space. they own it. any damage, injury, or harm caused by citizens against the fbi, property, individuals rests at the feet of republican leaders who have not stood up to stop it, who have not stood up to speak against it. so, you know, you own it. >> joyce, donald trump and his allies have been claiming that when he was president, he had this standing order that materials were removed from the oval office and taken to the residence, they were all deemed declassified the moment he removed them. his former national security adviser john bolton commented to nbc news about that claim. here's that. >> when a document is declassified, it's not just

declassified as to donald trump, it's declassified for the whole world. so in theory, if that order existed, which i don't think it did, the news media could today file a freedom of information act request for every document he declassified, which over a four-year period, could be a pretty high stack. so i think this is made up and i think a key point here is when somebody is making up stories like that, i think it indicates a level of desperation. >> you heard that. a level of desperation. can you explain this latest argument that we're hearing from the trump camp, with regard to declassification? >> so, i think that was a pretty good layout of the argument. unlikely that it's true that there was a declassification order, as trump contends in place. if there was, think for a second about the consequences. it would mean that trump essentially for his personal convenience, because his representatives have said that the president, who notoriously, by the way, didn't work, and watched fox news and spent his

time on twitter, that he was working so hard that he liked to take materials out of the white house, back to the residence, no longer inside of a secure scif facility. so that meant he routinely declassified everything that he wanted to take with him. that means that trump would have been putting his own convenience over our national security. and ultimately, this is just a house of cards that crumbles, but alex, it doesn't matter whether they were classified or not, because in what we learned of doj's released search warrant over the weekend, it became clear that doj was looking at three crimes, obstruction, espionage, mishandling, or destruction of certain types of government records. and none of those criminal violences require the government to prove that the documents were classified. so even if trump did wave his magic wand and get it done, it won't impact his criminal liability. >> there is a bit of a shift lately in the messaging around republicans who want the

affidavit released, betsey. considering the ex-president is under investigation for potential espionage act violations, do republicans know it is a safe talking point? because that would all but certainly never happen. however, would republicans live to regret these calls if it did? >> look, it all depends on what's in the affidavit. it depends on what evidence the fbi gathered before going to a judge and persuading that judge that they had probable cause that there was evidence of crimes that had been committed after mar-a-lago at that moment in time. if the affidavit comes out and it's persuasive, which one would certainly think it is, given that it not only got the sign-off from the federal judge, but also from the attorney general, a very cautious attorney general, if it comes out and it's persuasive, then republicans, of course, are going to have to scramble for some other way of talking about this. it puts them in a really uncomfortable position of essentially shadow boxing, trying to buy time by asking for

more information that isn't public yet. and once that information becomes public, then the entire conversation is going to change. >> interesting word, shadow boxing. i like that. joyce, this last question to you. republican senator lindsey graham lost his battle to quash that fulton county subpoenas, the probes, with the judge ruling that he must it have. so in a statement that we just got, graham says he will appeal to the 11th circuit. what's that legal fight going to look like? >> the 11th circuit is an increasingly conservative circuit, because the former president was able to appoint a number of judges to that court. but this means that graham will try to convince a three-judge panel that he shouldn't have to testify, and the law is against him, even with this conservative court. once judges become federal judges, they really tend to lose their loyalty to whichever president appointed them. they're concerned about the law and their orders withstanding

scrutiny. this panel should order graham to show up in fulton county and testify. >> okay. i thank you for that answer and all of you. ken dilanian, betsy woodruff swann, thanks for the chat. more, the spike in threats against federal law enforcement officers since that search at mar-a-lago. what extremists are posting online. and it's the final stretch for congresswoman liz cheney's re-election campaign after she took on donald trump in a public way. and the humanitarian crisis unfolding in afghanistan one year after the fall of kabul. the needs on the ground and what experts say about the terror threat there today. experts say r threat there today despite treatment it disrupts my skin with itch. it disrupts my skin with rash. but now, i can disrupt eczema with rinvoq. rinvoq is not a steroid, topical, or injection. it's one pill, once a day, that's effective without topical steroids. many taking rinvoq saw clear or almost-clear skin

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home addresses and names of family members, those are just some of the alarming details being included in threats against federal law enforcement officials that are spiking after the fbi's raid at mar-a-lago. that is according to an intelligence bull contain issued jointly by the fbi and dhs. sources tell nbc news that the bulletin says that threats are appearing across multiple platforms including social media sites, web forums, video sharing platforms and image boards. joining me now, nbc news senior reporter, ben collins, and nbc news national security analyst and former fbi special agent, clint watts. i tell you, wherever i get the two of you on together, i notice some pretty serious stuff to talk about. let's start with you, ben. we have the conservative outlet

breitbart, which is facing criticism for revealing the names of those fbi agents that were part of the search at mar-a-lago. you're plugged in big-time to this kind of chatter online. what have you seen with regards to threats to law enforcement officials? >> yeah, i've seen exactly that. you've seen garrett zigler, he used to work for the trump white house, by the way, posting on trump social and telegram social media photos of family members who were unredacted in that breitbart report. but you have to member, this is part of a much larger strategy by trump camp to push this stuff out. they could denounce this at any time. they could turn the heat down, wherever they want to. they could tell them, you know, this isn't the real enemy. the real enemy is xyz, whatever. which, by the way, they would probably listen to. they hang on donald trump's every word still in these forums. but that's not what you're seeing. you're seeing these people saying, fbi agents are the people to target. the fbi is in general the people to target. they are waiting for the

affidavits to come out from this, to leak. so they can find the higher, upper-most levels of the fbi that signed off on this, so they can get more names to add to their character list that people that they hate. >> ben, would an affidavit also include the name of the person that is presumed to be a mole for the lack of a better phrase, the person who may have turned on donald trump, to say that there is evidence here that you probably should get ahold of to the fbi? >> that's certainly what they're hoping for. they're hoping for some big, ridiculous, over-the-top spy-novel type of thing to be revealed, that shows that donald trump was secretly being spied on. in their world, that's what all of this is. in their world, this is a big spy novel, or donald trump is the only good guy and everybody else is doing some sort of elaborate, you know, oceans 11-style thing to get him into jail. that's not reality. but in these spaces, that's what it is. and that's what justifies these

people, in their brains, to sending crazy threats to the fbi. by the way, not just online, they say, in other mediums in this bulletin. that means maybe in real life, almost certainly on the phone and in letters, they are getting tons of threats. and you see them acted out in places like ohio last week. >> clint, as a former fbi agent, you're used to facing threats, because of your job. how unusual is it for agencies to release a bulletin like this about a spike in threats? >> i think it's pretty unusual. we have talked on a few shows over the last few days, that in terms of the chatter that's online, that's mobilizing or assignment to violence, it hasn't been this high since january 6th time, a little over a year and a half ago. i think it's also very unusual for dhs and fbi to do that, because they're basically calling out that they need protection from their own people, to some degree. they're illustrating a threat, so they can build in more security features to protect the fbi agents, and their families,

as this investigation moves forward. what's also said is in the basic conduct of the job, it can be dangerous, as well. it's just evaluating the danger to all of those individuals that are doing exactly what they're supposed to. that's literally what the taxpayers are paying them to do. and for the fbi and law enforcement across the board, even at state and local levels, when they follow the law, they're being passively punished in a way. usually by elected officials at this point, which is very strange in our country's history, because the law is pretty straightforward. i think everything in terms of the investigation that we've seen, quite straightforward. and just what you see there, whether it's fbi headquarters or state and local law enforcement, or coming up in the fall, elections and polling facilities. we've got, i think, a powder keg going on right now in this country. >> yeah, ben, clint says that he's not seen this kind of rhetoric since 1/6, and we all know what happened on 1/6, so

are we seeing the kind of rhetoric that proceeded 1/6. do you have concerns that it could gear up for something like a 1/6, if not on the capitol, but some place that becomes a center of violence. >> yeah, the only good news right now is that there is no formative dates or there's no big thing to plan around. cpac happened a couple of weeks ago. there's no place where they're centrally organizing for the future. that rally on saturday morning in phoenix at the fbi headquarters, that was going around proud boys channels on telegram for a few days. that was a relatively centrally organized thing among phoenix proud boys. that's a really, really specific thing and they got enough people to show up for that. and that's not a specific chapter down there in phoenix. the worry is when a date comes, when a specific politician, with a big megaphone like donald

trump or marjoie taylor greene says, this is the day, that's what we worry about. until then, you have to worry about these lone wolf style attacks where people do what they did in senate last week. when you get it ratcheted up to this level, you can't stop everybody. they are just -- there are tons of people who are extremely angry and don't want to plan anything. they just want to go shoot something up, which is what that guy did last week. >> so is there anything that can be done to shore up the security around our law enforcement and fbi agents? >> i think we can be a bit more preemptive. one of the challenges and one of the things that wasn't solved after january 6th was how do we monitor open source threats on social media? the individual that showed up at cincinnati, at the fbi field office was very clear about his intentions on social media. the trail was quite significant. and same thing here, you're seeing open calls for violence and death threats against targeted individuals. how do we pick up on that and

use that as preemption, rather than reaction? that's the one thing we can still do in this country and figure out, if the open source signals are there, someone is talking about mobilizing to violence or inciting violence, and what are we doing about it preemptively rather than reacting? we didn't accept this during the international terrorism days. i don't know why we continue to accept it during domestic terrorism days. >> it is a new reality we all face. ben collins and clint watts, gentlemen, thanks so much. one day to go before wyoming voters decide whether congressman liz cheney will be on the ballot this fall. what voters are saying in the final stretch. also in alaska, tomorrow will give the state's new ranked choice voting system its first test run. but former president trump and sarah palin, they're not fans. we're live from anchorage, next. . we're live from anchorage, next. ♪ ♪ breeze driftin' on by... ♪ if you've been playing down your copd,... ♪ it's a new dawn, it's a new day,... ♪ ...it's time to make a stand. start a new day with trelegy. ♪...and i'm feelin' good. ♪

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large out-of-state corporations have set ask your doctor about once-daily trelegy, their sights on california. they've written prop 27, to allow online sports betting. they tell us it will fund programs for the homeless. but read prop 27's fine print. 90% of profits go to out-of-state corporations, leaving almost nothing for the homeless. no real jobs are created here. but the promise between our state and our sovereign tribes would be broken forever. these out-of-state corporations don't care about california. but we do. stand with us.

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training to hageman's 58%. also with us in wyoming, pbs senior producer, steve peck. vaughn, how is this race shaping up for the congresswoman. i know she wasn't out campaigning this weekend in person. does that tell you anything? >> reporter: i think steve will be able to articulate what the cheney family here means to the state, alex. we're talking about her father, dick cheney, winning this congressional seat back in 1978 for the first time and yet polling suggests that liz cheney has quite a steep uphill battle over the next 48 hours here. to the point where they're trying to galvanize democrats to change their party registration and come vote tomorrow on behalf of liz cheney. democrats that i've talked to, some said that they are going to change. others are like, she's still a cheney, and for the lost 40-plus

efforts, we've been fighting their efforts here in the state. it's a hard ask. but harriet hageman has the backing of donald trump, a longtime gop activist, a land use attorney here in the state, and ultimately, when you're looking at the role that liz cheney has played here, she made a conscience decision that she was going to do whatever it took to take on donald trump, after that january 6th attack, when she voted to impeach him here. and i've had conversations where it's been suggested to me that she looks at her role in american politics today beyond just this one race, but she is going to continue to speak her truth and will fight back against, you know, donald trump's ability to potentially run for president again, and she looks to be at the forefront of that, even if that means going down in her state's primary tomorrow. >> a couple questions to you, steve, beginning with this one. let's take a listen together to harriet hageman at a rally with former president trump. this was back in may. >> we're fed up with the january

6th commission and those people who think that they can gaslight us and we're fed up with liz cheney. we are putting everyone on notice, as of november 8th, we are taking our country back! >> so tell us about this woman, a candidate who could unseat the former third most powerful republican in the house. and the fact that liz cheney is wyoming republican royalty. how has this happened? >> interestingly enough, harriet hageman ran for governor four years ago and finished a poor third in that race, in a race that the eventual nominee, mark gordon, is known to have capitalized on crossover voting that was discussed just a moment ago, to help him emerge from that primary. that seems to be the only line of thinking in which liz cheney is given any chance this time around. >> steve, let me ask you specifically on that.

because i understand that the university of wyoming survey that was put out there, they said that 98% of people who self-identify as democrats, who say they're going to vote, are going to vote for her. now, what's the balance between registered democrats and registered republicans in wyoming? i imagine it's very outweighing towards republican? >> it's enormous. there are more than 200,000 registered republicans now in wyoming and there are only 85,000, of all the other affiliations put together, and that includes the unaffiliated or the independent votes, which is a voter preference that can be registered for. among those, harriet hageman is among those who criticized the crossover vote as being decisive. this year, it's largely being dismissed. and there was some analysis after the governor's primary four years ago that determined that it probably was not

decisive. there's one other thing, that i'll mention if i might. within the huge body of registered republican voters in wyoming is the group that might be called the true rhinos. those who are not hard-core ideological republicans, but who register in the republican primary because they want to participate in wyoming voting. if i go tomorrow and ask for a democrat ballot, it's pretty boring. either there are no democrats on the down-ballot elections or there's only one. so there are people in the state what register as republicans, because in the smaller communities of wyoming, where most people live in communities of 5,000 or fewer, you tend to know the candidates for legislature or sheriff or county clerk, and you have a preference and want to express it in the primary. i don't know how many people know -- i don't think we can know how many of those people there are, but they are there. and that's part of this prospect

that is intriguing and is really seen as the only way she might have a chance to squirm through to be nominated again. >> real quick, steve. primaries usually don't get the draw in terms of votes that a general does, so what's the enthusiasm there for voting on tuesday, tomorrow? >> well, that would be the absolute key question. the general election in wyoming four years ago, 108%, meaning people registered street for the general, who hadn't been registered before. this year, there are tens of thousands of more registered republicans than there were then. and that's primarily because democrats or unaffiliated voters have joined the party for this purpose, then you would expect them, if that was their motivation for switching, to turn out in big numbers. >> okay, all right. vaughn hillyard and steve peck, thank you so much for wyoming. and as we mentioned, alaskans are also heading to the polls tomorrow and a very familiar name will be back on the ballots

there, sarah palin. the former vice presidential candidate is running for the state's only congressional seat, previously held by don young who passed away in march. she faces nick begich and mary peltollta, and lisa murkowski is facing off against a slew of her own gop challengers. but there's a bit of a wild card party this year, because this will be the first ranked choice voting election that alaska has ever had. joining us now, ali vitali in anchorage, alaska. yep, you have the most beautiful live shot i think we've ever seen. so take it away, there. because not everyone is very happy about this new process, ali. talk us through what's in store for tomorrow. >> alex, all kudos to our cameraman, scott, who found this beautiful location for us. but for alaskans who head to the polls, they have familiar faces and household names on the ballot, but an entirely new way of voting for those people. there have been a lot of efforts

on the ground to make sure people know what they're doing when it comes to their ballots. everything have mock elections held by drag queens at drag shows. a real effort on the ground to make sure that voters are read in and ready for tomorrow. voters on the last frontier charting a new one when it comes to the way they vote. using a system known as ranked choice voting for the first time this week in marquee primary contests for u.s. senate and the lone statewide house seat left open when longtime congressman don young passed away in march. >> most people can rank four things. anything from ice cream, i have my kids rank their favorite breakfast food. >> and now they'll be ranking candidates. >> it's new in alaska, but becoming more commonplace across the decade. from utah to washington state. in new york city's mayoral race and maine's gubernatorial. here in alaska, when the 2018

ballots looked like this, now they vote in order of numbered preference, up to four. all candidates from all parties listed together. >> the rules can vary, but here if you get 50% of the vote outright, you win. if no one gets there, the candidate with the fewest votes gets eliminated. their voters' votes are divvied up by second choice and on until someone gets 50% and wins. >> reporter: that may take some time, which isn't exactly new in a state this big, twice the size of texas. >> i don't think we'll know anything certain for at least a week or two, and we won't have certified results until the end of the month. >> alaskans voted more these new rules in 2020, but that doesn't mean all the candidates are onboard. >> in alaska, we have this bizarre system, that's newfangled. >> you have that rank choice crap voting. >> but rank choice advocates say this system encourages candidates to appeal to a broader audience. >> it rewards candidates that look for connection. and you don't have to be positionally centrist.

you need to be someone who is sort of civil in your behavior. >> sarah palin is famous, but, come on -- >> that means this election should be a little less negative, in theory. >> as governor, palin drove oil investment out of alaska, quit and left alaska to be a celebrity, who didn't want to be stuck in wasla. >> reporter: but negative ads and attacks are tempered with some goodwill towards rivals, even for the most partisan of firebrands. >> i am very, very thankful that we have great candidates up here. you guys have good choices. kind of can't go wrong. >> reporter: alex, we all like our election results as quickly as we can get them, but here on the ground in alaska, they are no stranger for waiting more their results, in large part because this state is so massive and they really do rely on a lot of vote by mail. that takes some time for those votes to come in and be counted. you combine that with the rank choice voting system, which takes some time on its own, and we'll probably not see results

for at least a week. but the important thing is, that's a feature, not a bug of this system. alex? >> listen, i can't blame you, my friend, if you try to put into nbc and say, i need to stay here until it's all wrapped up. anyway, ali vitali, we'll see how long you're there. thank you so much. it has been exactly one year since the fall of kabul and those devastating images of afghans trying to flee the country, 12 months later. remember these? these were heartbreaking. well, we'll take a look inside a children's hospital in kabul, also heartbreaking. and show you how the struggle there underscores the intense humanitarian crisis in the country. that's next. humanitarian crisis in the country. that's next. ♪ ♪ we believe there's an innovator in all of us. ♪ ♪ that's why we build technology that makes it possible for every business... and every person... to come to the table and do more incredible things. ♪ ♪

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one year ago today, the taliban took over afghanistan's capital without firing a single shot. militants swarmed kabul in the wake of the u.s. exit from that country, overtaking the american embassy and other government buildings. tens of thousands of afghans rushed to bagram air force base, desperate to find a way out with western militaries. a year later now, those who couldn't leave or chose to stay

live in a country squarely under taliban control. afghanistan's economy is in free fall, and malnutrition is rampant, especially among children. sky news chief correspondent, stewart ramsey filed this report from a children's hospital in kabul. it's a tough one. >> there's over 500 patients in this hospital, they have only room for 300. ward after ward is the same, jam-packed with really poorly babies and children. the head doctor says they're overwhelmed by demand and lack of equipment. foreign aid lost after the taliban takeover is critical, he says, if they are to save lives. >> this is a problem, to get drugs. our people are very poor. we need a ventilator machine. we don't have ventilator.

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>> -- international terrorist organizations that could well have fine harbor both in afghanistan and pakistan. isis, al qaeda, the hakani network, certainly the country of afghanistan has melted down, 39 million people. you know, half of them face acute hunger. the whole women's rights and girls' rights have evacuated. the afghan army evaporated. there's no cash to buy food or pay salaries. so it's a petri dish waiting to be populated by angry, armed insurgents of one form or another. it certainly isn't an argument to a state in afghanistan. i think both trump and president

biden made legitimate political decisions to pull out. biden himself got handed the doha agreement, which was a comical joke of handing over the afghanistan to the taliban, which promptly happened. so the tools we have left right now, alex, are pretty meager. i don't see any way for humanitarian aid and sufficient amounts to get in. the taliban will benefit from it. it's chaos. it's a tragedy. never mind 23,000 u.s. killed and wounded. >> yeah, over that 20-year war. sir, let me ask you about what this strike in kabul, what that reveals about u.s. intel capabilities. i mean, the success of that strike tells us what? >> well, u.s. intelligence is extremely capable. there's no question about it. our overhead satellite systems,

remotely piloted vehicles, obviously the cia has agents still on the ground. we have a variety of ways to collect information. however, there's no question, look, we had better part of 4,000 people just on the u.s. embassy in kabul prior to the evacuation starting on 15 august. so our ability to discern what's going on is limited. the strike was a real triumph of intelligence. but we shouldn't assume that over-the-horizon counterterrorism operations are going to be effective in the long run. the best protection we have is here in the united states, from u.s. law enforcement, the fbi, and other agencies. >> yeah. general, very quickly, do you foresee those thousands who fled, the afghans who had to flee for their lives, do you foresee a time when the country will be safe for them return if

they chose to do so? >> they would have to be mad to go back. we have the better part of 120,000 people out. the ones we didn't get out are the 97% of the people who have worked for the u.s. government didn't make it through the thing. that was a chaotic withdrawal. it's sort of interesting to watch, though. these were people -- this was ant defeat defeat for the u.s. armed forces. these weren't people who feared for their life because they worked for the government. this was a population saying in despair we've got to get out of here. it's highly unlikely that almost any of them will ever go back. >> thank you so much for the conversation. coming up, salman rushdie is off a ventilator after that horrific stabbing. the latest on his condition. hor. the latest on his condition.

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still remains in critical condition. ron, what are you hearing about the investigation into this attack? >> the united states is blaming iran, saying iran has incited violence against salman rushdie for generations. the iranians are saying they had nothing to do with this. there's a suspect in custody, a 24-year-old man named hadi matar, who has been charged with second degree attempted murder and assault with a weapon. he has a court date coming up in a couple of days. he has pleaded not guilty. this attack seems to be inspired by this fatwa that has been standing against salman rushdie now for some 33 years. it seems to come completely out of the blue. clearly rushdie felt like this order had been lifted. he was out in many more public settings in recent years. when this first happened, you'll

recall he went into hiding and had police protection and security for many years because of the seriousness of this. there was so much outrage in the muslim world about this book and about its fictionalized depiction of the prophet mohammed, which many saw as blasphemous. his injuries are not life threatening. he is in critical condition. he's off a ventilator, which is good news for him. but he has life-changing injuries, is the way his family described it. as the investigation continues into this man in new jersey as to what inspired him, he's 24 years old. the fatwa against rushdie goes back to even before he was born. the united states is saying it

appears to be connected to iran. the iranians are at this point denying any involvement in the attack. >> extraordinary. thank you so much for that. that does it for me, everyone. i'll be back tomorrow at 11:00 a.m. eastern. catch me weekends from noon to 2:00 p.m. eastern. "andrea mitchell reports" is next. "andrea mitchell reports" s next no matter who you are, being yourself can be tough when you have severe asthma. triggers can pop up out of nowhere, causing inflammation that can lead to asthma attacks. but no matter what type of severe asthma you have,

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♪♪ good day everyone. this is "andrea mitchell reports in washington," where the fbi and department of homeland security are sounding alarms over a new spike in threats to federal law enforcement following the search of former president trump's mar-a-lago home one week ago. mr. trump is attacking the fbi on social media, slamming the agency as corrupt as officials monitor new threats and rhetoric from online far-right