other countries, we understand how important it is for all of the countries in the middle east and northern africa to get the agricultural projects that they use to buy from us. so again, we will explore as we did for the past eight years defending our country but we will explore any possible diplomatic solution and any possible resolution without compromise on the territory and integrity. >> ukraine's ambassador to the u.s., oksana markarova, thank you for that update. we appreciate it. and it is exactly the top of the fourth hour of "morning joe." right now, 9:00 a.m. in the east, 6:00 a.m. out west. and we have a lot to get to this hour. we're just four hours away from a hearing to determine whether to unseal the affidavit federal investigators used to justify a search warrant of mar-a-lago. we're getting a live report from

florida in just a moment. plus a new subpoena from the department of justice, this one to the national archives for white house documents it turned over to the january 6 committee. meanwhile, in georgia, rudy giuliani testified for over six hours over his efforts to overturn the 2020 election. now georgia's governor is seeking to delay his own testimony which was scheduled for today. willie. >> let's begin this hour in the state of florida. where at 1:00 p.m. a federal judge will hear arguments about whether to unseal the affidavit used by the fbi to search the florida home of former president donald trump. the justice department is arguing against that saying it could compromise an ongoing investigation. the fbi goes through the seized documents sorting those covered by attorney/client privilege to

what is relevant to the case. joining us in west palm beach, correspondent sam brock. good morning. >> reporter: willie, good morning. and speaking to that specifically, the breadth of documents that were removed from mar-a-lago, fact that here we are nine days later and foerl investigators are still sifting through them. this case is about to take place, about four hours from now, made for some strange bedfellows in terms of those that want to see the documents unsealed. you have the trump organization and the news medias, abc, cbs, but for different reasons. but what might actually happen today, legal experts tell us it is extremely unlikely and borderline impossible that a judge would hear guidance from the doj specifying that unsealing this affidavit connected to the search at mar-a-lago could compromise national security given the fact that highly classified documents are what is at the core of this

conversation. what could happen, willie, we might see the judge decide to release a portion of the affidavit but it would likely be heavily reacted. the judge is under no obligation to set a time table. so we'll find out. but just to give you a little bit of the editorial from on the ground here, they just recently let a bunch of people in the courthouse behind me. i'm told from our producers on the floor where this is taking place, it is a small courtroom. about 40 to 50 people perhaps might be inside. there is no seats allocated for the media and no photography allowed inside. so we're relying on our folks to provide us with the details of what is said today at 1:00 and there is no set order for what is going to speak and when. it is going to last several hours and ultimately we'll get a decision but whether that is today or at some point down the line, not clear right now. >> and for all of the reasons you just laid out, the consensus view among legal experts

including those on the show this morning is that that affidavit will not be unsealed but we'll wait and see at about 1:00 this afternoon. i mentioned the fbi is going through and sorting the boxes, the documents that they found, returning some to donald trump and keeping those relevant to the investigation. as you look at justice department process here, where does it go from here? how quickly does it move? >> reporter: that is a great question, a lot of that is going to have to depend upon what the decision is from the judge today. but in terms of what is going on at this moment right now, sifting through the domes, part of it relates to what is material to the investigation, what is not material to the investigation and then you have stuff there that could be attorney/client privileged, it might not be, and that is returned already, the passports, the former president's passports, not material to this investigation but we're waiting in terms of a timeline and what will catalyze potential action from the justice department and what happens here today. but one very important note, under normal circumstances, the

justice department decision whether or not to bring charges related to whether or not there was a reasonable probability of conviction. but to swing and miss at a form he president, that really raises the stakes here i'm told from legal experts that it has to be ironclad, a slam dunk or they would not likely move in this case. of course, the attorney general merrick garland. >> so many brock live from west palm beach florida ahead of the hearing today at 1:00. thank you so much. so, joe, many republicans have called for the affidavit to be unsealed and they want out in the open why donald trump's house was visited by the fbi in a search last week. what do you expect to see here? a lawyer, a guy from florida and also we talked to dave aronberg who practices down in palm beach who said he sees no way the judge unseals this today. >> if you're a judge and you have the doj coming to you and let's say it is for insider trading, or let's say somebody

is trying to hunt down a terror cell or a drug cartel, and you have the doj telling you we really can't release this. if you release this, it is going to be showing our hand. then that would undermine the investigation. it is something that i know what mike pence said, it is a political side note but there is no way mike pence would ever support law enforcement being forced to show their hand while in the middle of an ongoing criminal investigation. i think that is the important thing here, jonathan lemire, is this is an ongoing criminal investigation, and it is just not something that usually happens and i suspect it won't happen in this case either. >> yeah. it wouldn't happen in any case and it seems that much less likely to have one in so high-profile. one where there is already real targets and threats to those

involved. let's remember when the warrant, which contains a lot less information than the affidavit, was put out by someone in trump's camp and then put out on his social media site, it listed the fames of the two of the fbi agents involved in the search who have since had to have security for fear of their lives. we've seen an uptick in threats to law enforcement and we documented the attack on the field office in cincinnati and threats in other cities as well. so there is that part of it as well as the idea that they would be jeopardizing the case here. that there would be -- showing a road map to what they're trying to did and it could jeopardize this investigation or perhaps subsequent investigations and a witness could be part of this as well and the trump camp has been turning itself inside out in the last week or two to try to uncover the identity of someone who might be cooperating, someone it is someone on the staff or a mar-a-lago guest or

member that may have played a role in this as well. so all of those reasons why nearly every legal expert suggests this will not be unsealed today. >> it won't happen because they won't do it in other cases because they wouldn't want to cause harm to the investigation and ongoing criminal investigation. and elise, also again, as jonathan said, there is a safety issue. we have fbi agents who have received threats. we have the fbi director saying that their greater threat now level risk than they have. we have a judge, a magistrate judge who has received threats. it is gotten really ugly. we see this also happening now. and these are all trump supporters who leveling violent threats. you have the same of course now with republicans, causing irs agents and causing workers for the government to come under

threat of possible attacks as well. again, by one conspiracy theory after another conspiracy theory. i think in this environment, is it not going to make it more likely that a judge will listen to the doj, not only for the sake of helping the investigation move forward, but also for the safety of those participating in it? >> joe, it is just been absolutely disgusting to watch all of these a political civil servants who signed up for the job not to become part of a political battle and to become a political punching bag, but to be an anonymous civil servant doing their job and upholding the constitution to see the threats leveled against these men and women who are just going about their jobs every day. usually without much glory or fan fare. so, yes, it seems very unlikely that the judge is going to want to bring these individuals under further scrutiny and unveil

their names. >> so, why don't we bring in mark zaid into this conversation. he's an attorney who specialized in cases involving national security and security clearances. and i wonder what you could add to what we know so far about this. we don't want to get ahead of it. but from even the rundown of what investigators were looking for, when they went to mar-a-lago and then the concerns now about releasing everything to the public, what are your thoughts? >> well, i agree with everything i've heard so far. it is very, very unlikely that the federal magistrate judge will order the release of this affidavit. i pursued these type of affidavits many times over the years and when the government, or federal agency invokes the law enforcement pending investigation exception, to either under the freedom of information act or dealing with a first amendment right that some of the media outlets might be pursuing, that pretty much

puts a kibosh on it. what we've seen so far with the warrant and then the receipt of information, which frankly supports that the warrant was a proper application of a search of the property, you know, reveals there was an interest in clearly someone on the the inside was telling federal law enforcement officers that what they were being told over the timeline that extended over a year, that they were not getting the full story from the trump team. now, we don't know what that was of course saying, we know there was a declaration or an affidavit or a assertion from at least one or two of his lawyers who said there is no longer classified information at mar-a-lago, which clearly turned out to be false. so we have that fact pattern right in front of us that shows everything so far has been justified. it doesn't mean that the trump supporters will obviously accept that. but i think objectively anyone

who looks at it legally certainly is going to say that it's been a proper process to date. >> first, how long will it take for them to go through the documents and sort of match them up with what they were looking for and is there anything in what we know so far unequivocally, that indicates that they found what they were looking for? >> well, the fact that they found at least as we know from the receipt properly marked classified documents, at the confidential secret and top secret and top secret sci level, which is serious. that means exceptionally grave harm to the united states by definition if that information was outside of secure controls which mar-a-lago would constitute. what we don't know, of course, we don't know a lot, quite frankly. we don't know this issue of did trump declassify anything?

and we hear his supporters saying oh, there was a standing declassification order that existed. i wave my magic hand and the information was declassified. now there could be some merit to that. even though that is completely outside of normal historic process. but we have yet to hear from any former white house or current white house official that there was such -- the existing of a standing order. and i've represented several cabinet members from the trump administration, i've seen no one support the fact that that existed. we also know that there were some media reporting that of the information, this is not bourne out yet by the receipt from the search warrant, but some of the information might have contained nuclear information. now if that is true, and there was restricted data or formally restricted data, which are the terms we use under the atomic energy act, that information cannot be declassified by the

president. that authority is designated to the secretary of energy and their designees. so we need to learn a lot more. but at least so far, and of course what is on the search warrant receipt, it just refers to binders, boxes, so we don't know how many documents might in fact be in those. so, i have had the fbi, when they've seized clients records of mine, or my clients' records, take months, i think i still have a client who hasn't gotten back files in six or eight years. but that is not going to happen in such a high profile case, obviously as the former president of the united states. >> so, mark, the espionage act has been invoked quite a bit over the last week and a half or so. a lot of people scrambling to familiarize themselves with that. how would that apply here. because you've sort of come out and said let's pump the brakes on that unless there is something to pursue there. >> you know, the espionage act

is a very confusing statute to people because when you hear it, you're like, oh, that means that the person is a spy. sure, it could. but the espionage act which dates back now over a century has multiple provisions. some of the provisions deal with old school spying, robert hanson, albert james, spying for the russians. other provisions deal with leaking classified information to the media. other provisions deal with the mishandling of classified information which would pertain to what we're talking about. but i'll have to even correct myself because so easily i say classified information. the act actually talks about national defense information which predates our current classification system. we equate it with classified information and i don't know of any modern case where's someone was initially prosecuted where the information, the national defense information wasn't classified.

but we look to it as being generally classified. so, the espionage act absolutely has an application so far from what we've seen to the facts, obviously we have to wait and see. it is also very statutory derived in the sense that the level of harm as i said earlier, exceptionally grave for top secret information, it is written right into the executive order of which the statute applies when the courts would look at these types of determinations. but, again, we're still in somewhat of an early stage of many of these issues. >> mark, elise jordan here, i have held a top secret sci clearance in the past and frankly sometimes that information that your lucky enough to see could be a little bit under-whelming. and that is what i wonder about what we saw listed in the receipts here. we saw that there were, you

know, ten documents sets and three were secret, three were confidential, so that is probably not anything that juicy. and then the four sets were top secret. but there wasn't anything marked as you said previously as restricted data, which would be nuclear information, or special access programs, so do you think that much like hillary clinton's emails, that, yes, there was some top secret information, but it turned out to be pretty under-whelming, do you think there is a chance what is in these documents is not going to be earth shattering and perhaps an example of the government overclassifying? >> well, i think to a lot of people, if we ever do find out any of the information that is supposedly classified, people will see it as underwhelming. i've litigated against the government for 30 years now to declassify information. i hold a ts/sci and from the

cases that i handle and we see overclassification and underwhelmed under the executive order that governs this when president obama issued in 2009, 12536, all of the executive orders for decades something as general as the foreign relations of the united states can be classified. so, that one document that refers to the president of france, if president trump wrote, i talked to the president of france, really nice guy, that can be classified, properly classified. so, that is definitely something to take into consideration. i often am able to beat back classification determines of the united states. over classification is a serious problem. and president trump or whom ever, because there are other people who might be criminally

responsible if the facts justify will have an opportunity to challenge of some that information and the judge through the classified information procedures act which is a statute that applies to this type of case, will of course look at all of the documents, and make determinations as to whether or not their classified properly or not. >> all right. attorney mark zaid, thank you. he specialized in cases involving national security. we appreciate your being on this morning. >> so let's really quickly go back to elise jordan. you bring up a great point, sometimes some of the hillary mails were under-whelming. you've had security clearances, i have, too. there are times where, more rare, but there are times when you see things that actually your very glad that they're highly classified but at other times there are some things that you see that are very

under-whelming and like wait a second, this is -- this is classified. and and so you bring up a great point at end of the day, this all may be very under-whelming but if so, my goodness, merrick garland and the justice department will have a lot to answer for. >> exactly. i just -- we aren't necessarily even going to know for a long, long, long time, because they don't necessarily have to declassify any of the classified materials that donald trump took down to mar-a-lago, any time in the near future. it would be years and years. so i just worry about all of the conspiracy theories and misinformation that can fester in the absence of actual knowledge about what was taken and what was contained and what was frankly donald trump's motive in defying the presidential records act. >> well, and i think, jonathan

lemire, the intel committee on the hill, who asked for a briefing from doj, i think we're going to hear more from that from democrats and republican as like. of course, there is always, when you talk to members of congress, always the chance of a leak. and so of course they would have to be cautious there. but i expect you'll hear a rising chorus to the hill, saying give us an idea what are you doing here and is this significant? he don't want to hamper the criminal investigation in any way. but as elise said, i think members of intel committee will want to get some answers pretty soon. >> and there has been a bipartisan call for more information here. both senator graham, republican and senator warner, democrat, had suggested that they would like to know more about what is going on here and what is at stake. you're right, it is congress and particularly there are some folks who will get briefed on this will have an agenda so we

may, maybe not specifics, but contours of what is found there may be leaked to the media, to the public. we'll shall have to see about that. but i would certainly anticipate here congress is out, this rest of the month, but as we get closer to september and as they return, it will be a steady drum beat for more information as some try to use this as a political issue heading into the midterms. >> well, by the way, there is also a new development in the justice department separate probe into the january 6 attack on the capitol. "the new york times" reports federal prosecutors issued a grand jury subpoena to the national archives for all of the white house documents it gave to the january 6 select committee. we're going to be following what comes of that subpoena. and up next, the latest for the atlanta grand jury looking into the efforts to overturn the 2020 election. also ahead, a major shake-up at

the cdc is in the works. in response to what a report detailing the missteps in the agency's response to the covid pandemic. plus water levels in western states dangerously low levels with arizona now poised to lose one fifth of its water supply. we'll have those details and what, if anything, can be done about it. and later, remember the company we work? it was the office sharing company that was once valued in the billions before collapsing in dramatic fashion. well now its founder just got $350 million to start a real estate company. we'll speak to a reporter who said the move speaks volumes about silicon valley. that conversation is ahead.

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it is 9:27 here on the east coast. to the state of georgia where a grand jury in fulton county looking into efforts to overturn the 2020 election continues its work. yesterday trump's former lawyer rudy giuliani testified before that grand jury for six hours. now the state's governor is fighting a subpoena to testify. nbc news correspondent blayne alexander is at the courthouse with more. >> reporter: well rudy giuliani spent six hours in the courthouse here behind me testifying under oath behind closed doors before the special grand jury. now of course, these are closed proceedings but we do know it centers around statements that he made to georgia lawmakers back in 2020. just on the heels of the presidential election, where he made a number of false claims and conspiracy theories about

georgia's election. after the testimony yesterday, an attorney for giuliani did not go into specifics citing grand jury secrecy, but a attorney did give an indication of what woe not speak on, saying would stay away with any conversations with the former president and cite attorney/client privilege. and all of this centers around an investigation into the former president's efforts to efr turn the election here in georgia. but pointing to a phone call that he made to brad raffensperger asking him to find enough votes to overturn biden's win here in the state of georgia. overnight former president trump weighed in on that calling it a perfect phone call once again. but all of this is widening the possibility of exposure for the former president and any of his associates to criminal exposure. now all of this comes as we're seeing the investigation itself widen here in georgia. and in fact, this morning georgia's governor brian kemp is fighting a subpoena of his own

calling it politically motivated this close to november. back to you. >> blayne alexander reporting from atlanta. for more on this, let's bring in tamar hallerman. it is good to see you. we'll get back to giuliani but let's start where blayne ended with governor kemp fighting a subpoena. he's supposed to testify today. what does that look like? is this grand jury going to hear from him? >> not today. the judge overseeing the grand jury proceedings gave the governor an excusal, he's excused for the day as this gets fought in court. we're expecting a response from the fulton d.a. office in the next day or two. and his motion to quash the subpoena details a striking communication break down between the governor and fulton prosecutors. for a while, it appears that they were kind of on more friendly terms, the way that the governor's aides tell it, they have been willing to bring in the governor to testify about these attempts that the former

president was calling him in the aftermath of the november 2020 elections and kind of what the governor said to kind of put the kibosh on that. but it seems like plans that we had to come in and voluntarily testify on july 25th here in georgia. those plans fell apart and they're accusing the fulton prosecutors office of changing the terms at the last second. >> obviously governor kemp is in the middle of a re-election campaign running against stacey abrams but he's also in the thick of what happened on 2020 along with brad raffensperger. so on what grounds would he be excused from this subpoena? >> well, he has a couple of different arguments. yes, he's arguing that this is very politically motivated. but he also cited things like sovereign immunity. he's the governor of the state of georgia and he could not be dragged into court and he cites things like executive privilege and attorney/client privilege since the grand jury is asking for many documents that detail

internal deliberations within his office when it came to his interactions with the form he president and his campaign. so far the judge overseeing the case has not been inclined to quash subpoenas. every attempt before him he has denied. at the same time when it comes to elected officials, he has been willing to set down guardrails so say okay, prosecutors, you're allowed to ask concern questions about certain topics but you couldn't step on legislative privilege and in kemp's case, executive privilege. >> so rudy giuliani was there at the fulton county courthouse yesterday for about six hours. that is an awfully long time to be there testifying before the grand jury. we don't know a whole lot about what he said. what are you hear being how his day went, though? >> we don't know a whole lot. an a.p. reporter caught up with giuliani at jfk and he was told

he fulfilled his opportunity and the judge over seaing the case was not called in to help mediate any disputes but it is unclear just how much mr. giuliani may have cited attorney/client privilege when he was asked about any any conversations he might have had with trump. and we don't know if he's pleaded the fifth amendment at all to avoid self-incrimination. perhaps those details will come out in the days ahead but so far we have not heard a peep from the d.a. office. >> and in the middle of a heated governor race. tamar hallerman, thank you for your reporting. we appreciate it. some other headlines we're following this morning. the director for the centers for disease control and prevention is calling for a drastic change in the nation's top public health agency. rochelle walensky said the agency needs a re-set following missteps made during the kroed pandemic. the changes include steps to

speed up the release of data. this comes as the agency continues to con front the pandemic as well as other evolving threats including monkeypox and a troubling reappearance of polio. the reorganization proposal must be approved by the department of health and human services, cdc officials say they hope to have a full package of changes finalized, approved and underway by early next year. a federal judge has ordered three of the nation's largest pharmacy chains, cvs, walgreens and walmart to pay $650 million to two ohio county, ruling that the companies must be held accountable for their part in fuelling the opioid epidemic. it comes after a jury last november concluded the companies helped create a public nuisance in the two counties by oversupplying addictive painkillers.

the pharmacies have denied any wrongdoing. this is the first time they've had to pay money in a opioid lawsuit. and a drought overnight west has left states battling over who has access to the limited water resources. now 40 million people are at risk of having to ration their water supply. nbc's steve patternson has more. >> reporter: on the surface, the boundly beauty of the colorado river feels eternal. but underneath an increasingly urgent threat is rising faster than ever before. >> the colorado river is 20% smaller than it was 20 years ago. >> that provides water to 7 states and 40 million people. now the system that sustained it is no longer rebust to maintain that output. >> we need to reduce the amount of water we're taking out of the colorado river by something like

20% for the long-term. >> the river's two main reservoirs, lake powell and lake mead are now nearly three fourths empty and projected to continue dropping. facing a tear 2 shortage for the first time in history, in january arizona will lose 21% of the yearly water allocation from the river as nevada loses 8%. and just to give you a sense of the scope of the crisis, you go back before the drought and where i'm standing right now, i'd be about 40 feet under water. the consequences of brought and water shortages are now playing out everywhere. in the northeast, water restrictions in 78 new hampshire communities. this past july, was the hottest on record for texas since 1894. and the fifth driest in this same time period. 34% of the midwest is abnormally dry or experiencing drought. 70% of the west is in a moderate drought and 98% of california is in a severe drought. farmers are now facing an uncertain future. third generation arizona farmer

nancy kaywood said less than half of her 247 acre farm is producing crops. >> we're not making money. we don't know how long we could hang in there. >> reporter: the crises creating a domino effect. lesser availability in restaurants and grocery stores and billions of dollars in lost revenue. a startling new reality impacting every level of life from coast to coast. >> nbc's steve patterson with that report. and up next, we'll check in on wall street where investors are trying to read the tea leaves on whether the fed will raise interest rates again next month as it warns of a growing housing crisis. andrew ross sorkin will be here. and a documentary and a series starring jared leno and anne hathaway explored the failure of the office share company we-work. >> boy, that place collapsed.

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welcome back to "morning joe." mika, 9:41 a.m. that is new york city. home of the kids that play stick ball in the bronx. the new york yankees. the yankees coming back last night. late, late inning heroics. >> yeah. it was looking like another bad night in the bronx but they did come back. they felt -- they tied it up and set it extra innings and then fell behind 7-4 and josh donaldson, another scrappy kid from up toronto by way of minnesota. he hit a grand slam. a walk-off grand slam and boy did the yankees need it. they got a little taste of it and hopefully this breaks their sort of mental slump to go along with their hitting slump. they're back ten games up in the division. >> truly america's team.

>> they are. >> beloved by all. you know, when i saw this shot last night, i could only go back to 1980 lake placid, the united states beating the ussr in hockey. the tears flowing from airline passengers eyes when the pilot came on and announced yes, team usa had won. yeah, pretty fascinating. >> and now the healing can begin. >> well we showed the picture of new york city. it is not just the new york yankees. it is a town that affectionately downtown, downtown sections is now known as the town that sorkin built. so let's bring in new york citys a own co-anchor of squawk box, andrew ross sorkin. you could talk about anything. >> but i can't take credit for that, my friend. >> but that is what they're saying. that is what everybody is

saying. all the kids are said it. >> i've not heard this. >> okay. well you just don't hang out in the right places. so, andrew, let me ask you, what is going to happen with interest rates, because we don't know, market is trying to figure out are they going to keep going up, the fed have released some notes, some ominous words spoken about just how difficult it is been to tame inflation. we expect interest rates to go up even more? >> look. i think if you read the minutes yesterday, and i know everybody is trying to read the tea leaves and read between the lines, my read of it is that they are going to continue to put the foot on the neck of the economy to try to slow it down and that means raising interest rates by at least 75 basis points next month and possibly continuing for some time. unclear for how long that goes on. but for those who were thinking they were going to do nothing or they would only do 50 basis

points, i think it is hard to get there. there are people that will debate that with you. the impact is clear, how much mortgages cost to get, what it is doing to the cost of both borrowing and also homes and new home starts. so there is an impact there. having said that, the majority of people would have a mortgage are not impacted. so 90% of mortgage holders already have that mortgage, they're not being touched. the interesting part to watch, by the way, on all of this, is renters. a third of the country rents. you're looking at cities like arizona where rents up are 20% and that is -- that could start eating into consumers' ability to buy other things. so i think that is something to keep an eye on. we had jobs and jobless claims this morning. they came down a little bit. there is a big debate, do you want people to have jobs or not. if you are trying to slow the economy, you want less jobs.

i know that sounds perversion. but if we have a supply chain problem, maybe you want more people in the work force. so that is a little bit of debate that is happening on wall street this morning. >> andrew, let me ask you about elon musk, he's been weighing into politics using his big platform. the republicans had this big sort of meeting conclave retreat in wyoming on tuesday in the state of wyoming, the same day that liz cheney lost her race there and elon musk was a guest of honor. what did he have to say to them? >> well, you know, it is a fascinating shift in terms of where elon musk has been politically for a very long time. he's been a relatively outspoken democrat. in large part because of the work he's doing for tesla and his views about climate and climate change. he has, as you know, over the last year, shifted markedly and has said publicly he plans to vote for republicans come this fall. in large part because he's frustrated with the white house and from an ego perspective, i think frustrated that the white

house has been praising companies like general motors and ford over tesla more than anything else. and what he said, and i could quote directly from something he said publicly, right when he was doing this meeting, he said to be clear i support the left half of the republican party, and the right half of the democratic party. he's been calling for sort of a more compassionate version of the republican party. it will be very interesting to see where elon musk comes out politically after this -- after the midterms. but clearly, clearly if he's had a relationship with kevin mccarthy for a very long time so i don't know if we should read into this he's a republican yet. >> thank you as always. a co-founder after a venture capital firm has announced a $350 million investment into flow. a new real estate company from adam newman. you may recall it was knewman

who was behind we-work, the overhyped office space sharing company. once valued at $43 billion. before going through a disastrous attempt to go public. as our next guest writes, the flow deal is one of the most sufficient ways i've ever seen silicon valley light money on fire. not only does this idea not fix a problem that our country actually has, it is going to be run by a person who grows a business with all of the discipline of a 6-year-old on a sugar high let loose in a water park. don't mince words. let's bring in lynette lopez who covers politics and economics and international markets and that was an excerpt from her latest piece which is entitled "if you f up in the biggest ways you could be redeemed,". silicon valley just handed $350 million to the guy who crashed we-work. lynette, what is flow? and what is going here?

>> flow is, well nothing yet. it seems. but it is going to be a residential real estate company that purchases or partners with residential companies and kind of revamps the way that, you know, i live, supposed to be cute, fun, and make people feel like they have a share in their community. because when the venture capitalist mark who announced this deal, he made it sound like living in an apartment is so terrible. when you rent, you have no connection to your community and you never want your parents to come through. it is not a great way to live. so, what he is saying is that adam newman is going to add his touch and make living in an apartment fun. which is apparently the problem u.s. has. we don't have fun apartments. >> yikes. >> and you any it is too extreme of a word, watch the series starring jared leno and anne

hathaway. it is extraordinary. so mark, we were just talking about this, is a great sky and has a great track record in silicon valley, putting up $350 million. why? that is the question. if he's coming with a guy who just crashed we-work and walked away with a bunch of money, even though the company fell apart, why why would a guy like marc andreessen support his next venture? >> there's a couple things, i think, to look at here. the cynical way to look at adam neumann is he walked away completely unscathed from this $43 billion mess he made. and he scaled the company quite quickly. it made no money. everybody got burned at the end. but if you invest in the beginning, then you'll probably be okay. and andreessen is a big crypto guy. it might be the same story with crypto. you can see cynically if you get in the bottom of the big scheme before it collapses, you'll make money. adam neumann is rich, adam

neumann is connected, he is a friend. that's what these silicon valley guys are doing, investing in their friends. the last thing is marc andreessen is a not in my backyard person. he and his wife wrote a letter to their town, which was planning to build some multifamily residences. they said, no, under no circumstances, do not build that near our house. it will drop the value of our homes. we don't want anything to do with that. so, the reality of our problem, which is inflationary here with rents in this country, and it's very bad right now, is that we need to build more housing. and that's not what this does. that's not what a guy like marc andreessen wants, even though he wrote this long letter at the beginning of the pandemic how america doesn't build anymore and we need to build more things. i guess as long as he doesn't have to build them, pay for them or look at them, that's fine. but if they're in his backyard or want his money, building

housing is not an investment that silicon valley or marc andreessen is interested in. it's the investment that will help our country. goldman sachs said the stickiest part of our inflationary problem is housing, rents. you just heard andrew ross sorkin talk about that. not solving the problem. >> lynnette,ist fun when they turned around wework and are on the road to profitability after getting rid of adam neumann. does the mirage of adam neumann having contributed at one point to wework, did that help him get the investment that, oh, someone was able to turn around his just disaster of a company? >> i just think people want to see money fly around. maybe we're not in a recession. that's all i can say. >> insider linette lopez, thank you very much for your insights this morning. thanks for being on. still ahead this hour, in her concession speech on tuesday

night, liz cheney warned that u.s. democracy is at a tipping point. is there something everyday americans can do about it? our next guest is a professor at stanford university who says he has some scientifically proven ways to help. >> bravo. >> we'll find out what they are next. we're back in one minute. are next we're back in one minute tric shs or sharp, stabbing pains. ♪♪ this painful, blistering rash can disrupt your life for weeks. a pain so intense, you could miss out on family time. the virus that causes shingles is likely already inside of you. if you're 50 years or older, ask your doctor or pharmacist about shingles.

it's time to put away the harsh rhetoric, lower the temperature, see each other again, listen to each other again. and to make progress, we have to stop treating our opponents as our enemies. >> the newly elected joe biden in november of 2020 vowing to be a president for every american after years of growing partisanship. but nearly two years later, polarization is at its worst. that's why scholars from around the country partner together recently to take an analytical

look at how to bridge the partisan gap in america, with an experiment called the strengthening democracy challenge. and joining us now, one of the leaders of that study, professor and director of the polarization and social change lab at stanford university, rob willer. i'm skurs how this study was conducted. what did you analyze, especially given that in the past year we've seen violence erupt? >> yeah. so, we were very interested in that problem of high levels of anti-democratic attitudes, partisan animosity and also some significant levels of support for political violence. so, we wanted to test as many ideas as we could. we tested 25 ideas in a massive survey experiment, sort of like a public opinion poll. and we got some really, i think, helpful insights, trying to build a tool box for intervening on these problems. >> right. what worked?

>> yeah, tell us. >> you know, one of the best ideas that we tested was a video we showed people before asking them about their democratic attitudes that showed scenes of unrest and violence in the streets in countries that were dealing with democratic collapse before then showing footage from the capitol riot from just last year and drawing a sort of straight line through to show. we maybe are on the precipice of some sort of democratic collapse and we should not take for granted the stability that we've enjoyed here for 160 years. and that one, i think, offers an insight, if people had a better sense of what was at stake of defending our democratic norms and laws, that they would hold to democratic principles more. >> professor, we've been talking all morning about a party that says we are at war. we are at war with the fbi, we are at war with the irs, we are at war with the radical left. how do you step back from that when it's not just cranks on the

internet, it's the leadership of the republican party saying these things. if you get in and talk to people, do you think we're able to get out of this? >> yeah, that kind of rhetoric is incredibly dangerous. it has a huge amount of influence on people in the rank and file, everyday voters. in this case republican voters. one of the other interventions we found that is sort of the opposite of that kind of rhetoric and was effective for restoring americans, including republican voters' commitment to democracy, was a short video that the two utah gubernatorial candidates filmed in 2020 leading up to the election where they both committed to honor the results of the election and committed to, you know, the democratic process. and it's even kind of touching to see these rival candidates that are at some level competing, getting together, doing an add spot, cooperating and saying, we agree on the rules of the game. we have different ideas about how to run the state, but we agree the basic rules of the game. and i think if more candidates did that in more elections, that

could make a difference, too. helping americans see that at some level we have to cooperate here even as we compete. >> director of the polarization and social change lab at stanford university, rob willer, thank you very much, professor. we appreciate it. joe, as we're leading up to this hearing today, at the documents most experts say that we won't see anything from the search warrant beyond what we already know about what happened at mar-a-lago. >> we won't. if you listened what mark zaid had to say, there is a concern that this may not be significant enough to justify a search of the former president's home. so, there is going to be a delicate balance moving forward, isn't there, between helping the doj have the space they need to develop whatever investigation they're develop, but at the same

time, having some transparency. >> yeah, we'll see. we probably wouldn't see today in that affidavit. sounds like they won't unseal that. because it may not turn out to be something, doesn't mean you don't investigate a president of the united states taking documents out of the white house to his mar-a-lago resort. that does it for us this morning. we'll see you right back here tomorrow morning. jose diaz-balart picks up the coverage in one minute. the coverage in one minute you're never responsible for unauthorized purchases on your discover card.

good morning. 10:00 a.m. eastern, 7:00 a.m. pacific. i'm jose diaz-balart. we're following the legal trouble following donald trump and his inner circle. at any moment an associate of