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from msnbc world headquarters to new york. welcome everyone to alex witt reports. developing this hour. the fallout grows on the fbi search in mar-a-lago. as we wait to see if donald trump's legal team filed a motion for a special master to review the evidence seized the department of justice is nearing a major deadline to propose redactions for the affidavit season that search. earlier today, house intelligence committee chair adam schiff spoke on winning the balance of the public's right to know versus the government's concerns. >> i think the question is, at one point in time does the public get to see that

affidavit? i think the justice department makes a powerful case that at the early stage of the investigation, when it could jeopardize the pursuit of justice, this is not the time to be giving essentially the trump lawyers a roadmap into how to intimidate witnesses or how to derail illegitimate investigation. >> this all comes as a new nbc news poll out today shows americans largely agree trump's actions should be put under a legal lens. 57% believe the investigation should continue. and this breaking news this hour, republican senator lindsey graham may no longer be giving testimony to a grand jury scheduled on tuesday on election interference. that is because a federal appeals court today temporarily blocked graham from testifying in georgia. now sending the case back to the district court. some new questions about whether former president trump and former vice president mike pence will give testimony to the january six committee. earlier today, vice chair liz cheney was asked about the possibility of hearing from the former president himself.

>> what about trump before you wrap up? are you gonna ask him to testify? >> i don't make any announcements about that this morning. so let me just leave it there. >> but it's possible you could ask him for wrapping up to testify? >> yeah. again, i don't want to get in front of committee deliberations about that. i do think it's very important as i said in the first hearing, second hearing, his interactions with our committee will be under oath. >> we're getting a fresh look at democrats messaging ahead of the midterms. suggest days after president biden signed that inflation reduction act into law, earlier on meet the press, democratic -- committee chair sean patrick maloney said he thinks his party will keep the control of congress in november. >> we have had a summer of strength. we just in last few weeks passed historical insulation to finally lower prescription drug

costs, capping seniors out of pocket cost. combatting climate change. that's on top of the american jobs bill, the chiefs and science to revitalize our manufacturing sector. the other side has had a summer assembles. obstructing veterans health care, ripping away 50 years of reproductive freedom. and now, we're trying to defund the fbi and ignore a serious threat to our national security with trump's latest scandal. >> on the heels of that, now to this hour's panel. nbc's justice reporter, ryan reilly. lisa reuben, legal analyst for the rachel maddow show. and hayes brown, msnbc daily columnist and editor. welcome all. ryan, i'm gonna start with you here. give us the very latest on the mar-a-lago situation. where do things stand? >> as this unfolds, i think i want to highlight something about the ongoing threats that are being faced with the fbi. we saw that attack of the fbi cincinnati field office. we saw a man arrested for a threat last weekend. in fact, in a recent motion

that was filed. the victim impact statement from a officer, a capitol police officer who survived the january 6th attack. he actually made reference to some of these new allegations are coming out about the mar-a-lago situation amid threats. he said quote i live with fear of another attack happening due to the rhetoric that it's currently discuss ad nauseam on social media, radio, in the news. he said in the fight of initial cte. he says, it is exhausting to the point where i don't watch follow any form of media anymore since i seem to live the news daily. and he really wants the individuals who are charged with nurse likes to be held accountable saying to not hold those individuals accountable for their actions will only encourage this horrific behavior again and again when they do not get their way. and if we quote stand back and stand by as the democratic country then -- we have become complacent and will allow this cancer to spread exponentially. it's an individual who's extremely -- made it through january 6th is extremely worried about the continuing rhetoric around the

-- as well as these new threats that are emerging from the search almost two weeks ago of donald trump's estate in mar-a-lago, alex. >> ryan, stay with us. don't go too far because we're in to bring in right now lisa rubin, legal analyst for the rachel maddow show. and hayes run as well, msnbc daily columnist and editor. lisa, i want to begin with the breaking news that just went down shortly before the show started here. that a judge has temporarily blocked senator lindsey graham from having to testify in the georgia election fraud probe. ram argues he should have protections as a federal lawmaker. but will this argument stand up long term? it might delay from tuesday. but long term is the question. will the grand jury ever hear from the senator? >> i think the grand jury should hear from the senator. alex, the immunity that senator graham has been talking about in his briefs, both the district court under the 11th circuit, stems from the constitution in the speech and debate clause.

which essentially holds the members of congress can be immune for their actions taken in their capacity as a lawmaker. but do you and i both know that the thing that bonnie willis is most interested in exploring with lindsey graham is a myth of a rough phone call that he made to brad raffensperger, the secretary of state in georgia. about the election and whether or not mr. raffensperger could make certain adjustments, find certain votes, whether he had certain powers. brad raffensperger has all the president told others that he felt pressured by that phone call. that's not a phone call that seems to be made in the exploration of lindsey graham's legislative options as a member of congress voting to certify the election. almost two months before january 61 congressman to certify the vote. yet again, the steps that he took during that call were as an advocate for donald trump and his capacity as a candidate. not as the president and certainly not in some underground capacity as a sitting senator.

>> let me ask you about something. senator graham's team put this line out and reading into the wall street journal. here's the quote. senator graham will suffer irreparable harm if forced to appear before his appeal concludes. if you're telling the truth, how do you suffer irreparable harm? are they concerned illegally? are they concerned politically. how do you interpret that? >> i understand that argument legally that senator graham's team is making. and it's essentially what we call you can't un-ring the bell. in other words, of senator graham is forced to testify before this appeal concludes, no appeal taken to its fidelity can sort of restore him to his status quo which is not to testify. it's already out there. the question is why is senator graham so hell-bent on not testifying? alex, as you know, if all he has to do is tell the truth about his phone call with brad raffensperger and other things that he was involved in the state of georgia, a state he doesn't represent and congress

or otherwise. why would it be so harmful for him to sit before the grand jury in fulton county and talk about what he knows? >> that's my question. i'm just trying to get the answer to that. anyway. let's turn back quickly to the pending decision on suing the mar-a-lago search affidavit. because trump's legal team, as we know, is considering stepping into the fray, they've got the fourth amendment base challenge there. suggesting this is from his attorneys who stayed mom by the way during last week's hearings. what do you make, lisa, of trump's legal strategy? >> i don't think it's much of a legal strategy at all. alex, you'll note that president trump and his legal team are really speaking primarily through the megaphone of social media and not through the microphone of the report room or even for briefs. the fact that at this stage in the game, they are now saying they want to have a special master appointed. leaves me scratching my head. a special master is something that a judge will sometimes a point where there are real questions about privilege and materials that are seized rudy

giuliani is a great example. last year when, the southern district sees another of his electronic devices a special master was appointed to make sure that nothing that was attorney client privilege. giuliani was acting as the president's lawyer fell into prosecutor's hands when it shouldn't be. but that's not the argument that president trump is making here. he's not claiming that the fbi has its hands in a bunch of attorney-client privilege information. he's just arguing that the search itself was over roth. that's a decision that judge reinhardt had to make when he saw the affidavit and it -- this strikes me as a strategy borne out of regret and borne out of public relations not out of legal strategy. >> interesting. hayes, i know that you wrote about two pretty different groups who are advocating for the unsealing of the affidavit. you have the media that includes nbc news. the conservative activist group judicial watch which trump and his allies support. were apparently strange bed fellows here. explain how the reasoning

through the release differs. >> the media has you know are arguing that this is a matter of public, the public needs to know what was this affidavit given the high level of interest around this case. given the fact that it is so unprecedented. people like the new york times, their lawyers did admit that normally the sorts of documents like an affidavit unsealed at the end of a case. but this is not a normal case. you have trump out there talking about this case, posting on truth social about this case. he has his lawyers talking to the press about it. the argument on that side is it's a matter of what the public has a right to know. judicial watch, they seem to be trying to get this affidavit out there or at least using this push to get the documents out there as a weapon against joe biden and against the permit of justice. because their arguments while there are legal briefs are very to the point saying that this is a matter of the public needs to know. that there is a lot of questions out there. these documents should be

unsealed the status of their making in press releases and in other media's more along the lines of into rain in this biden justice department. that is so out of control the targeting the former president and this cannot stand that i feel like is a real difference between the two. it's just getting the truth out there versus trying to at least give the appearance that some wrongdoing was happening. and that's the thinking behind judicial watches case. that something bad happened here. not just that we need to know what happened here. >> ryan, we have the doj arguing in court that unsealing the affidavit could pose some risks to witness safety and ultimately of course is up to the judge. who himself has faced death threats. he's going to the side what's redacted. the guy is human. how do you think this has affected any factor to the security concerns? he looks at their proposals. at the reduction to -- the proposals to redact. that's a voice to happen on thursday. but if you think about it, he

can't help but personalize something like this because having your life threatened is pretty darn scary. >> yeah, it is. it impacts your daily life. all the security measures. he couldn't go to services on the weekend because the synagogue had some threats against it. it's really -- it's impacted him in a real way. i think that that that family has to weigh on him and some capacity. but some measure i think you can sort of predict where this was going. when he signed this, given what has happened and how trump has targeted the fbi and doj. wasn't a huge jump to make the assumption that this is sort of what was going to unfold. threats against the judiciary. threats against the fbi. we could sort of see this coming in -- i think that that's why you could be pretty confident although we're obviously gonna want to see this on the line. i think you'd be pretty confident in the decision-making process that was in place at the fbi and doj. as well as he made that because

they all knew that this was all going to be really integrated. this wasn't just going to go quietly. this is gonna be something that was maybe going to be of great public interest and i think that he's someone who is going to stand by that decision based upon what that affidavit represented. there is a little bit of interest i think from him in saying listen, you would imagine getting this out there. he thinks is going to be good for him because the affidavit supports what action took place here in his view i believe alex. >> how closely do you think the safety issue raised by the doj's will be taken into account by the judge this week? >> i think the safety issues raised by the doj are definitely taken into the account. but not as righteous noted i don't think the personal safety concerns that judge reinhardt might have for himself or animating what decisions he's making. if anything, i would caution towards maybe reviewing more information so that you can convert some of the disinformation that surrounding the affidavit right now as hayes talked about earlier.

but one of the other safety concerns that i think just reinhardt has to be thinking about isn't just that of the fbi agents. but that of the doj attorneys involved. alex, one of the things that i noted last week in the briefs somebody or jay. there is signed by only two people. jay pratte, who's the head of counter-intelligence and export control video dj who's in this investigation, and one antonio gonzales, who is the u.s. attorney for the southern district of florida. a case like this we were talking about former president you see a whole long list of names. signing on to a motion to seal a search warrant for example. but here, you only see two and they're fairly senior people at that. that suggests to me that doj has its own concerns about the safety of its career prosecutors and lawyers. and that this isn't just a concern about fbi agents who might be visible and surveillance videos. or concerned about the judge who's protected by the u.s. marshals service. this is a safety issue all around the circle for everyone involved at this point. that is a sobering lee so, that

the cure 100% right, as usual, by the way. also a house jurgen of cigarettes or don't you go anywhere. anyway, ryan, you are the best. just, well thank you guys. the inflation reduction act might be a big deal for everyday americans, but is a big deal of people don't realize is? and, going in search of american optimism. we're gonna see if the new nbc poll is fine. poll is fine scent set the mood. ♪ feel the difference with downy.

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our new nbc news poll up today shows biden's approval numbers have not wavered, much despite a string of legislative victories. 42% say they approve of the presidents overall, drop while 55% say they disapprove. let's go to nbc's gary ground, joining us from the beach where the president continues his summer vacation. gary, we also we learning from this poll? >> alex, polls are just a

snapshot of a moment in time. but it is a pretty good moment in time for president biden, when this new nbc news poll was conducted. it was just after the inflation reduction act passed in congress. and it was after a strong july jobs report. you see it. they're 42% of americans say they approve of the president's job approval, and 55% say they disapprove. it is not just the president. who the voters are not thrilled. with voters show that the vast majority of americans show the country is on the wrong track, 75% of americans say that. and they also say they are not very positive about the, future with 60% of respondents saying that they believe americans blisters are in fact people are dogs, not in front of us. so what is behind these, numbers what is the reason for these numbers? it went to one of the best places we thought we could talk to voters about that. the iowa state fair happening in des moines. here's what some voters have to say. >> i think there are problems out there, it is not the presidents fault.

but i think both parties need to work more together. >> i think all those peoples should be gone, they might be of the 4:20 or 30 years. it's ridiculous, it's the same people in the same way. we know younger. crowd >> i think everybody is just -- no one seems happy anymore. there are a whole personality, and no one seems happy. i just like it is part oh being locked up for so long. we've got in a different direction due to covid. >> now, it all comes back to this kitchen table issues. i see him and talk to voters all over the country. and i see it reflected in our nbc polling. the issue -- care most about is the cost of, living, jobs economy, abortion, and guns. more than anything else, this is, new voters care about threats to our democracy. alex. >> isn't that extraordinary? i was shocked when i saw that.

thank you for bringing it. up appreciated, gary. more would lead to the seizure of documents at mar-a-lago, trying to mean as washington congressman adam smith, chair of the armed services committee. always an honor to have you here. let's get into it sir. new reporting the new york times which details the final days of the trump white house. chaos and scattered papers. he goes on to say that the government documents that trump with accumulated were to go to the national archives, but at least some ended up in florida. one of the reporters behind that piece or something up with this tweet. trump was focus not on preserving documents for the history of his presidency, as required by law, but on payback in trying to humiliate the fbi officials whose text messages got them removed from mueller's phone. how concerned are you about donald trump's handling of documents in general? these documents and others? and what kind of risk you think it poses to our country's national security? >> it's definitely risky. i'm vastly more concerned about your poll of white

conservatives are concerned about. that is a threat to democracy. we will have to assess what is in these documents, who knows will solve them, and it is possible that the overall damage can be contained. but it is sort of the entire philosophy behind donald trump taking those documents and his presidency, which is basically, we are not a nation of laws and institutions and rules, we are a nation of donald trump. go back to speak to the 2016 convention, i alone can fix it. and that was his viewpoint. the country is him and vice versa, that is enormous threat to a republican emergency, the spends in 1000 difference ways. one say that the documents to the people went ham. officers who. that pretty restful the entire institution don't matter. they don't want to president trump. they seem to not matter to the republican party. putting president trump ahead of our generous institutions. >> it is a threat because

people are buying into, that which is confounding. i'm sure you will agree. but let's go to the federal agency, sir, who are reporting an increase in threats following of the mar-a-lago search. we have the doj concerned with safety for those agents, seeing that the surveillance video is released of those agents movie moving the customers for mar-a-lago. welcome to concerns you have about these attacks that we are seeing on the fbi? >> well, it is incredibly concerning. again, it goes back to that basic loss of donald trump. but all these, agencies all of these people exist to serve him and not the country. and if they, don't he will seek retribution. and then he fires up, you know, his supporters. many of whom have decided this violence is unacceptable way to -- when you have a republican candidate for congress in my state, i said, quote, we are at war. that basically, if republicans don't get their, way they view it as a war. and they must attack. we are seeing a lot of lives in

jeopardy, i will tell. you will hear this from my republican colleagues more than anybody. republican colleagues who at one time or another dared to vote against what trump wanted. maybe they voted to certify the election, maybe they voted for the infrastructure, bill maybe they voted to form the january six commission. and when they do, that they and their families start receiving violent threats. for daring to go a gun to a trump and the maga extremist want. this is incredibly concerning and threatening, and i urge everyone in this country to organize, vote, and push back against this. do not support insurrectionists. even if you happen to like their patsy policy or some other aspect of what they are doing. this should be a foundational issue for the country. >> yes, 100 percent. let me ask you a donald trump's role in all of this. whatever accountability should he face, and what will he face? >> that is an interesting. threat difficult. look. i don't think you should speak

out every conversation that is out. there i've always viewed myself as a peacemaker, i try to work with whoever i can to solve problems, declined the temperature where you can, look for ways to agree and compromise, and certainly doing a -- executing a search warrant on a former president residence is unprecedented, and ramps of that conflict. but my opinion is that the alternative to, that in this case, is worse. the alternative of letting trump get away with it, because his supporters make violent threats. if you don't, you can't let that sort of -- and it is terrorism, govern the laws of this country. and that is the remarkable thing about. this as extraordinary is all of this, is alex, it is also incredibly simple. with the fbi day at mar-a-lago, they really had no choice. the president took documents out of the white house, which belonged to the american people. he sold them. pure and simple. everybody knew. in for 18 months, they tried to

reason with him and just get them back. at that point, either the president is above the law, or he is not. and if he is not, you have to deal with what this judge did him with the fbi, did and deliberately property back. >> listen, unprecedented action by the fbi, for it to a unprecedented president on his action. it stands to reason. it is logical. let me move on to an area that you know, well sir, at least around your position in the early armed services committee as we talked about ukraine. figures are certainly growing as russian forces are striking near europe's biggest nuclear power plant. ukraine is worried that russia may be planning some kind of a military operation to plant. and also plans to potentially divert the power that is created by that facility, to criminal efforts and also to russia. they knew president zelenskyy, who is managing ukrainians to be vigilant, because russia could do something, quote, particularly cool before ukraine's independence day. that is this wednesday. what are you watching, form and

how much of a threat does this power plants pose, in your mind, not just for ukraine to greet her greater europe? >> to the top weather you did mention there, agreeing with ukraine sort of reclaiming the momentum in this conflict. you've seen the strikes in crimea, we have seen the russian forces, which are degraded horribly and slowed down everywhere they are attacking. and we have seen the ukrainians getting back to territory. so that changes the dynamic. it stops putin from his plot to take over ukraine. but it also puts the russians into a desperate situation, which is dangerous as well. as far as the powerpoint is concerned, the russians are not attacking the power plant. they are using the power plant as a place to attack from. so the concern is how do you respond to that. do they just let them have a safe haven to bomb them across

the river, and then how does that impact the power plant, and then the other issue that you raise is not just happening at this power plant. the russians are aggressively trying to target ukraine's energy supply. one about her to her places. as winter comes. in it is similar to what they are doing in terms of cutting off natural gas supplies to europe, as we head towards winter. but look. putin needs to really pause and take a look at this. the level of conflict and the danger that he is placing russia this is chaotic, violent effort to erase ukraine from the map. it's costing everybody dearly, including russia. . . . . . . anne anne ? ical study, patients using salonpas patch reported reductions in pain severity,

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former nba star dennis rodman's plane to visit russia to seek the release of brittney griner. rodman tells nbc news that he got permission to russia and will try to go this week. griner serving a nine-year prison sentence on drug charges. back in the u.s., heavy rainfall and flash flooding are expected today across the southern plains. alerts are in place for 10 million people in six states. some places already seeing more than three inches of rain so far today. some areas will get double that through monday. and wendy's is pulling lettuce from sandwiches in michigan ohio in pennsylvania after dozens of people got sick after eating them. cdc is trying to determine whether romain lattice is the source of the e. coli outbreak. that sickened at least 37 people and if that lettuce was also sold at other businesses. now this breaking news, and you toast in the grand jury investigating from president trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election results in georgia. just a couple of hours ago, the

11th circuit court of appeals temporarily blocking senator lindsey graham from having to testify before the fulton county ground jury. last week, a judge ordered gram to honor his subpoena and testify on tuesday. he's among seven tried visors and associates summoned in this investigation which has focused especially on that phone call that trump made to the georgia secretary of state asking him to find that precise number of votes needed to reverse his election defeat. joining me now is greg blue's team, politically reporter for the atlanta journal-constitution. good to see you again, let's get into this. he's temporarily block from home to testify on tuesday. what happens now? >> some legal experts think that this could significantly delay this case. i'm really what others are stunned that this could end up -- about his conversation with donald trump and his two phone calls to georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger. so essentially now, everything is up in the air.

and we know right now that investigators are really particularly interested in questioning graham about the circumstances surrounding those two calls that he made to secretary of state brad raffensperger where he was asking about potential illegal ballots that we know it do not exist in this case. so we're also really closely watching one of the skaters are interested involving any potential coordination between trump campaign and lindsey graham. >> i can tell you the dea, there are a fulton county is not too pleased. i'm certain, because friend wilson said before. delaying the senator's testimony would also delay the revelation of an entire category of relevant witnesses. or information each of whom would require additional time and resources to secure on behalf of the grand jury. potentially craig how much does this set things back? >> it could be weeks. it could even be longer. i've talked to a few legal scholars this morning who said it could be even months. but also is part of that ruling a federal judge -- their decision and so it could

be quicker. it could be a very lengthy delay that could jeopardize a whole segment of fani willis's investigation. >> so he's just one of several witnesses who pushed back against the calls for them to testify. governor brian kemp last week, he moved to quash the subpoena for him to appear after months of talks with the da. after the electorally broke down -- reminding brian kemp was once praised for resisting trump's pressure to intervene in the election. so what is keeping him from testifying now? and greg, does it have anything to do with cam's been kind of hinting that he would welcome trump's endorsement. which he would not get every stultifying. >> exactly. and look, you know that governor kemp was the top of trump's revenge list. david perdue challenging trump, challenging governor kemp back in may republican primary. so camp is no big ally or no friend of donald trump in the sense. same time, he's in a very heated november election.

donald trump hasn't ruled out endorsing brian kemp. now we have this extraordinary revelation because we thought on the surface it seem like governor kemp and was willing to testify. it was cooperating -- file just a few days ago. we see the full extent of the clash going on between bonnie willis's office and governor kemp's attorneys. and he seemed to governor saying right now he doesn't want to testify this close to a november election. stacey abrams -- it would take valuable time off the campaign trail for him to prepare for all sorts of questions that come his way should he appear in person in the grand jury. >> speaking of questions. on wednesday, rudy giuliani said i'm a prosecutor since that he had satisfied his obligation after facing hours of questioning before the grand jury. what do we know about that, greg, about what happened behind closed doors? and how worried should donald trump be about rudy giuliani's appearance? >> yeah, six hours of testimony. we don't have any inkling that he actually said anything. he could have pleaded the fifth the entire time because --

>> we haven't heard that either, right? we haven't heard that he pled the fifth as we do other times. donald trump, 440 times, his son eric almost 500 times. when it's that bad, we hear about it. >> you're exactly right. look, his attorneys also suggested he could -- claim attorney client privilege for certain conversations. we haven't heard that either. that was before the testimonial. we've heard from rudy giuliani's him essentially saying that he satisfied the course requests. but look, prosecutors could make use of something he said. in six hours of testimony, something that he said could've become useful for prosecutors who, as i said, have named him as a target of criminal prosecution. he could end up facing criminal charges. >> he could eventually face indictment. in addition to making these numerous false claims about election fraud and georgia state legislative hearings. he also allegedly participated, as you know, in a scheme to create slates of fake

presidential electors across numerous states. and that includes georgia. what kind of crimes could giuliani be charged with? >> there is a number. there is a number of crimes. including making false statements and trying to interfere with elections. i was at the state capital on december 2020 when he was gonna given a heroes welcome. as he testified before the state legislative hearings. people were taking selfies with him. they were responding -- he used his testimony in the state capital just to spew all sorts of unfounded claims, lies, falsehoods, conspiracy theories about computers, all these things that have not true whatsoever. at the same time, there are still being regurgitated by donald trump's allies. as reason to believe in undermined the faithfulness and the confidence in georgia's election. >> can i ask you quick about legal advisers on trump, jenna ellis, who's said to testify this week. what do they want to hear about

her in terms of helping trump overturn the results in georgia? >> there are specifically looking at legal memos. she authored about what then vice president mike pence can do to reverse the election results. in any coordination she had with trump campaign officials as part of a broader plot to undermine credibility and faith of election and beyond. >> thank you for answering that because i wasn't aware and now i know. greg lewis, team thank you so much. coming up next, fear factor. the biggest gop lies about the eu irs funding and memorable guns are trying to scare a vote for the midterms. for the midterms ♪ well the sun is shining and the grass is green ♪ ♪ i'm way ahead of schedule with my trusty team ♪ ♪ there's heather on the hedges ♪ ♪ and kenny on the koi ♪ ♪ and your truck's been demolished by the peterson boy ♪ ♪ yes -- ♪ wait, what was that? timber... [ sighs heavily ] when owning a small business gets real, progressive helps protect what you've built

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seekers from the national republican senatorial committee. do not apply for any new irs jobs created by the inflation reduction act. that directive was supposed by flores and rick scott. it is part of a larger effort by republicans who seasoned democrats landmark law to spread unfounded conspiracy theories that the agency plans to deploy armed agents to shake down ordinary americans. joining me now msnbc columnist hayes ran, who were there with us. development thank you for sticking, around will come up to the so, here congressman. hayes explained what's senator scott said about this new position of the irs, and -- these false claims about the agency's attentions. >> as part of the i.r.a. was this funding for the irs

enforcement the democrats have been trying to get since the bye ministration started. rick scott who joined looked in specifically to post this open letter to job seekers made a bunch of claims about the fact that the irs is going to come after middle class americans, shake them done for money, shot your door with guns. among this half treat that he is putting out there is that the funding is billions upon billions of dollars to hire more irs agents than the fbi, state department, and pentagon put together have. what is really insidious about that sort of statement is how selective it is. she says the pentagon and open. ladder and if you take the pentagon and video tree and you add together those other agencies, yes that makes sense. but if you look at the department of defense, we do so most people think when you say the pentagon, that is over 700,000 civilians around the world.

this letter is very carefully crafted to exploit people's fears and explore the idea that the irs is coming for you, specifically. even though the commissioner of the irs, charles reddick, who trump appointed, told congress that he would follow the biden administration set a directive not to up the number of audits going to -- be making under $400,000 a year. so they are not coming after normal americans. here >> by the way, this can be done over ten years. it is notable that the irs actually has the same size today as it was in 1970. it's enforcement staff has fallen more than 40% since 2010, and millionaires have declined more than 70%. so what does this newly signed law due to bolster the agency? talk about the staffing and how that is going to play out. >> it's designed to take into account the resignation or retirement or transfer of several tens of thousands of people who are expected to

leave the irs during this decade. in the end, hopefully, is that will be up to the mid 90s. era which is not exactly the time when you think, well, the irs is really cracking down on the average american, showing up on peoples doorsteps. historically speaking, it does not really hard to go after tax collectors. i get it. i get why the irs is such a target for republicans, here. but the fact that they are doing this, in hiding the, fact basically, that these new enforcement agents will be tasked with bringing those audits of the super wealthy backup, and recover the millions upon millions of dollars of tax revenue that these people do all the governments. which is either heading away or is cleverly tucked into the tax filings by attorneys, and accountants. the goal is to actually put money into the bank, that these people already. oh and republicans cannot

really talk about that. >> let me ask you about what is being talked about, the senator. let's look at him, specifically. because he is the richest member of the senate. 1990, seven his health care company reached a 1.7 billion dollar settlement of federal charges of fraudulent billing practices. scott himself came away with $300 million in a stop. also a 5.1 million dollar severance in a 950,000 dollar a year consulting contact. do you care to comment on the questions that have been asked by citizens for responsible ethics in washington, but why the richest man in congress is so opposed to irs agents? >> a very fair question to ask. i would really like to know who amongst his, donors who amongst his friends base, amongst the ultra wealthy, has been pushed to, say well, this is not something that we think would be good for you. would you get for us. and therefore would not be good for america. even though these new agents in these new enforcements would

allow the actual -- of the programs that will help the poor, and help the needy in this country. i think that rick scott is probably the worst messenger on this, but i'm not surprised about how earlier in this campaign he put out the republican senate plan to raise taxes on most americans. i am not surprised that this is his, sort, of his tack. his skill level. when it comes to campaigns to reclaim the senate in the fall. >> extraordinary, okay. hayes, brown thank you for writing about it and shouting about. it meanwhile, two longtime democrats on capitol hill are sticking tuesday's primary. and one of them is short to lose. we will explain, next. we will explain, next.

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this is my happy place. there are millions of ways to make the most of your land. learn more at deere.com it's the all-new subway series menu! 12 irresistible new subs... like #11 subway club. piled with turkey, ham and roast beef. this sub isn't slowing down time any time soon. i'll give it a run for its money. my money's on the sub. it's subway's biggest refresh yet. now to a mystery sees can't into the midterm elections, to 79 days away. on tuesday voters in a new york florida and oklahoma will be heading to the polls. when is the most closely

watched races is the house seat for new york's 12 congressional district. according to a new poll, congressman joe matt areas leaving his closest challenger carolyn maloney by 22 points ahead of the democratic primary. but at least one will now return to capitol hill next, year now their districts have been range rancourt partially combined. joining me now is emiliano, reporter for new york. one welcome, emily. can you answer what has led to jerry nadler building this much of a lead over his longtime colleague caroline maloney? they are both two titans. >> good afternoon, alex. that is exactly. right it is called the clash of the titans, because after the primaries on tuesday, at least one if not both of the top heavyweights will be unseated. and be considered the primary among during, adler, maloney and challenger -- who is certainly putting up a fight. we can say that the momentum is with nadler, partially because the polling has been chosen

well ahead, in part because he was endorsed by senator minority leader chuck schumer. and partially because of the endorsement by the new york times editorial board which helps tremendously. even before all, that he has a space in the upper west side of manhattan which is a deeply loyal electorate. an electorate that is very politically active, that will turn out for them. this is a neighborhood that raised him in truly turned out to be a cultural war on the upper west side which is nadler's base, and every side which is maloney space. >> what does this mean for new yorkers as a whole? >> it means that new york will lose. as you said, at least one of these number democratic house leadership will lose. the only woman who served in congress that man had where the only jewish members of the congressional delegation in new york state. tons of connections, to washington. tons of clicks between which is collectively between the two of. them 60 years in congress.

now, -- challenger was an attorney and former barack obama. eight this impact could not be understated. you can cite them both. he winds on tuesday, which is much less likely. he could come to congress as sort of a changing of the guard. that has been the argument that -- has been making all along. >> one thing interesting from patel. both of these candidates made headlines this year. they wavered on whether or not biden will run again in 2024. you have a patel using this against them in a recent political ad, so did that help them or hurt them? >> i would not say that the campaign trail with all these candidates made much of an impact among voters. patel is going to seize on everything we can and try to get a foothold among voters. this is something that came up in the spectrum of new york one debate with w and i see just a couple of weeks ago. these three candidates were asked whether they would support joe biden for reelection in 2024. patel said that he, would

maloney in the adler waffles. and they were hesitant to say that they would support. tim maloney in particular had to come and say point like that you did not believe -- reelection. she is a comingling approximately bit in the aftermath. and say that you would support biden if he decided to. and she still does not believe he's going to. ron this is what's patel's on opening. and actually, both of the 77 year olds have h them by trying to pick off young voters who might be supporting patel. >> that is interesting. okay, emily no, thank you so much for following all those details, here locally, from new york. appreciate that. that will do it for me on this edition of alex witt reports. i will see you guys again next saturday at noon eastern. in a moment, cory coffin continues our coverage of yasmin julian. yasmin julian. ♪ ♪ we believe there's an innovator in all of us. ♪ ♪

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coughing in paris as mississippi. in a big court decision this sunday involving senator lindsey graham which could have a major impact on the george investigation of donald trump. we're also awaiting what trump has called a quote major motion in reaction to the search of a mar-a-lago home. details could come undone in time. this is brand new poll numbers out from nbc news show where a clear maternal majority -- investing in the form president. that poll also has some good news for president biden and democrats ahead of the midterms. we'll have more on