there was so much to talk about. unfortunately, technology got in the way. we couldn't get the line from the u.s. to london. london is technologically backgrounds. i apologize to my home country. tomorrow, extra business from london. thank you for getting up "way too early" with us on this monday morning. "morning joe" starts right now. they want to make them responsible for taking classified documents and preserved them. >> i still haven't seen any evidence he was at -- that trump was asked to give the documents back. do any of us believe donald trump is reading his nuclear secrets on his bedside at night? >> this is the first airing of a former president's home for potentially information, whatever they think is wrong. plus, the way hillary clinton's negotiation and emails were handled. >> what use could a former president have for classified or top secret information once he has left office? >> every former president has access to their documents.

it's how they write their memoirs. >> those are some of the new excuses from republicans about why donald trump took classified documents home with him to mar-a-lago. there was, though, one of the old ones about hillary clinton. the former president now is previewing his legal plans as he pushes more dangerous rhetoric. also this morning, new polling from nbc news shows americans no longer believe the economy is the most pressing issue facing our country. steve kornacki joins us to break down the numbers and to tell us what is on the minds of americans. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it is monday, august 22nd. with us this morning, u.s. special correspondent for bbc news, the great katty kay. katty, taking broadside shots a moment ago at your home country and the technology there. i was deeply concerned by that. >> i know. i was just hoping no one was listening back home. >> i think you're okay. we'll redeem ourselves here. >> okay. >> let's start with the new nbc news national poll which shows 57% of americans believe the

investigations into donald trump should continue. 40% say they should stop. when it comes to top issues facing the country, threats to democracy have overtaken the cost of living. the poll also shows a dissatisfied electorate. tracking with other numbers we've seen for months now. 74% of americans say the country is headed in the wrong direction. a record 58% believe america's best days are behind it. and 68% believe the united states currently is in a recession. republicans have a slight 2-point edge when it comes to which party voters want to control congress, though that's in the margin of error. a tie game there. democrats have significantly closed the enthusiasm gap. 68% of republicans express a high level of interest in the upcoming election, versus 66% for democrats. in may, that gap was 8 points. let's go to nbc news national political correspondent steve

kornacki at the big board, and the co-founder of "axios," mike allen with us, as well. steve, take us through some of the numbers and what jumped out to you. >> willie, everything we're trying to figure out in the last month or so is something changing here in terms of the midterm climate towards the democrats' benefit, away from the republicans, of course. the usual trend has been the out of power party, the opposition party does really well in midterm elections. earlier this year, just about all the numbers were pointing in that direction. the question is, are those numbers changing at all? let's take you through some of the big ones. you showed a few, and let's try to put some context on this. first, the president's approval rating, i mean, typically, this tells you a lot about where things are going in a midterm election. the only two times in the modern era when a president's party has not lost seats in congress in a midterm, president's approval rating was sky high on election day. that would have been 2003 with george w. bush. he was in the high 60s.

that would have been '98 with bill clinton. he was in the 60s. biden is at a 42% approval rating. 55% disapprove. the last time our poll, the nbc poll was in the field, it's been a while, but back in may, it basically looked exactly the same. start of the summer, end of the summer here, biden's approval rating in our poll basically flat. you mentioned also that question of the generic ballot. in our polling, again, comparing late spring, start of the summer, really hasn't budged that much now. republicans ahead by two. had been a tie in may. this is interesting, when you look at this one historically, think back now over the last decade or so, there have been two big republican midterm years. that was 2010. that was the huge sweep when they won 63 seats. that was 2014, barack obama's second midterm. it was a big one for republicans. at this point in 2010, republicans were plus 6 on the

generic ballot. it was clear by the end of summer 2010 where things were going in that midterm election and that republicans were headed toward a very strong performance. i think what is interesting i , the other big republican midterm, they trailed in 2014 on the generic ballot by 1.4 points. it is worth keeping in mind, if you think back to 2014, there was talk until very late in the midterm cycle that maybe democrats were going to buck history and have a good year. one of the things was the generic ballot was favorable to the democrats until deep into the midterm campaign. if you're a republican, you hope this is a repeat of 2014. if you're a democrat, you hope you can keep it where it is right now, in terms of the generic ballot. you mentioned the enthusiasm, as well. look at this change. i think this is notable here. oh, one screen too far there. if you went back to march, this is what i'm saying.

earlier in the year, the numbers were consistent with a big republican midterm advantage. temperatures had a 17-point advantage when it came to their voters saying they had the highest level of enthusiasm coming into the midterms. in may, it was down to 8, and now the gap is 2 points. the blue wave of 2018, democrats gained 40 seats in the house during trump's presidency. on this same question, democrats were leading by 2 or 3 points. now, it is a republican advantage of 2 points in our poll, but the movement there, it started before the roe decision but has continued since that roe decision. the movement there in the democrats' direction, i think that one is interesting. then you put this up here, the top issues, what people say the top issues facing the country are. it is interesting. threats the to democracy makes number one overall. if you add together cost of living and jobs and the economy, together they would come to 30%. if you merge those two as

similar, it'd be number one. the combined total is down a little from the last poll. what i thought was really interesting was just to look at the partisan breakdown. how do the two parties look at the top issues facing the country. you see stark differences on this one. for instance, you take the question of abortion, particularly after the supreme court decision. 15% of democrats rate that as the most important issue facing the country. five times greater than the republican number. only 3% of republicans rate abortion as the top issue facing the country. how about this for an imbalance? immigration and the border, 2% of democras cite that as the top issue in the country. 15 times as many republicans. 30% rate that as the top issue facing the country. there are stark divides between how each party universe looks at the big problems facing the country heading into this midterm. >> so much fascinating information in these polls. mike allen, if you look at that

screen that steve has up right now, he is right, if you combine the numbers two and three, those are the economy, 30%. that really is number one. but the fact that 21% of americans now say threats to democracy are one of the most important issues, or the most important issue facing the country does show the impact of the january 6th committee's select hearings. perhaps even now, the fbi investigation, looking into donald trump. this general theme, this general tone we've been living with for a couple years now about really the foundation of what our country is bill on. >> willie, that's a great point. there have been a lot of debate about the january 6th hearings. they've definitely over delivered in the content and the drama that they've come up with between their live witnesses and their network documentary style production. but this is a sign people are like, oh, well it only inside the beltway?

in rks no, this is a sign it is seeping out. i've been talking behind the scenes with the committee. for their hearings, when they resume in september, they plan more blockbusters. they're thinking of it as season two, and they're not going to have a sophomore slump in season two. they're teeing it up. in fact, liz cheney, vice chairman of the committee, teasing the idea they might try to call president trump. yesterday, pressing vice president pence to deliver on his statement last week, that he was considering or that he would consider appearing. she actually said he has an obligation to do that. that's a big fight we're going to see in the next couple weeks. willie, zooming back to the poll, and it is a great nbc news poll. 1,000 registered voters. there are two findings here that leapt out at me, and they're both very clever questions. the first one we saw in the graphic earlier, when we saw

that only 1/3 of americans think the best is yet to come. i have not seen this question before. are america's best days behind us? i guess it's been asked because mark murray's story said this is a record number of people said that it was, that the best days are behind us. and a second finding, willie, that we're featuring in "axios a.m." this morning was also a clever question nbc asked over time. that's about president trump. they asked republicans, are you more aligned with president trump or the republican party itself? this is where we're starting to see an early sign of possible data showing an fbi bump for president trump among republicans. he could still have -- this could be completely moot. he is, of course, being investigated for possible violations of the espionage act. your poll numbers don't make

much difference to you in that situation. but we're seeing a recovery in the nbc poll from may until now, in the number of republicans who think they're aligned with trump rather than the republican for they. this is trump dialing into the idea among republicans. the more they are against trump, the more republicans say they're for him. >> katty, it's a great point by mike. donald trump is banking on this and why he is putting so much into his conspiracy theories and attacking the fbi. he isbanking on the fact this is helping him.the martyr or th victim of the deep state, for whatever he did. when you look at the numbers, especially on the economy, joe biden has to be thinking, what do i have to do? record unemployment at 3.5%. 11 million open jobs.

it's really inflation as the recession question that has people feeling like we're in a recession. for all his legislative achievements the last couple weeks even, that approval number remains flat over the last few months. >> yeah. interesting, traveling around the country as i did earlier this summer, the one thing people kept raising with me was the price of gas. gas prices have come down. we all know that. it hasn't trickled down to supermarkets, for example. grocery prices are still high. until people start seeing the prices come back across the board, and i think until they see them coming down long enough and they trust they're not going up again, it'll be hard for joe biden's approval numbers to shift around that. steve, there is an anomaly in the poll i want to ask you about. i spoke to mark murray about it earlier, but i wanted your take. when you look at the issues ranked by importance, the issue of abortion comes, like, i think it's eighth on the list or something. it is pretty low down there on the list in terms of importance. yet, we keep hearing that this

is a huge galvanizing factor, particularly for democrats in the midterm election. how do you weigh those two things? if abortion do ranking so low, how can it also be this big, galvanizing factor? >> yeah, well, that's where i think the partisan breakdown is so interesting. abortion overall is not near the top in terms of issues animating voters. look inside the democratic universe. that's what you're seeing in this column here. these are democratic voters. actually, it's number two. it's the second highest prevalence issue among democrats. threats to democracy is the highest. you'll get that from democrats. abortion is the second highest you'll get back from democrats. cost of living, climate change come in behind that. again, just -- it's a night and day difference from republicans, where you stack all of these issues up in terms of republican voters and ask them what they think is the most important. they put abortion basically at the bottom of their list. what that ends up averaging out

to here, when you put republicans, democrats, and independents together for that matter, is abortion clocks in in single digits. but when you just look at democratic voters, it's actually the number two issue there in terms of salience. it gets back to the question, i believe it's the screen before this, the enthusiasm question we talked about. this is basically the way this question is asked in the poll, and i've been doing this for years so you can compare in past midterm cycles. you ask, on a scale of 1 to 10, how excited are you about voting in this year's midterm elections? what you're seeing here is the percentage in each party who said either a 9 or a 10, put themselves at the top level of the scale in terms of interest. at the start of this year, there was a huge disparity between the parties. republicans had a 17-point advantage there on the high enthusiasm for voting in the midterms. that was basically cut in half in may. of course, the dobbs decision came down in june.

since june, we've seen it close further. the democratic number has gone 50, 61, 66. i do expect that abortion had something to do with that in terms of increasing the democratic interest in this year's midterm elections and bringing that gap down to just 2 points right now. >> that enthusiasm is showing up in funfundraising, where democr are doing very well. steve kornacki, fascinating informs and a snapshot of where we are as a country right now. steve, thank you. mike allen, thank you, as well. good to see you. we showed, 57% of americans believe the investigations into donald trump should continue, and they are. former president trump is planning a defense to keep the justice department from analyzing the documents seized from his home. on his social media site, he accused them of destroying the country. teased he'd file a motion based

on the production from unreasonable search and seizure. trump's top attorney said on saturday he is considering a motion to appoint a special master in the case. this would be an outside official selected by a judge to carry out a judicial matter on the court's behalf. as of this morning, however, there still is no indication trump's team has taken those steps. let's bring in congressional reporter for "the guardian," hugo lowell, and senior national political reporter marc caputo. hugo, you've been looking at the fourth amendment. is this something donald trump is throwing against the wall, or is his legal team actually pursing this? >> it is not exactly clear. the fact we haven't seen this motion or filing to appoint a special master to review the documents is not encouraging. certainly, the team knows they have to do something. i spent the last few days in west palm beach. the overall sense was they needed to file something. not least because trump was not

particularly pleased at how christina bobb, one of his lawyers, got pulled apart on fox news and castigated for not filing anything. i think if we see something, it is likely to come today. they can't afford to wait any longer. if they wait any longer, the fbi and the doj would have already finished their filter review and, frankly, there wouldn't be a need for a special master to go through the documents. they're really on the time crunch now. >> marc, you're looking at how trump world and former president trump himself is looking at the fbi's execution of the search warrant at mar-a-lago politically and how it play or may not help him, if he decides to run in 2024. he thinks it is helping him, which is why he is making an issue of it and raising tons of money off it. some people in his world think it is not so great for him. >> yeah. it is usually not so great if you have the fbi execute a search warrant at your home.

>> yeah. >> then in a separate investigation, your close friend and adviser is a target in an election interference case, unrelated in georgia, where you might be the target, as well. your former cfo of your company, the trump organization, has to plead guilty to tax fraud charges and turns state evidence. where you have to plead the fifth more than 440 times. that happened in two weeks. nevertheless, amid all of this, donald trump is communicating to others he feels pretty good. he is focused on his political future. in order to do that, he is looking at a potential 2024 republican primary. the polling shows, a "politico" morning consult poll shows he increased his punitive or potential lead over desantis, georgia governor desantis, his closest potential rival, by ten points. there was a private poll he was shown, which was shared with us,

in a florida congressional race. before the raid, donald trump was tied with desantis, 38/37 in a crowded primary. after the raid, trump's lead grew to 52% to 20% over desantis. he is looking at this, the increased fundraising. he says he feels good. his advisers are like, we're not sure. let's be careful. so far, he has been able to survive kind of the roadrunner to all these various coyote investigations. they've kind of come up nothing. in some cases, yes, in two cases he was impeached, didn't get removed from office. in trump's mind, according to them, he doesn't think this will amount to anything. boy, there's a lot of stuff out there. it's hard to see how he gets away without a cut or a scar, but stranger things have happened, i guess. >> yeah. marc, at the moment, we seem to be in trump world, as we often are, weighing up the political side of his life against the legal side of his life.

at some point, they may clash. there have been a lot of speculations straight after the raid that trump may just, you know, buoyed by the enthusiasm he saw from his supporters of the fbi search, he may jump into the race early. he is inclined to wait until after the mid term elections according to your reporting. is there a chance that between now and the midterm elections the investigations pick up, we get more legal problems, and this would actually leave a window for him to be dissuaded from running if he makes the calculation that actually he can't win? as we know, trump hates the idea of losing almost as much as he likes the idea of withining. just by opening that timeframe to end of november, does he open up some sort of wiggle room for people to say to him, actually, you know what, it's not the best idea? >> trump often has a certain amount of wiggle room and speculative with things he engaged in, but in this case, from what we hear from people,

he feels relatively good of his republican future, at least in a primary, because he is so far out in front and the center of attention. now, if he gets charged before then, maybe that'd make a difference. brendan buck, republican strategist we voted in our story, he said trump will win the republican primary for president even if he is in jail. the likelihood iimately not run with everything he's done until now, it is slim. he'll run. it's a question of when he announces. >> as you write in the piece, he is particularly feeling himself right now after last week, taking the political scalpel, the one he wanted in liz cheney, reminding himself of his power in the party right now. hugo, looking forward to this week, the investigations, we're awaiting the ruling on the affidavit. the judge said, i'm open to releasing the affidavit. justice department, black out whatever you think needs to be blacked out, but we are going to

put something out there. what is the potential impact of that? or will it be, as analysts said op our show, probably a page full of black lines? >> i think it could be significant if you think of the things they'd have to redact and what they wouldn't redact. some of the affidavits also list out the kind of statutes that the doj thinks have been violated based on kind of testimony from informants, testimony from fbi agents on the case. it is possible, based on speaking to former u.s. attorneys, that the doj redacts a significant portion of the affidavit to do its sources and methods and investigative techniques that effectively outline a road map for the investigation. but leave unredacted discussion the kinds of crimes they think might have been committed by trump or people around him at mar-a-lago, by the virtue of him

holding on to thethorized to ha. if that comes out, could be another blow for him. we'll find out thursday whether the judge is inclined to release them. >> a big week ahead. congressional reporter for "the guardian," hugo lowell. senior national reporter, marc caputo. thank you. katty, you had trouble establishing a connection with the uk. we moved things statewide. we'll go to new jersey. >> always safer. >> running the cable under the hudson river. cnbc's frank holland joins us. good morning. what can we expect for the week ahead? >> good morning to both of you. wall street looks like it'll open in the red this morning. following a big change in direction in the markets last week. the dow looks on track to epiup more than 300 points lower right now. s&p and the nasdaq coming off a down week following four weeks of gains. concerns of the fed aggressively hiking rates, creaing a

slowdown or recession. that weighs on the markets. fed presidents say they believe more rate hikes are needed to get inflation under control. the fed's target for inflation remains around 2%. last read, inflation was over 8%. the fed will also hold its annual symposium in jackson hole, where jay powell will speak on friday. more changes coming to hbo max ahead of the merger with discovery plus. the streamer pulling dozens of movies and shows in an effort to cut costs, move away from content aimed at kids and families, and declutter the site. some shows include a "sesame street" spin-off and "teen generation" getting cut. hbo max and discovery plus emerging next year, designed to focus on the biggest audience each has. hbo specializes in adult content that skews toward a male audience. discovery specializes in adult themed reality content watched more by women. executives want more content that targets both gender

demographics and a moving away from kids programming. hbo max laid off 14% of the workforce as a reimagining of the site. "game of thrones" spin off "house of the dragon" premiering last night. example of the adult-focused content we'll likely see more going forward. i hate to be the bearer of bad news, but get ready to pay more for your coffee. the world's largest coffee producer in brazil is threatening to push prices higher. farmers resulted in drought and frost, with a crop being less of what it would be in a good year. brazil is by far the world's biggest coffee exporter. bad weather also hurting the coffee industry in neighboring colombia. amazon is taking cybersecurity hollywood with a new public service announcement with hollywood stars michael b. jordan and tessa thompson. >> do not give that shady website your -- >> password. you just got phished. >> cyber criminals.

>> shoes off, please. >> go to the real site and create a stronger password. >> multi-factor authentication. >> oh, man. >> this is a cinch. i'll take it from here. >> visit protectandconnect.com. >> trying to bring understanding to the mainstream about multi-factor authentication. i'm going to explain that. you're required to enter a code you receive by email or text in addition to a password to gain access to a secure network. 95% of cyber attacks are caused by human error, not a sophisticated hack or high-tech psa putting a light-hearted spin on data security. but the problem is serious and growing. losses from cyber security attacks increased by 383% to over $6.9 billion over the past five years. back to you. >> michael b. jordan can make

even cyber security exciting. frank holland, thanks so much. appreciate it. still ahead on "morning joe," the daughter of a key putin ally killed in a car explosion just outside of moscow. russia is blaming ukraine. we will dig into that and go live to ukraine for the latest, amid mounting tensions around a major nuclear power plant there, as well. playing politicians with people's lives. we'll explore the move by republican governors in texas and arizona to bus thousands of migrants to the northeast, with a bill being paid by their own state's taxpayers. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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you said you were thinking of running for president. would you run to send a message or you think you can win? >> you run because you believe you'd be the get candidate, the best president of the united states. any decision that i make about doing something that significant and serious would be with the intention of winning because i think i'd be the best candidate. >> would your path be inside the republican party or outside? >> i haven't made any specific decisions or plans about that at thisrunning as a independent isa possibility, one of the things you're thinking? >> i'm not going to go down the path anymore in terms of speculating. >> congresswoman liz cheney speaking with abc's john karl after conceding her election primary loss. here's more of that wide-ranging interview. >> this wasn't just losing a house seat. you were considered a future speaker of the house. it's a lot to give up.

any regrets? >> no regrets. i feel sad about where my party is. i feel sad about the way that too many of my colleagues have responded to what i think is a great moral test and challenge of our time, a great moment to determine whether or not people are going to stand up on behalf of the democracy and on behalf of our republic. >> what is your defeat say about trump's hold on the republican party? >> one, it says that people continue to believe the lie. they continue to believe what he is saying, which is very dangerous. i think it also tells you that large portions of our party, including the leadership of our party, both at a state level in wyoming as well as on a national level with the rnc is very sick. you know, we really have got to decide whether or not we're going to be a party based on substance and policy or whether we're going to remain as so many

of our party are today, in the grips of a dangerous former president. >> in addition to trump's gloating about your loss, his spokesperson said, she may have been fighting for principles, but they are not the principles of the republican party. i mean, arguably, he is right, isn't he? >> well, doesn't that tell you something? you know, what i'm fighting for is the constitution. what i'm fighting for is the perpetuation of the republic. what i'm fighting for is the fact that elections have to matter and that when the election is over and the courts have ruled and the electoral college has met, that the president of the united states has to respect the results of the election. and if donald trump's spokesman says those are principles that are inconsistent with donald trump's views and inconsistent with the republican party's views, i think that ought to give every american pause about who donald trump is and about

what the republican party stands for today. >> you're starting this political organization. what can you tell us? what are you going to do? >> i'm going to be very focused on working to ensure we don't elect election deniers. i'm going to work to support their opponents. i think it matters that much. >> will you be getting involved in campaigns against those republican candidates that are challenging or denying the results of the election? >> yes. >> including your republican colleagues here in congress? >> yes. >> katty, it'll be interesting to see what that looks like for liz cheney, what her role is as she moves forward. she's made very clear she's not going anywhere. what impact can she have? taking a step back, it's extraordinary, in five or six years, liz cheney, a republican named cheney now has no place in the party, where her father, you know, for many years, was a name brand and central figure,

particularly in the state of wyoming and nationally. now, the litmus test is, did you back donald trump enough, not are you conserative enough? >> yeah. she had a voting record in line with donald trump. it wasn't like she was voting against her policies. wasn't like she spent her career opposing his agenda. it was on this one issue of the 2020 election, and donald trump's insistence that it was stolen from him. i thought it was interesting, listening to that today, willie, as we have this poll out showing that the threat to democracy is the number one concern amongst voters in america as they head into the elections and, yet, there is liz cheney, alone in her party, alongside adam kinzinger and a few brave people who voted to impeach donald trump and have been ousted from the party, but she is alone with adam kinzinger, sitting there, trying to defend the thing that americans say is their top issue

in the poll going into the midterm election. i think that tells you all you need to know about where the republican party is on this one issue. >> to be clear, she sacrificed her political career, which still had a lot in front of it, to take this stand. we will see what she does going forward. coming up next here, a live report from ukraine on the volatile situation at one of the world's largest nuclear power plants. plus, chaos and scattered papers. some new reporting on the final days inside the trump white house. we will be joined by one of the journalists behind that story when "morning joe" comes back on a monday morning. families are struggling with inflation and congress and president biden just did something about it. signing the inflation reduction act. it means lower drug costs for millions and ramps up production of

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russian authorities have launched an investigation into the killing of the daughter of a

prominent russian nationalist and an ally of president vladimir putin. 29-year-old darya dugina died after a car she was driving blew up on a highway near moscow. someone planted an explosive device in the car, which is believed to be intended for her father, alexander dugin. dugin took a different vehicle at the last minute. so far, no one claimed responsibility. a separatist leader in donetsk blamed ukraine. kyiv immediately denied any involvement, saying, quote, we are not a criminal state. alexander dugin, also known as putin's brain, is a fierce defender of russia's war on ukraine and long has advocated for the unification of russian-speaking territories. his daughter was a journalist and commentator who shared her father's views. she had been sanctioned by the united states and british governments for spreading disinformation about ukraine. meanwhile, president joe biden is stressing the importance of protecting

europe's largest nuclear power plant that is in ukraine. during a call yesterday with the leaders of britain, france, and germany, biden expressed concerns of the situation at the facility as fighting intensified there in recent weeks. he stressed the need to, quote, avoid military operations near the plan. the leaders also recommended inspectors from the international atomic energy agency visit the site soon, in order to determine the safety of its operations. joining us now live from southeastern ukraine, nbc news correspondent josh lederman. josh, what more can you tell us? >> reporter: willie, there was more shelling near the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant over the weekend. just to give you a sense of what we're talking about here, we are in zaporizhzhia, which is a city of more than 700,000 people. right across this road, that's thenipro river. the largest nuclear power plant is on the other side in

russian-occupied territory. now, the winds are moving westward, toward kyiv. if there was radiation release, that'd potentially move toward population centers. i spoke this morning with the exiled mayor of a small village where the nuclear plant is located. he is now here in zaporizhzhia. he told me, it's getting harder and harder to even figure out what's happening in and around the nuclear plant because the russians have taken over the communication centers, cellular systems, and the internet. people are struggling to get information out of there. but another big concern is potential russian retaliation for the car bombing you mentioned that killed the daughter of alexander dugin. there are no indications right now that ukraine was responsible, but, certainly, he has been seen as the intellectual godfather, if you will, of many of putin's views, including his staunch support for invading ukraine. we're already seeing some right-wingers in russia call for some type of retaliation against

ukraine, which is already on high alert right now. because on wednesday, we are heading into ukraine's independence day, which also happens to coincide with the six-month anniversary of this war. president zelenskyy over the weekend has been warning that russia may be planning some type of particularly vicious attack to mark that day, to spoil the independence day, but also to remind ukrainians, as the war surpasses the six-month mark, they remain vulnerable all across the country. zelenskyy is warning ukrainians to take extra precautions that day. kharkiv, the second largest city in ukraine, will be having around-the-clock curfew as they try to keep people safe on a bittersweet independence day. willie? >> josh, clearly, a tense week there in ukraine. talk to me a little bit more about the nuclear plant, the vulnerabilities to it. you know, without being alarmist, we don't want to get ahead of ourselves, but it is

worth people trying to understand, what would be the potential, practical implications of a strike against that plant, which is the biggest nuclear power plant in the whole of europe? what could be the ramifications? >> reporter: well, there's a few possibilities, and we've been speaking with nuclear experts about this. reactors themselves, six of them there, are fairly secure. they're built to withstand a plane flying into them. we've already seen a lot of shelling at the site that damaged the power lines. some of them have already been knocked out. a big concern is that if the power supply to the cooling systems that keep the nuclear reactors from melting down goes out, they would really have to rely on diesel generators for short periods of time, to try to keep -- to prevent a nuclear meltdown. the other concern is there are massive amounts of spent nuclear fuel. hundreds of nuclear fuel rods that are stored at the site. they are less secure than the

nuclear reactors themselves. so if there is shelling at the site that first damages the prot protective layer themselves, radiation could be sent spreading. depending on the size of the disaster, some are saying it could be larger than chernobyl, fukushima, and could send radiation into russian possibly. >> we're not there yet, thank goodness. we mark this six months, and ukraine has more than held its own. remember in the days leading up to this, weeks leading up, there were thoughts russia and putin were going to roll tanks into kyiv and raise a flag and install a puppet government fairly quickly. here we are now, and, in fact, as you and i were talking yesterday on "sunday today," attacks from ukraine inside crimea even. that land that was taken by vladimir putin in 2014,

illegally, by the way. in many ways, ukraine is stepping up its attacks as we hit the six-month anniversary. >> reporter: that's right, willie. it was interesting because, for the first week or so we were starting to see these mysterious explosions in crimea, the ukrainian government was coy about it. they were not taking responsibility. they were kind of evading direct questions about whether ukraine was behind those attacks. but in the last two days or so, we started to see ukrainian officials much more forthcoming about the fact there is a concerted campaign by ukraine to try to liberate, demilitarize crimea. president zelenskyy saying in one of his evening addresses that he can feel the liberation of crimea in the air. now, we should point out, russia has poured massive amounts of troops and military assets into crimea. there is no sign they're going to be able to evict russia from the territory they illegally occupied in 2014. certainly, ukraine is trying to make clear to the russians, including the russians who are civilians living in crimea, that

they are vulnerable. they are not safe. russia can no longer feel they are impervious and can use it as a rear base and a staging ground to attack ukraine, as the ukrainians try to prevent this from becoming a frozen conflict and start to take back territory in the south as they head to the winter months. >> ukraine doing a lot of this with the billions of dollars of aid the united states and the west have provided. nbc news correspondent josh lederman covering a lot of ground for us from ukraine. thanks so much. still ahead this morning, the republican governor of texas sent nearly 8,000 migrants to new york city and washington, d.c., in the last four months. now, leaders in both cities say they need federal assistance to help all of those people. we'll have the latest there. plus, a disturbing video out of arkansas shows state police investigating use of force by three officers. we'll have much more on that story ahead on "morning joe." it followed me everywhere.

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a little overcast this morning, it is fair to say, in washington, as we come up the top of the hour. a new book alleges rudy giuliani tried to reach out to donald trump, through an associate. maria ryan allegedly asked giuliani be paid for his services and went as far as to request giuliani receive the presidential medal of freedom. according to "the new york times," the book titled "giuliani: the rise and tragic fall of america's mayor" cites a letter to trump dated january 10th, 2021, in which ryan wrote this. quote, dear mr. president, i tried to call you yesterday to talk about business. the honorable rudy giuliani has worked 24/7 on the voter fraud issues. he has led a team of lawyers, data analysts and investigators.

he needs to be paid for his services. ryan then allegedly brought up the presidential medal of freedom. writing, mr. giuliani rarely asks for anything for himself. he is praying you present this with him friday january 15th or monday the 19th. the final item in her letter was asking for a general pardon. wow. the book says the letter was intercepted before it got to trump by giuliani adviser, bernard karic, who had been trying to find election fraud. no luck there. unclear if giuliani had a part in the writing of the letter. he repeatedly denied he requested a pardon from trump related to the 2020 election. boy, there's a lot in there. coming up, we have the latest on the search of mar-a-lago, including the legal move trump's team keeps teasing but hasn't followed through on. plus, the chaotic final days of the trump white house that led to documents intended for the archives making its way to

florida. and david french writes in his piece, the world's most christian advanced nation is tearing itself apart, and its millions of believers bare much of the blame. david joins us ahead with that argument. and three officers in arkansas now under investigation after video appears to show them kneeing and punching a suspect on the ground. that video, the new reporting is ahead, when "morning joe" comes back.

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7:00 on the dot on a cloudy day in new york city. welcome back to "morning joe." it is monday, august 22nd. i'm willie geist. joe and mika are off this morning. katty kay is with us.

a poll shows threats to democracy has overtaken cost of living as a top issue facing america. 57% of americans believe the investigations into donald trump should continue. as for the most recent investigation, former president donald trump says he is planning a fourth amendment defense to keep the justice department from analyzing the documents seized from his home. in a post to his social media site, trump accused law enforcement of, quote, destroying our country, and teased he'd file a motion based on the protection from unreasonable search and seizure. trump's top attorney said on saturday he is considering a motion to appoint a special master in the case. this would be an outside official selected by a judge to carry out a judicial matter on the court's behalf. as of this morning, however, there still is no indication trump's team has taken any of those steps. meanwhile, there is new reporting on the chaos and confusion in the final days of the trump presidency that led to

those classified documents being packed away for mar-a-lago. "new york times" reports, trump created chaos after refusing to accept his loss in 2020, unleashed a mob on congress, and set the stage for his second impeachment. the "times" goes on to report, his unwillingness to let go of power, including refusing to return government documents collected while in office, led to a potentially damaging and avoidable legal battle that threatens to engulf the former president and some of his aides. questions of the mishandling of the documents lead to mr. trump, who often treated the presidency as a private business. but people in his orbit highlight the role of mark me meadows, who oversaw what there was of a presidential transition. mr. meadows ensured to staff members he'd talk about records, including one stashed in the

residence, according to two people with knowledge of the situation. regardless of whether mr. meadows followed through on the promises, early 2021, after mr. trump left the white house, officials with the archives realized they were missing significant material. let's bring in one of the reporters, justice department reporter for "the new york times," katie benner. great to see you. we saw mark meadows on january 6th, that day, and the testimony before the committee showing his cowardice and unwillingness to stand up to trump, saying, "it is what he wants. what can i do?" appears he stepped aside here, too. what a scene, empty boxes effectively stacked up around the west wing, waiting to be filled for documents for the national archives. the counsel says, that has to go to the archives. mark meadow says, yeah, i'll take care of it. instead, they're sent to mar-a-lago. >> one of the ways to look at the last days in the trump

administration is to see it as a continuation of donald trump's refusal to acknowledge that he was not going to be president come january 20th, 2021. he was in a deep denial and unable to fulfill the final duties he constitutionally and legally needed to abide by, including sending his presidential records to the national archives. >> do you get the sense that people around donald trump, he may not have or may not have wanted to have known, that they were legally bound to preserve the records and, in fact, send them to the national archives. the white house counsel said it again and again according to your piece. were there people telling donald trump, "these are supposed to go to the national archives," or would nobody stand up to him and say that? >> it'd be difficult to say donald trump didn't know what she was supposed to do. there were emails going out to every office at the white house telling them what instructions were. they were very clear. you saw mike pence boxing up all his documents. he had a national security

operation in the vice president's office, and he made sure every piece of paper was given to the archives. trump was a different case. january 6th, there had been a vie len attack on the capitol. his relationship with top lawyers in the white house had already deteriorated before that point. after, it was just as fraught. there was not a large number of people inside the white house who really wanted to have difficult conversations with donald trump, except for mark meadows. he was the person who volunteered to do it. he was the person who said he would. it is unclear whether or not he was actually able to get through to the former president. instead, we know that both men were working on different projects, focused on different projects in the final days. former president trump was focused on pardons. he issued scores and scores of them. he fought with aides and advisers over whether to former steve bannon, his former campaign adviser, which he did do. meadows was working to declassify documents related to

the russian investigation, in hopes of disseminating those to the public in the final days of the trump administration. >> there were justice department embeds, according to your reporting, who were actually in the white house, who were working alongside the administration, to make sure protocols were followed. how many authority would they have had with somebody like mark meadows? i imagine they never would have spoken to trump directly, but could they lay down the law when it came to this sort of thing? >> the end of the day, it was unusual for anyone to have to lay down the law with the president, asking them to comply with the law. it is not a normal job in the course of the end of a presidency. certainly, that duty would have fallen to the chief of staff with the help of the counsel. the justice department conversations with the white house in the final days was haggling over what to declassify. in this binder of documents

related to the russia investigation. again, the investigation was an obsession of president trump's throughout his presidency. i don't believe it was until january 17th of 2021, three days before the inauguration of joe biden, that the white house and the fbi came to an agreement on some items that could be further declassified and disseminated. mark meadows decided not to disseminate the binder, in part because of privacy concerns of the information contained therein. >> reading your reporting, you get the sense that donald trump thought he was taing souvenirs from being president of the yates. he wanted to bring stuff home and show it off. there was a fixation on the self-described love letters between himself and north korean leader kim jong-un. what else did he want to make it home to mar-a-lago. >> there were letters he thought of as his own. the letter from barack obama at the beginning of donald trump's presidency. to your point, he may have thought of these as souvenirs,

personal items, but he had many, many people telling him that was not the case. we've seen in different venues, whether the january 6th committee hearings, whether it is court documents, just not believing your advisers and not listening to them is not a good enough defense for doing something wrong. >> such a fascinating piece. justice department reporter for "the new york times," katie benner, thanks so much for bringing your reporting to us this morning. we appreciate it. over the weekend, we heard from a number of trump allies and republican members of congress making more excuses, some of them new, some of them old, for why those boxes of material wound up at mar-a-lago. >> they want to make him responsible for having taken classiied documents is and preserve them. >> i still haven't seen any evidence he was even at -- that trump was asked to give these documents back. do any of us believe donald trump is reading his nuclear secrets on his bedside at night?

>> this is the first airing of a former president's home for potentially information, whatever they think is wrong. plus, the way hillary clinton's negotiation and emails were handled. >> what use could a former president have for classified or top secret information once he's left office? >> every former president has access to documents. it's how they write their memoirs. >> member of "the new york times" editorial board and msnbc political contributor and analyst, mara gay. senior editor of the "dispatch" and contributing editor at "the atlantic," david french. david, you had a tweet that caught us eye. mar-a-lago is the combination of every trump scandal. attack the media. find the overreach. find the extreme view from the left or progressives and make that representative of what is here, and not the actual act

committed by the former president of the united states. but, david, you've been around a while. how do you explain somebody like chuck grassley going all in, defending the president of the united states here? not to mention, the irs, making up lies of irs agents kicking in the doors of small business owners. how do you view that? >> one thing we've seen, particularly post january 6th, where we had this short, brief pause, where it seemed like a lot of republican lawmakers were going to come to their senses right until they heard from the very, very, very angry base again. i think a lot of them learned a lesson. the lesson is, do not join in any trump scandal. do not pile onto any trump scandal, or they're going to hear immediately from the angriest cohort of republican voters. what you've got is an entire

political party, with very new exceptions, that is completely cowed by its most extreme base voters. to be sure, when the base voters are angry, they manifest anger through death threats and other kinds of threatening communications. it's very intimidating for a lot of these lawmakers. we're at the point where they immediately move to a trump defense, no matter the facts, in part, because they've been cowed by a very, very, very angry base. >> and they watched what happened to liz cheney less than a week ago, and they see what happens when you dare cross the president of the united states. >> true. >> mara, we heard hillary clinton's name invoked there. the hypocrisy is staggering. this was a group of people who literally were calling for hillary clinton to be put in prison for the private server she had in her email, at her home during the 2016 campaign. now, sort of waving away a president of the united states

packing up boxes, as we heard from your "new york times" colleague katie benner, of classified documents and taking them to the basement at mar-a-lago. >> first of all, let's address that issue. what hillary clinton did with her server was potentially unethical. but that is not the same as potentially committing a crime by refusing to hand over documents that belong to the american people, that contain potentially nuclear secrets of the united states. despite knowing better. god knows who had access to the documents, what the former president may have done with the douments in the interim. we need a full investigation there. it is not the same thing. i want to pull back, though, and i think what david is talking about is really important. there is a playbook here. it is important that we recognize that, rather than kind of taking on the substance of the republican arguments, when there really isn't substance to

it. which is, the playbook is to deflect, to project, and to normalize behavior that is not normal or appropriate or, in some cases, legal. that's what's happening here. i think that's kind of the way to approach it, which is not to take their claims seriously, but to really call them out for engaging in behavior that is not serious and that is kind of pathetic, coming from public servants. they're supposed to have a higher calling here. though it's been years since we can expect them to behave that way, i still think it is worth pointing out that they're just concerned about saving their butts from trump's base. >> david, let me ask about the piece you've written for the "dispatch." "christian political ethics are upside down." you talk about the notion of justice, but it is our own vision of justice that matters. put what you're seeing here in politics at the moment in the

context of this broader moral, ethical, christian conversation. >> right. >> one of the reasons i emphasize that is because, if we're going to talk about trump, in particular, the base of the republican party is heavily evangelical. you've seen this in the elections of doug mastriano in the primaries in pennsylvania. of kari lake in arizona, many others. they're running very aggressive campaigns with faith forward. yet, many of the characteristics and qualities you're supposed to expect to see in christians are completely absent. i referred to this famous verse from the book of micah. micah 6:8. it talks about how people are to, yes, act justly, but also to love kindness and to walk humbly. there's a total absence of kindness, and instead of kindness, there is this incredible aggression. a total loss of humility.

instead of humility, this confidence in these bizarre conspiracy theories. it is as if these individuals have figured out that trumpism, in their view, is the way to make america great again. then after that, the end's justify the means. yet, that is utterly contrary to a christian ethic. so you have a party that cannot win dogcatcher in many places in the country without utterly depending on christian voters, and, yet, you could not recognize a chrisschristian eth the way these individuals interact with the public, interact with each other, and as we've seen often in this mar-a-lago search discussion, interact with the truth. >> i want to read from some of your piece. it's titled "christian political ethics are upside down." you write this, "the church has formed its members to be adamant about policies that are difficult and contingent and flexible about virtues that are clear and mandatory. you're not kind until kindness doesn't work.

you're to be kind even through the most brutal acts of prepresentation and in the face of complete political defeat. when the world is greedy, you are generous. when the world is cruel, you are kind. when the world is fearful, you are faithful. when the world is proud, you are humble. how do you know we're christian? by our love. yes, we say. yes to all of this. right until the moment when we think our kindness, our faithfulness, or our humility carries with it a concrete political cost. we think we know what's just, and we can't do justice without power. so in our arrogance, we think we know better than god. we can't let kindness or humility stand in the way of justice, yet, we're sowing the wind and we rear the whirlwind. the world's most christian advanced nation is tearing itself apart, and its millions of believers bear much of the blame. in 2016 and '17, david, i know you heard this, when you'd can about donald trump, how can you support a man who is so cruel, profane, and says off porn stars

after having affairs while his wife is pregnant, the laundry list is long, they say, we are electing a president, not a saint. he is going to stand up for us and our way of life. boy, has that been exposed in the last few years. >> yeah. i always hated that saying. no one was arguing that we are electing saints. there's a difference between holding the standard of a saint and no standard at all. this is what has happened. there is no standard at all. in the piece, i contrast the movement dominating, for example, the maga right with the civil rights movement, which was christian to its core. it was thoroughly christian and confronting an injustice as grotesque as jim crow, and confronted it with an ethic of non-violence, with love and grace. i quote john lewis in the piece to that effect.

here, we have a maga movement that is proclaiming some sort of national emergency. it is nothing on the scale of jim crow. it's not within shouting distance of that. yet, they have utterly abandoned, in many ways, even the most basic requirements of human decency. again, in their interactions with each other, interactions with political opponent, in their interactions with truth. this is turning that christian political ethic utterly upside down. >> i wanted to ask you a question. you know, there are scholars, like dumez in michigan, who argue the white evangelical movement is actually, at this point, more a social and political movement than a religious one, focused on a warrior god that is nationalist. what do you make of that argument here, and how useful do you think it could be? >> yeah, i think she's on to

something. the researcher, ryan burj, said white evangelicalism is republican, and republican is evangelicalism. there is an element distinct from religion. there is also research that says white evangelicals, people who call themselves white evangelicals, now go to church, on average, less than once a month. in other words, a majority of white evangelicals are going to church less than once a month. what that indicates is they're not talking as much about a religious lifestyle even anymore, even though they label themselves as intensely religious. we're talking of a social, cultural, and political lifestyle. if you are going to identify yourself and put yourself forward as evangelical, as one of your primary identities in your life, then there is a basic expectation that there are standards of contact, some

values that you should apply. scripture is clear about those values. >> david, i'm curious what you hear, if you're willing to share. i know what i hear privately from your friends, christians, people you've known and loved for many years who defend donald trump still to this day, despite everything we've seen over the last six or seven years. what is the christian defense today of donald trump? >> at the risk of oversimplifying, there is three in general. one, look at all he's accomplished. that is a primary that, if you go back to it, they have a view of his four years, that this was a period of time in which christian policies were enacted at a rate you'd never seen before. you heard phrases like "most pro-life president in the history of the united states." the pure ends justify the means. then you have people who don't even really understand the things trump has done. they're so much in a right-wing media bubble, they don't know

all of trump's corruption. they don't know anything of the details of the january 6th. then there is the third category, which is, yeah, i like his accomplishments and i like his demeanor. i like that he punches. i like he fights and the way he fights. in many ways, that's the most troubling of all. they don't even take an end's justify a means approach. they say his means are his ends. they want him to be like this. this is what you see in the hyper maga christianity that is dominating in many cases the republican primary vote. >> he annoys and defends the right people is an argument i hear. to your first category, three supreme court justices and the overturning of roe versus wade justifies donald trump to a lot of people. david and mara, stay with us. we want to talk about the state of the republican party after liz cheney's loss yesterday. northeast political leaders are asking for federal help

after the republican governors of texas and arizona send waves of buses carrying migrants who crossed the southern border, now coming to new york and washington. later, another major primary coming up tomorrow. while it is clear who democrats in florida will put forward to challenge senator marco rubio, there are two major democratic candidates looking to face ron desantis in november. we will head to the sunshine state hours before voters head to the polls. but up next, three officers under investigation in arkansas after a video of them arresting a suspect appears to show them repeatedly punching and kneeing him in the head and the body. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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three law enforcement officers in arkansas are under investigation for use of force during an arrest caught on camera. blayne alexander joins us with more. good morning. >> reporter: willwillie, good morning. the video itself is less than a minute long, but it shows a violent encounter between three officers and a suspect. the mayor of this arkansas town says that he was shocked and sickened by what he saw in the video. we do have to warn you, that video is disturbing to watch. >> this is bad. >> reporter: it is the shocking video that has been viewed millions of times. this morning, arkansas state police are investigating a violent arrest that was caught on camera. according to state police, in the video are two crawford county deputies and a mulberry officer. the man is pitted down during an

altercation, and he is kneed and punched in the head. one of the officers appears to slam the man's head into the ground multiple times. it was outside a convenient store. at the end of the video, one of the officers appears to point at the camera. throughout the day, police had been on the lookout for the suspect, identified as 27-year-old randall worster of south carolina, after he allegedly spit on a clerk and made what officers called terroristic threats in a nearby town. while it is unclear what happened before the start of the video, worster was quickly transferred to an area hospital and later released and taken into custody. his condition is unclear. he is facing a slew of charges, including battery, resisting arrest, and refusal to submit. all three officers involved have been suspended. in a statement, the crawford county sheriff says, in part, i hold all my employees accountable for their actions and will take appropriate measures in this matter. a statement from mulberry police says the department will take the appropriate actions at the

conclusion of the investigation. now, willie, the names of the three officers involved have not yet been made public. meanwhile, state police say once their investigation is complete, they'll turn the case over to the county prosecutor to determine whether charges will be filed. willie. >> horrifying video. we'll watch for that investigation, see how it plays out. blayne alexander, thanks so much. turning back to politics. the committee in charge of electing more democrats to the senate is reporting a $10 million haul in july. that outpaces its republican counterpart for the fourth month in a row. the democratic senatorial campaign committee reports having more than $54 million in cash on hand. the national campaign fund for republican senate hopefuls is pulling ads and running low on cash, prompting some campaign advisers to demand an audit of the committee's finances. according to "the washington post," the national republican senatorial committee last week canceled bookings worth about $10 million, including in the

key states of pennsylvania, wisconsin, and arizona. a spokesman said the nrsc is not abandoning the races, but prioritizing ad spots that are shared with campaigns and benefit from discounted rates. the "post" writes, the retreat came after months of touting record fundraising, topping $173 million so far this election cycle. that's according to federal election commission disclosures. but the committee has burned through nearly all of that with the nrsc's cash on hand dwindling to $28.4 million by the end of june. this comes as senate minority leader mitch mcconnell says republicans no longer a lock to retake control of the senate in november, as he once believed, because of the quality of some of the republican candidates running in the key races. nbc's ali vitali has more on what all of this says about the current state of the republican party. >> reporter: liz cheney lost the battle tuesday night in wyoming.

>> she won. i called her to concede the race. >> reporter: but she's still hoping to win the war. >> i will be doing whatever it takes to keep donald trump out of the oval office. >> reporter: tuesday's results crystallizing the hold trump has over his party. gop voters electing candidates who embraced lies and election victory all in fealty to the former president. >> it was stolen. >> reporter: and the contrast between the party today and the one liz's father, dirk, led 20 years ago. >> we're proud of liz for standing up for the truth. >> reporter: scores have been settled this year. >> usa! usa! usa! >> reporter: not just cheney, who despite a voting record of over 90% with trump was still a 2020 target, but of the ten that voted to impeach trump, four lost primaries, two decided not to re-run, and only two survived. the party is teeming with ultraconservative pro-trump republicans. >> my republican is, you know,

liz, i barely knew ya. won't really miss ya. >> these guys are a different breed of cat. >> reporter: he's not wrong. gone is the centrist middle, evidenced by policy. >> you don't hear about limiting government. republicans don't talk about that and deficits anymore. >> reporter: as much as persona. conservative taking on a new meaning. >> some of the voters when they say, you're not conservative enough, what they might mean is you're not pro-trump enough. do you still fit in the party? >> well, if it is that, if the republican party chooses to go in that direction, i think they leave behind a lot of americans. >> reporter: the alaska senator, one of seven who voted to convict trump of impeachment charges after the 6th, advanced in her primary, hoping to be a proof point that trump's ire isn't a political kiss of death. even as trump acolytes in her state like sarah palin hope trump will be enough to mount a comeback. >> we can't afford more rhinos in office, or we get less

freedom. >> reporter: not all republicans seeing upside in a party re-branded in trump's image. >> there is probably a greater likelihood the house flips than the senate. >> reporter: senator mcconnell throwing shade on problematic candidates recruited in trump's image. >> senate races are just different. candidate quality has a lot to do with the outcome. >> reporter: all these threads of trumpism sure to culminate in the looming presidential primary. the former president's foes and friends positioning themselves around him. from pence, who is leaving the door open to testifying about january 6th. >> if there was an invitation to participate, i'd consider it. >> reporter: to desantis, campaigning in arizona with pro-trump candidates. >> i call it big desantis energy. >> reporter: to cheney herself. >> are you thinking of running for president? >> that's a decision i'm going to make in the coming months. >> ali vitali reporting for us there. david french, this is the deal that the party has made with donald trump. yes, he can run liz cheney out of office. they can win a bunch of house races. but when you get to a statewide

race, these are big states with a lot of moderates, some independents in there. when you put up herschel walker and dr. oz and blake masters and jd vance, because of their fealty to donald trump, because he hand-picked them in some cases, as mitch mcconnell just said, you may suffer the consequences. >> right. some of the guys may win. i'd say jd vance will be a favorite. what's happening, you're taking races that are extremely winnable and, in some states, you're throwing them away. dr. oz is trailing badly. herschel walker is testing the proposition of how many secret sons will voters tolerate. this is a remarkable turn of events. except that it is not that new, it's just been exacerbated. we've seen previous races, like sharon engle in nevada and others, where winnable races have been thrown away by a primary electorate that doubled down on extremism.

now, they're doubling down on trumpism and have elected some -- doug mastriano, not senate, governor's race, but mastriano was a guy at january 6th. time and again, you're seeing the primary voters doubling down. here is what is fascinating. they believe they latched onto a winning formula. they have a winning formula in primaries. in 2017, trump had the house, is senate, republicans had the presidency. the maga movement lost all that in near record time, in four years. the idea that republicans, through the maga movement, the discovered formula for victory, the record is the opposite of that. they're taking a red wave potential election. right now, at this moment, here in august, the red wave seems to be sputtering, particularly in the senate. it's not unrealistic to think democrats could make progress in the senate. no one would have seen that

coming, even three, four months ago. >> yeah, good caveat that this goes to november yet. mara, take what david has been saying about the senate and put it in the context of the house for us. we seeing similar trends? interesting mitch mcconnell was specifying the senate when he spoke of candidate quality. he wasn't talking about the house when it came to qualityish quality issues. in the house, are democrats starting to wonder whether they could even possibly keep the house? are they being wildly over optimistic, or are you seeing movement in the house that reflects the movement in the senate? >> i think the house is a bigger challenge for democrats. there is a struck schur issue structural issue. senate races often get a lot more candidate focused coverage, so it is true. i agree with mitch mcconnell.

i can't believe i'm saying this. the candidate quality matters more. in congressional races, you don't get as much attention necessarily on them. i think that leads to a party line vote often. so i think that's another issue here. democrats are still running behind when it comes to issues of the economy and inflation. they have ground to make up. when you look at the senate races, when you have extreme far right candidates, it is different. it motivates the democratic base. democrats have really, in congress, they have yet to capitalize on the dobbs decision. there's still time to do that. i think to drive democratic voters to the polls. there is also just a lot more congressional races, so there's a lot more money that needs to be spent. it's just a bigger lift for the democratic party. >> mara gay, stay with us, if you can. david french, thank you for

being with us. david's piece in the "dispatch," "christian political ethics are upside down," a must-read. up next, steps school districts need to take to make sure kids have a teacher in the classroom. this is amid a teacher shortage. just when you thought it was safe to go back in the water, kerry sanders has the latest after a couple shark attacks on the same beach. has some shore towns on edge. "morning joe" is coming right back. okay season 6! aw... this'll take forev—or not. do i just focus on when things don't work, and not appreciate when they do? i love it when work actually works!

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by if governors of border states. new york city and washington now asking the federal government for help. nbc news national correspondent gabe gutierrez has the latest. good morning. >> good morning. ahead of the midterm elections, republicans are seizing on a record-breaking influx of migrants at the southern border. but this latest battle over immigration is now playing out here in the northeast. >> reporter: the buses keep coming to new york city and washington, d.c. at first, hundreds, now thousands of migrants arriving in the northeast after being sent by the governors of texas and arizona. >> the need has outstripped our capacity to respond to it. >> reporter: calling it a humanitarian crisis, d.c.'s mayor requested the national guard. new york city's mayor is also asking the federal government for help. >> i don't think anything is more anti-american than shipping people on a bus, 45-hour trip, without any of the basic needs they have or direction or coordination. >> reporter: democrats call the

busing a political stunt. republicans argue it is a last resort, as scenes like this unfold at the u.s. southern border. large groups of migrants crossing. human smugglers cramming 150 people into this 18-wheeler. border patrol says more than 200 dead migrants have been found in one section of texas since last october. nationwide, border apprehensions fell 4% from june to july. overall, this fiscal year has seen the highest number on record. >> it was just texas and arizona that bore the brunt of all of the chaos and all of the problems that come with it. now, the rest of america is understanding exactly what is going on. >> reporter: we recently visited catholic charities in new york city. have you ever seen numbers like this? >> not really. >> reporter: which has been scrambling to help the growing number of migrants, many have venezuela, who captured the grueling journey on their cell phones. do you think you'd survive?

we spoke with rubin from colombia. he told us his four children thought they were going to die. when we finally reached u.s. soil, he says, i thank god for giving me the strength. >> here in new york, more than 6,000 asylum seekers entered the shelter system since this summer. authorities are now making plans to enroll more than 1,000 children in classes before the school year begins next month. >> gabe, can you paint a picture for us of what happens when those buses arrive in new york city? are there non-profits that are greeting them? are locals upset or supportive? paint that picture for us, and tell us a little more about what is going to happen to these workers and families. >> there's a lot of uncertainty for them. they've been arriving in washington d.c., and new york city. yes, they're charitable organizations there. we spoke with catholic charities.

many migrants are told to go to catholic charities, and they're processing more than they usually do an any given day. there are resources set aside for them. now, city of new york is trying to get more resources, either asking the federal government. they're potentially trying to recruit teachers from it dominican republic when the school year starts next month. they need more bilingual teachers. mayor adams says the resources here in new york are stretched. of course, republicans are seizing on this and saying, well, resources are stretched at the u.s. southern border in texas, arizona and other states. but, you know, the charitable organizations, catholic charities, says they're trying to do the best they can with the limited resources. they can always use more. as for the migrants, you know, many are hoping to apply for asylum. wondering what comes next. they don't know if they'll stay here or plan to be with family members somewhere else. >> thanks, gabe. >> governor abbott says the

buses will continue to travel to the cities in a fiscal year that will end with about 2 million migrant encounters at the border. that is a record. gabe gutierrez, thanks for bringing us the story. member of "the new york times" editorial board, mara gay, thank you, as well, for being with us. appreciate it. coming up next, as we approach the labor day holiday, millions of americans are preparing to get their last days in at the beach. now, some new shark warnings up and down the east coast have forced some beaches to close. nbc's kerry sanders joins us with what you need to know, when we come right back.

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welcome back to "morning joe." two beach-goers in south carolina suffered shark bites in the last few days. the incidents coming just a half mile apart. nbc news senior national correspondent kerry sanders joins us live from ft. lauderdale with more on that.

kerry, good morning. >> reporter: good morning, willie. this is so rare, first of all, shark attacks. consider this, there were two shark attacks, same day, same beach. in one case, it was a grandmother in the water with her grandson just feet away. >> get off the shore! >> reporter: sharks swimming dangerously close to shore. a hammerhead chasing down a stingray in alabama. farther north, a pennsylvania family's vacation to myrtle beach, south carolina, took an unexpected turn last monday. >> it was really our first day on the beach. we went down and the kids, even brian, he was a little nervous. i kept saying, don't worry about sharks. that's absolutely nothing to worry about. >> reporter: turns out, that day, karen was wrong. >> i was still in probably about waist deep water, and i felt

something -- it was sort of like a bite on my arm. there was a shark attached to my arm, so i kept hitting at it to -- i just wanted it off my arm. >> reporter: her 8-year-old grandson, brian, was feet away. >> i didn't even see it swimming up. i just saw it jump. >> reporter: karen spent the night in the hospital, getting dozens of stitches. that same day at the same beach, a second victim with a more minor bite to the leg. from long island -- >> oh, my lanta. >> reporter: -- to atlanta, shores having to close. this drone video catching sharks off cocoa beach, florida, last sunday. the same weekend, a 10-year-old boy was attacked snorkeling in the florida keys. part of his leg had to be amputated. despite these reports, experts is say shark attacks are still

rare. >> every year, on average, we get between 70 and 80 unprovoked bites by sharks around the world. it is a very, very low incident in general. >> reporter: andy says when a shark bite happens, it is usually because the shark mistakes a hman for food. but for young brian, he's not taking any chances, at least not right now. >> i'll put my feet in, but that's really all. >> reporter: so with labor day approaching and people planning their beach vacations, the question would be, is there a reason to be concerned? yes and no. historically, there are more shark encounters in august and september, especially along the east coast. we also know the warming temperatures in the oceans are drawing sharks closer to shore. but there are also more people in the water. it would appear because there's more people in the wear, there's

more of those encounters. bottom line, it is rare. when it happens, wow, it is just really frightening indeed. willie? >> yeah, some of the stories are terrible. to underline what you made clear, there were 70 shark attacks in the world, a planet of 7.7 billion people. it is rare. kerry sanders in ft. lauderdale, florida, thanks so much. ahead, new polling from nbc news shows the economy is not the top concern ahead of the midterms. we'll tell you what is now the most pressing issue according to voters. plus, the daughter of a powerful putin ally is killed in a car explosion outside of moscow. we'll have a report from the region. also ahead, where is tom brady? the legendary quarterback has been missing from training camp less than three weeks before tampa's opening game. we'll get to the bottom of where he might be. some of the strange explanations the tampa bay buccaneers are providing, when "morning joe" comes right back.

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they want that make him responsible for having taken classified documents and preserved them. >> i still haven't seen any evidence he was even at -- that trump was asked to give these documents back. do any of us believe donald trump is reading his nuclear secrets on his bedside at night? >> this is the first airing of a former president's home for potentially potential, whatever they think is wrong. plus, the way hillary clinton's negotiation and emails were handled. >> what use could a former president have for classified or top secret information once he's left office? >> every former president has access to their documents. it is how they write their memoirs. >> those are some of the new excuses from republicans about

why donald trump took classified documents home with him to mar-a-lago. there was one of the old ones about hillary clinton. the former president is previewing his legal plans as he pushes more dangerous rhetoric. also, new polling nbc news shows americans no longer believe the economy is the most pressing issue facing our country. steve kornacki breaks down the numbers. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it is monday, august 22nd. katty kay is still with us. 57% of americans believe the investigations into donald trump should continue. 40% believe it should stop. issues facing the country, threats of democracy has overtaken the cost of living. the poll shows a dissatisfied electorate. tracking with other numbers we've seen several months now, 74% of americans say the country

is headed in the wrong direction. 58% believe america's best days are behind it. and 58% believe the united states is in a recession. republicans have a 2-point edge when it comes to which party voters want to control congress, though it is in the margin of error. tie game there. democrats significantly closed the enthusiasm gap. 68% of republicans express a high level of interest in the upcoming election, versus 66% for democrats. in may, that gap was 8 points. let's go to nbc news national political correspondent, steve kornacki, at the big board, and co-founder of axios, mike allen with us, as well. steve, take us through some of the numbers and what jumped out to you. >> willie, everything we're trying to figure out in the last month or so is something changing here in terms of the midterm climate towards the democrats' benefit, away from the republicans, of course. the usual trend has been the out of power party, the opposition

party does really well in midterm elections. earlier this year, just about all the numbers were pointing in that direction. the question is, are those numbers changing at all? let's take you through some of the big ones. you showed a few, and let's try to put some context on this. first, the president's approval rating, i mean, typically, this tells you a lot about where things are going in a midterm election. the only two times in the modern era when a president's party has not lost seats in congress in a midterm, president's approval rating was sky high on election day. that would have been 2003 with george w. bush. he was in the high 60s. that would have been '98 with bill clinton. he was in the 60s. biden is at a 42% approval rating. 55% disapprove. the last time our poll, the nbc poll was in the field, it's been a while, but back in may, it basically looked exactly the same. start of the summer, end of the summer here, biden's approval rating in our poll basically

flat. you mentioned also that question of the generic ballot. in our polling, again, comparing late spring, start of the summer, really hasn't budged that much now. republicans ahead by two. had been a tie in may. this is interesting, when you look at this one historically, think back now over the last decade or so, there have been two big republican midterm years. that was 2010. that was the huge sweep when they won 63 seats. that was 2014, barack obama's second midterm. it was a big one for republicans. at this point in 2010, republicans were plus 6 on the generic ballot. it was clear by the end of summer 2010 where things were going in that midterm election and that republicans were headed toward a very strong performance. i think what is interesting is, the other big republican midterm, they trailed in 2014 on the generic ballot by 1.4 points.

it is worth keeping in mind, if you think back to 2014, there was talk until very late in the midterm cycle that maybe democrats were going to buck history and have a good year. one of the things was the generic ballot was favorable to the democrats until deep into the midterm campaign. if you're a republican, you hope this is a repeat of 2014. if you're a democrat, you hope you can keep it where it is right now, in terms of the generic ballot. you mentioned the enthusiasm, as well. look at this change. i think this is notable here. oh, one screen too far there. if you went back to march, this is what i'm saying. earlier in the year, the numbers were consistent with a big republican midterm advantage. republicans had a 17-point advantage when it came to their voters saying they had the highest level of enthusiasm coming into the midterms. in may, it was down to 8, and now the gap is 2 points. the blue wave of 2018, democrats gained 40 seats in the house

during trump's presidency. on this same question, democrats were leading by 2 or 3 points. now, it is a republican advantage of 2 points in our poll, but the movement there, it started before the roe decision but has continued since that roe decision. the movement there in the democrats' direction, i think that one is interesting. then you put this up here, the top issues, what people say the top issues facing the country are. it is interesting. the threats to democracy makes number one overall. if you add together cost of living and jobs and the economy, together they would come to 30%. if you merge those two as similar, it'd be number one. the combined total is down a little from the last poll. what i thought was really interesting was just to look at the partisan breakdown. how do the two parties look at the top issues facing the country. you see stark differences on this one. for instance, you take the question of abortion, particularly after the supreme court decision. 15% of democrats rate that as

the most important issue facing the country. five times greater than the republican number. only 3% of republicans rate abortion as the top issue facing the country. how about this for an imbalance? immigration and the border, 2% of democrats cite that as the top issue in the country. 15 times as many republicans. 30% rate that as the top issue facing the country. there are stark divides between how each party universe looks at the big problems facing the country heading into this midterm. >> so much fascinating information in these polls. mike allen, if you look at that screen that steve has up right now, he is right, if you combine the numbers two and three, those are the economy, 30%. that really is number one. but the fact that 21% of americans now say threats to democracy are one of the most important issues, or the most important issue facing the country does show the impact of the january 6th committee's

select hearings. perhaps even now, the fbi investigation, looking into donald trump. this general theme, this general tone we've been living with for a couple years now about really the foundation of what our country is built on. >> willie, that's a great point. there have been a lot of debate about the january 6th hearings. they've definitely over delivered in the content and the drama that they've come up with between their live witnesses and their network documentary style production. but this is a sign people are like, oh, well it only inside the beltway? no, this is a sign it is seeping out. i've been talking behind the scenes with the committee. for their hearings, when they resume in september, they plan more blockbusters. they're thinking of it as season two, and they're not going to have a sophomore slump in season two. they're teeing it up. in fact, liz cheney, vice chairman of the committee,

teasing the idea they might try to call president trump. yesterday, pressing vice president pence to deliver on his statement last week, that he was considering or that he would consider appearing. she actually said he has an obligation to do that. that's a big fight we're going to see in the next couple weeks. willie, zooming back to the poll, and it is a great nbc news poll. 1,000 registered voters. 3-point margin of error. there are two findings here that leapt out at me, and they're both very clever questions. the first one we saw in the graphic earlier, when we saw that only 1/3 of americans think the best is yet to come. i have not seen this question before. are america's best days behind us? i guess it's been asked because mark murray's story said this is a record number of people said that it was, that the best days

are behind us. and a second finding, willie, that we're featuring in "axios a.m." this morning was also a clever question nbc asked over time. that's about president trump. they asked republicans, are you more aligned with president trump or the republican party itself? this is where we're starting to see an early sign of possible data showing an fbi bump for president trump among republicans. he could still have -- this could be completely moot. he is, of course, being investigated for possible violations of the espionage act. your poll numbers don't make much difference to you in that situation. but we're seeing a recovery in the nbc poll from may until now, in the number of republicans who think they're aligned with trump rather than the republican for they. this is trump dialing into the idea among republicans. the more they are against trump,

the more republicans say they're for him. >> katty, it's a great point by mike. donald trump is banking on this and why he is putting so much into his conspiracy theories and attacking the fbi. he is banking on the fact this is helping him. he took documents to mar-a-lago. he can be the martyr or the victim of the deep state, for whatever he did. when you look at the numbers, especially on the economy, joe biden has to be thinking, what do i have to do? record unemployment at 3.5%. 11 million open jobs. it's really inflation as the recession question that has people feeling like we're in a recession. for all his legislative achievements the last couple weeks even, that approval number remains flat over the last few months. >> yeah. interesting, traveling around the country as i did earlier this summer, the one thing people kept raising with me was the price of gas.

gas prices have come down. we all know that. it hasn't trickled down to supermarkets, for example. grocery prices are still high. until people start seeing the prices come back across the board, and i think until they see them coming down long enough and they trust they're not going up again, it'll be hard for joe biden's approval numbers to shift around that. steve, there is an anomaly in the poll i want to ask you about. i spoke to mark murray about it earlier, but i wanted your take. when you look at the issues ranked by importance, the issue of abortion comes, like, i think it's eighth on the list or something. it is pretty low down there on the list in terms of importance. yet, we keep hearing that this is a huge galvanizing factor, particularly for democrats in the midterm election. how do you weigh those two things? if abortion do ranking so low, how can it also be this big, galvanizing factor? >> yeah, well, that's where i think the partisan breakdown is so interesting. abortion overall is not near the top in terms of issues animating

voters. look inside the democratic universe. that's what you're seeing in this column here. these are democratic voters. actually, it's number two. it's the second highest prevalence issue among democrats. threats to democracy is the highest. you'll get that from democrats. abortion is the second highest you'll get back from democrats. cost of living, climate change come in behind that. again, just -- it's a night and day difference from republicans, where you stack all of these issues up in terms of republican voters and ask them what they think is the most important. they put abortion basically at the bottom of their list. what that ends up averaging out to here, when you put republicans, democrats, and independents together for that matter, is abortion clocks in in single digits. but when you just look at democratic voters, it's actually the number two issue there in terms of salience. it gets back to the question, i believe it's the screen before this, the enthusiasm question we

talked about. this is basically the way this question is asked in the poll, and i've been doing this for years so you can compare in past midterm cycles. you ask, on a scale of 1 to 10, how excited are you about voting in this year's midterm elections? what you're seeing here is the percentage in each party who said either a 9 or a 10, put themselves at the top level of the scale in terms of interest. at the start of this year, there was a huge disparity between the parties. republicans had a 17-point advantage there on the high enthusiasm for voting in the midterms. that was basically cut in half in may. of course, the dobbs decision came down in june. since june, we've seen it close further. the democratic number has gone 50, 61, 66. i do expect that abortion had something to do with that in terms of increasing the democratic interest in this year's midterm elections and bringing that gap down to just 2 points right now. >> that enthusiasm is showing up

in fundraising, where democrats are doing very well. steve kornacki, fascinating information and a snapshot of where we are as a country right now. steve, thank you. mike allen, thank you, as well. good to see you. we showed 57% of americans believe the investigations into donald trump should continue, and they are. how the former president is responding next on "morning joe." [♪♪] for comfortable underwear that also helps provide protection from bladder leaks... try depend silhouette.

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site on friday, trump accused federal law enforcement of, quote, destroying our country. teased he'd file a motion based on the production from unreasonable search and seizure. trump's top attorney said on saturday he is considering a motion to appoint a special master in the case. this would be an outside official selected by a judge to carry out a judicial matter on the court's behalf. as of this morning, however, there still is no indication trump's team has taken those steps. let's bring in congressional reporter for "the guardian," hugo lowell, and senior national political reporter marc caputo. guys, good morning. good to see you. hugo, you've been looking at the fourth amendment. is this something donald trump is throwing against the wall, or is his legal team actually pursuing this? >> it is not exactly clear. the fact we haven't seen this motion or filing to appoint a special master to review the documents is not encouraging. certainly, the team knows they have to do something.

i spent the last few days in west palm beach. the overall sense was they needed to file something. not least because trump was not particularly pleased at how christina bobb, one of his lawyers, got pulled apart on fox news and castigated for not filing anything. i think if we see something, it is likely to come today. they can't afford to wait any longer. if they wait any longer, the fbi and the doj would have already finished their filter review and, frankly, there wouldn't be a need for a special master to go through the documents. they're really on the time crunch now. >> marc, you're looking at how trump world and former president trump himself is looking at the fbi's execution of the search warrant at mar-a-lago politically and how it play or may not help him, if he decides to run in 2024. he thinks it is helping him, which is why he is making an issue of it and raising tons of money off it. some people in his world think

it is not so great for him. i take from your piece. >> yeah. it is usually not so great if you have the fbi execute a search warrant at your home. >> yeah. >> then in a separate investigation, your close friend and adviser is a target in an election interference case, unrelated in georgia, where you might be the target, as well. your former cfo of your company, the trump organization, has to plead guilty to tax fraud charges and turns state evidence. where you have to plead the fifth more than 440 times. that happened in two weeks. nevertheless, amid all of this, donald trump is communicating to others he feels pretty good. he is focused on his political future. in order to do that, he is looking at a potential 2024 republican primary. the polling shows, a "politico" morning consult poll shows he increased his punitive or potential lead over desantis,

georgia governor desantis, his closest potential rival, by ten points. there was a private poll he was shown, which was shared with us, in a florida congressional race. before the raid, donald trump was tied with desantis, 38/37 in a crowded primary. after the raid, trump's lead grew to 52% to 20% over desantis. he is looking at this, the increased fundraising. he says he feels good. his advisers are like, we're not sure. let's be careful. so far, he has been able to survive kind of the roadrunner to all these various coyote investigations. they've kind of come up nothing. in some cases, yes, in two cases he was impeached, didn't get removed from office. in trump's mind, according to them, he doesn't think this will amount to anything. boy, there's a lot of stuff out there. it's hard to see how he gets away without a cut or a scar, but stranger things have happened, i guess. >> yeah.

marc, at the moment, we seem to be in trump world, as we often are, weighing up the political side of his life against the legal side of his life. at some point, they may clash. there have been a lot of speculations straight after the raid that trump may just, you know, buoyed by the enthusiasm he saw from his supporters of the fbi search, he may jump into the race early. he is inclined to wait until after the mid term elections according to your reporting. is there a chance that between now and the midterm elections the investigations pick up, we get more legal problems, and this would actually leave a window for him to be dissuaded from running if he makes the calculation that actually he can't win? as we know, trump hates the idea of losing almost as much as he likes the idea of winning. just by opening that timeframe to end of november, does he open up some sort of wiggle room for people to say to him, actually, you know what, it's not the best idea? >> trump often has a certain

amount of wiggle room and speculative with things he engaged in, but in this case, from what we hear from people, he feels relatively good of his republican future, at least in a primary, because he is so far out in front and the center of attention. now, if he gets charged before then, maybe that'd make a difference. brendan buck, republican strategist we voted in our story, he said trump will win the republican primary for president even if he is in jail. the likelihood i think that trump would ultimately not run with everything he's done until now, it is slim. he'll run. it's a question of when he announces. >> as you write in the piece, he is particularly feeling himself right now after last week, taking the political scalpel, the one he wanted in liz cheney, reminding himself of his power in the party right now. hugo, looking forward to this week, the investigations, we're awaiting the ruling on the reactions in the affidavit.

the judge said, i'm open to releasing the affidavit. justice department, black out whatever you think needs to be blacked out, but we are going to put something out there. what is the potential impact of that? or will it be, as analysts said op our show, probably a page full of black lines? >> i think it could be significant if you think of the things they'd have to redact and what they wouldn't redact. some of the affidavits also list out the kind of statutes that the doj thinks have been violated based on kind of testimony from informants, testimony from fbi agents on the case. it is possible, based on speaking to former u.s. attorneys, that the doj redacts a significant portion of the affidavit to do its sources and methods and investigative techniques that effectively outline a road map for the investigation. but leave unredacted discussion

or potential discussion about the kinds of crimes they think might have been committed by trump or people around him at mar-a-lago, by the virtue of him holding on to the documents he wasn't authorized to have. if that comes out, could be another blow for him. we'll find out thursday whether the judge is inclined to release them. >> a big week ahead. congressional reporter for "the guardian," hugo lowell. senior national reporter, marc caputo. thank you both for being here. appreciate it. coming up, two top democrats squaring off in florida for the chance to take on governor ron desantis in november. we'll get a preview of tomorrow's tight primary race ahead on "morning joe." a "ponzi scheme." the women and men i served with in combat, we earned our benefits. just like people earned their social security and medicare benefits. but republicans in congress have a plan to end so-called "entitlements" in just five years. social security, medicare, even veterans benefits. go online and read the republican plan for yourself.

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you got a lot of work to do because your kids are going to need it. you've said you'll think about running for president. would you be running to send a message or because you think you can win. >> you run for president because you believe you'd be the best candidate, the best president of the united states. any decision that i make about

doing something that significant and that serious would be with the intention of winning and because i think i'd be the best candidate. >> would your path be inside the republican party or outside. >> i haven't made any specific decisions or plans about that at this point. >> running as an independent is something you're think about? >> i'm not going to go down that path in terms of speculating. >> liz cheney speaking with john karl of abc after her primary loss. here's more of the wide-ranging interview. >> this wasn't just losing a house seat. you were considered a future speaker of the house. it's a lot to give up. any regrets? >> no regrets. i feel sad about where my party is. i feel sad about the way that too many of my colleagues have responded to what i think is a great moral test and challenge of our time, a great moment to determine whether or not people are going to stand up on behalf

of the democracy and on behalf of our republic. >> what does your defeat say of trump's hold on the republican party? >> one, it says that people continue to believe the lie. they continue to believe what he is saying, which is very dangerous. i think it also tells you that large portions of our party, including the leadership of our party, both at a state level in wyoming as well as on a national level with the rnc is very sick. you know, we really have got to decide whether or not we're going to be a party based on substance and policy or whether we're going to remain as so many of our party are today, in the grips of a dangerous former president. >> in addition to trump's gloating about your loss, his spokesperson said, she may have been fighting for principles,

but they are not the principles of the republican party. i mean, arguably, he is right, isn't he? >> well, doesn't that tell you something? you know, what i'm fighting for is the constitution. what i'm fighting for is the perpetuation of the republic. what i'm fighting for is the fact that elections have to matter and that when the election is over and the courts have ruled and the electoral college has met, that the president of the united states has to respect the results of the election. and if donald trump's spokesman says those are principles that are inconsistent with donald trump's views and inconsistent with the republican party's views, i think that ought to give every american pause about who donald trump is and about what the republican party stands for today. >> you're starting this political organization. what can you tell us? what are you going to do? >> i'm going to be very focused on working to ensure we don't elect election deniers.

i'm going to work to support their opponents. i think it matters that much. >> will you be getting involved in campaigns against those republican candidates that are challenging or denying the results of the election? >> yes. >> including your republican colleagues here in congress? >> yes. >> katty, it'll be interesting to see what that looks like for liz cheney, what her role is as she moves forward. she's made very clear she's not going anywhere. what impact can she have? taking a step back, it's extraordinary, in five or six years, liz cheney, a republican named cheney now has no place in the party, where her father, you know, for many years, was a name brand and central figure, particularly in the state of wyoming and nationally. now, the litmus test is, did you back donald trump enough, not are you conservative enough? >> yeah. she had a voting record in line with donald trump. it wasn't like she was voting against her policies. wasn't like she spent her career

opposing his agenda. it was on this one issue of the 2020 election, and donald trump's insistence that it was stolen from him. i thought it was interesting, listening to that today, willie, as we have this poll out showing that the threat to democracy is the number one concern amongst voters in america as they head into the elections and, yet, there is liz cheney, alone in her party, alongside adam kinzinger and a few brave people who voted to impeach donald trump and have been ousted from the party, but she is alone with adam kinzinger, sitting there, trying to defend the thing that americans say is their top issue in the poll going into the midterm election. i think that tells you all you need to know about where the republican party is on this one issue. >> to be clear, she sacrificed her political career, which still had a lot in front of it, to take this stand.

we will see what she does going forward. there is an investigation into the killing of the daughter of a russian nationalist and ally of president vladimir putin. 29-year-old darya dugina died yesterday after the car she was driving blew up on a highway near moscow. russian investigators say someone planted an explosive device in the car, which they believe was intended for her father, alexander dugin. dugin took a different vehicle at the last minute. so far, no one claimed responsibility. a separatist leader in donetsk blamed ukraine. kyiv immediately denied any involvement, saying, quote, we are not a criminal state. alexander dugin, known as putin's brain, is a fierce defender of the war on ukraine and advocated for the unification of russian-speaking territories. his daughter was a journalist and commentator who shared her father's views. she had been sanctioned by the united states and british governments for spreading

disinformation about ukraine. meanwhile, joe biden is stressing the importance of protecting europe's largest nuclear power plant in ukraine. during a call yesterday with the leaders of britain, france, and germany, biden expressed concerned about the situation at the facility, as fighting has intensiied in recent weeks. he stressed the need to, quote, avoid military operations near the plan. the leaders also recommended inspectors from the international atomic energy agency visit the site soon, in order to determine the safety of its operations. joining us now from southeastern ukraine, nbc news correspondent josh lederman. josh, what more can you tell us? >> reporter: willie, there was more shelling near the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant over the weekend. just to give you a sense of what we're talking about here, we are in zaporizhzhia, which is a city of more than 700,000 people. right across this road, that's the nipro river. the largest nuclear power plant

is on the other side in russian-occupied territory. now, the winds are moving westward, toward kyiv. if there was radiation release, that'd potentially move toward population centers. i spoke this morning with the exiled mayor of a small village where the nuclear plant is located. he is now here in zaporizhzhia. he told me, it's getting harder and harder to even figure out what's happening in and around the nuclear plant because the russians have taken over the communication centers, cellular systems, and the internet. people are struggling to get information out of there. but another big concern is potential russian retaliation for the car bombing you mentioned that killed the daughter of alexander dugin. there are no indications right now that ukraine was responsible, but, certainly, he has been seen as the intellectual godfather, if you will, of many of putin's views,

including his staunch support for invading ukraine. we're already seeing some right-wingers in russia call for some type of retaliation against ukraine, which is already on high alert right now. because on wednesday, we are heading into ukraine's independence day, which also happens to coincide with the six-month anniversary of this war. president zelenskyy over the weekend has been warning that russia may be planning some type of particularly vicious attack to mark that day, to spoil the independence day, but also to remind ukrainians, as the war surpasses the six-month mark, they remain vulnerable all across the country. zelenskyy is warning ukrainians to take extra precautions that day. kharkiv, the second largest city in ukraine, will be having around-the-clock curfew as they try to keep people safe on a bittersweet independence day. willie? >> josh, clearly, a tense week there in ukraine. talk to me a little bit more about the nuclear plant, the

vulnerabilities to it. you know, without being alarmist, we don't want to get ahead of ourselves, but it is worth people trying to understand, what would be the potential, practical implications of a strike against that plant, which is the biggest nuclear power plant in the whole of europe? what could be the ramifications? >> reporter: well, there's a few possibilities, and we've been speaking with nuclear experts about this. reactors themselves, six of them there, are fairly secure. they're built to withstand a plane flying into them. we've already seen a lot of shelling at the site that damaged the power lines. some of them have already been knocked out. a big concern is that if the power supply to the cooling systems that keep the nuclear reactors from melting down goes out, they would really have to rely on diesel generators for short periods of time, to try to keep -- to prevent a nuclear meltdown. the other concern is there are massive amounts of spent nuclear

fuel. hundreds of nuclear fuel rods that are stored at the site. they are less secure than the nuclear reactors themselves. so if there is shelling at the site that first damages the protective layer themselves, radiation could be sent spreading. depending on the size of the disaster, some are saying it could be larger than chernobyl, mirror what we saw in fukushima, could send radiation spreading not only into europe but also russia, katty. >> those are concerns. not there yet, thank goodness. as we mark the sixth month, we have to stop and say that ukraine has more than held its own. remember in the days leading up to this, weeks leading up, there were thoughts russia and putin were going to roll tanks into kyiv and raise a flag and install a puppet government fairly quickly. here we are now, and, in fact, as you and i were talking yesterday on "sunday today," attacks from ukraine inside crimea even.

that land that was taken by vladimir putin in 2014, illegally, by the way. in many ways, ukraine is stepping up its attacks as we hit the six-month anniversary. >> reporter: that's right, willie. it was interesting because, for the first week or so we were starting to see these mysterious explosions in crimea, the ukrainian government was coy about it. they were not taking responsibility. they were kind of evading direct questions about whether ukraine was behind those attacks. but in the last two days or so, we started to see ukrainian officials much more forthcoming about the fact there is a concerted campaign by ukraine to try to liberate, demilitarize crimea. president zelenskyy saying in one of his evening addresses that he can feel the liberation of crimea in the air. now, we should point out, russia has poured massive amounts of troops and military assets into crimea. there is no sign they're going to be able to evict russia from the territory they illegally occupied in 2014.

certainly, ukraine is trying to make clear to the russians, including the russians who are civilians living in crimea, that they are vulnerable. they are not safe. russia can no longer feel they are impervious and can use it as a rear base and a staging ground to attack ukraine, as the ukrainians try to prevent this from becoming a frozen conflict and start to take back territory in the south as they head to the winter months. >> ukraine doing a lot of this with the billions of dollars of aid the united states and the west have provided. nbc news correspondent josh lederman covering a lot of ground for us from ukraine. thanks so much. coming up, a preview of president biden's week ahead. we will go live to the white house. plus, cnbc's andrew ross sorkin has business before the bell. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

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escape out of japan. worthy of a movie. you're stuck in a box for several hours, right? breathing through air holes. what is that like? >> i'm not going to confirm or say anything. what i can tell you, it's obviously, you know, you have a lot of anxiety when you are in a period where you are going out of the country but not out of reach. >> former nissan ceo turned fugitive, carlos ghosn, 2 1/2 year ago when he was smuggled out of japan in a guitar case. with the help of two americans, the tycoon escaped charges in tokyo and returned to his childhood home of lebanon, where he remains in exile today. joining us now, "wall street journal" reporters nick and sean, co-authors of "boundless: the rise, fall, and

escape of carlos gh oghosn." good morning. congratulations on the book. i mean, this story, for people who are not familiar with it, we have to take a step back. nick, i'll start with you. just kind of set the table about who carlos ghosn is, then we'll get to in an instruction case being smuggled out of the country. >> thanks for having us on. carlos ghosn is head of three fortune 500 companies and nissan and renault and mitsubishi. and he gets arrested, surprise arrest in the fall of 2018 at the time he was flying high. he was at davos and used to be in media and one day he lands in japan and he's arrested and we find out about the alleged crimes that have been going on for a number of years and he said he is the victim of an

unfair system. the japanese say that he's a greedy dictator and commits all of these crimes and 13 months after his arrest, he is facing four charges, up to 15 years in jail and he basically one day just leaves his house, he's on bail and in this kind of amazing escape, manages to get to lebanon in a musical instrument case. so that is where he's been living for the past two and a half years. lebanon does not extradite and he's still out there living as an outlaw. >> still a fugitive. so how did this high-flying executive end up inside of the musical instrument cases. what did he do? what were the charges against him in japan and he's clearly so desperate to get out of that country? >> well carlos ghosn was facing two main charges. one was related to alleged plans

to defer his compensation for a number of years until after his retirement, and the second bigger charge was an allegation that he took kickbacks from a nissan and renault dealership to the tune of several million dollars. and it was after the charges on the amanny-related actions that carlos ghosn decided woe leave the country. >> so, sean, the story is just wonderful because it is kind of shakespearian, here is this guy that gets greedy and cheating on his wife and he made a bad margin call and the banks went millions and then he plan this is larger than life hollywood type escape in a guitar box. i mean i'm hoping there is a movie coming because i've been fascinated how he got away with this. but get us inside of the guy's

head a little bit. what takes him from being successful and as far as we know uncorrupt ceo to having that margin call go wrong back in 2008 to suddenly going off the rails and becoming this corrupt, greedy figure who has to end up being arrested and then get out of the country and now living as a fugitive. >> i think one thing that nick and i realized in our reporting over the years on the carlos goen case, it is hard to understand what happened unless you start at the beginning. so nick and i investigated and laid out in a massive sweeping narrative carlos ghosn's life and career up to this point. and you see a map that was talented and deserved earning he earned but when he reached the uppereshon of the corporate world he found a environment void of oversight and in that

environment carlos ghosn began to do things in secret and in the shadows that ultimately came to light after a rebellion by several nissan executives who were trying to avoid a merger between renault and nissan and went digging for dirt on carlos ghosn and came up with quite a bit which we've laid out in our book. many of the details have not come to light until now. >> so, nick, as you reported in the book, mr. carlos ghosn was cooperating and then realized he's in serious trouble and then in summer of 2019, he gets in trouble with a former u.s. special forces soldier, what happens from there? >> yeah, exactly. and the way carlos ghosn tells is, because he's somebody on bail once more and one of the conditions is he cannot talk to

his wife. at this point, he's facing this long jail sentence, the bail conditions are tough and he decides to escape and he gets in touch with michael taylor who is a former green beret and made a career out of, you know, putting off kind of improbable operations and he was involved in for example extracting there was a "new york times" reporter who was held hostage by the taliban. he was involved in getting him away. and michael taylor, at this stage, has done a stint in jail himself and he's senting vitamin water, it is fun but it doesn't necessarily keep someone blood boiling. so he looks into the carlos ghosn case and how could i get one of the most famous people out of japan. how do we do this and he figures quickly that you could do this either by sea, in some kind of like containership or you do it by air. either by going through the border or a private jet and when they set on in the end is to get

him inside of a music equipment box and roll him past security and on to a private jet. and actually the plan is, in my opinion, genius in its simplicity. they didn't over think it. and private jet terminals have lax security. and they won't blow up their own plane so you have a box where you could tick what level of security you got. you could see on the cctv that we managed to review, that when michael taylor, one of his helpers and the box go past security, one of them goes through the metal detectors goes off and they do nothing and they roll the box along it and not through it and it is simple to get him across the border an on the plane. >> we're watching the video right now from december 30th of 2019, a vehicle rolling right up next to the plane and he's stuffed in a box and put on that

plane and ferried off to freedom where he remains in exile. it is an amazing story. we just scratched the surface, the new book is boundless, nick costoff and sean mcclain, appreciate it. coming up next in our fourth hour of morning joe. a capitol police officer said he now fears another attack could be coming after the fbi search of mar-a-lago. we'll tell what you the officers are saying in new court documents. that comes as former president trump is posting online about his legal plans and engaging in more serious and dangerous rhetoric about law enforcement. we'll speak with chief legal correspondent ari melber. and tom brady expected to return to training camp following speculation and concern over where exactly he's been. we'll go live at the buc's training facility when "morning joe" comes right back. ht back.

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