use after he was banned from twitter. >> yeah. doesn't have the reach twitter did, but if he loses this, it'd be that much more diminished. mike allen, thank you. we'll talk again in a bit on "morning joe." thanks to all of you for getting up "way too early" on this monday morning. "morning joe" starts right now. ♪ this is ground control ♪ >> live look from kennedy space center this morning as nasa prepares to take a key step in a long-awaited return to the moon. with a test flight of its most powerful rocket yet. the artemis i mission is expected to launch a few hours from now depending on the weather, and we will carry it live. we are also following this morning the major national security concerns from donald trump's reckless handling of classified documents. were u.s. intelligence sources and operatives compromised? we'll look at that. plus, the investigation into

possible obstruction. good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is monday, august 29th. it's pretty much the end of summer. there is new reaction this morning after a heavily redacted copy of the fbi affidavit used to justify the search of former president donald trump's mar-a-lago home was unsealed on friday. the 36-page affidavit removed details of the federal government's efforts to recover classified documents, including top secret information that trump is alleged to have illegal little taken from the white house at the end of his presidency. the affidavit states that in mid-may, fbi agents conducted a preliminary review of the contents of 15 boxes trump returned to the national archives from his florida property in january. quote, identified documents with classification markings in 14 of

the 15 boxes. it states that agents found 184 unique documents that had classification markings. 25 documents were marked as top secret. 67 documents were marked as confidential. and 92 were marked secret. according to the affidavit, agents saw markings devoting various control systems designed to protect various types of sensitive information. they included markings that designate intelligence gathered by, quote, clandestine human sources, like a report by a cia officer, or someone who works for the defense intelligence agency. as for the redactions, they were primarily in the section providing probable cause for the search, which is about 20 pages long. one almost completely blacked out section is titled, "there is

probable cause to believe that documents containing classified national defense information and presidential records remains at the premise." a special master will be appointed. u.s. district judge, appointed by trump in 2020, issued a two-page order on saturday, despite not yet hearing arguments from the justice department. the judge gave federal officials until tomorrow to provide the court with a more detailed list of items the fbi had removed from the florida estate. but the ruling left unclear how a special master would operate and who might qualify to take on such a role in a case involving classified national security secrets and a former president. meanwhile, national

intelligence director hanes announced an investigation of the top secret documents. hanes said her office will lead an intelligence community assessment of the potential risk to national security that would result from the disclosure of the relevant documents. chair maloney and house intelligence committee chair adam schiff had asked for a security damage assessment in the days following the fbi search. a spokesperson for the office of the director of national intelligence also confirmed on saturday that the, quote, assessment we are leading is consistent with the bipartisan request from the senate intelligence committee. let's bring in nbc news justice and intelligence correspondent ken dilanian. presidential historian and rogers chair in the american presidency at vandebilt university, jon meacham. and the host of "way to early" and white house bureau chief at

"politico," jonathan lemire. also with us, the co-founder of "axios," mike allen. good to have you all on this monday morning. >> ken, we're getting an intel damage assessment from intel officials, possible special master to review the documents and to look at the process as it is moving along. a lot of procedural steps are starting to be taken to assess how damaging this is to national security. what can you tell us? >> good morning, joe. so, yeah, a lot of interesting developments over the weekend with this judge in florida signaling her preliminary intent to appoint a special master in this case and demanding the justice department provide a more detailed inventory. of course, she was appointed by president trump. a lot of people are very spun up about this. i think we should wait and see on that. first of all, they've been reviewing these documents, the justice department, for three weeks with their own filter team, an independent team

designed to weed out things they shouldn't see, like documents covered by attorney/client privilege. we don't know exactly what this judge is going to order the end of the day. she may be satisfied after she sees what the doj files, that they've followed all the procedures here. people are talking about, you know, special master and do they need security clearance? the goal of the special master would be to take out privileged documents. presumably, nothing that is highly classified is also privileged. there is no attorney/client privilege in a cia human source report that trump has at mar-a-lago. again, we should wait and see on that. the big takeaways from this document being unsealed was, to me, one, the fbi is talking to a significant number of civilian witnesses. those names are blacked out, but that's how they got probable cause. not one informant or key witness. a significant number whose identities need to be protected. two, they believe they'd find evidence of obstruction of

justice at mar-a-lago. that was new. three, the incredibly, highly classified nature of the documents, things that normally would never be outside of the originating agency, like the cia, let alone a secure vault. things that could compromise sources and methods, could get people killed. those are the kinds of markings, human control system, meaning possibly a report by a cia officer about his or her interview with an overseas spy. sitting in donald trump's golf club at mar-a-lago. just stunning, stunning developments, guys. >> it really is. you look at what we're talking about here. as mika said, 184 classified markings on documents. 25 documents marked top secret. 25. 67 marked confidential. 92 marked secret. yet, there always seems to be this process of defining dooef

deviency down for donald trump. a committee said it caused grave counterintelligence risks. whether you take the documents, you know, there are a lot of republican senators and members of congress and former members of congress -- i know as a former member of congress -- that if we had mishandled documents, if we'd taken one document, one top secret document, let alone 25 or ten documents with classified markings, the fbi would be at our house the next day. all of these senators and all of these members of congress that are suggesting that -- or newspaper editorialists who are suggesting it is much to do about nothing, they'd all be in jail. i know because of the briefings

i got when i was in the armed services committee and the warnings we got. yet, here you have republican senator lindsey graham of south carolina saying in an interview yesterday, not that what donald trump did was okay -- >> well, this is the last defense. >> he didn't do something that would have lindsey thrown in jail in a day. but, now, this threat of violence. if you hold -- and this is where -- isn't this where it ends, really, for the republicans? joe biden said the maga trumpists, the semi-fascists. i don't know where the word "semi" came from. isn't this where it ends? they say, if you hold our people to account. if it is really true that in america, no man is above the

law, well, there's going to be violence. because donald trump is above the law, lindsey suggests. if donald trump is indicted for taking 25 top secret documents, 67 confidential documents, 92 secret documents, and taking them from the white house and refusing to give them back to the federal government, despite them trying to work with him patiently. if he is indicted for doing something that would have members of congress in jail immediately, well, there may be riots out there. there may be violence. that's lindsey's warning. take a look. >> most republicans, including me, believes when it comes to trump, there is no law. it's all about getting him. if they try to prosecute president trump for mishandling classified information after hillary clinton set up a server in her basement, they literally will have riots in the street.

i worry about our country. >> riots in the street. there's a threat of violence. of course, lindsey at least admitted the truth. when it comes to donald trump, he and other republicans believe, quote, there is no law. now, abc news, retiring senator blunt brought up hillary clinton's emails. >> was it right for the president to take the government documents, which he was supposed to return to the national archives, down to mar-a-lago? >> you should be careful with classified documents. i had access to documents like that for a long time. i'm incredibly careful. i was wondering as i was listening to that discussion if the same things were said when secretary clinton had documents, when director comey had documents. >> yeah, the same things were said. what do you think we've been catching hell for for, like, five years? yeah, the same things were said. "the new york times" wrote about it for a year and a half. michael schmidt still probably

can't go into a bar on the upper west side without people yelling at him for reporting for a year and a half in "the new york times" about hillary's emails. we talked about it. we said she needed to be straightforward. where have you been, roy blunt? >> yeah, well. >> oh, wait a second, you were wallowing in it. you were basking in it. republicans were basking in it. they loved it. they loved the fbi. when james comey, ten days before the election, sent a letter that they knew, that donald trump knew would throw the election his way. >> i mean, the obvious, joe, is that hillary clinton's emails, yes, we asked a lot of questions. >> a lot of questions. >> but there is a far cry between her emails and the documents we're talking about that were removed in boxes and taken to a country club. >> you're talking about -- >> and put in the basement. >> -- a false moral equivalency with donald trump. i don't know if you're waking up right now, but 184 classified

markings on documents that donald trump took out of the white house improperly, most likely illegally. 25 documents marked top secret. 67 confidential documents. 92 documents marked secret. yet, knowing all of this, we know this to be the case, "the wall street journal" editorial board asked of the mar-a-lago affidavit, "is that all there is?" now, i quote "the wall street journal" editorial board a lot because i like a lot of things they write. i know most people who watch this show do not. but, man, on russia, on this, they are -- talk about defining

it down. a federal judge on friday released a heavily redacted version of the fbi affidavit used to justify the search of donald trump's mar-a-lago home. we can't help but wonder, is that it? is that it? did you really just ask that question? this is why agents descended on a former president's residence like they would a mob boss. oh, i don't know, or like they would if somebody took 184 documents with classified markings on them, "wall street journal" editorial page. if you are going to indict a former president, you better have him dead to rights on something bigger than mishandling documents. what the -- jon meacham, i know maybe it is just the southern baptist blood running through my veins right now. >> yeah. >> but is -- okay, let's be serious, is that all there is? i not only heard that, and you

read that. donald trump's former acting chief of staff, mick mulvaney, who actually is working for a news operation, says, so if the classified documents from mar-a-lago turn out to be crossfire hurricane, the 2016 russia hoax, he said those words, russia hoax, and they exonerate trump, what happens next? i responded, if you or any member of congress had taken half of those government documents after leaving office, you'd already be in jail. but you know that. and russia hoax? really? the republican senate intel committee said trump's 2016 campaign caused, quote, and this was marco's committee, by the way, a grave counterintelligence threat. jon meacham, despite our tone this morning, despite my tone this morning, this is so damn serious because, here, you have

"the wall street journal" editorial page. i know it has a conservative bent, but it's written a lot of great editorials on january 6th. it's called trump out for lying about the stolen election. but, here, you have "the wall street journal" asking, is this it? >> yeah. >> when you're talking about a president seizing top secret documents from the white house and refusing to return them. >> you've got here this machinery of reflexive and perpetual, partisan defense that has gone into overdrive, as ever. it is not even defense. it's now affirmatively bad for the constitutional experiment, to reflexively and blindly defend anything your side does, does not make you a

constitutional actor in the way we're supposed to be. it makes you a partisan warrior in what is going to very -- you know, senator graham said it -- in what can become a stative nature, right? we haven't talked about thomas hobbs yet this morning, so let's do that. i want mika to perk up. >> i'm here for it. >> hobbs wrote a hugely important book about the state of nature is the war of all against all. the point of civilization, the point of the rule of law, the point of understanding in the rest of the tradition, understanding we have rights and responsibilities to each other, that, that way, we move above just constant, perpetual conflict. the "journal" editorial, lindsey graham's riots comments, all of that is part of this now instinctive cult of personality.

the chief personality, it has been decided, can do no wrong. therefore, any criticism of, any factually based assertion about him has to be wrong or evil. it can't just possibly be true. we can't -- they can't look at it as, you know what? the facts say this. maybe that leads me to a place i don't want to be. guess what? that's what life in a republic is supposed to be. facts can lead you to a place you don't want to go, and that's what makes america, at its best, a marvelous place. it enables us to use our minds and not just our muscles and our guts. right now, the trump factor in the united states of america is about muscle and gut and power. >> you know, mika, if any member

of congress, if any ambassador, if any member of the intelligence agency had taken this many documents out, you know, like i said, they would be in jail. we saw with two former cia directors the mere mishandling of classified documents. nothing of this scale. you know, they faced consequences. we saw sandy berger, former nsa director, face consequences for this. when you hear lindsey graham say you can't hold donald trump to the same standards we hold others, why, you can't even go back and retrieve the documents that he won't return. >> yeah. >> he is above the law. if you try to hold him to the same standard we'd hold former

cia directors and former national security directors, that we hold members of the senate to, there will be violence in the street. "the wall street journal" and mick mulvaney asking, is this all there is? do i need to go over the 184 classified markings on documents, the 25 top secret documents? the highest classification. the 67 documents marked confidential. with hillary's emails, people were looking, that's a "c." does it stand for confidential? i don't know. let's talk about it another year. the documents marked secret, it's not a close call. what "the wall street journal" editorial page is saying is, in trump's america, trump is above the law. for anybody else, the same editorial board would be demanding they immediately get sent to prison. >> "the new york times" editorial board had a piece that

really laid it out. it was the board itself writing that, actually, donald trump is not above the law. not at all. not even because he is a former president. and that, in this case, yes, yes, there may be more violence. there already has been violence. many argue, because of this president, instigated by this president, promulgated by this president, and there will be more if he is held to account. whether to hold him to account, jonathan lemire, "the new york times" editorial board argues that in order for our democracy to survive, he has to be. because our democracy has been put in peril. there are not just -- there's several crimes here that could have been committed if you look at what's not redacted in, so far, this affidavit.cluing obst >> seemingly every development

we learn makes it more damaging, what trump took with him. we're working, slow motion wheels of justice, whether to get an indictment from doj. not sure if there'll be any time soon. evidence gathered by human sources was found there. this is the most top secret and dangerous material the u.s. government has. this would be the identity of spies, of their handlers, of people who are in and doing the most patriotic duty overseas, putting their own lives at risk, and potentially that all being cavalierly held in an unsecure room in mar-a-lago. now, ken dilanian, we hear from senator lindsey graham, talking about violence in the streets. we already had violence in the streets. we had violence at the u.s. capitol fueled by trump and his supporters, saying things were unfair and they were going to fight back. it seems he is lighting a match to that again.

talk to us a little bit, if you will, about the ongoing threats that law enforcement agents themselves have faced, fbi field offices, cincinnati, other places, but, also, what he intel officers are fearful of what could happen, as republicans are stirring up this talk of violence. >> it's a great question, jonathan. look, my u.s. law enforcement sources say they have never seen a threat environment more dangerous to federal agents than the one that they are seeing right now. we know about the attack on the fbi cincinnati field office. there was another one that didn't get a lot of attention last week. a man jumped a fence outside a chicago fbi office and was throwing rocks. okay, that may have been a disturbed persony whisked away by police, but it shows the threat environment out there. there was an intelligence report from dhs and the fbi to this

effect, that they are under siege. two fbi agents who were named in the original warrant that was disclosed, and some media organizations published with their names, they were subject to death threats. it is absolutely the case that, you know, the federal government is very concerned about this and tracking this. they link it directly to this search and to the rhetoric from republican politicians and a u.s. senator from florida who compared the fbi to the gestapo. absolutely, jonathan, it is a huge concern. >> nbc's ken dilanian, thank you so much. greatly appreciate your reporting, as always. mike allen, following up on that, it is interesting that there were some reports after the redacted affidavit was put out, that some of the most inflammatory, reckless members of congress who, in the past, had written things about the fbi

and the search and donald trump, went on to other subjects. >> yes. >> it is almost as if the republican party has sent out sort of an order saying, stop calling the federal bureau of investigation the gestapo, as members of the house and the senate have done. stop calling them communists. stop, republicans, saying that you want to de-fund the fbi, an operation that, obviously, takes care of kidnappings, that, of course, tries to stop domestic terrorism and foreign terrorism every single day, that chases down drug cartels, that keeps us safe. it seems as if some republicans, at least, have figured out that they probably need to stop putting fbi agents' lives in danger by calling them nazis. >> well, joe, that's a great

point. going back weeks on the show, you've been talking about how republicans are on the wrong side of law and order and the opposite side that they have been for decades. so that's one part of it. the threat environment that ken was talking about, incredible story on the front page of the sunday "washington post" that, now, in addition to federal agents and the irs, now threats against the national archives, the keeper of the declaration of independence. that, for sure, is part of it. joe, there is a second reality here. as i talk to people close to the president, former president trump, over the weekend, they are queasy about the facts now that are coming out. people defended him reflectively, defended him all these many years, suddenly, there's a lot of concern about the facts. one of the biggest things, joe, is just the volume that you've been -- excuse me -- that you've been highlighting in that

graphic. you think about the person in the bar test. they look at the number of boxes, the number of documents. joe, i can tell you that there's some short-term within the republican party, political bump maybe for donald trump, but the long-term really looks bad. you talk to people who know how the justice department works, how doj operates. look at this. they knew that he had documents. they asked for them back. there's a lot of sign in these documents that he was not forthcoming about them, to say the least. that's kind of textbook of how doj operates. very difficult to prosecute someone for sedition. what we're seeing here, much less complex, much more what doj does. >> right. of course, the wheels of justice do turn slowly. you look at the investigation into the last democratic nominee for governor in the state of

florida. who almost beat ron desantis in 2018. he was just indicted by the feds a couple weeks ago. a six-year investigation. yeah, the feds often take their time. i don't know that that's going to be the case here. jon meacham, i want to go back. we've been talking about the violence that -- and the threats that the men and women of the fbi are enduring right now. that the national archives head is in fear of right now. you know, joe biden talked about maga trumpists, maga republicans, the most extreme trump supporters anti-fascist. there were people offended by it. the governor of new hampshire was offended, saying it was for

all republicans. he didn't say all republicans. he talked about the extreme maga republicans. but i just, again, maybe i'm a little fuzzy on what exactly fascism is, but if you have threats of violence, if you make threats of violence, saying, "hold our leader to the same standards that you told everybody else's leader to, and there will be violence in the streets." the threats of violence, it's out there. acts of violence we saw on january 6th. donald trump calling, calling people to washington, saying it was going to be wild. we know that's what the january 6th committee has shown us. he was calling people there to do exactly what they did. and the use of violence to achieve political ends, which is exactly what was going on on january 6th. donald trump and the mob wanted

to stop the counting of the electoral votes on january 6th. a constitutionally mandated act that congress is supposed to do every four years. it's -- you then take all of trump's fascist rhetoric during campaigns, talking about beating the hell out of them, carrying protesters out on a stretcher, beat them up, i'll pay for your legal defense. telling cops, bang criminals' heads on the top of what he called paddy wagons. again, praising a member of congress for beating up a reporter who asked a question about health care reform. i must say, actually, for the most extreme, saying semi-fascist leads me only to the question, what is semi about that? it is full-on fascism. >> well, the president speaks

for the president, in the full disclosure mode, as you know. president biden is my friend. i help him when i can. so everything i'm about to say should be seen in that context. he was calling it as he saw it. again, he speaks for himself. but what else would one take away from the last five years, six years or so, of american politics, but that there is an extraordinary number of people who have designs on or have been brought along on a kind of tide to undo the constitutional conversation in favor of their own vision of power? that's what this is. what, you know, fascism,

autocracy, dictatorial trends, you know, we could spend the rest of the day whiteboarding, as we say, that. the point is, that the republican party, the party of eisenhower, reagan, ford, bush, romney, mccain, a party founded in the mid 1850s to oppose the spread of slavery to the territories, that party has been hijacked -- and there's lots of debate about that -- but it is now a vehicle for this autocratic personality who overrides the rule of law, who explicitly would prefer to be in power as opposed to following constitutional principle, and an extraordinary number of americans have proven willing to support him. the great question for the future of the country is how big

is that number? how big is that number? so my question is, i think this is a moral crisis as much as it is a legal one. joe, you and i know endless numbers of republicans who are all over this, right? some are all in with trump. some are embarrassed about it. some will say they aren't all in when they talk to us but really are. you know, gr gratiations of this. at the tend of the day, are they willing to do something? maybe it comes down to voting. maybe no poll shows it. maybe it is going to end up being in that voting season, where they say, enough. problem is, you've probably got, i don't know if it is 40%, i don't know what the number is, you've got a lot of true

believers. then you have their opportunistic enablers. a lot of the opportunistic enablers are the people we've been talking about this morning. that's the moral crisis, right? if you're putting your own position, your own fundraising, your own re-election above the constitutional experiment, then you -- then what are we talking about here? we're not talking about american democracy as give and take. we're talking about it only as take. >> yeah. you know, i agree with you, that the historical question is, what is that number right now? i will say, just judging from the fact that most of my friends and family members are supporters of donald trump or have been supporters of donald trump in the past, i think that dropped a good bit after january 6th. not 40% or 50%. >> not as much as you'd think. >> not as much as we can. you know what?

10% there, 15% there. obviously, as more information comes out here, as mike allen said, more people quietly going, my god, this has gotten worse than we've expected. i have noticed that what may have been 45% is 40%. i think it may be 35%. maybe those are the true believers. maybe even 30%. most people i talk to now say they want trumpism without trump. they want ron desantis. we'll see how that goes. i think electorally, i don't think i know that, electorally, donald trump has caused republicans to lose the 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020. it'll cause them to underperform in 2022, most likely. would cause them to lose in 2024. it is a losing proposition. the question is, what do we do with 35% of the country that

believe riots are acceptable, that believe that donald trump did nothing wrong on january 6th by calling people to washington and having them riot, and the belief that donald trump can take whatever top secret documents out of the white house that he wants. that he is above the law. >> it's a good question. >> what do we do with the 35% of americans? of course, the answer is, we do our best to try to move them back to believing in the basic tenants of this constitutional republic. i think that's a generational effort on all of our parts. presidential historian jon meacham, thank you so much. the latest episode of his podcast, "reflections of history." it is an extraordinary podcast. it is available now. he actually, every day for five, six minutes, he gives you great

insight into an important, historical moment. >> perfect for this moment. >> thank you, jon, for being with us. >> co-founder of "axios," mike allen, thank you, as well, for coming on this morning. ahead on "morning joe," president biden mocks one of former president trump's excuses for taking top secret documents to mar-a-lago. we'll show you those remarks. plus, a live report from war-torn ukraine. amid escalating fears of a nuclear accident, more shelling near europe's largest nuclear plant have u.n. officials ted heading to the area today. also this morning, after months of gloomy predictions, democrats are voicing growing confidence about this year's midterms. we'll have new reporting on the party's narrow path to keeping the house this november. and a new era of space exploration could kick off today. we are counting down to this morning's artemis rocket launch. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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♪♪ ♪♪ ♪♪ "shake your thang" by salt n pepa 42 past the hour. new shelling near a nuclear plant in ukraine over the weekend have officials on high alert this morning. last week, the plant which is europe's largest nuclear facility, was cut off from ukraine's power grid, causing a massive power outage and prompting international fears of a potential radiation disaster. this week, inspectors from the united nations nuclear watchdog are expected to visit the russian-occupied plant. joining us from odesa, ukraine, foreign correspondent meagan fitzgerald with more. what's the latest? >> reporter: well, mika, we are

expecting to see those inspectors inside the zaporizhzhia nuclear plant by the end of this week at the latest. you know, once they're there, we expect them to look at everything from the structural integrity of this plant, to pay close attention to the damage that's been done because of the fighting, even assess those workers that are inside the facility. of course, ukrainian officials are saying it is ukrainians who are inside working at gunpoint under the russians because, of course, they control this nuclear facility. look, this is a critical mission that leaders across the world have been calling on for weeks now. of course, the concern is that increased shelling in the area could contribute to nuclear meltdown. we are seeing radioactive materials seeping out of that plant and really just disseminating across the continent. ukrainian officials this weekend saying, look, they're not taking any chances. they have distributed already these iodine pills to people in the area out of an abundance of caution, telling them not to take it yet, but they are monitoring the levels in the

area. should they need to take it, they will let them know. this, of course, coming as shelling continues in and around the zaporizhzhia nuclear plant. we know over the weekend, the russians are saying the ukrainians hit the plant. ukrainians are saying it's the russians. all of this coming as we saw a huge potential disaster last week, when that fire, because of shelling, broke out right near the plant, knocking it off the power grid, causing the plant to run off these backup, diesel fuel running genergenerators. no one knows how much diesel there is, so that's why it is a concern, especially in ukraine. all eyes will be watching as the inspectors make their way to the facility by the end of the week. mika. >> nbc's meagan fitzgerald reporting for us from odesa, ukraine, thank you very much. coming up, a lawmaker on the january 6th committee teases the theme of next month's new

hearings. here's a hint, follow the money. also ahead, president biden is seeing a bump in his approval ratings as republicans seem to be losing ground in house races. we'll dig into the new polling. plus, a bad sign for the trump-backed u.s. senate candidate in arizona. a major pac is pulling millions in ad money for blake masters. >> yeah, it's not looking really great out there for him. >> sending it to the midwest. >> yeah, you know where they're not sending it? >> yeah. >> to dr. oz. >> and -- >> i mean, where do you send the money? >> turkey? >> pennsylvania? to jersey? do you send it to turkey? there's so many. how about hollywood? maybe he is still kissing his star on the hollywood walk of fame. you just don't -- he's got eight houses. where exactly would you spend money if you're dr. oz? >> maybe a p.o. box in pennsylvania? i don't know. up next, we'll go live to kennedy space center, as nasa is

preparing to send its most powerful rocket ever on a six-week mission around the moon. >> wow, beautiful. >> "morning joe" continues. >> i knew we'd get to the moon one of these years. >> in a moment. >> tech: cracked windshield? trust safelite. we'll replace your glass and recalibrate your vehicle's camera, so automatic emergency braking and lane departure warning work properly. don't wait--schedule now. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪

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go ahead, mr. president. this is houston out. >> hello, neil and buzz. i'm talking to you by telephone from the oval room at the white house, and this certainly has to be the most historic telephone call ever made. i just can't tell ya how proud we all are of what you -- for every american, this has to

be the proudest day of our lives. >> that was then president nixon speaking on the phone with neil armstrong and buzz aldrin, as they walked the lunar surface in 1969. a few years later, nasa's 1972 "apollo 17" would be the last time astronauts would land on the moon. now, after more than 50 years, nasa is ready to return with the scheduled launch of its artemis i rocket this morning from kennedy space center in florida. once launched, the rocket and capsule, which has no crew on board, will spend six weeks orbiting the moon before returning to earth. if the test flight goes well, the next step is putting astronauts in orbit around the moon in 2024, before attempting a landing in 2025. joining us now from the kennedy space center is nbc news correspondent jake ward.

jake, is the weather cooperating this morning? >> reporter: good morning, mika. certainly, the weather at this point is extraordinarily beautiful. i'm here from california, and i still can't get over what it looks like to be in florida at the break of drawn. an extraordinarily beautiful, clear day. the trouble, of course, is getting this system, one of the most powerful, certainly the most powerful, one of the most technologically complex systems ever to leave earth's gravity, getting it ready for launch, that's another matter. to talk for a second about the purpose of this mission, because you can get bogged down in whether it'll go at this particular moment. i want to touch on how extraordinary it is to go. on the one hand, nasa and the whole space flight enterprise has changed immensely. once upon a time, the kennedy space center, this facility, was a government only, top secret facility. today, when you drive in, it's got launch pads and buildings operated and, in some cases, owned by private companies. nearly 1,000 private contractors went into building this particular rocket. when we speak to the researchers

about what it is to go to the moon and why we want to send humans there, their ambitions are really quite startling. have a reason to the chief scientist in charge of what we would find out upon the moon when we land humans there. have a listen. >> humans are just much better field geologists than robots are. we can think faster, react faster, absorb what is going on around us better. we can also do more complicated things in terms of sampling. digging trenches and taking drill cores and making sure we get really the right samples back and not just random samples back. "apolo," we went to six places but they were all the central, near side of the moon. with artemis, we're going to explore an entirely new part of the moon. we'll go to the south pole, some of the oldest parts of the moon. there's some new stuff. >> reporter: so what is so amazing about the possibility of

going to the south pole is that idea of perhaps getting down there and looking at water in there. at this point, what we are waiting on for the launch today is the combination of hydrogen and oxygen and the various tanks on board the spacecraft, for them to be ready to go. you have to remember, h2o, water, hydrogen, oxygen, could be a fuel source for onward flight from the moon. the ambitions here are enormous. if, as you mentioned, this gets off the ground today, we wind up with the possibilities of another launch in 2024 with people aboard it. then 2025, actual boots on the moon. now, those are the big picture, amazing things here. let's talk whether it'll go today. the 8:33 a.m. scheduled launch is probably not going to happen. it is slipping because the pre-flight checklist is so complicated and because they're falling behind. weather has been difficult until now. there has been complicated issues. currently, they're having trouble getting hydrogen to flow properly through the third of four engines on board.

but there is hope, in that there is a two-hour window. 8:33 to 10:33 is the window. weather is forecast to get worse over the course of the window. if it doesn't fly today, could be friday. weather is supposed to be bad then. if not friday, monday. the forecast also has bad weather. it is not looking great for a launch right now, but, certainly, the ambitions here, i don't know, for some reason, they stick with me, though we are, of course, going to be disappointed if it doesn't go up today, mika. >> all right. nbc's jake ward, we'll be watching the weather and you. thank you very much. still ahead, we have the latest developments related to the fbi's search of mar-a-lago. including what the agency found back in may that accelerated efforts to get more boxes of documents from the former president's home. "morning joe" is coming right back. >> tech: when you have auto glass damage... choose safelite.

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most republicans, incluing me, believes when it comes to trump, there is no law. it is all about getting him. if they try to prosecute president trump for mishandling classified information, after hillary clinton set up a server in her basement, they literally will have riots in the street. i worry about our country. >> yeah, and lindsey is right to be worried about our country. if you listen to him, he doesn't believe the law applies to donald trump. when it comes to donald trump, there is no law. i know he was trying to claim that that was said in terms of democrats coming after him, but lindsey, lindsey is now -- and i guess this is where it always ends. >> yeah. >> you have violent rhetoric in your campaign speeches like donald trump has had. you threaten violence. you talk about the glory days of

beating people up and taking them out on stretchers. you tell people if they beat up protesters, you'll pay for their criminal defense. you praise members of congress that beat up reporters for asking questions about health care reform. you tell people to come to washington on january 6th, it will be wild. you praise them as patriots after they beat the hell out of law enforcement officers. after they chant at the top of their lungs, "hang mike pence." after mike pence hides in the basement and, actually, you have his secret service members actually calling home and saying good-bye to their families because they don't know if they'll survive the day. now it comes to this, where lindsey says, you hold donald trump to the same standard you'd hold lindsey graham or any other

member of the senate or any member of the house, there will be riots in the street. that's senator lindsey graham warning of violence in the street if donald trump is held to account for his mishandling of classified documents. if, mika, if we still believe in this constitutional republic, that no man is above the law. >> it is -- >> he obviously thinks donald trump is above the law. as he said, the law doesn't apply to him. that's what you call a freudian slip. >> two minutes past the top of the hour. this as we learn more about why the justice department searched the former president's resort three weeks ago. a resort where he lives, very public. the potential risks to national security and the investigation into possible obstruction. also this morning, we are watching kennedy space center, as nasa prepares to launch its most powerful rocket into orbit.

a key test run for the return to the moon efforts. we will carry it live if it happens on our watch. the weather might not cooperate. we shall see. we are watching. jonathan lemire is still with us. joining the conversation, we have the president of the national action network and host of "politics nation," reverend al sharpton. good to have you on board this morning. >> jonathan lemire, you've been following joe biden's problems. we've talked about his low approval ratings time and again. the numbers ticked up from 36 to 40. ticked up from 40 to 42. yesterday, there was a cbs poll out, showed he was at 45%. a gallup poll showed him at 44%. i do find it fascinating, and kind of humorous in a sort of

dorky, political way, for a nerd that follows politics too closely, that you still have republicans talking about joe biden's historically low approval ratings. well, his approval ratings are still historically low. if you take this poll or if you take, for instance, the gallup poll and you go back 50 years -- stay with me here -- you go back a half century, joe biden's numbers are actually higher than all of his predecessors at this point, or the same, other than george h.w. bush after the gulf war and george w. bush after 9/11. let me just say that again. obama had the same numbers. everybody else in the gallup poll going back 50 years have had lower approval ratings. now, should they be happy at

45%? no, they shouldn't be happy at 45%. do they have a lot of problems? yeah, they have a lot of problems. i'm just saying, you look at everything that's happened, and you look at the extremism on the republican side. i know a lot of people are saying, look at the great things the democrats are doing. they're making their list. i think so much of this is just driven by the fact that republicans, as i've been saying for six months now, are acting -- a lot of republicans are acting like insurrectionists, wackos, freaks. those republicans that are now running in pennsylvania, in arizona and other swing states. when that happens, independents look around and go, what the hell do i do? i don't like all his policies. it don't like the wackos on the far left. i sure as hell don't want to have to deal with these people that are making 10-year-old girls who are raped leave their

state. i sure don't like old men in state legislatures across the south and even across wisconsin telling women what they do with their health care, what health care choices they make. i sure as hell don't like the fact that republicans in michigan have put a woman in charge who says a 14-year-old girl being raped by your uncle is a perfect example of why we must give her no choice on her future. this is -- this is the republican party of 2022. the republican party after uvalde that, yes, there were, i think, ten republicans that stepped forward and took a modest but badly needed step, and i salute them. but so many other extremists in the party. >> took pictures of themselves. >> still saying 18-year-old wackos should be able to go in on their 18th birthday and buy weapons of war.

and hell with 90% of americans who say we should have universal background checks. we're for the gun maker, not the 90%. all this extremism, the january 6th extremism, now the mar-a-lago extremism, it's all adding up. this doesn't happen in a vacuum. >> we should note on the cbs poll, 45%, president biden's highest mark there since february. this is turning around what had been nearly a year-long slide. last august, the president's approval rating started to go south because of the delta variant and the early tumultuous days of the afghanistan withdrawal. it'd be slow and difficult to get that reversed. this is has been the white house theory all alone. senior aides felt like this was possible, that if they could end this, get to the spring and summer with a burst of legislative success, which they have, and we've been ticking

through it for weeks now, the number of victories, some bipartisan, some democrats only, that they've been able to put up on the scoreboard, that that'd help. they have democrats coming home. some of the more liberal, more progressives who have been disenchanted with some of the president's first two months, as the election approached, they'd rally around the standard bearer again. the last piece is this extremism of republicans who seem so out of step with the rest of the country. that's been put on full display this summer. you mentioned the mass shootings. we, of course, have the supreme court's decision to overturn roe v. wade. and we have republicans in the dramatic minority, what they hold as their view compared to the rest of the country. then the cherry on top is the fact that donald trump is in the headlines again, dominating the headlines with his behavior here, potentially criminal behavior, with these classified information. at minimum, it just reminds so many american voters just how tired they were of this guy. by the end of 2020, they were sofa so fatigued by trump

dominating every thought, that he was the only thing ever on television, they thought it was chaos, undemocratic, and they were done with it. inflation remains a pesky problem. democrats will be the first to tell you that. they're not taking anything for granted, but they feel good about where biden and the party stands heading into the midterms. >> rev, you look at a couple things that have passed or the president has signed. the student loan, the student loan relief. 54% approve. 46% disapprove. inflation reduction act, 55% approve. 45% disapprove. i have serious concerns with how the student debt relief bill was put -- or act was put together for, my god, a thousand reasons. none of which have anything to do with helping people out that are in a crunch. but, i mean, we have predatory

lending. we still have colleges that are hiking tuition rates at grotesque rates, and they have been for the past 20 years. you know, for my education, i think undergrad, i paid $500 a semester. paid for law school, $1,000 a semester. it is grotesque, how much these colleges are spending. i really would have preferred for, as big of a problem as this is, to have a more sweeping, a more global solution to this. because, right now, only thing you're doing, seems to me, pouring more gas onto the fire and telling colleges, "yeah, go ahead and hike your tuition up another 300% over the next 15, 20years." >> i think we can't underestimate the fact that 43 million americans, young people and some older that wanted to do the right thing, couldn't afford

it but went into college anyway and built up these -- this debt that has, in many cases, strangled them for decades, so they're the victims of their own good choice. i think that what president biden has proposed here is good. at the same time, i have to agree with you. we need a global solution to deal with the escalating and unfair rates that these colleges are getting away with. the predators that have exploited this. to put novocain into a situation to stop the pain on 43 million, you still have to go and get the root cavity out of the problem, which we haven't done. because the novocain will wear off, and you'll still have people getting into debt if you don't deal with all of the surrounding issues here. i agree with you in the long run, but i'm very happy to see that there's been some relief for some people that have been struggling for decades with bad

credit, couldn't buy homes, couldn't build their wealth, had bad credit scores, only because they wanted to do the right thing with their lives. we preach to people, don't do things that are street life in many of our communities. don't take bad choices. go to school. be somebody. they did. they ended up in debt, and there is a way we need to relieve it. >> while you're preaching, while you're preaching, let me remind you, jesus said to the woman at the well, where are your accusers now? and there were none. he said, i don't accuse you either. go and sin no more. turn over a new leaf. we need to say that to the predatory lenders. >> right. >> say that to the universities that are actually putting out degrees that are worthless in subjects that are worthless, that are raking in millions and millions of dollars. jonathan lemire, again, because

i'm a nerd and i have nothing better to do, i went to the google machine early this morning. i just wanted to see. i said, my god, i remember writing a $500 check when i went to university of alabama and handing it to them. that was tuition. now, it's like $36,000, $38,000. middle-class kids can't afford that, right? look at some of these i found. this is from 2016. mind you, the numbers are low here because, from 2016 to 2022, chances are good if these trends go along. it's just been jacked up even more. but in 2016, when kamala harris was a member of the senate, she went to howard. tuition then, 3,000. tuition in 2016, 23,000. increase of 251%. next slide, please, t.j.

next, bill cassidy. he went to lsu. a state you're in the deep south. like me, he paid about $450/500 for tuition. today, it's $7,800. a 526% hike. next slide, please, t.j. rand paul, baylor university. $2,900 in 1984. $29,000. a 441% increase in tuition. joe manchin, tuition, $232 then. now, it's been hiked up by 457%. you have mike rounds from south dakota. i wanted to get -- i wanted to get state colleges from across the country, from louisiana to west virginia, here in south dakota.

a 359% increase from when senator rounds went to south dakota state university to today. and for the elites, elite schools, if you go to yale university, like most republican populists did, yale or harvard or princeton, the tuition has been hiked 216%. these numbers are indefensible. i just -- my only point is this, jonathan lemire, like, go ahead. if you're going to do debt forgiveness, do it in a way that tells the universities, we're going to forgive this debt, but here's the deal, if you want universities to be able to take part in the loan program, state colleges, you're going to have a fixed fee. maybe it is a $5,000 tuition. private universities, $10,000. you don't like that? that's fine. you don't have to do it. you don't have to be part of the

federal loan program. we're no longer going to let you get rich off the backs of poor students, middle class students, and taxpayers. because these people have priced middle-class americans out of going to colleges and university, without the help of the federal government. then you add the predatory lending rates on top of that, and it's just -- the system is just a disaster. why do this withoutholisitc app? >> the system is badly broken. 526% increase? 447% increase. 251% increase. that is a sampling. it is a buburden. the criticism of what the biden administration did is it didn't address the predatory loans you mentioned. this is a white house known for its deliberate decision making process, and i'm being kind there. this one, in particular,

tortured this president and his inner circle. this was something that, yes, there was a campaign promise he wanted to address. biden himself, per reporting, per people i've talked to in the white house, had mixed feelings about this. wasn't sure if it was the right decision. if he were to do it, how far to go. this was the compromise that they came up with. it certainly didn't make everyone happy. there's some on the left who are angry about it, some on the right angry about it. others say, look, it is a good step. it is a good first start. we will see. i don't know that -- this is certainly not going to be the last time this white house and we have many conversation. it's a beginning, but it doesn't, you're right, it doesn't address sort of the overarching problems with an education system right now that is simply just either out of reach for so many americans or, if they make the decision to go for it, they're saddled can crippling debt, particularly for decades. >> i don't want to hear from republican hypocrites who have been bailing out the largest

banks on wall street who, themselves, have been bailed out in ppp loans. please, just stop the hypocrisy. again, i'm all for debt forgiveness if it is done in a way that fixes the system. this wasn't done that way. on top of that, mika, i've got to say, also, you and i have known people that have spent years working their tails off to pay back their student loans. >> yeah, i know. i do. >> it shouldn't be offensive for anybody out there to hear me saying this. people that have been playing by the rules and doing everything they can. i understand some people play by the rules, fall behind, and just can't catch up. i understand. the system is broken, and it needs to be fixed. i do wonder, what about the person who spent 10, 15 years doing everything they could to pay back the loans and finished it up, like, two or three months ago, then, suddenly, with the

wave of the hand, they're like, well, why did i do that? that's the biggest problem, also, a bigger problem, also. people taking out loans now are led to believe, well, i'll take out the loan. i won't have to repay it. the universities will say, "well, we can hike up tuition even more." >> that's what i'm worried about. >> they'll take out the loans, knowing they won't have to pay it anyway. >> yeah. >> we need to address this, and it needs to be done in a whoe ist wholistic manner. the documents former president donald trump took with him to his club, mar-a-lago, after leaving the white house. "the new york times" is reporting that the return of some documents by trump in january may have illustrated the need to recover all remaining documents as soon as they could. quote, when fbi agents in may went through 15 boxes of

material turned over to the national archives by mr. trump in january, a year after he left office, they quickly determined that they contained 184 documents marked as classified, including some labeled hcs, an especially troublesome revelation in the eyes of intelligence experts. according to a 2013 directive from the office of the director of national intelligence, the hcs designation is, quote, used to protect exceptionally fragile and unique, clandestine operations and methods that are not intended for dissemination outside of the originating agency. joining us now, one of the reporters on this story, washington investigative correspondent for "the new york times." mark, if you can tell us more about exactly how the documents were discovered in the up to 15

boxes, were they in the a clump? i saw one report that said they were sort of haphazardly strewn among all 15 boxes. >> yeah, it is our understanding that the documents themselves were scattered in several different boxes, amid a manner of other things, not including government documents, personal effects, et cetera. that was the first job of the fbi agents at the scene, was to recover the documents. then they start going through them to sort of make sense of why they were taken and also put them into categories of what are the most sensitive. what documents contain secrets that are the most damaging if they were to get into the wrong hands? this initial assessment that goes on and then is ongoing now because the director of national intelligence announced over the weekend they're going to do

their own damage assessment, security assessment, to sort of determine what could have gone lost or what damage might have been done if the secrets did get into the wrong hands. >> mark, the trump orbit's explanations for having those documents there have shifted quite a bit. one of which was that former president had his blanket declassification order. now, we should note, there is no sense that's true. a number of former white house staffers said they never heard of it, including former national security adviser john bolton, who had a position where you think he would have if such a thing existed. let's just say, for the sake of argument, that is the case. but if there are hcs documents, human intelligence control system, which potentially could reveal the identities of cia informants and others of the most sensitive and dangerous -- people who face the most dangerous situations in our government, how just incredibly risky is this? >> well, you know, documents are

marked like hcs, et cetera, based on the sensitivity of the information in the documents, right? because, you know, the more sensitive the information, the tighter the circle of people who can see the documents. hcs documents, you know, might not and probably don't name the actual informants, sources that the cia and other agenies use for information. the president wouldn't necessarily have to have that information, this president or any president. but the more information that is provided about a source, if it were to get into the wrong hands or potentially get back to the government where the espionage was taking place, there could be a process of elimination that could narrow down the identity source. the devil is in the details, of course, but there is a reason that they do mark things as such, because they are, you know, concerned of the -- about the safety and identities of the

people who risk their lives to provide information. >> all right. mark mezzeti of "the new york times," thank you so much for your reporting. rev, i'd love to get your insights on the republicans, what the republicans are doing. lindsey graham threatening violence, saying there will be riots in the street if donald trump is held to the same standard as, say, oh, i don't know, lindsey graham. if lindsey took -- let me get these numbers right. if lindsey took 184 documents with classified markings when he left the united states senate, if 25 of those documents were marked top secret, if 67 of the documents were marked confidential, if 92 of those documents were marked secret, and if lindsey took them home to wherever he lives in south carolina, let's just say in a

condo in hilton head, he would get up to the top of his condo in hilton head and look over the ocean. before he could sit down on his couch, there would be a knock at the door. it'd be fbi agents saying, "senator graham, you'll need to come with us." like, nobody would get away with this. >> no, but -- >> this would put lindsey graham in jail. this would put any member of the house, kevin mccarthy, in jail. this would put anybody that works in government in jail. what does lindsey say? what is lindsey's response? oh, you told donald trump to the law, there are going to be riots in the street. >> no one would get away with taking these kind of documents. what is more disturbing to me is what you raise, and that is, it seems that senator graham is not

concerned about the intelligence being confidential, that protects american lives. he is predicting violence rather than looking at the violence that could occur if those documents got into the wrong hands and was against the interest of america. so senator graham, what is your priority? protecting american interests, protecting our intelligence, or having some thugs and hoodlums get angry because someone that was careless or criminal or both may have put us in jeopardy? i fail to see where the senator's concerns are. you're absolutely right, it is a double standard. even beyond that, didn't people in south carolina send him to washington to protect their interests rather than say, wait a minute now, if you protect our interest, people will get mad and burn the streets down. i mean, i don't think that's what you go to the u.s. senate to try to do for the people of south carolina.

>> this just doesn't end well. i don't understand senator graham, senator blunt, all the others. i mean, you know that you're wondering, and this is basic, you're wondering what those documents were doing there. you're wondering what a former president would do with documents like that in his club where people from around the world come to party with him. you know that he's had questionable -- and this is at best -- questionable meetings and appearances on the world stage with dictators. private meetings with putin with no notetaker. kim jong-un. you even admitted, the former president, on television that you would take dirt on a political rival. you would shake down a world leader for it. lindsey graham has no question about what these sensitive documents were doing in the basement of mar-a-lago? it defies logic. that's the thing, he's not

stupid. he knows this is a big question of national security. this is not drama. this is not overreaction. this is not exaggeration. this is not the left going crazy. it's just not. you know it is a question, what the hell were those documents doing in the basement of mar-a-lago? and you're a bold-faced liar if you say you don't have that question. and you jump, eagerly, like a fly to fly paper to hillary clinton's emails. it's pathetic. it's also really bad for this country. and, yes, there may be violence, none of us like this, none of us wanted this. true patriots who love this country, love our democracy, love the process and the rule of law that makes us great, we don't like what's happening. we're not taking any joy in this.

the question is why would you still shill for someone who has embarrassed you time and time again. >> yeah, you know, actually, he said he was off the trump train. >> he's not. >> that he stepped off after january 6th. after those riots. he cared about the riots until three people and a hound dog chased him in washington national airport, then he got right back on the train. it's fascinating that he talks about riots. jonathan lemire, i don't have a really good memory, i can't remember, but i think we had riots on january 6th. and when you had leaders trying to get people like lindsey graham to support an investigation into those riots, he had no interest in that. had no interest in investigating those riots. but, now, he is worried about riots in the future, coming from republicans, coming from his party, coming from donald trump

supporters? again, also, the irony is so rich, these people that talked about riots, black lives matter riots, it's all they talk about. seriously, it acts as if there were no peaceful marches at all. riots, riots, it's all they talk about. yet, they're fine when trump riots are actually putting democracy at risk. when they're trying to overturn an election result. lindsey is even fine threatening riots, saying, you know, trump supporters will riot in the streets. there will be violence if he is held to account. if he broke the law. it's great. again, this party of law and order, this supposed party of law and order that's saying, de-fund the fbi, that's calling law enforcement officials the gestapo, that are now threatening riots. lindsey is now threatening

republican riots in the street if donald trump is held to the same standard as lindsey graham or anybody else in the senate or house. this is a hell of a transformation over the past two years. >> yeah, it was barely 18 months ago when we had riots. riots at the u.s. capitol, the very citadel of our democracy. riots fueled by that man, donald trump, and his allies who, for months, lied about te election and whipped up his supporters into acts of violence. it does feel like we're heading down a similar path. the dog whistles, the breadcrumbs, almost invitations to violence we're hearing from republicans, something bad could go down if donald trump is indicted. it's dangerous stuff. we talked earlier about how we know there's been a remarkable spike in threats against law enforcement officers in the wake of the law enforcement search. and we've now been living with, in the january 6th environment, the most normalization of

discourse in our country, at least in a century and a and a half. that's something a lot of intelligence agents and law enforcement personnel and law makers are worried about. violence that could come with the midterms and certainly the 2024 election. comments like this from senator graham are kicking the hornet's nest and stirring up more trouble. deeply disturbing. >> well, and, of course, the greatest risk, mika, is caving to the threats. >> yeah. >> all right, okay. lindsey, if you are trying to stir up republican riots, if you think republicans are going to riot in the street, republicans are going to riot in the street. they're not above the law. they'll be arrested. >> we've already seen this. >> they'll go through the same thing that -- >> go to jail. >> -- people who listened to donald trump on january 6th are going through.

if you break the law, you're held to account. if the answer to republicans threatening violence on the fbi, the answer to republicans threatening violence in the streets. it's not backing down. it's holding those people accountable, just like you hold donald trump accountable -- >> and if these -- >> if they break the law. >> if these republicans were true leaders -- >> they're not. >> and the true focus was the united states of america was serch serving our country, they would lead and say, when someone has done something wrong, when someone has threatened our democracy, when top secret documents that threaten our nation and lives are being stolen from our u.s. government, from our country, one must be held to account. >> yeah. >> please be peaceful. >> you know what it is saying? >> don't threaten violence. >> you know what?

let this investigation run its course. they'd say what we've been saying. nuclear secrets? we have no evidence of nuclear secrets. there's a source that told "the washington post" there were nuclear secrets. i don't -- i don't see any evidence of nuclear secrets. nothing in the papers that say nuclear secrets. the left needs to wait. the right needs to wait. let the process run its course. for the "wall street journal" editorial page to say, is this all there is? they know that's not all there is. let's let it run its course. maybe, maybe there's some serious, serious damage to america's national intelligence. maybe there's not. we have to wait and see. we need to let justice run its course. something that republicans, like lindsey graham, obviously think are a threat to their party.

>> all right. still ahead on "morning joe," could democrats actually maintain control of the house in november? we have new analysis from "the washington post" on that. plus, maryland's republican governor, larry hogan, says of his party's pick to be his successor, quote, this guy should not be the nominee. he shouldn't be governor. what that says about the kinds of candidates the republican party has chosen this election cycle. >> that's really not good from your own party. >> you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. >> yikes. the unknown is not empty. it's a storm that crashes, and consumes, replacing thought with worry. but one thing can calm uncertainty. an answer. uncovered through exploration, teamwork, and innovation.

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i'm not getting involved in endorsing in the race. this isn't just maryland, this is happening across the country. it is why mitch mcconnell is saying we may not win the senate. it is why we were hoping to pick up seats in governors' races and now we're not. if republicans are to get any power back, we'll have to start talking about the issues people care about and not relitigating what happened in 2020 or, you know, defying things that are fact. this should be a really huge year for republicans, just because of the failures of the democrats who are in control of everything and biden's low approval ratings. we could blow it by nominating unelectable people. that's exactly what's happening across the country, and why the wave is going to be more of a ripple rather than a tidal wave. >> maryland's republican governor larry hogan speaking yesterday with cbs news. a supe pac aligned with mitch mcconnell is cancelling nearly $10 million of ad buys in as and alaska. the move is raising questions about the party's confidence in

blake masters, who is hoping to unseat arizona's democratic senator mark kelly in november. according to "politico," the pac's strategic shift away from arizona is due, in part, to a massive $28 million commitment to ohio's senate race. jd vance is facing a opponent in tim ryan. quote, we're leaving the door wide open in arizona, and we want to move additional resources to other offensive opportunities that have become increasingly competitive. joining us now, "washington post" national reporter covering the white house, out with new reporting titled, "democrats see the once unthinkable: a narrow path to keeping the house." annie, is it possible? >> possible, yes. i think likely is still kind of

up in the air. but it's new to think that democrats holding the house is even possible. just six months ago, there was a sense that there would be a complete wipeout in the house and the senate for democrats. that thinking has really shifted, as you pointed out, with the senate. now, that's sort of -- some similar dynamics are impacting house races. so there's talk and some action among democrats, you know, to posture differently. there is a possibility of having fewer losses or even a narrow possibility to holding on to that chamber. >> you know, annie, it's been interesting through the years. the conventional wisdom has been, and i've seen it in elections, sure you have, too, that on the issue of abortion, that drives the right. it drives single issue voters more than the left because somebody can be pro-choice and mean a lot to them.

they're also focused on the environment and other issues. in this case, though, i have been surprised, post dobbs, post kansas, just to the degree that we're seeing shifts in individual races, even in arizona where you have blake masters changing the language on his website to not be as offensive to pro-choice voters as he had in there. how much is dobbs seeming -- and, again, we're at the end of august. long way to go. at this point, how much is dobbs reshaping the political landscape out there? >> it absolutely is. to your point, it has been a surprise, both to democratic strategists and republican strategists, who initially believe the dobbs decision would have a minor impact around the margins. what's happened is democrats have done a fairly good job, if you measure it by the recent special elections and house races, of packaging dobbs as

part of a broader theme of republican extremism. they put dobbs, you know, gun control, the january 6th hearings all in one bucket. that's having an impact in the house landscape and a political landscape. when you think of the changes and things of the senate races, a lot of that is due to some of these candidates coming out of the senate, the primaries, as being much more extreme. when you look at house races, the candidates are just less well-known, and it is more of a measure of the landscape. you would expect that landscape to be tracking president biden's still low approval ratings. instead, there is a different phenomenon happening, to where these house democratic candidates are separating themselves from the president. democratic strategists i talk to, democratic house leaders are baffled by this, but they do point to political shifts, like

dobbs being the primary one, as sort of changing the way the electorate is thinking. perhaps, especially if the election is held now, which it is not, but it is more of a referendum on the supreme court than joe biden. >> you know, it's fascinate, even before joe biden's numbers jumped from the 30s in some poles to 45 in cbs, there is a growing disconnect between the president's approval rating and what we'd see in the generic ballot for members of congress. that was fascinating, too. i'm wondering, as you heard the lead-up to your segment, any insight you could give us. it is fascinating, they're taking money out of blake masters' race, which they felt was going to be very competitive. putting it into jd vance's race, with ohio becoming redder by the day. they didn't think that'd be competitive. dr. oz, it look like he has been thrown over the side. they may be even giving up in

pennsylvania. talk t talk about how donald trump endorsed candidats have caused much of the shift you're talking about right now. >> yeah, the idea that republicans need to spend their own -- nearly $30 million of their money defending a seat in ohio, i mean, this is a state that donald trump won by, i believe, nine points, nearly ten points. walking in, you know, six months ago, the feeling among republicans is this is going to be really easy. whomever comes out of the republican primary in ohio is going to be a senator. you know, it was a bruising republican primary. clearly, they have not coalesced their party in ohio. then congressman tim ryan, one republican keeps telling me, tim ryan, a democrat, is running as

a working class republican. they've been saying, we're having a really hard time running against a working class republican in ohio. which is, you know, their backhanded compliment to the campaign that tim ryan has been running, which has been issues-oriented and sort of pocketbook issues oriented. that's a very unexpected place for republicans to spend money. also, vance has had a lot of trouble raising money on his own. it is really telling that republicans are having to spend that kind of money in a place that ought to be a pretty safe seat for them. >> yeah. i mean, who can imagine a candidate who comes from silicon valley, praises san francisco, praises the elites in silicon valley, suddenly having problems when he transplants himself back to ohio. "the washington post"'s annie

linskey, appreciate it. rev, we're seeing a shift in biden's approval ratings and in the generic ballot. i want to warn everybody, we're not even at labor day. i mean, when i was running, i ran four campaigns for congress, everything was preseason until after labor day, after the kids were back in school, after everybody was back, settled in at work. i didn't think anything counted until after labor day. i know with early voting, that's not exactly the case now. we're not too far, in some states, from that. but i, still, we're seeing some shifts toward the democrats. they actually think they have a shot to do better in the house than expected. i'd be stunned if they took over the house, given the history. one of the big problems you've been talking about has been the disconnect between people of color and the president of the united states, people of color and democrats. they didn't feel they were following through on promises.

those numbers are going up, and the numbers are going up among democrats and, to some degree, people of color. what's going on? >> i think that people are beginning to sense that the president is trying to move in terms of keeping some of the commitments he made. so there has been large disappointment that we did not get the john lewis voter bill through the senate. it got through the congress, through the house, but not the senate. the george floyd bill didn't get through. but the president did come with an executive order to put some of what would have been in george floyd in the executive order. it doesn't do everything, but it shows there's an effort there. i think that the student debt forgiveness addresses a commitment he made. that means a lot to the base. i think what we saw in the inflation reduction act addresses some of the climate change situation.

there is disportiondisportionat in black community. that's where we have higher asthma rates. even though we don't get everything we want, the effort is the reason i think you're seeing him begin to gradually i the polls among black voters and others, we want to know even if he can't win everything for us that he's in there fighting for us. i think the problem is, as you said, post-labor day, you're going to have to keep doing that and you can't underestimate the new pediments that have been put by state legislatures particularly in the south they have made voting even more difficult. you'll have to raise the enthusiasm level because a lot of us on the ground that are nonpartisan are saying to people it's not going to be as simple as it was the last time you

voted. we got to be able to drive them out and biden's going to have to motivate them to come out. we'll talk about this and the partially redacted affidavit of the search of former president trump's mal mal, where he lives, we'll talk with this with congressman david ciccilline. we earned our benefits. just like people earned their social security and medicare benefits. but republicans in congress have a plan to end so-called "entitlements" in just five years. social security, medicare, even veterans benefits. go online and read the republican plan for yourself. joe biden is fighting to protect social security, medicare and veterans benefits. call joe biden and tell him to keep fighting for our benefits. ♪♪ with 20 made-to-order griddle combos, there's a perfect plate for everyone.

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hey, thanks! we got a muffin for ed! all right! you don't need those calories. can we at least split it? nope. advanced security that helps protect your devices in and out of the home. i mean, can i have a bite? only from xfinity. nah. unbeatable internet. made to do anything so you can do anything. welcome back to "morning joe." five minutes before the top of the hour, let's bring in democratic congressman david cicilline of rhode island, a member of the house judiciary and foreign affairs committee and author of a new book out tomorrow, titled "house on fire." a title that's quite appropriate for the conversation today, congressman, i'll start by asking you, what do you make of

some of your republican counterparts who are saying, listen, this, you know, harassing of the former president of the fbi and everybody else, about these documents and if you go further, be careful, there will be violence, you can't have this. i mean, can it be determined at this point what we know so far is that these documents were there and that former president donald trump was actually in negotiations through his attorneys with the national archives and others to return them, fair enough to ask, what were the documents doing there in the first place? >> yeah, absolutely right, it's good to be with you. the whole point of my book, we're living in a very dangerous time, this book is really about sounding the alarm of the dangers of this kind of authoritarian leadership, you know, this fascist ideology where any conduct can be explained away, this is very

dangerous. it was written to sound the alarm to make the defense of our democracy a top priority, because we're living in a very dangerous time and the ability of my republican colleagues to continue to excuse and make up excuses for the really horrific conduct of the former president is hard to comprehend sometimes but that's very typical of this kind of leader, where the truth doesn't matter, you stoke fear and victimization, the checklist of authoritarian leaders, you can go down that list, it describes the former president, a call for all of the people of this country to respond to this and stand up and defend our democracy. in the end on it was the people of providence who said enough is enough to the corruption and the leadership that was there and elected me, elected new leadership, that's the moment we're in, the american people need to say enough is enough and reject this kind of leadership

and protect the future of our democracy. >> talking here at the break and you were saying that painting the republicans the party of extremism, blind loyalty to a president. part of the democrats' winning argument this fall. the growing optimism the party may be able to keep the house, do you share that optimism and what is -- how do tell the american people we're the party you should pick as opposed to the others guys? >> we have to reinforce and remind the others that we have gotten done for the american people, the american rescue plan, to the chips act, inflation reduction act, gun safety, remind people every step of the way that republicans were against every single piece that protect our economy and at the same time you remind them of all

we delivered. the republicans have been the party of corruption and chaos and insurrection and qanon and marjorie taylor green and the big lie, so it's both reminding people democrats have gotten done, which i think you're seeing now, and reminding them of what the alternative is, it's a scary perilous party. >> congressman, and i agree with you about the accomplishments and the achievements need to part of the messaging, but what captures my attention is the title of your book, do you think people understand that basic democracy is at stake here, we're talking about, now, people that literally would say you're elected by mob rule, if we don't agree with the numbers we just get a mob and we stop the count and we turn it over, i mean,

right or left, we should all agree that there's basic things that we do in a democracy. >> i think you're exactly right. one of the reasons i wrote the book. i don't think people fully appreciate the danger we're in and how perilous a time we're living in and what i articulate in the book is how we got here, my experience as a citizen and a mayor and now a member of congress. part of this is to really sound the alarm. this moment is so perilous and that we have a responsibility to do everything we can to make certain people understand the danger we're in and make the defense of the institutions of democracy our most basic priority in this midterm election. >> the new book is "house on fire." congressman david cicilline,

thank you very much for being on this morning. you're looking at live pictures from kennedy space center in florida, where nasa looks to kick-start its return to the moon with its most powerful rocket yet, the window to launch is supposed to open within the next half-hour, but fueling issues and the weather have both put this morning's scheduled launch into question. we'll update you as soon as nasa announces its plans. but first, this morning's new developments with the fbi's search of former president trump's south florida resort where he lives, the heavily redacted affidavit used to support the search has revealed new details on the sheer volume of classified documents stored at mal mal and is raising new questions about national security. kelly o'donnell has more. >> reporter: this morning, the latest twist on the trump fbi

search, two separate moves for mal mal damage control. first, the director of national intelligence has told key leaders in congress that she's launched an assessment of the potential risk to national security, if secrets seized from the former president's home had been compromised, 11 sets of classified documents were removed in the search, plus another 184 classified document recovered earlier as described in the affidavit. democrats say that danger is real. >> he could be putting our national security at risk, he could be putting lives of individual people who worked for the united states at risk. >> reporter: the second legal twist, a florida federal judge appointed by president trump writes that she's prepared to grant his request, a special master, ind pin dent official to review everything seized by the fbi the judge also wants a more detailed list of what was

removed and where those documents are now. judge cannon is giving the doj until tomorrow to respond. some republicans say more oversight of this investigation is needed. >> if you're going to take unprecedented action and raid a former president's house you must have a strategy for unprecedented transparency. >> turned over a lot of documents, should have turned over a lot of them. >> up to doj whether that reaches a level of indictment. this is disgusting in my mind and like, no president should act this way, obviously. >> reporter: still mr. trump's allies warn that a move by doj could be meant with major backlash. >> if there's a prosecution of donald trump for mishandling classified information there will be riots in the streets. >> joining us now -- >> there's the threat, if donald

trump is held to the same standard as every other elected official, lindsey says there will be riots in the streets by republicans, trump supporters, the republican party now is the party of rioters, party of riots in the street. lindsey says if you're a republican out there you should be offended. lot of people were offended by what joe biden said about maga republicans being semi-fascists. what lindsey is saying you're all rioters, go out in streets and riot. if donald trump is held to the same standard as you. if in our constitutional republic in 2022 no man is above the law. lindsey's getting ahead of him, isn't he? >> probably. >> senators saying, look, we need to wait. >> yeah. >> and see what's in documents.

>> joining us now mark and congressional reporter for the guardian hugo lowell. >> thank you so much for being with us. mark, i'm glad that intel officials are looking at this, i'm not an expert in this stuff, you are for the most part, but when i look at the redacted affidavit, i see a redacted affidavit and i need to know more, what about you? i'm hearing people on the left saying, talking about nuclear secrets and a meltdown of human intelligence, people on the right saying it's much ado about nothing, most of us confused by the back and forth because we don't know what the hell's in there? >> that's right, joe, i think to what my boss used to say, patience, grasshopper, which means, let's slow down right

now. she's going to take a look at what's in those documents, it makes a lot of us really nervous. i ran agents for cia for 2.5 decades, a russian, a japanese, agrees to spy for the united states, a sacred bond wean the cia and that agent and that's to keep their identity secret. the notion there's possibly compromising information is really serious. we have to let the investigation play out. both senators warren and rubio called for this investigation, called for this dni assessment. that's a good thing to get to the bottom if there was

compromise. >> the question, why any of these documents were in mal mal and that there was negotiations between the national archives and trump's people about returning them, the trump end of this clearly adding to the vault dags that these documents were there and the question is, why, why were any of them there? why would the president of the united states take something that's not him, that belongs to the united states government, classified, top secret, all the different labels, why does we have them? hugo you have reported on the redacted affidavit, quote, specific mentions of private areas at mal mal, for instance, pine hall, a foyer to trump's residence not particularly widely known, suggests the fb had close operational knowledge from a source about where documents were being kept or moved.

what more can you tell us about that. >> the fact that pine hall was mentioned, you know, among other places, was really interesting, pine hall an entrance way that leads into trump's area so the fact that the fbi has pinpointed that location suggests to me and certainly to people around the former president that the fbi has someone on the inside, someone close to trump himself or around his family that knows the kind of documents that were being left around them, that spooked them to have that level of detail and knowledge, it's not going to come from people from the help or the staff, that close quarters to the former president. >> hugo, first of all, as you said, identify who's cooperating, just the frustration about their

inability to mount a real strong legal team, they haven't been able to have those team of killers, to quote the former president, and how worried are that inability comes as his legal peril rises by the day. >> look, i think a lot of this is coming from the fact that trump's lawyers don't know where the justice department wants to go next. the espionage act, classified documents at mal mal, they're also monitoring the obstruction side. that's where lawyers are very nervous. it sounds having the former president's lawyers witnesses to that because of their interactions with the justice department and that's indeck tiff of the general inability to find defense here. >> the fact he's fighting -- i'm

talking about trump -- giving two, three different stories on why the documents were there, doesn't that raise the feeling there may be something that might amount to nothing, fighting hard and running out different scenarios that makes many of that were like not convinced one way or another, feel he wouldn't be fighting as hard if there wasn't something there. >> if there was an easy explanation for why these documents were there, if he had a straightforward defense like there was pure incompetence, he should just that, he would just say that, the fact that he has to go through these different iterations and complaints about the justice department seems to be indicative of the fact he's not quite sure what the most

effective tactic might be. this is why you get the different arguments and none of them really stick. >> so, mark, what can you, obviously we've already say we're not sure what's in there, there's no way we can tell if there's been damage, it's great there's going to be an intel assessment, very positive step you have democrats and republicans asking for that, a reasonable, responsible thing to do. this special master, lot of nonpartisan legal analysts who said this wouldn't be a bad thing for the sake of transparency, but, mark, what did you see in the affidavit that, that caused you concern? so anything specific that you're focusing on, that you want to learn about, because of concerns

it may have? >> well, joe, absolutely, because we're talking about documents and the irony and of course you mentioned it earlier this morning, you know, this crowd, it's just documents, is that all there is? documentary intelligence collection that's the apex of what we do, you know, documents are what, you know, allowed the soviet union to steal our nuclear secrets, they developed an atomic bomb because u.s. spies gave them documents and so when you have something of that nature that's when the hair goes up on the back of your head, what's in that document? is it something that could reveal the identify of a cia agent? someone we could recruited overseas? reversed engineer what in those documents and catch agents of ours who as i mentioned before there's a sacred bond we have

with these individuals. nothing more important than our ability to protect them. to me that was most telling there are documents and that kind of is something that's got to be looked into, because at the end of the day, that's what spies to do is steal information. >> thank you both very much for being on this morning. we're waiting for word on launch of nasa's artemis 1. right now the mission is an unscheduled hold. joining us now is with the very latest is jacob ward. >> reporter: it seems to be a combination, as you mentioned, the countdown clock has been held at 40 minutes.

supposedly at this hour the team in charge of the extraordinary job of using liquefied fuel putting it in the rocket they're meeting with the launch director because we're having trouble with engine 3 of 4, they have to be held at their boiling point, and they're having trouble maintaining pressure, getting flow of hydrogen through that third engine, this is an engine we have used before, recycled from the shuttle program, this is not necessarily new technology, it has to work perfectly as we know, dreams of talking about people on the moon again what we'll discover there, dragged back to earthly matters very unlikely at this point that the rocket is going to go up as planned at 8:33. >> all right, jacob ward, thank

you very much for the latest update. a look now at few of the morning papers. in new york, the times union reports that health officials are warning of expanding community spread of the polio virus after it was found in wastewater sample. officials on friday announced the virus was detected in four samples from sullivan county, two of which were collected this month, that's just to the northwest of rockland county where officials in july discovered the first case of polio in the u.s. in nearly a decade. the nevada secretary of state's office has approved regulations for counties to hand count votes beginning as soon as this november's midterm elections the rules require bipartisan teams of at least four people to count the votes, it also mandates spacing between tables and requires room for

observers, state officials say teams will be allowed to count batches of 50 votes at a time the new regulations are expected to take effect in october. in north carolina, fuel shortage causing concern in the northeast, a new report found that dee several fuel and heating oil supplies are more than 60% below the five-year average in new england. gasoline levels are also at their lowest in nearly a decade along the entire east coast. an extreme weather event could spark supply disruptions. serena williams takes the court tonight in the final tournament of her legendary career, the first-round matchup pits her against the 80th ranked player in world, if she wins she'll face the two of-seeded player in the second round.

williams announced she was walking away from the sport, telling vogue, quote, i have never liked the word retirement, it doesn't feel like a modern word to me. maybe the best word to describe it is evolution. 23 grand slam titles, the most of any player in the open era. it's fitting that she'll finish her career at the u.s. open since that's where she won her first grand slam, 23 years ago, back in 1999, when she was just 17 years old. williams defeated five past or future major champions in that tournament. >> reverend al, there's of course people talking about how she's changed tennis but she's done so much more than that. >> she has, she's not only changed tennis, she set a high

bar of achievement of showing how someone can come in an area that she was not expected to dominate as she has done, she and her sister have been phenomenal. when i was a boy preacher going up in brooklyn, althea franklin came to our church and for me to see the trajectory in this country to go from althea gibson to the williams sister and serena shows how far we have come. handled it with grace and dignity. she walks away with dignity and i think we should all be proud

of her. >> extraordinarily role model and inspiration and okay player and between the lines, joe, sets a record for grand slams in the open era, 23, she's not just a tennis legend but belongs on the short list of sports legends known by just one name, jordan, brady, gretzky, it's serena, she's there in that conversation and a few others. the u.s. open one of the best sporting events of this year kicks off today. great to see her make a push. >> it really would. >> i can't see what her next act is. up next, historian jon meachem reacts to lindsey graham's threat that there will be riots if donald trump is arrested. >> if donald trump is held to the same standard as us.

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♪ call owondnder whahatmy c cas. eight million ♪ so i called the barnes firm. i'm rich barnes. youour cidedentase e woh than insurance offered? call the barnes firm now to find out. yoyou ght t beurprpris jon, i want to go back we've been talking about the violence that and the threats that the men and the women of the fbi are enduring right now, that the national archives head is, is in fear of right now. you know, joe biden talked about maga trumpists, maga republicans, the most extreme trump supporters being

semi-fsacists. there were those who were offended. we talked about the extreme maga republicans. but i just, again, i'm -- maybe i'm a little fuzzy on what exactly fascism if you make threats of violence saying hold our leader to the same standards that you hold everybody else leaders to there will be threat of violence, act of violence we saw on january 6th, donald trump calling people to washington saying it was going to be wild, we know that's what the january 6th has shown us, he was calling people there to do exactly what they did and the use of violence to achieve political ends. which is exactly what was going

on, on january 6th, donald trump and the mob wanted to stop the counting of the electoral votes on january 6th, a constitutionally mandated act that congress is supposed to do every four years. it's -- you then talk all of trump's fascist rhetoric during companies talking about beating the hell out of them, carrying protesters out on a stretcher, beat them up, i'll pay for your legal defense, telling cops, bang criminals' heads on top of what he called paddywagons. i must say, actually, for the most extreme semi-fascist leads me to the question, what's semi

about that? it's full-on fascism. >> the president speaks for the president in full disclosure mode as you know, president biden's my friend, i help him when i can so everything i'm about to say should be seen in that context. he was calling it as he saw it. again, he speaks for himself, but what else would one take away from the last five years ix six years or so of american politics but that, there's an extraordinary number of people who have designs on or have been brought along on a kind of tide to undo the constitutional conversation in favor of their own vision of power, that's what

this is and what, you know, fascism, autocracy trends, you know, we could spend the rest of the day whiteboarding as we say that. but the point is that the republican party, the party of eisenhower, reagan, ford, bush, romney, mccain, a party -- a party founded in the mid-1850s to oppose the spread of slavery to the territories, that party has been hijacked and lots of debate about that -- but it's now a vehicle for this autocratic personality who overrides the rule of law, who explicitly would prefer to be in power as opposed to following constitutional principle and an

extraordinary number of americans have proven willing to support him the great question for the future of the country is how big is that number? how big is that number? and so my -- my question is, i think this is a moral crisis as much as it is a legal one, joe, we know endless numbers of republicans who are all over this, right, some are all-in with trump, some are embarrassed about it, all these grade dagss of this. at the end of the day, are they willing to do something and maybe it comes down to just voting, maybe no polls shows it, maybe it's going to end up being in that voting season, where they say, enough, the problem is, you probably got, i don't

know if it's 40%, i don't know what the number is, you've got a lot of true believers and you have their opportunistic enablers. and that's the moral crisis, right, if you're putting your own position, your own fund-raising, your own re-election above the constitutional experiment, then what are we talking about here? we're not talking about american democracy as give and take, we're talking about it only as take. coming up, the latest on the war if ukraine and the nuclear power plant caught in the crossfire what the u.n. is saying about the potential threat next on "morning joe." moderate to severe eczema still disrupts my skin.

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new shelling near a nuclear plant in ukraine over the weekend have officials on high alert. last weekend, the plant, europe's largest nuclear facility was cut off from ukraine's power grid, causing a massive power outage and prompting international fears of a potential radiation disaster. this week inspectors from the u.n. nuclear watchdog are expected to visit the russian occupied plant. joining us from odesa, ukraine is megan fitzgerald. what's the latest. >> reporter: we're expecting to see those inspectors inside the zaporizhzhia by the end of this week at the latest. you know, once they're there, we expect them to do is to look at everything from the structural integrity of this plant, paying close attention to the damage

that's done, assess those workers who are inside that facility. ukrainian officials saying are there are ukrai ukrainians work. the concern is that increased shelling in the area could contribute to nuclear meltdown, we're seeing radio active materials seepg out of that plant and really just decimating across the continent, so ukrainian officials this weekend they're not taking any chances they have distributed already these iodine pills to people in the area out of an abundance of caution, they're monitoring the levels in area should they need to take it they'll let them know, all coming as shelling continues in and around the zaporizhzhia nuclear plant, over the weekend the russians are saying that the ukrainians hit the plant, the ukrainians are

saying it's the russians. the fire because of shelling broke out near the plant, causing the plant to run off these backup dee several fuel-running generators. the question how much dee several the russians have in their pile at the facility? that's why this is creating such a concern here globally. all eyes will be watching as inspectors make their way into that facility by the end of the week. >> thank you very much. coming up, we'll go live to the white house for president biden's week ahead. kelly o'donnell joins us. plus, honoring an american hero who helped bring freedom to france near the end of world war ii. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

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you look at a couple of things that have passed, or that the president has signed the student loan, the student loan relief, 54% approve, 46% disapprove the inflation reduction act, 55% approve, 45% disapprove. i have serious concerns with how the student debt relief bill was put together -- the act was put together for my god a thousand reasons, none of which have anything to do with helping people out that are in a crunch, we still have predatory lending, colleges that are hiking tuition rates for the past 20 years, for my education, think undergrad i

paid $500 a semester and for law school, $1,000 a semester. i really would have preferred for as big a problem this is to have a more sweeping, a more global solution to this, because right now, only thing you're doing is pouring it seems to me, pouring more, more gas on to the fire and just telling colleges, yeah, go ahead and hike your tuition up another 3% over the next 15, 20 years. >> we can't underestimate the fact that 43 million americans, young people, and some older, that wanted to do the right thing couldn't afford it but went to college anyway and built up this debt that has in many cases strangled them for decades, they're the victims of their own good choice and i

think that what president biden has proposed is good. at the same time i have to agree with you, we need a global solution to deal with the escalating and unfair rates that these colleges are getting away with, the predators that have exploited this and to put november kane into the situation to stop the pain on 43 million, you have to get the root cavity out of the problem. you still have people getting into debt if you don't deal with all the surrounding issues here, so i agree with you in the long run but i'm very happy to see that there's been some relief for some people who have been struggling for decades with bad credits, couldn't buy homes, had bad credit scores. we preached to people don't take

bad choices. go to school and be somebody. they did and they ended up in debt. >> while you're preaching, while you're preaching, let me remind you, jesus said, where are your accusers now? there were none, he said, i don't accuse you either, go and say no more. turn over a new leaf. we need to say that to the predatory lenders, to the universities that are actually putting out degrees that are worthless in subjects that are worthless that are raking in millions and millions of dollars and jonathan lemire, again, because i'm a nerd and i have nothing better to do, i went to the google machine early this morning and i just wanted to see, because, my god, i remember

writing a $500 check when i went to university of alabama, that was tuition, now it's like 36,000, 38,000, so, look at some of these -- this is from 2016, mind you, the numbers are low here, because from 2016 to 2022 chances are good if these trends go along it's just been jacked up even more. in 2016 when kamala harris was a member of the senate she went to howard, tuition then, $3,000. tuition in 2016, 23,000. next slide, bill cassidy, he went to lsu, a state university in the deep south, like me he paid $450, $500 for tuition.

today it's 7,820. 526 .hike. next slide, rand paul, baylor university, was 2900 in 1984. 29,000, now, a 441% increase in tuition. joe manchin, tuition, $232 then, and now, it's been hiked up by 457%. you have mike rounds from south dakota -- and i wanted to get state colleges from across the country, from louisiana to west virginia, here in south dakota, 359% increase from when senator rounds went to south dakota state university to today. and for the elites, elite schools, yale university, like

most republican populists did, yale, harvard, the tuition has been hiked 216%, these numbers are indefensible and i just -- my only point is this, jonathan, go ahead f your going to do debt forgiveness do it in a way that tells the universities we're going to forgive this deal but here's the deal, if you want universities to be able to take part in the loan program, state colleges you're going to have a fixed fee, maybe it's $5,000 tuition. private universities, $10,000, you don't like that, that's fine, you don't have to do it, you don't have to be a part of federal loan program but we're no longer going to allow you to get rich, because these people have priced middle-class

americans out of going to colleges and universities without the help of the federal government. and then you add the predatoial lending rates, the system is just a disaster. so, why do this without having a more holistic approach? >> the system is so badly broken, 526% increase, 447% increase, that's just a sampling. this is real burden. some criticism of what the biden administration did, it didn't address the overarching the affordability crisis, this is a white house that's known for its deliberate decisionmaking process, this one in particular really tortured this president and his inner circle, a campaign promise he wanted to address.

had mixed feelings about it. this was the sort of compromise they came up with, it didn't make everybody happy. some say it's a good some on th right angry about it. but it is a good first start. this is not the last time this white house and we have this conversation. it is a beginning. but it doesn't, you're right, it doesn't address sort of the overarching problems with an education system right now that is simply just either out of reach for so many americans, or if they did make the decision to go for it, they're then saddled consider crippling debt potentially for decades. >> coming up, the possibility of obstruction now looms over former president trump. we'll talk about his efforts to thwart investigators from recovering the documents he took from the white house.

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we've got breaking news. on america's latest efforts to return to the moon. let's bring in nbc news correspondent jake ward. what do you have? >> well, mika, as the rain begins to fall on us here in cape canaveral, unfortunately the launch has been scrubbed for today. there will be no attempt today. there was supposed to be as you know a two-hour window between 8:30 and 10:30 in which it could go but that is not going to happen. it is an extraordinarily delicate thing to find the proper moment, the relationship between the movement of the earth and the moon to find the proper moment.

the next window is friday, and that would rob the orion of the solar power it needs so it has to wait until friday the 2nd. when the next launch window is open. we don't know if they'll take that one. right now artemis one will not go up today, mika. >> all right. nbc's jacob ward, thank you very much for that update. a small town in france turns red, white and blue in honor of an american hero who died fighting to liberate the country from the nazis in world war ii. exactly 78 years ago yesterday, lieutenant john gilmore jr., an army fighter pilot was shot down by anti-eric artillery and that is when a small french village comes into the story. nbc news now anchor aaron gilchrist joins us live from northeastern france with the

details. aaron? >> reporter: hi, mika, good morning. we're about 3 hours outside of paris in this small town where that american pilot has become a part of its story. including the effort to find his family. it took nine months and about 5,000 miles but with the help of u.s. consulate the town did find the family back in the states. they're here now and helping this town celebrate a new chapter. a soaring show of air power from the french air force above, and below a small town rolled out a welcome teaming with patriotism. all to honor an american hero who died helping bring freedom to france near the end of world war 2. >> it is extraordinary. i can't come up with enough words for this. it is unbelievable. >> chelsea gray flu all the way from wyoming to the french town for a special tribute to her great uncle and to discover a piece of her family history. >> there are people who feel

like they wouldn't have been here -- >> without my great uncle, yeah. >> reporter: lieutenant john gilmore jr. was an army fighter pilot during world war ii. as he team took out a german supply convoy, he was shot down over this town. his burning plane was headed toward this home and two children standing in the window. he was able to turn that plane just enough to crash into this field. the locals will tell you, he saved their lives. >> it was a bombardier fighter and his name was john gilmore. >> a local journalist and historian has written about gilmore's story and that of his friend bernard. >> saw the plane coming and he thinks the pilot saw him also. and the pilot, the plane was burning, he voids the house and crashes in the park. >> at 95 now.

his health kept him from the special gathering but his granddaughter came in his place to share the family's story. >> translator: my great grandmother was a nurse and out of instinct she ran to try to rescue the pilot, hoping she could save him. she had the reflex to take the bracelet. she want fod stop the germans from stealing it and hoped one day she could return it. >> reporter: that bracelet had been hidden away until just a few years ago, chiselled with his name and the words "forever nancy". >> he didn't know what to do with it and kept it until now. he decided he wants to do some research and find the family and finally give it back. >> for his home town, that bracelet has come to mean so much. this special ceremony 78 years to the day after gilmore died, this small village awash in red, white and blew and honor him and

other soldiers who helped to liberate the town. that bracelet is also the reason for chelsea's trip with her mom and son. a mission to thank the french for save guarding her family's legacy and to receive not just a relic, but they will also go home with an invaluable piece of their great uncle's identity. >> i think it is a connection to the past and knowing that my mother's uncle and my great uncle and my grandmother's brother had such an impact on this town. >> and a fuller picture of the selfless act that cost him his life and saved so many others. >> you come here and you see that they're so grateful and i want to capture as much of that as i can and bottle it up and take it home and share it with as many people as i can. >> reporter: we already have an idea of what the next chapter of the story is. you remember the bracelet with the etching on the back that said forever nancy, we