msnbc world headquarters here in new york. welcome to alex witt reports, developing this hour president biden is heading to two key states tomorrow. giving labor day speeches in both wisconsin and pennsylvania. as we mark the start of the official campaign season, meanwhile today white house advisers defending the soul of the nation's speech in which he called donald trump and his maga ideology a threats to democracy. >> the president has not called out all publicans, he has been very specific about his maga agenda and what the president has said is that mainstream republicans, independents, democrats, can all come together. we have seen us come together to do what is right on behalf of american people. if people are silent then the very core of what we do as a country is in danger. >> with 65 days until the midterm election we are getting a clearer picture of the message that both democrats and

republicans hope will win their party control of congress. >> we are going to hold the majority in the house because we have a plan to fix the problems are countries facing the other side has only a ploy to win back power from shelves and rip away our constitutional freedom, reproductive freedom, it has awakened millions of voters. >> if democrats want to make abortion the main issue when every poll we have seen says that the economy and the cost of living is the number one issue, good luck to them trying to defend their extreme position. >> i guess he hasn't seen all the polls. meanwhile we are still being the key decision that could be made any moment, as a judge determines whether to grant trump's request for a special master to review what it was seized from mar-a-lago. >> earlier today -- both sides the aisle gave way to trump's handling of the documents. >> the process for

declassification. the president is in a very different position than most of us in the national security space. if this was such a national security threat, for god sakes, why didn't they -- on this. >> is not the case of an overdue library book, not sloppy bookkeeping, this is a staggering refusal and willful retention of hundreds of classified documents often containing exquisite information bearing on our national security. >> now a close look at the right rally in pennsylvania last night. it was trump's first since the search of his mar-a-lago compound. it was the only story making that front page of the morning newspaper there. nbc's monica albright is joining us with more on the attack. >> good afternoon, trump is no stranger to airing his grievances in any format. last i was no exception, he repeatedly railed against the department of justice fbi in a

nearly two-hour speech calling them vicious monsters and suggesting that the ongoing criminal investigation into his handling of classified documents is clearly politically motivated. >> hello pennsylvania. former president trump back on the trail and back on offense on his first speech -- the shameful raid and breaking of my home in mar-a-lago was a travesty of justice. >> blasting the releasing a document recover last month. >> it was a disgrace, a disgrace, they went in and took documents. dumped them on the floor staged a photo shoot and pretended that i had done it. >> claiming that it extended to his teenage son's bedroom. >> they even did a deep and ugly search of the room of my 16-year-old son. >> the comments coming a day after a judge unsealed the most detailed list yet of what

authorities say was seized in mar-a-lago including more than 11,000 government records, among them dozens of empty folders marked classified raising questions about the location of their contents. back in canteen campaign mode, trump using yesterday's rally to stand for republican candidates and deliver a blistering attack on president biden taking aim at his bill philadelphia dress on thursday. the most >> the most vicious, hateful, divisive speech ever delivered by an american president. vilifying 75 million citizens. he's an enemy of the states if you want to know the truth. >> slamming his -- estate critical to control after november's midterms. >> this election is a referendum on the corruption and extremism's of joe biden and the radical democrat party.

>> pennsylvania has been the epicenter of politics this week, president biden went there twice in recent days, first to wilkes-barre not far from where the president was last night and of course philadelphia for the continued speech are for the battle of the soul of the nation. >> tomorrow he will head milwaukee before traveling to pittsburgh where he's expected to a peer alongside candace for senator senate and gubernatorial candidates. >> let's bring in peter baker, nbc analyst and correspondent for the new york times clearly somewhere for the labor day weekend. >> and joyce vance legal analyst and attorney for the university of alabama school of law and clint -- nbc national security analyst and distinguished research fellow at the fore and institute. >> thank you all for being here. clint, you may be away as well because i think that's a different backdrop. let's go to this, peter. before i get your reaction to donald trump speech last night,

let's take a look at what form white house communications director stephanie grisham said about his remarks. >> i would imagine that we will see a lot more realities where he will feel he has got his voice and he will continue to be divisive and blame everybody and not take responsibility. i think -- he doesn't think anybody is following the legal aspects of it and then all he has to say is his version of the truth and the mega extreme right wing of the party will believe him. >> sadly, they will. >> peter, is how you interpret the former presidents messaging? to see his defiant stance of some kind of political strategy or just his and needs reaction to something? >> i think it can be both, of course. it is a political strategy because it taps into the grievances of his base that he is always appealed to. remember, his whole political career is built on the idea that they, somewhere, they, the deep state, they, sometimes the mainstream republicans are out

to get him and therefore out to get you -- that has been his appeal for a long time. the idea of recasting his duly authorized court ordered search on his home in some kind of a break-in to use his word is in his way of spinning at to make it look like something untoward has happened by the authorities. rather than explaining his own actions, why did they have documents begin with? didn't belong, they want the american people, the government. he did return them when asked, he was subpoenaed, did not return them had lawyer sign a paper saying he had returned them. these are things he's not going to explain that a political rally. >> joyce, trump is not speaking out against the search since an app and. it happened almost a month ago now. what effect that might that have on the legal case given that this is still an open investigation? should he be talking about at this much? >> so, of course the big unknown here alex is whether the doj proceeds to prosecution

of trump or anyone else in this case. the typical wisdom that the defense lawyers well in parts of someone who is under investigation, which the former president clearly is here is that this is a good time to keep your head down and not make public comments. everything that trump is saying, ultimately, these are statements that trump is making against his own interest and very likely to be admissible if there is a trial down the road. none of this helps him. that is not what he is trying to accomplish, here. i think peter is dead on the money when he makes the point that trump, who is completely until they're to the truth. is simply trying to rally the base and make them a few not the legal argument, stephanie grisham's point, but view this only as a raid into obscure the reality that this was a duly authorized legal process that was executed by the fbi. >> you know, clint, this week to you doj revealed those 48 empty folders they fountain marked classified from

mar-a-lago. with these folders have any marks from them in some way like color number, letters, something that could indicate what was in them at least and one time? is there any conventional wisdom on one's going on in these documents? is it possible that the folders were empty when they arrived at mar-a-lago? >> i think all of what you said is possible, alex. traditionally they don't have sequential numbering on them, just cover switched educate what sort of information is on the inside of them. there are two different type types, the manila type folders with top she covers that are normally put on top to classified documents in file folders. oftentimes you probably see the white binders that you would get and then office door. they slide those in the cupboard essentially. that's what those folders likely are. you can see sometimes the -- will begin with a large sum of documents. they don't set nearly nihilist lee into a pile but each one

itself will be stamped. they might be debated but in the case of those white binders they will unfold its take material out somebody else can read them flip them or show them. particularly in the white house -- mike asked is that it could be one or all of the things. someone a ferry some dangerous. that tim documents were deliberately taken out and they all relate to each other, others may have been present trump pushed the presidents and takes a bunch of documents out of the folder, no windows where anything goes to just a big mix pile. one thing is remarkable about this is that there have been several rounds where top u.s. have been turned back to the national archives and fbi yet these road remain, why? to me there's some reason why the documents were there. there's also some very interesting classification that you don't see much with the -- meaning that it was compartmentalize. it is an example there where was in the secret category, that means there's something sensitive in it but they did

want that essentially right it for access. once lots of interesting dynamics going on. i'm not sure we will ever know, entirely, or feel confident that we know that all of the documents have been recovered. >> that is very disturbing, right there. something this week with one of trump's attorney slammed the doj for releasing this photo which my director put that one up again. these documents scrawled across, sprawled across trump's office. it also gave some insight into how secure that location is. let's take a listen. >> i am down there frequently. i have never seen that. i am never ever seen that that is not the way his office looks. everybody knows trump's office, he has to guess frequently there it's just a joke. >> a couple of things peter, authorities say those documents were intentionally placed there on the ground for the photo. that's why you might not see them in disarray like that. when you went to mar-a-lago to

visit the president for his book, where you in his office? did you go to his office? just how you obsess the missing documents. >> we were in his office the second of our two interviews it was chairs i did not see any classified documents round i will say that. that photograph does illustrate the kind of things that the fbi was finding their. they were not planted at some of trump's people tried to suggest later. they backed off now and do not make that suggestion. still lots of knick-knacks the momentous from his presidency. it was not super secure, but you could have go through a secret service path down before you went upstairs. mar-a-lago is though, a working hotel, restaurant, club, for members. a lot of people come in and out of that facility all the time with some security but not what

the federal government feels is appropriate to these kinds of documents. these types of documents are supposed to be prime property to begin with. the especially securing government facilities under proper procedures, even if the former president is not meant to take them or if they're classified or not as per his other explanation to declassify things if that is true. it does not mean he has the ability to take them and keep them after he has been subpoenaed for them. >> all this about the missing documents is not where you see donald trump's appears to be the most legally exposed? do you agree or not? >> the legal exposure is for the search warrant with the doj specifies the kind of legal claims that it is pursuing. ultimately, though those involved tension and mishandling of documents involved in national defense or government records, the most damaging prospects for the former president is the fight that he tried to object

obstruct the investigation. so noses cases involving his mishandling documents are resolved without prosecution or misdemeanor prosecution as they were in the keys to general petraeus. the notion that the president obstructed the investigation will loom large as this proceeds. we are now seeing the sworn statement from one of the lawyers acting as a custodian custodian of records turning over documents early june and certifying that this is everything that we have. it is a very passive voice statement indicating that this is what she was advised of obviously standing behind that statement for someone who advised her. the person who told her that this is everything. the doj will continue to push and that might be the most serious legal predicament the former president faces. >> on that notion, clint, of people in and out of donald trump's office which by the way the trump attorney confirmed she said it happens all the time, is this the exact

scenario that you might expect foreign actors to take advantage of, those potentially with nefarious intention? >> alex, that's the most troubling to me, all these documents or not in a secure location. who knows who had access to them. i imagine some other request for surveillance from mar-a-lago is partly to know when attorneys were going in, we also know who is going in and out of these facilities that could possibly see at. it would also be totally abnormal with people carrying around cell phones, an ability to take pictures, foreign interest, or just for economic trade, just show up. there's a lot of different motivations by all of them are bad. some of them worse than others. foreign interests, malign actors are targeting united states for espionage purposes, mar-a-lago has probably been targeted, there's several documented cases where foreign enemies have focused on this location, it's not a secures

the white house, it's not protected in the same way, we now find out there is information there that's unguarded. it is really the worst combination of events that i think we can look for. i can't recall anything like this in recent history. >> yeah, peter, the tone of donald trump's speech last night, what are you hearing from folks close to trump? is he publicly defiant but privately worried about the many legal consequences he might face? i mean, is there any insight into why he didn't just give up the documents in the first place? >> yeah, that is still the critical question here, what on earth was he thinking about? why was he keeping these documents? it's not a case of being casual or cavalier with them, he obviously intended to hold on to them, even though he had been asked for them back. what was the purpose? we don't know, he hasn't told us. i think there is concern in the trump circle that he is in serious possible trouble here. that's where you see some republicans beginning to kind of distance themselves to some extent, they have kind of backed off the full-throated

defensive attack on the fbi you saw in the initial phase after the search, some of these documents released from the court now are pretty disturbing. that's left a lot of republicans nervous about what's going on here. and willing to be caught out too far in defending him. again, just come back to it, he is not explained what he wanted with the document, why he needed them, or so he thought, instead, he is trying to focus the attention on the authorities rather than his own actions. >> joyce, during the speech in philadelphia, donald trump complained that when those documents role seized officers went and searched through his son, bear in, his room, didn't officers have a legal responsibility to look through everything? >> we don't know the truth of this matter. doj may well decide to take the high ground here and not issue a statement. it would be illuminating, i think, for all of us if they would clarify the bounce within which they searched. you are absolutely right to point out that the search

warrant authorized them to certain areas that they have probable cause to believe contained evidence or fruits of criminal conduct. sometimes you going to start to residents and you do end up searching the children's room, that's what you're evidence suggests sometimes people will conceal evidence of criminality in their kids room, thinking that no one will ever search in those sorts of areas. i think we should pump the brakes on this one because if you gauge the comments about his sons room against the caliber of truth of all of the other comments the former president was making, and that speech it is unlikely that this will turn out to be untrue. >> that's a very good assessment, hadn't thought of it that white, you're absolutely right, as usual. clint, let me get to what happened on thursday, which was donald trump appearing on that conservative radio show, supporting those accused or convicted after storming the capitol on january 6th. take a listen. >> so, i met with a number of -- i met with them and i'm

financially supporting people that are incredible. it is a disgrace what they've done to them. what they have done to these people, it is disgraceful. i will tell you, i will look very favorably about full pardons. if i decide to run if i win i will be looking very strongly at pardons, full pardons. >> clint, if he did return to the oval office, just how concerning, not just the prospect of trump pardoning capitol rioters, but this kind of rhetoric as well? >> yeah, it was interesting now, vladimir putin also supports those who have been detained for january 6th to. if you listen to russian media. so, it's hard not to laugh sometimes when you hear the similarities. the big problem with these sorts of pardons, it is condoning activity, it is saying that you can break federal law, you can participate in an insurrection, you can charge into the capitol, threatening lives of congressmen, and it's okay. in fact, if you do, and donald trump likes it, he would give you a pardon.

that is totally anti-democratic, that's authoritarian, that's how third world countries with governments that are totally autocratic operate. so, it's a terrible tone to set for the country very clear that it's a federal crime most of them film themselves doing it that's the other part about it, they participated in a crime, they admitted to the crime, they found themselves doing it to then be pardoned it doesn't really make any sense other than for political purposes. i mean, relate to continue to rally the base. >> they provided evidence against themselves. last question, it's gonna be quick, all need a yes or no, even a maybe. peter, you first, do you think donald trump will be indicted? >> i wouldn't hazard a guess on that, he's escapes only diffident vest geishas in the past, we'll see what happens with this one. >> okay, clint, you next. >> maybe, it depends really on the parts of redacted of david, i think, in terms of my judgment. >> okay, we're gonna leave it to our tierney, joyce, to give

the last answer, what do you think? >> i think that there that on the money, this is a big maybe for now, depends on what the evidence looks like when it all comes in and how doj assesses this case against president in earlier cases. >> okay, peter, joyce, and clint, thank you guys so much for spending part your holiday weekend with me. i so appreciate it. now, let's go to the white house, president biden set to deliver to speeches on labor day. the of course traditional start of the campaign season. nbc's julia's at the white house for us. julia, welcome, and what is on the presidents agenda tomorrow? where is he going? what can we expect to hear? there's a lot answer there. can>> that's right, alex. president biden has quite a busy labor day plan tomorrow. he will be heading to milwaukee, west conson, and pittsburgh, pennsylvania, to deliver speeches celebrating labor day and the dignity of american workers, especially unions, which he has repeatedly said has helped build the middle

class. so, the white house really has a lot of focus on pennsylvania and wisconsin. this will be the third time in just one week that biden will have been in pennsylvania. the fourth time senses term again that healthy and wes conson. so, there obviously hyper focus on those states where there are senate and governor races that are going to be quite a battle. one of those being the pennsylvania gubernatorial race between doug mastriano, who is at the capitol on january 6th, and democrat josh shapiro, we might see a bit of a focus on a as biden gave a speech earlier this week where he called out those maga republicans alam austrian oh for their threat to democracy. well he's received criticism about what some people thought was a divisive speech, his top aides have been defending biden's remarks as actually

being a unifying message. take a listen to what his top aide said earlier today about that speech on democracy earlier this week. >> he is calling on democrats, independents, mainstream republicans to really come together and make that decision and stand together to make their voices heard so that we can protect what is the most important to our value as a country. that is what you heard from this president. as president he believes he has, he should be the strongest voice on democracy, and that's what he's using. he is using his voice to lift that up to show what the inflection point that we're in at this current moment and how much it is important to protect those values. >> brief correction there, it was karine jean-pierre, the white house press secretary giving those remarks on msnbc. so, as biden has these events tomorrow labor day, kicking off the mid term season, he will have to unite not only the

country but also the wings of his party to get voters to turn out in the midterms. alex. >> yeah, i'm sorry you said, i was gonna cartoon say the name, but i love karine jean-pierre, she has such a pretty name. anyways, thank you so much, appreciate that, julia. meantime, new today, lingering disturbing questions about that terrifying plane threatened the legal fallout facing the suspect. $30. (daughter) i've already told everyone! (nurse) wait... did you say verizon for just $30? (mom) it's their best unlimited price ever. (cool guy) $30...that's awesome. (dad) yeah, and it's from the most reliable 5g network in america. (woman) for $30 a line, i'm switching now. (mom) yeah, it's easy and you get $960 when you switch the whole family. (geek) wow... i've got to let my buddies know. (geek friend) we're already here! (vo) the network you want. the price you love. only from verizon.

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say stole a plane and threaten to crash into a walmart yesterday faces the judge today. we may learn more about what led to a terrifying few hours across northern mississippi. nbc's blayne alexander is joining us from mississippi. blaine, welcome. why are we learning today about the hours long pretty frightening ordeal in the area sturdy? >> well, alex, absolutely frightening for the thousands of people here on the ground in

northern mississippi. we know that suspect as we go before a judge here in tupelo in less than two hours. as you can see, the walmart here behind me is back opening bustling serving customers. for much saturday morning it was evacuated along with a number of nearby homes and busy roads in the area, all with that plane flying overhead and no idea when or where it would come down. >> officials are still trying to determine why they say 20 nine-year-old cory patterson a tenure employee at tupelo regional airport hopped into a twin engine plane saturday morning and took off. police say the first 9-1-1 call came from the suspect himself. >> from the aircraft called 9-1-1 to tell them that he is going to crash this aircraft into the west main walmart. >> the call came in just after 5 am and triggered a massive evacuation. nearby businesses, homes, even major streets all cleared.

this map shows the planes erratic flight pattern as officials on the ground tried by cell phone to talk patterson down. they say patterson, who had flight experience, but officials believe was not a licensed pilot, at one point agreed to land the plane but did not know how. >> there were two pilots working together as a team, they were in direct contact with him, they had him lined up, he was on his approach, head -- last-minute, aborted, decided to change his mind. he flew for more than two hours, talking about his family, at one point even posting to facebook. sorry everyone, never actually wanted to hurt anyone, i love my parents and sister, this isn't your fault, goodbye. >> when you saw that post, what did you think? >> we also need at the same time that he was running out of fuel, so, we knew that the plane was gonna have to be coming down very soon. >> more than five hours and 15 miles from warp again, patterson ultimately landed in this field where he was arrested. a stunning and to a flight that

left thousands looking up in fear, including tupelo mayor, todd gordon, who says that one point the plane flew directly over his house. >> what was the scariest part of today? >> i think just the unknown. not knowing what the end result is going to be. >> now, alex, we know that patterson is facing a number of charges, including grand larceny and making terroristic threats. we also understand from officials that there could be more federal charges to come as well. alex. >> okay, it will keep an eye on all that with your help, thanks so much blaine alexander. next talking points, speeches by president biden and donald trump, deciphering the rhetoric and the reality, the effect on the upcoming midterms. the upcoming midterms. try boost® high protein with 20 grams of protein for muscle health. versus 16 grams in ensure high protein. boost® high protein also has key nutrients for immune support. boost® high protein. it's the all-new subway series menu! 12 irresistible new subs... like #6 the boss.

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electricity to the grid. this reserve line, just one of the six raptors working, this comes after the plant narrowly avoided a radiation leak during a shut down last week. nasa says it will wait until later this month, or perhaps october to attempt another launch of its artemis rocket. the test launch scheduled yesterday afternoon was called off for a second time because of a hydrogen leak. officials say repairs are needed before they can try to launch the 40 billion dollar rocket in capsule again. tropical storm earl is expected to pass through the north of the u.s. virgin islands and puerto rico today, creating several inches of rain for the islands and possible flash flooding. the atlantic hurricane season had a slow start this year, with only three named storms before this week. in the meantime, 65 days until the midterm elections, the biden ministration today defending president biden's soul of the nation speech. earlier today white house adviser was pressed on whether the message was unifying. >> has the president

essentially given up on those maga republicans, some 70 million people? >> what the president has done is said that he will continue to work with mainstream republicans, that he will work with democrats, that he will work with independents to get things done in our country. but this maga republican agenda, this hate fueled agenda, this mega republican agenda that we saw incite violence on our nation's capital has no place in the democracy. >> joining me now is crystal, democratic strategist and former political -- susan, republican strategist and msnbc political analyst, and former republican congressman from florida, david. also an msnbc political analyst. big welcome to all of this holiday sunday. so, before we dive into the conversation, i want to play part of the speech, and then donald trump's new response to. it'll take a listen. >> there is no question that

republican parties today dominated and intimidated by donald trump in the maga republicans. >> biden came to philadelphia, pennsylvania to give the most vicious, hateful, and divisive speech ever delivered by an american president. you're all enemies of the state. he is an enemy of the state, if you want to know the truth. >> while, crystal, to you first. no one should disagree with keisha lance bottoms comments, was president biden's message as unifying an optimistic as they suggested it would be? >> well, i'm not sure if it was absolutely unifying. what it did do is outline exactly where the republican party is today. the republican party and many other republican party, let me say that, not every single republican. but there are people in the party who are denying the 2020 election results are as they

were, which is that president biden is the rightful president of this country. the republican party, many members of the party are installing secretaries of state all across this country to make sure that results are, you know, being favored in the way that they personally or as a party determined that they should be. and that is some of the things that president biden spoke about. this extreme election denying, the 2020 election results, the january 6th attack. all of those things are characterized by the maga movement, and it is inciting violence in this country, i think that the president was right to call it out. >> you know, suzannah, crystal there is echoing the sentiments of president biden who made clear that not all republicans are maga republicans. earlier today democratic congressional campaign committee chair, sean patrick maloney, doubled down that idea. take a listen. >> this is not republicans versus democrats, this is mainstream republicans and democrats versus maga

extremists. this election is about mainstream versus maga. i am proud that we have a president that knows right from wrong. >> so, susan, is that how you see it? too many republicans, at least privately, draw that distinction? >> this is very difficult to sit and watch happen in realtime. i do agree with president biden's message, it is true, absolutely right in how he was looking in addressing the nation. however, with two months to go before the midterms, this president is not a good messenger, neither is maloney for republicans. if you're trying to find those center-right republicans or independents, these are not the right people. the way joe biden won was when republicans and independents could no longer support the mega, the donald trump's, and they were not buying into the

democratic agenda, they were buying into, we need a stable and safe country. so, i think they need to be a little more careful with the messengers as far as trying to win elections. so, for example, list cheney, adam king zinger, they both can be republicans spending money against other republicans who are maga. you know, it's similar to the january six select hearings, alex, where we saw republicans calling out the other republicans for what they were. that is what was affective. >> david, let's take a listen together to house some fox news hosts reacted to president biden's speech. here is that. >> not all republicans are maga, just like not all democrats, you know, love the squad. there's different factions within the republicans. >> i would say the vast majority of republicans all are probably maga republicans. there is a small sliver of

people who agree with liz cheney. >> meghan's not extremist, january 6th is an aberration. >> your turn, david. how's mega defined within republican circles? >> i think most importantly for fox news to realize there's not two sides to the truth, there is one truth. i think what joe biden acknowledged unaccepted ownership of is that there is no unifying was insurrectionists or unifying with people who had suggest that you're not allowed to exercise your vote, exercise your franchise. that is the maga platform, the notion that trumpism, violence on january 6th, taking away someone's right to vote is actually means to political success, that is the threat that joe biden was identifying. success,and so, look, it is true know statistically about 30% of republicans actually reject those parts of montana. i think that's what joe biden is speaking to. the key to unlocking this, susan is exactly right, it is not necessarily the issue all

by itself protecting democracy it's about the coalition that delivered victory in 18 and 20. that coalition is why you hear joe biden saying democrats, independents, and mainstream republicans. it will take that coalition, the appeal has to be made to mainstream republicans. it has to be done so effectively and sincerely. with that, democrats could defy history. >> so, there is a new op-ed in new york times, it asks, does biden really believe we are in a crisis of democracy? democrats quote are running a political operation in which the threat to democracy is leverage, used to keep swing voters onside without having to make difficult concessions to the center or the right. so, crystal, is this political posturing, or is this is serious concern or is it both? >> i think it's a little bit of both, it's absolutely political posturing, because where you know months out from the midterm elections in november. but also, there is a serious

threat to democracy with people, again, we have election deniers in this country, that is a serious issue. we have to attack that head on actually call it what it is. i think that's what we've seen the president do we've seen stacey abrams do this down in georgia with their fight. pointing to correct and write the election results in that state, if you will. and so, when we think about threats to democracy, when you think about secretaries of state, when you think about these state legislative bodies that republicans are really focusing on, these are the people who could likely decide the outcome of elections in this country. and so, if we don't get that right at that level, what does it mean for these larger elections in 2024 when we're talking about the next presidential election? >> susan, curious what the national republican campaign committee chairs that today about what he thinks will be on voters minds in november, take a listen. >> i am convinced that when

people vote they are gonna ask the question, and my better off today than i was two years ago? they are gonna say overwhelmingly no. prices are out of control, my security is in jeopardy, it's time for a change. they're gonna vote in a new republican. >> so, susan, you and i have said many times, we've had this discussion about how people vote with their pocketbooks. however, serious threats to democracy, really serious threats, and then taking away abortion rights, they weren't kitchen table topics we wouldn't having those conversations before as they are now. what is given influence voters more? >> we'll, if you could tell me what the price of grocery and gas will be come november, i can answer that question for you. if we do see a change and prices do go back, or there's other unforeseen things, it will be the economy. it usually is pocketbook issues, you bring up a very good point about the abortion rights. people are now seeing what

happens when government has the ability to control outcomes like the supreme court. and crystal mention this twice, secretaries of state. secretary of states are really important, democrats if you want to protect democracy make sure you get out there and vote for secretaries of state, there are some republicans who have a history of protecting elections. but vote for those who are committed to protecting our elections. that is where democracy lies. >> 100 percent. hey, david, same question to you. let me give the scenario that the economy is better, gas prices are down, inflation has come down in november. tell me what is gonna be the issue is people go to the polls and vote on. >> look, the economy, roe v. wade, is it gonna be rove ember, and then this notion of donald trump, is america ready for more trumpism or not? i'm gonna flip the script look, -- said something everybody

believes, which is that people go in the voting booth and say i'm a better off today than i used to be? i would flip that script in a very specific way, i think voters are asking themselves what i'd be worse off with republican leadership? what we've seen this year is the threat of trumpism and republicanism, actually think we're seeing very rational voters should've statistically that they whether or not i'm totally in with the biden agenda or only softly, just turning my head and saying okay, what i do know as a voter is that i don't go to the other side, because republicans would make me worse off today than i am. >> crystal night susan, david jolly, good to see all three of you guys, thank you so much. the president of the naacp met with president biden friday to discuss dangers to the nation's democracy. i'll talk with him about that and the ongoing water crisis in mississippi. the local people there today calling it a crisis 50 years in the making, black residents bearing the brunt of it. the brunt of it. unlisted. try boost® high protein with 20 grams of protein for muscle health.

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white house on the president student loan forgiveness plan that aims to council is $10,000 in college debt for those earning less than 125,000 a year. here's what white house press secretary kareen jean pierre said just this morning on the sunday show on msnbc. >> the student loan system is broken. this was one way for the president to fix that. >> while republicans expect to challenge the plan in court, some democrats oppose, others say just doesn't go far enough. joining me now, naacp president, derek johnson who has pushed for all student debt to be forgiven and who also met with president biden on friday at the white house with other civil rights leaders. derek, welcome back to the broadcast. good to see you. let's go first with the loans here. economists, penn norton say the presidents plan could cost more than 500 billion dollars over time and at least one adviser to the former president clinton said that money could fund say,

pre-k for all three and four-year-olds for ten years. yes, you want more relief. tweeting that it is ten or 20, 000, it's like a bucket of water on a forest fire. are there better fires that water might be used on, derek? and how much relief do you recommend? >> so, you know, we actually commend the president and this administration for taking the right step forward to deal with a student loan crisis. our economy, our system, should not be based on individuals locked in the cycle of debt. student loan debt is a super debt, you cannot discharge it in bankruptcy. so, you have many individuals who are in careers that are not marketable, who had to take up student loans because of the tax cut on the rich. and so, there should not be a comparable between the cost of student loans forgiveness and other programs. we need to be looking at how to revise our tax code so more

people can pay their fair share. >> understandable, but when you call for all student debt to be relieved, do you mean every dollar? that someone who owes money right now should be absolved from having to repay? >> i'm an advocate, i'm gonna push for the maximum amount to help people. what has -- with this announcement, individuals who went to school on a pell grant, they can get up to 20, 000, what has also happened is a reexamination of the regulations. so, there are pathways for individuals to contribute to society and payback their applications. think about the majority of student loan holders are people who work every day. these are school teachers, police officers, individuals that help our economy grow and go, individual to protect our democracy. they should not be penalized because state legislative bodies could talks on the superrich and increased tuitions ring a time where we have the highest number of individuals seeking a pathway

out of poverty through higher education. they did exactly what they were told to do, they should not be penalized as a result. >> listen, it's hard to argue that. but let me ask you this, could the money that would be lost, if you will, by the repayment or lack thereof of the student loans, could that money be used elsewhere? in areas for people who have even more pressing needs? >> well, that was not the question when we gave 1.9 trillion dollars in the height of covid, when we gave corporations ppp loan forgiveness, those are not the same questions that were asked. so, you should not put individuals in a posture of thinking they're doing something wrong, because they went and got a higher education, now they're locked in the cycle of debt that they cannot get out of. why are we not asking those questions when we give tax cuts, when we're giving corporate giveaways, when we're having tax benefits for corporations? so, this false narrative, it could've been's differently compared to how it's been used,

it's the wrong narrative. it should be a narrative that we are in a student loan debt crisis, similar to the housing loan crisis in 2008, we're all of those individuals were able to get out of that debt through bankruptcy in many cases, make it in the street, bailed out, individuals who intentionally created this trap, they are going to jail. now, we're asking these questions to individuals who went to school, did what they were supposed to do, and walked into this perpetual that. it is the wrong question. the right narrative, we should celebrate the success of this administration moving forward and individuals not getting out of this debt trap. >> you said you're not bucket, and you definitely are, and it really articulate one at that. good job on that, derek. one more quick question though, it's about your meeting with the president on friday. this was the day after his speech on maga republicans in the threat to american democracy. how closely aligned is the president with civil rights leaders demands to fight racial injustice and protect democracy? >> well, he was spot on, his

speech was pitch perfect. you know, african american experience, we know that if you have domestic terrorism leading the way who are white supremacists and you don't hold those individuals accountable, we are guaranteed to have more acts of domestic terrorism. it could pull our nation apart. and his message on thursday evening was pitch perfect, you cannot say you are for democratic principles and you love this country and losing the election to decide that it must have been -- because the outcome was not where you supposed to be. you cannot support advocate for those who went on january 6th to tarnish our democracy and our capital and say that it's okay for them to do that, they had legitimate concerns. that was an insurrection. that was an act of treason. they should be held as such. there is no gray line here. we commended the president for his message in our meeting, and we are aligned with the

statements he made because we know, as african americans, if domestic terrorists are not held accountable, were guaranteed more acts of violence. >> naacp president, derrick johnson, great conversation, thank you so much for joining me. an arrest in the kidnapping of the tennessee areas, taken while jogging. what has happened to her? that still remains a mystery. still remains a mystery at drugstores with chase freedom unlimited. that means i earn on my bug spray and my sunscreen. you ready to go fishing? i got the bait. i also earn 5% on travel purchased through chase on this rental car. that lake is calling my name! don't you get seasick? we'll find out! come on. and i earn 3% on dining including takeout. so much for catching our dinner. some people are hunters. some are gatherers. i'm a diner. pow! earn big time with chase freedom unlimited with no annual fee. how do you cashback? chase. make more of what's yours. (dad) we have to tell everyone that we just switched to verizon's new welcome unlimited plan, for just $30. (daughter) i've already told everyone! (nurse) wait... did you say verizon for just $30? (mom) it's their best unlimited price ever.

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e.l.i.s.a. flattered before she was kidnapped while jogging in memphis, tennessee early friday. today, a suspect is under arrest and charged with kidnapping. what has happened to the 34-year-old heiress and mother of two? that remains a frightening mystery. let's go to nbc's jesse, joining us now from memphis. jesse, some new details on the case. >> yeah, alex, just within the last hour so we have gotten details from an affidavit that was filed with a judge that goes into more detail as to

what allegedly happened to e.l.i.s.a. fletcher and how authorities seem to have found their suspect. as you just mentioned, this mother of two is still missing. police say they have the man who is responsible for this alleged abduction. authorities announcing today that 38-year-old cleo that abstinent has been charged with aggravated kidnapping attempt of evidence. authorities are alleging that he violently objected this mother of two, while she teaches junior kindergarten here in memphis on early friday morning. you see the image of the suv, according to affidavit that suv was driving by fletcher while she was on her morning run, right near where i am off of the campus of the university of memphis. authorities say that vehicle drove past her, stopped and waited for her to come by. then a suspect allegedly got out of the vehicle, quote, ran aggressively toward her, abducted her. she allegedly fought back. she has not been seen since, according to authorities. police were able to connect the dots on this case because

according to this affidavit, what was left behind here included the mother's cell phone and a pair of essentially flip-flops, of sandals. police say those sandals were tested for dna, the dna on those sandals matched mr. absent, according to the affidavit, and using cell phone records, tracking down the vehicle, they found the suspect, according to this affidavit. they say although he's now in custody, he is still not sharing, according to the affidavit, where this mother of two might be. alex, one more thing we want to point out, memphis police have confirmed to us that the suspect is the same individual who pled guilty to a separate kidnapping case more than 20 years ago, alex. >> this is just a horrible story. okay, jesse, thank you for the very latest on that. we are keeping our eye out for new -- from that florida judge on whether a special master will be appointed to review the documents recovered from mar-a-lago. what good will a special master to? it's a wake up for the world, a powerful monsoon delivering a

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