hi there, it is 4:00 in new york. and the hearing of the january 6 select committee is now just a few days away, and the aftershock s from the deadly shocs still being felt with the midterms now less than 50 days away and the fates of the people involved in the insurrection from the disgraced ex-president and inner circle all the way to the mob who stormed the capitol. and let's talk again about stephen ayres, he is a january 6 department who back in july testified publicly before the january 6 select committee and said that donald trump effectively directed him and hundreds of others to attack the

u.s. capitol. >> so why did you decide to march to the capitol? >> well, basically, you know, the president got everybody riled up, told everybody head on down. so we were basically just following what he said. >> after the president's speech as you are marching to the capitol, how did you feel? >> i was -- you know, i'm angry. you know, after everything that was basically said in the speech, you know, a lot of the stuff he said he already put out in tweets. i've heard it and seen it before. so i was already worked up and so were most of the people there. >> thursday a federal judge sentenced him to two years of probation for disorderly and disruptive conduct.

he said now that i've been sentenced, i want to again say that it was wrong for me to be inside the u.s. capitol and that i'm sorry. like so many others, i hung on to every word donald trump said and he took advantage of us. my family and i have suffered, first for my bad judgment and then for speaking out. but if it helps this country get over this partisan and divisive bull bleep, it will all be worth it. his story is in contrast not just to what happened to donald trump after january 6, trump has doubled down on the big lie and his presence looms larger than ever on the gop, but also the fate that has befallen some of his fellow insurrections. take for example mark fincham. if elected this november, he will be in charge of a crucial battleground state and he made stunning admission last night, from the arizona republic,

quote, republican secretary of state revealed during a debate thursday that he was interviewed by both the department of justice and the congressional panel investigating the january 6 insurrection at the u.s. capitol. fincham took part in the stop the steal march to the capitol and he says he didn't go into the building that was breached by rioters. he has maintained the presidential election was stolen from trump and thursday he invoked the mules conspiracy documentary as evidence that there was fraud in the election. a critical hearing by the january 6 select committee against the backdrop of and on going threat to our democracy is where we start. joining us from member of the select knit committee. there is news on the legislation that you and liz cheney are

working on. tell us where that stands. >> we think it is an important piece of legislation. we know the president was vie violating the electoral count act and as well as the 12th amendment. and there is looseness in that that invites mischief and so liz cheney and i have worked very hard, and the january 6 committee is not just about fact finding but recommending legislation difference changes to make us safer. and we do a number of things.ifo make us safer. and we do a number of things. the ex-president lied to people and made them believe that pence had the authority to throw the election out and impose his will to make trump the president even though he lost the election. and we made it completely clear

that that is not the case along with raising the threshold for objections, making sure that the objections are rooted in the constitution, not fantasies. and a number of other procedural protections that we think will go a long ways to prevent the kind of misconduct that the ex-president engaged in. he knew what he was doing was illegal. he was told that. even john eastman said it was illegal. it passed the house. >> a but majority of the republicans voted against it. if you vote against this, what are you for? >> it is interesting, rodney davis the ranking member of house administration committee basically said that the system worked. right? so i guess the riot was okay.

i mean, i know that davis was not in favor of the riot. but to say that the system worked without change when we had that kind of riot and an ex-president who whipped people into a frenzy by lying to them, that is just dumb. and, you know, the republican leadership whipped against the bill. i think it is very unfortunate, but it is a bipartisan bill and of course there is bipartisan work in the senate to also do a bill. there is a lot of overlap, there is a few dissimilarities. but i'm confident that we can bridge what few gaps there are and come up with a good strong bicameral, bipartisan law that will make our country safer and i hope that we can do that in the very near future. >> the republican leadership whipped against the crist sense of the select committee, the republican leadership wanted people who are under scrutiny for their roles, and i wonder if

the republican members will be a focus of your next public hearing. >> i won't get into what the hearing will be about. live those announcements to the chair and vice chair. we do think that it will be worth watching. there is new information. we've worked throughout the summer. we've introduced quite a number of people and received quite a lot of documents. but i will say i'm disappointed, although unfortunately not completely surprised, that the republican leadership has been so unwilling to take steps to make our country safer from insurrection. but in a way maybe -- given that majority of the republicans voted to overturn the election, maybe it is not a surprise. >> i want to show you something, your colleague in congress and on the committee, liz cheney,

said about donald trump's criminal exposure and culpability. >> as we detailed in our january 6 hearings, a federal judge has remvp viewed evidence submitted by the january 6 committee and concluded that former president trump likely violated two criminal statutes when he pressured vice president pence to reject legitimate state electoral votes in our joint session. that is what vice president pence called, quote, unamerican. in our hearing, we have demonstrated that president trump knew specifically, knew specifically, that what he was doing was illegal. but he did it anyway. president trump's conduct was illegal under the existing eelectoral count act and it would be illegal under this new bill as well. >> we don't know what we don't know about what has gone on at

doj before. liz cheney and others started citing the criminal statutes that you all have mustered the evidence to prove have been violated. but we do know that since your dramatic public system and since the evidence was marshalled in public, that the doj investigations are further along. i wonder if you can talk about whether additional crimes will be introduced into public evidence and additional evidence will be presented to prove that those crimes should also be under investigation. >> as you know, nicolle, we've laid out facts and for the most part not attempted to make a criminal law case because that is not the role of a legislative committee. congresswoman cheney was appropriately in that clip you just played quoting a federal district court judge who reached a conclusion based on the evidence he reviewed that

ex-president trump and dr. eastman had violated the law. we've laid out evidence that shows that that is the case is liz cheney just pointed out. but there are two things that the department of justice has to do. they need to identify evidence that crime has been committed and then they need to make assessments of whether the evidence is sufficient to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that that is the case. so that is a job that they have to do. the legislative committee can't do it for them. but we'll be laying out some additional information. and as i say, some of this has to do with the culpability, whether it is moral or criminal, but some of it is outlining ways that we can make our country safer as we did with the reform of the electoral count act and

there are other things that we're looking at that would make us less vulnerable to misconduct that we saw the ex-president engage in. >> you can legislate yourself to safety when the ex-president is describing the capitol police officers who protected democratic and republican members of congress a disgrace? can you protect against a leader of one of the two parties who has aligned himself with the qanon conspiracies? >> well, those are very alarming and i think unamerican things to do honestly. you can't legislate somebody having shame, you can't legislate make somebody honorable in their conduct.

but you can make it more difficult to distort. for example, as mr. ayres said, the ex-president told people, an armed mob, that vice president pence had the ability to throw the votes out. that was not the case. but there was enough ambiguity in the statute that he could get away with that lie. if we change the statute, it will be very clear that that lie is false. and so that helps. >> congresswoman, news has broken that the committee has successfully negotiated an interview with ginni thomas. and what is in the public arena, especially at the "washington post," they have reported on the email she sent to actual legislators urging them on overturn the results of free and fair elections in their states and deny the will of the voters

in those states. that is also part of the snurks under criminal scrutiny. but i bone wonder what the committee's interest it in ginni thomas. >> as we've indicated publicly, we have an interest inwonder wh committee's interest it in ginni thomas. >> as we've indicated publicly, we have an interest inwonder wh committee's interest it in ginni thomas. >> as we've indicated publicly, we have an interest inwonder wh committee's interest it in ginni thomas. >> as we've indicated publicly, we have an interest inwonder wh committee's interest it in ginni thomas. >> as we've indicated publicly, we have an interest inwonder wh committee's interest it in ginni thomas. >> as we've indicated publicly, we have an interest in discussing with her the various activities that she knew about relative to the fake electors and efforts to overthrow the election. she said publicly that she can clarify everything. and that she is willing to come in. and i'm glad that she is following through on that. i don't want to jump ahead and say what this interview will yield because we haven't had it yet. but i'm looking forward to all the information that she can provide us. and once again, this is a legislative committee, not a criminal investigation. we do however have a strong interest in what dr. eastman

did. as you know he took the fifth amendment before the committee all day. and i think that he took the fifth amendment because he must believe that he has criminal culpability. and she of course had extensive communication with dr. eastman. >> i wonder if you want to know about conversations between ginni thomas and her husband who is the lone united states supreme court justice to dissent from the decision that freed up many of donald trump's records to be used and consumed as part of your investigation. >> that would not be a focus i don't think of our investigation. you know, our investigation is to find all the facts that led up to the january 6 riot and effort to overturn the election. and i wouldn't say that any conversations between husband

and wife would ordinarily be within the scope of that investigation. >> what do you make of the public its trust of the united states supreme court dropping to historic lows? gallup who records whether the public approved of the supreme court tracked a 20 point drop and at the same time, you have the wife of a sitting supreme court justice who is the lone dissent in a decision to turn donald trump's records over to the committee investigating a deadly insurrection. you have her at the center of what we know is under criminal investigation, the fake electors plot. what do you make as a member of a co-equal branch of government about the public sentiment about the united states supreme court? >> well, i think unfortunately the court's actions on a number of cases have made the court

seemed like just another partisan institution. and the justices should take care that their actions don't feed that perception. the fact that new justices voted to throw out a 50 year precedent after telling the u.s. senate that they had no intention of doing so helps also undercut confidence in their nonpartisan activity. so it is not for me to tell justices when they should recuse, but ordinarily the recusal is when there is a conflict or whenever there is an appearance of a conflict. and i think that many feel that justice thomas would have been well advised to consider that standard when hearing that case. but it is a broader concern than

just that case. you know, we have now a court where the decision is predicted based on the partisan appointment of the judges. that didn't used to be true. and it is really a very serious matter for our country when that institution, which is supposed to be above toll tic politics i perceived unfortunately of being much of politics. so we have a lot of repair do. >> never a shortage of things to ask you. we're grateful for you to taking our questions at the end of a busy week and ahead of an even busier one. thank you so much. >> thank you. joining our conversation, katie bennett and andrew weissmann. both msnbc crib tors. the delicacy with whichever public statement around ginni thomas is handled is so

fascinating to me. if you are just going to bottom line it and put it out there, she is married to the only supreme court justice who doesn't want congress to look at the text which included her texts to mark meadows which basicallied to him to get with sydney on the fake evidence of fraud. what do you make of the importance of not just the public hearing next week but the private interviews still ahead? >> taking the ginni thomas pete first, there are legitimate reasons to have her be interviewed because as representative lofgren said, she had extensive communications with a lawyer named john eastman and she may have the information about a plot to basically behead the justice department so that crony could be put in and a keep

to pressure the vice president. so she has a lot of information potentially as an important witness. and also connective tissue to these various schemes. so they there are good and sufficient reasons to call her. and i think that the additional reason that everyone is fascinated and also disturbed by is because of the refusal her husband to recuse himself. and that really can't be laid at her feet and it is important to separate the two, but i do think that her interview with put a lot more pressure on the actions of her husband in deciding to sit on a case where he clearly had a vested interest and, you know, it is really i think beyond the pail that he did not recuse himself and it will lead to as the representative said to additional sort of skept tim about skepticism of the supreme

court. >> and she gave a very holistic response. it is not lost on chief justice john roberts. i want your analysis and insights into what has changed in terms of what we know doj is looking at? last time there were public hearings from the 1/6 hearing, it was so opaque how much of this was under scrutiny criminally by doj. feels like we know a lot more both about the elector scheme, about trump's inner circle, about the big griff which was the subject of lofgren's testimony. talk about how the doj has caught up with the 1/6 committee. >> and the justice department would argue that they have not caught up so much that they

are -- they were not trying to catch up, but their investigation start from a very different place. we can see that they are basically looking at everything. they are looking at the actions taken by trump's closest inner circle ahead of the rally on january 6 to see was going on there. we know they are looking at seditious conspiracy because they have already charged two of those cases. it is unclear whether or not they have found any connections between those people charged who are members of far right nationalist groups including oath keepers and proud boys with anybody close to the's inner ci. and also looking at placing people in key swing states to having them falsely always that donald trump won in those states. just a couple weeks ago they

issued more than 40 subpoenas requesting documents and other information from a variety of people, you know, looking at those very issues. it will take a long time now for the fbi to come through whatever it is that people give them to find the information responsive to their investigation. so they are moving, but still i think fairly early to middle stages of the investigation. >> and andrew, i thought the points that you made about the posture of rule of law and about the threats it faces and i wonder how you think that bodes for what katie describes as pretty early stage investigations in to 1/6. >> so i put the pieces together in the following way, which is that i think that there is the will there and i think that is a big strange frankly as a result of the january 6 committee that

you have seen a change in the attorney general's support for this kind of investigation. leave aside the mar-a-lago piece. but i think in many ways the january 6 committee did the public such a big service because they also essentially gave cover to the department of justice in taking a broader action. that being said, i really do think that it is important to stress what katie said which is i agree, and i know a lot of my colleagues who do what i do, joyce vance has said this, which i do think that this is early stages. we don't have a sense of how big the team is. this will need to have a large sophisticated team at the fbi and at the justice department. and it is really important that merrick garland has the will do this. but that there also is just the leg work and skill that lk needed to move this along and i

do think that the january 6 type investigationneeded to move this along and i do think that the january 6 type investigation, those are all the signs that i think that we can see publicly, it doesn't feel in the middle or towards the end. >> so interesting. eric holder made the similar point before the public hears began that perhaps one of the greatest services of the public phase would be to sort of socialize the idea and familiarize the public with the broader body of evidence that may come under scrutiny by doj. and this will always be the week that the courts called out donald trump. they called his bluff on his claims that he magically declassified document that's kept at his club just by thinking it. we'll talk about what is next in that investigation as well as donald trump's growing legal jeopardy. and the scandals keep filing up for the midterm candidates, one

involving a candidate who reportedly lied about giving to charity and another who lied about serving in afghanistan. and another whose testimony led to the investigation that threatens to bring down the trump family business. michael cohen will join our discussion. michael cohen will join our discussion shingles. some describe it as pulsing electric shocks or sharp, stabbing pains. ♪♪ this painful, blistering rash can disrupt your life for weeks. a pain so intense, you could miss out on family time. the virus that causes shingles is likely already inside of you. if you're 50 years or older, ask your doctor or pharmacist about shingles. what do we want delivered every month? clumping litter? salmon pate? love that for me. just choose the frequency and ship it!

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spokesman says that intelligence officials have also picked back up their classification review and national security risk assessment of those documents. it is week of mounting peril for the ex-president. it highlights the glaring gap between the bizarre ways he says he declassified documents including by thinking about them and his own legal team's reluctant to repeat any of the whamky ones in quote. from the "new york times," over the past week, it undermines a bullwark of his efforts to justify his actions suggesting that theres of no evidence to support the assertion that trump declassified everything despite what he may have said on tv.

he will have to support those claims in court. and this was a week that doj finally was aided by the gravity of the rule of law and the truth and the facts coming back into focus in the back and forth with trump's team. >> absolutely. and we were speaking how the january 6 investigation is still really early on. in terms of the documents investigation, that was an investigation that was moving on it a much more relatively more rapid clip. it was clear in the documents and records that have been made public that the justice determine had formed a theory of the case, they felt that he may have violated the espionage act, they received evidence from his

home and then it came to a pretty harsh stop with this court battle. and now that they can use these national security documents, the classified information, they can do a couple key things. they can assess the threat to national security. they can try to assess whether or not the former president showed the documents to people and to whom. this can conduct more veer would you interviews talks about the documents. and this helps move the investigation forward. and they don't impacted midterm elections so the ball keeps rolling. >> and so i've said you seem optimistic, why. and you had a sense probably from your expertise and your years of public service, you understood it was heading this direction, but talk about the implications on what we now

understand to bee completely linked up pursuits and protecting state secrets. your, this is the argument made to the 11th circuit and before that to judge cannon which is that the two are so interlinked. so if something doesn't agree to a voluntary interview to find out what they knew about these documents, you want to issue a grand jury subpoena. and that is a criminal process. so you need to have the two interlinked. but, you know, nicolle, i'll give you the counter to sort of i am optimistic in terms of this coming to an end. but i'm going to tell you about a conversation that i had last night with two former fbi officials who are superb gt as

and they were scoffing at me that this would ever result in a criminal case.agents and they were scoffing at me that this would ever result in a criminal case. i do think that merrick garland will be focused on prez dent precedent to me. but their point is the sign of staffing within the finefbi and the department. we see that it is staffed by counterintelligence folks. but that is not within the bureau or department where you normally see criminal investigations. that istraditionally what they do. and so i think that they are trying to protect a lot of people who are part of the investigation by not making them public in the way that the t. happened in the special counsel

investigation and it protects them from the attacks.he t. happened in the special counsel investigation and it protects them from the attacks.e t. happened in the special counsel investigation and it protects them from the attacks. t. happened in the special counsel investigation and it protects them from the attacks.t. happened in the special counsel investigation and it protects them from the attacks.. happened in the special counsel investigation and it protects them from the attacks. happened in the special counsel investigation and it protects them from the attacks.happened in the special counsel investigation and it protects them from the attacks. but it makes it hard for the outsiders. but what you see is not the traditional groups that you would turn to if you are doing a case against the former president of the united states. >> so practically speaking it means that the people working this case are counterintelligence agents, they are involved because of the national security risk to the country and if we're going to proceed to any sort of charges against donald trump, they would have to bring prosecutor type, and you don't see any sign that that is happen something. >> exactly. granted, we do have the u.s. attorney.

counterintelligence has some experience, but not traditionally where you look. and this is where katie may have more intel. which is who is staffing this. because that i think is really going to be a sign for whether the department is taking this so seriously that they want to have this cross the finish line and they understand the importance of speed in having that done. >> katie. >> sure. so on the staffing concern, i think thatandrew's point is serious. i've heard that the justice department is being extremely careful about who goes on dockets, who appears in court. they are trying not to give the public too much more information about names of people working on this case because of security reasons. there have been so many threats against for example jay bratt who is named on all these documents who appeared in court. and others including the fbi agents whose names were on the

search warrant. and that if feels like to the department you are taking unnecessary risk at a time where there are a myriad and constant and very violent threats against people working on this particular case. so that could be -- i don't know if it is deputy, but it could be one reason why we don't have more of a sense of staffing. and the other thing that i think is related to andrew's point is that because this case is one that deals with really -- sensitive classified information, that actually complicates the department's ability to bring a criminal charge against donald trump. the reason for that is because any national security secret that could really harm the united states, that would be extremely dangerous if it were put into public view, the very thing that you would want to prosecute somebody for, that is the information that the intelligence community is very, very cautious about putting in front of a jury. so is it makes it hard to use some of these things as evidence. >> it is so counterintuitive

that about a the stuff trump took and kept and lied about returning is so sensitive, he almost had some insurance against a jury trial. it is incredible. continues to benefit by his conduct. thank you both so much for starting us off. up next for us, in a rare interview, a former supreme court justice speaks out about his role in that stunning game changing decision by the supreme court to overturn wade roe v. wade. stays with us. overturn wade ro wade stays with us. or active psoriatic arthritis and... take. it. on. with rinvoq. rinvoq is a once-daily pill that tackles pain, stiffness, swelling. for some, rinvoq significantly reduces ra and psa fatigue. it can stop irreversible joint damage. and rinvoq can leave skin clear or almost clear in psa. that's rinvoq relief. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections,

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you say did i like this dobbs decision? of course i didn't. did i do everything i could to persuade people in of course. >> how concerned are you about the state of the country today and the polarization? >> worried. >> that might be the understatement of the century. worried. that was former supreme court justice stephen breyer after retiring from the court in his frustrations and certain about the state of the country. and as we discussed, ginni thomas who is the wife of clarence thomas agreed to an

interview with the january 6 select committee to discuss her efforts tooff turn the 2020 presidential election. joining our conversation, legal correspondent season user owed either editor of slate and author of a really important beautifully written and new book called "lady justice, women the law and the battle to save america." when you start writing a book, you can't know that it will end up being the biggest issue in the country. >> i would even cop to the fact that i would happily have a less stirring release if roe had not been overturned. what makes the book timely is also the thing that breaks my heart. >> talk about that. >> well, the book sort of start mis-2016 when the court is hearing a big abortion case and there is finally three women at the court and there is a woman

arguing and it is so clear that we're close, we're close to getting something that feels like equality and the decision in all women's health which was a spectacular decision kind of senator centering women and we were inching up for something that felt like parity and respect and dignity. and then someone was running for president who was accused of horrific assaults on women. and now everything that lock her up chant directed at hillary clinton is actually being done to women around the country. >> such an amazing sort of book ended analysis of where we are. talk about where the court is, because i've never seen the public angst about this. and the truth is that supreme

court has dropped 20 points in terms of how the public views them in terms of approval on legitimacy. >> yeah, there is no other way to describe it i think other than as a complete self-own. i think that the court which is the custodian of its own public respect and legitimacy has done one thing after another and another in a compress amount of time, whether it is the shadow rocket orders that they are deciding on an emergency basis late at night without interesting, that was sb-8 one year ago, or whether it is these partisan speeches going to the mitch mcconnell center and lauding his greatest, or the leak which is unpresented, or the way that the justices attack each other in the open, all of that in the shocking term that we had last year, not just abortion, but guns, the ep ap, religion, everything was on the

table and the court did not seem inclined at all to pump the brakes. i think they drove it over the cliff and now blames us for our lack of regard for the court. >> and during the dobbs arguments, justice sotomayor talked about the stench on the court and something really specific. it is about republican state legislators passing bills based on who trump appointed to the court and what they thought held come. how has that become part of the dueling supreme court justice speeches? that is an undeniable fact that they passed the bans after trump made his three picks. >> and it was clear over the progression of dobbs which was briefed to be one thing and as soon as amy coney barrett came on the court asked for something

else, which is a complete overturn of roe v. wade. no better symbol of how -- what it is that was happening is entirely a function of who was on the court. and i think that there is a really deep sense on the part of dissenters that this is because you can't win in, you know, a fair fashion, you are not just seeing statehouse that are passing that on its face nullify roe, but they are going further that if you don't like it, ladies, go out and vote. you are not without electoral power. and the sense that he is quite literally trolling us, that this is the same supreme court that has handed power to state legislatures, taking away power from voters, to say that you are not without power, go ahead and vote, and also we're taking away your vote, that is just next

level trolling. >> amazing. this a beautiful cover. lady justice is out now. and this conversation is to be continued because i don't know if there is any issue weighing more heavily on voters' minds. so i know that you may or may not have had anything do with this, but perfect timing to have written the perfect book. thank you so much for being here to talk about it. >> thank you. and coming up next for us, two scandals in just one day for the gop midterm slate. both involving candidates facing big questions about their past and know for tricky relationship with the truth. that is next. ruth that is next

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anything else i can help you with? like what? visionworks. see the difference. gop problems keep getting worse and worse and they fear that they have nominated an unelectable set ofs. herschel walker has misrepresented his charitable givings. and of the four charity respect one declined to comment and the other said that they had no record of any gifts in the last decade. this comes on the heels of new reporting that a republican running for congress in ohio has misrepresented his military service. the a.p. reporting that jr made

jrmajekski said that he deployed to afghanistan but the records don't show that. let's bring in al sharpton and also michael steele. michael, so this is all an extension of mitch mel refusing to convict donald trump from in-skriting a deadly insurrection. he put in motion the race to the bottom and i think the problem is the ones who might 14ri7 sli through. >> yeah, that is the problem. and we might be focusing on the

bright light but it is the kari lakes that could slip through, the mastrianos of the world who could slip through. so the attention level to mcconnell's plea in the quality of the candidates is real. and not just the one shiny objects that are fodder for humor, but the ones who aren't, the scarier ones, the ones who are more determined to be the next iteration of trump. trumpism has its hold now as you've talked about and covered so aptly over last few months, it has its hold. and it is not on the gop, it is on the country. and so you will see more and more of these candidates kind of fit into that mold. and that is where those trying

to guard against democracy need to be steadfast. >> i agree the bozos aren't as scary as the ones who can hide with those between dreamists. who are you worried about and watching? >> kari lake is at the top. governor of florida, for all the stuff he has done, he will probably get elected and in a big way. so you are looking at these individuals, in that bucket, but you have then the truth deniers who already hold office. the what-aboutism that they promote. when you look at a rubio campaign, when you look at someone like the senator from

south carolina, who is pushing out this noise that further fuels the flames here. so when lindsey graham is out there, all are the prties are upset that he said this about abortion, okay, but that is the least of the concerns when you are looking at the bigger picture about what impact what lindsay has said and how he protected trumpism up to this point. so those are the fink things that we have to focus on and we understand what next year will look like if republicans have roll of the house.we have to fo understand what next year will look like if republicans have roll of the house.have to focus understand what next year will look like if republicans have roll of the house. >> it feels like the president is trying to make the argument of the extreme in terrorism's image. which candidates are doing the

best? >> as i travel the country, i see that if you look at the campaign of ms. beasley in north care, i think she's doing it very well. i think val dem beings in florida is doing it well. stacy abrams is doing it well.m florida is doing it well. stacy abrams is doing it well.b florida is doing it well. stacy abrams is doing it well.ea is doing it well. stacy abrams is doing it well.i is doing it well. stacy abrams is doing it well.n is doing it well. stacy abrams is doing it well. i think what has happened is they have tried to re-enter pretty on the republican side what is even required to run for office. you have to remember that donald trump was accused of all kinds of things and even on tape saying things about women. so they are trying to make it permanent that it doesn't matter if you lie about your background. and he won't release his tax returns and you find out why if you look at the attorney general

lawsuit. so herschel walker didn't do what he said and still within a margin of error on georgia. the real fear i have is that we have lowered the bar so in american politics that is acceptable to lie and there is no standards anymore because there was a time you had to lead the race and now if it is a bad day, don't worry, there is tomorrow. >> and just go on fox news and wash and dry and repeat. we'll be watching politics nations this weekend. thank you both so much for being with us. the man who once said that he knows where all of donald trump's skeletons were buried because he buried them, that is donald trump's former personal attorney michael cohen and he is on guest when "deadline: white house" returns after a quick break. hite house" returns after a quick break. to severe rheumatoid arthritis or active psoriatic arthritis

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diverse and creative people. but when the out-of-state corporations behind prop 27 look at california, they see nothing but suckers. they wrote prop 27 to give themselves 90% of the profits from online sports betting in california. other states get much more. why is prop 27 such a suckers deal for california? because the corporations didn't write it for us. they wrote it for themselves. kevin: i've fought wildfires for twenty years. here's the reality we face every day. this is a crisis. we need more firefighters, more equipment, better forest management to prevent wildfires and reduce toxic smoke. and we need to reduce the tailpipe emissions that are driving changes to our climate. that's why cal fire firefighters, the american lung association, and the california democratic party support prop 30. prevent fires. cut emissions. and cleaner air. yes on 30.

i love it when everything comes full circle. hi, it is 5:00 in new york. you probably heard it before, when a tiny event or microscopic change sets off a massive chain reaction. eventually resulting in something much, much bigger. the flutter of a wing snowballing into a hurricane. consider that line of thinking in the context of this week's historic and unprecedented developments. week talking about the lawsuit

brought by latitia james implicating donald trump and his three eldest children. yes, the result of an investigation into his business practices. but to understand what originally sparked had huge moment wednesday, we have to go back a bit further. the flutter of the bitter fly's wing happened in 2006 when donald trump reportedly made the decision to have an extra marital affair with a porn star named stormy daniels. a decade later, that one decision prompted a directive from trump to his attorney who often served as his fixer, michael cohen. cohen was reimbursed for illegal hush money payments to keep the entire favor -- affair quiet. and michael ultimately served time but not before fully

cooperating with law enforcement and providing testimony before the oversight committee. >> did the president or his company ever inflate or assets? >> yes. >> to an insurance company? >> yes. >> who else knows that the president did this? >> allen weisselberg, rob leaner man and matthew calamari. >> and do you think that we need to review his financial statements and his tax returns to c ompare them? >> yes, and you would find it at the trump org. >> and those of us in the public learned from the first time in that exchange and provided key insight into the trump organization's pattern of shady business practices which brings us back to where we started. the metaphorical hurricane this week, a huge lawsuit for donald trump, donald trump jr., eric trump, ivanka trump from a trump

extramarital affair to this. >> fraud and deception that was used by mr. trump and the trump organization for their own financial beneficial is astounding. inflating the values of assets by whatever means necessary to increase mr. trump's purported net worth. i will remind everyone that this investigation only started after michael cohen the former lawyer, his former lawyer, testified before congress a this high school -- misconduct. >> and joining us now is michael cohen. his new book is out next month. and i want to pull back the curtain about what you can see there, but this is the first time we've had a chance to talk

to but you as the connect difference tissue and she mentioned you, she thanks you for your cooperation. and we had a sense i think from donny deutsch and others that you were very cooperative with the multiple investigations into trump. did you think that it would come to this lawsuit that you saw this week? >> i didn't think that it would be a 200 page indictment to be very honest but, and i'm extremely thankful to our tenacious and just our fierce attorney general tish james, the shout out was extremely appreciative because i spent over 400 hours speaking to seven different congressional committees, law enforcement, attorney general, district attorney and so on. and to be recognized and acknowledged for it was extremely -- it was appreciated. but i never thought there would be a 200 page indictment.

i knew of almost all of these actions that she talks about, but i didn't think that you needed 200. like the al capone effect, you won't get him on racketeering, you get him on tax evasion. and much of this, especially the easier low hanging fruit so to speak, that was available a long time ago. and all i can say is she is possibly one of the most thorough attorney generals in this country. >> what some e she seems to hav mar shelled is the actual receipts. she says that they have the documents. so is it just an open and shut case? >> it looks like it to me. and i think that donald acknowledges that it is a an open and shut case because at the looks terrible right now.

going on sean hannity, listening to the ramblings from the old movie young frank stein, the nonsensele cal ramblings, but yet they put it on television. >> it was amazing. and there have been other moments. i was to told in trump's camp that you had theability to take him down. what has the next five years been like? >> nothing but pain. watching my family suffer. i talk about it in the book revenge, why? because i am responsible for the stormy daniels payment. nevertheless, the southern district of new york basically put a gun to my wife's said and said michael, you either plead guilty on a friday night at 5:30 to a monday or we're filing an 80 page indictment that will

include your wife. so there was no way that i would put her through this nonsense so i never thought the judge would give a 36 month sentence, i thought it would be financial. so when i started to realize that donald was behind it and that is where in the book i provide not my statements because donald is excellent, he is an excellent marketer, he mansions whether it is the little marco rubio, it is the lying ted, and funny that they are so close now. don't worry, ted, you go go into the bus soon too. and then you start with the low energy jeff. he labeled me a liar. and therefore my credibility came into question which is why probably alvin bragg claims that i wouldn't be a credible witness. nonsense. when he testified before the oversight committee, i knew that every republican would talk me a credibility because i knew the playbook. i wrote it and i told them i

know what you're doing. not one of them asking me a single question about donald. and so that is where revenge goes in to it and i layout not from my words but from fbi agents, former fbi agents, current, judges, prosecutor, in their words not mine explaining what is going on here. and all of this was created by a president who didn't want to be a president, he wanted to be king. listen to the sean hannity only a king can think and -- >> even a king has to declare things so. >> maybe 1700s. but i was talking about this the other night when i was on another program and i said i hope he doesn't have that ability because i feel like my throat is closing. maybe he is thinking about choking me. but i'm still here. >> and he was serious with

taking that screen, sometimes used as a screen for as miami alzheimer's, why did he take? >> he had no idea. he thought it was an intelligence test. you can't major this stuff up. folks, this is america. >> take us through what happened to you at the hands of the built barr justice department. >> no, i mean, i talk about it extensively in the book. all of a sudden i'm released based upon covid, based upon with what they call co-morbidities. several years earlier i had blown a whole series of

pulmonary embolus and so they release me. but then they pull it back. and all thefiles had to go to washington to approve it. and then my wife had to find all the documents. and so i go for an ankle monitor. i had my son waiting in front of the building. all of a sudden they tell me, well, we need you to sign this two page document. and it is not a two page document that looks like any federal document that you've of seen because it doesn't exist. they wrote it specifically for me. and the very first paragraph prohibits me from publishing a book, speaking to media. a complete infringement on my first amendment constitutional right. and i brought a friend of mine who is a lawyer, i've known him forever, and i wanted a witness. and so he turns around and he

goes how can me client possibly sign this? it is a violation of his first amendment constitutional right. not only could i not speak, no member of my family could speak, neither could any friends. it was so overbroad. that being said, they asked us to wait in the lobby in the waiting area while they speak to their superiors so that they could make some alterations to it. and an hour and 15 minutes later, three marshals standing over me, not just with handcuffs, hand scuffs, shack kell, they put me in this rook that was maybe 30, 40 degrees for like three hours.scuffs, sh kell, they put me in this rook that was maybe 30, 40 degrees for like three hours. i've never been so cold. >> because you couldn't sign this gag order? >> because i wouldn't sign it.

and they drove me back to prison that night all done by the president and bill barr. and so what the american people think that they know about me, what they think what they know about my case, you don't. and what we do in this book is i show you, and not my word, the words of prosecutor, judges, lawyer, we show you all where this is all going including the fact that i can't get my own documents from foia because it will implicated entire department of justice. and i don't care for jeff berman. and his book that just came out, which i won't buy and i won't read, nevertheless, it validates my book. it is exactly what i've been saying all along that trump, bill barr -- remember, bill barr will do nothing except donald trump told him do it.

he was excerpts the pressure. i didn't have the affair. and i was just directed to make the payment, do an mda. >> so you agree with what you understand berman wrote about main doj having a 40 page, i think the charging documents, they wanted to scrub any reference to individual one who was donald trump as unindicted co-conspirator. >> and yet they scrubbed 18 to 20 pages. i don't give him a pass. he sat with this for four, five years for what purpose? he had something to write a book about? destroying my life so you could profit from it is this i don't think so, pal. >> and what do you -- what do you see as still unfinished business? i mean, the criminal

investigation and criminal investigators had access to all the same evidence that the attorney general tish james -- why is there not a criminal investigation? there there will be. >> by who? >> i believe that there will be a criminal prosecution by the irs. i believe that there will be potentially a criminal prosecution by sdny, especially now that it is not trump controlled. and i also believe that there will be other criminal investigations that will be forthcoming. but remember this is all part of the playbook that i am responsible for helping to create. this playbook is delay, delay, delay. nice part, he is not delaying anything from tish james. she is now -- she is fully committed and she'll go down in history as helping to save democracy. >> when you provided testimony to tish james, was cy vance's

representative in the room? >> every time that i met, and i met 12 or 13 times with the district attorney, three while i was still incarcerated up in otisville, every time there after when i returned, there was a member of tish james' office present and then they decided to do this as a team. and they shared information so whatever i gave to the d.a., they shared with our attorney general. >> so one of the -- the prosecutors quit the criminal case. >> two of them. >> two of them. and then they detail some of their reasons in their resignation letters. but what gets mr. bragg from all the evidence you provided tish james,you provided mr. bragg's office to what we see is a pretty open and shut case of

criminal tax fraud and insurance fraud? why didn't he charge? >> it is an interesting question and really one that only alvin bragg assuming he wants to tell the truth will state. so here is the interesting thing. mark pomerantz, who is a veteran attorney, of the highest quality, and the same with carey dunne, they both resigned. it was six weeks into alvin bragg's taking over of the district attorney's office. after six weeks he makes a determination that there is not enough here for us to go after. >> and there is nothing that tish james had that he didn't have. >> correct. and vice versa. nothing. i mean, in that letter, he spells out specifically that at the end of the day, we believe that we have a multitude of crimes to prosecute on. and six weeks in, and he will tell you that he read documents and so on. no two people no more about this case than mark pomerantz and

carey dunne. they spent more than two years doing this. they know every page. there is a about a million documents in that office. and the fact that they resigned in protest? part of my book. >> when tish james said that cushman and wakefield is under investigation, and they are talking to deutsche bank, do they face lawsuits? >> it is possible. i don't want to get into the potential of what tish james is prosecuting on. her and her indictment spoels it out. but there is a topic that lot of people aren't looking at in tish james' indictment documents. there were subpoenas sent to donald regarding the classified documents and he said we don't have any and they served him with a complaint. he of course opposes it. and they lose. the trump organization lose.

so then he appeals it. delay, delay, delay. so he appeal it he loses again. takes it to the supreme court. delay, delay, delay. and he lose it is again. and -- >> and that opens up the mazur -- >> no, this is financial documents. it is part of that. correct. what happens, he is obligated to turnover the financial records. does he? no. and he complains there is no more documents to present. the fbi raid finds a box of documents exactly responsive to the subpoena. he now has an obstruction of justice case as well. >> is that he why he is fighting the return of the document sths. >> that and so many other things. he believes that by doing this he will be able to delay it long enough that the november -- midterm elections will change and in fact what they will do, he will try to exert pressure over the republican party to get

the people do what he bt with as. s it is not about him. he will throw his kids under the bus too. an interesting dynamic. none of them have loyalty at all. but that is why he is doing it. it is all about delaying long enough to think in his mind which is inaccurate that he could effectuate the determination that he wants. >> is this the most trouble he's ever been in? >> absolutely. he has, what, eight, nine investigations? when i testified before the house oversight committee, as a result of that, and i give so much respect for congressmen clay and aoc and so many others who had asked, rest in peace, elijah consummings who asked ab things that led to 18 investigations being opened.

but yet the judge ruled that i didn't cooperate and therefore i shouldn't get a sentence reduction pip wouldn't sign the 5k 1 cooperation agreement. why would i? i didn't commit a crime. ask me whatever you want and i'll tell you and give you the documents that i have. they didn't want to hear it. they don't care. it is our way or the highway. and i said i didn't do in i go so not a chance. it was only after they decided to go after my wife -- >> yeah, he is -- >> he's the guy who excellent slept with her. it is not because i didn't have the money, but it would be never be able to explain to my wife that i took $130,000 out of our

joint accounting check. what is it for? i can't tell you. that won't go over well. >> let me ask you about the kids. have they ever been in this much trouble? >> don and ivanka saw some trouble with the trump soho project. my favorite story which i wrote in "disloyal" when donald said if one of the two have to go, let it be don junior. >> i remember that. >> yeah, he'd say by the time she got back, her roots would be jet black. >> what do you think they are thinking is this it seems like jared is probably ivanka's confidant and it is unclear to m whether -- are they plotting against each other in. >> absolutely. they are trying to figure out who can provide the information to get them off. and ivanka truthfully is the

most incentivized. let's being serious. jared kushner gets $2 billion from the saudis? he may be one of the most incompetent real estate people in the history of new york. he's done the single worst deal. 666 fifth avenue. and it would have wiped out his family. >> everything you know, what do you think donald trump took in addition to the financial things he was trying to keep from tish james or anyone else, what do you think that he took to mar-a-lago? >> obviously he took personal mementos so he can show off to people. when he would go there after to maybe saudi arabia or, hey, look, i got this letter from putin or i got this love letter -- who gets love letters from kim jung-un? i don't get it, but not for me to discuss. i also believe he took the top secret documents for the sole purpose of using it as a get out

of jail free card. basically leverage. it is for him power and leverage. the power is he still believes that he is president of the united states of america. he walks around his golf clubs demanding people to refer to him as mr. president. he is still wearing the presidential seal. that is okay if that is all you got in clothing. but then on top of it, he takes these documents, top secret documents and that is a get out of jail free card. you want to indict me and my family? i'll turn these documents over to our adversaries and then let's see what happens. >> incredible. will you come back when "revenge" is out? >> absolutely. there is on which -- listen, like i said -- >> it is really unexamined this period. >> there has never been a case like this in the history of america. i wrote this because i never

want to see it again. when you have parents of unfortunately, breaks me hart when you see children who get killed with these out of control people going into schools with guns and so on, they all become activists because there is a pain that we feel from an injustice. i can't explain it. it is something unfortunately you only feel. i want to make sure that this never happens again because trump created his own playbook here. and what we have to be concerned about is someone like a ron desantis, donald trump 2.0, a guy smarter and potentially more devious than donald coming and doing the same to you or to any of this his critics. so my mission is that justice is served. >> and can't wait to dive into it.

glad you wrote about it. michael cohen, thank you for being here. we need to squeeze in a quick break. when we come back, reaction as the walls close in on the disgraced ex-president. and how right wing groups are just now quitely ramping up their assault on the right to vote 45 days ahead of the midterms leading democratic elections attorney will take us inside their stealth operation and what can be done to stop it. n and what can be done to stop it. oooh we're firing up the chewy app... what do we want delivered every month. hmm. clumping litter? resounding yes. salmon pate, love that for me. and some of those catnip toys. just choose the frequency...

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in the break we talked michael cohen to stick around with john heilemann. >> and nothing that happens in the break -- >> under my motorcycle helmet. >> that is what guys are bad haircuts -- >> by the way, if you didn't have a mullet, you weren't cool. there we'll take the next couple minutes to dig up these photos. but in the meantime, i want to ask you -- i need to regain control here. but michael cohen as i said to

him on the air, he has singular observations about donald trump. but the reference in tish james' lawsuit to documents that may have been at mar-a-lago could that could be responsive to the subpoenas, is to me one of the flashing red warnings about what is really going on in that investigation. >> absolutely, nicolle. and i did this when he said that, just the layered nature of everything. and so i just have this question that i want to ask michael if you don't mind. s as these cases begin to close in, what are donald trump's possible reactions? you testified that you didn't believe that he was going to agree to a peaceful transfer of power. it was prophetic. do you think

he will unleash the threats of violence that he has talked about in light of these cases closing in on him? >> i think that he has already done that. if you listen to the rhetoric that comes out of his mouth on a regular basis, even two weeks ae ago he made a statement on television americans aren't going to take this, they won't take this sitting down, they will rise up and fight like hell. right? and what he is doing, he is calling to arms all of the people that are his maga supporters. and that is what he is doing. so he is doing it the way a mob boss does it. he's giving you the code but not actually saying it so he doesn't end up with the 4r50ib89. liability like what he is facing with january 6. >> i don't know what the sthifl sniffle thing is now. >> yeah, people ask me is donald

trump on drugs because he is constantly sniffing. he just has allergies. >> i have allergies but i don't sniff. john heilemann, what do you make of week that was? >> i go to the 30,000 foot. basic feeling about the americans who hate him, and there is a lot, people are weary and there is a sense of like he never has had to pay. he's never -- the bill has never come due. accountability has never been brought to him.

and somehow partly because of what we saw the mueller investigation, two impeachments, everything that happened and he hasn't paid a price. i think people were overly optimistic in those four years that he would be brought down and now they are -- they don't want to get near the hot stove and believe that accountability is at hand. and i think if you look at those two cases and what michael laid out in the previous block, and you listen to -- you think about the -- not just the import of the appeal's court decision or tish james, but things that trump has said and the ways in which the appeals, tactics that they have used, the short term that trump is always looking like a new lilly pad to jump on, but in the court of law where unlike american politics or anywhere else in american society where you can say anything you want and appeal to your side, you get in a court of law and there are rules. he said stuff -- there was a

smarter way to play all of this which was at least on the mrl documents to say i don't know what is here, i'm president of the united states, i have no idea. and if anything is here, it is somebody else's fault, no the high problem. but he needily went into either they planted stuff or they are mine. i think the bill has come due. i think this week you look at it and said the truth is like the likelihood of him being indicted, prosecuted, just nothing is ever certain in american life, but it is like this is -- the walls actually finally are actually closing in. it is not an illusion, no it is for real. >> and how does he keep getting lawyers to represent him?o it i for real. >> and how does he keep getting lawyers to represent him? it is for real. >> and how does he keep getting lawyers to represent him?it is r real. >> and how does he keep getting lawyers to represent him?

>> as you know, he doesn't pay lawyers. even when he wins. the new one is competent, but the other ones are lilly. he has parking lot lawyers. bobb is in trouble herself simply because he had her sign affidavits that there was no more documents. so her client lied. she will now have to potentially testify against him in order to protect herself. how does he get lawyers? i don't know if he can find competent lawyers in this case. i know he has this one, but after a short while, i don't care how much money that they are paying him, you end up walking away because he is impossible. he will dictate to this lawyer who is as i said very competent, he will dictate how it wants to go and every day is a fight. it is exhausting. >> and it is not just the legal

threats, it is also the public conversation put in motion by the select committee's public hearings. since their last hearing,trump has publicly aligned himself with qanon. and we now no he that doj is investigating and that doj has at least commenced a criminal investigation into january 6 and all the people around trump. what do you make of where we are as a country, as the january 6 committee gets ready to resume public hearings next week? >> we're still deeply guided, nicolle. and there are those no matter evidence, no matter the narrative that has been so powerfully told by the january 6 committee, there are still shows hiding behind -- not hiding behind -- who still support donald trump. and their support is deepened at every moment in which he feels grievance. every moment in which he expresses a sense of being a victim, that the deep state is

attacking him. and so each of these cases may deepen our own sense of suspicion, our own feeling that he is corrupt to the core. but for those who support him, it just strengthens their support of him. and this is what makes it interesting to me. donald trump will be revealed. tish james case reveals that he has been lying which most knew about the level of his wealth. emperor has no clothes. and what is revealed if donald trump has no clothes on? my goodness. >> can't see that. >> you know, you get that, will you -- >> you just routined everybody's night throughout america. >> none of us will eat tonight. >> you knew donald trump when -- some of his early interviews, he

wasn't a republican and then he became a republican and now the republican standard bearer and now playing the qanon theme song at his rallies. is migration about anyone that will come? >> yeah, it is all about him having an audience. he desperately needs an audience around him all the time. another example, there was recently a picture of donald on his golf course with like six, seven team around him and everybody kept saying it is like a mafia around him. it is not. eric was next to him, and he then the guy who was the tee master. he likes an audience because that way any member that is a driving body sees donald trump holding court. it is a power thing. >> and one thing i learned from michael cohen over the years back before even some of these things, back even in the campaign, there is a thing with

trump where people have a tendency and it is natural because he consorts with white nationalists and authoritarians and people who have ideologies that are evil and disgusting. i think that michael would agree, donald trumpdoesn't have an ideology. he is about self advance him and he is in the moment. he will choose whatever the thing is that he thinks either advances his cause or gets him out of trouble or gets people to say he's great. he doesn't think six months ahead. he doesn't know anything about six months behind. he is just pure opportunistic id. and if you have no principles and you say if i say racist stuff, like if you say -- oel sigh i'll got a reaction from

the crowd so i'll do anything. it is like when people ing so t. hitler is a deeper thinker. trump has no ideology other than his own greatness and self preservation. when fields are green, self advancement. but it is just these -- he is lining closer to like -- he is closer to like -- >> pt barnum. >> it is a self seeking thing, no the like a cognitive being. >> and i can give you a great example. when i set up in 2011 for donald for meet with like 200 evangelical preachers from all over, we all sat in that room and some of the comments that he made, the anti-abortion, really

evangelical belief system, and afterwards he said, man, you believe that? he go, unbelievable. he goes, it is amazing. just amazing. and he was referring to the fact that he was lying and they all ate it up. they all laid hands on him and they prayed. that is where that issue ended up becoming a reality. he realized that these are the things that i have to say to makes a john pointed out to make them love me, to make them support me. >> and that creates the cycle where he now sees himself and talks about being the most pro-life president that the country of had. >> as he is holding the bible upside down. >> just incredible. you have blown my 3450i7bd. mind. thank you for being here and staying. glad that you did. >> if he gets the mullet -- >> we'll deal with the mullet after the show.

when we come back, alarming new reporting about the sharp uptick in anti-voting lawsuits filed by conservative legal organizations who are not waiting until election day to try to disenpractidisenfranchis. dis. (woman vo) sailing a great river past extraordinary landscapes into the heart of iconic cities is a journey for the curious traveler, one that many have yet to discover. exploring with viking brings you closer to the world, to the history, the culture, the flavors, a serene river voyage on an elegant viking longship. learn more at viking.com

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a new warning will how

republicans are changing their playbook after watching the failures by the ex-president's legal team. with just over a month left before the midterms, conservative lawyers have already flooded the systems with almost five times as many anti-voting lawsuits this year than file in all of last year. writing the biggest concern is as we near the 2022 midterm elections, national republican groups have shifted focus from voter suppression to sub version. the gop want to limit what votes count. and of course when they lose, those lawsuits, republicans claim that it is further proof that this system a rigged or susceptible to fraud. joining us now, the voting rights attorney and founder of the democracy dockets. i think first time i talk to you spoke of the continuum on which

republicans would travel starting with the voter suppression laws which almost in quaint with what passed in georgia right after trump was defeated. but is this the obvious place. talk about how to guard against this, which is almost the alternate reality. >> i think first everyone needs to wake up and realize what is coming. what we've seen since january 6 is not just donald trump become more and more unhinged, not just his supporters become deeper and deeper into his crazy conspiracy theories, but we've seen the entire republican party become more and more unmoored from the anchors of democracy. it is not just the rhetoric that their candidates use, not just the election deniers that they are wielding but is the tactics that they are planning as we move toward election day. so early we saw laws in 20212021

that were aimed at voter suppression making it harder to vote. and now we're seeing legal challenges in court aimed at who counts ballots and whose ballots count. and we need to be prepared for this next phase. >> arizona is a state on my radar because everyone running on the republican side is an election denier who is committed to going back and decertifying president biden's 2020 win. tell me what we do as a democracy about that and what other states are alarmed by and watching. >> yeah, so nicolle, the number one most litigated state as of today or this year is the state of arizona. while everyone is paying attention to gas prices and inflation and all those things that are really, really

important to americans, understand the republican party went to court in arizona to abolish no excuse vote by mail. that's right in, a state where 85% of the voters vote by mail, the republican party sought to abolish it. and so we we are seeing these k very, very dramatic efforts in court and in legislation. right now my team is in court challenging a law that would allow people who move from other states into arizona to be denied the right to vote if they didn't call the state that they left and cancel their voter registration. think about that. you move from wisconsin or new york or california to arizona, and if you don't know to call to cancel your prior registration, republicans passed a law that could make it impossible for you to vote in arizona. so it is very, very serious in arizona. it is the second most-litigated state right now is in wisconsin.

we see republicans attacking vote-by-mail in pennsylvania, in north carolina. we see republican activity in court in georgia, and really everywhere throughout the country. >> what are you -- what is your degree of alarm now compared to one year ago when a lot of our conversations were around what ult mayly came up short, but the push for voting rights legislation. >> look, i told you a year ago that we were one or two elections from losing our democracy, and that the critical thing we needed to do was enact comprehensive voting rights legislation to prevent that. and i didn't say that because i was trying to be alarmist, but because it is clear where we are going. so we didn't get the voting rights legislation that we desperately needed, so now we are left to slogging this out in state legislature by state legislature, in state court house and in federal courthouse

throughout the country and by turning out the vote, by having people vote in such overwhelming numbers it makes suppression and subversion unlikely. ask yourself this, nicolle. think about a candidate like a kari lake or a mastriano. was this even imaginable two years ago? even when trump was on the ballot, could you imagine of of late of election deniers you have in arizona. it is getting worse, not better, the attack we are seeing in our own country. >> marc elias, ominous but it is very important. thank you for spending time with us. >> thank you. >> quick break for us. we will be right back. or us. we will be right back.

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every single meal? if only it was this easy for us. we're back with john and eddie. because we talked about the mullets for so long we ran out of time to talk about anything else, but the show time is coming back this sunday. >> the show time? >> "the circus." what do you have on sunday? >> we're looking at first episode back in our fall, second half of the season we are talking about how the electoral landscape has been transformed by the issue of reproductive rights and abortion and looking at could it really be the thing that saves democrats. >> amazing. equally important, here is the mullet, eddie. the mullets that were talked about and reported on. there it is.

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welcome to "the beat." i'm ari melber. we begin with the legal heat. classified documents are a scandal. january 6th congressional probe picks back up. we have news on that. and then something that up ended donald trump's entire business prospects in new york. as i mentioned you might say, well, i feel like i heard about this before, what is the deal? never like this before. we are talking about something that is now an active new york case that could end the trump organization as it is known along with a quarter billion in fines and penalties or more. and then you have the federal