knowing i did the right thing. >> that's all for this that is all for this edition of dateline. i'm edition of dateline. andrea canning. thank you for watching. watching welcome to the show. i am charles, i am in for -- it is a good week not to be donald trump. the former presidents legal troubles are kicking into overdrive. on wednesday, new york attorney general letitia james announced a state is suing suing trump, his children, and their organization for 200 alleged incidents of fraud spanning over a decade. in addition to seeking 250 million in fines, she said that

she is sending a criminal referral to the irs and federal prosecutors in manhattan. just hours later, a federal appeals court gave trump a huge setback in his fight over classified government documents seized from mar-a-lago. that panel freed federal investigators to use those classified papers as a part of their pro. judge aileen can in, a trump appointee, they had blocked investigators from reviewing those documents until an outside judge could review them. on wednesday, the 11th circuit court of appeals said that can in abused her authority by demanding the documents be reviewed. two of the three of the appeals court judges are trump appointees. we are not done yet. also on wednesday, writer eugene tell said that she will sue trump under a new law that lets sexual assault victims file civil lawsuits no matter

when the statute of limitations expire. carol said that trump raped her in a manhattan dressing room in the 1990s. caro has also filed a defamation suit against trump. that goes to tyler the next year. and then there is this, this was back in april. it appeared that the manhattan district attorney's investigation would wind down after the grand jury wrapped up without any charges. on wednesday, the da took to twitter with a statement. quote, our criminal investigation concerning former president donald j trump, the trump organization, and its leadership is active and ongoing. that is a lot. we have more on how trump and his team are responding to all of this in a minute. first, we want to make sense of all of this that i just went through. joining me now is former fbi special agent --

she is currently an assistant dean and senior lecturer at yale university's jackson school of global affairs. let me read from the 11th circuit ruling in the trump document case. >> the united states it is likely to succeed and showing that the district for -- they abused its discretion in exercising jurisdiction over the motion as it concerns a classified documents. how big is this ruling? >> charles, in the legal world, we call this a bench slap. this is basically the appeals court saying that you got is completely wrong. the opinion by the 11th circuit is crystal clear. i encourage people to read. it is really written in a way for a layperson to understand both the history of how i got to this point.

also, there is the undisputed law, the body of law that substantiates the department of justice's position that classified documents that belong to the united states government. they are classified if the executive branch says they are declassified, says they are classified. in any case, they do not belong to donald trump. they should not be a part of this. this is something that has given great deference. this was a big dressing down of judge cannon. frankly, they went beyond what they needed to. they kind of slammed a lot of the other aspects of her legal reasoning as well. >> let's stay on this issue. donald trump went off and went tonight. he again defended his position about the classified documents. he said that he had already declassified hit them in his

mind. >> you are the president of the united states, you can declassified just by saying declassified. even by thinking about it. trump also went on to talk about the radical left. last night about this declassification. >> can you mentally declassified arguments? even if you could, does that even matter in this case? >> i have never of telepathic declassification. to the extent that the president of the united states would be and original classification authority -- at you the problem with trump is that it passes to joe biden. presumably, as soon as joe biden believes that these are

classified, they become reclassified. >> it also does not work in his favor, even if you accept the premise. again, it is a red herring. they said, you know, so what. -- this is a stolen property case. whatever their classifications status, they were not his, they did not belong at mar-a-lago. >> even if he did declassify it, here is the question that he did not even ask him. if you have the classify them, why didn't you just tell us what they were? it's not part of the function of declassification to make it available to the public? it is no longer secret. >> exactly. the point of the classification is to assess the content of the documents. no longer being damaging to national security if they're disclosed. some of that, presumably, you

can disclose it. the fact that he kept secret, that is the part that does not make sense. you don't say anything about it. you weren't interested in having the sources hand -- that is normally what you would do if you went to declassification process. >> and then we have the new york lawsuit against trump, his children, and the business that charges say he defrauded the value of the assets. trump took to social media. but he said james is a racist attorney, unquote. how serious is this case against trump? >> i think that this is a very serious case we. we are a society that loved lying crime, we light as a people around the top and put in orange jumpsuits. he really has the potential oh

-- it could harm trump in a very fundamental way. letitia james can actually order that the trump organization seized to operate in the state of new york are. that would avenge julia bring an end to his empire. charles, the thing that matters most to donald trump and all of the world is to be seen as a successful businessman who is very, very, very rich. this trial will explodes the fact that he is not very rich. it has all been a lie. it is all a house of cards. by the way, she is asking for a significant financial penalty that would hurt him as well. >> and related news, we learned that ginni thomas, the way south of supreme court clarence thomas, they have agreed to testify to the january six committee about her involvement

-- how big of a deal is it that she is going to testify? >> i think she is an important part of communication. she was in touch with mark meadows. she was that communications and rallies. what is the big problem here, charles, given what we might learn from her testimony, this really places justice clarence thomas in a position where he should not be -- he already has done that in a situation where some records from the national archives are being turned over to the january six committee. i think that we are going to see more about the level of

conflict once we start hearing the testimony. >> thank you very much. we are with trump's legal troubles. the former presidents rhetoric has gotten more dangerous. the country would face, quote, problem's if he got indicted. he has also appeared to make overtures towards qanon, the conspiracy theory personality called. they carried out violence on the capitol in response to the election lies. the government was getting more attention in 2020. also, they hesitated -- >> during the pandemic, the qanon qanon movement has been gaining a lot of followers. can you talk about what you think about that? what do you have to say to people who are following this premiere at now? >> i don't know much about the movement. they don't like me very much.

i appreciate it. ever people all over the country. >> legal troubles are mounting. he is embracing qanon war tightly. it began last month with a barrage of social media posts. trump nod to the conspiracy theory. last week, he shared a poll showing himself wearing a qanon pen with the movements motto. the storm was coming. that was all a warm-up for trump slough rally last week in ohio. something a lot like the qanon theme song play in the background of his remarks. >> it was hardworking patriots like you who built this country. it was hardworking patriots like you who are going to save our country. we will stand up to the radical left lunatic's and rhinos. we will fight for america like

no one has ever fought before. >> this is chilling, especially since the fbi warned back in june that qanon followers could grow increasingly violent as the conspiracies outlandish predictions field come true. a new report by rolling stone reporter, it says that even though those in trump's inner circle is openly embracing the movement, they argue that america or is run by a cabal of seat more shipping pedophiles. we have seen this before or. challenge his election laws. the followers heeded his call to come to the capital. you know what happened then. what could happen now as investigations continue to close in around trump? he is again activating his most fanatical supporters.

let's turn to rolling stone politics reporter, nikki mccann ramirez. trump's embrace of qanon baffles allies. what are people saying about his turn towards qanon? how concerned are they about it? >> hi, thank you so much for having me. what we know for the people we spoke to, there is no consensus over why trump reimbursed qanon. -- he winked and nodded at qanon. he denied the conspiracy when prompted to. trump's circumstances have changed, he is no longer president. he is very isolated on social media. in fact, he had to basically build his own social media platform to keep posting into

his social. what we know through previous reporting is that when it was being created, board members reached out and courted the major personalities and follower base in order to milk the subscriber ship of the platform. trump is now facing all of these external pressures. -- he is very vulnerable for facing challenges from the presidency. like your previous guest mention, late people we talked about this, trump is a person who loves to be loved. in this moment where he fears for the future, there are these investigations, this is similar suits. this is a base whose core believe it is that people are out to get him. it is a moment where he feels like he is showing up this support to keep pushing forward. he is turning to the people who

are most responsive to this message. that has become qanon, qanon has become very immersed in trump's core support base. >> it is not just trump. the trump candidates are doing it as well. they are openly embracing qanon. there is doug mastriano, a gop administrator in pennsylvania. he is posting qanon memes. this week, mark, the gop of arizona, he is the state nominee. he held a fund-raiser with 9/11 truth yours and qanon influencers. and then there is mike flynn, the former trump national security adviser who is now the republican party official and poll watchers. this week, he went on a conspiracy podcast. here is a clip of what he said when he was attacked globalists. >> they are trying to change the very essence. you all know harare.

that is just not going to work. they are going to basically put components into it. >> he does not seem interested in stopping any of this craziness. could they stop it if they wanted to at this point? >> i don't think so. i think the qanon conspiracy, the culture qanon in particular, the way that cultural leads to trump, it has become very entangled with aspects of the republican party and the base. this is a horse that has left the stable. it is difficult to rein in. while trump himself has been consistently winking and nodding towards this bay throughout his presidency and post presidency, it is important to remember that there are people around him. they are helping fuel this relationship. round him. they a>> they are pointing

interacting trump. they are full in the culture of qanon into the campaign cycle, the rallies. -- he is also very engaged with this space. >> amid thank you so much. still to come, on rosters going in russia after putin announced a partial military mobilization. what does this mean for ukraine? we will talk about that after the break. e break. landscaper larry and his trusty crew... were delayed when the new kid totaled his truck. timber... fortunately, they were covered by progressive, so it was a happy ending... for almost everyone. ♪ ♪ i'm getting vaccinated with prevnar 20. so am i. because i'm at risk for pneumococcal pneumonia. i'm asking about prevnar 20. because there's a chance pneumococcal pneumonia could put me in the hospital. if you're 19 or older with certain chronic conditions

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watching ukraine successfully last counteroffensive >> gains russia's army in a way that nobody had been expecting. last week, they announced they had we claim more than 3000 miles of territory in the east and south of the country. russia is responding. the russian president ordered a partial mobilization of 300,000 military reservists. russia has not undertaken that kind of motion since world war ii. putin discussed plans for russia to annexed areas of southern and eastern ukraine. he even threatened nuclear toleration.

>> if there is a threat to the territorial integrity of our country, if we are protecting our people, we will use all of the means available to us. i am not bluffing. those trying to blackmail out with nuclear weapons should know that the tables can turn on them. >> already, we have seen reports of citizens giving orders to enlist. especially those with medical skills. protests broke out across russia against putin. video of a protest outside of st. peters church shows officers in tactical gear striking the protesters with batons. another video outside the church, authorities are seen leading people away from the group won by one. more than 1300 people have been arrested and demonstrations. how is the new escalation from putin going to play in russia? what does it mean about where

the war stands on the ground in ukraine? joining me now is russian american journalist -- they are a staff writer at the new yorker. they are the author of surviving autocracy, vocal critic of vladimir putin. how are you reading this escalation by putin? last month, ukraine was re-capturing territory. there was some optimism that this might lead to an into the war. these announcements from putin suggest otherwise. does this strike you as an act of desperation by him? maybe just an escalation. >> it is both. and it's an act of desperation and escalation. i think he is making his plan clear. he is going to use can invite. early ease are people who are not recently trained in combat. people who are not willingly going to the front lines.

they are not bad already. they are not motivated military. they are can invite or. he's doing this in order to hold current positions. he is playing for time. it is very clear that he is counting on europe getting tired of ukrainian refugees. that is something that is already happening. he is looking forward to a cold winter with expensive gas, possibly short supplies in countries like germany. he is hoping for unrest and wavering support in supporting ukraine in western europe. he is also waiting out of the american administration. he is hoping that the midterm elections will mean that president biden's administration, which has been so supportive of ukraine, will that have less support in congress. they will even be looking forward to 2024. it is the long game. he has no regard for human life. there is no amount of life or money that he is not going to pay in order to prolong the war

on ukraine. >> you point out that he may be hoping for support in europe. we are already seeing some incidents out flagging support in russia. from your contacts in the country, what is the mood of the population of that country? >> my contacts at the moment representative area small portion of the population. these are people who don't support the war. i don't think that we are seeing flagging support for the war in russia. it is very difficult to measure the public opinion in a totalitarian country. it is almost impossible to measure public opinion in the country at war. at the same time, i don't think there is any reason to have the fears that we are seeing from an independent and state support research. they have overwhelming support for putin's war, overwhelming by into putin's propaganda. that is reaching hundreds of millions of people opposed to independent media. that is reaching a very, very

tiny and diminishing number of people. we did see some protests yesterday. 1300 people were arrested in 38 different cities across russia. that is huge. that is 1300 people who were willing to risk actual jail time. five, seven, as long as 15 years in prison. for a country of 145 million people, that is a drop in the bucket. putin is willing to force these people out of the country or imprison them. they are not actually going to make a dent in the support for the warmer. if anything, it seems to be increasing. there is also his ability to bully the country into submission and mobilization. >> on thursday, russian foreign minister sergei laughter of spoke at the un security council meeting on ukraine. he criticize the west for, quote, pumping ukraine full of weapons. their goal is obvious, they

want to drag out the fighting furlong as possible. he says that the west is a party to the conflict. how much of the will or is about the last? is it more than about ukraine? is this a proxy war between russia and the west? >> from putin's point of view, for many russians point of view, it is certainly a war with the united states. it is with the west in general. it has been that way since the very beginning. putin's pretext for the warriors nato expansion. there is propaganda that he has years to sell the war to the population. it is that russia is fighting the united states in the ukraine. i mean, ukraine in putin's imagination is not a place that exists. it is a line between russia and the last. that is how he has garnered support, how he has more martial supported russia. russians imagined themselves fighting.

they're fighting for their place in the world alongside the united states. >> thank you so much for joining us. i really appreciate it. still to come, hundreds of thousands of puerto ricans are still without water and power in the wake of hurricane fiona. yeah, as fiona tore from the island this week, the attention of americans on the mainland was somewhere else. i discuss that with latino rebel founder, drove auto after the break. afte the break. subway series menu. twelve irresistible new subs. the most epic sandwich roster ever created. ♪♪ it's subway's biggest refresh yet! what happens when performance... meets power? you try crazy things... ...because you're crazy... ...and you like it. you get bigger...

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still recovering after hurricane fiona slammed the island earlier this week. the storm dropped more than 20 inches of rain. it caused flash floods. it triggered mudslides. roads and bridges were swept away. buildings collapsed. at least eight people were killed. many of them had been without running water for days. some more filling jobs with makeshift pipelines like this one. they can cook and clean. they can get some drinking water. as of thursday, more than two thirds of the island was without power. the fragile electric grade again locked out by the category one storm. that is despite the fact that it was privatized a year ago to help modernize and strengthen it. all of this is happening five

years after hurricane maria devastated the island. >> we have nothing from maria. the government doesn't give nothing for maria. the united states sent a lot of money to fix it. especially for maria. we are seeing the same. i don't have faith in this government. we have to make our ally ourselves. that is how we live. >> relief efforts are underway. president biden approved the disaster declaration to get more aid. it does not cover the entirety of the island. if you have not heard much about the storm, it might be because it took a few days to get to the top of the headlines. fiona made landfall on sunday with much of the devastation appearing on monday morning. on monday, much of the focus of americans was on the funeral of queen elizabeth the second.

political pundits and news co-hosts of the view, they called out the lack of puerto rican coverage. they say, i respect the queen as much as the next person, but can i please get some news and footage of the effects of fiona and puerto rico? it is for those who need reminding, there are american citizens in distressed. joining me now is julio rivera. he is the founder of latino rebels. he is an msnbc columnist. his piece this week's headline, puerto rico is once again forced to be its own xavier. julio, puerto rico never fully recovered from area. now we have fiona. why is the island so vulnerable? why must, it as you say, before us to be its own savior? >> you know, charles, thank you for inviting me. i think you have to look at the history of the last ten or 15 years in puerto rico.

this is what austerity, this is what fistful control, bored politics, puerto ricans can't even control their own destiny right now. this is what living on a colony is. this is what it is to be second-class in the american landscape. what was being predicted after maria, and we can get into the details as to why there was not money spent, but everyone who had followed maria was saying, what about the next storm? what happens when the next storm happens? i, i supported begin, i am just crashed. i am crushed that i have to come back five years later and remind people that puerto rico continues to be ignored. these stories of resilience, puerto ricans are incredibly resilient. i'm kind of tired that we have to have our zillion cb up in front. puerto ricans need help.

they need equality. they need dignity. the united states, once again, the colonial government of puerto rico, and i would say the pro statehood government of puerto rico, they have failed its people again. >> you talked about colonialism being a problem. i want to go to what you will. you said that fiona exposed west so many puerto ricans already knew, the colony is dying right before our eyes. nothing has really changed. unless colonialism is dismantled, the same thing will keep happening to puerto rico. what will american colonialism do for what we are seeing right now in puerto rico? what would happen if you dismantled it? >> yeah, i think it plays a direct role. look at the fact that, you know, from 1898, which is the u.s. invasion of puerto rico, from them and tell now, what has

happened, one of the things that i say the pieces that people tend to forget that the relationship between puerto rico in the united states based on actual racism and xenophobia. look at the historic cases of the early 20th century. that is still a lot in the book. it is part of u.s. legal code. it is so obvious that we are seen this as american citizens. we are really not. we could american history. you know, what is happening in puerto rico is an american tradition. whether it is slavery, racism, the nfl will be, at genocide. whatever you want to say. i am kind of relieved at the word colony is becoming more mainstream in this discussion. i am very grateful that i can say the word colony. >> no one tells me i can't say that anymore. that gives me hope. people need to understand the relationship between the united states in puerto rico. this isn't how that has been endured, abused, oppressed, overlooked, dissect it.

it is a bipartisan problem. the united states needs to solve it. whatever we land on, we need to have a resolution. we are going to have another hurricane in a couple of years. i'm going to be saying the same things. i really don't want to be doing that. >> the colonization is one step. i am not sure if that is in the offing. what else can congress in d.c. due to help where we go? it is not just in the aftermath of this particular storm, but what can we do in the long term? we need to fix the right electric grid, we need to prepare the island for storms. >> look at the money that came into fema. i wanted to bring this up. look at fema for puerto rico during hurricane maria. you are not getting the money until your entire electrical grid is built. who does that? that is what the united states told puerto rico. they told us that we need to build the electric grade, then they give us the 13 billion dollars.

why can't puerto rico get the money, build the grid, make it resilient, use alternative sources of energy opposed to what has happened with the history of public utility companies in puerto rico? there are problems with it. it is not perfect. that is coming with a private company. it is occurrence already am of canadian and american investors. they want to profit off of the lives of puerto ricans. that is a reality. puerto rico is still in the dark. it was in the dark previously before the hurricanes as well. there's a lot change here. >> julio, thank you so much for joining me. joining me crispy bacon. but what about the new boss? it looks so good it makes me hangry! settle down there, big guy the new subway series. what's your pick? she is fearless heart's on the line depend silhouette keeping leaks off her mind. comfortable in shapeware fabric she moves with ease. confident on nights like these. depend silhouette. the only thing stronger than us, is you.

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embedded in the foundation of our country. most people learn in school that multiple founders were enslavers themselves. nobody constitutions cause. it declares that anyone who was not free that asean slave would

count as three fifths of a person for the purposes of determining congressional representation. most of us have learned that slavery was abolished in 1865 with the eradication of the 13th amendment. that amendment did not fully abolish slavery. slavery is still very much legal in america today. this is how the 13th amendment actually reads. neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime wear of the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the united states, except as a punishment for crime. that phrase creates real consequences for american prisoners forced to work in inhumane conditions for almost no money. here is what one former prisoner told the abolitionist group. >> one of the jobs that i had well incarcerated it was as a seamstress. i sowed underwear, sheets, pillow cases.

i started off making 17 sets an hour. if you reach the quota, and i was 30,000 sheets a day, you have the opportunity to have that amount doubled. i didn't know at the time, each dozen was being sold for about $30 on the outside market. it made these people of millions of dollars. working in prison made me feel very dehumanized. it made me feel like i had no autonomy. made me feel like i was worthless. it made me feel angry. you are not allowed any days off. you are not allowed any sick time. if you did not go to work, you were sent to solitary confinement. that is 23 hours a day locked in these ellison as your bathroom. >> now, a bipartisan group of lawmakers and activists are working to pass the abolitionist amendment. it would ensure that neither slavery nor involuntary servitude maybe imposes a punishment for a crime. in 2022, that is over 150 years

after the 13th amendment was ratified. it is long past time to completely expunge any exception for slavery from the constitution. joining me now is bianca. this is the executive director of the prisoner rights group. bianca, how did this push for this amendment came about? >> hi, thank you so much for having me this afternoon. you know, as you were explaining, we know there is a cause in the 13th amendment. there is something deeply wrong in our society if we can allow for slavery. we can't allow for it under any circumstances. feel free to fill in the blanks, fell on the sentence. larry is okay, when? for many of us who work with people who are incarcerated, if you are around that system, we know that this particular exception is absolutely

problematic. it does not represent the values of americans today. we are working with congress members to help change that. >> many americans would be surprised that slavery is still allowed today. how is it affecting people who are incarcerated? how common is this kind of work? >> sure. the amendment is the exception cause in the 13th amendment. tom it does affect millions of people in the united states today. it is not just the 2 million people who are currently incarcerated. in fact, it was a specific commitment that targets everyone who has a criminal connection. that is over 70 million americans today. we know, like i said, that slavery has no place in our society. it cannot exist today.

just as you saw that video from johnny, slavery shows up in the history. it shows up in so many different ways in our system. that starts with a lack of autonomy that people have. it goes on to the fact that people can be punished for things like solitary confinement. but it still often refer to as the whole or the box. these are terms of actually originated during slavery. solitary confinement was born. these people can be violated or have their visits and contact with family cut off. again, those are things that date back to slavery in ways that work in obedience was demanded by people who had enslaved others. -- >> how optimistic are you that this will actually become the law? we are really optimistic for several reasons. as you noted, it is a

bipartisan bill. in fact, the last few weeks, we have seen a great number on both sides of the aisle join the bill. the bipartisan part of the bill is particularly robust. it is growing every single day. we've also seen a number of state campaigns that are going to the ballot this november. some that passed ballot initiatives. that includes states that are red and blue states. we're excited to see those pass. we are excited to see what that will mean for the federal effort to pass the appalachian amendment. >> what can viewers do to support your efforts? >> thank you so much. we really encourage folks to visit our website. you can take action. you can ask your legislators to support the abolition amendment. you can also tweet and follow us on twitter. look this up on instagram. we are constantly sharing calls to action around this issue.

>> bianca, thank you so much for joining us today. i really appreciate it. before we go, the next public hearing of the january 6th select committee is set for next week. more on that after the break. stay with us. with us it's every-other-month, injectable cabenuva. for adults who are undetectable, cabenuva is the only complete hiv treatment you can get every other month. cabenuva helps keep me undetectable. it's two injections, given by a healthcare provider every other month. it's one less thing to think about while traveling. hiv pills aren't on my mind. a quick change in my plans is no big deal. don't receive cabenuva if you're allergic to its ingredients or taking certain medicines, which may interact with cabenuva. serious side effects include allergic reactions,

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or lost their primaries. among other things, the bill makes it explicit of the vice presidents role in counting electoral college votes is terminal. it raises the threshold for members of congress to object to electors from one house member. it goes to one third of both chambers. the bill was written and introduced by congresswoman liz cheney. both members of the jury committee -- later that day, the same committee announced that it would hold its next public hearings on wednesday, september 28th at 1 pm eastern time. you can watch our coverage on msnbc as well as on peacock. many others will need coverage for msnbc peacock. that is starting on wednesday at 12 pm eastern time. that does it for me. we will be back on sunday at 8 pm. we are right here on msnbc. for right now, goodbye from new

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we are live from miami, florida. we have lots of news to cover. we have lots of questions answered. let's get started. it is put up or shut up time for donald trump. he is up against a new deadline to backup his claims that the fbi planted evidence during its search of mar-a-lago. the doj gets the greenlight to resume its review classified documents. the ex presidents legal demands, are they backfiring? plus, florida state senator jason is here to talk about the escalating migrant crisis and