mig radio show, saying, oop oom we have enough black women, ketanji brown jackson in the supreme court, we have vice president kamala harris. i don't know if i want to vote for stacy abrams. who would not be proud of abrams unless you are so insecure as a man that you feel that you've got to be manipulated for provocateurs or the faith community that i don't believe in women's right to choose and women ought to be school board subordinate, not leading? did you read the bible and forget the book of esther and ruth? did they edit that out of your bible? it's becoming disturbing, lawrence o'donnell. >> that's right. the point that's so important is in this time when so many americans are concerned about the strength and durability of our democracy that we have to understand that these things go together, that the enfranchisement of all americans, people of color, but women who are the majority of

all backgrounds, that their full and equal participation at every level of our political process, that is the most fundamental building block of a stable and enduring democracy. we see it in iran. we know it to be true in afghanistan and everywhere around the world where women's rights have been repressed. those are the most repressive regimes for democracy for all, and that is true here too. >> joe. >> lawrence o'donnell, thank you so much. greatly appreciate it. i can't help but, listening to rech and just thinking about america, sort of sets us apart when it comes to how we deal with women and leadership in leadership roles, especially as president of the united states. you can look back. my god, israel had golda meir 50 years ago. india, bhutto. you can go around the globe. the united kingdom, great britain, obviously the most

important person on the world stage for them, protecting outward from britain, queen elizabeth. the entire era shaped by this woman. and in her time, as queen, there were three women who were british prime ministers. here in the united states, you can look and see barack obama, we are the first majority white country that elected a person of color as president. and, you know, that is certainly something that we should all take great pride in. it undercuts what communist countries have been saying about us for years. but when it comes to women, when it comes to women, there is still a certain underlying attitude that is stopping americans from electing a woman to as president of the united

states. we saw it in 2016. i wonder how much longer we're going to see it. >> i know. you can see lawrence o'donnell's piece at knowyourvalue.com. thank you very much. it is just past the top of our fourth hour of "morning joe" right now, 6:00 a.m. on the west coast, 9:00 a.m. on the east coast and 4:00 p.m. in kyiv where explosions shattered months of relative peace there. this comes at russian president vladimir putin that calls an attack of a bridge next to its annexed territory of crimea a terrorist attack. keir simmons is reporting from moscow and has the latest on that. >> reporter: russia's promised revenge coming this morning with those rocket attacks on major ukrainian cities, striking back after another setback. in the past hour, the russian leader on television calling the attacks retaliation.

last night president putin branding this explosion on his prized bridge between russia and crimea a terrorist attack on civilian infrastructure. the bridge a crucial military supply line and symbol of russian strength quickly reopened, but the destruction in plain sight. while ukraine has not publicly admitted responsibility, russia is blaming ukrainian special force for the explosion that happened almost exactly midway across the bridge just after 6:00 a.m. saturday. the russians say this truck carrying fertilizer was the epicenter of the blast. on a parallel rail bridge, a locomotive filled with fuel tanks caught fire. while some explosive experts think the detonation was under the bridge. last month an unmanned ukrainian drone boat capable of attacks from the sea washed up on a beach. bloggers openly criticizing

putin's military. the enemy has stopped being afraid. and the other hammer ukraine into the 18th century. the demand for escalation just days after president biden warn offend the prospect of armageddon. in moscow, under a statue of a russian revolutionary, the anxiousness is palpable. do you find the atmosphere has changed in moscow? >> yes, a lot. the atmosphere extremely, has extremely changed. >> reporter: why? >> people are worried about the situation in the city and the country. >> let's go right now -- that was nbc's keir simmons with that report. let's go right now to cal perry in kyiv. what's the latest there? >> reporter: hey, joe. we've just made our way back from the scene of one of those rocket attacks. at least eight people confirmed killed here in the capital. there was 85, joe, 85 different rockets and drones that were fired by russian forces across the country here from the east

to the west. we're seeing damage. more than a dozen cities have been hit. you can expect that death toll will rise. some of these targets were infrastructure targets. we're told in the capital they will have rolling blackouts in the next 24 hours. that is the scene -- that is the footage from the scene we just came from. there's these huge craters. many of the buildings are destroyed around it. expect the death toll to rise for that reason. we're told again overnight tonight there will be rolling blackouts in kyiv. it's likely you'll have that in lviv. we are under an air alert. i had a chance to speak to the mayor who is urging citizens to find cover, to stay inside some of those subways that have been emptied for months. they're filling up as people are hoping the worst is over, but they're bracing for the possibility of more attacks. >> so, cal, talk about the air defenses in kyiv and across parts of ukraine and how effective were they.

i know it's early. i know we have the fog of war. but the morning after, are the ukrainians suggesting that any of these air defenses were effective? >> reporter: yeah, the air defenses here are excellent. this is my third rotation reporting here. i have not seen air defenses anywhere in the world like this one. they say they shot about half of the rockets and drones that were headed for targets, they say they knocked down. one of the things officials are thinking is that is one of the reasons that the russians fired some 85 rockets or drones to try to overwhelm those air defenses. when we talk about those drones, we're so often talking about civilian components in these drones, that is civilian wiring that's basically been built into what is now a military drone. they fly low. they fly slow. they miss that air defense system because they don't have the signature of a military drone. it is something that officials here have said they're more and more worried about because when those drones -- talking about kamikaze drones, they just run them into the sides of

buildings, they cause massive fires. we saw it last week and people here are concerned about it. >> all right. >> all right. thanks so much. >> nbc's cal perry, thank you so much. we want to turn to politics now and the very tight and very important race for governor of arizona. the republican nominee, kerry lake, was reportedly removed from the audience at a town hall over the weekend after eyewitnesses say she staged a stunt meant to rattle her opponent. at the report on saturday where lake and katie hobbs were not meant to interact, the republican nominee reportedly sat in the front row of the audience as she waited for her opponent to come out. according to organizers both campaigns previously agreed to wait in a green room until it was their turn to speak. lake claims she was not told this and instead pleaded for hobbs to come out and debate her

from the audience. hobbs has refused to debate lake, who still denies the results of the 2020 election, saying, "it's impossible to have a real conversation with her." former president trump was in mesa, arizona, last night, rallying for the state's entire republican ticket. nbc news correspondent vaughn hillyard was there covering it and joins us from phoenix. what stood out to you. >> reporter: we should be clear about this kari lake and hobbs situation here. we are two day ace way from early voting in arizona, 48 hours. it is go time here. over the course of these last months, ever since that august 2nd primary, katie hobbs, the democrat, has wholly avoided any interactions with kari lake. the lone debate was supposed to be this wednesday, but she has refused to go toe to toe with a republican. i talked with her on saturday as to why she's doubled down on that decision, and she says she

doesn't want to be part of a spectacle of conspiracies with kari lake. in the meanwhile, it is the republican backed by donald trump, at these forums. she i'll take the stage on wednesday night by herself with a broadcast audience across every television station here in the state of arizona and is going to most likely spew several of those election conspiracy theories to an audience without any rebuttal here. that is where you see kari lake last night appearing on stage with donald trump, doubling down on her alliance with him. you know, she says why would she not step away from donald trump, and she said that, look, it's what got her here to this point and that she would ultimately -- i'm not sure if you can hear kari lake there like i can in my ear -- but kari lake said she would not stem away from donald trump because it's what got her here to this point. when you look at the polls, you're seeing them in a dead heat here. and you have to also look at these other candidates, mark

fincham, an election denier, the fellow running for attorney general. polling shows them all in situation where is there could be a clean sweep of victories here, and you cannot ignore the fact that it is very well-known in the state of arizona exactly where these candidates stand when it comes to the 2020 election. so you're looking at a reality, well, democrats thought this state was trending blue, that the majority of the arizona electorate could very well in the next month, vote those individuals into office. we caught up with some voters over the weekend. take a listen. why don't you trust kari lake? >> for one, abortion. >> reporter: some would say kari lake is an election denier. did you consider not voting for her because of that? >> i did, but i try to look at things that might benefit us more. >> reporter: how do you consider

yourself? >> conservative. >> reporter: but you're voting for katie hobbs? >> never mind. >> reporter: who are you voting for? >> i don't want kari lake. she seems more like the public people. you never see katie hobbs anywhere. nowhere. >> reporter: during that rally last night, i also want to bring attention here to mark fincham, cowboy hat, mustached secretary of state candidate. during that trump rally, he tweeted, "all i want for christmas is a few arrests of election fraud criminals." i asked mark about that and he suggested there is already indications of potential voter irregularities, that there are individuals from the state of new mexico that are crossing into arizona, illegally registering to vote. the table is already being set by the republican candidates in a potentially close battle to claim voter fraud and irregularities at the same time. they very well could outright win it without even having to

make such claims, guys. >> vaughn, of course claims are absolutely outrageous. you look at the slate of statewide candidates in arizona for people like me who actually, i don't know, i like western democracy, i like free elections, i think people that lose elections -- you know, for me, i'm very rattled by what i see out in arizona. that said, if kari lake's positions are so indefensible, then katie hobbs, in my opinion, needs to debate her because, you know, she's leaving the stage to her, turning the microphone over to her, just like the democrats -- or republicans did in the september -- or in the december -- the january 6th hearings. just turning the microphone over

instead of pushing back. that one person talked about how katie hobbs wasn't around. i've never seen running from debates ever, ever, in any race, i've never seen it help a candidate. i'm wondering when you were talking to people did this have an influence, did this impact them, the fact that katie hobbs won't debate an out-and-out election denier that let me say our next guest politically would tear to pieces. >> reporter: two things on that front. joe, you've run campaigns before here, and so often campaigns, they try to get out in front of the public. kari lake, by being on the road every single day, by holding gaggles with the press, by going out to little -- holding little campaign event, going to forums, participating in the debate, she is in the local news every single day. we were here for the course over several days. katie hobbs frankly -- i know we're the national press coming in, but she had no events to cover. that makes it very difficult.

there's a women's march on saturday morning. she quickly spoke at that but did not participate in the actual march. she quickly moved to her vehicle there. i think this is a situation that has frustrated democrats, frankly. i've had a great number of conversations from legislators to democratic voters to operatives frustrated by katie hobbs not going on the attack and fighting back against those conspiracy theories. i was also talking with a former mccain aid, longtime republican operative, who said he'd join for tv campaign ads, do what it would take to stop kari lake in support of the democrat running in this race, but she said the cavalry never arrived. he needed katie hobbs to be the one fighting, but she hasn't done that, which makes him and others, republican, independents, feel on the outside by jumping forward themselves when they feel like the democrat herself has not

take an strong enough stand. >> vaughn hillyard live if phoenix, than you very much. to your point, joe, at the least, she should be able to get on stage and be there to talk about fact versus fiction. and even if it isn't a conversation, because if kari lake does what she does, it's usually spewing a slew of lies wrapped up in a tight little present. so what she should do is just say i can't comment on that, because that isn't a fact. but here are the four different ways that this is not fact, and you have a candidate that is constantly lying. is that what arizona wants? does arizona want a governor who lies through her teeth for power? does arizona want a governor who doesn't care about you, she just cares about winning, and she will stoop so low she will degrade herself and capitalize on the power of disinformation just to get power?

that's what she's doing right here, right now to your face -- lying. i'm not participating in lying. i'm just here to separate fact from fiction. and when she brings up an actual policy that's an actual debate, i will engage. even if she did that, it would be something. but nothing? i definitely think that is running away from what is, some might disagree, a threat to our society, kari lake. >> well, you know what, mika, you make very compelling arguments. so the democrat should go out and make those compelling arguments. people go, oh, she's so telegenic, she's this. no, she's an election denier. she's -- >> she's a liar. >> she's a conspiracy theorist. she's a barack obama supporter. when it was cool to support barack obama, she supported him.

when it was cool to support donald trump, she supported donald trump. when it was cool to support conspiracy theory, she did. i'm telling you again, our next guest, if he debated her, there would be open weeping among republicans. >> let's get to him. >> why do we have a democrat who is running scared and running away from a person who should be the easiest in the world to debate against? because she is literally embracing crack pot conspiracy theories promoted by chinese religious cult websites. you can't debate against that? >> joining us now with more on the political landscape in arizona and the implications for the entire country, one of the state's democratic members of congress, ruben gallego. >> congressman. congressman. congressman. you and i, i suspect we

disdegree on a lot of things. but if somebody is threatening american democracy, you get your butt up on stage and you debate them and you take them out politically. what's happening in arizona? why does it seem that we have a democrat who, i must say, like other democrats i've seen and who are the complete opposite of you, running scared when american democracy is on the line? >> well, i'm not that deep in the campaign, but i can tell you that katie hobbs is a friend of mine, loves this country, is fighting for this country. >> but we need to hear that from her. >> i was in the navajo nation. she has presence everywhere. look, it is difficult to fight, you know, the freak show that -- when it comes to town, and that's kari lake and donald trump. she is an election denier. she's gone from being anti-choice to pro-life to choice again and now she's trying to figure out whether she's going to arrest mothers or

arrest the doctors. so this is the situation we're dealing with. it is a very dangerous situation, i agree. we have election deniers up and down the ticket. we have the trifecta of lunacy that's running. arizona, the democrats are fighters. we've been fighting for quite a while. we know how to defeat this craziness. she's not the first loony person to come through on the ballot and won't be the last. >> congressman, i am going to ask you the question i've been forced to answer about my own -- i've been forced to answer that entire my life, like, what's the deal with florida? florida is a really weird state. we've been talking about georgia this morning because of herschel walker, obviously. compare georgia and arizona together, they seem to have a lot of things in common. georgia have republicans there who not only stood up to donald trump and his election deny bug the secretary of state recorded trump and probably will get, you know, arrested because of it.

i'm curious, the republican party runs hotter and more extreme in arizona than it does in any other swing state. can you explain why that is? >> sure. look, that's the republican party. not all republicans. >> right. >> we have dedicated republicans that aren't part of the republican party, were pushed out by trumpism and just extremism many, many years ago. the type of people that you find, you know, that are head of your chambers of commerce, small business owners, pastor, things of that nature. they're coming out to support democrats because they believe these three people that are running are a severe danger to democracy. not only that, we don't want to deal with the embarrassment anymore. time and time again we've had republicans that have led this state and trying to become a modern, sophisticated state, and you have these yahoos who come in and embarrass us. my friends are stepping up, like wes.

the republican party does not represent the extreme -- i'm sorry -- the republican party here does not represent at all the actual republican party all together. >> but jonathan lemire, if the freak show is difficult to fight, then don't fight it, then fine, don't be in the race. don't democrats need to fight disinformation, fight for rightings that women have had for 50 years that were taken away? how do you do a campaign and not participate in debates, especially if your opponent says i want to debate you? >> a difficult case to make when in other races it's the democrat who is urging the republicans to debate. georgia is an example with senator warnock. i'll set up against herschel walker at any time. at this point, so far, it's just the one. there are some national democrats who have some concerns about this strategy. congressman, i want to switch gears and talk about an important issue in arizona. that's on friday, an arizona appeals court reinstated an injunction blocking a near total abortion ban, a ban that dates

from 1864. civil war-era law. the law has no exceptions, no exceptions, for victims of rape or incest, and friends of abortion fighters with imprisonment for nearly five years. how is this playing in the state of arizona? how is this going time pact what people do a month and a week from now on election day? >> look, it's having a lot of impact. you have to remember, arizona at its core is very much a libertarian state. there are a lot of republicans and independent men and women that do not like this type of garment overreach, coming into your family and telling you what to do with your body and your family choices. and let me tell you, it's not just democrats. i'm going up and down this state. i've been in rural areas, urban areas, and republican young women are pissed off. it will come up. two, you have to remember in

arizona, we have a turnout that includes young people. that's why it's difficult to win in off-year elections. i think this year you'll see a lot of young people vote because of the overturning of roe v. wade. they're out there, they're mad at this right they've had far long time is being taken away from them. they'll come out and vote with a good revenge. >> all right. ruben gallego, i really appreciate your coming on the show this morning. the landscape in arizona seems really, really dicey. congressman ruben gallego, thank you. coming up, less than a month before the midterm election, republicans are painting the democrats as soft on crime, and some democratic campaigns fear it's working. new reporting on that. also ahead, a positive jobs report sent the markets tumbling on friday. why that good news was seen as bad and what we can expect this week. a key inflation report is released.

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late in the first half. here's barkley. another end-around. wanting to throw. oh! daniel bellinger rumbling for the touchdown! >> got to get back here more often. >> we will. >> here's allen trying to go deep. he pulls it in! incredible catch! >> incredible is right! >> into the hands of kyle duggar and he will take it all the way for new england! defensive touchdown! >> on the move. a fake by rosen. this is the rookie running back, hall! clears a block by barrios!

still on his feet, dragging defenders, down to the 1! >> right up the middle, tony power. breaking free. pollard cuts back. pollard all the way, touchdown, dallas! >> da, da, da, da, da, da. who needs "sportscenter," right? some of the top plays from around the nfl yesterday. you had josh allen and the bills just starting to look like the bills again. they were dominant. the giants doing well, coming back in london from a 17-3 deficit over a really good packers team. and then the jets, the jets doing something really strange in the meadowlands. they're winning games. the jets? but not, t.j., the mets. in major league baseball last night in the wild-card round, the san diego padres, they just

embarrassed the mets last night. i was cheering for the mets. a little concerned going out forcing the umps to touch the pitcher, the padre pitcher's ears and everything. jonathan lemire, before we get to postseason picks, that spin rate was insane last night. i mean, if you, like, quadruple your spain rate, you have to ask yourself, what's this guy putting on the baseball? >> yeah. the teams had access to that data in the dugout which is why buck showalter went out afterwards. the mets said they thought musgrove had something in his glove or his ears. his ears were shiny. no way around it. >> glistening. >> glistening ears, not what you usually see. there is some theory that former ball players on twitter suggested he may have had a red hot, which is a substance like an icy hot, you put on yourself,

has a burning sensation. some pitchers think it improves their focus, basically they're pitching in pain. musgrove denied that as well. the umpires went out and had an almost sensual check of joe musgrove and his ears and found nothing. spin rate was up. it's the playoffs. the harder you throw, spin rate also goes up, so maybe musgrove is a little jacked. >> could be. >> therefore more velocity and more spin. i don't know. i get why the mets looked but it didn't feel very desperate and they didn't find anything. >> they didn't find anything. t.j. said from -- you talked about putting icy hot on your ears, t.j. said you know what that's called? that's also called cheating. of course we're coming up on the celebration of "morning joe's" 15-year anniversary. >> oh, my gosh. >> remember earlier in the show, pat buchanon, mike barnicle, we

would see them putting icy hot on their ears to focus their delivery during the early morning hours of 2007 and 2008. >> now i understand the mugs. okay. very nice. 15 years. >> of course, mika, i'm curious. the padres are facing the dodgers. >> yep. mm-hmm. >> what are you thinking? >> i'm a little upset after last night. >> yeah. boy, it was bad. i got to say the mets, mans, it was tough. but you do have cleveland facing new york, going to the bronx. that should be a great series. cleveland pitches were fantastic. yankees are a really good team but they don't have the best hitters. seattle, what a comeback against the blue jays. came back -- i think they were down 8-1, came back, won to 9-8. going up against the astros. the phillies, our condolences to claire mccaskill and some of the greatest fans in the world in st. louis. that's a shock. but the phillies going up against a buzz saw called the

atlanta braves. them you have to l.a. dodgers, who are the best of the best. they're going up against their rival san diego, about 90 miles to the south, 60 miles to the south. i don't know. me and geography in california, not on the top of that. to the south. from orange county to l.a., you get to san diego, which we all know, german for, i don't know, baseball, i think, mika. so, what else is going on? >> great. thanks. turning to the economy now -- i'm glad you're feeling better, joe. i really am. you know you're better. >> bad. >> trust me, he's feeling better. the markets, though, they're feeling a little better, opened just moments ago. let's bring in cnbc's dom chu. what are we looking at today, dom? >> so, here's how we're going to make the turn. icy and shot, icy and hot is what the fed is looking at right now, right, because what we have is a hot-ish economy, at least in a certain measure, and the

fed is looking to ice it down. >> that's good. >> it is pretty good, right. here's the reason why it's important, is because what happened on friday, right, we had a pretty decent we'll call it jobs number. job growth is still there but it's slowing down. but unemployment came down. that's good, right? the problem is in a situation like this, it's all about what the federal reserve and really central banks around the world have to do to get things under control on that price hike or inflation front. we know what they have to do. they have to take cash out of the economy, and that means raising interest rates to slow things down like inflation in the economy. clear signs, though, that inflation is slowing down in certain parts. we see fuel prices dropping. i pay for gasoline multiple times a week. i see it as well. food prices for certain goods are coming down. even real estate prices are showing some signs of slowing down. the problem is if you want to call it that, that america still has a pretty darn good economy on the jobs front. that's good news for the economy, bad news for markets. it means the fed still has a

ways to go to get inflation under control if jobs are still relatively plentiful and wages are relatively growing. it means more and stronger rate hikes down the line. that puts a damper on stock prices. it's also why this week is so important. we get producer price index on wednesday. that measures inflation at the business level. then you get that highly focused on consumer price index on thursday. that measures what all of us really pay at the counter, at the store, at the retail level. and by the way, in the middle of all of that, on wednesday, you get the fed minutes from their last meeting where they raised interest rates by 0.75%, so you get the conversation from behind closed doors. oh, and by the way, it's the kickoff to earnings season, meaning you get more commentary about inflation and everything else. 14 companies on the dock thet week, pems coe wednesday, delta air lines, walgreens, dominos on wednesday, thursday, and friday, all the big banks. so, it's a lot of macro data, a

lot of micro data, a lot of cat columnist for possible market volatility. that's what you have to look towards. >> icy hot, cnbc's dom chu, thank you very much. we'll see you soon. up next, new york city's mayor has declared a state of emergency as busloads of migrants continue to arrive in his city from border states. it's the subway series menu! 12 irresistible subs... like #11 subway club. piled with turkey, ham and roast beef. this sub isn't slowing down any time soon. i'll give it a run for its money. my money's on the sub. it's subway's biggest refresh yet.

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beautiful shot of new york city this morning at 19 minutes before the top of the hour. new york city's mayor has declared a state of emergency as the city struggles to house thousands of migrants who were bussed in from the southern border. gabe gutierrez has the latest. >> reporter: with bus after bus arriving from the southern border, this morning new york city is under a state of emergency. >> this is unsustainable. the city is going to run out of funding for other priorities. >> reporter: mayor eric adams

says the city is burning through a billion dollars this fiscal year on what he calls a humanitarian crisis, more than 61,000 people living in shelters. >> we need help, and we need it now. >> reporter: some migrants are already being housed in hotels, but new york officials are now also in negotiations with cruise lines to house asylum seekers on ships. the city also started building a tent camp, but because of flooding concerns workers are moving it to randall's island off the coast of manhattan. advocates for the homeless are slamming the housing plan. >> these facilities tend to be erected or docked in places that are very far from mass transit and services. >> reporter: weeks after florida governor ron desantis chartered migrants to martha's vineyard, the battle is heating up. mayor adams is blasting greg abbott, who's been busing migrants from his state, abbolt's saying, "mayor adams is an absolute hip kritd. instead of fear mongering and complaining about a few thousand

migrants in his sanctuary city, he should call on president biden to do his job and secure the border." in washington, d.c., migrants have been dropped off outside the home of vice president kamala harris. it was a 40-hour trip, this man said. back in new york, charities are struggling to keep up. this weekend hundreds of migrants, many from venezuela, lined up for warm clothes as winter approaches. >> that was gabe gutierrez without with that report. i'm without words on the busing of these migrants. so they miss their appointments, the hearings at court that they miss, due to these i guess political stunts. >> it is nothing but a political stunt, but it shows how people have no concern for human beings. these are human beings, some of them children. and they just cart them around like that. as you say, miss their asylum

hearings. >> hearings. there's no regard for whether or not we'll try to resolve the problem. they're used for political hate. mayor adams is right. the federal government needs to help. this is a real financial drain on these cities, and there's no end in sight. >> is it legal to do this, i mean, to move these migrants into place where is they can't go to the their hearings? it seems to me the martha's vineyard story has sparked some legal machinations. >> yeah. the department of justice is looking into it, but they haven't found anything yet that they can use. but the rev makes a good point, political story and political stunt, but these are human beings, this more than political pawns. some will say i'm glad i'm somewhere else. but they miss their asylum appointment and it's made a difficult situation worse. >> another big issue ahead of the midterms is crime. with republicans stepping up

their focus on the high crime rate across the nation. >> mandela barnes wants to end cash bail completely. me wrote the bill. barnes still wants to end cash bail today. mandela barnes, not just a democrat, a dangerous democrat. >> john fetterman wants to release convicted murderers from prison. he appointed a staffer who wants to eliminate life sentences for first-degree and first down murder. we loves free stuff, but we can't let him free murderers. >> those are some of the ads republicans are running against mandela barnes, challenging johnson, and fetterman, running against mehmet oz. democrats are concerned the ads are resonating after some recent polling showed manier voters believe republicans are better on the crime issue. joining us now, nbc news senior national political reporter

sahil kapur. his latest reporting is entitled "democrats try to preempt the gop's soft on crime attacks. it may not work." sahil, what did you find? >> hey, mika. this is a familiar theme for republicans. we are 29 days away from the midterm election and it's part of a three-pronged message republicans are closing with in key senate and house races. the message is the economy is bad, the border is bad, crime is bad, and therefore vote for us. democrats have anticipated this months ago. they saw the way republicans tried to weaponize the issue of crime in the 2020 election and many of them believe it did have an impact in helping republicans overperform. they're trying to push back, democrats are, in a number of ways. they are pointing out their support for legislation that would boost police funding from the american rescue plan, which funnelled billions of dollars to local police department, to a package of pro police bills that house democrats recently negotiated and passed. there are other attempts by house democrats to run ads

pushing back and oppose defunding the police and highlighting their own ties to law enforcement. we see that from members of congress like abigail spanberger, elaine luria, jarrett golden, and then there's the third approach which president biden has tried to do, which is to go on offense and saying republicans are the soft on crime party in part because some of them are turning a blind eye to january 6th. he points out many have attacked law enforcement like the fbi, and president biden has tried to highlight the fact that many republican, most, in fact, oppose tougher gun laws. he argues that loose gun laws are a significant contributor to crime. now, there is a division among democrats as to how to go about this because there's a salience to the crime issue they don't want to elevate. some democrats believe that voter perceptions are so entrenched, you know, in the same way that voters tend to believe democrats are better on things like health care, that they care more, that voters just believe in their gut that republicans are tougher on crime. and some democrats just want to

steer the focus away from crime to issues like abortion or prescription drugs savings and the inflation reduction act. others believe democrats have to fight back, that this is a sufficiently important issue to voters. it ranks third, fourth, fifth in the polls depending on the race. and they have to fight back and argue. many believe that democrats have a good argument to fight back to counter republican attacks. we see that from a recent spate of ads in particular from the advocacy group every town for gun safety, attacking republicans as soft on crime, for opposing tougher gun laws, which they argue is a major contributor to violent crime, mika. >> nbc's sahil kapur, thank you so much for your reporting this morning. earlier this year, president biden signed an executive order focused on advancing, quote, effective, accountable policing and strength in public safety. while much of the focus was on the changes to arresting individuals in the wake of the murder of george floyd, also

included was this language aimed at limiting solitary confinement. "it is also the policy of my administration to ensure that conditions of confinement are safe and humane and that those who are incarcerated are not subjected to unnecessary or excessive uses of force, are free from prolonged segregation, and have access to quality health care, including substance use disorder care and mental health care." the key part being free from prolonged segregation. but new data from the federal bureau of prisons shows the opposite. so-called solitary confinement is spiking under the biden administration, up 7% from since president biden signed that order. joining us now, former executive editor of "the new york times" and founding editor in chief of the marshall project, bill keller. his new book is entitled "what's prison for?

punishment and rehabilitation in the age of mass incarceration." it's so great to have you back on the show. nice to see you. >> thank you. >> i want to hear about this book, especially in light of sort of common narrative or schools of thought among many is that the criminal justice sy perpetuates the racial and economic balance. it's a drain on your system and toxic to those who are incarcerated. >> it is interesting talking about all the crime, crime, crime. crime is up, and it's a problem. it is a fallacy that you should lock up more people for longer periods. we are the world leader in incars raeugz. it isn't solving the crime problem. . >> right. every year, 600,000 people are released from prison. two-thirds of them are rearrested again within five

years. that is not a demonstration of the value of mass incarceration. >> that is a pretty bad recidivism rate. >> and what amazes me is we keep doing it. i remember growing up in new york. we used to call jails correction facilities. now they are called detention facilities. even the name change, bill, tells us where we've changed what we are focusing on. we're not trying to correct people. we're just trying to detain them >> there is a 200-year history of sort of political schizophrenia on this issue. we have this punitive streak we brought over from the puritans, i guess. >> yeah. >> and there are periods when rehabilitation is embraced and there are periods when it's not.

since the '70s there's been a sharp turn towards the punishment rather than rehabilitation. >> the book touches upon some lesser explored aspects of the prison system in the united states, including for-profit in incarceration. >> if you count the ones for-profit companies, it is 10% of prisoners are in private prisons. that overlooks the fact that they contract all kinds of services to private companies, transportation, medical care, cafeteria, uniforms, telecommunications. and a reporter shane valley went undercover at a private prison in louisiana and talked about

the bottom line is everything. >> right. >> so bill keller, the new book is called "what's prison for punishment and rehabilitation in the age of mass incarceration." thank you so much. congratulations on the book. it's great to have you back on "morning joe". thank you for coming on this morning >> thank you. coming up, donald trump wants back the materials the fbi took in its search of mar-a-lago. they're mine, he says. do you think? i don't know. he also said it's planted so i'm kind of confused. 'm kind of confused

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neutrogena®. for people with skin. the prosecutor in georgia investigating whether former president donald trump and his allies illegally tried to interfere in the 2020 election is widening her probe. fulton county district attorney fannie willis filed a petition seeking testimony from two allies, newt gingrich and national security adviser michael flynn. in the court filings, willis said both gingrich and flynn have unique knowledge of the circumstances surrounding what she characterized as multistate coordinated efforts to influence the results of the november 2020 election in georgia and elsewhere. the petition seeks to have both of them appear before the georgia grand jury next month

after the midterm elections. jonathan lemire, this is like your book in many ways. everyone says watch this specific probe. this is the one that could be resounding. >> yeah. the d.a. has been aggressive. it only seems to be expanding. she wanted brian kemp to testify. the judge said no. we have to wait until the election. she said fine. she is adding names to the roster. >> interesting. okay. that does it for us this morning. jose diaz-balart picks up live coverage. and good morning 10:00 a.m. eastern, 7:00 a.m. pacific. breaking overnight, russia attacks several cities in ukraine in retaliation for a weekend attack on a key bridge. we'll have live reports from kyiv and moscow. 29 days before the midterm

elections. how things will turn out is still anyone's guess. we'll take a closer look at one of the states in the balance, ohio. meanwhile, florida residents are assessing the damage from hurricane ian. in the wake of that hurricane, migrants are many times the backbone of the rebuilding. we'll look at the dangers they face. a step toward accountability in texas after the uvalde police department suspended after the massacre that left 19 students and two teachers dead. we will talk to the state senator leading the push for accountability. in venezuela, two dozens killed after landslides brought on by heavy rain. and we begin this hour with breaking news out of ukraine. overnight, russia launched a series of deadly strikes across ukraine, including in