kevin: and helps prevent the wildfires that create toxic smoke. that's why calfire firefighters, the american lung association, and the coalition for clean air support prop 30. naomi: i'm voting yes on 30. good to be with you. i'm katy tur, with the lead slipping away in the poll, the democrats are trying to reframe the issue of the economy. with gas prices back on the rise, president biden announced the release of 15 million barrels of petroleum from the strategic oil reserve. >> we're calling it a ready and release plan. this allows us to move quickly to prevent oil price spikes and respond to international events. independent analysts have confirmed that drawdowns from reserves so far have played a big role in bringing down oil prices. bringing them down.

>> now, 15 million barrels does sound like a lot, and it does have the potential to drive down gas prices in the short term, but it is not a new release. it has been planned for a while now. the final tranche of that 180 million barrels the white house announced last spring. so why announce it today? again, president biden said it was not about politics, but the election is 20 days away, and polls show the economy is dominating the national consciousness. around 80% say the economy or inflation or both will play a major role in how they cast their vote. the president wants to remind voters his team is trying to do something about it, especially as democrats try to say it is, republicans say it is all the democrats fault, as voters tend to blame the party in power when they worry about the state of things. is that fair? probably not. the economy is extremely complicated. and people who spend decades

studying it say presidents have very little control, if any at all, over immediate ebbs and flows. but nuance is hard to argue on the campaign trail. of course, we should remind you that polls do not tell the whole story. they never do. and they haven't been all that reliable over the past few elections. which is why pollsters will warn you that there's a lot of uncertainty out there. there are big variables. what does abortion do to turnout? voter registration in pennsylvania and ohio is up. what about the threats to democracy? january 6th? or looming presidential run by former president trump? they could all come into play. but what history tells us is that when it comes to voting, a person's pocketbook tends to be top of mind. joining me now from the white house, nbc news digital senior white house reporter, shannon, i'm asking this of you, this was planned, the last tranche, and it's come can at a notable time.

>> yes, katy, and you know, you heard the president, you noted there, saying that this was not political, and i won't say democratic strategists and pollsters that i have been talking to, that my colleagues have been talking to, they have been raising the alarm that the white house and the democrats need to do more in these final days to show they are actively doing something to address these main concerns consumers have around inflation and the economy. they just don't want to hear the president and the democrats hear about legislation they previously have passed because consumers are still feeling pain here and in their wallets, they want to hear about what they are doing now, and more importantly, what they're going to do over the next two years, and this certainly seems like an example of the white house trying to show not just tell what they are doing, even though for the reasons you noted, katy, this is not going to have a major impact on oil prices. this is a rounding error, essentially, of the amount of

oil america uses in a week or a month and it was previously planned. but here's a little bit more of what the president had to say when asked about the politics of this. >> what is your response to republicans who say you are only doing this release to help democrats in the midterms? >> where have they been the last four months? that's my response. >> is it politically motivated, sir? >> no, it's not. >> the midterms are here. >> it makes sense. i've been doing this for how long now? it's not politically motivated at all. it's motivated to make sure that i continue to push on what i've been pushing on. we're calling it a ready and release plan. this allows us to move quickly to prevent oil price spikes and respond to international events. >> so one other thing i would note, going on today at the white house, along this line of the president trying to talk about what he and his administration are doing to help the economy, we expect at 3:00, another event talking about the

infrastructure law, and it is an issue that hasn't really resonated with voters, but democrats feel they can continue to sort of score some points with voters here and there by talking about some of these specific projects that are going to be starting soon, in the coming year at least, in specific districts and states that they think will be appealing to voters. >> shannon pettypiece at the white house, thank you very much. let's bring in msnbc political analyst and former rnc chairman michael steele. always good to see you. the economy is a big driver at elections and when the economy comes into question, people blame the party in power. we are seeing that now. it's complicated though and i think it is something to do a better job of explaining because the economy is not subject to immediate policy changes by the administration. the economy, it takes years for policies to go into effect. so when you are trying to talk to voters about, you know, educating them, about how best to vote, how do you do it? how do you talk about nuance when nuance is so hard to

digest? >> well, you do it three, four, seven months out, not three weeks before an election. because the very thing you just said, you've got to bring voters into the conversation, and you have to help them frame and understand exactly what, what you announced today, how that plays out, what it means to them, what they should be looking for, what signs should they be looking for down the road to show that this is working or whether it is on infrastructure, whether it's on gas prices, whether it's on health care, whatever the subject is, one thing that has been stunning to watch is how democrats apparently have all these successful policies, right, and they don't want to talk about them, they don't know how to have that conversation. it reminds me of republicans in the reverse frame during the obama years, and during trump years, on obama care. repeal and replace. okay, what is it?

we're waiting. so when the moment comes, you have no bill, you have no effort under way that would actually repeal the legislation and replace it with what? so you can see how political parties like to do the rhetorical flourishes but they're not bringing people into the conversations because americans aren't sitting here, you know, completely out of the loop, they're watching, they're experiencing this realtime, katy, and i think for the president, his efforts today, while important, you know, three weeks out, you don't know how at this point the voters are going to take it all in because the republicans can make the counter-argument that you just heard in the presser. so this is all politics, it really didn't mean anything. >> they're flooding the air waves right now with ads saying the economy is terrible and democrats are to blame. >> yes. >> and a really simple message. i'm hoping that you can flush that out there. how do you bring them into the conversation? what do you say? the economy will go through ups and downs and you got to hang on because this is going to be good in the long run?

is that enough? >> well, it is for the very reason that you said. the president has no control over this. the congress has no control over this. our economy is being shaped as much by what's going on in europe right now as it is what's going on on wall street or what's going on, on wall street. and it is the very inter-connected and much more than it has ever been, economic reality. and so going back to the state of the union, when the president first started rolling out his conversation around what he wanted to do on infrastructure, and how he was dealing with covid, everybody knew at that time that the warning signs for this economy were there. we knew that there was going to be a tightening coming. so at that point, you begin to get people prepared for that, you let them know that, look, over the last four years, five years, folks, we spent an extra $4 trillion, 2 trillion during the trump years, 2 trillion at the beginning of my term, to get

us stabilized with covid. to help those families. imagine if we didn't put those moneys into place during covid. what do you think the economy would would look like now? if people were unemployed for those two years because their bosses couldn't keep them because we didn't provide the resources for the employers to keep their employees or for people to have that extra $2400 or $1600 in their bank account. that's how you make the argument. that's how you begin to bring the public into the conversation. so they understand how they're connected to all of this. so then when republicans or anybody comes out and says well, the economy sucks, they go, nah, not really, not as bad. yes, we're hurting but it is not the way you're making it seem. and you lessen the fear and the concern. >> when you look at where we are right now, 20 days away, we have polling showing the republicans are re-taking the lead, how

confident are you in the numbers that are being put out that these are going to stay this way, and we are going to see republicans re-taking the house? >> they very well may re-take the house. i think the x factor, going into the cycle, i said it before and i'll say it again, white suburban women. that's the x factor. that's the only group that the republican party is preying on as they did in 2019, as they did in 2020, and as they're doing now. 2018, they were scaring suburban white women with caravans coming to their neighborhood. 2020, they were talking about low income housing coming into your neighborhood. i had, on this air, saying wait a minute, we're already here, what you are talking about, black folks already here, because we know what the ins inference and now we're talking about crt and what they're doing to your kids and they're mixing this message to reframe the narrative for suburban white females, in a way that gets them to move off of their vote in

2020 for biden and democrats and back on to them in 2022. the question remains for them whaunks -- waunk is going to happen come '23 with republicans running the house? >> michael steele, thanks for joining us today. >> thank you. let's go to energy secretary jennifer granholm. madam second, thanks for joining us. i'm not sure how much you got from our conversation with michael steele, whether you were plugged in, but he was saying that the issue here today is that you're trying to bring people in to tell people the economy is going to be okay, and that the democrats are putting measures in place that are going to help things just stay the course, but that this conversation about oil reserves, about steadying yourself, steeling yourself for the ups and downs of this should have started happening months ago, the democrats should have been on board months ago instead of

coming out today to try to stem the bleeding in the polls. >> first of all, this is about people are feeling on the ground, this is not about the political moment. the president has been releasing 10, 30 million barrels per day, from the strategic petroleum reserve, since the, almost since the war began, a little bit after the war began, because russia pulled all of those barrels essentially off the market when it invaded another country, and so they were not going to accept russian oil. the president has been doing this all along. and this is exactly why the amount per gallon is down about $1.15 since the peak back in june. so the president has been on this. and today, he also is going to be announcing another really big and important thing for the economy, which is that we are going to be building the batteries for electric vehicles in the united states, when previously, and everybody agreed, china has really held a lock on building batteries for electric vehicles. so it is a one-two punch. we want to make sure that we

increase production right now, which is part of what was announced today on oil and gas, but we also want to accelerate the transition, to clean energy, so we're not held hostage to these global ups and downs and volatility associated with the fossil fuel sector. >> how do you tell people though that it is not as bad as it feels? because even though you just mention and we showed a graphic that showed that prices are declining, they're still pretty high, and there's a feeling among some at their local station that the prices have gone up a few cents at least in the last week. so you're going to get a variety of experiences out there, not every gas station reacts the same way. we're talking about averages around the country. how do you make sure that people understand what's happening? and i know you say it is not political but we're 20 days from an election so everything right now, everything right now is influencing how people are going to cast their vote, and you vote, you obviously want democrats to remain in power. >> i'm talking about the president having been working on

this for a good part of this year. but however, fully agree, people see it advertised as they go on a street corner but looking on average, you're right, every region of the country is a little bit different, but on average, we have seen the price continue to drop another 5 cents over this past week, and we will continue, i think, because the president has announced an additional release, and he's also encouraging increased production by the oil and gas industry, so that we can make up for the barrels that have been taken off the market as a result of russia's invasion of ukraine. and can i just say, one other thing, he announced today, which is not being covered that much, which is a big piece of it, which is that we're going to buy back, to refill the strategic petroleum reserve, at a price of about 70 dollars per barrel. right now the price per barrel is about 90, could be between 90 and 100, so we'll be saving the taxpayer money but what this does is say a couple of years out, to oil and gas companies, you can invest now, in increasing production, because there will be certainty that your, what you are producing

will be bought back, so that allows for them, and for their investors to allow them to increase production. >> what about saudi arabia, what are the plans for any sort of consequences from this administration or what's being talked about because they raised prices, opec+ has raised prices for a gallon of oil. >> well, their cuts certainly have an impact like all do, and that's why it is important for us to do what we're doing, and i'll let the president talk about consequences on saudi arabia, but i think one of the great pieces of news that is going to be coming out today is just wait, this battery announcement, which is the first of the announcements with the bipartisan infrastructure law, which will allow for us to build out the decks for the electric vehicle, and which will allow more electric vehicles to be made in the united states, which will reduce the demand for fossil fuels and certainly will alleviate people's pocketbooks if they're able to get into one of those electric vehicles eventually. >> and i know you're going to be

be at that event which starts around 3:00. >> yes. >> just one last question if you don't mind. should we expect there to be some decision or announcement made about saudi arabia coming from the white house? >> i'm going to let them respond to that. i'm not in that column. >> secretary granholm, thank you very much for being on the show and talking to us today. >> thank you. vladimir putin declares martial law in the regions he illegally annexed. what the decision could mean for the war. and president trump then president biden, delayed the release of records regarding the assassination of jfk. and one group is suing the government to make them public now. we'll see what happens with that. and there is a scheme afoot. senator sheldon whitehouse joins us with evidence who he says is really controlling the supreme court. me court. better? create something new? our dell technologies advisors can provide you with the tools and expertise you need

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russian president vladimir putin declared martial law this

morning on parts of the ukraine he illegally annexed last month. kherson, zaporizhzhia, they will all be run by the russian military he says, though ukraine says that changes nothing, that they are still fighting to take back that territory. meanwhile, moscow continues to fire on kyiv, and now the eu plans to sanction iran for supplying russia with suicide drones. in russia, "the new york times" reports hundreds of thousands of men are now gone. they've either fled or been drafted. joining me now from moscow is nbc's chief international correspondent keir simmons. so give us the latest on what is happening there. >> we spoke many times, haven't we, in the past days and weeks, about those expecting an u-turn if you like from president putin and once again, here is the evidence of that. it is a declaration of martial law in these annexed areas of ukraine, and it is a sign that

frankly president putin is doubling down. despite his own military describing the situation as difficult, as you mentioned, it means that the russian military are now in charge, rather than, if you like, the leaders that were installed by president putin, and he is also giving them more powers. and this all s-all about a battle over the crucial city of kherson in ukraine. thousands of civilians are being removed from that city, by the russians, as the training forces bear down on it, and you know, we had a televised interview with the general there, who is the general who president putin put in charge of what russia calls its special operations in ukraine, and he, the way that he spoke, frankly, many russians have heard this from their military before, he described the situation in ukraine as tense. he was very frank, to be honest.

he said that it is difficult, i feel like i've been in some ways preparing the russian population for the challenges ahead. and then we saw this announcement from president putin which again i think was in a sense a response to that and kind of measures put in place for what russians clearly signal to its own population are going to be, as they say, difficult, difficult times. so those restrictions don't just lead to that annexed area, it has spread across russia and here in moscow for example under the decree, cars can be searched. there is clearly a desire to have more control. president putin not turning back but wanting to have more control. and at the same time, as you mentioned, thousands of russians have now been drafted or have left the country because they do not want to take part in what russian is doing in ukraine. >> how much is this part of the

conversation every day on the streets of moscow? >> yes, it is the conversation on the streets of moscow. when you go and talk to people, it is the vibe, and you will hear russian after russian saying they support president putin and many say they cannot conceive of anything other than a victory for russia in ukraine despite its own military saying that things are difficult, but they do also say they are anxious, particularly in relation to that draft, to that partial draft of 300,000 russian men, so the atmosphere has changed, but the truth is, that still there is a good bit of support for president putin. >> keir simmons in moscow, thank you very much. and meanwhile, in kyiv, cal perry visited a school where students are being taught how to prepare for the worst. they're putting on swim caps and

goggle, surgical masks and plastic monacos. the elementary and high school kids are learning how to try to survive the unsurvivable, preparing for what eventually could be a nuclear attack. coming up next, what happens when florida senate candidates, val demings and marco rubio, faced off in the first and only debate last night. and the records of the jfk assassination under law should have been released five years ago. what one group is doing right now to get them right now. w. will you make something better? create something new? our dell technologies advisors can provide you with the tools and expertise you need to bring out the innovator in you. (vo) with their verizon private 5g network, associated british ports can now you need precisely orchestrate nearly 600,000 vehicles passing through their uk port every year. don't just connect your business. right on time. make it even smarter.

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♪ you did it! ♪ with centrum multigummies. ♪ what will you do? will you make something better? create something new? our dell technologies advisors can provide you with the tools and expertise you need to bring out the innovator in you. the country's largest online source of jfk assassination records is suing president biden and the national archives. the foundation wants to force the federal government to release all remaining documents related what happened on november 22, 1963. the government has long said it was a lone gunman who killed jfk, lee harvey oswald, but lots of folks have questions, and those questions take on a conspiratorial tone when the government keeps delaying the release of all of the records. the last delay was last year, by president biden, the next

release date is december 15th, which the cia tells nbc news it plans to comply with, so why is this organization suing? joining me now is nbc news senior national political reporter mark caputo. with the story, why are they suing? >> because they don't trust the cia, the government ort white house in this case, the national security state for i don't know the last 60 years have kept the full story of jfk's assassination under wraps. in 1982, congress passed a law that said look, release everything by 2017, and when 2017 came and went, and the records didn't get released. trump delayed, it and then delayed it again, and left it to biden and biden delayed it. after the foundation had gone flew the records and looked at everything, they said we're not sure this is all going to be released in december. let's sue. that's where they are. >> what's the likelihood they will prevail in this? what is the reading that biden and trump used to delay it

further? >> well, biden's excuse was covid. and according to the attorney for the foundation, that was sort of a dog ate my homework excuse. and in the case of trump, he just said that these agencies needed more time. again, the assassination happened in 1963. almost 60 years ago. there's been ample time. there hasn't been the ample will on the part of various agency, the cia especially, the fbi to a lesser degree, and the other agencies, to release the records. >> curious at the very least. mark, thank you very much. and i want to go back now to the midterms, in florida, crime and abortion dominated the senate debate between republican senator marco rubio and democratic challenger val demings and kari lake is being joined on the campaign trail of glen youngkin who ran and won

centered in part on the platform of critical race theory. shaq brewster is here with me and vaughn hillyard from tucson, arizona. shaq, what happened at that debate last night? >> it was a feisty one. definitely an entertaining debate, a lot of interruptions, a lot of insults back and forth, but also a clear contrast between the two candidates. senator marco rubio coming in this race as the front-runner, but the challenger representative val demings putting up a fight last night. we saw them go back and forth on issues of gun control. on senator rubio reversing his position and comments he made after the 2018 parkland shooting and saying that he no longer supports the idea of raising the age to buy an assault weapon. you saw senator rubio go after congresswoman demings on the issue of effectiveness, saying that he is a polished and effective senator, and that she would essentially be a rubber stamp for democratic policies. then we saw this exchange over the issue of abortion.

i want you to watch it. >> you made promises that you had no intentions on keeping to the parents of parkland. florida passed legislation raising the age, to have an assault weapon, passed red flag laws that we've seen 7,000 plus instances, where they've been used now. it's our primary responsibility, it is the safety of floridians. and senator, 24 years in elected office, and you have not yet risen to that occasion. and then when asked about it, you say something that makes no sense. >> what makes no sense is that we're going to actually pass laws that only law-abiding people will follow and criminals continue to buy them. the truth of the matter at the end of the day, the americans have a second amendment right to protect themselves. >> obviously, katy, that was on the issue of guns but you can get a sense of the contention, and the contentious nature that we saw with the debate and a

similar exchange over the issue of abortion. one thing again, this is an increasingly conservative state. and florida is, you know, democrats have not done well in florida, at a statewide level in some cycles, so democrats here understand they have an uphill bat until this race, but you saw a lot of people in the state pleased with the performance from val demings in this fight that she has against marko rube bow. >> vaughn, let's go to arizona. governor glen youngkin i don't think, but i don't believe he denied the 2020 election results correct me if i'm wrong, but what is he doing out there with someone who has? >> this is an open 2024 presidential candidate, the main stop in michigan and oregon but now joining the stage with kari lake in a number of minutes here. as liz cheney you will recall a couple of weeks ago, said that individuals like glen youngkin in her words should not accommodate candidates like kari lake. what you are looking at is lake

essentially now in these 20 days trying to broaden her appeal to an arizona electorate much of the same way glen youngkin was able to do so one year ago in virginia, where he opened up a big tent party there, and forever trumpers and never trumpers and focusing on state-based issues which is what you heard kari lake increasingly trying to do over the last two weeks and i asked about campaigning alongside her, and she was thrilled. and on the other end, both candidates are yet to take part in the debate. democrats and independents and mccain era conservatives that i talked to, much to their ire. but she did sit down with a 30-minute interview last night with the local pbs and i will let you hear it. take a listen. >> political leaders like kari lake continue to mislead them. she is not running for the

people of arizona. she is running for herself. and for the former president. and when people like her question the results of the 2020 election and try to overturn them, we stand firm, because there is no evidence of anything she or anyone else who says about the 2020 election being stolen. >> when you look at the polling here, this continues to be a close race. kari lake's campaign says they have momentum on their side and continues to talk more about issues from inflation to water issues to fentanyl. and when you're seeing this campaign evolve, not only glen youngkin with her last night, she was on the campaign trail at an event i was there about an hour and a half ago with tulsi gabbard and both reflected on former democrats and kari lake was an obama supporter a number of years ago and this is part of her hedge to try to win over independents and conservatives that voted for joe biden and

mark kelly two years ago and those voters that she needs to pull up a victory and keep the position in republican hands. >> thank you. "meet the press" is live from georgia today, you can tune in at 4:00 p.m. when chuck todd will talk to political officials in that state, and among guests brad raffensperger and lieutenant governor geoff duncan and andre dickens, atlanta mayor. coming up, where's the beef? that's truly word for word what the special master is asking for in the mar-a-lago special records investigation. what he is talking about. and he said he didn't set out to look for a scheme but that is what he has said he had found. sheldon whitehouse and what he is arguing what is happening to the supreme court. and he has evidence. and he has evidence. will you make something better? create something new? our dell technologies advisors can provide you with the tools and expertise you need

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funders, with what is called the judicial crisis network, which is run by carrie severino and it is doing pr and campaign ads for republican judicial nominees. it got $17 million donation in the garland gorsuch contest, it got another single $17 million donation to support kavanaugh, and somebody, perhaps the same person spent $35 to million to influence the makeup of the supreme court and over here a whole array of legal broughts of dark money with a different role and bring their cases to the court and they don't wind their way, they get shoved, with legal groups that ask to lose before to quickly get to the court to get their business down there. >> you probably remember that moment, amy coney barrett's

hearings in 2020, senator sheldon whitehouse laying out what he called a scheme by the right to use dark money to shape the supreme court. now, two years later, he is laying out his case in detail in his new book, it is apartmently titled "the scheme," senator whitehouse argues in it, there is a right wing plot to capture america's courts, and going all the way up to the supreme court, arguably the most powerful body in the united states, one that has virtually no oversight. joining me now is the senator from rhode island, sheldon whitehouse, senator always good to have you. thanks for coming on. so this book is detailed, it is at the very beginning of it, you say i'm going to lay out my case and argue it and point you to all of the evidence and you, dear reader, can make your best assumption or you can take from it conclusions -- >> judgment, yes. >> thank you for helping me with that. so lay out the evidence for us.

what is the evidence that you found that the supreme court is not being controlled by the nine justices who are on it but instead controlled by a shadowy group of unknown figures who have a ton of money at their disposal? >> the first thing is that the traces of this go back many years, indeed plane decades, and it really lit up under trump, it became extremely apparent what was going on. and that was that our supreme court justices were actually being chosen by a group operating via the federalist sort, a private organization, providing secret recommendations to the president that were followed, while accepting huge, multimillion dollar anonymous checks, and then when it came time for confirmation, you would see these checks, like the clip you mentioned that would go to the judicial crisis network, which i'm sure has offices in the same hallway and the same

building as the federalist society, and they put up the tv ads, and then once the judges are on the court, then come these flotillas of front groups who don't disclose who is funding them but all file separate briefs that point in the same direction to steer the court to the results that they want, and around this there is a whole lot of parliamentary behavior, world procedural behavior by the court, and very tellingly, over and over again, the outcomes violate conservative judicial principles. so the true north on this compass is who wins and not what the principles are. >> you say you first started to notice this and question it when you were looking at climate change. it was a bipartisan issue. not that many years ago. >> yes. >> and then suddenly it was not. what changed? >> business united changed everything. in fact, we were bipartisan on climate change until january of

2010, when business united was decided. after that, no republicans has gotten on a serious climate bill since. and what happened was they were able to plow unlimited money in politics and they were able to hide it with them, by operating through a whole bunch of phony front groups. and now you had anonymous unlimited money pouring into our politics, something that the citizens united decision said would be corrupting, and that they allowed it to happen, and so i started to look into that, and then i started looking at some of the supreme court decisions and realized it was the same groups that were in front of the supreme court that were behind the climate denial operation. and then you start to see how it fits together, and that's when i tried to lay out in the book.

>> in 2018 and 2019, my colleague jacob soboroff and i talked about dark money and i was asking lawmakers about it and most did not want to talk to me but i did get lindsey graham to stop and here's what he told me about dark money and citizens united. >> i had a hearing about this, so if i get to be chairman, i don't know if i will, i would like to hear, have a hearing about dark money, and i think floating money into the political system, even the dark nature of these organizations is something that somebody needs to address. >> so he said that it was a big problem, and that when he was chairman, he was going to look into it. is lindsey graham going to partner with you on this? >> not yet. but i think he shares a particular concern that i have, which is if you're going to keep the dark money avenues open for domestic big special interests like the fossil fuel industry,

there's no way to keep those avenues open for the fossil fuel industry but close them to vladimir putin, and close them to china, and close them to the iranian ayatollahs. once you let dark money into our system, once you let unlimited anonymous money into our system, you can't police from foreign influence either. >> so how can they -- so many of your colleagues, not just the members of the supreme court, but everybody is benefitting from dark money, democrats included, are benefitting from dark money, lots of dark money going into democratic campaign, and in fact, at one point it was more than the republicans and the republicans will point and say they're just as bad. >> yup. >> how do you stop it? if everybody is benefitting from it? >> disclosure is the way to stop it. >> how do you get disclosure? >> you have a law -- >> how do you get them to pass a law when they're benefitting from it? >> that's the problem. you got the republican party, taking a categorical position in

favor of dark money, and every single republican in the senate, to a person, voted in opposition to this bill, despite the fact that their own voters are crying out for reform in this area. but when the leadership and elected official level you become dependent on dark money, and you see it as your permanent pathway to power, you will cross your own voters to keep access to that power. and -- >> there's millions of dollars going to convince those voters that it is not a problem. >> exactly. at some point it becomes circular. >> yes. >> you can put enough money into the system to convince people to vote for somebody even though they're horrible on that issue because money talks and eventually it drowns everybody out. >> i guess part of the solution is look into who is funding a lot of the ads you see on television. if you can't quite figure it out, maybe question the

motivations behind it. that's a lot of work for the individual. worth it but a lot of work. >> thank you, senator. >> a lot of the people involved in that stuff are also involved with what happened in the court. >> senator sheldon white house, good to have you on, the book is "the scheme", it is thick and a lot and it is going through all of the evidence and all that is happening in this country and all of the problems we face it. it's worth. it i appreciate your time, sir. why the special master reviewing records seized at mar-a-lago are now skeptical of donald trump's executive privilege claims. don't go anywhere. go anywhere.

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wants trump lawyers to get a better understanding why they are asserting privilege over the documents seized at mar-a-lago a little perplexing as i go through the law, what's the expression, where's the beef i need some beef joining me is former u.s. attorney and msnbc legal analyst barbara mcquade. my floor direct ser shaking his head at me barbara, what is he asking for >> this is what we said in the '80s, katy, he is asking for substance, for reasons to support trump's claims of executive privilege and they have asserted privilege over certain documents before the special master and haven't explained why. and the judge is asking for th executive bridge is not meant for everything and sometimes for executive branch secrets to the legislative branch. but athere, trump is trying to protect the executive branch secrets from the executive branch. it is a etnonsensical starting point. in addition, executive privilege is qualified. means it can be waived

when there is a greater interest that outweighs it. so in this instance, it is not at all apparent why there is protection for executive privilege, and so the judge is demanding to know why do you think so, give me the evidence, give me the beef. >> can we expect judge cannon to get involved here, as she's done in the past, to try and assert some authority over the special master? >> it is possible. she's i ultimately the boss her. but i t think, i'm hopeful that the 11th circuit has kinds of cabined her authority a little bit by insisting her orders be lawful and the judge, judge dearie has asked the trump team to come up with information, with evidence, with support, and the lawyers have said they will do that and we will have to see what they come up with, but ultimately i think the special master here will say there is no executive privilege and it may be even that the justice department is successful in the 11path circuit court of appealso dispense with the special master

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