finally all of these transcripts as opposed to the snippets that we have seen in testimony, and in parts released by the committee so far. >> it will certainly make for must reading. i appreciate that. "politico's" nicholas woo. thank you so very much for waking up and joining us and providing us with your expertise. and thank you for getting up "way too early" with us on this thursday morning. we have a packed "morning joe" starting right about now. down in georgia, herschel's gearing up for his runoff with raphael warnock and he's doing it by tackling the issues voters believe matter the most. >> the other night i was watching this movie, i was watching this movie called fright night, but it was about vampires, i don't know if you vampires, a werewolf can kill a vampire, do you know that. >> senator, your time has expired. >> whoa, and that is what donald

trump has defense attorney to the -- done to the georgia republican party. >> have you heard all of that, willie, yet? >> i have. >> it's incredible. >> how is he going to bring this plane in for a landing, and you get to the end, and it doesn't. it goes into the side of sewn mountain. >> yeah, there's no sense to it at all. >> no. >> it's a very good georgia reference. >> we're going to have more from that moment in the campaign trail. the big development, nbc news projects republicans will win the house of representatives. with democrats in control of the senate, we're going to discuss what a split congress means for the biden agenda. we're following new reporting this morning that more and nor republican maga donors are ditching trump's 2024 presidential run with one billionaire who donated to trump in 2020 telling the "new york

post" quote i wouldn't give him an f'ing nickel. >> we'll put him down as undecided. good morning. >> we're hearing a lot of that and a lot of bumbling around by former allies and workers of donald trump, elected officials, people like mike pompeo, mike pence. some of them don't want to come out and say it directly, but the impact is clear. >> speak to it. >> yeah, they speak to it, the fact that it seems the party is finally moving away from donald trump. >> mike pence is on this tour ostensibly about his book, but all he is being asked about is donald trump, and he's getting closer and closer to saying no. he's saying effectively there are going to be better options out there, including perhaps myself in his words. it's not just mike pence, it's congressional republicans sprinting away from cameras on capitol hill when they're asked

about donald trump. it's these big donors who helped him launch his campaign in 2015 and 2016. rode with him through the terrible things that happened, now finally are saying, no, we're not doing this again. >> not doing it. and to willie's point about mike pence possibly running, noticing that his comments come after the midterms and his comments come saying donald trump endangered his life but also not cooperating with the january 6th committee saying it's too partisan. all sort of preparing himself to light himself up for the next powerful position. along with joe, willie, and me, we have former white house press secretary now an msnbc host, jen psaki and white house editor for "politico," sam stein stays on with us this morning. you're doing a great job, sam. >> thank you. >> oh, my god, he'll be 60 years old, and it's just how old we are. so let's go right to those republican megadonors breaking

with donald trump. the former president announced his third presidential bid. steven schwarzman says he will not back trump's campaign. he said america does better when its leaders are rooted in today and tomorrow, not today and yesterday. it is time for the republican party to turn to a new generation of leaders and i intend to support one of them in the presidential primaries. he is not the only republican megadonor who has decided not to support trump this go around. earlier this month, billionaire ken griffin endorsed florida governor ron desantis. griffin called trump quote a three-time loser. >> ouch. >> well, that's only a fact. that's not like a description. >> and billionaire, ronald lauder will not help finance trump's campaign either according to a spokesperson.

meanwhile, "the new york times" reports that other donors are actively weighing their options. while a number of former allies are staying on the sidelines an early sign that he may face difficulty winning the support of the republican party still reeling from unexpected midterm losses. the paper notes even as our daughter has declined to get involved this time around, "the times" reports, the transformation of mr. trump's position and the party over the past week has been striking and his campaign kickoff appears to have done little to silence the criticism. >> these mega donors, obviously some of the people that fueled donald trump's campaign, were with him, and listen, they follow power. they follow the person they think is going to be in power. and a lot of them have really stuck their neck out saying, you know, if they thought that donald trump was going to get there. i guess a better way to say it is a lot of them aren't going to

stick their neck out unless they're pretty sure they're betting on a sure thing. right now for most of them, ron desantis seems to be the sure thing and donald trump already in the rear view mirror. >> you need money to run for president. it was stated pretty plainly, and a lot of these people are the people who have been funding these outside groups that helped some of these republicans win, not just this year, but in years past. so that's certainly not a good sign. i think it's important to state here that none of these people, the members or these donors woke up and found morality. they just found that he was a loser and they did not want to bet on this horse. i will say, though, what wakes me up at night, we have been through a trauma with trump over the last several years is that he's been ruled out before, and it is possible he can use this to his advantage. yes, he needs money, but if the establishment, all of these members, all of these big money donors are against him, how does he use that to his advantage, and i think we got to be talking about that because that's what

he's thinking about and trying to figure out right now. >> yeah, and i've got to say, of course, his problem is -- and willie, i just keep hearing it from one donald trump supporter after another donald trump supporter, his biggest problem is the guy that he's really going up against, that he's got to get through if he's going to win the republican nomination is ron desantis, and it is nearly unanimous, the people i have spoken with in the past who have been die hard trump supporters, all deeply offended that he was attacking ron desantis on the same night that ron desantis was rolling up historic numbers in the state of florida while donald trump's selections were losing the senate. >> and really embarrassing them. >> for republicans. and, you know, they're saying, i'm sorry, it's kind of funny after you consider all the things donald trump has said in the past, that they're saying things like, man, he didn't show any class.

there's no class when you're attacking ron desantis, you know, so you know where i'm going with that, but this apparently seems to be the final straw, and unlike the other times when donald trump's back was against the wall, there is an alternative now inside the republican party. the more he attacks ron desantis, the more he hurts his own standing in the republican party, so right now, he's sort of in a no win situation. >> ron desantis has given republicans somewhere else to go and fresh in their minds is their overwhelming 20 point defeat, where they flipped a bunch of blue counties red, captured latino voters in the state of florida and can go out and say, i've got these 29 and 30 electoral votes this florida locked up. but to jen's point, we have been saying that for the last week as well, you don't get to say donald trump is in the rear view mirror, he gets a big say in whether or not he's in the rear view mirror, and we know he's

not going anywhere. mike pence did say he's deciding whether to run in 2024 and doubled down on remarks that voters will not have to settle for the former president. >> the president is entitled to announce his intentions whenever he desires. i honestly believe that we'll have better choices come 2024. you know, i don't think -- >> better choices than donald trump? >> i do. >> i do, he says. former secretary of state in the trump administration, mike pompeo, also considering a presidential run, tweeted yesterday quote, we need more seriousness, less noise and leaders who are look forward, not staring in the rear view mirror claiming victimhood. he did not menace trump by name, but in tuesday night, trump claimed to be a victim of a rogue justice system, and house minority leader kevin mccarthy who dodged and ignored questions about trump's new presidential

campaign. >> are you prepared to endorse president trump? >> why? >> no, are you prepared to endorse him. >> do you support him running for president? >> leader mccarthy, do you mind stopping? >> do you want him to run for president? >> my kevin, my kevin, where hath you gone, my kevin? he just doesn't want to talk about it, which sam stein, certainly means that he wasn't too worried about the threat coming from mar-a-lago, one of donald trump's remaining supporters down there said that kevin mccarthy if he wanted to win the speakership is going to have to strongly support donald trump and say it out loud.

he's avoiding it, and he wants to become the next speaker of the house. that's a guy, when he's walking, avoiding answering that question, he's simply reflecting the will of most of his members. >> look, this all reminds me of this movie "fright night," involving a bunch of vampires. i'm not going to go down that road. i will not go down the werewolves and vampires road. i align with jen's comments. trump can probably use some of this to his advantage. he ran successfully as an outsider in 2015 he was the president between then and now, so less of an ability to do, so but he doesn't necessarily need the gop establishment to run for office. he's done it before without it. two is on the fundraising front, the gop megadonors are helpful but the cash base is the online donations. he should still have that.

the third component is stuff like mccarthy, and pompeo on the pile on. that's more tricky to navigate. then again, trump has leverage over mccarthy. all trump really has to do is come out and say we need to not elect this man speaker when the vote is held in public in early january. that's a ton of leverage over mccarthy, especially because the house republican majority will be so slim, so, you know, i know trump's in a weakened state but he's been in a weakened state before. post january 6th we all thought it was the last chapter for him, and then mccarthy went down to mar-a-lago, so i'm not totally sure that this is it for trump. i think he has a few more tricks up his sleeve. >> jen psaki, it's not just donors and what they do with their money. there are some republican leaders finding a way to sort of speak around this or speak to the trump issue without mentioning trump's name and you look at one govern who's now working with corey lewandowski

who worked with trump but finding a way to navigate this. >> kristi noem, she was quoted this morning, the fact that corey lewandowski is in the story sitting with her, why, what is happening here, that's one of my reactions, but she talked about the need to expand the base of the party and talk to people who support trump but also don't support trump. now, putting aside all of the crazy, which we should not put aside all the crazy, that's the kind of message that wins elections, right, and if you look at it, it's so starkly different from what kari lake did, when she punched all the mccain supporters and all the people in arizona who love mccain in the face, which turned out didn't work for her, and the expansion of it, expanding the vote is what either party needs to do. i read that and thought why is lewandowski there, but also that's a smart message. >> that message, it's interesting, willie, that message really stands out.

jumped off the page to me because you have an understanding, you have republicans talking like they haven't spoken in about a decade. we have to expand the base. you heard that from kristi noem who doesn't govern like a person who thinks she needs to expand the base but after the election results, she thinks she needs to expand the base. you have mitch mcconnell saying that the republicans were too harsh, too severe. they scared away independents, all of this. and i saw a headline yesterday in the "new york times" that the senate had actually gone over a procedural safeguard to ensure marriage equality. it's a shocking headline how easily that procedural vote passed. let's remember, again, just for perspective, then vice president joe biden went on a sunday show and said the administration supported marriage equality and same-sex marriage, and he paid a

terrible price for it inside the obama white house. because barack obama was running for reelection. he was still saying that marriage is between a man and a woman because he was a christian and so that was just a decade ago that even progressives were angry at joe biden for getting ahead of them on this message. here we are ten years later, and you have republicans and democrats coming together to support a same-sex marriage protection, which, again, we wouldn't have seen the vote pass that cleanly before last week. there is an understanding, there's just a big understanding, i think, among a lot of republicans that they've got to stop turning off independents and moderates if they want to win elections again. >> yeah, that's almost a direct quote from mitch mcconnell a couple of days ago. he said we got wiped out among

independents. the vote on the federal guy marriage legislation was 62 votes. you've got 12 republicans to go with the 50 democrats. point out, mitch mcconnell was not among them. he voted against that. it looks like it's on a path toward passing through the senate to have federal legislation to codify gay marriage. that's one step republicans may be recognizing, but then there's the extremism on abortion, guns, democracy, and all the other things that cost them so desperately in this election, and kind of stunned them. are they willing to change, are they able to change their positions on those or at least moderate them a little bit so they can recapture some of those independents who fled from them a couple of days ago. >> yeah, and make no mistake of it, when willie talks about extremism on these positions, we have talked about this before, you know, the majority or a plurality of americans when you talk about abortion, they support the 15 week ban that john roberts had supported and

upholding a mississippi law that the rest of the court would not have gone along with. if they had, the whole world politically would have most likely been different. when you hear on abortion, 10-year-old girls in ohio that have been raped having to flee the state. you have candidates running for governor talking about 14-year-old girls being raped by their examples, the perfect example of why there can't be any exceptions, when you talk about that. when you talk about guns. republicans who have been on the wrong side of a 90/10 issue for years now, since sandy hook. 90% of americans support universal background checks, and other gun safety laws. i'm wondering as we move forward, are republicans still going to support the 7%, the 8%, the 9% position. just to please some gun lobbyists? doesn't make a lot of political sense. >> it does not. >> all of this adds up.

and makes the republican party look like it's out of touch, which is why, mika, republicans under performed so historically this week. we have an elections update this morning. nbc news now projects republicans have won control of the house by a slim margin, they barely did it with 218 seats being officially called for the gop. that is a number of seats needed for the majority. >> and of course there was a time that mccarthy was thinking they'd win by 60 seats, they would win by 50 seats. >> still pretty devastating. >> they would be lucky to win by four or five or six. >> nbc news estimates republicans will win 221 seats, while democrats will hold on to 214 seats. the margin of error is plus or minus two seats with seven races yet to be called. the results hand president biden a divided congress with democrats keeping control of the

senate, a stunning victory for the democrats. the president issued a statement which reads in part quote, i congratulate leader mccarthy on republicans winning the house majority and i'm ready to work with house republicans to deliver results for working families. >> jen psaki, let's talk about the nightmare it is to be whether it's kevin mccarthy who's going to be the speaker. i say this because i know this. i was there when republicans had a four vote -- you've got 218 members. 218 members that are tired of being just a face in the crowd. all they have to do is find three of their friends, let's talk to the democrats, i want to pass this bill, and it gets done. that is impossible for the best of speakers to maintain, and right now on the republican side, all i see is anarchy,

republicans supposedly have the power but aren't going to get anything done there. >> be careful what you ask for, kevin mccarthy, if this is your dream. it's so hard to govern with that slim of a majority. he has doubled down on proxy voting which they have been doing in the house, allowing people to vote from their districts, which, you know, the fact is a lot of these members are older or people have family member issues or reasons they just don't show up because it's a big huge caucus. it means he needs all of these members not to just support his agenda but to show up in person. which is a two hurdle challenge. plus, as you said, joe, he's got a bigger dose of crazy he's going to have to manage in terms of his caucus than most caucuses. be careful what you ask for, kevin mccarthy, this is the gift you'll have for the coming years, which is managing this big group. let's bring in congressional investigations reporter for "the

washington post," jackie alemany, an msnbc contributor, following all the moves in terms of the balance of power, jackie, what are you looking at? >> yeah, mika. i can't echo enough what you have just said that kevin mccarthy faces a task if he ultimately does become speaker, which seems inevitable, but is going to be a hurdle in the next few weeks as he's trying to get from 188 votes of support behind closed doors during the leadership elections we saw earlier in week to the number 218 and the hatred for mccarthy among his ranks is palpable amongst certain house freedom caucus members. but as for today, actually i'm keeping an eye not just on republicans who are going to be making announcements on investigations. one of the only things a lot of republicans can agree on now, you're going to have jim jordan and james comber, ranking members likely to become the chairman of the house judiciary committee and oversight

committee announce some of those investigations into various targets, many of them quite political this morning. we're going to be hearing a big announcement from speaker pelosi later today. unclear what that's going to be exactly, but i do think that we're going to want to tune into the house floor at some point when she does come to speak at 2:00 and address her members. >> we'll see. we'll be watching that closely. she has that press conference coming up later this morning, jackie. rick scott made a run for the leadership position, made a run at mitch mcconnell. pretty bold move a week after losing the united states senate against the odds. what did that due to the dynamic? what does it look like inside the party on the senate side. >> look, i think that the senate in general was always a little more inoculated to the politics that the house faces, which is just definitely a more ideal

logically extreme and diverse conference. rick scott never faced a chance. sitting senators were skeptical that scott could separate himself from the results as the head of the campaign arm o. senate and was responsible for propping up flawed candidates who should have won seattles that republicans expected to win, seats like pennsylvania. and now the runoff in georgia where the candidate herschel walker, it won't make a difference whether he wins or not in terms of control of the senate but was a seat viewed as winnable, and now has an extraordinary tight race. mitch mcconnell does face a leader mccarthy problem in terms of being able to manage his conference at the end of the day. but again, we'll see how much the house is passing at the end

of the day. i'm not sure all that much is going to make it to the senate, and i think that the goal for republicans right now and next two years is not to legislate but really to just block the biden administration so, you know, the task for mcconnell and mccarthy is a little bit different than what pelosi and schumer were up against these past two years. >> yeah, you know, the thing is, and i said this before off air to sam stein, i didn't want to get pommelled on twitter, but i'll say it on air now. >> great. >> since it's already happened. >> okay. >> and i'll get pommelled on twitter today, actually when people were saying, oh, my god, what's going to happen when the republicans take control of the house, they're going to have this massive margin, and i said, well, if the democrats can somehow hold on to the senate, for democrats if you just want to look at this cynically for

democrats, and i know jen knows exactly what i'm about to say, it's the best thing possible. you're going to have an extreme gop house that can't get anything done as far as passing laws. there are going to be people out there that are going to be saying the crazyiest, stupidest things. there are going to be massive headlines, and it's going to matter because they're in power. i remember karl rove coming and talking to us in 1999 before george w. bush's campaign in 2000 and somebody brought up us running newt gingrich out of town in '98 and karl rove, you know, somebody asked him about it. he said, well, it sure makes our job a lot easier. we probably wouldn't be able to win in 2000 if we were competing against newt gingrich's headlines and having to answer for newt gingrich at all times. now you actually are going to have whoever, whoever that republican is running in 2024,

they're going to have to answer for the most extreme statements made by marjorie taylor greene, or made by jim jordan, or made by lauren boebert. you know, ron desantis is in a church and somebody says do you agree with lauren boebert if jesus had an ar-15 he wouldn't have been crucified and died for everybody's sins and that would have been preferable. but that will follow the craziness, now that they're in power actually matters and it's something that whoever is running for president in 2024 on the democratic side, well, just cynically, it's probably going to help him a lot. >> i don't know why you would get a twitter pommelling for that, although i will say, a twitter pommelling is good for the soul, occasionally. i enjoy it. it keeps you fresh. i think that's a very accurate

and admittedly cynical way to look at things, which is that you have a villain that you can run against in the house gop conference, right? you have -- it's not unified democratic control of governance, so it doesn't become necessarily a referendum. you can turn the spotlight on republicans, especially if you get high stakes show downs over funding the government and potentially a government shut down, and high stakes show downs over the debt ceiling and lifting the debt ceiling which can damage the economy. if you can run against that, that is of course beneficial. the flip side of that is it's not good for the country necessarily, and if you're in office there might be some legislative initiatives that you want to pursue that are simply just closed off now. so immigration reform or even dealing with daca, done. unless they do it in the lame duck conference. the build back better initiative, the domestic stuff they didn't get to, parental leave, child care, done, unless you deal with it in congress.

that's the downside of having the divided government. you cannot do that legislation. i would say one other thing, we don't know what the house investigative committees are going to do with their time. early indications they're going to go after hunter biden, which i think will gin up sympathy for joe biden. it may uncover he's not what biden wants. there is the element of surprise there that could produce some bad headlines for the white house but overall, despite the coming twitter pommelling, you're probably right on this one. >> you know, probably right on this one. you know, jen, the thing that we have learned is -- and we republicans learned it with bill clinton. democrats, you impeach somebody, you think it's going to be this huge political win, one of the reasons newt gingrich was run out of town was because the public reacted in such a negative way in the '98 midterms

during impeachment. you look at donald trump, even after two impeachments, even after the mar-a-lago investigation, his numbers in a lot of polls over the past month actually had gone up. so those investigations will backfire. i think the biden administration knows it. but also think about this. republicans are not going to do anything great. they're the do nothing republicans. pass a stand alone bill. we're going to stop pharmaceutical companies from gouging everybody on insulin. stand alone bill. that's it. the senate passes it. the president wants it signed, killed by republicans. pass a billionaires tax, and that billionaires tax goes to funding pre-k, you know, education. i mean, you could line up a hundred bills like this and just let the republicans vote no on every single one of them, and campaign on it in '24. it will make a difference.

>> yeah, it turns out everybody in the country for the most part is for lower the cost of prescription drugs. everything you have outlined. you're sort of held accountable to a different standard. if you do nothing, you're the do nothing congress. to build on what sam said, it's not investigations into the president's son or other family members or whatever they may pursue. they have also been verify clear, they want to impeach, mayorkas, tony blinken, a bunch of cabinet members people have probably never heard of and that consumes time and energy, and if they're that instead of lowering the cost of prescription drugs. doing something about lowering the cost of energy and inflation. people can make their own judgment about that. they ran on doing something and it seems they're going to do nothing. they're doing impeachments. >> jackie, before i let you go,

you covered the january 6th committee so closely that the house has been called for republicans, that's going away in the next couple of months. what's left for them? what's ahead of them? is there more testimony to come. we heard from former vice president mike pence, he's closing the door on testifying. saying the committee has no right to his testimony. what's left to do? >> they have to get the report done we have all been waiting for. as we have reported, there has been some behind the scenes differences about how this report should be structured exactly. we're also waiting on a number of criminal referrals. chairman of the committee, bennie thompson told us the committee is currently working on that. they met on monday when they were back from recess to discuss the path forward. they're also figuring out how exactly to handle the counter litigation to the former president who has decided he's

not going to cooperate with the subpoena or testify before the committee, they have to decide if they're going to ultimately try to hold him in contempt, but at the end of the day, a lot of this is really just now in the hands of the department of justice. they're going to have to at some point, the committee transfer all of the information that they've collected and that report, which is expected to be a prosecutorial road map to the department of justice that's moving ahead in their investigation, which is also running parallel to the investigation into trump's handing of classified documents. i think we need to watch very closely what republicans do going forward with their subpoena power in the house gop conference and the way they try to sort of run a smear campaign against the fbi and the department of justice to essentially i think grease the wheels in the case that the former president is ultimately indicted for either something

related to january 6th or the mishandling of classified documents. today at that press conference we're going to hear a lot about investigating the doj, the fbi. you're already seeing them in the minority call for fbi whistleblowers to come forward, and i think we're going to see a lot more of that. >> "the washington post's" jackie alemany as always, thank you very much for being on this morning. >> thanks, mika. and still ahead on "morning joe," nato officials say it was a ukrainian missile that crossed into poland and killed two people. but russia still bears the blame. we'll have the latest on the response from world leaders. also ahead, air fares are soaring ahead of a busy holiday travel season. we'll talk to the head of the tsa about that and a look at the morning papers including a new effort to block donald trump from taking public office ever again. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. watching ""

we'll be right back. research shows people remember commercials with nostalgia. so to help you remember that liberty mutual customizes your home insurance, here's one that'll really take you back. wow! what'd you get, ryan? it's customized home insurance from liberty mutual!!! what does it do, bud? it customizes our home insurance so we only pay for what we need! and what did you get, mike? i got a bike. ♪ only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ ♪3, 4♪ ♪ ♪hey♪ ♪ ♪are you ready for me♪ ♪are you ready♪ ♪are you ready♪

♪ ♪ ♪♪ voltaren. the joy of movement. ♪♪ >> tech: when you get a chip in your windshield... trust safelite. voltaren. the joy of movement. ♪ upbeat, catchy music ♪ >> tech vo: this couple counts on their suv... as they travel for their small business. so when they got a chip in their windshield... they brought it to safelite... for a same-day in-shop repair. we repaired the chip right away.

and with their insurance, it was no cost to them. >> woman: really? >> tech vo: plus, to protect their glass, we installed new wipers too. that's service the way you need it. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ ( ♪♪ ) (snorting) (clattering) (frustrated grunt) i need some sleep. (groaning) (growling) (silence)

(sigh, chuckle) if you struggle with cpap, you should check out inspire. inspire. sleep apnea innovation. learn more and view important safety information at inspiresleep.com. when you're through with powering through, it's time for theraflu hot liquid medicine. powerful relief so you can restore and recover. theraflu hot beats cold. the eat fresh® refresh just won't stop!

now, subway® is refreshing their catering with easy-order platters and lunchboxes perfect for any party. pool parties... tailgates... holiday parties... even retirement parties. man, i love parties. subway keeps refreshing and refreshing 37 past the hour. here's a look at some of the other headlines making news this morning. philadelphia officials lashed out at texas governor greg abbott after a ten-year-old girl who arrived in philadelphia on a bus of migrants was hospitalized with dehydration and a high fever. she came on the bus from texas. the bus carried 28 people in total. five of them children. they were greeted yesterday morning in philadelphia with warm drinks and clothing. because city officials had advanced notice of their arrival, they were able to activate a mass care plan, which included mobilizing the office of migrant affairs and the

office of emergency management. abbott's office did not immediately respond to the request for comments about the child. terrible. former tonight show host jay leno recovering this morning after surgery for serious burns he suffered during a recent car fire. leno was in los angeles in his garage where he stores his cars where one of them burst into flames this past saturday. he's in good spirits. he suffered burns to his face, hands and chest that doctors categorized as second degree and verging on more severe. must be incredibly painful. in a major shake up in college academics, yale and harvard are withdrawing from the u.s. news rankings. that separate letters, the deans for both law schools harshly

criticized the rankings, saying they devalue programs that encourage lower paying public interest careers and reward schools that give scholarships to students with high test scores rather than those in need of financial aid. yale dean heather gerken wrote the rankings are flawed. its approach fails to advance the legal profession but stands squarely in the way of progress. we'll be following that. and coming up, we have more of herschel walker's bizarre campaign speech about werewolves, and vampires. meanwhile, a retiring republican lawmaker goes scorched earth on kevin mccarthy, we'll play for you those comments. and up next, national security analyst for nbc news clint watts joins us with more insight on the deadly missile mistake in poland and the state of the war in ukraine. we'll be right back. and the sta of the war in ukraine. we'll be right back. this... is a glimpse into the no-too-distant future of lincoln.

♪ ♪ it's what sanctuary could look like... feel like... sound like... even smell like. more on that soon. ♪ ♪ the best part? the prequel is pretty sweet too. ♪ ♪ my asthma felt anything but normal. a blood test helped show my asthma is driven by eosinophils, which nucala helps reduce. nucala is a once-monthly add-on injection for severe eosinophilic asthma. nucala is not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. ask your asthma specialist about a nunormal with nucala.

if you still have symptoms of moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis or active psoriatic arthritis after a tnf blocker like humira or enbrel, rinvoq is different and may help. stand up to your symptoms with rinvoq. rinvoq is a once-daily pill that tackles pain, stiffness, swelling. for some, rinvoq significantly reduces ra and psa fatigue. it can stop further irreversible joint damage. and rinvoq can leave skin clear or almost clear in psa. that's rinvoq relief. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. serious infections and blood clots, some fatal;

cancers, including lymphoma and skin cancer; death, heart attack, stroke, and tears in the stomach or intestines occurred. people 50 and older with at least one heart disease risk factor have higher risks. don't take if allergic to rinvoq as serious reactions can occur. tell your doctor if you are or may become pregnant. ask your rheumatologist for rinvoq. rinvoq. make it your mission. learn how abbvie could help you save. what should the future deliver? make it your mission. (music) progress... (music) ...innovation... (music) ...discovery? or simply stability... ...security... ...protection? you shouldn't have to choose. (music) gold. your strategic advantage. (music) visit goldhub.com.

[ speaking in foreign language ] we're still gathering information but we have seen nothing that contradicts president duda's preliminary assessment that this explosion was most likely the result of a ukrainian air defense missile that unfortunately landed in poland. and whatever the final

conclusions may be, the world knows that russia bears ultimate responsibility for this incident. >> that is secretary of defense lloyd austin agrees with polish president duda that a missile that struck a polish border town appears to have been launched by ukraine in defense against russian missiles. the two leaders also agree while ukraine may have launched the missile, the blame ultimately falls on russia as its war on ukraine continues. joining us now, columnist and associate editor for "the washington post," david ige -- ignatius. and former fbi special agent and national security analyst for nbc news, clint watts. good morning to you all. clint, let me start with you, just on your assessment of how this has shaken out. when this news broke a couple of days ago, russia has landed a missile inside poland, a nato member, what's next, and slowly and surely, intelligence

agencies said it's looking more and more like this is a ukrainian missile. president zelenskyy notably still suggesting it was a russian missile but he stands alone on that. >> not helpful, you know, having this debate at a time when ukraine has been doing so well. at the same point, it just shows you how tense that situation is. over 100 missiles being fired that day, all the antiair craft missiles going. they are talking about several hundred flying all over the country at any given time. it was natural that something like this would happen eventually, and i think everyone has been bracing for this happening to some degree. at the same point, the russians are increasingly using munitions. it's erratic and sporadic and whenever that happens, it gets more dangerous. we're at a particularly dangerous point i think with the missiles and the way the strikes are going on around the country. >> as the defense secretary said yesterday, yes, this looks like it was a ukrainian missile, and a tragic accident. but, but, but we have those defensive antiaircraft missile

installations in place because russia is firing deeper and deeper into ukraine and going after civilian targets. >> yes, and he also tried to reach his russian counter part but i gather that phone call was refused. not good. i think that russia has or is certainly losing the ground war, and all they have left are dumb missiles and drones they're buying from iran. this is pathetic, but they're causing a lot of damage on the ground and still destroying civilian targets and infrastructure as the winter approaches. so it's still a bad deal, but it is pretty clear after careful work and the polls need to be commended too because they did invoke article 4 of the nato charter after careful work that this was a mistake. >> and david ignatius, we certainly saw that poland stood shoulder to shoulder with the united states and the rest of nato.

nobody got out in front of each other. that certainly was good news. what else have we learned from this false alarm? >> joe, i think we've learned in addition to just how dangerous this war is, the russian onslaught that the ukrainians are trying so hard to defend against, we have learned that the system to calibrate precisely what's happening in the fog of war seems to work. this was the most dangerous moment that you could imagine. for many months we have worried, the u.s. has worried that russians might attack our supply depots moving from poland into ukraine. setting off an article 5 so called nato reaction, which nato would have to respond to an attack on nato territory. in this case, people waited, they gathered evidence, they tried to make sure what had happened in the fog of war. whose missile was this, and they found evidence that contrary to

what they might have imagined initially, it was not a russian missile, but a ukrainian one. were able to fore stall the sharp reaction which could have led to rapid escalation of this conflict. one take away amid this terrible situation is that system works, and we should be glad that responsible level headed people are running it. >> david, in your -- you have a question and answer session with readers every monday at "the washington post", and a lot of questions had to do with the end game. peace talks. you were skeptical that we were there, but you did say that both sides appear to be reaching an exhaustion point. what can you tell us about that, and what can you tell us about any reporting you have about both sides possibly inching closer to at least sitting down and talking to each other? >> so, joe, i don't think we're

there yet. everyone around the globe would like to see this war end. but as i noted in that discussion with readers, wars end because the parties decide that they simply can't gain their goals on the battlefield. they are exhausted and negotiators find a way to get them out of the predicament. we're not there yet. and efforts by the united states or any other mediator to interpose in this conflict are, i think, a mistake. this has to be russia and ukraine, talking, realizing that they need to come up with some compromise that they accept. it is interesting that our director bill burns was just meeting with his russian counter part in turkey, and went on to see president zelenskyy in ukraine. i'm certainly going to be asking questions today about what happened in those meetings, but as near as we can tell, there's

basically burns warning the russians about any escalation, the dangers of it. so as much as we hope that this winter could provide a transition point where the two sides could begin to talk about peace, i just don't see it yet. >> jane harman following up on what david's talking cia director burns traveling and talking to his counter part in russia, if there were anybody that would be a key player and at least the start of negotiations from the united states side, it would be director burns, would it not. >> it sure would, and he met with putin personally before this ridiculous unnecessary illegal war started. but obviously to no effect. i wanted to add to what david said, which is there's no room for compromise right now. and that's the u.s. position, and lloyd austin met with his

counter parts this week, and almost a billion dollars more aid is coming from sweden and germany and us and canada, and that's what we have to do. there's no evidence that putin keeps his word and it ain't over until it's over, and it's going to be a brutal winner but the strongest weapon in this fight is the ukrainian heart. it's much stronger than dumb missiles or drones or tanks or whatever else has been used and the ukrainians are very well trained at this point, in part thanks to us, and in part also thanks to their enormous tech skills to withstand this, and boy, if russia isn't pushed back here, we are going to have an article five nato confrontation and that's not going to be good for anybody. >> general milley said yesterday there's zero chance at this point that russia completely overruns ukraine. with that said, even though they're retreating from places like kherson, they're still lobbing missiles, you know, 85 a day in some cases and they're

hitting infrastructure, power grids, we saw pictures yesterday of ukrainian heart surgeons performing surgeries with head lamps to continue to do their jobs. so what does this winter look like? where is russia right now? how long does this go on? >> i think we're at a major inflection point in the war. partly because this is the second mud season which leads to frozen tundra. yes, you could advance on positions but it gives russians time to build fortifications. if you look at what's going on closer to crimea, primary, secondary lines of defense are going into place. the fight will expand outside of ukraine. i would look for cyber attacks particularly around energy in europe. putin sees this as his lever to try and bring the alliance to its knees. the other thing i would look for is influence operations. we often times see the russians playing around in populist movements. and the wild card is what's going on inside russia.

we have not covered that well in the last six months. there are statements saying putin should be removed or assassinated. i have never heard that in my life. that's a different scenario that could play out. the squeezing is happening on both ends. >> well, thanks. i just had a thought experiment for joe biden as we close here, and that is to do something woodrow wilson did, who never served in congress, joe biden did for 40 years, set up an office and have office hours on a periodic basis. this is a huge opportunity for a sea change because of the result of the midterms. one of the thing that has to pass immediately is the electoral count act so we don't see a repeat of january 6th in 2024. >> for sure. if anybody can do that, it's joe

biden. >> we had a conversation about whether harry truman could succeed with the marshall plan or truman doctrine, the way he did it was working with a republican congress extraordinarily closely, and finding the responsible members, and with author vandenberg, having conversations with him every day, sending his staff members over to vandenberg's home at night, to keep them updated with what was going on. republicans who were isolationists far more engaged. of course these republicans, certainly on the senate side with shoulder to shoulder with biden's aims right now, but it certainly wouldn't hurt going forward, would it, to work even more closely with both sides on the issue of ukraine? >> on the issue of ukraine and also, joe, on the issue of china. if you're going to look for an issue that's analogous to the

late '40s, it would be the growing u.s. competition with china, and there's strong bipartisan support. president biden, like president truman is somebody who's been disrespected in some ways, not seen as a strong leader. and this is a moment for him to play a stronger leadership role, to work more with congress. i think one message certainly that bill burns took with him to turkey and then to kyiv is to say our commitment, our american commitment to ukraine will continue and there's every sign that there will be bipartisan support. so on that issue and on the issue of u.s. china relations, there is a chance for biden in this next period to be a strong i don't want to say trumanesque, but a strong leader. >> jen, you like the idea of the president setting up shop on

capitol hill, you did have one concern. >> he might never leave. i think it's a compelling idea. for those of you who know joe biden and have covered him, he loves being in the senate. he loves talking to members of both parties. i spent a lot of time in the oval office with him. people would be surprised. you probably wouldn't be of the number of people he would pick up the phone and call, republicans, democrats, people who disagree with him on a lot. the one caveat i would say unfortunately in the environment we're in right now, if he goes up to capitol hill to an office there, he takes a press corps with him, it becomes a massive pomp and circumstance and my only tweak would be it probably is better if he does it just from his office on the phone. a lot of that behind the scenes would be more effective. >> the personal contact makes a huge difference, having served there for nine terms, i know that, and maybe he should get you back, jen, and you can just handle everything. >> we got her. >> the president is listening.

jane harman, clint watts, we appreciate it. more ahead on the republican party's apparent breakup with donald trump, including one of the first men who rushed back to the former president's side after the capitol insurrection now running away from reporters asking about backing trump's new bid for the white house. plus, president biden will be left with a split congress for the next two years now that republicans are officially projected to win back control of the house. one house democrat who held on to her seat last week, congresswoman sharice davids of kansas will join us. also ahead, senator majority leader whip dick durbin will be our guest. "morning joe" will be right back. e our guest. "morning joe" will be right back

mr. trump said a weaponized justice system is the greatest threat to the u.s. >> we must conduct a top-to-bottom overhaul to clean out the festering rot and corruption of washington, d.c. and i'm a victim, i will tell you. i'm a victim. >> that's right, folks, i'm the biggest victim of all. every time i do something illegal, they come after me. i've done 30 illegal things. they've come after me at least 20 times. it's so unfair. so unfair. as ridiculous as this is, i'm glad he's being honest about why he's running.

he's running for the same reason every shirtless guy on cops runs, the popo is chasing him. he said it. >> yeah, and there's that as well. welcome back to "morning joe." look at a beautiful shot of the white house on this thursday morning, november 17th. sam stein and david ignatius are still with us with just 19 days until georgia's upcoming senate runoff election. herschel walker, the former college football star turned self-proclaimed fbi agent turned republican senate nominee, he's adding a new title to his resume. >> he's a film critic. >> yes. on the campaign trail yesterday, i just want to start this hour with this. i'm still trying to figure it out, and maybe somebody can decode what he said. >> i think willie could. >> more than two minutes to analyzing a monster movie he watched on tv, somehow trying to tie it to the senate. take a look and see if you can

do it. >> i'm going to tell you to keep the faith. you ever watch a stupid movie later at night, hoping it will get better, and it don't get better. the other night i was watching this movie called fright night, freak night, some type of night, it was about vampires. i'm going to tell you something that i found out, a werewolf can kill a vampire, do you know that. i never knew that. i don't want to be a vampire anymore, i want to be a werewolf. i'm watching this knew movie, and let me tell you how stupid it is, it's one in the morning. i'm watching my tv of these kids of a vampire watching, what was funny these kids had a vampire in their attic at their house. so they was watching their tv, now i'm watching my tv of they watching their tv and they see a vampire killer on the tv, and they win the contest, you all

got to stay with me. actor, as this actor comes to their home, he got all the right stuff. he got all the right stuff because you know got to have a stake and got to have a thing to kill him in the heart and necklace and gauntlet, that work, i don't know what it does, but it works. a cross, it burns, i know that works, and all of a sudden, this is what was so funny about it, as they're walking through the house, this guy has gotten holy water, he's blessing the house, this actor. he's blessing the house. his holy water, they walked up stairs and this vampire looking good in this suit. whoa, that sounds like senator warnock, doesn't it, looking all good in this black suit, floating from the ceiling, looking good, and cool, and i'm thinking, whoa, they better get out of that house, somebody float from your ceiling get out of the house. that's not your house. as he's floating from the ceiling, the kid jumped behind the hero, the guy jumped from him, he started laughing, and he

said that don't work. he took the cross, put it on the vampire forehead, and the vampire didn't do anything. that don't work, and that's what it is in our life. it doesn't work unless we have faith. we have to have faith in our fellow brother. faith in this country. faith in the elected officials that right now that's the reason i'm here. >> i got it. >> that's why you're here. >> willie? >> i've got to say, it's some rambling incoherence taken to olympian levels. >> is he okay? >> but that is what donald trump has brought to the georgia republican party. that is what he's brought to the gop, and it's why people are turning away from donald trump. they understand why they didn't win back the senate this year, but my gosh, again, it's, you know, you sit there and latch at

-- laugh at some point. it really is a tragedy that that guy who is so ill equipped on so many levels to even be the mayor of his hometown in georgia, according to people from his hometown in georgia, might be a united states senator. >> yeah, it will be interesting to see how this plays out now with a couple of weeks until the runoff. the entire rational republicans put forth, establishment republicans in washington flew down to georgia, stood behind him as he talked about what was it, something happened with a cow. i can't remember. there's a bull or something. something. >> bulls getting cows pregnant or something. >> yeah, that one. >> but the entire rational was, yeah, wink, nod, we get this guy is not good. we get that he's not a good candidate. that he doesn't have any views on policy. can't put together coherent thoughts but this is about winning the senate.

this is about power, and we need this seat if we want to control the united states senate. well, with that rational now out the window because democrats have taken care of that already, they'd certainly like to have this additional vote in senator warnock, 51 instead of 50, are republicans energized to go out and vote for a guy in a state that voted for brian kemp to be governor who whether you like him or not has done things for the state and is a more conventional style republican in the state of georgia. are they going to vote for herschel walker now without that rationale. are you going to watch that review of the vampire movie and say that guy should be one of 100 people in this country to serve in the united states senate? maybe they will. it remains to be seen. >> it remains to be seen. >> but this is the party's malpractice, this is someone who is completely unfit, perhaps unwell. not trying to be mean. i'm saying what would happen if he was voted to be senator from

georgia, would he be even -- what would he do? and what damage would he cause? >> i know. again, when i say he's unfit, in just about every way, you go back and look back through his history, and he's had some great, great challenges, and we don't know that he's through those great challenges, but david ignatius, i think, again, not to sound old, but it wasn't so long ago that i was on capitol hill and senators were still -- men and women they looked up to, whether you're talking about john mccain or ted kennedy, or allen simpson, you just go down the list. they were in their own way, giants. >> they were giants. it is painful to watch some of

herschel walker's comments. i wrote down when you were saying that this was random incoherence taken to olympic levels. i thought that was a memorable phrase. what's interesting to me is whether the republicans in the aftermath of the midterms are going to try to reconstruct their party as a governing party. the republican party has been a car wreck, attached to this narcissistic figure, seeking revenge, really out of control, and does the republican party become a party that people will trust, the mistrust factor was obvious in the midterms and it's obvious when you watch herschel walker. so are figures in the center of the party setting out to rebuild it? that's what i'm going to be watching the next few weeks. trump seems to have gone over

pretty flat in his reelection campaign, the opening salvo, it just seemed, you know, he was almost sleep walking through parts of that. when i see somebody like mike pompeo as ambitious and opportunistic a politician as there is in this country begin to back away from trump, it just seems to me, we're watching this, you know, save yourself if you can process in the republican party. but it's going to take -- it's going to require a center of the party that really wants to rebuild a governing organization, not a populist, you know, go to maga rally party, and i don't see that yet, i have to be honest. >> a real republican party. >> right. >> and there's going to be a real challenge now because you're going to have a position where republicans are going to control the house by the barest of margins. they're not going to be able to get a lot of things done. but the question is are they

going to be continuing to make irresponsible statements that turn off independents, that turn off moderate republicans, that turn off the very swing voters that decide whether you win states like arizona, wisconsin, pennsylvania, michigan, and georgia. >> really, if it could bring humanity back to the party, along with the fact that they need to have the conservative ideals and values that they once stood for. not laughing when somebody gets attacked. not avoiding an insurrection where democracy almost was pulled down. these are easy things. you just need to do it. nbc news now projects republicans have won control of the house by a slim margin, with 218 seats being officially called for the gop. that's the number of seats needed for a majority. nbc news estimates republicans will win 221 seats while

democrats will hold on to 214 seats. the margin of error is plus or minus two seats with seven races yet to be called. the results hand president biden a divided congress with democrats keeping control of the senate. the president issued a statement which reads in part quote i congratulate leader mccarthy on republicans winning the house majority, and i'm ready to work with house republicans to deliver results for working families. let's bring in senior national political correspondent for "the washington post" ashley parker and staff writer at the atlantic frank fore. good to have you both. >> good to have you both here. ashley, of course, there was a time when kevin mccarthy and so many others were predicting a giant red wave, the possibility of 60 seat majority pickup, 50 seat pickup, 40 seat pickup, it may be four, possibly five.

how much of a bind does that put kevin mccarthy in even becoming speaker? >> it puts him in an incredible bind. first he has to become speaker. more than that, then he has to govern, and so far, kevin mccarthy has proven that he is no speaker pelosi. she had a similarly thin margin, but she held her conference together with an iron grip, and you can already see the signs among republicans. in some ways, some of the republicans, house republicans who feel very emboldened right now are the more extreme trumpist republicans who the nation sort of overwhelmingly rejected on election night, but who were still going in to congress expect to go wield outsized power, making already demands of mccarthy, and it will be fascinating to see what he does with a raucous difficult situation. >> and by the way, it was just one year ago in november of 2021

that kevin mccarthy had said republicans were going to have a 60-seat pickup. >> nope. >> a lot has changed. here was adam kinzinger talking about the man who wants to be the next speaker of the republican house. >> kevin mccarthy is a coward, if he becomes speaker it will be the worst time of his life, and history will not be kind to him. >> how hostage do you think he will be to marjorie taylor greene and matt gaetz, what will that look like? >> he's going to be completely hostage. so first off, marjorie taylor greene recently said she's all in with kevin mccarthy, listen, she doesn't say something unless she's been promised something. matt gaetz is against marjorie taylor greene because he wants to be more famous than her, and he's stealing her thunder. if he gets to 218. we don't know what the majority is going to be. it's likely there will be a republican majority. any one of those people, you

know, a couple, two or three, can deny him the 218 votes he needs. he's going to be walking around making deals with everybody, cutting every deal he can with the crazies, i call it the freedom club. now, the question, nicolle, is going to be the moderates who are left, i don't know who they are anymore, i don't know what they believe, are they willing to say, kevin, this has gone too far, and we will vote against you if you acquiesce to the demands. we wanted to get along and govern. it's harder to do it. freedom club wants to burn it all down. >> and there's the challenge because the thing is of course you haven't -- and i know from experience, the freedom caucus or people on the far right, the trump right come out and say, come our way or we're not going to give you the four votes or the five streets, not just on becoming speaker but the rules so you can advance the bill on anything you want to do on funding for the house, on

funding for anything. you can always hold every one of those bills hostage, that works it first, right, because it's disruption. it shocks the process. but i can guarantee you from experience at some point mainstream republicans step up and go, wait a second, why are we ceding to these four, five, six, seven crazy people, no, we're going to withdraw our five, six, seven votes, stop listening to the crazy people, start listening to the main street republicans or you're going to get nothing done. we can do what they do. see, that's what kevin mccarthy's problem is right now, he can go out and he can strike a deal with every radical in his caucus. it will catch up to him because people who live in swing districts, who like, for instance, in new york state who decide whether he's the speaker two years from now or not, they suddenly start going wait a second in my district, is it

better for me to strike a deal with democrats or marjorie taylor greene. well, that's not really a hard question to answer. i'd rather be associated with democrats than radicals on the trump right. >> willie, that's the question, and i mean this in all seriousness. he's smart enough to see down the line as joe just projected how things go, how we've seen things go. this is the same guy who went running back to trump to mar-a-lago after the insurrection, and rekindled everything with trump after a violent insurrection at the nation's capitol. so the question is he going to double down on crazy. my worry is the answer is yes. >> part of the reason he did run back to mar-a-lago is because he wanted the job that he's getting now, that he's going to be speaker of the house, so sam, to joe's point, let's take a practical case. impeachment, we have heard marjorie taylor greene and others say we're going to start impeachment investigations and

hearings on day one. kevin mccarthy hasn't gone down that road. he wants other hearings, he wants to investigate the administration on other questions. what do you say to congresswoman greene, what do you say to these other people who believe it's time for retribution, payback for what they believe democrats have done to donald trump. >> i think what he'll say is let's start at a lower rung, go after the cabinet members, hunter biden, let's look into the covid response, let's build a case before we go fully into impeachment. the other thing that does ultimate benefit mccarthy in the margins is the fact that the senate is not in gop hands. it's in democratic hands. he can say to them, look, we can do all the stuff you want, it's going to go nowhere. the senate is not going to pick it up. they're never going to convict him. they're not going to pick up impeachment. they will ignore it. mccarthy does in a way benefit from the fact that democrats have control of the senate. this is presuming that mccarthy ends up being speaker.

i'm not totally convinced that he'll get the votes necessary to be speaker. already we know there's one or two republicans who have come out and said, i will not vote for mccarthy. he can win them back over, but if they're steadfast, all that matters is another two or three republicans taking the same approach and suddenly you don't have 218 and you might have to go to democrats for votes. >> it really is a nightmare scenario when you have as many people who are as politically unstable as this republican house caucus has, again, four, five, six votes away. you look at the republicans that won in biden districts. not a single one of them are going to go along with a single vote that marjorie taylor greene wants them to go along with or that wing o. party or the freedom caucus if it gets him in trouble at home. so again, it's going to be -- it's going to be quite just

really a big challenge for mccarthy. >> frank, your latest op-ed in the atlantic is entitled "what joe biden knows about america" and in it you write in part, now that the democrats have survived a midterm election without suffering the calamitous results that afflict a ruling party, let's give biden his political due. his success wasn't justice accidental or the product of his hapless opposition. he had a theory for how his party could navigate the nation's polarization, and it was far shrewder than appreciated, in part because of its generosity to his fellow citizens and their concerns. the biden method is often messy, committing gaffes, it's his lifelong pathology, and his ditering issues draw out the painful decisions but over his career, a pattern keeps reasserting itself. just after he is dismissed as a relic, he pulls off his greatest

successes. and, frank, i couldn't agree more. i keep saying he's always underestimated, and people look at things in his life that have happened, mistakes he has made and they make all of these conclusions, and joe biden has found a way to learn from his life. to deepen his instincts from his life. and as you said, like, just at the, you know, bring of these midterms, everybody was really concerned it was going to be a red wave, there was a lot of talk that the democrats were not focused on the right things and joe biden held a speech specifically on the state of our democracy and he constantly talked about abortion. >> he was totally creamed for that speech he gave about democracy. so many pundits said he wasn't focusing on the right issue. every poll said that voters' primary concern was the economy, and by addressing this issue of the rise of authoritarianism, he

was missing topic a, he wasn't speaking to voters' concerns, he had a far less cynical view of the american people. he thought they would be able to look past their concerns on rising gas prices and focus on the most important thing which is saving democracy and it turns out that he was, of course, correct. >> so in a way, david ignatius, those instincts that joe biden was pointing to before this election is something that was opposite of what the republicans were doing. he treated the american voters, republican, independent, democrat, whatever, as smart. he said to them, i know you understand the importance of our democracy. we can't have gas prices. we can't have, you know, the issues that we want to deal with without a functioning democracy. and he gave them the choice to make a decision about our country. >> mika, i think you're right.

i've had a theory about biden for a while now that his absolute core driving passion, his legacy issue, if you will, is he's the guy who stopped donald trump. he's the guy who beat donald trump in 2020. and now, he's the guy who saw the setback of the trumpist candidates in the midterm elections in 2022. what i'd like to ask frank, who's writing i really respect, is whether he thinks having had the success against trump biden is going to think, okay, my time is ending now. i don't need to run again. i shouldn't run again. my job, this job that i did well, as you complain in your article, i've done that. it's time to give somebody else a chance to rebuild the party. >> i don't know if he settled on this decision yet. i think he looks at trump and he looks at his track record of beating trump. i think there's part of him that

considers himself an indispensable man. he thinks if the democrats veer off into a different direction, maybe they won't pick somebody who has record, the personality, the political skills to beat trump. on the one hand, i think he's probably thinking to himself, here's this threat to the republic who's reemerged to use herschel walker language, it's like the vampire has come back, and joe biden needs to be the werewolf here. on the other hand, i think one of the patterns of the biden presidency that is pretty telling and fascinating is that you have this guy who's craved the presidency for the entirety of his adult life and yet has constantly been able to shelf his ego at crucial moments and say this is not about me. i think one of the successful things he did during the last two years politically was to make it less about himself and so he's not a figure who

bestrides the public. he's not somebody who's on television constantly. his goal was to lower the temperature in the country which meant that his approval rating would suffer because sometimes he seemed like a less omni present president, and he was less polarizing, which i think helped pave the way for the democrats' success last tuesday. >> yeah, you know, willie, it is something, the guy is always underestimated. i remember writing a column in the "washington post" after everybody said that his career was over, he was humiliated in iowa, humiliated in new hampshire, and said, well you, probably want to let voters in south carolina and at least let some black voters have a say issue because those two states he lost were predominantly white. he did come back, and he comes back, wins the presidency, and

then he's mocked and ridiculed for speeches on democracy, his focus on abortion, and by this point, joe biden's pretty tired of being under estimated. and he has a historic midterm, i mean, this is a guy, you know, we always joked about your new york yankees and my boston red sox being the little engine that could, i think i can, i think i can, always under estimated. this is joe biden. the guy gets the job done. >> yeah, i know you guys hear the same thing i hear from some people at the white house talking to democrats, not to us, but something to the effect of how about a little gratitude. joe biden is the guy, as frank just said, who stopped donald trump. we don't know what this country would have looked like with a second term of donald trump. it was joe biden and perhaps only joe biden among democrats who could have stopped democrats, and he did that by the skin of his teeth. got legislation passed, major

legislation passed that's appealing to democrats, and now sort of defying history and inflation, and a whole bunch of other factors holding on to the united states senate, keeping the house very close, governor's mansions as well. so i think perhaps now, ashley parker, some democrats who said we can't have him run again might stop and say, maybe now that donald trump's saying he is the guy who can beat trump again. >> it certainly quieted a lot of the private rumbles of that idea that it was time for president biden to step aside, and even some that had become public, and before the midterm elections when it did look like, and democrats believe this as well, it could potentially be a red wave. there was this sense that in the days and weeks afterwards, you would have all of these ambitious democratic hopefuls coming out and sort of publicly saying what had long been said privately, as soon as tuesday nigh not even was over but it was just clear that even if republicans won the house, which

they obviously did, that they ultimately lost, and this was a huge win for president biden and democrats. all of that talk just immediately quieted down. >> david ignatius, we have sad sad news. obviously for anybody that has known him, michael gerson, i'm getting reports has passed away at the age of 58. he was a speech writer, of course, for george w. bush. he was a man of deep faith, a man who became a fierce critic of trumpism, a man who believed that the republican party needed to move back to its traditional roots, and was forever guided by his strong sense of his christian faith, michael gerson

passed away at 58. >> joe, i share with all of his colleagues at the post and with all of his readers a sense of real loss for michael. he has been ill for some time. he responded to that with great courage. he wrote about it. he wrote about what you know when you're facing a mortal illness. he wrote about his religious faith which only deepened over time. he was a rare person. we talk about the qualities that would lead to a reconstruction of american politics, the basic decency that we associate with our country, but we see too little. every time i was with michael gerson, i saw those qualities, he wrote about them with such great passion in his columns, he's somebody we'll really miss for his writing and for who he was. >> we will be certainly praying for michael's family, friends, loved ones, and post colleagues. michael gerson passed away at the age of 58. we'll be right back. passed awa the age of 58.

we'll be right back. it's nice to unwind after a long week of telling people how liberty mutual customizes your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. showtime. whoo! i'm on fire tonight. (limu squawks) yes! limu, you're a natural. we're not counting that. only pay for what you need. ♪liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty.♪ if you still have symptoms of moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis or active psoriatic arthritis after a tnf blocker like humira or enbrel, rinvoq is different and may help. stand up to your symptoms with rinvoq. rinvoq is a once-daily pill that tackles pain, stiffness, swelling. for some, rinvoq significantly reduces ra and psa fatigue. it can stop further irreversible joint damage. and rinvoq can leave skin clear or almost clear in psa. that's rinvoq relief. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections,

including tb. serious infections and blood clots, some fatal; cancers, including lymphoma and skin cancer; death, heart attack, stroke, and tears in the stomach or intestines occurred. people 50 and older with at least one heart disease risk factor have higher risks. don't take if allergic to rinvoq as serious reactions can occur. tell your doctor if you are or may become pregnant. ask your rheumatologist for rinvoq. rinvoq. make it your mission. learn how abbvie could help you save. you need a bed that's smart enough for both of you. the sleep number 360 smart bed senses your movements and automatically adjusts to help keep you both effortlessly comfortable. our smart sleepers get 28 minutes more restful sleep per night. save 50% on the sleep number 360 limited edition smart bed. only for a limited time.

it's a beautiful live picture. it's 7:33 in the morning. at the top of our building here at the rockefeller plaza. back in august, voters in kansas decisively defeated a constitutional amendment that would have weakened abortion rights. it helped to set the stage in part for the party's big wins nationwide in last week's midterms. joining us now, democratic congresswoman sharice davids of congress who won reelection herself. congresswoman, great to have you on this morning. congratulations on your win again here. i noticed in 2018, you flipped your seat, which had been a republican seat to the democratic side. you win in 2020, and then this time in 2022, you win by an even wider margin than you won in 2020. so walk us through, if you could, what's going on in your district and in the state of kansas. >> it's good to be here, and i like the time line we're talking

about here. you know, i think that there's a lot going on in kansas and certainly in the kansas third, you know, i think that it's really important to recognize that what we saw both in august and again in november on election night was that people recognized that our rights were on the ballot in august, and again in november. and that also, you know, it's important to recognize that people want a representative who's going to show up, who's going to show up to do the work, who's going to show up to listen, to best represent the district, and that's what i've been able to do over my time serving the kansas third. >> and congresswoman, there's been a lot of focus put as i mentioned at the top on that ballot initiative over the summer on abortion in the state of kansas. people look at presidential elections, well, kansas is a red

state, donald trump won by 15 points in 2020, and i think that's perhaps why nationally at least there was some surprise at that number. how big of a motivating factor do you think that was to voters in your election? >> well, again, i do think that people were -- if you think back to june when roe was overturned, the impact was immediate. people felt it viscerally. i mean, the fear, the anxiety. in kansas, we were watching neighboring states enact very extreme laws, and we knew that we didn't want politicians making very private health care decisions for us, particularly around abortion or reproductive rights. and so i think that people were -- we were getting organized already, and certainly that continued through after the august, you know, after we were

able to push back on this extreme -- these extreme policies, and i think that, you know, i think that people are absolutely concerned about their rights and they're concerned about making sure their kids and grand kids have opportunities, which is why it was so important for us to make sure that, you know, i am always out there listening and talking about and working on concrete solutions to the issues that are most pressing. >> congresswoman, sam stein here, when we talked about the ballot initiative, one of the things was in echo of what you said, they had to show up in the communities to talk to people face to face to explain sort of the stakes of what was going on, in addition to the sort of tricky to understand language of the initiative. you look at people like john fetterman, he showed up in the red areas of the state, and helped buffer the margins of democrats in the areas. i'm wondering if you take stock

of what happened, do you think democrats do a good job showing up to traditionally republican conservative or rural areas, what would you like to see the party do differently in going forward. what would the message be for party leaders about investments in those communities? >> look, i'm always going to encourage investment in kansas, and in the kansas third, so i do think that that -- i do think that that's an important thing to be thinking about, but, you know, when it comes to what other folks in other states or districts should be doing, you know, i can't speak to that, but i can say that i show up in every part of the district. you mentioned that with some other folks, senator elect fetterman certainly, but i think it's really important for anybody who is on the ballot. democrat, republican, independent, if you want to represent people, you have to actually listen to people, and show up.

i show up in every single part of the district. i am always there to listen. i think people appreciate when you show up and you don't already assume that you know everything about what they're dealing with. i also make sure that i show up, listen, and then deliver when i get the chance out here, whether it's, you know, an upcoming farm bill which i'm very much looking forward to working on or the bipartisan infrastructure bill that we got to work on. people want you to listen and deliver, and that's what i have been able to do for the kansas third. >> congresswoman ashley parker of the "washington post" is here with a question for you, ashley. >> thank you, congresswoman. i wanted to follow up on something willie asked you. obviously abortion was a big issue in your most recent race and the races of a lot of democrats. i'm curious, do you think abortion has the potential and those rights being taken away to become for democrats what it was for republicans? you know, for a number of

decades, at least until maybe congress codifies roe. i guess my question was was it just a big issue because the dobbs decision has come down or could this be galvanizing for generations to come? >> wow, that's a -- that's maybe something that's best left to political scientists and that sort of thing. i can tell you that i think that protecting our rights and knowing that, you know, i think the kansas third wanted a representative who is always going to push back against not just extreme policies or any attempts to have politicians making these very personal, private decisions, particularly around access to abortion. and i think, you know, i think that so long as you have politicians out there who are either running for office or are already elected who are trying to take away rights that we

consider to be foundational, i think that these issues will continue to be important on every single -- on every single ballot, and every single election, and my hope is that folks who are currently representing districts or are seeking to in the future recognize that people do not want their kids to have less rights than they have. and i think that is something that has been very clear from this election cycle, i think. >> democratic congresswoman sharice davids of kansas who won by 12 points last week in a district that just four years ago was red. thank you so much for your time today, congresswoman, we appreciate it. >> thank you. and ashley parker, thank you as well. always great to have you on. come back soon. up next, legislation to protect same-sex marriage has passed a crucial step in the senate with a dozen republicans getting on board. we'll speak with senate majority whip dick durbin about when that bill will come up for a final

vote. plus, we are coming up on the start of what is expected to be a very busy travel season, getting back to pre-pandemic levels. we'll talk to the tsa about what that organization is doing to get people through long security lines at airports across the country. security lines at airports across the country. the first-ever all-electric chevy silverado rst. with a multi-flex midgate for extra storage. and an available 400 miles of range on a full charge. evs for everyone, everywhere. chevrolet

45 past the hour. here are some of the other stories making headlines this morning. newly released video from the january 6th insurrection shows a group of rioters breaking into house speaker nancy pelosi's office looking for the lawmaker. the video is part of the government's evidence against one of the capitol rioters. riley williams, and was released at the request of the nbc news. in that video, you can hear the group calling and searching for the pelosi. at the time, the speaker's staff

was huddled in the conference room, barricading themselves, and hiding from the mob. the jury in williams' case began deliberating yesterday on charges that she aided and abetted the theft of speaker pelosi's laptop. a strong earthquake shook parts of texas yesterday. the epicenter of the 5.4 quake was in a tiny community in west texas. but people in san antonio, more than 350 miles away reported feeling vibrations from it. it's believed to be the third strongest earthquake ever recorded in the state of texas. tennis star novak djokovic will make his return to the australian open in january. the australian government confirming this morning djokovic has been granted a visa to compete in the major tournament one year after the 21-time grand slam champion was deported over his stance against the covid-19 vaccine. and a new report finds that

participation in youth sports has finally climbed back to pre-pandemic levels. according to the aspen institute's annual state of play report, which surveys youth sports parents, children ages 5 to 18 are spending nearly 17 hours a week playing sports. the most since before the covid-19 outbreak. the rebound was driven largely by increased competition, which is up 32% from a year ago. willie. >> that's great news. another thing bouncing back, mee -- mika is travel. on a flight from san francisco to chicago. it's the latest in a string of violent incidents on airplanes. on top of that, the tsa already has taken roughly 5,000 guns this year, which puts the agency on track to break last year's record of 5,972 firearms detected at check points. joining us now, tsa

administrator, david pikosky, great to have you with us this morning. >> thanks, willie. >> let me start on the gun question, it boggles my mind, people don't know you can't bring a firearm on their carry on package. >> nearly every person said i forgot it was there, i didn't know it was there. that in and of itself is a problem. the other thing i would emphasize is we're probably going to break the record we broke last year, almost 6,000. we'll probably be over 6,000 this year before the calendar year is out. the concerning part is 87% of those firearms are loaded. >> what do you chalk that up to? is some of it malicious, or do you believe most people didn't know or believe they had it. >> we do an investigation in every case, because we pursue a civil penalty action. in most cases we don't believe it is malicious. you need to know you have a gun, and it's clear, when you check in for your flight, it's the clear warnings are there, and we have signs through our check

point, and we have been in media talking about this for a while, we need to see the numbers come down. >> if you need a sign to tell you don't bring a loaded gun on the plane at this point, maybe drive to where you're going. let me ask you about the return to travel. we were talking about this in the commercial break. you were at some months more than 100% of pre-pandemic levels of travel, which is good news. people are moving around the concerned again, getting on airplanes. what does it mean for you, though, as an administration. >> what it means is we're seeing very robust return to travel. in fact, we have seen a greater closing of the gap between the pre-pandemic levels and now in the fall. so many days we're pretty much at pre-pandemic levels and some days sundays in october which generally aren't that busy exceeded the pre-pandemic levels. so we have expected coming into the thanksgiving day holiday it will be very busy beginning next tuesday and wednesday and then thursday morning and the busiest

day is sunday following thanksgiving. in 2019 that almost was 3 million people through the check points. we don't think we'll hit that number this year but will be very close to it. >> how's the tsa doing on staffing? you go to a crowded airport with a long line and see stations closed without people working there. do you need more staff? >> we need more staff. we have been short staffed for a year and a half now. we have had some success bringing on people. to assist the airports is we ask for volunteers. we basically say if you're fully certified would you volunteer to help them out in peak periods? we expect over thanksgiving to have almost 700 people redeployed in the country. i would just point out that over

the summer, very busy, the wait times were most days rarely exceed the standards for wait times. we look at non precheck passengers through in 30 minutes or less. precheck ten minutes or less. >> joe? >> i got quite a few when it comes to air travel. so after 9/11 the federal government stepped up. gave us the tsa employees we needed. i think paid them pretty well and you're sitting there saying i feel safe on the plane. suddenly you started to see lines closed down and go dark and you could tell the funding was cut back. i look at the agents now and so many of them are overwhelmed because we don't have enough tsa

agents and i think the bottom of this is the fact that tsa employees are the lowest paid in the federal government making no sense considering it's the interstate system and the airports that are the arteries of america's economy. so what can we do to get members of congress to start paying tsa screeners and employees more money and so you can hire more? >> joe, that's the most critical challenge. the president in the fiscal '23 budget which is still under consideration asked for a simple thing. hey, let's pay the tsa employees at a fair rate compared to other federal employees. we ask for if i'm a tsa employee and moved to another agency how

much would i make? the difference is stark. the officers in the checkpoints there's a 30% difference. that's huge. these are generally entry-level wages and federal air marshals is 20%. when they look across and see the federal counterparts they know they're not paid fairly. i emphasize this to the congress and hoping the congress passes this when they pass an appropriations bill for fiscal '23. >> paid 30% less then maybe the quality issues. the best and brightest will go somewhere else and get paid more and impossible for you to hire the people you want to hire to keep plans and america's skies safe. why wouldn't congress support this? >> yeah. i think there's absolutely no

good reason not to support this. it's critical for the operational success in the future. as you mentioned it is hard in this environment to be able to hire people. you are not competitive and asking them to work shift work, on the feet all day long and national security positions. they cannot fail in the mission so it's no sense to not provide them at least the same pay as the fellow counterparts. >> when do we stop taking off the shoes? >> one priority -- i have three priorities. people always first. we had a great discussion on that. the second is partnerships with airlines and airports. the third is technology. there are technology solutions for this. we need to look at shoes. whether you look at them visually or through an x ray or

other technology is the question. >> if you sign up for precheck you don't have to take off the shoes. you were nominated by former president trump in 2017 and reconfirmed. a rare feat. tsa administrator, thank you for what you do for the country. appreciate it. >> my privilege. >> by the way, keep making us take the shoes off until you have the technology. >> whatever is needed. >> flying is safer than ever. let's not rock the boat. senate majority whip dick durbin to talk about what a split congress will mean for president biden and the democratic agenda. plus, democrat adrian fontes won in arizona defeeting an election denying challenger. arizona's incoming secretary of

state will be our guest this morning. she knew that i always want to know more about my family history. with ancestry i dug and dug until i found some information. i was able to find out more than just a name. and then you add it to the tree. i found ship manifests. birth certificate. wow. look at your dad. i love it so much to know where my father work, where he grew up? it's like you discover a new family member. it's the greatest gift. now on sale at ancestry. first psoriasis, then psoriatic arthritis. even walking was tough. i had to do something. i started cosentyx®. cosentyx can help you move, look, and feel better... by treating the multiple symptoms of psoriatic arthritis. don't use if you're allergic to cosentyx. before starting...get checked for tuberculosis. an increased risk of infections some serious... and the lowered ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor about an infection or symptoms... or if you've had a vaccine or plan to. tell your doctor if your crohn's disease symptoms...

develop or worsen. serious allergic reactions may occur. watch me. ask your rheumatologist about cosentyx. what if we wanted to electrify all of this... 100% carbon free... is it possible? ♪♪ aes has been leading energy transitions for decades... and is partnering with the worlds leading companies to decarbonize industries... cities, and nations. even the internet. is it possible? can we reliably power the things we love and green the planet at the same time? yes... aes. my asthma felt anything but normal. ♪ ♪ it was time for a nunormal with nucala. nucala is a once-monthly add-on treatment for severe eosinophilic asthma that can mean less oral steroids. not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection site reactions,

back pain, and fatigue. ask your asthma specialist about a nunormal with nucala. moderate to severe eczema still disrupts my skin. despite treatment it disrupts my skin with itch. it disrupts my skin with rash. but now, i can disrupt eczema with rinvoq. rinvoq is not a steroid, topical, or injection. it's one pill, once a day, that's effective without topical steroids. many taking rinvoq saw clear or almost-clear skin while some saw up to 100% clear skin. plus, they felt fast itch relief some as early as 2 days. that's rinvoq relief. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. serious infections and blood clots, some fatal, cancers including lymphoma and skin cancer, death, heart attack, stroke, and tears in the stomach or intestines occurred. people 50 and older with at least one heart disease risk factor have higher risks. don't take if allergic to rinvoq, as serious reactions can occur. tell your doctor if you are or may become pregnant. disrupt the itch and rash of eczema.

talk to your doctor about rinvoq. learn how abbvie can help you save.

the low energy speech wasn't received well by the people watching live in the room. according to abc some audience members tried to leave early but stopped by security. have a look. >> i saw people trying to leave perhaps concerned that the hall would empty out too much and started to prevent people from leaving. and people leaving early before he was done. >> strange those people didn't make it through because trump supporters never let things like doors or security stop them before. >> welcome back to "morning joe." it is thursday, november 17th. the third hour of "morning joe." donald trump's third presidential bid is setting off a new round of republican

infighting as trump allies square off against a growing chorus of lawmakers, donors and former trump administration officials saying the gop needs to change course in 2024. nbc news senior congressional correspondent garrett headache has the latest. >> reporter: with the speaker's gavel poised to pass to mccarthy republicans vow to ramp up investigations and the president's son hunter's business dealings. the shift in the balance of power from abortion to climate to gun reform. even as republicans celebrate the victory they confront deep divisions. with some allies saying they're on board. >> i like his policies and how

tough he is. >> reporter: republicans say it is time for the party to move on. >> we need a future leaning party. >> reporter: echoed by former administration officials. >> unfit for office. >> reporter: republican mega donor steven schwartzman said it is time for the republican party to turn to a new generation of leaders. the leading potential rival florida governor ron desantis is dismissing talk about a republican civil war. >> people need to chill out a little bit. seriously. >> reporter: congressional leaders avoid the question. mitch mcconnell steering clear. >> the way i go into this presidential primary season is to stay out of it. i don't have a dog in that fight. >> reporter: he has won another fight fending off a challenge

from trump ally rick scott who sought to oust him after the failure to win control of the senate. >> that's nbc's garret haake with a report. so fascinating that you have rick scott coming off this disastrous performance running the republican senate committee arm and then decides to run for majority leader. that would be like -- i don't know -- working in private business running a hospital chain and racking up the largest ever medicare fraud fine for any hospital chain in the history of america and then deciding to run a state or be a senator. >> interesting hypothetical there. >> out of thin air. >> talk about a lack of political self awareness.

defeating in the senate. should have been a layup. the house is declared to go to republicans but by a slimmer margin. and then a couple days later to say i should be the leader of the united states and taking you on, mitch mcconnell, he lost yesterday 37-10. the caucus disagreed with the assessment of himself. >> let's bring in dick durbin of illinois, chairman of the judiciary committee. senator, first of all, would love to get your reaction to the historic midterms. nobody around here, nobody we have that you canned to has a seen a midterm like it. >> when you do the analysis, it really was a fascinating election. it starts with the fact of

quality candidates. the position was in sync with most americans. look at the turnout of women expressing the strongly held feelings on reproductive health. we had a situation with a record to speak of and most americans can understand and identify with. and then the extremism on the other side rejected by the voters in virtually every contest in a swing state. they lost as i hoped they would and back on track to something that's reliable in the future. >> i wonder whether yesterday's historic vote on the respect for marriage act may have been influenced in part by the election results and maybe enough republicans understanding that if they keep taking positions that the most extreme members of the base support they

won't win general elections. >> joe, you put the finger on it. i spoke to republican senators who sat for hours trying to analyze what happened to them and a fundamental question is what is our base? what do they believe in? is it just maga republicans loyal to trump or more to it? basic conservatism? they have to make that decision. the house of representatives will be ground zero in the civil war within the republican party. this four-vote margin to take control of the house of representatives, you know that can evaporate with absences on the day of the vote. you can see country -- uncertainty. >> there's talk that perhaps the states lowered because you have

the majority in the senate. how important would it be to have that 51st vote? >> that's true. we are taking georgia seriously. we believe that we have another quality candidate to prevail. the fall off in votes in the regular election suggest many georgia republicans not excited about donald trump's choice for senate in georgia. we have a quality candidate who's working hard. i'm contacted by friends saying how can i help. it tells me that the december 6th election will be one that's national attention start to finish. >> senator, we are hearing voices on the extreme maga right, people who are actually

seeming to do vladimir putin's bidding, talking about the united states no longer supporting the pushback of vladimir putin, the freedom of the ukrainian people. what do you believe the prospects are for congress continuing to lend support to ukraine in their fight against the russian invasion? >> i think there's a solid bipartisan group of members committed to standing by ukraine. these people in ukraine are dying every day. going through deprivations that americans can't appreciate. i think the biden administration has stood by them. when we have suggestions from members on the house on the extreme that they're growing impatient i think to myself the people in ukraine did not invite

this invasion. they every fighting back successfully in an inspiring way. we need to stand together with nato and on behalf of the ukrainian people. >> all right. chairman of the judiciary committee, thank you for being on this morning. >> thank you. we have the ceo of the messina group, jim messina. and special correspondent benny farian. good to have you both. >> what is your take a week later? >> a couple things happened last week. one is big democratic turnout in important swing seats. women voters surging in ways that the polls were wrong. we have been talking about the polls for a long time and they missed the surge. and then second, democracy won.

right? you had a bunch of deniers losing all over the place and i'm pleased they lost. we lost the house. there's more work to be done and i think the party needs to rally around joe biden in 2024. >> there's so much talk about a red wave or read tsunami. the polling was wrong to bolster the claims. the house is gone and hope to hang on to the senate. but in the piece headlined voters are smarter than the media. so what's your assessment now ten days after the elections about some things that went wrong? >> we worked on bad polls,

really. you talk to pollsters saying we were close but they weren't. they told us it was going to be a red wave and it wasn't. there's anxiety because pollsters had been wrong, underestimated trump in 2016 and then in the senate in 2020 there was a republican underestimation. i also think there was too much media on media group think and not enough openness to other ideas. there was a certain anxiety if you said there's a chance democrats to hold the house which there was a chance. the republican majority is very, very slim, to be silly and maybe wish casting. they were close. >> the great example is the issue of abortion where a narrative said red hot in the summer and now subsided and then

the exit polls in michigan and pennsylvania the number one issue sometimes orr the economy. >> yeah. when dobbs -- when the decision came down people were like this might not move voters and five special votes and then people thought maybe it will and then in august everyone's like no. voters only care about gas prices. and again it was too much supposition and not enough reality. >> look at this from 30,000 feet now. we know that the senate and the house are closely divided. senate has an awful lot of power to do things that the house doesn't. joe biden will likely appoint more federal judges. obviously you need treaties,

ambassadors, cab net officers. can whisk through the senate. the house far more divided. if you're advising the biden house, what do you tell them to do over the next two years to highlight what the democrats do right and what the republicans likely are going to do wrong in becoming even more ideological running the house? >> look. they need to stay focused which is delivering for the american public and they have done that. focus on the economy. inflation is still the biggest issue. it will continue to be. if democrats are still trailing on who's better for the economy they need to focus on that. continue to deliver for the american people and then draw a very sharp contrast to the house to give them the opportunity and continue to overreach. they're already that you canning

about doing an abortion vote which is insane politics. they will continue to go after that stuff. joe biden should just play off that and stay focused on the american economy. they have a really good track record if they continue to do that for two years. the politics will sort themselves out. >> you had an interesting takeaway watching the results which is that for all the complaint that is the politicians are too old and needs to be a new generation you start to see in the democratic party a bench. shapiro in pennsylvania. whitmer in michigan. what did you see in that? >> there were a lot of really good candidates that won governorships in swing states. michigan has now three women in power. that's incredible. and in wisconsin, a lot of democrats becoming stars and

that's going to be really interesting and i hope there's more coverage of those guys. >> jim messina and molly jong-fast, good to have you on. thank you both for being on this morning. in a rare display of public discord ukraine and the western allies clash over who launched the miss sill that killed two in poland. richard engel has the latest. >> reporter: zelenskyy insist ds the country didn't fire a missile that crossed into poland. i have no doubt it was not our rocket, he said. asked about that, president biden saying overnight -- that's not the evidence return. >> reporter: poland's president

called it a tragic accident from a ukrainian air defense system. an assessment shared by the pentagon. >> we have seen nothing that contradicts the preliminary assessment that this explosion most likely the result of a ukrainian air defense missile that unfortunately landed in poland. >> reporter: the u.s. and nato blamed russia suggesting ukraine using the air defenses after russia launched missiles targeting the ukrainian infrastructure like this attack this morning. >> while we still don't know all the facts, we do know one thing. this tragedy would never have happened but for russia's needless invasion of ukraine and the missile assaults against ukraine's civilian infrastructure. >> reporter: russia tried to

capital ides on the confusion accusing the enemies of whipping up hysteria. the u.n. ambassador saying this is a conscious attempt to bring nato into direct conflict with the country. russia says the missiles against iran at least 20 miles from the polish border. and we will have more ahead on the deadly missile strike in poland. plus a guest this morning says election deniers are not done yet. that new piece in "the atlantic." you are watching "morning joe." research shows people remember commercials with nostalgia. so to help you remember that liberty mutual customizes your home insurance, here's one that'll really take you back. wow! what'd you get, ryan? it's customized home insurance

from liberty mutual!!! what does it do, bud? it customizes our home insurance so we only pay for what we need! and what did you get, mike? i got a bike. ♪ only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

♪ [laughing and giggling] (woman) hey dad. miss us? (vo) reflect on the past, celebrate the future. this season with audi.

welcome back.

donald trump's former vice president mike pence said he is considering whether to run for president in 2024 and doubled down on the remark that is voters will not have to settle for the former president. >> he's entitled to announce the intentions whenever he desires but i believe that we'll have better choices come 2024. i don't think anybody -- >> than donald trump? >> i do. >> i do. he says. >> i do! >> former secretary of state in the trump administration considering a presidential run tweeting yesterday, we need more seriousness, less noise and leaders who are looking forward. pompeo did not mention trump. and then there's house minority leader mccarthy dodging and then

ignoring questions. >> announcing? >> president trump. >> why? >> are you prepared to endorse him? >> you guys are crazy. >> do you support him running for president? >> do you mind stopping for a minute? >> do you want him to run for president? >> where have you gone? he doesn't want to talk about it. which sam stein, means that he wasn't worried about the threat from mar-a-lago, a remaining supporters said that mccarthy is going to have to strongly support donald trump.

he's just completely avoiding it and wants to be the next speaker of the house so a guy walking avoiding answering the question is simply reflecting the will of the members. >> look. this all remind me of this movie "flight night" with vampires. >> go ahead. >> i won't go down that road. look. i align myself here with jen's comments which is, i do think trump can probably use this to his advantage. he ran successfully as an outsider in 2015. he was the president in between then and now. he doesn't necessarily need the gop establishment to run for office. he's done it before without it. two, on the fund raising front the mega donors are helpful but the main cash base is the online

donations. third component is pence and the pile-on. that's more tricky to navigate but trump has leverage. if they don't want to answer the question all trump has to do is not elect the man speaker when the vote is held in public in early january. the house republican majority would be so slim. i know trump's in a weakened state but he has been before. we thought it was the last chapter for him and then mccarthy went to mar-a-lago. i think he has a few more trirks up the sleeve. >> it is not just donors and the money but republican leaders finding a way to speak to the trump issue without mentioning trump's name. look at a governor who's now

working with corey lewandowski who worked with trump. >> yeah. she was quoted. the fact he is sitting with her. why? she talked about the need to expand the base of the party and talk to people that support trump and don't support trump. putting aside the crazy and we should not, that is the kind of message that wins elections. it is so starkly different than kari lake punching the mccain supporters and people that love mccain in the face. and the expansion of the vote is what either party needs to do. that's a smart message. >> that message, it is interesting. that message stands out.

jumped of the page to me. republicans talking like they haven't spoken in a decade. we have to expand the base. nome doesn't govern like a person that needs to expand the base. you had mitch mcconnell saying that the republicans were too harsh, severe. they scared away independents. i saw a headline in "the new york times" that the senate gone over a procedural safeguard to ensure marriage equality. shocking headline how easily that procedural vote passed. remember again, just for perspective, then vice president joe biden went on a sunday show and said the administration

supported marriage equality and paid a terrible price for it inside the obama white house because barack obama was running for election. so that was just a decade ago that even progressives were angry at joe biden for getting ahead of them on the message. you have republicans and democrats coming together to support a same sex marriage protection which again we wouldn't have seen the vote passed that cleanly before last week. there is an understanding. there is a big understanding i think among republicans that they have got to stop turning off independents and moderates to win elections again. >> almost a direct quote from mitch mcconnell. he said we got wiped out among

inspecteds. the vote yesterday procedural hurdle on the gay marriage legislation 62 votes. should point out mitch mcconnell voted against it. that's one step republicans may be recognizing but then the extremism on abortion, on guns and democracy and the other things that cost them desperately in this election and stunned them. are they able to change the positions on those or moderate a little bit to recapture the independents that fled from them a couple days ago? >> make no mistake. when willie talks about extremism on the positions we talked about this before. the majority are a plurality of americans on abortion. they support the 15-week ban

that john roberts supported in mississippi law that the rest of the court might have gone along with. if they had the whole world politically might have been different but 10-year-old girls raped having to flee the state. candidates running for govern talking about 14-year-old girls raped by the uncle why there can't be an exception. when you talk about that. when you talk about guns. republicans who have been on the wrong side of an issue now since sandy hook. 90% of americans support universal background checks and other gun safety laws. are republicans still going to support the 7% to 8%, the 9% position? just to please some gun lobbyists. doesn't make a lot of political

sense. >> it does not. >> all of this adds up and makes the republican party look like it's out of touch which is why republicans underperformed historically this week. kevin mccarthy is poised to be the next house speaker. doesn't have the support of the house caucus. we have the preview of what could be a chaotic new term on capitol hill. that's next on "morning joe." if you still have symptoms of moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis or active psoriatic arthritis after a tnf blocker like humira or enbrel, rinvoq is different and may help. stand up to your symptoms with rinvoq. rinvoq is a once-daily pill that tackles pain, stiffness, swelling. for some, rinvoq significantly reduces ra and psa fatigue. it can stop further irreversible joint damage. and rinvoq can leave skin clear or almost clear in psa.

that's rinvoq relief. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. serious infections and blood clots, some fatal; cancers, including lymphoma and skin cancer; death, heart attack, stroke, and tears in the stomach or intestines occurred. people 50 and older with at least one heart disease risk factor have higher risks. don't take if allergic to rinvoq as serious reactions can occur. tell your doctor if you are or may become pregnant. ask your rheumatologist for rinvoq. rinvoq. make it your mission. learn how abbvie could help you save. (vo) after fifteen years of the share the love event, make it your mission. subaru and our retailers have donated over two hundred and fifty million dollars to charity. in fact, subaru is the largest corporate donor to the aspca...

...and the national park foundation. and the largest automotive donor to meals on wheels... ...and make-a-wish. get a new subaru during the share the love event and subaru and our retailers will donate three hundred dollars to charity. snoring keeping you awake? the sleep number 360 smart bed lets you gently raise your partner's head, and it senses your movements and automatically adjusts. save 50% on the sleep number 360 limited edition smart bed. only for a limited time. trying to control my asthma felt anything but normal. ♪ ♪ enough was enough. i talked to an asthma specialist and found out my severe asthma is driven by eosinophils, a type of asthma nucala can help control. now, fewer asthma attacks and less oral steroids that's my nunormal with nucala. nucala is a once-monthly add-on injection for

severe eosinophilic asthma. nucala is not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. talk to your asthma specialist to see if once-monthly nucala may be right for you. and learn about savings at nucala.com there's more to your life than asthma. find your nunormal with nucala.

these days, there's more to your life our households depend on the internet more and more. families grow, houses get smarter, and our demands on the internet increase. that's why we just boosted speeds for over 20 million xfinity customers, on us. so you get more of the speed you need for day and night streaming. more speed you need when you're work from homeing. and more speed you need as your family keeps growing. check in on your current speed through the xfinity app today. we have an election's update this morning. nbc news projects republicans have won control of the house by a slim margin. they barely did it with 218 seats being officially called for the gop. that's a number of seats needed for the majority. >> of course, there was a time

mccarthy thinking win by 60 seats. then win by 50 seats. >> nbc news estimates republicans will win 221 seats while democrats will hold on to 214 seats. the margin of error is plus or minus two seats. the results hand president biden a divided congress with democrats keeping control of the senate. a stunning victory for the democrats. i am ready to work with house republicans to deliver results for working families. >> let's talk about the nightmare it is to be -- whether mccarthy the speaker. i say this because i know this because i was there when republicans had a four-vote -- i'm sorry.

218 members. 218 that are tired to be a face in the crowd. all they have to do is find three friends saying talk to the democrats. i want to pass this bill. and it gets done. that is impossible for the best of speakers to maintain. the republican side all i see is anarchy. this will be a difficult two years where republicans supposedly have the power, the responsibility. but aren't going to be able to get anything done there. >> be careful what you ask for, kevin mccarthy. it is hard to govern with that slim of a majority. he doubled down on being opposed to proxy voting and doing in the house for a few years. the fact is that a lot of members are older or family

member issues. this is a huge caucus. he needs the members to not just support his agenda but to be there in person which is a two-hurdle challenge. as you said he has a bigger dose of crazy to manage in terms of his caucus. yes, be careful what you ask for. this is the gift for coming years, managing the big group. >> we'll talk more with nbc's sahil gapur. trump reemerges. we'll talk about that when "morning joe" returns.

if you run a small business, you need the most from every investment. that's why comcast business gives you more. more innovation... with our new gig-speed wi-fi, plus unlimited data. more speed... from the largest, fastest, reliable network...

and more savings- up to 60% a year with comcast business mobile. all from the company that powers more businesses than any other provider. get started with fast speeds and advanced security for $49.99 a month for 12 months. plus ask how to get up to a $750 prepaid card with a qualifying bundle. well, we fell in love through gaming. but now the internet lags and it throws the whole thing off. when did you first discover this lag? i signed us up for t-mobile home internet. ugh! but, we found other interests. i guess we have. [both] finch! let's go! oh yeah! it's not the same. what could you do to solve the problem? we could get xfinity? that's actually super adult of you to suggest. i can't wait to squad up. i love it when you talk nerdy to me. guy, guys, guys, we're still in session. and i don't know what the heck you're talking about. we are still gathering information. we have seen nothing that contradicts president duda's

preliminary expression that this explosion was the likely result of a ukrainian air defense missile that unfortunately landed in poland. whatever the final conclusions may be the world knows that russia bears ultimate responsibility for this incident. >> agreeing with polish president duda a missile launched by ukraine in defense. the two leaders agree while ukraine may have launched the missile the blame falls to russia as the war continues. joining us is david ignacius, jane harmon and national security analyst clint watts. good morning. clint, just on the assessment of

this. on the news breaking russia landed a missile inside poland. what next? slowly but surely the intelligence agencies said it's looking more like this is a ukrainian missile. president zelenskyy notingly suggesting a russian missile. >> not helpful having this debate when ukraine is doing so well. over 100 missiles fired that day. anti-aircraft missiles flying after them. it was natural something like this would happen eventually. everyone is bracing for this happening to some degree. the russian increasingly using dumber munitions. it is erratic and sporadic. we're at a particularly dangerous point with the

missiles and the strikes around the country. >> jane, the defense secretary said yesterday it looks like a ukrainian missile and tragic but we have the missile installations because rush is going after civilian targets. >> yes. he also tried to reach the russian counter part but i gather the phone call was refused why not good. i think that russia lost or losing the ground war and they have dumb missiles and drones from iran and causing damage on the ground and destroying infrastructure as the winter approaches. it is a bad deal but pretty clear after careful work and the poles need to be commended because they did invoke article 4. after work that this was a

mistake. >> david ignacius, we saw that poland stood shoulder to shoulder with the united states, nato. nobody got out in front of each other why what else have we learned from this false alarm? >> i think we have learned in addition to how dangerous this war is, russian onslaught, the ukrainians are trying to defend against, the system to calibrate what's happening in the fog of war seems to work. this was the most dangerous moment to imagine for many months we have worried, the u.s. worried that russians might attack the supply depots from poland into ukraine. setting off an article 5 so-called nato reaction which

nato would have to respond. in this case people waited. they gathered evidence to make sure what happened. whose missile was this? they found evidence that contrary to what they may have thought they forestall the sharp reaction to lead to rapid escalation. a takeaway amid the terrible situation is that system works. we should be glad that responsible people are running it. >> in your -- you have a question and answer session with the readers every monday at "the washington post" and a lot of questions had to do with the end game. peace talks. you were skeptical that we were there but you did say that both sides appear to be reaching an exhaustion point. what can you tell us about that

and what can you tell us about any reporting you have about both sides possibly inches closer to sitting down and talking to each other? >> i don't think we every there yet. everyone around the globe would like to see the war end. but as i noted in that discussion with readers wars end because the parties decide that they simply can't gain their goals on the battlefield. they are exhausted and negotiators find a way to get them out of the predicament. we are not there yet. efforts by the united states or any other mediator in this conflict are i think a mistake. this has to be russia and ukraine realizing to come up with a compromise to accept. it is interesting that our cia director bill burns was meeting

with russian counterparent in turkey and went on to see president zelenskyy in ukraine. i'm certainly asking questions today about what happened in the meetings but it was basically burns warning the russians about escalation. so as much as we hope that this winter could provide a stab situation point where the two sides could be talking about peace i don't see it yet. >> but, jane harmon, following up on david talking about the cia director traveling and counting to his russian russia, were anybody that would be a key player in at least the start of negotiations from the united states' side, it would be director burns, would it not? >> it sure would. and he met with putin personally i think before this ridiculous, unnecessary, illegal war started. but obviously to no effect.

i just wanted to add to what david said, which is this -- there's no room for compromise right now. and that's the u.s. position. and lloyd austin met with his counterparts i think this week and almost a billion dollars more aid is coming from sweden and germany and us and canada, and that's what we have to do. there's no evidence that putin keeps his word, and it ain't over until it's over. it's going to be a brutal winter, but the strongest weapon in this fight is the ukrainian heart. it's such bigger than dumb missiles or drones or whatever else has been used. the ukrainians are very well trained at this point, in part thanks to us but also their enormous tech skills to withstand this. and, boy, if russia isn't pushed back here, we'll never have an article 5 nato confrontation and that won't be good for anybody. >> general milley said yesterday

there's about zero chance at this point that russia completely overruns ukraine. with that said, even though they're retreating from places like kherson, they're still lobbing missiles, you know, 85 a day in some cases and they're hitting infrastructure power grids. we saw pictures yesterday of ukrainian heart surgeons performing surgeries just with head lamps to continue to do their jobs. what does this winter look like? where is russia right now? how long does this go on? >> i think we're at a major inflection point in the war partly because this is the second mud season, which leads to frozen tundra. yes, you could advance on positions, but it gives the russians time to build fortifications. if you look closer to crimea, primary and secondary lines of defense are going into place. the fight will expand outside of ukraine. i would look for cyberattacks, particularly around energy in europe. putin sees this as his over there bring the alliance to its

knees. also influence operations, the russians playing around in populist movements, rising inflation. and the real wild card is what's going on inside russia? we've not covered that very well over the last six months, but the war has come home. you're seeing people rising up against putin. there's even statements from former leaders and current leaders inside russia saying putin needs to be removed or he should be assassinated. i've never heard that in my life. that's a very different scenario. the squeezing is happening on both ends. >> i just had a thought experiment for joe biden as we close here, and that is to do something woodrow wilson did, who never served in congress. joe biden served four years. set up an office in the capitol and have office hours on a periodic basis and meet with members. this is a huge opportunity for a sea change because of the result of the midterms. one of things that has to pass immediately is the electoral count act so we don't see a repeat of january 6th in 2024.

>> for sure. if anyone could do that, it would be joe biden. >> and deb ignatius, we had a conversation at the cathedral a few weeks back about how harry truman was able to succeed with the marshall plan or the true doctrine, setting up nato, all the things he did. the way he did it was working with a republican congress extraordinarily closely and finding the responsible members and with arthur vandenberg having conversations every day with him and if he didn't send his staff members over to vanden derg berg's townhouse at night to keep them updated with what was going on, that made republicans, who are isolationists, engaged. of course these republicans certainly on the senate side are shoulder to shoulder with biden's aims right now. but it certainly wouldn't hurt going forward, would it, to work

even more closely with both sides on the issue of ukraine. >> on the issue of ukraine and also, joe, on the issue of china. if you're going to look for an issue that's analogous to the late '40s, it would be the growing u.s. competition with china. and there's strong bipartisan support. president biden, like president truman, is somebody who's been disrespected in some ways, not seen as a strong leader. and this is a moment for him to play a stronger leadership role, work more with congress. i think one message certainly that bill burns took with him to turkey and then to kyiv is to say our commitment, our american commitment to ukraine will continue and there's every sign that there will be bipartisan support. so on that issue and on the issue of u.s./china relations,

there is a chance for biden in this next period to be -- i don't want to say true manesque but a strong leader. coming up, a look at some of the republicas could-be challengers to trump in 2024. two were top members of his administration. "morning joe" is back in a moment. ever wonder why they call it the american dream... and not the american goal?

announcer: derek jeter ...or plan? maybe... it's because in dreams, you can do anything. in dreams... you can hold your entire world in the palm of your hand. and turn time inside out... again and again. and you can do it all with your eyes wide open. before we begin, i'd like to thank our sponsor, liberty mutual. they customize your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. and by switching, you could even save $652. thank you, liberty mutual. now, contestants ready? go! why? why? only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty.♪

trump is running for a third time. here he is making the announcement from mar-a-lago. >> in order to make america great and glorious again i am tonight announcing my candidacy for president of the united states.