♪♪ hi, everyone. it's 4:00 in new york. it is the end of an era in american politics. speaker nancy pelosi announcing today that after nearly 20 years at the helm, she will be stepping down as leader of the house democrats. wearing white, the symbolic color of the women's movement. pelosi spoke in what she described as the most beautiful

building in the world because of what it represents. as she told the democratic colleagues who surrounded her she would remain a members of congress but will not seek a leadership post. >> for me the hour has come for a new generation to lead the democratic caucus that i so deeply respect. and i'm grateful that so many are ready and willing to shoulder this awesome responsibility. madame speaker, standing here today, i'm endlessly grateful for all of life's blessings. for my democratic colleagues whose courage and commitment and the support of your families have made many of these accomplishments possible. in fact, could not have been done without you. >> for my dear husband, paul, who has been my beloved partner in life and pillar of support, thank you. we're all grateful for all the prayers and well wishes as he

continues his recovery. thank you so much. >> it would be difficult to overstate the impact that nancy pelosi has left on our country and our politics as the leader of the house democrats. "the washington post" writes this, quote her decision to not seek re-election as the top democrat in congress' lower chamber marks the culmination of a political career widely seen as setting the standard for political power. pelosi redefined the speakership and made history climbing the ranks of democratic leadership, becoming the first woman to be second in line to the presidency as speaker of the house twice. she has led the caucus in the house since 2003, her tenure in congress spanning four presidents, wars in afghanistan and iraq. a once in a century financial crisis and a global pandemic. in that time she built an unparalleled legislative record that includes the affordable

care act and recently, the first bill addressing the climate crisis. in her second run as speaker of the house beginning in 2019 she was one of the only people in washington going toe-to-toe against donald trump, corralling her caucus to impeach trump twice and at every step of the way refusing to back down from donald trump. he ripped up her copy of trump's 2020 state of the union speech because it was, in her words, manifesto of untruths. in 2019 she told him to his face that with him, quote, all roads lead to putin. and in the final days of the trump presidency she took charge in the midst of the worst attack on the capitol in centuries. it's a legacy that led president biden to call her the most consequential speaker in american history. a statement from the president released after her announcement reads in part, quote, when i think of nancy pelosi, i think of dignity.

in 2007 she made history as the first woman speaker but that was just the beginning of the history she has made during her four terms. i know because i have seen her in action during my career as a center, vice president, and now as president. because of nancy pelosi, the lives of millions and millions of americans are better. even in districts represented by republicans who voted against her bills and too often vilify her. that is nancy, always working for the dignity of all the people. and as a fierce defender of democracy through our laws, history will also note her fierceness and resolve to protect our democracy from the violent, deadly insurrection of january 6th. it is a threat of political violence and intimidation that continues and she and her family know all too well that that will never stop her from serving our nation. speaker nancy pelosi passing the torch to a new generation of democrats is where we start

today. ali vitali is here and annie carney is back. donna edwards is here. and with me on set for the hour, alicia menendez. donna edwards i start with you because you have served with speaker pelosi, what are your thoughts today? >> it was so moving to hear her today and also hear her talk about the expanse of her legislative career working in concert, working with three presidents, bush, obama, and, of course, president biden, on legislative agenda that was important to the american people. so when i listen to her today, she was a mentor of mine. i served on her leadership team. i learned so much from her in the way that she was able to understand the democratic caucus and to speak to the needs of the american people. and while it's a, you know,

somewhat sad day for this transition. it's one that she has managed to make sure that the transition happens in a way that continues to benefit the american people. >> ali, we've covered the rise of political violence and the threat of it as a reality for elected officials in this country. but she's lived it. let me show you some of what speaker pelosi had to say about voters rejecting violence and autocracy in last week's midterms. >> last week the american people spoke. and their voices were raised in defense of liberty, of the rule of law, and of democracy itself. [ applause ] >> with these elections the people stood in the breach and repelled the assault on democracy. they rejected violence and

insurrection. and in doing so, gave proof through the night that our flag was still there. [ applause ] >> i think those words would be powerful coming from anyone in the capitol on january 6th but for her it spans the professional and the personal. >> clearly. especially in light of what's happened in just the past few weeks because the threats didn't start and stop on january 6th. pelosi is someone who has been at the center of conservative ire for decades now. but especially during the trump era. the fact that mere two weeks before election day her husband was attacked in their home is just another reminder of the ways that the political violence in this country has hit a fever pitch and it's a stark contrast frankly when you see the fact that steve scalise was among the few republicans who was in the chamber today as pelosi said she was stepping out of leadership was striking to me, because she was so immediate and direct in

the aftermath of the attack and the shooting that steve scalise was involved with, in saying basically they had to defend their own. that we all had to come to the aid of people who were attacked in this congressional community. the fact that kevin mccarthy was not in that chamber, i think another reminder of the bad blood that exists between those two parties. but kevin mccarthy is in his own reality at the top of the field. the fact that pelosi is still going to be in the building i think for democrats gives them a leg up in how they're going to maneuver in this period of being in the minority. the other thing that struck me, throughout her speech she kept talking about the oath of office that all lawmakers take. certainly that oath was tested no more than it was on january 6th as you saw multiple members of the republican party putting democracy into question by putting the results of the election into question. but pelosi also harkening to other women throughout history

when she talked about the oath that binds all lawmakers, both present and past. she remarked on people, important women throughout history. and she also leaned on this moment in feminism. making note of the fact that as she has been in leadership, women in leadership ranks has doubled. when she was first elected in the late 1980s, there were only 23 women serving in this body. now there are five times that many in this current congress, many of them on the democratic side in large part because pelosi has been there to finance the campaigns, raise money for the campaigns and also be a mentor in female leadership as she's widely seen as one of the most effective speakers of all time, and a historic one at that. >> there is the speaker pelosi we cover who comes on all of our shows and stays maddeningly on message. >> message discipline is

stunning. >> it is central to her success. but then there's the speaker pelosi we don't see but is very much what ali just described, pulling the political levers to lift up women and high quality candidates who have really -- who will be her legacy in that chamber for years to come. >> to say nothing of the tedious work of counting votes and persuading votes. >> right. >> and making sure -- we talked about the fact that she was able to pass health care under former president obama. the fact that she was able to get through the summer of action under president biden. she did that with a five-vote majority. that is an extraordinary task. i think we're just at the beginning of contemplating what she has meant to women, to politics. there's a study that psychologists do across the world where they tell people draw me a picture of an effective leader. and nine times out of ten, people draw men. even when they don't specify

men. they use male pronouns because our idea of leadership is still so entrenched in this idea of masculinity, so in that her accomplishments that are measurable are important it's hard to measure how much it hazmat erred to see her in the public eye. i think of 2018 her walking out of that televised meeting with former president trump where she once again stood up to him. she walks out of the white house, puts on her sunglasses, buttons up her coat and that moment becomes iconic. 2019 she takes the speaker's gavel and is surrounded by children. even the footage from january 6th of her basically running -- >> let me play something. >> please. >> there's this legacy of what a successful legislaor she was. but her daughter was in there filming her mother as part of a larger project and we have some of that footage. let me play that.

>> we have got to get to finish the proceedings. there has to be some way we can maintain the sense that people have that there's some security or some confidence. that government can function and that we can elect a president of the united states. the concern we have about personal -- >> safety. >> personal safety is -- just transcends everything but the fact is on any given day they're breaking the law in many different ways. and quite frankly much of it at the instigation of the president of the united states. >> i want to punch him out. waiting for this, for trespassing on the capitol grounds. i'm going to punch him out, i'm going to go to jail and be happy. >> she's in a room with democrats and republicans, and she's clearly the one in charge. >> clearly the one in charge. as you posited to me before we

came on air, she has done that multiple times. where she has really understood the role to be third in line to the presidency. >> right. >> second in line to the presidency, how do you do the math? >> president, vice president -- yeah, the first one outside the complex. i want to relive some of her strength and standing up to trump. i think i have some of that as well. let me play this. >> i also pointed out to the president i had concerns that all roads seem to lead to putin. i tore up a manifesto of mistruths it was necessary to get the attention of the american people to say this is not true, and this is how it affects you. i don't need any lessons from anybody, especially the president of the united states, about dignity. >> sadly the person running the executive branch is a deranged, unhinged, dangerous president of

the united states. >> annie, it seems quaint that we had a debate in this country about whether it was polite to tear up his speech now that he stole documents and took them to mar-a-lago. but that was a flash point at the time, she was criticized for doing what she did. but she was fearless and she was really the most willing to stand up to him during the trump years. >> i've heard from a lot of people looking back on her accomplishments and what's she going to be best remembered for, they're putting up how she behaved in the trump years next to the health care act and the legislative victories. one thing i think notable is that she also held off impeachment for months under pressure from progressives, under pressure from democrats who wanted to go that route. i think she was very mindful of

that an impeachment that looks like it was politically motivated would be bad for the country, bad for the party. and she slow walked it. so even in her role as speaking truth to power, pointing her finger in his face, ripping up his speech, she was meticulous and careful and brought a narrow impeachment on the first one, an impeachment of facts. there was pressure for her to move faster, but she stood up for that for her belief of what's best for the country. >> i heard she developed a close relationship to liz cheney, which seems like the democracy creating strange bedfellows but i guess they are two strong, fearless women in the body. >> liz cheney is another who broke with her party because she's standing up for democracy.

they obviously have a lot in common, strong leaders who believe in country first above party. one thing that's interesting about pelosi's move today, what i heard from a lot of people close to her, is that it was really important to her that she wouldn't be re-elected by the voters of san francisco and two weeks later resign if she wasn't going to be in leadership if they lost the house. and that staying on as a rank and file member is -- you know, it cuts against the caricature that she's only after power. she tells people her first duty is to her voters in san francisco and staying on because they just elected her. it's meaningful for her and hopefully people think it's important for her legacy that it cuts against the idea that she's only interested in wielding power and she wouldn't want to be here if she didn't wield the

gavel. >> it's also a nice contrast to what's happening on the other side. john edwards i worked for george w. bush and she first became speaker when he was president and i know he always saw her as formidable. and extremely capable. i remember the first state of the union address when she was behind him and he sort of paid tribute to her. the chamber erupted. i think it was a several minute long standing ovation. the glass ceilings that have been smashed by speaker pelosi are as notable as the ones that have not been realized in the presidential category. just talk about that a little more. >> if you recall, of course you do, in the bush administration, they had to navigate some really difficult crises for the united states. of course 9/11, but also the financial crisis of 2008.

and had to work in partnership. i think what you see about speaker pelosi is that she has the ability to -- she'll have a really tough knuckle fight but she always tries to find where the sweet point is. where it is in terms of bringing on her caucus, in terms of bringing on other republicans if she needs to and working with the president and navigating what might go through the united states senate. that is a particular set of skills that not every legislator possesses, and i think it is what has contributed to her success. and then the ability to move from one fight and then go into the next one clean hands and starting all over again. and i think that she's going to be remembered for having maneuvered her caucus but also working across the aisle when it came to passing importance

legislation for the people. >> she was in a chamber that had a much more difficult covid work place challenge than even the white house, which is smaller, fewer people there. just talk about her leadership during the pandemic. >> her leadership during the pandemic, following the science, making it so members could vote by proxy. many of those safeguards she put in place are now things that the likely next speaker, kevin mccarthy, if he's able to cobble together the next 218 votes is going to reverse. i think when you think about speaker pelosi, and alyssa hit on an important point here, the idea of representation mattering. the fact this is still a pretty male dominated body the fact that pelosi has been at the apex for so long does broaden the public's understanding of what leadership could look like and frankly should look like because of the effectiveness when she's

held the gavel and even when she's out of power. the word leverage came up a lot today with my sources and lawmakers here on the hill because it's the thing that pelosi knows how to wield better than anybody else. you think about the republicans on the other side, john baner, paul ryan, the fact that they had unwielding and unruly conferences around them and they were not able to get control of them, not able to use the leverage to their advantage, contrast with pelosi who was so adapt at understanding the pulse of her caucus, understanding where republicans might need some extra votes and how she could extract something from those moments as well. that's just a sign of just how effective she is. and so the fact that she's staying around, many people have used the word bittersweet to me in talking about this because on the one hand they are losing a leader with so much

institutional knowledge of this building, how legislating works. and that's also if hakeem jeffries is the next person atop the caucus, which everyone seems he will be, he benefits from having that institutional knowledge still in the building. you watched jeffries not turn the page yet on what his plans are. he's really allowing this capitol hill complex to live in the pelosi legacy before he announces what his plans are, despite the fact that the conversation is, if pelosi would leave, the next leadership is jeffries in the number one slot, as a representation of a new era of leadership. as much as there's reverence for pelosi in this caucus, there's been a steady drum beat from many in the rank and file who say now is the time for a new era in leadership here today. >> it's a perfect example what

you're talking about her fingers on the pulse. no one is going anywhere today. in the next hour we'll speak with one of speaker pelosi's california colleagues, long serving member of the house zoe lofgren, she was in the chamber today and worked closely with the speaker for years. we'll talk about all of that and the state of play with the 1/6 committee in the next hour. next for us, what the republican party has in store for the democratic leader who will replace nancy pelosi. a look at the maga extreme gop agenda in the next congress. but new politically motivated changes in line with the maga movement coming to reshape education across our country. all those stories and more when "deadline: white house" continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere. continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere. fabric softener! wrinkle guard penetrates deep into fibers, leaving clothes so soft, wrinkles don't want to stick around. make mornings smoother with downy wrinkle guard fabric softener.

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if justice thomas really wants to deal with bullying in america, or this problem of people supposedly unwilling to accept outcomes they don't like. i have advice for justice thomas start in your home. >> kevin mccarthy has the nerve to say about anyone, lauren boebert is a mess, matt gaetz is a mess. sit this one out. >> republicans throughout the country want to make it harder to vote and easier to steal an election. >> speaker is anyone else tired of hearing the insurrectionist in chief continue to lie about the 2020 election? something is really wrong with this guy. is donald trump, a, a

pathological liar, b, a socioowe path, c, a malignant for that is cyst or d all of the above? >> i'll go with d. that was hakeem jeffries with his trademark fiery rhetoric who in the wake of house speaker nancy pelosi's decision to step back from leadership is one of or the top contender to replace her. a formidable opponent for republicans who after spending this past campaign cycle trying to convince voters that they alone can fix anything, things like inflation or gas prices, just hours after nbc news announced they had retaken the house, they laid out the agenda for the next congress. you could not make this up. for their first act they're investigating donald trump's number one delusional boogie man, the son of president biden.

hunter biden. we doubt this will have any impact on the price of milk, bread, houses or anything else. we are back. the thing about republicans, and i know this from having spent time with the republican party, is there's this notion that both parties reflect after they lose and then make adjustments. there was an autopsy -- >> i was going to say there was -- >> they go through the motions but they don't do that. you would think in the number of days it took to call the house, they would have said, if it's this close maybe we should actually do something about crime or inflation. but no they're going to investigate hunter biden. >> they're making concessions to their chaos caucus. >> marjorie taylor greene. >> yes. and what's important to understand, is mtg they thrive on the idea government can't work. so they don't want legislation

brought to the floor they can vote for. they're not looking for policy, solutions, they're looking to make a point and for them, chaos is the point. it actually services them. >> so hard to process but you're right. >> you're coming at this as a person who would want to see a proactive legislative agenda. saying look at the results of the election, clearly people have concerns they're asking you to address those concerns, get to it. that's not what the most extreme members of the caucus are here for. >> they will have met their match, annie, in jeffries. he's got the number and so skilled at tagging the republicans with the biggest loon among them. someone's alarm is going off, is everyone safe? if anyone needs to go anywhere. >> you know, democrats have a large majority. which they can use that to make kevin mccarthy, i assume, his

very narrow majority even more difficult to run. but the fact of the matter is, the democrats are in the minority. and kevin mccarthy is likely going to inherent an ungovernable conference, if he is elected to be speaker. i don't know that that's going to be the case. doesn't seem like there's another great option right now but he has his work cut out for him to convince some 30 republicans and make concessions to have him be their leader going forward. alicia is right, though. what republicans are interested in is inflicting pain on joe biden through investigations. they're not interested in passing legislation. it's about these investigations that they've been promising voters for months. but kevin mccarthy will have to actually pass some bills like funding the government. and a -- the small majority that he has does give those more extreme members more power,

because they are a larger percentage of the entire republican conference and that's going to be his path to navigate going forward. >> and you no e, donna, the whole misnomer that a fever could break on the right has been revealed as a misnomer. they'll keep getting hotter and hotter until we all melt. but the idea that they had such a catastrophic midterm that amid inflation, that causes a lot of economic pain for millions of americans and distress for just about everybody, the idea that in this climate where they were so brazenly anti-democratic they're going to continue down the rabbit holes, will be fascinating from a sort of political science standpoint. i think it's terrible for the country but to keep doing the thing that repelled the voters from your party is insanity. >> i think what has happened here is that so many of those republicans were actually

elected in districts where it was an insanity so they're bringing that back into the congress. i look back on the time that speaker pelosi served and led the minority. she was very skillful at trying to figure out ways in which she could leverage that support to get benefits for democrats with a very fractured caucus. this caucus -- this republican conference is even more fractured and i think that it isn't just about getting the benefit of 30-some votes or whatever is needed for mccarthy to become speaker. the question is how long he will be speaker, because he's not going to survive in an environment where he has to cut a deal and get democratic votes and still go up against that chaos as alicia said, chaos caucus. i don't view his leadership as

short term, i always thought of him as weak. and frankly i will be surprised should he become speaker but i don't think it'll last very long. >> ali, i wonder what the feelings are about security. you look at the footage of speaker pelosi and there are democrats and republicans in that hideaway with her, they're on the phone with the secretary of defense, the attorney general. they're calling in state national guards. and everyone is sort of trying to row the same direction. we know that 19 republicans with the white house helping to plot the coup, we know none of them participated in the investigation into how january 6th came to be. we also know they have disrespected the capitol police who protected everyone in that building that day. what are the rumblings if there are any of how kevin mccarthy approaches the security of democrats and republicans serving in the body? >> i don't think that that's the place that people have gone yet.

though certainly it's one of the obvious and immediate things they're going to have to start talking about, because everyone in this building would you agree, especially on the democratic side, that things are getting so hot right now, threats are up and that's a bad thing for american democracy. i have to look at the fact that when you look at the things that this caucus, this conference are likely to tackle. right now as we're talking marjorie taylor greene, other members of the freedom caucus are holding a meeting that they want to audit ukraine's spending and make sure not another dollar goes to ukraine. and the basic premises in government is up for conversation because of the way this caucus is likely to move forward once it has the majority officially. all of the things that annie laid out make the job of mccarthy that much harder as the man leading republicans at this

moment. also why you hear people like senator elizabeth warren and others saying this lame duck period is so important, funding the government, dealing with the debt ceiling. people who want to see the government function hold power of the house and can ensure it functions even republicans take power in the body. chaos is a fascinating one you bring up, a word that mitch mcconnell used as well but he didn't use it in a positive. the selling point on this side of the building is chaos is the point. the other side of the building, mcconnell derided the chaos, pointing it at donald trump without saying it. but making clear the chaos didn't work for republicans. so the other side of this building from where i'm standing took a different lesson from midterm elections than the house republicans did. and watching that jockeying game is going to be interesting for those of us up on the hill because it's going to make kevin

mccarthy's job harder but it's clear he has a partner on the other side, mitch mcconnell, who does not see the field the way he does. >> adam kinzinger said that kevin mccarthy single handedly resurrected donald trump when it was better for him to have been purged from our politics. to the degree republicans did so badly he's a huge political liability to republicans and mitch mcconnell came closer to saying that than kevin mccarthy ever will. ali and annie great to have your expert reporting and analysis with us today. thank you so much. donna and alicia are sticking around. up next it's not just the house gop, is it, it's the governors across the country bringing the maga culture wars to our nation's kids and schools. an attempt in virginia to whitewash history for elementary school aged kids throughout that state. r elementary school aged kids throughout that state.

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out rage today from virginia educators and democrats over what they are calling politically motivated changes to elementary school curriculum proposed this week by governor glen youngkin's new school board. just one of their proposals, according to reporting in "the washington post," included removing martin luther king jr. from holidays that students in kindergarten should learn about. after lots of criticism it appears they have added that back in. but here's one they're yet to

reverse from "the washington post," the new guide lines delete a suggestion from the previous version that kindergarteners be taught respect for diversity by learning how to work collaboratively with people of diverse backgrounds, viewpoints and experiences. joining our conversation is heidi przybyla. we miss her from when she was here. she's reported on how state legislatures have changed what can be taught in schools. donna and alicia are still here. talk me inside what's happening not just in virginia but where conservatives are trying to reach into curriculum. >> yeah. nicole, this is happening in a number of red states but it really did start here in virginia when glen youngkin was elected on the notion that critical race theory was being taught in schools. it is seen by many in the conservative movement, particularly as the enthusiasm

wains on abortion. but there's one problem, they could never define it. i did many interviews with virginia voters who couldn't explain to me what critical race theory is. what this looks like is an attempt, nicole, at using something that could be a template again in other states as well to make good on that promise of banning something that i didn't find any evidence that exists. it's notable for many reasons. i think it's a living document, it's going to get a lot of pushback, there's going to be changes to it. but it's striking how it erases the role of indigenous people. erasing, i guess they reversed it now, mlk day, there was juneteenth changing indigenous people's day back to columbus day. it appears to have a euro central focus. i saw at one point, fifth and sixth grade, about learning about continents other than europe -- >> what?

>> and then just the issue of not talking about racism. i don't know how you teach about our history of slavery, jim crow, and segregation without mentioning racism. my concern as a parent in this state and a reporter, is what are the penalties, what are the repercussions going to be for teachers in this state and other states it's happening. we had a hot line set up here that was put in place right after the campaign to rat on teachers that parents felt were violating critical race theory non-teaching rules. >> heidi, just finish this sentence for me. the goal of not teaching students all the continents is what? >> look, i'm just reading this myself. and i don't -- i don't want to

make a sweeping statement that they wouldn't learn about the other continents but they would have a euro centric -- that's what i took away from reading the article. i'm not the original reporter on it. but it seemed there's an emphasis on european culture than some of the other continents which fits into this broader narrative of what's happening here is to kind of takeaway some of the diversity that is not, i don't know, european centric. or anything when it comes to racism that doesn't frankly make america and american history look virtuous. not teaching about koe loanism, not using words like imperilism, and racism. when these things wind up being used as models in the original state and virginia is really the original state when it comes to

ground zero and campaigning this issue of critical race theory. >> donna, i remember from heidi's reporting and many others that it was proven that there was no critical race theory being taught in elementary schools in virginia. so this is about something else. and i wonder what your theory is on what that something else is. i think there has been an aggressive pushback against, you know, a nation that is increasingly diverse. you look at a state like virginia. particularly in northern virginia where you have schools where there are a couple of hundred languages that are spoken in homes in these school systems. and you see republicans in particular running more candidates for school board positions across the country so that they can begin to redirect the curriculum. and i think it is a direct push back against the changing face of the nation which is

increasingly diverse, more black, more brown, more inclusive. and you have a set of people who want to go back to the good old days where my families were not incorporated into the history that was taught in our school systems. and i think it is a wake up call because this starts at the lower level in the individual school boards and school systems, and then it moves to the state and the next thing you know it's a move across the country. >> i just interviewed whoopi goldberg about her new movie "till". about emmett till. she's been trying to have that movie made since i've known her, about nine, ten years. i said why. she said, there's such an effort to erase our history if you didn't put it out in other ways, in art, cultural, film, books, it could be lost. >> exactly. i want to underline what you and

others have said. this question of critical race theory in 2021, the virginia department of education said critical race theory is not part of the -- they are trying to solve for a problem that does not exist and in doing so they are creating a new problem. you then had the virginia education association, that's the union that represents 40,000 educators in the state of virginia saying we're really worried about this. we're worried about it for the reasons that heidi laid out, which is our job is accuracy. our job is making sure our students have an understanding of our history. >> this actually happened. >> as it actually happened so they are not want to repeat it. so the position this is putting educators in is really, i think, still there are a lot of question marks around where it goes from here because it is making it harder for them to do their job and making it harder for our kids to have a full understanding education that they need and deserve. >> it's an amazing thing to see

glen youngkin who rode this, in complete contradiction with what the virginia educators say is happening there. it's amazing to see him try to grab it back as desantis is ascending. >> this is what you and i keep talking about. it's easy to say that trump and trumpism is over because they have caught onto the fact that he may not be the winner he is suggesting he is. but it is alive in folks like youngkin and desantis within the party. it's in every form, the don't say gay bill in florida, that you have desantis putting migrants on planes. and having a police force --. >> it's like competent trumpism, seems like an oxymoron. no one is going anywhere. it's not just virginia. it's not just a proposal. how a conservative school board has taken over south carolina

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visit coventrydirect.com. did you know if you turn to cold with tide you can save up to $150 a year on your energy bill? how? the lower the temp, the lower your bill. tide cleans great in cold and saves money? i am so in. save $150 when you turn to cold with tide. it is so unbelievable how this is going, and we voted for these people. what is the cause dr. richardson is being removed, terminated? >> i'm not going to discuss personnel matters in -- >> okay. i don't know why you want to terminate somebody without giving them a reason. >> this was one of the three

board members in berkeley county, south carolina, who walked out of a meeting along with audience members after several major six backed by the conservative activist group moms for liberty. within two hours, the school board had voted to fire the district's first black superintendent, terminate the district's lawyer, ban critical race theory, and set up a committee to decide whether certain books and materials should be banned from schools. heidi, dawn in and elise are back. heidi, what do we know about how this happened and who this group is? >> it looks like a lot of these groups are backed by conservative think tanks. moms for liberty is going and trying to put members of their own choosing into school boards all across the country. and they're backed by conservative think tanks according to the nbc story like the goldwater institute. the problem here is there

doesn't seem to be a counter weight to this to the left or even in the mainstream. what you see instead are people who are leaving school boards because it's a very frustrating job to be constantly pounded by these individuals who want to ban books, who are pushing this issue of bathroom wars, and people are hanging up their hats and they're being replaced by these -- taking documents from conservative think tanks on these ultra war issues. and the bottom line for a loft parents in these areas is you're going to have to pay more attention to who's on the ballot down the ballot. you can't go into the booth and just pay attention to the top of the ticket in a lot of these local races. it seems that a lot of the parents there didn't necessarily approve of this. there were audible gasps in the room. people were not happy. and this is being organized at a

much higher level. on the left, it doesn't seem there is a counter. >> donna, i think because it's hard to fathom that the depths of depravity on the right would extend into all the areas they do, right? we had this discussion two years ago about local election boards. why are they putting an elect denier so there has to be a counter. what should the response be to this highly politicized takeover moves from the far right backed as heidi said conservative think tanks? >> i think it's a reminder to us that it's important to pay attention from the top to the bottom of the ballot. school board races have been traditionally nonpartisan all across this country. but the fact is that conservative think tanks are putting materials in the hands of activists in local communities. they're running people for school board, and frankly, the left, forget it.

the middle can't afford to just let these things go by. there need to be a source of candidate recruitment. keep in mind that the way conservatives have operated is they run you for school board, and then they run you for county council and then they run you for congress. so it should not go without notice that the importance of these elections even at the most local level and the impact of course that it has on our students. our parents need to wake up. >> and we have to do a good job from our standpoint of covering these stories. there is a lot of this extremism all over i. >> all over. it strikes me i do think there is some counter weight to this. i'm thinking about run for something which runs candidates up and down the ballot. i think the question is what is the objective here. is the objective of the groups that are funding something like moms for liberty actually to change the nature of what is happening in schools. is that primary or is that secondary to activating a group of parents, moms specifically --

there was one article that referenced women ages 20 to 30 and weaponizing their fear into political action. what is actually the primary objective. >> it's amazing. amazing. thanks to all of you for having this conversation with us. heidi, donna, alicia. when we come back, congresswoman zoe leff green and the big story on the changes for the democrats. and what is next for the january 6th select committee. don't go anywhere. we will be right back. l be righ. you want what's yours. that's why tide loads of hope is expanding to provide clean clothes to more people in crisis. with every purchase of tide hygienic clean you can help too. if you have this... consider adding this. an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan from unitedhealthcare. medicare supplement plans help by paying some of what medicare doesn't... and let you see any doctor. any specialist. anywhere in the u.s. who accepts medicare patients.

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it is unambiguous that the vice president does not have the

authority to reject electors. there is no suggestion of any kind that it does. there is no mention of rejecting or objecting to electors anywhere in the 12th amendment. >> was it your impression that the vice president had directly conveyed his position on these issues to the president not just to the world through a dear colleague letter, but directly to president trump? >> many times. >> and he had been in consistent in conveying his position? >> many times. >> many times. hi, everyone. it's 5:00 in new york. it is the focus of the third public hearing by the january 6th select committee. how the vice president refused to give in to the ex-president's desperate incessant demands to overturn the results of the 2020 election, and by doing so, ultimately ensured the peaceful transition of power. we heard testimony from those closest to mike pence, some of what you just heard there about the intense pressure campaign

waged by the former president, and how pence would not go along with this illegal scheme. the committee showed us never before seen footage of mike pence in a loading dock, hiding in a safe location as reuters entered the capitol building, refusing to get in the car. we saw the infamous vade owes of trump supporters chanting "hang mike pence." as for testimony from the former vp himself, he now says the committee, quote, has no right to it. take a look. >> i served for 12 years in the congress. it's inconceivable to me that one party would appoint every member of a committee in congress. that's antithetical to the whole idea of the committee system. that being said, i never stood in the way of senior members of my team cooperating with the committee and testifying. but congress has no right to my testimony. >> you're closing the door on that entirely? >> i'm closing the door on that. . >> because running for president? pence's answer conveniently leaves out the fact that it was

republican leader kevin mccarthy is responsible for the committee being what it is. a point which the committee was quick to point out, releasing a statement last night, which read in part, quote, the select committee has proceed respectfully and responsibly in our engagement with vice president pence. so it is disappointing that he is misrepresenting the nature of our investigation while giving interviews to promote his new book. every member of the select committee supported the creation of an independent bipartisan commission after initially supporting such a commission, leader mccarthy withdrew his support, and the bipartisan plan to rate the commission was defeated by republicans in the senate. the select committee was only formed after the proposal for an outside commission was defeated. the select committee has consistently praised the former vice president's refusal to bow to former president trump's pressure to illegally refuse toe count electoral votes on january 6th. but his recent statements about the select committee are not accurate.

meanwhile, the fight for donald trump's testimony continues as the select committee works to wrap up its investigation before it concludes with the start of the next congress. it's where we begin the hour with congresswoman zoe leff green of california, a member of the house january 6th committee. she was seated prominently today during house speaker nancy pelosi's speech in the house chamber, and she was the first member that speaker pelosi greeted as soon as she finished her address. congresswoman, we want to talk about the select committee. but first, your reaction. your thoughts and your feelings listening to speaker pelosi today. >> well, the speech she gave was wonderful, and she is the most effective speaker of the house i think in the history of the united states. we have operated with very tiny margins, and with that, we have delivered enormously impactful legislation that will tremendously improve the lives of americans from the bipartisan

infrastructure bill, the chips and science bill, the inflation reduction act, even the affordable care act back when obama was president. i mean, a remarkable speakership. and she is a remarkable person. i respect her decision, but clearly, she will be very much missed. >> where does the steeliness come from? >> well, i don't know, but she was the only girl and youngest in her italian american family, and i think she had to learn to stand up for herself in that family. i mean, she is devoted to her family herself. being the mother of five isn't the easiest thing in the world, and she is just -- she said today, she never expected to be in elected office, and certainly never expected to be speaker of the house. but she is committed to public

service and really to children. when she works on things, even if it has to be something very tough, she'll say well, it's for the children. and she means it. she has been guided by that. i'll never forget when she first became speaker. and on opening day, people bring their children and grandchildren to the floor. and after she gave her speech, took the gavel, she invited children up. and pretty soon it was her children and grandchildren. and then it was democrats, and then it was republicans. pretty soon she was surrounded by this huge number of children. and that has really -- that has fueled her public service for all these many years. i respect her so much. >> i had heard and i asked some of the reporters on the last hours on this, and i wonder if

you can share anything, that she has through the duration of the select committee's work developed a pretty close relationship with liz cheney. can you answer that? and speak more broadly about her support, which we don't see so much behind the scenes of the january 6th select committee. >> well, she is always there to support our decisions. and i think when she had the idea of supporting liz cheney to the committee, i thought it was a good idea. and i don't know that they were particularly close. and i'm not suggesting they're close today. but certainly, they have a very positive professional relationship. that i think they both value. i know there is respect in both directions. >> i want to ask you about something that adam kinzinger said on this program yesterday. cassidy hutchinson was in georgia yesterday testifying in that criminal investigation into the efforts to overthrow the election there. and i asked how dangerous cassidy hutchinson is to donald

trump as a criminal fact witness, and he said very dangerous. and then he said something interesting about the women who came forward and cooperated fulsomely with the committee, and that it was different than the cooperation and the sort of willingness to tell the full story of trump's conduct and anti-democratic behavior between the election and the insurrection. i asked him why that was. he didn't have an answer. do you? >> well, i think that's a little bit of an overstatement. certainly cassie hutchinson is an example of that. there were some witnesses and people will see when we release all of the evidence that not all of the women who came forward are in that category. but certainly the young women who did step forward told the truth very forthrightly. and i think made a big difference for our investigation and ultimately for the country by, you know, they were

harassed. they were threatened, and yet they stepped forward. cassie hutchinson stepped forward and told the truth. and i'm sure -- she was there. she was a trumper to the very end. she was there on the day that the peaceful transfer of power took place. so she was certainly all in as a conservative republican. but she couldn't countenance lying. and i respect her for that. >> congresswoman, can you take us inside what is happening now? are there criminal referrals being drafted? >> we -- as i think we mentioned before, we have a subcommittee of the committee that's made up with all the lawyers on the committee, including me. and we are going through the evidence and then comparing it to criminal statutes. and then we're going to make a recommendation to the full committee. that process isn't done yet. >> but no one has ruled out

criminal referrals to the justice department for donald trump, is that correct? >> that's correct. >> are you looking at his refusal to abide by the subpoena? could he be referred for that separately? >> well, let me say we haven't finished the process. all of the referrals civil and criminal will follow after our subcommittee makes a recommendation. the fact that we made a recommendation doesn't mean that everyone else on the committee will agree. but we haven't really gotten to that point either. we're working as hard adds we can. as you know, we're writing our report. we're editing. we're doing addendums. we're trying to figure out how to roll this out. so we're working really hard, as hard as we can. >> and will the roll-out of the report be as multimedia and as produced as the other highly effective and produced hearings of the summer were? >> i can't say that. i mean, obviously, the

announcements to the chair and vice chair. but there will be a multimedia element. there is going to be a regular written report that's goes on a shelf and a few people read it. and then there will be something that's more accessible to the american public that be multimedia. and how we roll it out, i can't say at this point. >> through the summer and into the fall, you were one of the more forthcoming members about the active nature of the investigation into the secret service, both what they withheld and what they ultimately produced to the committee and the private counsel they retained. congressman kensinger seemed to go farther and say -- let me play what he said yesterday about secret service. >> there is somebody lying at the secret service. let's be very clear. there is some really kind of interesting going ones at least with some of the people, and we're not going to let that go. thor thing too, keep in mind, even whatever we can't finish on the committee, if it is criminal

in nature, doj could take that or could see the report we put out and make a decision to go forward from there. >> it feels very much like the committee's views its work as a handoff, that you are still -- you're still investigating the secret service. is that right? >> there are still interviews going on about the secret service. and i'll just say this. they're there are inconsistencies. there are inconsistencies between testimony. there is inconsistencies -- you know, we received over a million pieces, over a million pieces of information finally from the secret service. and some of that isn't consistent with testimony. you know, whether it's lying, whether it's faulty memory, what, it's very difficult to say at this point. but it doesn't completely square up. let me just say that. >> and is the testimony, the public testimony from cassidy

hutchinson about the conduct of the ex-president and his agents in the car among the incidents that is still being probed by the select committee? >> remember, she never said that it happened. she said she was told by mr. ornato. i think it's important to say she was relaying what she was told. it's very clear that we've received multiple pieces of information from multiple source, that the ex-president, former president wanted to go to the capitol. there was plan to go to the capitol. i mean, rudolph giuliani was telling cassie hutchinson on january 2nd it's going to be great. we're going the capitol. we had evidence there was a big delay before the president went back to the west wing. there was a heated argument about going to the capitol.

and the vehicles were kept, you know, outside of the white house waiting to go to the capitol for an extended period of time after the then president trump got back to the west wing. so all of that is we have multiple sources, and it's been publicly disclosed. so that is a significant issue. whether all of what ms. hutchinson was told correct, i don't know. but i'm confident she relayed what she was told. she might have not been told what was accurate. we're not sure yet. >> because men exaggerating the depths of their physical altercations is a story as old as time. it's so interesting that that's still active. or maybe not exaggerating, but that's still part of the probe. it's just a fascinating detail. congresswoman zoe lofgren on a very busy and important day in the chamber. thank you very much very much for making some time to talk to us. >> thank you very much. take care.

happy thanksgiving. >> happy thanksgiving to you. joining our conversation, miles teller, co-founder of the political party forward. with me at the table, katty kay, u.s. special correspondent for bbc studios and msnbc contributor, plus former kentucky senate account, retired marine corps colonel amy. we don't have your most important title, amy. the effort you ran to make sure that the people in charge of our elections, the secretaries of state was not wildly successful. congratulations. tell me how that happened and why it worked and how you feel. >> really, it was my team and i. we looked at what this threat to democracy as it was developing in the spring, you know these election deniers that were on the ballots in these key swing states around the country ended four of them got through the primaries. and in minnesota -- >> nevada?

>> nevada, arizona, michigan, and minnesota. and so we were very concerned about this. we decide look, we can't just keep talking about it. i'm a person of action, right? that's what i do. this is my next mission. we've got make sure these guys don't get into office to oversee our elections, particularly for 2024. that's so important. we know that that was the path that donald trump wanted to take. >> that was the plan. >> so we got in gear. we launched the american sos project. we worked with a lot of other organizations like the lincoln project, and i vote around the country the make sure, get the resources, put them to good use, and really make sure that voters know that these guys are extreme and that they're anti-democratic. that's what we did. >> did you -- we ran one of your early -- your first ad actually on the show yesterday. we don't build statues in washington to secretaries of state. should we change that? do you think has to stay on the

radar now, that we have to remain vigilant? >> i do. because, look, public servants, we need to have people of integrity in these positions. and there are so many of them that are so important to the functioning of our government. i mean, you were talking about it earlier. just the fact that former vice president mike pence doesn't want to testify. that -- >> it's nuts. >> he is not doing what a public servant should be doing. >> right. >> it's in our constitution, you know, that congress has this ability. and so we need to make sure that we have persons of integrity that really care about our democracy getting into these positions. >> it's amazing that pence is guided by something now that you just have to put on the table. he wants to be president in a republican party where they're not as into donald trump, but they're still pretty into him. and to take -- to want to take -- and i think everyone is

grateful that he did the right thing. he did his duty on january 6th. the committee has linized him for doing that, and the committee is clearly bipartisan. he knows liz cheney and adam kinzinger well. but still to play politics and refuse to talk to them seems cutting back down the gutter. >> i think he is in an impossible position with the base, and yet he still seems to be wanting to walk a line where he keeps some of donald trump's supporters happy. but from my reporting this summer, and kudos for amy spotting this on the secretary of state. i spent a day with mark finchem in june. >> oh, wow. >> traveling around arizona. what was fascinating is how much money there was in his campaign. that was this june. i think then democrats really started funneling money in over the summer. so the efforts that amy put in raising money did make a difference in that race. but i remember being in a trump merchandise store in show low, arizona. and about a quarter of the merchandise in that store was hang mike pence, mike pence was

a traitor. and these were die-hard trump supporters selling cutouts of trump as rambo for $100 that they couldn't keep in the shop because they were selling so fast. but the thing that really struck me the most is pence is a traitor merchandise that they were also selling. when i asked them about it, they said well, he is a traitor. we see him as much as a traitor as we would see any democrats and the january 6th investigation is a sham investigation. i don't really see why pence is walking this line, because it's not a line he can walk. >> it's so interesting. myles, how do you see it? >> well, i see it the way i saw mike pence when he was vice president of the united states. we saw the past couple of days that mike pence was brave enough to go talk about january 6th in his book. he was brave enough to do television introduce. he was brave enough to do a cnn town hall, but he is not brave enough to go talk to the american people's representatives in congress. and nicolle, that's the same mike pence i got to know in the

trump administration, the man who always had the courage to keep his mouth shut when it mattered most. so that's the mike pence that we're still seeing today. i think it's going to hurt him if he tries to run for president of the united states, including the fact that all he did here was run out the shock clock until it was clear republicans could win the house. and then he didn't have to go testify. that looked very cowardly to me. and i think that cowardice is going to come back on the campaign trail, because congress has a right to this information. but i want to add one caveat to what amy said earlier. and i'm a huge amy mcgrath fan, which is a crazy thing to come from me as an ex-republican, but she has done incredible work in this campaign cycle. we are so grateful for the fight she put up. but i want to sound one note of caution. over at forward, we tracked 250 radicals in this cycle, election deniers and qanoners. half of those radicals made to it the primaries. and then of those, 30% of the total of the 250 ended up winning their races. maybe not in the battleground,

but it shows we've got qanoners and election deniers who are actually winning. we have a january 6th planner who just won his election to the u.s. congress. so bad guys are still winning. this was in a lot of ways good for democracy, but we've got to stay incredibly vigilant and do the democracy reforms that make it hard for these extremists to win in the primaries, like rank choice voting and open primaries. >> i want to get all of you -- we need to get a quick break. but i do on the other side want to understand from all three of you how we should talk about what was achieved last tuesday and how we should talk what is still left to do in terms of protecting democracy. so put a pin in that. no one is going anywhere. when we come back, voters did make voting a top issue in the but as miles alluded to, not everyone got the message. kari lake who lost the race to be arizona's governor still has not conceded. on the contrary, she seems to be the one taking a page from the trump playbook, promising to

correct the many wrongs she says took place in the governor's race. it's another tragic sign that the big lie is still infecting our politics. later in the hour, protests in iran now into their third month and growing wider and more intense and violent. we'll speak with the iranian american journalist and human rights activist that could eventually topple the islamic regime. deadline white house continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere. r a quick bre. don't go anywhere. decor fro. washable rugs up to 80% off. and living room seating up to 65% off. search, shop, and save at wayfair! ♪ wayfair you've got just what i need ♪ super emma just about sleeps in her cape. but when we realized she was battling sensitive skin, we switched to tide hygenic clean free. it's gentle on her skin and out-cleans our old free detergent. tide hygenic clean free. hypoallergenic and safe for sensitive skin.

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election in november? >> i'm going to win the election and i will accept that result. >> if you lose, will you accept that? >> i'm going to win the election and i will accept that result. >> something happens when you become indiscernible from your "snl" character, which she has. we all saw it a mile away. predictable. frankly, pathetic, when your candidacy for political office is predicated on denying the results of a free and fair election, which there is no evidence this was anything but. and then your candidacy subsequently fails, one can rightly expect a challenge of the results. that's why today the nation rolled its eyes at kari lake. she is the projected loser of the arizona governor's race. true to form, she is refusing to concede, alleging improper election day something. in the video this morning, lake shared a single anecdote about long lines at polling place, a polling place. and she is putting together, quote, the best and brightest legal team to explore ways to,

quote, correct the many wrongs that have been done this week. we're back with miles, katty and amy. miles, kari lake is now less democratic, more authoritarian than doug mastriano, which is something i would ever utter. but that's where we are. mastriano has conceded his gubernatorial effort against josh shapiro. i think it took him five days. what does -- what happens in arizona, a place where there has been a lot of big lie activity? >> i don't know what happens, nicolle. kari lake is kind of like a voodoo doll and pollstering doll had a baby. she'll say the same trump lines we've heard over and over like we heard with that reporter. i do worry she is going to be the one who takes this election denialism into the next generation and giving it new life. and that's what we have worried about in the lead-up to these midterm elections, that we would

have people who contest their results, even though there is no need to contest them if they've lost fair and square. it seems like kari lake is really poised to do that. and i think that gives a lot of concern because arizona is a tinderbox right now. i'm in arizona at the moment for related political efforts, and there is a lot of tension here in the air in the state because of her comments and words. and of course, nicolle, it's not just kari lake. we've got some of these other elections we're watching where others could follow suit. right now lauren boebert i think is only 600 votes ahead of frisch. but if those numbers changed, that might be another person we see the kari lake line spouted from. so this isn't over yet. and we can only hope that people do concede like tim ryan did very graciously in ohio. >> you know, there is this feeling that we donnelled a political bullet, right, that last tuesday came and went, and that the people that haven't conceded their defeats are the

outliers. but then you think january 6th took two months to brew. it built and it built and then it happened. what are you watching? >> as miles said, i'm watching arizona too, because that did become ground zero of the election denialism. and kari lake's whole campaign, whole political career really is based on denying the results of the 2020 election. i don't see where she goes. >> right. >> her only option now is to carry on fighting that because she didn't -- i spent time with her when i was in arizona. she talked about the wall and she talked about abortion. but when i saw her out trying to win voters at a campaign event with a retirement community, really i'd say 70% of her message was about the fact that the election was stolen. when i interview her afterwards, she couldn't find the evidence. it's like throwing jelly at a wall. it's incredibly frustrating because the evidence never come. >> right. >> but the promise -- >> the platitudes. >> right. she has one line. and she is incredibly effective.

she is actually a very effective campaigner. she walked into this room of retirees in arizona and she had them eating out of the palm of her hand. they knew her from television. she was very poised. i was the only journalist there and she didn't love that and kept calling me out. i do worry about arizona. mark finchem also hasn't conceded. what happens if mark finchem and kari lake don't. they have millions of people who supported them in the state. what do they do with that support. >> this is sort of that uncomfortable tension between democracy having a very good day last week, americans not wanting to go along with this lurch toward authoritarian practices. but feeling like there is still a whole lot of angst and a whole lot of work the be done. >> absolutely. we won the battle. we didn't win the war. these elect deniers aren't going away with one election. and, you know for, those of us that love our democracy, whether

you are independent or republican like miles or used to be, or a democrat like myself, you know, we care about this country, and we have to keep fighting. i think that's the most important thing. and the other concern that i have is not just these election deniers, but what has been proven over and over again is that the mainstream republican party leadership is willing to go along with this. >> worse, they enable it, right? >> enable it or are silent. i ran against some of these guys. i ran them pour the house race against a guy who is just as silent about it. >> mike pence campaigned with don bolduc. even though he stood up on january 6th and did what was right by the constitution, it didn't stop him from going out and campaigning with election deniers. >> incredible. well, this conversation is to be continued as well. miles teller, thank you for spending time with us. katty and amy, we'll be back in the hour. when we come back, protests

in iran growing in intensity and violence. our next guest says it could be the beginning of the end of the islamic republic. masih alinejad joins us after a quick break. you won't want to miss this. at humana we believe your healthcare should evolve with you and part of that evolution means choosing the right medicare plan for you. humana can help. with original medicare you are covered for hospital stays and doctor office visits but you'll have to pay a deductible for each. a medicare supplement plan can

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in iran, authorities there are being more aggressive, more brutal in their efforts against anti-government protesters. a third month of demonstrations and they show no sign of backing

down. earlier this week a first known death sentence was handed down to a protester linked to the country's judiciary was found guilty of setting a government office on fire and causing, quote, destruction and corruption on earth. according to the u.n. high commission on human rights, at least ten protesters have been charged with offenses that carry the death penalty. questions are swirling as to how the iranian regime will handle the thousands and thousands of people who have been arrested for their roles in the protest, just protesting. which started after 22-year-old mahsa amini died in police custody after failing to comply with the country's strict dress code. well, independent reporting is suppressed in iran, the u.s.-based organization human rights activist news agency said that 15,800 protesters have been detained, and at least 344 have been killed since these demonstrations began in september. nbc news is not able to verify the numbers independently.

general list masih alinejad, a voice of resistance and a leader to many of these young people in iran joins us now. masih, tell us what's happening. >> it's beyond sad, you know. as you mentioned, the regime is getting more brutal. the crackdown is getting more aggressive. but the more that they kill people, they create more anger. just yesterday, they killed a 10-year-old son, a boy called kian. i was just watching his video. i couldn't stop crying, but when i see that their family are brave. and another young man got killed, today his father took to the street and were just celebrating, like showing victory and saying, you know, my son sacrificed his life for iran, for freedom. this is something that you just read in book about like heroes.

but the revolution is taking place in iran. iranian regime killing more people, and people are getting more braver and taking back to the streets. >> what -- what can be done to help them, to, i don't know, can anything be done to help them is a better question. >> of course, of course. i had a meeting with president macron. i just came back from paris. and that was the same question. first of all, the leaders of democratic countries should recognize this as a revolution, as it is. this is just the beginning of the end. when teenagers are getting killed, when a schoolgirls and schoolboys are getting killed, but the day after, they take back to the streets and saying that we want to end this regime, this is called a revolution. but we need a specific hub. first, you know, there is a petition going around, almost got a million signatures. iranians are asking the leaders of g7 to kick out the

diplomatics, the iranian officials. right now i'm talking to you, the children of the ayatollahs are here. we've been all witnessing how the leaders of democratic country isolate putin. >> right. >> no? >> right. >> this is the same. a war has been imposed on iranian people. >> children, right. >> every day innocent people are getting killed. this is called war. and more important than this, iranian regime is helping putin to kill innocent ukrainians. that is why we actually called the democratic countries. we call the west. this is the time. you have to address khomeini the same way you address putin. >> what did macron say? did he commit to do more? >> to be honest, i actually invited two young women to be with me. i asked president macron to look into their eyes and their faces. i told him these are the new face of iran. one of them, her mother just got

killed recently right after the brutal death of massa. but she was very brave. you cannot believe me. i was crying by listening to her story while she was talking to president macron. and you know what she said? she brought a picture of her mother. she said mr. president, i want you to not shake the hand of those who killed my mom. i want you to recognize us and our revolution, and he did. now france the first actually leader of g7 to recognize us as a revolution. but we want more, you know. because he can call his ally. biden administration can call their own allies as well to isolate the islamic republic. they can -- still i want to see in new york that my fellow sisters, michelle obama had a successful campaign bring our girls back. you remember? they can do the same i know. >> for iran? >> yes.

i had a meeting with hillary clinton as well the other night. >> yeah. >> i asked her the same. because now i see a shift. i mean, a change of tune among policymakers in america, less the liberals, the republicans, they finally see this as bipartisan issue. but we need action. >> it's interesting that it's challenging because iran is a threat. i mean, a threat to u.s. foreign policy. when you have these conversations with leaders, do you meet resistance? or do you meet just a lack of awareness. >> a lack of awareness first. for instance, president macron was saying you know, foreign country cannot do anything to bring regime change for you. wait a minute. we don't want you to bring regime change for us. but while people of iran are managing to have regime change, to kick out these barbaric regime, you're actually shaking the hands of these murderers, and that means you're taking sides, you know. and still the same, you know.

there are many leaders around the world. they think that. if they support iranian protesters, they might send the wrong signal to iranian regime, and they might put the life of protesters in danger. this is the narrative of the islamic republic. this is a gender apartheid regime. how you can, democrats is all about feminism, women's rights. the west, share the values of these people in the streets. >> who are risking their lives. >> exactly. they're risking their lives to save the rest of the world from one of the most dangerous regimes. because iran is in iraq, yemen, everywhere. >> and they're providing weapons for putin in ukraine. >> exactly. >> will you come back? i will say it can be a challenging story to cover. it's challenging to -- it's so dangerous for the protesters to speak out. there so we'll rely on you to be our eyes and ears if you will. >> i don't know how to thank you for not abandoning iran and iranian people.

thank you so much. >> you're making me cry. masih, thank you so much for spending time with us for sure. we're going bring back our friends katty kay and amy mack grat in a moment. don't go anywhere. ♪ from holiday hills, illinois to rudolph, wisconsin.

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policy mind, but she is also a very sophisticated activist. and to take the message of what the iranian people and iranian women are trying to do to michelle obama, to hillary clinton is a smart and powerful one. >> yeah. and she is the one that is getting the video. to the extent that they can, the activists who are risking their lives every single day, and we shouldn't forget that, and who are being brutally beaten. they're being taken from the hospital beds the they're injured. the doctors who are treating them are also being threatened. the clampdown is horrific. and it's really tough for them. but she is the one they are sending their video to. as you pointed out, she is our conduit to covering the story. she is our eyes and ears when we can't get there ourselves. she makes the strong point, how are we going get more coverage of this story, which is hard to cover. we need it for the iranian people to have a difference. because there are not millions of them on the streets as there were for the fall of the shay. it's tens of thousands so far. but for that to grow into the

revolution, the topplesing of the regime that those protesters are wanting twhierks need to have this on the news every day, and she would be the way to get that story out. >> how do we do a better job? >> it's very hard. in the bbc, we can't be there. we have bbc persian, but our journalists have become under pressure themselves. mi5 has just come out and said there have been 10 attempts against british iranians on british soil. she must have security, because they are reaching out to people who are trying to drive coverage of the protests globally. that doesn't mean we shouldn't do it, it's dangerous for them as well. >> it is so extraordinary. we're talking about voters really understanding the importance of these midterms to our democracy. it's clear too that americans still see themselves connected to democracies around the world. we see it's waned a little bit, but there is still deep interest in ukraine and deep interest in making sure that putin doesn't have his way there. and people do care very much about people risking their lives

in iran. >> and we should. that's what america is all about. and you know, in iran, it's the young generation. >> right. >> it's the young girls that are standing up. >> and dying. >> standing up against this fascist religious regime, and dying. so we should be standing with them. we should be showing the world what the iranian regime is doing to them and standing behind them. >> as a foreign policy question, it's not easy. they're very sanctioned already. we've put enormous amounts of sanctions on russia. it hasn't stopped them invading ukraine and brutalizing parts of ukraine. apart from building constant awareness of the story, it's hard to see how much influence. >> her point, though, was due to the iranian diplomats, what you've done to putin's. her point is you can always do more. do you think we will? >> i think it depends partly on how much coverage of there is of the story. the iranian nuclear deal, amy and i were talking the break, it's dead in the water at this

point. it's just not possible for the west to reengage on any level while these protests are going on. and the protests show no sign of stopping. their courage to come out and do something. she has said it might sound bizarre that i'm campaigning against a head scarf. that head scarf is in itself the symbol of oppression. without the head scarf, that regime will fall. >> i want to come back to extraordinary women here at home. speaker pelosi's speech today. your thoughts. >> you know, have i so much respect for speaker pelosi. she took an oath to defend the constitution of the united states of america against all enemies, foreign and domestic, just like i did in the military. and she has lived you know? she defended the capitol. she is about this country. she is a beacon of democracy, not only here in our country, but around the world. and i just have a tremendous respect for her, and i'm excited to see the new -- newer

leadership of the democratic party as well, but let's not discount just the amazing tenacity and awesomeness of nancy pelosi. seriously. >> speaking about america and democracy around the world, didn't she just go to taiwan against the recommendation of some? she really is -- >> interesting she had the support of republicans in the senate. mitch mcconnell supported her move. the white house was not so keen on it. she's prepared to toe her own path as well. >> she is for a declaration that putin is a state sponsor of terror. her foreign policy that has become even steelier. >> in a way her foreign policy reminds us of what perhaps the republican foreign policy used to be. in some ways like mccain. >> so crazy. so crazy. what a moment. so nice to have you here in the studio with us. thank you so much. we have to sneak in a quick break. we'll be right back.

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fate may do what it wants welcome but this much is settled -- in our right minds, we know that love is at the heart of all things. many understandably pray for a strength they do not possess, but god's promise is somewhat different, that even when strength fails, there is perseverance, and even when perseverance fails, there is hope. and even when hope fails there is love, and love never fails.

>> love never fails. all my love today i'm sending to the family and friends and colleagues of that man. that was the kindhearted, good natured smart as a whip michael gerson. the world learned this morning that gerson -- he was a speechwriter for george w. bush. that's when i got to know him. he imbued suture clarity, so much right and wrong into moments and speeches in 9/11. he died at a washington area hospital from complications of cancer. he was only 58 years old. a complete list of reasons to admire michael gerson would take us all night, so we'll be brave. michael gerson was a man of immense character, of principle. he was a student of theology, and virtue. he was honest and wrote about his own struggles with depression. he became a valued and well read

columnist at "the washington post." as white house communications director, to sit next to him and match words for a moment of slice for our country. again, we are all thinking of him and his family and his incredible contributions to our democracy here at home, which he never stopped hoping for and fighting for. quick break for us. we'll be right back.

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thank you so much for letting us into your homes during these extraordinary triem times. we are grateful. "the beat" wit