>> another anti-semite. >> a source tells nbc news that trump was very impressed with fuentes who he claims he did not know beforehand. >> he's a type of defense for trump when trying to escape accountability. >> he's done this. >> remember in 2016 during his campaign for president trump said he didn't know david duke and the kkk when he was asked to denounce the hate group. >> i don't know what group you're talking about. you wouldn't want me to condemn a group that i know nothing about. i would take a look. if you send me a list of the groups i would disavow them. >> the you can ku klux klan. >> i don't know david duke. >> really?

>> he did know david duke. >> can you imagine actually saying that he didn't know the klan? didn't know about the klan? just like he said he doesn't know about qanon and the proud boys. it's unbelievable. >> while trump claimed not to know him he had previously denounced duke 16 years earlier when trump ran for president as a member of the reform party. so when it was convenient -- you get the rest. >> right. >> let's bring in nbc news correspondent vaughn hilliard, politico's jonathan lemire and al sharpton. >> i know you're a reporter so i'll say it. we around this table know donald trump is lying that he knew who his guests were just like he knew who david duke was, but even if you were one of these people that liked to be lieded to by donald trump you have to

stare down the inescapable that today there is reporting that trump refuses, despite his staff members telling him, you have to condemn this guy, trump refuses to defend this neo-nazi, this white supremacist, this holocaust denier because he doesn't want to offend him or any of his followers. >> let's look at it this way, guys. i think we have internal conversations here as a news organization often about how much hay do we make when a white nationalist and white supremacist goes on stage alongside the likes of a marjorie taylor green or paul gosar. these are fringe members of congress and when you start to have this individual appearing for dinner alongside the former president of the united states and the leading candidate for the republican party for president in 2024 this is no

longer fringe. nobody can claim that nick fuentes is an individual with the platform. along with ye who has million of followers and this is an individual when you go back to 2017 when you hear donald trump using the phrase very fine people to reference the charlottesville event. one of those individuals on the white nationalist side was this individual here, nick fuentes. earlier this year i was at cpac in orlando, the conservative political action committee conference where republicans have long gone to and nick fuentes was holding his own white nationalist conference across the street and on to the best of myself trying to ignore taking place i watched it for hours as individual and after speaker after speaker espoused these anti-semitic views quite loudly. he says white young men are the

secret sauce for taking back america. i just want to read you this quote here. we are going to take power in this country. we're going to do it within my life time. we are coming for you. your days in power are numbered. you think you can replace us? you're wrong. we will replace you. that is the man who had dinner last week with the former president of the united states. >> and not just any dinner. dinner at mar-a-lago which former president trump calls his florida white house, his southern white house program this is the place where classified documents were seized by the fbi that the president had taken, stolen from areas where these documents are kept in our government, office buildings and in the white house, and brought them to mar-a-lago. this is where he's having dinner now with white supremacists and antisemites. >> jonathan lemire, he refuses

any condemnation of this guy and it's the same thing with, you know, it's the same thing with kanye west, but there is a strange silence and even if a guy like mike pompeo won't condemn and afraid it say trump's name and marjorie taylor greene, yeah, she's a fringe member and she stops being a fringe member when kevin mccarthy is triking deals with her, so he becomes speaker of the house. >> this strain of white nationalism is becoming more central to what today's republican party is about. >> marjorie taylor greene is about to become a very important member of congress as republicans are about to take the majority there in the house and for trump, and his refusal to condemn the hateful rhetoric and hateful people because he doesn't want to alienate those supporters, his ceiling as a

candidate may be lower, but he's trying to harden that floor. he's trying to play to the lowest common denominator to try to keep some supporters in check. so, vaughn, we remember when trump was president the phenomenon would be your reporters would go up to the hill to get reaction from republican lawmakers there, no, i haven't seen the tweet. they didn't want to address it because they knew nothing good could come of it and we're seeing this phenomenon and it was sure thanksgiving weekend and it was easier for lawmakers to hide from reporters and when they start appearing in front of cameras again. do you think that anything would be different this time around? >> you have congressman comer that donald trump showed a better judgment and this is a grown man and i have to go back this last year and it was the white nationalist conference and nick fuentes held there. marjorie taylor greene appeared

on stage with nick fuentes. where did she then appear the next day and i would talk to matt who is the head of cpac who has been a longtime figure in conservative politics and i pressed him, how can you legitimize marjorie taylor greene and she told me it is not for him to cancel anybody. it is important to have these voices be present and which, of course, why isn't liz cheney invited here? that is the reality what joe is saying here is that marmgry taylor green is not a fringe figure. paul gosar is not a fringe figure. andy biggs and talked about running for the house speakership. i mean, these are individuals who are the republican party now and frankly view your silence from individuals who would rather not -- you will not hear a rob portman and you will not

hear from the adam kinsinger and liz cheney. those folks are out the door and the traditional lawmakers that we used to go to for comment and the anti-trump quote, those are going to be gone. >> the thing that i would be interested in is not only have we not seen any denuvens yagz two or three days later from donald trump. will the media, people like you ask kevin mccarthy outright. you're running for speaker, will you denounce what trump has done and what -- ask tell members of your caucus that you should not be appearing as they have with this guy? will governor desantis who is supposedly the leading potential candidate against donald trump and it happened in his state where he's governor. would he be questioned about this. i'm concerned about where the mainstream republican party leadership is going to be given.

if we're going to entertain desantis as an alternative to trump. let's see if you're an alternative to trump. let's see where you are, kevin mccarthy where you are as speaker and nobody should get a break here and nobody should get a pass and there's a history of republicans fearing losing this base of voters that donald trump was able to turn out in his 2020 election and they legitimized going after these very voters in 2022 because we saw in the numbers that the years of recognition in rural parts of arizona and rural parts of ohio that they turned out in record numbers with donald trump. are they willing to sacrifice those voters who are sympathetic to white nationalism and are they willing to try to win back over those middle ground voters? they have not done it before. georgia is going to be the perfect example with that question? we asked who should you be

asking your question to? donald trump may be going down for a rally as well over the course of these next few days. >> vaughn, you spent a lot of time in arizona and by the way, the first time i campaigned in '94 and '96 and '98, there have always been extremists out there. whack jobs who would stand up in town hall meetings and say things and you're, like, okay. next question? >> that said, the republicans have talked about -- we don't want to defend the voters and you just brought up rural voters that came out. this formula didn't work in 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, and most dramatically this formula didn't

work in 2022. show me five rural voters in rural arizona that would be offended if you attacked white nationalism. i will show you 500 voters in maricopa county that would be glad you did that. that's what i don't understand when you're talking about georgia or arizona. are any of these swing states the refusal to stand up to the hatred, to the bigotry and the antisemitism and the extremism. yeah. you get the four or five votes here or there, and you lose the 400, 500 in the suburbs and you end up, as you saw, losing elections in arizona. they should have never lost, and i think that the issue is folks around the country have had plenty of conversations with either friends or family members who live in other parts of the country here where donald trump

remains that key entity that opened up the door to the america first movement here. i think that we have to understand that there is a loyalty and a frailty to donald trump that transcends the normal politics that you or i have been acquainted with over the last year since you've worked in politics since i've covered it here. there is a loyalty to this man who is the leader of this movement. there are folks with pictures of this man in their home. donald trump is more than a political party and when you are talking to voters around this country or even go on a drive whether it be upstate new york or rural arizona, you see trump 2024 flags outside. those weren't put up in 2020. those weren't put up now, and i think if you're having these conversations here, there was a speaker phone that marjorie taylor green may espouse and

there is a next layer of it, and we're talking about the harms that immigration have on our neighborhoods that republicans use, but it is much louder and it is much more easy to understand and much more explicit terms when the likes of donald trump or a marjorie taylor green say it that is not veiled in any more politically tender rhetoric that the other, more moderate republicans may use. >> i understand, but again, it's a losing proposition. they just lose and you talk about immigration and mika, you know, you look and you see that immigration has been used. it was used in 2018. remember the caravans. lepers are coming to the united states and bringing leprosy and

trump actually deploys troops and keeps them away from their families through the holidays because he's thinking that doesn't work. republicans get crushed in '20. they tried the convoys and the caravans in '20. it didn't work. they lost the house. they lost the senate. >> i understand what vaughn is saying. those people are out there. i'm trying to reap out and just say it's not working. it didn't work in 2022. my god, you would have thought it would have worked in 2022 because illegal immigration in the southern border is crazy right now if you go to the southern border. there is such a humanitarian crisis there and the numbers are just unbelievable and yet a democrat wins the senate race. a democrat wins the governor's

race. so again, and i -- you know, rev, i understand this. i understand this because, again, being in politics, i understand there are bubbles on both sides, right? but i understood, as a politician what you understand as a preacher. you can preach to the choir if you want to lose and you want your church to die, but it is a conversion business. we are in the business of converting people and the republican party under donald trump, they've gotten out of that business. it's been a business of some traction instead of addition. instead of lost voters and lost souls they keep preaching to the choir and keep losing. it's fascinating. i've never seen a party so stuped they it can't learn from the mistakes in 2018, 2019, 2020, 2022. they can't! >> well, as a preacher, i can

tell you that if you just preach to the choir, if you turn around and there's no one in the audience or in the congregation you and the choir will become irrelevant and i think that is what they're doing. they emptied out the church, so to speak, because people who really do not want to go that far and be perceived or in fact be bigots, biassed and anti-semite, racists and that is the political danger because if you can morally live with that and you have no problem being perceived as that, then you must deep down inside have some of that bias and bigotry yourself. that's why i said let's see where desantis is. let's see where mccarthy is because why would you tolerate this unless there's some hidden bias in you?

>> i don't disagree with that. nbc's vaughn hilliard, thank you very much for your reporting. we appreciate it. so the biden white house is also commenting on trump's dinner last week. for that let's bring in white house reporter for politico and morning joe reporter unieen daniels. >> good to see you. what does the white house have to say about this? >> first, we have to remember that this is a president who ran for president because of the 2017 charlottesville march. he has a huge concern about the rise of white nationalism in this country so there's no lack of shock and dismay and not surprised in this white house coming from the president himself. the report has asked him over the weekend while he wases in nan tucket and while he thought he answered in a very biden way. >> mr. president, what do you think of donald trump having dinner with a white nationalist?

>> we do want to hear what he thinks and andrew bates released a statement that bigotry, hate, and antisechl tichl have absolutely no place in america including at mar-a-lago, holocaust denial should be condemned. this is an example of the theory in the case of the republican party, that donald trump the ultra mega maga and nick fuentes are growing and have a presence and foothold in the republican party and you can see that when i talk to folks here who point to the lack of senior republican leadership who are calling out this meeting at all, and specifically calling out donald trump by name. you can look at kevin mccarthy.

one of the reasons that republicans are having a difficult time figuring out what to do with this fuentes meeting is because he's not someone who has been -- as vaughn just said hiding on the sidelines. he's been meeting with marjorie taylor greene and paul gosar, and they didn't say anything then. so it is unlikely that we'll hear anything from them now and the concern for the white house is largely about the permission structure that is created by folks like this, by them getting a much larger voice and by them getting a much larger platform and meeting with the former president at his home because not many people knew who he was before and that is not the case now. >> eugene, you're certainly right that this has been the case of the white house and it reflects the new dynamic that washington as a whole is about to encounter. you mentioned marjorie taylor green is about to be in the house majority and this is a republican party that has

uplifted her and people like nick fuentes who have become more central to what they're trying to do. so how are white house aides preparing what is incoming and this new type of republican rhetoric that will be more forefront with them in the house. >> the difference is the platform like you're talking about, jonathan. this is a republican party that's been doing this for quite a while. biden ran because of this concept that white nationalism was growing and becoming louder in the united states of america. it's like how people say on twitter they're singing the quiet part out loud and that's been happening a lot more so you have a white house who is going to be out front. we will continue to hear and we have juggling of the press and communications team and earlier this year. you will continue to see those folks like andrew bases and the press secretary calling things out and they continue to promise that president biden as he's

done over and over has been explicit about these things and then you have to think about how that changes as you go into the 2024 election and how this administration both talks on the politics of this and the concern about what it's doing to the country as the administration that's overseeing a lot of this and i think that's something the white house is trying to figure out at this point. >> politico's eugene daniels. thank you very much for that report. we turn now to the senate runoff in georgia where early voting is under way. the state supreme court denied a republican bid to block voting on the saturday after thanksgiving. as many as 22 of the state's 159 counties let voters cast their ballots saturday. the runoff between democratic senator rafael warnock and herschel walker is next tuesday, december 6th. meanwhile, senator warnock is out with a new ad that shows voters reacting in realtime to

some of herschel walker's more puzzling campaign speeches. here's part of it. >> i was good. >> unbelievable. >> so when china gets our good air. >> it's all the same air. >> not only does it make no sense, i don't even understand what he thinks he's saying. >> now we have to clean that back up. >> i sat and watched these on twitter and i'm, like, what the heck is this guy talking about? like, literally, what is he talking about? >> he is unqualified for this really, really serious job. >> no one is watching this saying this guy's got it together. >> is anyone understanding or are we wasting time. >> it is embarrassing. >> they want a yes man. someone who will just punch the

button. >> let's call it what it is. [ bleep ] embarrassing as hell. >> oh, i mean -- well, you know? >> let's bring in politics reporter for "the new york times" covering the south. maya king. she joins us now from atlanta. what can you tell us what is happening right now with voting that's under way especially the saturday voting. there was a lot of fighting between democrats and republicans and voting on certain days, souls to the polls and there seems to be a pretty big turnout so far. >> thank you for having me. absolutely. i think a lot of people must assume that in a runoff election after a thanksgiving holiday that might dampen turnout particularly among key dechl democratic constituencies and what we've seen over the last weekend especially has challenged that notion. hundreds of thousands of voters have turned out across georgia

particularly in these deeply democratic areas in and around metro atlanta and within that electorate, people who have cast ballots are black voters and younger voters and this is a core of the democratic constituency and it's good news for senator warnock at this stage because it's shown that a lot of the people who have supported him in the november 8th, general election are turning back out to cast ballots one more time. >> maya, let me go back to the ad that reverend senator warnock ran. i'm getting from people in georgia, and we have the national action network in atlanta and i'm talking to people on the radio that they feel not only that herschel walker is not qualified, but they're almost embarrassed by his candidacy, saying he's a fine athlete and not taking anything away from that, but

that he is totally unqualified and for them to present him as an alternative just because he's a named black against someone more qualified and enabling more people to vote. are you sensinging that in your interviews and conversations with georgians? >> absolutely. and on the airwaves. to your point, reverend, a lot of faith leaders have come forthwith advertisements of their own saying i'm going to pray for herschel walker and that's something that's resonated with a number of voters and i was with senator warnock and asked him what his message was to voters purpose he repeat these two words, competence and character posing it as a final thing as a question to voters whether or not they believe herschel walker is qualified to serve in the united states senate against senator warnock who has completed two years in the

chamber. that advertisement underlines exactly what it's been which is not only pouring millions and millions of dollars into a campaign message against herschel walker and posing these questions to voters in the final days and one that gets him to the polls saying this say close race and it was only separated by 30,000 votes. there is a possibility of herschel walker being in the united states senate and whether or not georgia voters feel that he would be qualified to serve in that chamber has been the final message to them in these last few days. >> politics reporter for "the new york times" maya king, thank you very much for your report this morning. coming up on "morning joe," ukraine is on edge for more russian strikes this morning as kyiv prepares for the possibility of another round of evacuations. the country's former president petro poroshenko will be our

guest. also ahead today is cyber monday and it could be the biggest online shopping day ever. meanwhile, protests against covid restrictions in china have rattled world markets as oil prices fell to the lowest levels this year. we'll get all those details when cnbc's dom chu joins us with the latest. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ng joe." we'll be right back. research shows people remember commercials with nostalgia. so to help you remember that liberty mutual customizes your home insurance, here's one that'll really take you back. wow! what'd you get, ryan? it's customized home insurance from liberty mutual!!! what does it do, bud? it customizes our home insurance so we only pay for what we need! and what did you get, mike? i got a bike. ♪ only pay for what you need.

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♪♪ ♪ look how pretty the tree looks! ? i'm always -- i love it. >> this time of year when the comcast commerce tree gets put up. >> there's a big lighting wednesday night.

>> that's fantastic. people are swept in in the spirit of the holidays and start putting down credit cards and cash for the nbc experience store. >> and that. and a "morning joe" mug. >> all because of the comcast commerce trade. >> the holiday shopping season, do you know that that joke is 15 years too old? >> no, no. it was ge something. >> it was changed because -- fine. it's just old. >> we used to call it the tree when ge ran the place. you don't remember what it was? >> please top. >> let's put it to bed. >> the comcast commerce tree. >> anyhow, the holiday shopping season continues today and cyber monday. >> cyber monday. despite inflation, the biggest online shopping day in the u.s. is set to hit a record $11.2 billion. this comes after blak friday

raked in new online shopping records with sales hitting $9 billion. >> meanwhile, oil prices are plummeting this morning. >> thanks, biden! >> thanks, biden! >> do you remember that? i just tweeted it out. look what i just tweeted out. i did that, oil prices are at its lowest levels of the year. do you remember people would always put stickers. >> thanks, biden. >> when oil prices went up. now they're plummeting. thanks, biden. can all of the trumpers go out and put that on the gas. >> can we talk about the miami airport, too? >> thanks to desantis it sucks. >> it's horrible! >> by the way, the miami -- >> it's disgusting. >> it's ranked one of the worst in america. i don't know who you blame for that. >> i blame desantis. >> he could take care of it. he doesn't care.

>> stop it. it's just like blaming biden for gas prices. i'm wondering where are your friends today? where are your friends today that used to blame gas prices going up on joe biden? if you could, tell them hello for me because i will be saying hi to some of my trumpier friends that blame -- now, ask them, it had a lot more to do with market forces globally and market forces inside the oil industry, market forces that really republicans should know more about, but since they're not conservative anymore, since they're anti-freedom, since they're anti-helping the ukrainians out in the house, i

guess they just don't understand the market forces anymore. >> oil prices plummeting this morning in response to anti-government protests across china. >> they think hyatt is a golfer. they know nothing about it. >> this morning extraordinary scenes across china. protests in multiple cities against the government's grinding zero-covid rules. from shanghai in the east to arumshi in the northwest. crowds swell in defiance spilling over. >> we want freedom! >> chanting for freedom from the grip of a covid policy that protesters say has worn on. >> they're calling for the end of lockdowns and the end of testing and all of the zero-covid measures that have ruled daily life here. >> the blank sheets of paper to protest censorship.

the internet here scrubbed of any hint of unrest. the boldest public challenge yet for leader xi jinping. in shanghai, surrounded by police, some protest ors daring to call for him to step down, a move almost unheard of in china. they did it for everybody says this woman in beijing. the national outcry triggered by a deadly fire that put hours to put out. it was blamed where lockdowns have confined people for months. videos on social media showing candlelight vigils and shows of frustration. on block they yelled while in guangzhou they did knock down barriers. china has tried tweaking the zero-covid rules and they're bearing down again. a challenge for the communist party with no exit from zero

covid in sight. >> cnbc's dom chu. you know, it was have interesting a month or so ago when the saudis cut production and they were warned not only by the united states, but their closest allies and here we are, oil prices actually plummeting because again, international forces, it's really, it's these international forces that drove gas prices up and drove oil prices up and now driving it down and my god, if this continues in china, talk about the impact that it will have not only china and asia, but across the world including the u.s. >> this is very much about market forces and you know, i watched these market forces as a cows of my job every day. this is very much about on the oil narrative, at least.

this is very much about the demand side as opposed to the supply side of this market force that's happening. you mentioned saudi arabia and output cuts and things like that that can strain the supply of oil that can raise prices, but this is very much an overwhelming trend for oil prices that has been linked to demand, slowing demand and you mentioned china. the reason why china is such a big part of the story is because china is the second biggest consumer in the world second to the united states. it is the second biggest oil importer of the world, so they depend a lot on this foreign oil to power this economy and if their economy starts to slowdown because of these covid protests and because of what's happened for the civil unrest in china and that could dampen demand. for context out there, remember in the wake of the ukraine invasion by russia, back in march, u.s. benchmark oil prices hit a high of roughly $130 per

barrel. today they sit closer to around 74 to $75 per barrel and that's a massive decline. by the way, that's translateded into fuel prices as well. gasoline prices today for aaa are roughly $3.55 a gallon nationally. they will remember $5.02 a gallon back in early june. so this has been a huge move because of demand concerns and by the way, if you want to link it all together mika was talking about the black friday and cyber monday that they expected to have today. those lower fuel prices are expecting to power consumer spending and the interesting part of that consumer spending story right now, you mentioned the record $1.2 million on black friday, it shows that the american consumer is at least relatively healthy. they started to buy things like consumer electronics, equipment and toys, but a lot of the bad news around this is because the increase in spending comes

alongside inflation that's been running at four decade highs for a good part of this year. another troubling indicator to keep an eye on, joe and mika, is to watch how many consumers are using credit to make some of these purchases on black friday and cyber monday. those jumped by 78% compared to the prior week meaning more people are turning towards installment payment plans to do their shopping as opposed to paying for them outright. so again, black friday and cyber monday. no doubt about it. this is a good thing. people are spending money, but you have to keep an eye on the other trends especially when it comes to buy now, pay later. >> cnbc's dom chu. thank you very much, mika, the collapse in fuel prices, oil prices also devastating to vladimir putin. less money for him to spend on a war that he's already losing. >> and to that now, the latest from ukraine where russian forces continue to strike key

infrastructure facilities in order to knock out heat and power sources as winter continues. ukrainian president zelenskyy warned during a video address yesterday that this week will present further challenges to the nation's power grid ahead of more missile strikes. joining us now the former president of ukraine petro poroshenko. we thank you for joining us once again on the show. if you can tell us what is expected in terms of the missile strikes and the effort to try to get power to as many people as possible? >> thank you very much, indeed, for your invitation. second, please don't be mistaken because we have a power grid for the last 278 days, and maybe eight and a half years. i want to remind you that the minus 30 degrees we have no

heat, no electricity and no gas and -- i don't know, in the 30,000 people city. today in my house i don't have electricity for the 22 hours from 24, and we have now no electricity and here you see we have a small generator generating the light for our communication and the temperature is minus and we have snow on the street, but the main message is we do not trade our freedom, our democracy for electricity, for oil, for gas, for heating and this is just a demonstrating the real face of putin. that russia is a terroristic state and we are waiting that american congress will make the

necessary resolution. point number two is that our hospital, our kindergarten and our school are now keepinging on generator and we definitely and urgently need the converter and we need the generator and we need spare parts for our system and at the same time, i'm telling them because i was two days in washington from here and back, and my message was together with our electricity system we definitely need an air defense because we know that russia has a new crew missiles in the black sea under russian territory and the russian territory and the very next moment while the spare part appear to have electricity supply, that is a cruise missile. we are not afraid that we

modernice it and we do not give chance for the crazy, maniac putin to make pressure ukraine and europe and the whole democratic world to affect our freedom. >> president poroshenko. president zelenskyy said he believes this next week or two could be mooj the most dangerous in the world that russia is preparing new strikes and terrorizing in particular civilian targets. what right now does the ukrainian military need from its allies who themselves have economic concerns and have constraints, but are still supplying weapons. what do you need this minute as the cold winter sets in? >> point number one, we need air defense. we need ammunition for our children. you are in a different type of war.

this is the war of artillery and we need jet fighter. defensive weapons. we must not allow russia to dominate in our airspace and for the artillery, we need long range, very high accuracy ammunition and that's why we are welcoming the statement of the corporation and they are capable to supply us with the artillery weapons with a range of 100 miles and we demonstrated that the ukrainian soldiers are efficient and using that. this is not to take russian territory, and this is just to destroy russian logistics and the russian ammunition storage and to destroy the russian command and from ukrainian soil

and independent country. together with the whole world we feel the strong shoulder of our allies and our friends from the united states, from uk, and from the old member states and on behalf of the ukrainian people who is more important i want to thank you for the extremely efficient cooperation during this war. >> all right. the former president of ukraine, petro poroshenko, thank you very much for being on this morning. >> it really is -- the situation there is dire, but the ukrainians remain steadfast. >> the resolve is unbelievable. >> the resolve is extraordinary and remains an example for the rest of the world. >> coming up, broadway's new take on an american classic. actor wendell pierce joins us to talk about his starring role in the revival of arthur miller's "death of a salesman."

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coast. speaking of california, one political headline out of california. governor gavin newsom has put to rest speculation about him possibly running for the white house in 2024. in an interview with politico, governor newsom said he won't challenge president biden for the democratic nomination. newsom says he is all in on the president's expected re-election campaign. by the way, a great article just posted in the "new york times" also about democrats and the possibility of joe biden running again in 2024. now, to the tony and pulitzer-prize winning play about the futility of the american dream "death of a salesman." it's back on broadway again for a limited run. it has been hailed by critics and has a black lowman family. arthur miller's "death of a

salesman" wendell pearce. let me ask you, how do you step up to the plate for a play that was written in 1949, still relevant today, one a pulitzer prize that year, considered one of the greatest plays of the 20th century. it's been revived five times. i would think that's a lot of pressure for anybody. talk about -- i know you said you would be crazy not to take this opportunity. but talk about do you feel the pressure because of the weight of this extraordinary piece of work? >> yes, i do. the pressure is there. but, as they say, pressure makes diamonds. >> right. it's from those moments i step on the stage and i look out and i realize that i'm stepping into an iconic role, an iconic

play. and i feel as if i'm at base camp of mt. everest looking up and i have to summit it in the next couple of hours. i think of two groups of play. the small fraternity of men who played the role before over the 70-plus years. there's only been five men. and now i join that small fraternity. i also think of another group of men which is ozzy davis, earl high man, james earl jones. men, because of our cultural ignorance, never had an obligation to play. to those two groups of men, i have a sacred obligation to do the best that i can. >> yeah. those are two extraordinary groups of men.

i want to ask you, what makes a play written in 1949 still seem so relevant in 2022? >> what makes it relevant and what makes it a classic and speaks to that across time, race, place, age. 70 years from now, it will still be speaking to our common humanity. something that we shared with those who have gone before us and will be after us. it recognizes an authenticity and a truth. there is a cautionary tale that we have this great american aesthetic, that we have this american paradox that we never live up to the aesthetic we espouse. that is the thing arthur miller tapped into and gives us a great opportunity to relearn that listen over and over and over. that makes it timely, timeless at the same time.

>> wendell, always good to see you. >> same here. >> i want to ask you a two-part question. i know there is a partnership on broadway for all, a nonprofit helping to bring inclusiveness into broadway. secondly, i was moved when i read you said you were wrestling with doing this part. it was part self-reflection and that you wanted to know if the best was indeed behind you. >> absolutely. >> you've been in it now since october 9th. have you answer thad question? do you see there is more wendell left? >> yeah. there has been a deep dive of self-reflection. no man could ever play the role and not be challenged by the psychological impact of it. ultimately, this man is challenged to the point where he destroys himself. and he's on a self-destructive

path. and so what you do is , in any role, you start to reflect on your connection to that role. and you get to a point as a middle-aged man and say my best days are behind me. but with this challenge and achievement, i've come to the realization that my best days are not behind me. there are many more to come hopefully. and also, more importantly, i have fear about having courage. courage is acting in the face of fear, not the absence of it. sometimes the challenges of a career, of a life may be fearful. but find the courage to face them. that's the blinders that willie lowman has on, that this materialistic wealth, he was blinded by the fact that he had a familial wealth, the love of family that was all around him that he couldn't see.

and he was blinded by this pursuit of some materialism. so i've learned that lesson. willie lowman for so many in the audience, the character there. you also, though, are part of jack ryan's show. >> yes. >> which is entering its third season, i believe, next month. tell us a little bit about what we should expect there. >> jack ryan is a great show. i've been living in budapest the past year and a half. i have worked in vienna, prague, rome, athens. so the travel log is wonderful. that is something people love about the series. it is intrigue and excitement. it's an action show. but the intrigue of it, the geopolitical things that are happening in the show, we wrote

this before everything that's happening in the world today. but it reflects what's happening in the world today. and while we thought it was something that was totally fictionalized to a higher level, sometimes you are surprised at how the geopolitical world can actually manifest things that even hollywood writer couldn't even come up with. >> all right. wendell pierce, thank you for being with us. can't wait for the season premiere friday >> thank you very much. >> and i'm thinking rev and i will be coming to see "death of a salesman." thank you so much for being with us. thank you for having me. >> playing at the hudson theater on broadway in a limited engagement through january 15th. again, season three of "jack ryan" will return to prime video on december 21st.

all right. wendell, thanks again. that does it for us this morning on "morning joe." jose diaz-balart picks up the coverage after this short break. thanks for being with us. thanks for being with us (chuckle) ...you should check out inspire. no mask. no hose. just sleep. (beeping) learn more and view important safety information at inspiresleep.com. i'd like to thank our sponsor liberty mutual. they customize your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. contestants ready? go! only pay for what you need. jingle: liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty.

good morning. 10:00 a.m. eastern, 7:00 a.m. pacific. cyber monday could mark the biggest online shopping day ever as consumers look to spend big on the web. meanwhile, a rare sight in china. massive protests