good to be with you. i'm katy tur. the january 6th committee only has a handful of days left on the congressional calendar, and as we've been reporting, they seem to be making the most of these last weeks. interviews with high profile

aides like kellyanne conway and tony oronato and robin vos, the wisconsin gop speaker who refused to overturn the results under pressure, and on the final report and on the final decision, we have some news. the house select committee held a closed door meeting earlier and when we begin this afternoon, to decide on whether to send a criminal referral for former president donald trump to the d.o.j. now, as you know, the d.o.j. does not need that referral. the department is already investigating. and both the january 6th and the mar-a-lago documents probes are now under the direction of special counsel jack smith. but a criminal referral would send a message. we'll explain that in a moment. and more news on the mar-a-lago documents case. last night, the 11th circuit ruled that judge cannon was way out of line, in appointing a special master, and what "the new york times" calls a sharply critical written opinion.

so let's bring in two of our best reporters, joining us now, nbc news capitol hill correspondent ryan nobles, we are so happy to have with us, and "washington post" national security reporter devlin barrett. >> ryan, i want to start with you and the january 6th committee. because earlier we heard from chairman bennie thompson that criminal referral wasn't going to happen. what has changed? >> it there has certainly been a lot of back and forth from the committee members about a utility of formally sending over a request from congress to the department of justice to consider criminal charges against one or more people that the committee has investigated. and it seems as though once the justice department starting to ramp up the investigation, that need lessened even more. but there is no doubt members of the january 6th select committee who still believe that it is imperative for the committee to take this step. so as a result, they set up a sub subcommittee of a few members, all of them lawyers, with experience in this regard, to kind of take a look at the benefit, the value of issuing

referrals like this. that group, that sub committee, which included members of like jamie raskin, liz cheney, and adam schiff, were expected to offer up their recommendations to the full committee today, and then a decision would be made. from what we're hearing from inside the committee during today, it looks like as though they're not ready to make a formal decision on that yet. but this is the direction that they're heading. having these real conversations about whether or not it's worth it. and i should also add, in addition to the idea of criminal referrals, like for donald trump or others, there's also this issue of these outstanding subpoenas that have not been answered, specifically from members of congress, including the house minority leader kevin mccarthy and the committee still has to decide if they want to take any action on that. >> i imagine some of this is, does this matter, because the d.o.j. is investigating donald trump and whether you're talking about it is worth it, do you have any sense of the argument there and why they would want to do this or not want to do this? >> the biggest reason to stop

short of doing it, if they send over the criminal referral, and the department of justice just ignores it, or takes a look at it and decides it holds no value, and that they're not going to prosecute, then that basically takes the wind out of that, those sails, for future opportunities to do something like this. if you're going to send over a criminal referral, you have almost got to make sure that it's something the department of justice is going to act upon, otherwise these criminal referrals don't mean anything. and the other part that they're weighing is whether or not that taints the process from a political perspective. so the department of justice would like to conduct an investigation that is completely independent of any politics, and certainly republicans and the former president have done everything they can to paint the january 6th select committee investigation as a partisan exercise, so there is the possibility that if they send over those criminal referrals, then the department of justice feels a political pressure that they don't want. that's all part of whether or not it is worth it to make, to take that step, especially because there is no legal ramifications behind it. >> and just finally, this this

is going to be quick, does this have to go to the full house for a vote if they do decide to send a criminal referral, like a criminal contempt charge? >> yes, it would have to go to the full house to be voted on before it could be taken as a step. >> it will be interesting if republicans got on board with this, these times have changed certainly so that would be different. let's talk about the 11th circuit and the ruling last night. as i read it, and i, they're saying that the law is clear, that, let me read it to you. we cannot write a rule that allows any subject of a search warrant to block government investigations after the execution of a warrant. nor can we write a rule that allows only former presidents to do so. either approach would be a radical reordering of our case law, limiting the federal courts' involvement in criminal investigations. and both would violate bedrock separation of powers limitations. obviously, this is written as a legal document, so, you know, it is going to be somewhat dry, but at the same time, this, for

them, i just wonder how you would feel if you're judge cannon, reading this, and getting the news that you were way out of line? >> no judge likes to be overruled on appeal. but they especially don't like to be overruled in, you know, in thorough blanket terms like this. so i do think it is a very, it's a very public rebuke of judge cannon's reasoning and her most high profile case. that will sting for most judges. the other thing to keep in mind here though and this is a nuance, but you know, trump got some of it, as bad and as thorough a rejection as this decision is, trump got some of what he wanted out of this case, because he did get some delay on the part of the investigation, by forcing it through this special master process for several months. >> so the trump team has responded to this, and i'll read that as well, the panel's decision today is purely procedural, and based only on

jurisdiction. the decision does not adoctors the -- address the raid on mar-a-lago. it wasn't purely procedural? and does it not address the merits? it feels like it does. i. >> i mean if you look at their arguments throughout this process, their arguments have repeatedly come before judges who by and large have said that these are not good arguments, these are not sound legal bases to fight this thing. but i do think, again, like a lot of these are trump arguments, are made not so much for the audience of judges, they're made for the audience of the public and trump supporters. >> a very good point. >> so i think that is part of, i think that's who they're really speaking to in a statement like that. >> they have been arguing in the court of public opinion. >> sleen celine dion cds and

golf shirts. >> one of the things in the process in the oral arguments that led up to the decision, there was a point when trump's lawyer argued that there was real harm being committed to the former president because. so things were taken were very personal, and they included birthday cards and photos of celine dion, and some old shirts. and i was a little shocked that at the time the judges didn't interject and say why is that an important harm to anyone. these don't sound like important things. and the judges even in their written ruling mentioned the celine dion photos in a footnote, so i think that stuck with them in a way, but not in a way that helped trump. >> all right. devlin, ryan, thank you very much. joining me now is former u.s. attorney and msnbc legal analyst barbara mcquade. can we start there on the celine dion paraphernalia and the shirts and what did you make of that? >> sometimes personal items can have evidentiary value. so the mere fact that the

government took them, seized them, doesn't mean they get to keep them forever, doesn't mean it is improper. if there is a bank robber and you go into their home and you seize the hat that matches the hat worn by the robber, you know, a bright green hat, it may belong to the person, but it has evidentiary value. so the fbi gets to take that. in the same way here, they allege that the passports were found in the same door along with classified documents. that's important. if these celine dion's photos belong to donald trump, that's important. if they are stored in, next to, or in the same draw as classified documents because it suggests that donald trump has custody and control and dominion over the classified items as well as the personal items. so there's nothing improper about this. >> i didn't mean to interrupt you. but to just talk about the special master that was there for a limited time and i imagine the special master probably feels pretty frustrated that he put in all this work, and now, poof, it doesn't matter, but i mean, it did effectively give

donald trump the delay that he often looks for. what does it mean for the d.o.j. to now have it fully back in their court? >> you're absolutely right. i mean since august, these documents have been hung up. and they've been unable to review them. and so now, they get to move forward, and looking at the kumt documents, it is critically important here, because they can't charge the case without seeing everything that is there because in is always a risk to the national security that you charge a case that has documents as evidence, those might come out and there might be some that cannot ever see the light of day. so what the justice department can do is assess the documents and make a charging decision. >> what do we think about when the charging decision might come? i mean there have been some conversations, you know, speculative conversations, that appointing a special master right now means that they're actually trying to get this done faster, that maybe merrick garland and the d.o.j. were further along in the investigation and they wanted to push, pull back and say, it's time for somebody else to

deliver the final result and actually we're going to get this in the next couple of months. do you have any sense of that? is that just pure wild speculation? is it not even almost a good idea to talk about this? you tell me. >> well, it's difficult to speculate. and i think the timing is really more having to do with donald trump's announcement that he was running for president than do to do anything related to the course of the investigation. i don't know how ready they are, but this is a very significant event, gaining access to these documents, but i don't think an indictment is imminent, i doubt it would happen before the end of the year because what has to happen next, they have to decide what documents to use in the case and share those with the intelligence community and get an assessment that they would not do anything that would be harmful to the national security by disclosing a source or method of collection. there is a phrase you may have heard, that prosecutors look for what they refer to as goldilocks documents, just right, not too

sensitive that they could never see the light of day or too obvious it wouldn't suggest to the public the seriousness of the offense but what they will endeavor to do is find the documents in between, just right document, goldilocks documents, to make sure the intelligence community is okay with going forward with the documents, with the jury seeing them and the judge seeing them and other people. i think it will take at least several weeks, so i don't see an indictment before the end of the year. >> what is interesting. i had been curious about that. because the documents are so secretive, and so sensitive, according to the government, and how do you present them at trial, how do you push this case. there's also this news, one of our producers, our eagle eye producers outside of federal court this morning in dc and saw former trump administration white house counsel pat cipollone go in with prosecutor thomas wyndham, who is investigating the former president's push to overturn the 2020 election, cipollone's lawyer was also there, and they went to the third floor, where grand juries meet, and this

producer said, a few minutes later, she saw two men entering the same area of the third floor after telling a martial they were here for the grand jury, so we can maybe guess, with an educated backing that pat cipollone was talking to the grand jury for the d.o.j., and there is also "the new york times" reporting that other trump aides have done so as well, dan scavino jr., also social media guru, they call him william russell, william b. harrison, so these people are close to donald trump and pat cipollone, we know obviously his relationship pretty well with trump, what does that say to you about this investigation? >> well, it suggests it could either be about january 6th or it could be about mar-a-lago if they're going to the grand jury, but this is pretty high level stuff. there was some reporting in recent months that the justice department was trying to work through some executive privilege issues. it pat cipollone was there today to testify, it appears that maybe they have resolved those issues and he is going forward to answer questions.

i don't know which case those questions are going to be about, whether he is going to talk about both cases but usually you start talking to the people in the inner circle later in the investigation as opposed to earlier, so it suggests a maturing of the investigation, and maybe a point where they're getting closer to making a charging decision. >> barbara mcquade, thank you very much for what is always a very interesting conversation about the inner workings of the department of justice, as fash as we can tell from the outside at least. barb, thanks so much. and calling all political journalists, and democratic campaign staffers, you might not have to pack your sub-zero clothing for the start of the 2024 primary season. president biden is trying to get the party to ditch iowa and start the nominating contest in south carolina, beyond the better weather and no offense better food, starting in the palmetto state would align better with the makeup of the democratic party. joining me now to explain that is nbc news senior politics reporter jonathan allen. with a full disclaimer,

jonathan, that i do truly love iowa during primary season, and they have some great restaurants, including some great mexican food, but why this push for, you're laughing, they do have great mexican food, why this push for south carolina to start? >> they do have great mexican food, also any food you want on a stick, katy, but often it is very, very cold in iowa at the beginning of primary season and charleston, columbia, pretty much everywhere in south carolina, a lot warmer. >> not so bad. >> what the president didn't, you know, did not say exactly why he was doing this in terms of political reasons, he did say that he wanted to honor and reflect the diversity of the democratic party as the early primary states go, recommending south carolina go first. but let's look at some of the obvious things here. number one, south carolina, the cradle of the victory in 2020, and the primary, and then into the general election, but also,

this is biden sending a message to the rest of the democrats out there who have been toying around with the idea of running against him that if they want to try to do that, they can come to south carolina, where he was strongest and fool around and find out. basically, laying down the gauntlet to get them to come to south carolina. and it also sets up vice president kamala harris potentially in the future. south carolina's a primary electorate, tends to be a slight majority african american, so it puts her in a good position if she wants to run for president in the future, and then you've got the other states, iowa shifting out, obviously, predominantly white, doesn't have a huge city in it, and so you lose out on the open side of the democratic party, whether that's, you know, liberal, moderate white, african americans, latinos, et cetera, and des moines is a reasonably sized city but not the size of some of the others such as atlanta or georgia. and adding georgia and michigan to this list, some of the larger

states that have their urban areas, suburban areas and rural areas. >> let me put up what the proposal is versus what 2020 was. i mean iowa has been first for something like 50 years. this is for the democrats. so this is 2020, versus 2024, and you can see, starting with south carolina, and go to new hampshire and nevada on the same day. and then georgia and michigan. by the way the republicans plan on having the same schedules a they always have had, in recent years, so they're not making any changes. but new hampshire, iowa is obviously not happy about it. new hampshire is obviously not happy about it either, because they, they're claim to fame is the first state to primary, iowa's a caucus, the first state to primary and it would make them the second, and it would be at the same time as nevada drawing attention away from the state. and the democratic chair told

nbc news they would be the first, no matter what. how much sway does ray buckley have? >> it's not so much the ray buckley having sway but the state of new hampshire has a law on the books and this is a complication for the democratic party, if new hampshire is the first, before the party, the only state to go on, they can do that, and the democrats will have a penalty for that, they have seen this in the past where states jump the line and take a penalty. and it is entirely possible that new hampshire ends up staying first as far as a primary state goes and the national party tries to get us and the public to not try to pay attention to the results of the primary. >> jonathan allen, thank you very much. i will see you in charleston in january, my friend. >> absolutely. >> god willing. thanks. still ahead, new numbers out of georgia, what they say about who is in the lead, plus what a court just ordered one arizona county to do with its election

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last call for early voters in georgia. at the end of a record-crushing week of turnout, the only state that has not yet settled on a senator, today is the last day to cast an early ballot. it is also a day where herschel walker is staring at a new poll that shows him trailing democratic incumbent raphael warnock. a 4-point lead for warnock, that is barely within the poll's margin of error. and last night, senator warnock brought out his closer again, former president obama who took the opportunity to underscore warnock's latest ad, showing voters confused over what exactly herschel walker has been talking about on the campaign

trail. >> that's the last time i was here, and mr. walker has been talking about issues that are of great importance to the people of georgia, like whether it's better to be a vampire or a werewolf. this is a debate that i must confess i once had myself. when i was seven. then i grew up. in case you're wondering by the way, mr. walker decided he wanted to be a werewolf. which is great. as far as i'm concerned, he can be anything he wants to be, except for a united states senator. >> all right, well, georgians

head back to the polls, a judge just ended a month-long election standoff in rural arizona, you may recall election officials in cochise county had been holding up their certification of the results over unsupported claims of the integrity of election equipment. late yesterday, the court ordered two of the three officials showed up to finally certify. joining me now from georgia where yes he is covering the georgia runoff is vaughn hillyard but we are going to talk to him about all things arizona, because he is our arizona expert. and so vaughn, thank you very much for coming on and talking to us about what's going on in cochise county. they finally certified the election results but it took a court order to do so. they didn't meet the deadline for the certification. so what does that mean? >> it feels like our democracy is just like a puzzle at this point here, and we're almost built out here, and cochise

county is going to be one of the last puzzle pieces that now we can say is on the table, and now we're waiting for the folks in georgia to get their act together here over the final four days and then we've got the full picture. in arizona, cochise was about to make things really damn interesting, katy, because the board of supervisors, three members, two republicans, those two republicans had decided that they were not going to certify the election results despite them being in the favor of republicans, and a lot of it was based on the conspiracy theories stemming from 2020, and ultimately, yesterday afternoon, they went before an arizona superior court judge and the judge ordered that by arizona state statute, it says that they quote shall certify the county's results, it is not a question, it is their obligation, as board of supervisors. so that is where late yesterday evening, two of the three board of supervisors, one of the republicans did in fact show up, and the other was missing, but that one republican did show up and did in fact, along with the democrat, certify cochise county's results and therefore

on monday, arizona will officially, with the signatures of the governor, secretary of state, and attorney general, arizona's 2022 midterm elections will officially be certified. >> vaughn hillyard, thank you very much for joining us on arizona from georgia. appreciate it. let's go to arizona secretary of state-elect adrian fontes, the maricopa county recorder until 2021. congratulations on your win, sir. thank you very much for joining us. i want to get with what we were talking about with vaughn, cochise county, having to get a court order to certify the results of the election. what's your reaction? >> it is unfortunate that we have elected officials in arizona so brazenly and without any merit break the law. within 20 days of the election, the law says that certification had to happen. as stated in that piece, the law says they shall make that certification. it has every appearance that board of supervisors, or at

least the two who voted against it, broke the law. we're going to have to look into it more once we take into office. >> you're talking about looking into it more. the county attorney told us that his option is evaluating the options. what sort of options were on the table? they did so late, and they policed the deadline and not all three of them, just two. so what are the options? >> look, accountable can take various forms in our justice system. prosecutors at the local level have a lot of discretion. the attorney general has jurisdiction over this case as well. and there may be federal implications since there were federal offices on this ballot. we're going to have to wait and see what the folks in the justice community decide. >> we'll talk about accountability, there is some accountability for kari lake and mark minchem in their lawsuit against voting machines, a judge ordered sanctions against the two of them. didn't just dismiss the lawsuit. they ordered sanctions against the two of them. why do you think the judge made

the move to sanction them instead of just saying this case is meritless? >> well, rule 11 allows courts to act with some severity as against members of the arizona bar who bring frivolous lawsuits, who bring lawsuits that would somewhat degrade the justice system, and the judge did the right thing. these were lawsuits without merit. and in arizona, we're getting sick of it and that's why so many beat the big lie candidates in november. >> let me ask you what you're going to do in the coming years. 2022 is over. election deniers largely lost. at least ones in close races. 2024 is fast approaching. what are your concerns? >> well, some of my concerns really stem from the basic administrative attitude that some folks don't understand, we're already planning for the

2024 and eventually the 2026 elections. it takes a long time to get all of these pieces of the puzzle together. if we're going to make improvements in. so counties across arizona, we're going to have to get some of those funds in. that's why i'm hear in washington, d.c., lobbying congress, to make sure that that $400 million does not come out of the omnibus bill, so that we can get the equipment, the necessary infrastructure in place, it's got to go through procurement, testing, implication, before we execute, for that march 2024 presidential preference election in arizona, which in all reality is just around the corner. >> well, i hope you'll come back on and talk to us more about this and what you're planning on doing for the state of arizona to make sure that the free and fair election does get certified, and everything goes off without a hitch. the secretary of state for arizona-elect adrian fontes, thank you very much for joining us. >> thank you so much for having me. coming up, inside iran. it is almost impossible to use social media to amplify the

protests out there. so what has that meant for american iranians? next, ron desantis, is he a flash in the pan or the next leader of the republican party? mark liebowitz is here us with on his latest. s uwith on his latest. with carmax you get pre-qualified in no time at all. so you can see your personalized monthly payment for any of our cars. with no impact on your credit score. that's car buying reimagined. carmax. if your business kept on employees through the pandemic, innovation refunds could qualify it for a payroll tax refund of up to $26,000 per employee. all it takes is eight minutes to find out. then work with highly qualified professionals to fill out your forms and submit the application. go to innovationrefunds.com to learn more. hi, my name is tony cooper. and if you have both medicare and medicaid, i have some really encouraging news that you'll definitely want to hear. depending on the plan you choose, you may be eligible to get extra benefits

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ron loves playing with the kids. >> build the wall. >> he reads stories. >> then mr. trump said you're fired. i love that part. >> he's teaching madison to talk. >> make america great again. >> people say ron's all trump. but he is so much more. >> >> you remember that ad from 2018 when ron desantis's wife narrated a message of a maga dad running to be governor of florida. that was then. this is now. desanctimonious. and predicting the future is a bad idea, we've learned that around here, it is worth learning a little more about the man many republicans who have not met him are predicting will be the next gop nominee and while those who do know him say

they're not so sure. joining me now is the atlantic staff righter and msnbc political contributor mark liebowitz, his latest is -- mark liebovich. wait until you get to know mark desantis. this is filled with colorful language and descriptions of ron desantis and his personality. what's the deal, why is there a disconnect between those who have not met him and those who have? >> well, i think what you is see very often in politics, especially when you have kind of this 800 pound gorilla candidate that everyone is kind of looking to is the reality doesn't match necessarily the hype around him, and desantis is kind of a classic example of someone who, you know, now has a bunch of glitter around him, i think a lot of republican donors are very excited about him, and sort of someone who can rescue the party from trump, but ultimately, they have to come out and play some time, and they don't always wear it as as well

as they think they might so we saw him reading to his kid, make america great, i mean very moving, i thought, speaking as a dad, i was really kind of moved by that, but hopefully for the sake of a child, that will not be repeated, and will never be spoken of again. >> you mentioned a moment on the debate stage with charlie crist, where he was asked are you running in 2024 and you said desantis kind of froze and ultimately saved by the moderator. and that donald trump's team was looking at that moment, and thought that they could, that was a weakness of his, they could use that to their advantage, that he would not be very good on the debate stage against donald trump. why? >> one would think, and i mean donald trump has shown again and again that he is very good at tearing apart people who are not as fast on their feet as he is, who are not as comfortable in their skin as he is. and desantis is kind of a classic example of someone who trump can run circles around. someone who is not terribly

fast, somewhat plotting and trump has a real quickness about him and for better or worse, people who like him, he'd say he has a charm about him, and as desantis would sort of enter any charm offensive of donald trump unarmed. he doesn't seem to have that same appeal. which again, i think it could be a real handicap for him. >> part of what people say about desantis is he is trump with a brain. trump with all of the anger towards the culture war issues, wokeness, et cetera, and without all of the bombs that donald trump is exploding on himself, and there was a recent one, i don't want to get into too much of it but giving this more. gen is not the greatest idea, but there is the kanye west and nick fuentes dinner and kanye going i don't know how to, crazy, anti-semitic, and what does that do for a ron desantis run?

>> well, i mean it does sort of underscore this is a let dramatic, less problematic person. i think republicans have shown a real appetite to move on from trump, and desantis kind of runs the empire here, the anti-woke florida empire, where trump himself has elected to live but he is kind of cordoned off in this weird little bubble, and hopefully, you know, for republican sake can't do as much damage as he had in the past, just sort of waits for people to come and kiss his ring, and maybe the fbi is searching his premises, and maybe kanye and nick fuentes are coming to dinner or something but this is the empire that ron desantis has fashioned for himself, and again, at some point he will have to combat and take on donald trump and i don't think that is going to be as pretty for him as he might think. >> i wonder if we will look back on this conversation in 2024, may of 2024, or august of 2024,

and look at this like we're talking about scott walker in 2015. it's hard when you're the early front-runner. >> it is. i mean there is a whole sort of list of nonpresidents out there, whether it's scott walker or rick perry or beto o'rourke, or what have you, who look really, really, really good early on and very untested, and then all of a sudden, they come out in public, and lo and behold, they don't register to the degree that a lot of early hypesters will will register them. again, there is a long list of people like that and i think desantis has a pretty high bar at this point because i think a lot of people are very excited about limb and vested a lot of hope in him. >> just finally, from your sense of things, i don't know how close you got to desantis in reporting this article, but do you have a sense of who he is, and who is running things for him right now? >> yeah, i mean he's an opportunist, he is someone who knows thou pick targets. he is very good at agitating the

right people. he's, you know, he has a knack as many people do at this point, for i guess triggering all of the right sort of liberal targets. and again, that is sort of a fun game to play if you don't actually have to come out and defend yourself, and actually don't have to prove, say what you're to for, and i think right now, he is in a great position because he didn't have to argue for anything, he can just point to his victory in november and say look, i'm really popular, donald trump is not, the scoreboard speaks for itself, and you might let the glitter kind of amass around him. but at this point, you know, i don't think it will be as, ever be as easy or fun as it is for desantis as it is right now. >> right now the stakes are pretty low or at least the opportunity is there in front of you. mark liebovich, thanks for being with us. go ahead and read his latest

article in "the atlantic," wait until you get to know ron desantis. coming up, what president biden is doing in boston today with the prince and princess of wales. right after the break, what happens when your government silences you? what if we wanted to electrify all of this... 100% carbon free... is it possible? ♪♪ aes has been leading energy transitions for decades... and is partnering with the worlds leading companies to decarbonize industries... cities, and nations. even the internet. is it possible? can we reliably power the things we love and green the planet at the same time? yes... aes. ♪♪ what will you do? will you make something better? create something new? our dell technologies advisors can provide you with the tools and expertise you need to bring out the innovator in you.

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blackout, it is very hard to get images to show the world, listen, rise up, not rise up but help us. >> it is very hard to figure out what is going on the ground there. and these individuals, diaspora, because of the age of twitter and instagram and tiktok, they're able to spread the message, spread the movement online. the world is watching. despite the best efforts from the iranian government, domestically, to shut everything down. let's take a little bit of a listen to what some of them had to say to me and then we'll talk after. >> the last time i spoke to someone in the country, they told me sometimes i hate being iranian, not because of the identity but because i don't see

a future in this country for myself. >> she left iran nine years ago. now 22 years old, she is the same age as mahsa amini, the young kurdish woman who died three days after being arrested by the morality police for allegedly violating the country's strict dress code. her death triggering what many are calling a revolution in iraq, led largely by women. >> what would you be doing right now if you were in iraq? >> i would be probably on the streets protesting. >> alongside the diaspora, she and others are leading a movement online. >> i feel like i left them in this prison and now i have to do something over here to, you know, to free them from it. >> in 2019, she started an instagram caught middle east matters and now uses the platform to amplify the voices of iranian protesters. >> your family is in iraq. are you worried the government will target your family members? >> of course.

but i'm scared but the moment i become scared, iranians have won the battle. >> they launched an investigation called the iranian diaspora collective. they say it focuses on the will of iranian protesters, and hope it will bring about change there. >> to see the faces of young people in iran and many, many, many of them are young women, young students, queer people, honestly it feels like a duty, i don't know that it feels like a choice at this point. >> and elica lebon has 300,000 on tiktok and her most watched video has 6 million views. >> i've said this before, and i'll say it again, say their names to save their lives. >> with the conflict this iran, it has been scattered, with the government at times managing at times to shut off electricity and the internet. limiting access into and oust country. instead many protesters are

saying they are relying on the diaspora to be their voice. >> they are inspiring us. and we're inspiring them. and it is not stopping. >> that's what i see. don't be afraid. don't be afraid. we are all together now. i will not rest until you are free. we will not rest until you are free. >> some of the questions, what is going to happen with this? and these protests, how effective will they be, certainly the first major challenge to the iranian regime, iranian regime, and what is the sense here in the united states? remember, a lot of people, as you know, who fled and live here now, fled the last revolution. >> it is the first major challenge within this scope, right, within this age and era of reach that they have. i think anybody that sits here at this table could tell you, they don't know what is going to happen in iran, i don't think anybody knows what is actually going to happen in iran, what we do know this is a sustained

effort domestically in iraq, and this is a country that is suffering economically. >> the lights went off on you for some reason but keep going. there is a country that is suffering economically, inside of iran. these are people that feel like they have nothing left to fight for. and because of that, they will put everything on the line, their lives, their freedom, on the line, for change. >> are they willing to stand the threats from the regime, the death penalties -- >> they have been. >> the murder. >> they have been. it has been sustained. and they have been continuing to stand up to those threats domestically. >> it's incredible. >> that's what is astounding to me and diaspora, because they say we have a duty to put this out there. >> it is incredibly brave. i have a lot of iranian's friends, i know you do a news show, put this on the news and keep this in the headlines because it is a really big deal and they obviously feel for their families back home.

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president joe biden is in boston today, where he's meeting with the prince of wales, during william and katherine's first visit to the u.s. in eight years. the british royals are stateside for the earthshot prize ceremony which awards $1 million to winners of projects focused on resolving climate issues by 2030 but the big trip is being eclipsed by controversy, and not of their own making. joining me now is nbc news chief international correspondent keir simmons. obviously they want to come and talk about the earthshot prize and these companies are trying to fix or reverse climate change. unfortunately, there's other stuff happening. >> reporter: that's right, we're standing here, on what they call the green carpet, you see what they did there, instead of the red carpet, and we're expecting the folks to arrive, william calls his super bowl, but you're right, there are all of these

other controversies that have been swirling around, harry and meghan netflix trailer released, you know that is a minute long, and threatening, if you like, to be damaging, and then of course, this racism controversy, from buckingham palace. that happened earlier in the week, and it is very difficult for william and headlines, i suppose you could say, except now it is a real opportunity i think for him to do that, while meeting with president biden, and also at these events, i think he will hope that he can be a little bit more, a bit more positive day but i will say people around the prince say he has been focused very much on his causes, and hasn't let this other stuff swirling around bother him. i know he does pay close attention to what is written though, so you can bet that he will have noticed and aware of what is being said. >> we will watch out for the meeting and for the prizes and the companies doing exciting stuff, later tonight.

keir simmons, thank you so much. that is going to do it for me today. hallie jackson picks up our coverage next. jackson picks up covegera next. (scrooge) bah humbug! my signal is totally ghosting me! (cecily) you need a better network. 'tis the season to switch to verizon. they'll give you the new iphone 14 pro. (scrooge) amazing phone! (vo) this holiday season verizon gives you the new iphone 14 pro. plus an apple gift, like apple watch se, ipad and beats fit pro. all on us. that's a value of up to $1900. (scrooge) wow! (vo) and there are unlimited plans for everyone starting at just $35 a line. it's our best deal of the year.

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