on why they asked for these documents in the first place and how they got them. >> yeah, this was something that chairman neal asked for several years ago, katie, and it worked its way through the corresponds. ultimately, the courts deciding they did have the right to the information. that's how a few weeks ago this committee ended up with them. look, there's a lot of pressure from some democrats within the committee, congressman bill pascrell who has been unspoken about them. but the one thing that strikes me, what one congressman on the committee said, this being released is not actually any

different than the information we have about every other president. because most people just do this in the course of running for president in the first place. trump, of course, you and i remember this from the first run was out of the ordinary for not releasing his tax returns. that was something, of course that continued through his time in the white house, saying they were under audit. then ultimately, they end up here. this would, frankly, level the playing field in terms of giving the public transparency into the investigation. >> vaughn that donald trump is saying about this? >> reporter: donald trump is inside of his private club at mar-a-lago as we speak. we just checked his truth social account. there's nothing from him ahead of this meeting. of course, we can go back and play sound bites from donald trump talking about the audit that he would consistently say as to why he would not release his tax return. this is an individual who did not want to fully disclose what his financing, where his lending

was coming from. this is somebody who, you know, "the new york times" has been on the front lines of reporting out and providing us a better understanding of exactly where and who he was financially tied to. where it lied. and of course, it was worth noting that was the family business, was found to be criminally guilty, or guilty, on criminal tax fraud charges spanning a 15-year period so for donald trump this is a financial situation in which he has largely been able to side step politically. but one that comes at a time when he's mounting his own 2024 presidential run. the question comes to what extent does further scrutiny from other republicans like a glenn youngkin try to hone in and when you're talking about defrauding the american taxpayer. >> you're very intimate with what could be in the returns of

course, you've seen some of the past returns, what are you watching for today if we do get anything? >> well, i think we're going to see two things come out of it. i think there's going to be some stuff that's not going to be shocking to people. that's that we'll see a lot of losses on his tax returns, and that's consistent with what with saw -- i have a theory about donald trump. i think the main reason he didn't want the tax returns that he's fought for so long to keep them is because they reveal he's a really bad businessman. i think that track has been laid in reporting but what i'm thinking about, what i'm going to be looking for, it is information on the audit that we performed out there, it's a huge audit that could cost him a hundred million dollars if it goes against him. i'm going to be looking for information on that, if it's been closed. additional information but vaughan made a good point, the trump organization was convicted of tax fraud in a new york city court. and i'm just wondering what else

the irs could be up to in terms of looking at donald trump embedded in the investigation. i think that's the main thing that i'm going be keeping my eye on. >> i'm sure people are going to be asking themselves whether there's criminal exposure that could be revealed in this. i wonder is there anything that we might find out from these returns that prosecutors, especially in new york haven't already seen. i mean, is it asking too much to say there might be something there. >> well, you know, he wanted to keep his tax returns secret because there's criminal activity in there. you rarely find in a tax return, just on the face of it that there's criminal activity. there's actually a line in the tax return where if you've accepted a bribe, you have to check it and say that you have. so if the feds find out that you have, and you didn't disclose it, you can be in a lot of hot water for that. but you don't usually see it just by looking at the returns. it takes -- taking those tax returns and putting them

together with bank information and other financial documents that you come together to get tax fraud. that's what the manhattan d.a. did. and we've done that with some of our work at the "the new york times" to show that donald trump engaged in tax fraud. i'm not expecting that. you know, there is a line on the tax return where is you have to say, you have a foreign partner. we have seen decades of his tax returns. he's never clicked that. he's always had one partner. and we've never found a secret russian partner that he might have. keep in mind, the tax returns that we're going to be seeing are. ones that he filed with the full knowledge, look, he was in office, he was president, probably pretty -- you know, they've been scrutinized pretty carefully with an eye they could come out one day. >> are we going to see regarding, this is maybe a tax return filed for the organization. anything regarding some of the money that he made from his properties. from, i don't know, the trump hotel in d.c. his other golf resorts during his time in office. could we see anything like that

that might indicate, you know, foreign businesses or foreign governments paying a turn amount of money to stay there. and what that could mean. >> that's not going to be in the returns that we're going to see, as far as i know. but i think it's also, just -- because you asked an important question about are we going to see how his businesses are doing. a lot of people are asking about that mar-a-lago, for example. that's not what was in the information, as far as we know. that the ways and means got. they're getting his personal temp which is a landing page for the tax returns and then a few businesses. "the new york times" has seen all of his corporate returns for each of his individual businesses up to 2018. we have a lot of information on them, you know, most of them are losing money is what we found in kind of shorthand, but we're not going to see individual returns coming out today for -- i think there's some, a little bit we'll get on bedminster, there could be surprises today, i don't

know, we're all excited to see what's going to happen, but, no, you're going to see the 1040 which is the landing page. >> vaughn, one more question for you, it was a bit muted yesterday in terms of the action for the criminal referrals. among republicans have you heard anything today? i know you were talking about potentially this is something that some republicans who want to run against him in 2024 could use, but are you hear any preemptive attacks from anybody on the committee who might in the past have told us that these tax returns don't matter and this is something that democrats want to use to hit donald trump over the head with, for lack of a better phrase? >> reporter: right, republicans have consistently been unwilling to use any of these issues, narrative issues that have otherwise damaged donald trump to their benefits. you know, i was standing outside of mar-a-lago shortly after the fbi had executed the search warrant and pulled out classified and national defense

material. and nobody was on the attack against donald trump within the republican party. and you should not expect it. over the course of the 2016 pain, we heard from a plethora of republicans who defended donald trump and his finances. i was just on the phone with somebody who was longtime involved in the republican party at a high level nationally. she left the party, i should say, its apparatus, just a few years ago. and largely, the folks who are working in the republican party today at the state level and national level are individuals who were elevated to these positions largely because of donald trump. and so when you're looking at the framework of who is going to step outside of the lines and try to use whether it be these tax returns that come out this afternoon, for criminal referrals from the j.- committee, and ron desantis in tallahassee, and glenn

youngkin said he's focused on the months ahead. and adam k kinzinger is out of e congress in a few months. >> vaughn hillyard, ali vitali, thank you for starting us off. with me is barbara mcquade and spokesperson and msnbc security analyst once again matthew miller. guys, good to see you. barb, for the tax returns, anything you're going to be watching out for? >> well, i don't know that we'll find evidence of crimes that are previously unknown. if the justice department or the manhattan d.a. wanted this material, they had the ability to get that through other means. i think in instead, you know, criminal accountability is not the only way to hold people accountable. i think some of the things we'll be looking for is what is it that donald trump has work today desperately to hide for all of these years. it's six years of returns, as we

heard there, these are returns likely prepared with an eye towards eventual disclosure. i don't know there's anything that is especially egregious here. it may show things like income coming in from means that is inappropriate for a president. foreign office is s inappropriate for a president. foreignources, for example. it may so deductions for things that might be inappropriate or unlawful. and it's difficult until we see what's there. when somebody works very hard to keep things that are normally disclosed out of the public domain, i think it usually raises an eyebrow there might be something worth seeing there. >> matt, let's talk about yesterday. the criminal referrals from the january 6th committee. doj, you understand that agency, you understand how they work. what is the reaction, the likely reaction if you haven't heard from sources or a likely reaction inside doj to rempls

referrals to the house select committee? >> i don't think the referrals themselves is that important to the department of justice but the underlying information. the department does have a duty when it gets referrals like this to investigate them. sometimes, they do that with a full blown investigation. sometimes, they take a summary look and decide they don't need to do anything further. but that is in cases where the department is not already investigating a crime. we do know that's not the case here, the justice department has a full blown investigation and they're interviewing witnesses and bringing them to the grand jury. so i think it's important to get witness transcripts and other information that the committee examined because it might provide doj with information it doesn't already have. or they can look at places where they've interviewed witnesses and also spoke to the january 6 committee and find out whether those witnesses have lied to one

or both of those set of investigators. or whether it's a witness they plan to use in a trial down the road, whether there's conflicting testimony that would undermine the testimony. they have a lot of evidence to get through. they said they're very eager to get their hands on, i suspect, if they get that within the next few days it will be a busy day. >> no rest for the weary. and it was raised yesterday that the prosecutors might not want this to be made public because potentially interviewing any witnesses going forward, who might have spoken to the committee, it gives those

on this evidence, wait for the conclusion of the department of justice investigation and then make it public. so at the conclusion of the doj investigation if it's in the next congress, the january 6th committee will no longer be in existence and the members who had access to that information will no longer have the ability to make it public. so while -- i think that is a legitimate concern. i do think in this case the interests of transparency and given the american public the full record probably wins plus, twitter told him to get lost. cnbc has exclusive reporting on what elon musk did after twitter

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if and when title 42 does lift,

and they'd need more resources in order to accommodate that capacity. >> so they say they need more resources, where could those resources come from? who are they asking? >>. >> well they've asked fema and they're expecting about $6 million to come from fema this week to pay the city back. look, what they really need is space. they say that they want military bases like fort bliss that took in so many after begans. it's not far away from here. they want that open to be able to take in these people. right now border parole can't hold them. there's simply too many people, and there's just -- there's too much here for the city to take in. they've also talked about trying to work with cities in the interior of the country, some of the ngos here have been sending them to churches in denver, colorado, for example, but there is a lot of angst here, a lot of worry about title 42 lifting and

not being able to take in those people that they say that as many as 20,000 migrant are waiting in juarez for title 42 to lift. >> so is that what they're coming -- is that why so many are there now because there's this expectation that title 42 is going to be lifted? is that -- has that -- has that been circulating? >> reporter: yeah, it's a good question. i've been speaking to a lot of people about that here today. they heard title 42 would be lifted. they started coming. they made their migration. many of them leaving venezuela anywhere from a few weeks ago to a few months ago trying to get here. they heard title 42 would be lifting and then they heard, you know what, they could get in because in a lot of cases, they're able to get in despite title 42. either they're in a nationality that mexico won't take back, so they're allowed in or because border patrol is stretched so thin, we've seen many be able to walk right in, which means they don't get apprehended, they don't get counted and oftentimes they're not able to get the medical care or the care from

shelters they would typically get. there's a process that is usually in place here at the border that i've seen the past nine years i've covered this. this process isn't being followed right now. so many of these people are coming through and sleeping on the streets and if title 42 lifts, they expect that really to be a magnet for even more migrants to come hear. >> all right, so carol, the biden folks have until 5:00 p.m. today. what are you hearing? >> reporter: well, look, katie, the white house has said and the administration has said they have a plan for how to deal with this. that's what we've heard from administration officials. we know that they've been actively working to try to come up with a plan to deal with this. while there's a stay here, we don't know how long that's going to be, and even if it is for some time, and it doesn't -- title 42 doesn't wind up lifting tomorrow, there's an awareness within the administration that this is going to happen at some point, and so what they say is that they have a plan. they intend to roll that plan out, and that it's something that they feel is going to address a lot of these problems.

i spoke with one white house official, katie, who said, look, it's going to be a messy couple of weeks, but once our plan gets rolled out and starts to take effect, things will be fixed. now, that very much remains to be seen, but there is a real effort and a scramble in the administration to try to come up with something to address what they expect to be a really large influx. >> do they want title 42 lifted or is title 42 convenient for the biden administration? >> that is not the administration's position that they want this to be lifted or not lifted. they're saying that it's out of their hands, that this is not something the white house has been very careful to say this is not something that is -- something that they get to decide. it's up to the courts. it's up to the cdc, it's a public health policy. so that's their posture. while there may be some officials in the administration who are breathing a bit of a sigh of relief that potentially this could play out a little bit

longer and they don't have to roll out this plan right away, there is this recognition that this is happening at some point. this keeps getting delayed and delayed, and they're going to have to address this issue. we don't know a ton about the plan that they intend to roll out, but officials have said there are elements of the plan that would go into effect regardless of whether title 42 is lifted. that it's been in the works for some time, and then there are very specific elements tailored to title 42 lifting. >> carol lee, thank you very much, and julia ainsley thank you as well. and coming up, will he or won't he? to step down from twitter? he held a poll, and the users of twitter said yes. cnbc has some exclusive reporting on what he's doing now. don't go anywhere. plus, what happened when crypto king sam bankman-fried reversed course in a bohemian courtroom and what his bankrupt company is asking of the politicians he donated to.

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the 30-year-old was expected to agree to extradition at yesterday's hearing according to a source with direct knowledge of the situation. but at the last minute he changed his tune and demanded to see a copy of his federal indictment before agreeing to return to the united states. it was described as an emotional court appearance. sam bankman-fried was seen with his head in his hands, his knees shaking and the courtroom was packed with media. joining me now is nbc's jake ward. so what happened, and what does this mean for the time line on when he might come to the united states? >> well, katie, this wild day in the bahamas really was the result of just mixed expectations about what it was that was going to happen with sam bankman-fried. the bahamas has an extradition are treaty with the united states, but if you choose to fight that extradition treaty, it can take months, maybe even years for someone to be transported to the united states. we had expected sam bankman-fried not to fight extradition, because his lawyers

and prosecutors had expected him to go along with it. then he shows up in court yesterday visibly shaken and demands to see the charging documents. that gives the sign that maybe it's going to slow everything down. but then he's remanded back to the local jail and then tells his lawyers, let's go forward. so it may be that he's very much on a fast track to face the music in the united states. we're looking forward to a possible hearing later this week, but at this point, it lax looks like these not going to fight extradition against the advice of all of the attorneys we've spoken to and will move to the united states quickly. >> what about the political donations ftx made? what's the company asking for with that money they donated to all of these lawmakers? >> what a terrible position that the lawmakers who received donations from sam bankman-fried and ftx are in. according to a press release, not only do they need to come to those people who received those donations in order to help repay

the creditors owed billions of dollars in the collapse of this cryptocurrency exchange, but even if they've given that money on to charity. several democratic lawmakers have chosen to do so, presumably thinking that would help them reputationally and be a good way of washing their hands of this money. turns out ftx won't be satisfied with that. even those who have received third-party donations, given it away to charities, they're going to come to those charities like the salvation army in order to get the money back. everybody in a terrible position as the ripples of this cryptocurrency scandal continue to expand. >> remarkable, jacob ward, thank you very much. should he stay or should he go? that is what elon musk asked twitter users this week. more than 17 million votes came in. the results were clear, step down they said. now cnbc reports musk is actually looking for his replacement. what kind of ceo could that be? joining me now is insider

columnist lynette lopez, her account was suspended by musk and remains banned. he had always said he only planned on being ceo for a short period, right? was this just a way to get it off his hands by putting this poll out there, or did he think that he was going to win? >> i don't think that he thought that by the time it would be time for him to search for a successor if that's in fact what he's doing. i don't know. but i don't think he expected to leave twitter in worst state than he did when he found it, so that's one thing. i don't think he expected to lose the poll the same way i don't think he expected to be booed when he went on stage with dave chappelle in boston the other week. i don't think he understands the way people feel about him, the way people feel about the app. he's surrounded by yes men, and reality doesn't necessarily penetrate that bubble very easily. what kind of ceo would he look for next?

i still question whether or not he's looking for someone. he has been fighting against the results of the poll ever since he started tweeting again saying that it's probably run by bots, he commented under another poll that showed him winning that was supposedly a more scientific poll that was like an hour ago. so he can create a world for himself that isn't necessarily reality, and he has the money to support that world to live in it. he might construct a reality where that poll is false and just keep it moving. keep it going exactly as he is. >> all right, okay. let's put that aside for a second and just think about the idea. if he is looking for a new ceo, what sort of person could he be looking for? any indication from the way he's run his other businesses, the way he's talked about this one, who that might be? would it be somebody that would do his bidding or someone more

independent? >> the only somewhat independent ceo in his world is the ceo of spacex, and she has had his back when he was accused of sexual impropriety, all kinds of stuff. she has shown herself to be loyal in specific situations, but i think spacex is the only one of his companies with an actual competent ceo that does the job. tesla, he's the ceo. no one's running it right now. it doesn't seem -- it's very confusing obviously for shareholders also. >> the stock is tanking. >> tanking. people are confused. the rest of his companies, he is a micro manager, so i can't imagine if he's still interested in twitter and what happens in twitter that he would actually hire a ceo with their own brain and their own ability to make decisions. i think he would still be breathing down that person's neck. >> so interesting, emily, on the subject of spacex, bill nelson

who's the nasa administrator was asked whether he was concerned or he asked the spacex ceo whether he should be concerned about elon musk's twitter behavior, and she assured him no, there was some separation there, i guess. tesla doesn't have that as you were pointing out. how much money from your reporting does elon musk need right now? i mean, how in the hole is he? he keeps selling this stock for tesla. what else could be going on? >> well, the x that we're missing in this equation is how much money twitter is making, how much money twitter is bringing in. we know he needs $1.4 billion by the end of the year to pay twitter's debt bills. we don't know how much money he needs to keep the lights on on twitter right now and we don't know how much money he needs to like, you know, pay legal bills, all sorts of the things. >> will we know that by the end of the year, which is next week? >> i don't know. i don't know when -- what

kind -- when he has to pay his twitter bills. you know, i don't know -- the bankers will be working this out. this will come out very slowly on wall street. you can see the market kind of starting to digest it. one of the reasons why the stock is down this morning is because a bunch of the wall street banks who put out research every morning are now like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. this guy is really losing it. so that realization is starting to hit. people are going to start doing the math, and it's going to look uglier and uglier. >> anyone going back to advertise on twitter that might have frozen their accounts to wait ask see what happens. have things gotten better and have people started going back on these companies, or have we only seen more companies flee? what's the status? >> i see fleeing. i do not see reports of returning. i see reports of fleeing. i've -- you know, "the financial times" report that had elon is calling some of these people and screaming at them. it's not exactly the way you'd

treat your customers, so it begs the question how does he think this business works. how does he think twitter works? it's very confusing. tesla shareholders are watching this wondering how much of their money he's going to have to throw after this, and over at morgan stanley, his biggest creditor, they're talking about, well, this twitter debt, it's kind of worthless. we're not having a good time selling it. maybe we want to swap that out for tesla debt. that would put even more pressure on tesla because, you know, nobody actually knows the value of twitter right now. let's be real. >> lynette lopez, thank you very much. i'm sure all things will be told eventually. appreciate it. coming up what a bombshell report just revealed about an incoming republican congressman and why democrats are being blamed for not knowing this stuff. later, the unspoken potentially deadly crisis facing new mothers.

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♪ ♪ wayfair, holiday your heart out. ♪ wayfair, you've got just what i need ♪ i'm a privet sector guy. i was born and raised in abject poverty in this country skpshs only in this country does somebody who comes from a basement apartment in jackson heights like i did is able to rise to become a successful business person to then run for united states congress. >> on the campaign trail george santos loved to boast about his business stature, his ability to pull himself up from the boot straps and to be as successful as he is today. new reporting from "the new york times" suggests the now congressman elect is not the man he says he is, not a former employee of citi group or goldman sachs, neither of which had knowledge of him working there. not a graduate of baruch college where officials found no record

matching his name and date of birth, and not the founder of a non-profit animal shelter, which the irs says it can't find records for. george santos himself has not yet responded, but his lawyer says, quote, it is no surprise that the congressman-elect has enemies at "the times" who are attempting to smear his good name with these defamatory allegations. joining me now is nbc news capitol hill correspondent ryan nobles. no one did any vetting on this guy? >> reporter: well, it's interesting you ask that question, katie. democrats actually did do a pretty lengthy bit of opposition research on george santos. the problem may have been that they focused on the wrong things. you know, a lot of what they focused on were his claims of election denialism of the 2020 election, his connections in support of the former president donald trump. they did get into the questionable, you know,

questions about his financial background, the nonprofit that he supposedly ran, but they didn't really do a lot to highlight it, and there just really wasn't a lot of local media coverage surrounding this particular race. and so no one picked up on the inconsistencies in his background in the way that "the new york times" did. and so, you know, there are, of course, a lot of questions being raised by -- of democrats here in washington and in new york in a district that joe biden won and was previously held by a democrat, why someone with so many questions in his background was able to win a race like this in a very competitive election cycle. >> okay, so they did some backing or vetting but not all of the vetting. that we've now seen from "the new york times" that so much this is not verifiable, goldman sachs can't find a record of him, baruch college can't find a record of him.

not registered as a nonprofit for the animal organization, and there's more in the "new york times" reporting. that's just some of the things they pointed out. does it mean anything for his election, for his status as congressman-elect? >> you know, it really doesn't, katy. he won the election fair and square, at least in terms of the casting of ballots and the counting of ballots. it's not necessarily against the law to lie about your background. now, the questions may be raised about his financial ties and in particular the fact that he loaned his campaign somewhere in the range of $700,000. and so there will be questions raised about that. that is theoretically something that could be handed over to the congressional ethics committee. it could also be something that the federal election commission looks into as well. you know, there are some very narrow possibilities that the members of congress led by whoever turns out to be the speaker at that time, if it's kevin mccarthy could vote to refuse to seat him in his seat

because of these questions, but that is a real remote possibility. it is very likely that he will become a member of congress, and the other thing to keep in mind is that right before this "new york times" story came out, he came out vocally in support of kevin mccarthy's speakership and of course the margins are so narrow for mccarthy to hold the speakership and for republicans to maintain the majority that they probably do not want to mess with the seat of a guaranteed vote on the republican side. so they're not going to take these dramatic actions. really, the only way for democrats to rectify this problem for them is to beat him again in two years, unless, of course, there's something in his background that comes out that is explicitly illegal that could lead to some sort of criminal prosecution. at this point there doesn't appear to be anything more than he just made up a bunch of stuff about his background. >> okay. thank you very much. coming up next, the mental health crisis that's striking new moms. and what is being done about it?

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are actually preventable. one of the first large scale reviews of post-pregnancy deaths revealed that the current leading cause of death in new moms is not physical complications, but mental health. joining me now is nbc news correspondent morgan radford, morgan, and you're very pregnant, so watch out for this, it's really hard having a kid, and the aftermath of that mentally can be really tough thing to go through, especially for moms who might feel like there's not a lot of help out there for them. >> and even preparing for it can be mentally pretty tough, right? it's something that a lot of new moms don't talk about. imagine that you're talking about mental health, but 80% of those deaths being preventable. it's pretty striking. a lot of groups that advocate for moms and mental health say while this data isn't new, the data is new, but it's not surprising. these groups have been sounding the alarms for years. now one group of women is hoping it will help draw new attention to the problem and they say they have a plan now to do something about it. >> for dr. lucia, pregnancy and

motherhood are all part of the job. >> room three is ready. >> reporter: but when she had her first child, even she was caught off guard. >> i myself had a very hard time during my pregnancy and postpartum. i believe it was the anxiety first that it ended up getting into some depression as well, and it was -- it was intense. >> reporter: a secret crisis that we now know is happening among new moms nationwide. for the first time, a large scale review of post-pregnancy death reveals that the number one cause of death for new moms is actually mental health, with white and latina mothers the hardest hit. >> and the most striking data point, researchers found 80% of these deaths were preventable. >> it's a phenomenon that's been unspoken for years but one they know firsthand. >> i knew immediately something

was wrong right when i got pregnant. my mood shifted. never had thoughts of harming myself in my life, and all of a sudden these thoughts are snapping in my head every day. >> i was losing weight. i wasn't feeling like myself. i didn't want to talk to nick, i wasn't bonding with the baby at all. >> reporter: which is why hudson became a psychiatric social worker focusing on new moms, and fira helped create momma, a startup with an app that helps screen new mothers with depression and connects them with the help they need. >> women can screen on their phone where they're most comfortable. doctors can get the results back instantly. >> reporter: a free resource that's been recognized with an award from health and human services, and one that's now being used by nearly 100 doctors across three states. >> if i had come across that app, it would have made a complete different. >> reporter: a new kind of tool aimed at tackling a nationwide problem for the next generation.

is the cdc's division of reproductive health has been working on preventing deaths like these. if you're a new mom or even know someone who might be experiencing these kinds of complications, you can go straight to cdc.gov/hearher. it has resources for women, personal stories and resources there in spanish for people who need it. >> it's okay to not be okay. it's okay to not be okay. make sure you got someone to it talk to and someone to help you get through it. >> it's okay to not be okay. >> i appreciate that. i wish you nothing but the best, of course. that is going to do it for me today, lindsey reiser picks up our coverage next. wrinkle guard penetrates deep into fibers, leaving clothes so soft, wrinkles don't want to stick around. make mornings smoother with downy wrinkle guard fabric softener. ♪ what will you do? ♪ what will you change? ♪ will you make something better?

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