with no line activation fees or term contracts. saving you up to 60% a year. and it's only available to comcast business internet customers. so boost your bottom line by switching today. >> a very good day to all of comcast business. powering possibilities. you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. welcome everyone to alex witt reports. we begin with some breaking news. there are two new statements from the biden camp, this on the classified documents found in his home and office. this literally came down within the last five or six minutes or so. let's go right to nbc's aly rafah. she is with the president in wilmington, delaware. i know you just got your hands on, it as have i alley, and so let's talk about what we do know.

what are you seeing? >> yeah alex, after a click glance at these two statements, we are learning the big big news here is that there have been more classified documents uncovered from his wilmington home. this is coming from the statements according to richard's of, or the special counsel to the president, as well as bob bauer, president biden's personal attorney. basically, bob bauer is saying that as a personal attorney, he went to the penn biden center, and he and his team, as well as president biden's wilmington, home went to the home, and because he does not have a special security clearance to be able to handle, these he then informed the doj and the national archives, and then richard bauer, the special counsel to the president in his statement says, quote, because i have a security clearance, i went to wilmington thursday evening to facilitate providing the presidents personal counsel found on wednesday to the justice department. while i was transferring it to the doj officials who

accompanied me, five additional pages with classification markings were discovered among the material with it for a total of six pages. the doj officials immediately took position -- possession of them, and this is coming alex after we know that those documents found at the penn biden center, they were found in november, turned over to the doj, and the national archives them. to thethat second tranche of documents was found in president biden's garage as wilmington home. that was back on december 20th, and then there was one single classified document that we know of that was found in a quote, adjacent room according to the special counsel. but now we are discovering that there are more documents, we don't know where those documents were found, but he said that when that single document was found, back on january 11th, that there were more additional documents found with that, and this is raising a new set of questions, as far as the level of classification

that these new documents hold after earlier this week, that one of those classified documents at the pin biden center was the highest level of classification. so definitely a lot more questions in addition to the outstanding ones that we already have for the biden white house in light of this new news about more classified documents that we just discovered. >> yeah, it's been a lot treated like just the last few minutes. ali, thank you for that. i know you will continue reading this, and joining me now on the phone, we have charlie savage of the new york times. we also have lisa rubin, of course msnbc legal analyst, and she is joining me. we should be able to see on camera second, there you are lisa. all right charlie, you have written the definitive article on this. and it is breaking news, incredible developments, but let's put this all into context. how do you see it? >> i think the biggest question raised on its face is, why did the white house say on thursday, hey, there was one more record

found in the space next to biden's garage, and then it turns out there is six more pages of classified documents found in his garage. it is an obvious question to ask if it's a larger critique that the white house has been reticent to put out everything you know about this. they sat on it for almost three months and then only when there is a leak did they acknowledge it on monday, and even then, they only said they acknowledged the document at the think tank and told the public that there had been a second tranche found in november in his garage. and so the answer in these, to one this day on one on thursday, when there is six on thursday, because they did not know about the other five pages on thursday morning when they put out that statement. a statement of been found wednesday night by a biden lawyer, a personal lawyer who did not have a security clearance, and therefore they stop looking in that state on wednesday morning. and did not go further on thursday, later, when the justice department goes to pick up the document, a white house lawyer who does have the security clearance went to

facilitate that, and that's when they looked a little deeper at that and found the other five pages. and so it wasn't an intentionally misleading statement. >> in the statement that we got, that is certainly as we get richard's of, or special counsel to the president, and he talks in the statement that was released by the white house minutes ago, that doj officials were with, him and so he immediately turned those documents over into their hands. let me ask you, lisa, as an attorney, with some privy information with what documents like this might look like, when they talk about one document versus six now, is it possible that all of these pages, because they are not talking about separate documents, at least, and charlie, you can correct me this is true, but it seems like they're talking about numbers of pages. does that mean distinctly different documents? or could this be one fema of a document that would have six pages to it, if you get what

i'm trying to ask? is this one big document? that is six pages in total, or is this like with six different documents? is this like with six differen do>> not at all clear, alex. i trust that the story that we are being given right now is true, as charlie just explained, that there was a personal lawyer who discovered one page of the document, without a security clearance, and that person identify the document, and pulled it out, and set it aside. and then a later point, time someone from the white house counsel's office accompanied by the department justice found those other five pages. whether that is one unique document or multiple documents, i think remains to be seen. that is one of the many questions that people like me have about this situation, which as it unfolds, i still believe there is a false equivalence with what we understand about the trump situation, but many of those differences are collapsing. one of the differences that are collapsing is the disparity in volume between the two. now, to be fair, there are over 300 documents with classification markings that

have been found in total belonging to former president trump and retained by him. but we started this journey understanding that there was one document found in the penn biden center, and then that evolved into fewer than a dozen, and now understand from public reporting this morning, that there are on the whole, i believe, around 20 documents found between the two locations. and it is not clear that we are done with the evolution of this, as i think the white house's statement and bob our statement this morning, sort of implicitly recognized by saying that regular ongoing public disclosures would pose the risk that, as for the information develops, and this provided on this periodic basis may be incomplete. that was the gist location for not telling us about the sooner. but it seems to me that that also applies to the present in which we are living, alex. >> and charlie, give me observations as a seasoned reporter, how much does this drip, drip, drip effect that lisa is describing, damage the president? would it be better if it was

like, we found 20, here it is, that is it. >> well two things, one to answer your question, my understanding is that these are a total of six pages discovered between thursday night and wednesday night and thursday, and it's more than one document but fewer than six documents. -- >> okay, so what it has multiple pages? >> at least one with multiple pages. and i don't know that actually makes a difference in the world, but obviously, the drip is politically damaging to biden, it gets negative headlines, it is a new round of social media commentary, and he keeps the story alive, and on the other hand, if you take their statements here in what they are saying at face value, they don't really have a choice, to some extent. if they had said on monday, well, there are stuff down in the garage, and stuff found in

bidens, nevertheless will still be true that from the dock you found, wednesday they announced it right away, and then another drift and more documents were found. they're in this kind of trap where they don't know everything. it was the justice department got involved, which i think was eight days after november 2nd discovery of the initial batch, at that point, they weren't able to do their own investigation i believe because the justice department would not want them free interviewing witnesses that the justice department wanted to interview about. what where these documents, who passed what, up how did they get here, where were they before? that would be colluding the investigation, and you try to get the story straight, you're trying to compromise what is true here, or to put the best spin on things. but they will have a full understanding of themselves. there it would all these documents are. there are not many pages there, are they don't know the contents are. and everybody wants them to say, that and they are kind of darned because we are on tv. if they do, or they.

don't >> thank you for that. okay lisa, i will get back to a trial just touchdown, and what you said as well. that is, the lack of ability for the white house to address what is happening in totality. right? the complete perspective, because they don't now. but from a legal perspective, how many times have we heard from anybody who is a defendant in any kind of a case? . i'm not saying the specifics of what kind of situation this is, but always attorneys suggest, be quiet. don't say anything until you have all of the facts. is that kind of the protocol but the white house is following, and is that wise in this situation? . who >> you know, alex first of all i want to be clear that neither former president trump nor president biden is a defended right now. at, most both men are subjects of ongoing investigations by two separate special councils, and i think it's important clarify that. you are right to say that in an

ordinary investigation, the best advice is to shut up and stop talking. but, in both cases here, we have people who are either a declared candidate for president united states, and then incumbent president who is likely expected to run here. and therefore that legal advice has to be balanced against the politics here. now, our colleague jim psaki early in the week so that the white house overall strategy here was short term pain for long term gain. they believe ultimately that president biden will be exculpated, and those around him to, but there is one other complicating factor that i want to draw your attention to, and that is that some of the people doing the speaking here, may end up as a witnesses. you will recall that when we first heard about the story, the narrative was, the documents at the penn biden center were discovered by the presidents personal attorney's. one of those personal attorneys is now doing the talking, that is bob bauer. but i imagine at some point, someone at the special counsel's office is going to want to talk to mr. bauer if he

was indeed the person who discovered that document, and anyone else who is with him and doing the cleaning up of the penn biden center, about why you are there for the search. what was the nature of your search? who had access to those documents before you went in on november 2nd? there are whole panoply of questions that they might want to pose to the same personal lawyers that are doing some of the speaking to president biden right now. >> yeah, charlie, on a political level, the president has said sometime at the beginning of the year, he was going to announce his intentions on whether not he was going to run for reelection in 2020, four. people assume that that was going to be january, it is now at the 14th, and so we are halfway through. if the president has made up his mind, and we are here to have decided, i'm going to make that announcement pretty soon, does this, should they situation delay? that what are the political ramifications of this? >> well, as i mentioned earlier, it is certainly a series of bad headlines for biden.

this was not a good week for him, starting with the disclosure on monday. that is what has been happening, and culminating, we thought it culminated in the appointment of special counsel, and now it is culminating in this. and so he will certainly want, i would think that his political advisers would want to get a little distance from, this have something else be the forefront of peoples minds about biden. some kind of policy when or something before he moves into an announcement, if that is what he does. but i am not a political professional, so maybe they are some other idea. >> you have pretty astute political observations, my friend, but let me ask you lisa, which of these special counsel investigations into documents, whether be trump or biden, which one do you expect will take longer and why? >> i expect the trump investigation will take longer. that is for a couple of reasons. one, jack smith, although he inherited investigation that was far more mature than, for example, the investigation that

rob her as the special counsel in the biden situation, is about to commence, it's also much more complicated one, and he of course has two investigations under his mandate. but part of the problem for him also is the volume and the willful-ness of president trump's conduct in that situation, and trying to understand a host of questions, including the former presidents involvement in packing up his materials, when he asked people to say, one of the first 15 boxes return over the national archives, in february of 22. and the continued obstruction of the former president, over things make it far more complicated. that having been said, alex, we are at the very beginning of this biden situation, and with each day, particularly thanks to the intrepid reporting of people like charlie, we get a new and developing understanding of the situation. and so based on the facts, as i know them, now my expectation is that the trump investigation

may take longer to resolve. that having been, said it is not clear to me that either one of them is on a very long time horizon. special counsel jack smith is expected to make a charging decision at least with respect to mar-a-lago sometime by the summer. >> okay. so charlie, two part question to, you the first, do you agree, do you think down trump's investigation will take longer than that of joe biden's, i guess barring any further developments, for the discoveries, and second part of it is, how long. how long does this take for joe biden? >> i do think, i totally agree that the trump investigation or matter is much more complicated. and even though it has been taking place since august, there is a lot of reason to think that investigators have been stymied and slow down, to not talk to them, and there is a fight over executive privilege and granddaddy testimony, et cetera. the biden strategy seems to be

to cooperate entirely, tell them everything that they need to know. ntirely,do what they say to do,t seems to be similar. there is not been a question of obstruction, there is not the volume that was at mar-a-lago, there is not the issue of subpoena that was apparently implied with it, and they need to answer some basic questions. who packs this stuff up. how did it end up at these locations? did anybody access it in between, where was it just sitting there in storage? and that is it. about, point they will have the information about what facts exists to make the decision about what is with willful misconduct, here and what is not. and so i think that the biden inquiry has the potential to not take very long at all, unless there's a bit complicated we don't understand about yet. >> okay, well given what we know about this, far i want to thank you charlie savage for running up so quickly and getting with us on the phone as quickly as possible, and lisa, we are scheduled to talk with

you a little bit later. we have a lot more developing at this, hour and washington could be heading towards a major showdown over the debt limit. treasury secretary janet yellen warns that the u.s. is expected to reach the maximum amount that it can borrow on thursday. washington post reports house republicans are preparing a controversial plan to use that saline gauthier shunts to make some major spending cuts. meanwhile, some new details emerging of republican george santos and his embellished background, as calls grow for the congressman to resign. the new york times reports santos's lies or well-known through some well connected republicans doing his campaign, and yet many look the other way. and a former member of the january six committee is sounding the alarm over speaker mccarthy's willingness to allow public access to unruly security footage from that day. former congressman elaine luria tell innocently see why she thinks the idea could backfire

on republicans. >> they are the same people we. sad we have done enough to ensure security within the capital, well, if you really saw this accreditation the capitol, showing every evacuation route, every corner, and every bit of information that would lay out a roadmap for someone who wants to come and try to do something like this again, that is really dangerous. >> what we now have the number of reporters in place to go over those amendments for. us we will begin with, you nbc's julie tsirkin on capitol hill. so republicans, actually, her preparing for a big fight over how to continue paying for the nations bills. how are they responding to treasury secretary pretty gloomy warning? >> well, look, treasury secretary yellen made her opening claim, and now this group of house republicans are making their is. and talking about the chip roy faction of the deficit, on the house freedom caucus in the house, and that is the group of people who actually were able to get some concessions out of mccarthy in order to trade their votes, essentially. in a trade for their support.

and the issue, here and this is different from the debt limit fight that we've seen even 2021 when mcconnell, who's the house minority leader in the senate, look, we can't default, we want to come to a compromise here, and that ended up giving solved. this is different because now we have a group of republicans who hold a lot of power and being able to virtually remove or challenge mccarthy's speakership if he does not go along with what they had conceded. now the big thing here is, you see on your screen, january 19th on this upcoming thursday, that is when yellen says that we will get our debt limit. the u.s. will hit its debt limit, and they will use emergency measures to keep that from happening until june. that is the big deadline, fair and we thought that this would actually happen in little bit later this time, or maybe in the fall. this means that negotiations need to happen. now republicans in this group, one of their plans now is potentially peeling back some funding from some other non priority items they say. it is not clear what they will

agree on, but about 80% of the revenue has been allocated already. so this is about a 20% cut, and about one trillion dollars that they will have to make if they don't go past that debt limit and increase it. >> okay. let me ask you about something else. the moves by the new gop led house this week certainly raised alarms. what are we hearing in general from democrats over these alarms? >> yeah, look, the big thing here is that kevin mccarthy, even the press conference on thursday, continues to say false claims about some members, including eric swalwell, adam schiff, and key members of the intelligence committee, saying that because of some allegations, including the false claim that swalwell was involved with a chinese spy, nearly a decade ago, that was unproven, while people looked into him, and because of this reason, he will not be allowed to sit on the intel committee, and neither will schiff, who told me this week, he's not sure when he will get reconstituted. i wanted to take a listen to something disturbing that eric swalwell shared, a threat he

received overnight, a violent threat, in light of these comments from mccarthy. >> getting your -- kicked off of the committee's legal problems. the american people are going to be happy into ecu hand for the neck until death,, that, legally. through trial. have a nice swing bleep. >> so look, this is obviously scary for these members of congress, and it is all part of the republican agenda to investigate and conduct oversight and to retaliate by what they thought was unfair from democrats. that includes the january six committee, look at their members, subpoenaing members of congress, including kevin mccarthy, and so this is all a political fight that of course you have some really practical and dangerous and scary implications. >> okay, one little detail we want to make sure to reference, eric swalwell was the one saying those comments. thank you julie, thank you so much. and let me get the straight, americans are concerned about inflation, environment, health care, and a front burner issue

for republicans is, listen to this. >> i do think it is funny that absolute utter republican out there, what they're, like you can take my gas stove for my cold dead hands. >> now, consider this headline from wall street journal editorial artist last night. progressive democrats are really coming through the kitchen appliances. we are going to unpack this, and we're going to take the delivery guy to, next because we will be cooking at home. ill be cooking at home ose my son. you think, why us? you know, why me? why my child? [ marlo thomas ] you can join the battle to save lives by supporting st. jude children's research hospital. it is such a gift to give hope back to a family. as a dad, i'm eternally grateful. [ non-english speech ] [ marlo thomas ] join st. jude with your debit or credit card

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breaking news. we have two new statements from the biden camp on the classified documents found on his home and office, including the revelation that five new additional documents were found in wilmington. joining me now, pennsylvania congressman madeleine dean, a democratic member of the house judiciary and financial services committee. so, congresswoman, this all went down about half an hour or so ago, and so i would love your reaction to this latest

news. >> well, i think what i will say is that, like president biden, i take classified documents very very seriously, any classified information, and so what i believe is that it is appropriate that eric garland has put an independent counsel, special counsel, on this investigation, because that shows independents of the department justice, it shows equal treatment under the law, and what i do see is that, so far, the reporting shows a very different set of scenarios between what has been found in the biden garage or office, and of course what was hidden by mr. trump for a very long time. >> from a political perspective, does this concern you at all that it may affect the goodwill towards president biden at this point, in the potential announcement as to his deciding to run in 2024.

we don't know that that is the case. they've been presumptions that it would be, but that has yet to be announced. >> no, i don't think it will hurt him. as i said, it will investigation will reveal what happened here. was there some willful concealment, as it seems to be indicated in the trump set of scenarios, not to mention a tremendous number of documents, or was this something done by somebody else, negligent. i don't think that will impact the presidents decision or reality of running or not. what i think really americans care about is what is going on with our economy, and what we see is the biden economy, and economic plan, is working. inflation declined for the six consecutive month. we are now down at 6.5%. still too high. but we will be going in the right direction. prices are falling. that is what people care about. >> yeah, they do. they also care about this.

we will ask about the house republicans who are using their new majority this week to take action on abortion. one measure is meant to protect the life of babies who survive abortions, and then the other condemns violence against antiabortion organizations. those measures prompting congressman nancy mace to suggest that her party didn't learn anything from the midterms. take a listen. >> you want to get serious about saving lives in protecting women's rights? then everybody -- every woman should have access to birth control, and that is something that both people and the aisle could -- and something that could be passed into law for the president united states. something thatbut we are racinge fringes. i have a colleague in the house right now that wants to bring a bill to the floor that bans all abortions with no exceptions. what are we doing here, that is not where 90% of the country's. >> i mean, she makes a valid point. how is it that the message on abortion from the american

public delivered in the midterms does not seem to register with republicans on the hill. these are pretty much their first agenda items once they took control. >> and i agree with my colleague on the other side of the aisle. what this demonstrates, and not just these two abortion bills, but the other bills that came forward is a lack of seriousness on the part of the republican conference, as they have been hijacked by the far-right, nancy mace is correct. this is a lack of understanding of where people are on the subjects. it is a lack of understanding of the medical side of a late term abortion, which is often a very serious fetal abnormality that is heartbreaking to those parents of the infant. and it is a basic misunderstanding. the born alive bill of the criminal code, it is already a crime to kill an infant. this was a strange and misguided message in this bill. >> so we have touched on the

economy and abortion, another issue that is probably not a priority for the american public, but it is a hot agenda item for the republicans, investigations of president biden. and include that special subcommittee investigating the weaponization of government and the oversight committee leading a probe into biden's family businesses among others. are republicans taking their cue from donald trump, who is clamoring for investigations into the man who beat him in 2020. >> i don't know about that. we have seen from the fringes of the republican conference, this die hard interest in investigating and distracting from what they claim that they were running about. remember, they were running about the border. they were running about crime. they were worried about inflation. but yet this first week they showcase none of those issues. and so they are not serious. but what is beyond not serious

is the dangerous nature of this subcommittee. the weaponization of the federal government, and we are going to, and this is a subcommittee within the committee that i hope we will be sitting on again, which is judiciary, that we are going to be investigating the investigators, trying to learn what is going on and investigations, investigations that may include some of my colleagues. some on the committee, this is a very dangerous blurring of the responsibilities. so this is really about unserious chaos and the cap -- caucus, but what they don't realize or seem to care about is the dangerous nature of it. the very threat that you just showed to my colleague, eric swalwell, this is where these kinds of demonization's, disinformation goes, to the threats of violence. i hope the republican conference gets itself in order to tamp down on these threats. >> i'll get your reaction to something that speaker mccarthy

said this week concerning former president trump. let's take a listen to an exchange that he had with a reporter. here it is. >> there is been some interest among some of your rank and file republicans to possibly introduce a -- trump's impeachment and possibly vote. when you think of that? is that something that you'd be able to -- >> when you find the final information that the russia document was all a lie, when you watch one through, i can understand why members wouldn't bring that forward. >> you are a trump second -- manager, and so it is a safe republicans try to expunge one or both of donald trump's impeachments? >> well, it would reveal their ethos in the credibility, which would be zero. you don't get to erase history. you don't get to erase the wrongdoing of a president, whether it was with a phone call, with ukraine president, or whether it was the incitement of insurrection by

american citizens against american citizens at our very capitol. mr. mccarthy and his far-right colleagues, who clearly have control over him, cannot erase history. they never will. >> and lastly, i'd like to get your thoughts on republicans latest culture war if you will, protecting gas stoves. the outrage on the right comes after a report this week that the consumer product safety commission was considering some new regulations regarding indoor pollutants. what here is democracy -- democrat congresswoman alexandria causeway cortez who posted the video on social media explain what she would support a ban modesto's despite easing one. >> i do think it is funny that the absolute utter republican meltdown where they're like, you can take my gas stove for my cold dead hands. how do you talk about gas stoves, you have a gas stove. first of all, first of all -- and second of all, it doesn't even matter.

by that logic, these are the people who said that we never should've gotten rid of leaded gasoline. just because someone may have driven a gasoline car. science evolves and gives us new knowledge with time. >> so, we should say that the white house has made it clear that it does not support banning gas stoves. however, republicans are still telling republicans that the democrats are coming with your kitchen appliances. what is your reaction? >> i'm trying not to laugh. this is a manufactured distraction from what matters. i will go back to my original comment. do we have serious people in control of this republican led congress, with just a four vote majority? or do we have unserious people. and have to say, on a personal note, i finally got a gas stove. it cooks and it helps me cook very very well. certainly what we want to pay attention to health and safety,

but this is absolutely a manufactured distraction. i don't think this one is going to go very far. >> okay, congressman madeleine de, my friend, i will apologize for the last minute, minute 15 that we had to spin on the topic, but thank you very much for impact as always. some new reporting on the trump -- all the potential candidates have one thing in common, that is later. subway keeps upping their game with the subway series. an all-star menu of delicious subs. like #4 supreme meats. black forest ham and genoa salami. you can't stop that much meat. you can only hope to contain it - in freshly baked bread. try subway's tastiest menu upgrade yet. i've been sniffing this hoodie for weeks and it still smells amazing. but there's no way downy unstopables will keep this thing smelling fresh until the super bowl. but go ahead, try it for yourself with this coupon right here. where my finger is pointing! over 12 weeks of freshness. you gotta sniff it to believe it. - life is uncertain. everyday pressures can feel overwhelming it's okay to feel stressed, anxious, worried, or frustrated.

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boost® high protein. now available in cinnabon® bakery-inspired flavor. learn more at boost.com/tv ♪ i like to vöost it vöost it ♪ ♪ my vitamins can boost it ♪ ♪ i like to vöost it vöost it ♪ ♪ we like to (vöost it) ♪ ♪ (sfx: tablet fizzing in glass of water) ♪ find your vöost: n osts. ♪ ♪ (vöost it) ♪ >> breaking news on the devastating in california where some back-to-back storms are moving in this weekend after that storm of atmospheric rivers wall at the state over the past couple of weeks, excuse me, leaving at least 19 people dead, thousands under evacuation orders are without power now. joining me from moderate county california, and you see scott cohn. so, welcome to talk about the damage and the impact that the storms are having a california's drought. is there anything good to take from this?

>> there's not a whole lot alex, and so i will tell you, the rain has let up a little bit, so there is that, and the steelers wind, and the ground so saturated, so where we are, that behind me is the salinas river. it is a major tributary, major waterway i should say in this part of the state. it is above flood stage, this road is cut off, it is expected to remain above flood stage until at least mid week. and the concern is that if things continue this way, this waterway, it is intercepted by a number of key roadways and if they are cut up, a whole section of the monterrey peninsula in california becomes effectively an island. and this is just one example of the impacts from this storm across the state. >> we cannot emphasize enough how we can eliminate and reduce the amount of fatalities just by human behavior, whether it is don't travel if you don't

need to, watch out for the first responders. don't go around barriers. don't go into floodwaters whether you are walking, standing, driving, it is really imperative that you stay away from standing water. don't drive around the barriers. it is critical. >> at least 19 people dead thus far, and 12,000 people evacuated at this point, and about 15 million people in california under flood advisories. and alex, you asked about the drought, and we are certainly doing better than we were going into this rainy season. but still about half of the state continued under extreme drought, and we really don't have the infrastructure and the rain is coming too fast and too early in the season to guarantee that the drought is over with. so basically, it adds insult to injury. >> yeah, so i'm worried also about the agricultural lands there in the central part of california, just over the

mountains from where you are, scott, and so we'll talk about that is well next time. thank you. riddle me this, what happens when you mix george santos, matt gates, in a couple of webcams? what some are calling the theater of the absurd, that is next. plus, the new article out of the new york times, santos's lies were known to some well connected republicans, and so who did what, and when, ahead. d when, ahead. but we got to sell our houses! well, almost perfect. don't worry. sell with confidence to opendoor. yes! -done. request a cash offer at opendoor.com there are some things that go better...together. like your workplace benefits... and retirement savings. with voya, considering all your financial choices together...

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wasting no time, launching multiple investigations into president biden. the house oversight chair asked the treasury department to turn over documents related to the business ventures of president biden's family members, including some hunter biden and brother james biden. house republicans this week also proving the formation of a select subcommittee on the weaponization of the federal government. those are just two of several probes planned in the newly republican led house.

joining me now is kurt bardella, democratic strategist and former gop spokesperson for the house oversight committee. and katie hill, former democratic congresswoman of california. welcome to you both. kurt, it is interesting talking to you about this, because you have an interesting perspective after working for the house oversight committee, so tell me what you think the goal with all of this is, with these investigations. whether it's james comer, or jim jordan, why are they doing this, and how will they go about it? >> well i think that the real goal is purely political, it is partly to cover up the ascension and the feeling that exist within the republican conference that barely was able to even pick a speaker of the house, and so they use these investigations and the bombastic posture and rhetoric to try to smooth over the eternal dissensions, because they know that they don't have a governing majority. they know that they can't even agree amongst themselves on any kind of substantive a policy

agenda. for all of the rhetoric that we heard about the economy, about inflation, about gas prices, it is interesting that the very first posture that they have in their new majority has nothing to do with any of those issues, and everything that they do with political investigations targeting their political adversaries. >> and on the heels of that, katie who do you think is more at risk, politically, for all of these investigations, is it president biden, or is that the republicans. could this backfire in the gop, and end up helping democrats in the next election? >> i definitely think that is possible, because the circus that if the gop is going to be on full display, the challenge that we have is, and i think it's really important for us to not make the same mistake that the gop made with the january six committee. we need to be, democrats need to be on this committees and continuously pointing out what a farce this is. i think that if we do that effectively, then the american

people are going to see exactly what a joke this republican conference is. >> okay, let's move to the daily beast, which has some new reporting on donald trump's confidants gaming out a vice presidential pick. they are all women. trump world is thinking about at least a far, nick marjorie taylor greene, tulsi gabbard, kristi noem, and kari lake. and so katie, tulsi gabbard is particularly interesting, because she was the democratic colleague in congress, and how did she go from that to being considered a potential trump pick? >> yeah, it's very bizarre. she was actually pretty progressive on a lot of issues when she was a democrat in congress, and i think that we have seen it pretty self interested shift. you have the fox news contributor ship, you have now her name is being banded around with us. i don't think that is actually going to go anywhere.

i think that it is just talk, but you know, i am more disappointed in her shift then the republicans or trump world using her and some way. >> look, the other names are interesting as well. the extremists here in this group, katie, kari lake. marjorie taylor greene. what do you make of it? you said you don't think it is too serious about tulsi gabbard. are either of those candidates seriously being considered? >> well i think that that is probably very realistic possibility. marjorie taylor greene and terry lake are both darlings of the trump wing of the party, and so it really depends on how much of this is about going towards his base, and how much of this is actually a serious attempt to win an election and appeal towards moderates, and i don't think that he has proven to be a particularly strategic

candidate, and so loyalty is rewarded in this world, and i think it's very possible that we see somebody like kari lake, and frankly that's a benefit to democrats. they are both ridiculous, and i don't know any other way to put it. >> yeah, the gop strategist told the daily beast what trump learned is that you cannot pick pence and haley's, who are the establishment, does that make sense to you? and if, so there's this group swing a little too far to the extreme? >> i don't understand the political calculation that after watching candidate after candidate who wore the maga flag get rejected by the voters, including kari lake in arizona, while republicans of any stripe would think that putting them on the ticket will somehow benefit them, and that they would perform any better in 2024 than they did in 2022. it makes absolutely no sense, it shows that the republicans continue to learn the wrong lesson from failure.

what is interesting, after the midterm elections, we heard them say, they're going to do another autopsy to find out what went wrong. what went wrong is that you nominated a bunch of lunatics, and the voters rejected them, and so putting one of them on your ticket in 2024? i can't think of a better gift for the democratic party. >> i wanna turn now to republican george santos who certainly getting hammered with the calls to resign from congress, including from his own party. santos responded in an interview with fellow republican matt gates, take a listen? >> i was elected by hundred and 42,000 people. until the same hundred 42,000 people say they don't want, me we will find out two years. all the people who need to resign, i beat them by double their margins in the victory, because i outworked every single one of them. >> embellishing once resume isn't a crime, it's frankly how a lot of people get to congress, and we want everyone to be honest, and again, you've acknowledged that, and you're working for it going forward. >> same question to both of you. first of all, is this embellishing, or is this line.

and secondly, does he survive the entire term? you first, katie. >> well, we have seen that republicans don't call on people to resign. especially when you have such a slim majority. i don't think there's any chance that mccarthy or republicans in congress are going to seriously try to get him to resign, because it means a special election, and it means potentially losing that seat. to a democrat. it's a huge difference between the democratic caucus in the way that we hold our own members accountable, and the way that republicans do it, which is purely in the entrance of political gains. >> 15 seconds to you to answer, kurt. >> yeah, it is lined by the way. embellishing is one thing, and playing on a volleyball team that you didn't, do payment your mom died a 9/11, 15 years later, claiming that you are jewish, give me a break.

this is fantasy land, and that shows a lot that kevin mccarthy needs george santos so much that is going to tolerate this kind of treasury, this type of fraud, and 144,000 voters in history, they don't get to vote for george santos, because they have no idea who the heck this guy is. no one knows. >> guys, thank you so much for the chat, and katie, i love the picture of the baby, and the cat who just, appeared that is fun. >> i can't do anything about. this >> it's all good, we welcome them both. are you guys, thank you. the jaw-dropping revelation this week about the former president and the plan that he considered for north korea. sometimes, the lows of bipolar depression feel darkest before dawn. with caplyta, there's a chance to let the light shine through. and light tomorrow, with the hope from today.

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guaranteed for 3 years. (einstein) brilliant! >> we are learning some new (vo) only on verizon. details about trump's original plan for manchin conflict with north korea. back in 2017, using a nuclear weapon, and blaming it on another country. in fact, that is just one of

countless stunning nuggets in a new addition biography of john kelly. trump's former chief of staff, of course, it is in the book, donald trump versus the united states, inside the struggle to stop the president. it appears exclusively in the paperback addition, which comes out in three days. i'm happy to report it is already sold like hotcakes. the author, michael schmidt, he is also the washington correspondent with the new york times and an msnbc national security contributor. welcome. this is pretty extraordinary. 13,000 words you put together for this. how is it that donald trump went from calling kim jong-un little rocket man to then exchanging love letters with him. was it john kerry -- kelly who said that we need to try diplomacy, how did that evolve? >> john kelly comes in as chief of staff in july of 2017. he thinks that donald trump needs process, he thinks donald trump would be better staffed, and he quickly realizes that donald trump is dumber, more

limited, at least here, and more than he ever thought he was. and he would listen to anything. and kelly was terrified that trump's ignorance was going to lead to a lot of problems, but the biggest problem was going to beat north korea, because trump was using public rhetoric that he wanted to use force against north korea, and he was also saying this in private. and kelly was terrified that the north koreans would try and take some sort of action thinking that they may actually attack them. kelly tried to repeal the trump, and said that hundreds of thousands of people will die, that didn't work. kelly said that you can destroy the economy, that did not work. it was only when kelly said to trump, and kelly not knowing what to do, he was the chief of staff to the president united states. there was no one else to call. there was no one else to help them. and he says to trump, what if

you try to become his friend? everyone dating back to eisenhower, nobody has done this. you are the ultimate deal maker, you can do this. kelly knew that this would not lead to a denuclearize north korea, but he knew that trump's ego may be willing to go along with this to ratchet back that rhetoric and take the possibility of a catastrophic war from starting off of the table. >> here's something that's pretty striking, it's what you're right. kelly would have to remind trump, he could not share classified information with his friends. previous trump advisers have recently spoken out about how he would often ask, we have to keep these documents, actually we can't. talk about that. is this something that kelly expected, and how often did this kind of thing happen. >> i think kelly was terrified about a lot about trump. the north korea stuff, the way that he talked about classified information, the way that he

would use a personal cell phone to talk about people. president of the night station abusing their personal cell phones to do that. but kelly, didn't -- trust the trump knew how to handle classified information. the trump would talk openly about these things, and kelly would try and stop trump from doing things that could damage national security. here's the chief of staff to the president of the united states concerned that the president of the united states could damage national security. remember, the president united states supposed to be in charge of protecting the country. but trump behaved in such a abnormal, immoral way, in kelly's eye's, that he didn't trust what trump could do. >> it is something else that just struck me as bizarre. the ongoing competition, if you will, that you write about

between ivanka trump and melania trump. and that kelly had been told earlier in the presidency that ivanka wanted to perform the ceremonial duties and have the status of a first lady. what is that about? >> john kelly is a serious a national security figure as we can find. a four star marine general. who comes into the white house, he thinks that he needs to put in some structure and better staffing for trump. all of a sudden, he is confronting far more frivolous issues like fights between the first lady and ivanka trump, and ivanka trump trying to maneuver, when kelly was told, to become the first lady in this ceremonial way. i've written a book about at one point, kelly had to go to amara and tell her to stop having parties at the white house pool. she was using the white house pool. and so, again, here's john kelly concerned that we could

be on the brink of war with north korea, trying to mitigate these issues that are not a serious, but we're front and center and the trump white house where things were off of the rails. >> having met john kelly, i have to say, that would scare me if he came at me and said, no, this is ridiculous. he is a very austere, he is a boss, he is a four star general. >> i think the most telling thing that i found, one was that kelly later told confidants, i did know that they created people like that, and he was talking about trump. the second thing is is that when kelly was a teenager, he went to enlist in the marines, and he went through the whole medical screening, and they said, at the end of the day, we have good news for you. if your eyesight doesn't exclude you, your bone spurs will. and then kelly had bone spurs. kelly fought the doctor, and he said, you have to let me go.

he says, you have to let me, go and the doctor says, no, you're medically disqualified, and kelly fought the doctor, the doctor said, okay, our mere marines. kelly said marines. >> bone spurs, somebody i actually didn't because a bone spurs, allegedly, and we know who we're talking about there. michael schmidt, it's a great book, i'm so excited that it's doing so well, but for anybody who hasn't seen it, here's the name. donald trump versus the united states. inside the struggle to stop a president. aptly named, thank you michael. some new information about the accused killer of four idaho college students, you hear from a woman who said that she went on a date with him, next. not so smart. (cecily) well, there is a smarter way to save. (einstein) oh?! (cecily) switch to verizon! (vo) that's right. for a limited time get verizon unlimited for just $25 a line, guaranteed for 3 years. (einstein) brilliant! (vo) only on verizon. when cold symptoms keep you up, try vicks nyquil severe. just one dose starts to relieve 9 of your worst cold and flu symptoms, to help take you from 9 to none. for max-strength nighttime relief,