hamlin continues incredible recovery, there is speculation by the potential appearance before tonight's playoff game against the miami dolphins. nbc sports mike florio is hinting at the possibility yesterday. hamlin pay history makes a surprise visit during a practice on saturday. bills linebacker matt milano posted this picture on his instagram stories. it has been nearly two weeks since hamlin collapsed on the field, suffering cardiac arrest. he was released from the hospital last week. thanks for watching the katie phang show. this, morning as always. velshi is next. >> today i, velshi the weekend on capitol hill is going to be a big. one high stakes showdown is just days away. the consequences could be dire and will depend largely on which faction of a warring republican party actually takes charge. plus, why we are still learning about additional classified documents than in president biden's delaware home.

what we know about how they were found in what the biden team is doing about it. and a dangerous escalation into the battle over medication and abortion. we will touch down in the state whose attorney general has threatened to prosecute women for taking abortion pills. plus, they would've been dr. martin luther king junior's 94th birthday. tomorrow, we celebrate his. life later this, hour though, we will talk with his. work velshi starts now. and good morning to you. it is sunday january the 15th. i am ali velshi. we begin with a dire warning for the american economy. a debt ceiling showdown that is set to explode this week in congress, with potentially disastrous consequences. but in order to understand what is at stake, let us start with a history lesson and a historic visit. on, friday president biden hosted the japanese prime minister fumio kishida at the white house. an important visit meant to highlight the close relationship in the alliance between those two nations.

among the many problems of the discussion, russia's war in ukraine, china, the constant escalating threat of north korea, and ways to make japan a greater military power. which is something the country has deliberately avoided. it's post-world war ii existence. by the way, speaking of russia's brutal war and can she does visit, russia's former president dimitri moore of has reacted publicly to this meeting. i don't want to show. said publicly stating that the shooter was showing complete subservience to the united states, and should ritually disembowel loop so. he's a bit harsh to be discussing on sunday morning. later in the show -- for minister under cause your joins me. but first, i want to go back to that brief history lesson that i promise you. because japan is interesting for another reason and a stark reminder to american lawmakers,

about what happens when you play with fire in a fragile economy. sometimes the fire explosion has catastrophic consequences. coming up in the 1970s and 80s, heading into the nine days, was the fastest growing large economic power in the world. you remember sicko watches and tvs and cars. then in the, 90's economic disaster. the start of where this is called the lost. decade characterized by what is essentially a zombie economy that was not quite that but was not alive for growing either. it was caused by a number of factors. but essentially it was a mix of a great is good mentality coupled with high interest rates. we've caught something called stagflation. stagflation is a stagnant economy sort of like a recession but not really sinking but not going anywhere along with high inflation. it is extremely difficult to get out of that. japan's law stepping turned

into what is known as the lost twenties. and then they lost 30. it is something to pain is actually still dealing with. in fact, the day before he met with biden at the white house, japanese prime minister kishida implored business leaders in japan to accelerate wage increases. warning that the economy could once again fall into stagflation if we just felt too far behind rising prices. yet another thing with america should think about. let's bring it back home to the, u.s. because newly in charge republican lawmakers in the house of representatives allowed the casket to push them into a dangerous and down debt ceiling staff, stagflation or something like it could be the future of our nation. while recent data shows an inflation is slowing, down and is still, high maybe three times as high as we needed to be. right now, the future of the entire economy, we'll look strong in america, is uncertain. and the threat of recession is very real. on thursday, four days from now, treasury secretary janet yellen says the united states will hit what is known as he gets

healing. this is a self imposed a limit of how much debt the u.s. government is allowed to take on. to cover the gap between what the government takes in and what it spends in a yearly budget. that is financed by bonds that the u.s. government issues and sells to investors and ordinary people. the bond is a promise to pay back the loan to the certain interest rate. and that rate is relatively low because alone to the u.s. government is considered the safest investment on the planet. however, if the debt ceiling is not raised, as some house republicans are threatening, that becomes less safe. it causes a catastrophic chain of consequences, including a spike in inflation and simultaneously to bring an uncertain economy possibly into a recession. a stagnant or shrinking economy, plus inflation, is stagflation. when we get ourselves in that position we could be in for a very difficult few years. economically. imagine our lost, decade lost 20 or lost 30 years, all because some house republicans

want to play politics with america's prosperity. but not all republicans to do. joining me now is the former republican congressman fred upton of michigan. congressman, good to see with you for being with us this morning. i was careful to say not all republicans would have that sort of result. a lot of republicans would like the government to spend less money. or make sure it spends no more than it takes in. that is a different discussion then not raising the debt ceiling, and understanding the consequences of that. >> you have to raise the debt ceiling because you're not gonna balance the budget every night. it took us a long time to get here. thinking about your show this morning, and a law 50 years i think we had a balanced budget maybe two or three times. there was under newt gingrich back in the 90s. of course back then we had a majority leader. and even though we had a balanced budget and actually a surplus, he wanted to use the surplus to reduce taxes and not pay down the debt. i was among those that want to

talk to you begin to pay down the debt. it's a lot like your credit card. at the end of the day, you are the yelling came up with a bit of a surprise announcement next thursday's the day, quarterly payments are due on tuesday. a pretty big infusion of cash that is coming in. so this is a warning. but at the end of the day we're gonna have to deal with this, and she is good number of different lowers the chicken maneuver to actually forestall that cliff for a number of months. at the end of the day, we've got to deal with this. the extend the debt ceiling. all the time you see different sides look for something to come along with it. the issue that kevin mccarthy is going to have now as speaker is it if you thought last week was a hard, it's going to be easy as to what is going to happen. not only to the debt ceiling but also trying to pass the

budget in the house and get to the end of the fiscal year. and get the bills done without a shutdown. that is going to be the really hard work that has to happen. >> you use the word cliff. this is probably gonna show up almost in june. because as you said, president secretary yellen can move things around a little bit. barrasso money here and use it there. but by june there will be no more options. something will be missed. some payment will be missed. , some people think that as long as you are the bond holders, you are. good but actually does the u.s. government. the u.s. government misses a payment to anybody, with the social security or traffic controllers, is the same problem. >> that is right. prison guards or the fbi or wherever those trucks go out, somewhat you hit the ceiling and just like your mastercard a reset card would say, you overextended -- forget about filling out that gas tank or whatever. days we will get that ceiling without some issue, some lobbying cast.

>> fred, i've been looking to talk to affordable. weeks i'm sure you know this. people were talking about u.s. possibly becoming speaker of the. house right? when they couldn't come to some agreement they, said he was a person who republicans might agree with? or maybe it will get even some democratic support it becoming speaker of the house? and your name came up as a possibility. tell me why, and tell me how that played out for you? >> well, dawn bacon is a good friend. he has come up next. i drove through his -- a couple weeks ago. i hope nobody went to vegas. i hope nobody -- that this is going to happen. as you know, many of your listeners, no you don't necessarily have to be a sitting member of congress to be speaker, but we knew that we were going to go through this tough work for. kevin i was a given, supporter i've known him well for a long time. so it's bacon. and what you would call a governing republican. you get things done. and at some point, things

collapsed. don bacon and maybe a word of frustration who talk to him, next said, if i'm fed up that you're gonna propose that. took me a little bit by surprise. it was not going to happen. but we do have the government. that is the point >> tell me how that goes. there are i think 20 members of the house who are recalcitrant. we think there are at least 18 republicans who won in districts where joe biden won, and several more republicans who are in closer competitive races. and then there is i don't know what you want to call, it but the chaos caucus in the republican party. we are not sure with a driven by, political self preservation or -- something is going on it is not going to be about, governing as you just described. what does it look like to you? if we get to the state ceiling issue for instance, are -- there are only need to be six. of them are there six republicans who might say, we

are republicans and we don't want to be democrats but we may have to vote with democrats on this one? >> a couple of. things look at the last congress. pelosi, hannah innocence, the same margin that mccarthy does. a number of times, whether passing the chips legislation or re-casting the bipartisan infrastructure bill, avoiding a shutdown a day or two before christmas this last, year there were a number of republicans who say, hey, we have to prevent chaos from happening. we need to govern and we need to move forward. we will see how the dynamics work in this congress. again, govern right now is 222 but i would imagine that one of the things i think you could go to vegas on is, i don't think santos is going to be a congressman a few months from now. at least on the house floor, and voting. kevin's margin is a democratic seat. so instead of 2:22 into 21, you are going to have another

special election comments this next month for the democrats to be elected there. for the first-time, taking -- in place. that margin gets ever so smaller. and at the end of the day, whether it is casting a rules package, getting bills to the house floor and what i would call pheromones which are jermaine to appeal, a crisis of how are you going to pass the budget? remember the budget does not really have to be signed. it is just a roadmap for the congress to follow. they are gonna be some really tough issues coming ahead. and to get something on the presidents desk, there are plenty of issues we are to be dealing with. immigration is of course at the top of the list. you have inflation and energy issues. all those things, i think there is a sweet spot. which is why i was on the problem side solver side of what's actually get things done. >> i hope you're. right as you said, i'm talking

to don baking in the next hour so help you turn it to be right. i'm glad to have you, here thank you for joining us again. former publican congressman fred upton of michigan. who for a hot second some people thought might be the speaker of the house. we will talk again. thank you. >> all right. >> still to come on this hour of velshi, another batch requests of documents found in president biden's home in delaware. what the white house is saying about that. next. plus, honoring martin luther king junior be on his fight for racial justice. dr. king was a warrior for economic equality. i will talk to the man who is working to keep dr. king stream alive today on that front. and the electoral college probably confuses you. it may confound you. but did you know that like many systems in this country, the electoral college has, believe it or not, some racist origins? i'll bring you the explainer, the best explanation will hopefully ever need. er need. struggling with the highs and lows of bipolar 1? ask about vraylar. because you are greater than your bipolar 1, and you can help take control of your symptoms - with vraylar.

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confirming yet another batch of documents are classified, markings found in the presidents home in delaware, eat documents found on thursday, news of the discovery was made public yesterday afternoon, increasing the total number of batches of records discovered to three. a small number found at the presidents office at the pan biden's entering washington d.c., another set, what i believe to be a single document in the room adjacent in the garage. been some talk about rooms adjacent to the garage, only partially new, been trickling down in the last week, biden's lawyer saying they've been cooperating with the investigation, they continue to do so, white house lawyer richard sovereign statement, the president is immediately involuntarily provided a pen biden documents the archives, and we welcome them to the department of justice. on thursday, the justice department pointed the gentleman, robert her as special counsel, to investigate

the handling of the classified documents. documents were said to be from biden time as vice president in the obama administration. joining me now, charlie savage, washing in correspondent for the new york times and an msnbc contributor. charlie, good to see you, good morning. charlie is also the author of a bunch of book called power wars, the relentless rise of presidential authority, secrecy and take over, the return of the imperial presidency in the suppression of american democracy. truly, what do we know about this? we've heard some rumblings about a room adjacent to the garage, the fact we are looking into it seems this is one extra document of six pages? >> no, not correct. it is more than one document. whatever the number is, it comprises a total of six. there are several in their. yes, so on thursday morning, the white house has acknowledged an nbc news scoop from the day before that there as been a further batch of documents found in biden's garage, back in november.

also, they threw a line in there that a single paged document has been found in a room adjacent to that garage. turns out that was separated by eight months. that page had been found this wednesday night, just this wednesday night on the other bad came in from december. but then on thursday night, a white house lawyer had gone to the justice department lawyers at the wilmington house, looked through other stuff which had been found with that one page, and found five more pages of stuff. so is israel trickling out of additional discoveries, not very large but certainly it is unpleasant for the white house to have this constantly having new quote unquote discovery. >> what is the distinction between the garage and room adjacent to the garage, they are not thought of as the same thing, or because they were discovered at different times? >> i think the latter, they had searched some boxes. i assume, it sounds like they

were shipped to the garage after biden and obama left office, and found one patch of stuff in december, then they realize there was some other stuff, a box, taken to a room next to the garage, just this week, they looked in there and found this other stuff. >> thank you for your reporting, charlie. charlie savage, the washington correspondent for the new york times and then msnbc contributor, we will work with you to follow the story. coming up next, one red state governor is threatening to prosecute women for taking abortion pills, finding out the state of his own states law. his own states law. ook back on them, i look forward to the chance to make new ones every day with verzenio. verzenio is proven to help you live significantly longer when taken with fulvestrant. verzenio + fulvestrant is for hr+, her2- metastatic breast cancer that has progressed after hormone therapy. diarrhea is common, may be severe, or cause dehydration or infection. at the first sign, call your doctor, start an antidiarrheal, and drink fluids.

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next on behind the series... that run with the champ was magical. i mean the tender chicken, the peppercorn ranch... i love my rings but i'll cherish that lunch... forever. the subway series. the greatest menu of all time. (cecily) what's up, einstein? (einstein) my network has gone kaput! the subway series. (cecily) you tried to save a buck on it? (einstein) not so smart. (cecily) well, there is a smarter way to save. (einstein) oh?! (cecily) switch to verizon! (vo) that's right. for a limited time get verizon unlimited for just $25 a line, guaranteed for 3 years. (einstein) brilliant! >> abortion was a losing issue (vo) only on verizon. for republicans in the midterms, upon taking power in the house last, week one of their first acts was to pass a pair of anti-abortion bills, including one, misleading lee called a born alive bill. this is the type of anti-abortion legislation used by opponents to falsely equate eve --

abortion with infanticide, it is not new. in fact, a very similar born alive bill was wrongly rejected last december by voters, when it was offered as a ballot measure in the solidly republican state of montana. the bill has no chance of passing, in the democratic-led senate, before be signed into law by biden, but it shows how the republican party's agenda continues to align with anti abortion policies, rather than with the general public. as the new congressional term began, the heritage foundation sent republicans a letter signed by dozens of antiabortion groups, urging them to quote, legislate abortion policy at the federal level and pursue a robust pro-life agenda, and quote. they went as far as to propose that the republicans pass a nationwide ban on abortion after the sixth week of pregnancy. meanwhile, in the absence of the federal abortion protections, the biden administration has taken steps to make abortion care more accessible. the fda recently announced changes which will make it easier for patients to obtain abortion pills, what we have been discussing is when is it medicinal abortion?

soon, local pharmacies can dispense these for the first time, patients will be able to receive them through the mail. the ease of access in which abortion pills will soon be available is not sitting well with officials and states which are the most hostile towards abortion. earlier this year, alabama's attorney general steve marshall said women could be part skewed for taking abortion pills. this, despite a state law but explicitly exempts patients from being punished. handmaid's tale, much? the law quote, does not provide an across the board exemption from all criminal laws including the chemical endangerment law, and quote, referring to a law passed to protect children from matt lab fumes, and has nothing at all to do with abortion. they are going to use a math lab law to prosecute women for taking an abortion pill, that's where we are in america, in 2023. he's walked back the statement since then, but offers no solace to people in alabama, who might need abortion care now or in the future.

damage done. the message is clear. alabama continues to be one of the most hostile states, enough executives will continue to push its rhetoric to advance its antiabortion agenda. now joining me, the operations director for the west alabama women center, the author of the book, the new handbook for a post-roe america. also joining us is genius fouled, in the executive director of yellow hammer fund, it reproductive justice organization that serves alabama, mississippi and other states in the deep south. good morning to both of you, good to see you again, thank you for being with us. >> good to see you again, ali. >> robin, when i was with you at your clinic, you told me, it has become very hard in your state to direct women to places where they could actually have an abortion procedure done, and they were making it hard for you to even sort of imply, suggest to women how they would get a medicine aubergine. >> yes, that is true. and one thing that i could say is a positive outcome of the attorney general, basically

threatening any pregnant person with prosecution is the fact that at our clinic, we decided we are no longer remaining silent about where a person could obtain an abortion. we are letting people know that there are websites like plan b, where they could go and look up information, telling you that in medication abortion, even in states where abortion is illegal. we are saying that is our freedom of speech, something we are allowed to do, despite his claim that will be considered a conspiracy. >> let me ask you about this, what did the attorney general call it, the chemical endangerment law? actually, this is a law, not meant to be about abortion at all. it is actually used in alabama to target women before? >> oh, absolutely. that is not something alabama's shy to use in their laws, to incriminate or incarcerate people, and was not even intended for that purpose. i really think it is necessary

to put it into the wayside, in which the state incarcerate, kills, marginalize some communities, that's definitely one of the ways that the state aims to view people with this system. >> robin, there is a distinction between when i was talking to both of you, the targeting of doctors, nurses, abortion providers, health care workers and women who actually take the abortion pill or seek, you know, reproductive services and abortions. how important is that distinction to us, should my viewers be understanding this is yet another step, or is it all the same thing, whether you target doctors, nurses, health care workers, abortion planners or the woman it selves, it is the same thing? or t>> what is necessary for everyone to understand is now that we are in a niche of medication abortion, it is possible for a person to manage their own abortion without any sort of medical intervention, any sort of assistance.

a person can go to an axe -- website like aid access dot org, enough medication sent to, them even if it is illegal in the state. a person can manage their own care without letting anybody know, and if a person has a complication, they could go to a clinic like mine, or a hospital and simply say, i am pregnant, i'm having a miscarriage and i am scared. they do not need to let people know about their abortion. this is terrifying for lawmakers because they have gone through and said okay, we are never going to punish the person getting the abortion. but once you remove everybody else, there is no one to punish. now that it is easy for a person to do this on their own, they need someone they can frighten, someone that they could try to threaten, otherwise people will autonomous lee do it by themselves as they should be able to. >> and, the issue is that this does frighten people, right? we were talking about this, but everybody follows this story every day. if you hear from someone, a lot of women have had abortions

there not planning to have, seeking abortions they're not planning to get, they are not fully rested on the whole thing, if word gets out there, you ordered this pill, you get this pill, you take this pill, you go to jail, that is half the battle? >> it is. i think sometimes what people rely on when they are trying to scare people is that folks don't have the time to research and know this information. and i'm sorry, like robin marty said, people get scared with certain things happen after they manage and go to the hospital and say hey, there's this thing i have done to self manage, not knowing you don't have to disclose it. nothing looks different from a few self manage, versus having a miscarriage. i think a lot of the problem is that fear, that's something we need to have a conversation about as often as possible, in a way that is protected by our first amendment right, that's a thing to do before having the

conversation with public spaces, to let people know what they can do. >> very same question, first of all, the first amendment right. when i was in alabama last summer, robin and i were -- went to her clinic, asked the question about what you should be allowed to tell people, not allowed to tell people as it relates to medication abortion. let's play a little bit of that, robin. >> if i walk gain here and i see you wearing a shirt as medication abortion is extremely safe and effective, and i say, could i get some? >> no. i can't say anything. if i were a regular person, i would say something like a person could go to aid access dot org and obtain medication abortion without needing a prescription and how that shipped to them whether it is a legal state or illegal state, but that person runs a lot of risk and surveillance and

should be very careful, that will be something i would say if i were a regular person, i am not a regular person, so i cannot say that to a patient. i cannot say that to anyone. honestly, wearing the shirt is a risk and they do that on purpose, i know that this is one way to make a conversation happen, to make people think about this. >> robin, has anything changed in that conversation you and i have had in alabama? >> yes. we are telling people where they can go to find pills, but explicitly they could go to a texas dot org, we are leaving them to first member tested websites that have information for them, let it in though there are places, safe places, we are letting them know that we can provide ultrasounds if they are concerned with abortion and while we can help them have one we give them an ultrasound we should let them better understand their choices. because the attorney general has said that he is coming

after pregnant people, and throughout all of this, that is who we have been trying to protect, but not pushing the line. if he's going for them anyways, we will go ahead and test the lines. >> and jenice, again, robin, there are some things that she is constrained from telling people, but we are not, so i will tweet it out and let people know. but is this fight going to be successful? our national organizations, organizations like yours able to fight back against this on a national level? >> oh, absolutely. i think one of the things that we were at first optimistic about, where more safety nets, exclusions and also thinking like, had it happened, i think it was the immediate realization that we will just need to take the risk, this is an actual death threat. there's a higher mortality rate in this state, they have 900

million -- it's very necessary to medicate the risk, but something that we have decided is okay, what are we going to do about this, where can they go? this is life or death, literally life or death for folks. >> thank you to both of you, good to see you again. robin marty, the operations director for the west alabama women center. jenice fountain is the executive director of the yellow hammer fund. coming up next, staggering outbreak of covid-19 deaths in china, linked to his national health commission. nearly 60,000 people who have covid had died since december. oven roasted turkey. all on the subway club. three peat - that's great. three meat - that's epic. the subway series. the greatest menu of all time. sometimes, the lows of bipolar depression feel darkest before dawn. three peat - that's great. three meat - that's epic. with caplyta, there's a chance to let the light shine through. and light tomorrow, with the hope from today.

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stark reminder the covid-19 pandemic is far from over. there's been a major outbreak in china in recent weeks after president xi jinping list is the country's strict lockdown measures. yesterday, china's national health commission announced nearly 60,000 people who had covid have died since early december. the total includes roughly 5500 deaths directly caused by covid, about another 55,000 due to other illnesses combined with covid. the true number is likely higher because the figures reach for the chinese government only include deaths which are recorded at medical centers. should know the world health organization has criticized the way the china counts covid deaths, calling it too narrow. china's come under fire from other governments and the world health organization for the

lack of transparency reporting on covid cases. the search comes after beijing fully lifted its strict zero covid policy on december 7th, which consisted of mass testing, quarantines and lockdowns among other measures. chinese health officials insist the latest wave of deaths and infections as past its peak, numbers are now on the decline. the government spokesperson said the daily number of people visiting so-called fever clinics peaked at 2.9 million on december 23rd, and as drastically fallen since then. in light of the recent surge, countries around the world are bringing back strict this use containment measures for people traveling from china. the united states as already joined south korea and japan in restoring virus testing measures at airports for those who are arriving from china. meanwhile, the world health organization says it is currently working with china to help analyze the information released yesterday, it helps to better understand the epidemiology of this particular wave, and its ramifications. up next, henry martin luther king jr., in addition for his fight for racial comments,

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the visionary, dr. martin luther king junior, whose dream was cut short, aging that spoke to propel the hopes and aspirations of millions of struggling americans. beyond his call for equal rights for black americans, those who pay close attention to the latter part of his life know that he was only just beginning. mlk was turning the page of the movement, reaching the fight for racial justice with economics and expanding this struggle for freedom into april movement. but this time is activism, however, dr. king was facing a steady barrage of threats, civil rights historian jason sopko tells us was often depress writing quote, the death threats were coming every day. they were coming fast and furious. despite his fears, king it

continue to pursue the next struggle in this chapter for freedom, the church you see, or the historically temple in memphis, tennessee. this was home base for the famous sanitation workers strike that brought keen to memphis in 1968. the catalyst for that strike was the gruesome deaths of two sanitation workers, nicole cole and robert walker, who are crushed to death by a malfunctioning truck. workers i've been complaining about dangerous equipment for sometime, but when the city refused to compensate the deceased workers families, other employees launched their strike on february the 12th, 1968. now, around that same period, parallel to that, king was building a new movement that would unite america's poor. he called it the poor peoples campaign. for mlk, bridging the classed divide was a natural outgrowth for the struggle of racial justice. during a meeting with organizers at multi cultural and multi faith groups, which included indigenous americans, latinos and poor white workers, king described the effort as a highly significant event,

telling organizers that it was the beginning of a new cooperation, understanding and determination by poor people of all colors and backgrounds can assert and win their right to a decent life and respect for the culture and dignity. not too long after that meeting, king arrived in memphis on march 28th, to lead a march in support of the strike of sanitation workers, with claymore church as the starting point. it is this part of his legacy, his efforts to narrow the nations class divide that is often overlooked. but, it is a divide, sadly as not only gotten larger since kings time, america out today is reaching gilded levels of inequality, with a government which is bought and paid for by billionaires, corporations and money so insidiously, we casually refer to it as dark money. this type of wealth disparity preoccupy king in the months before his death, and led him to create the poor people can campaign. he returned to memphis on april 3rd, to deliver his historic, i

have been to the mountaintop speech in important to striking workers. now, what does this all mean in this great period of history? it means we have got to stay together, we have got to stay together and maintain unity. when the pharaoh it wanted to prolong the slavery in egypt, hit a famous formula for that. what was? he kept the slaves finding among themselves. but whenever they got together, something happened in pharaohs court, a can't hold the slaves in slavery. when the slaves got together, that was the beginning of getting out of slavery. now, let us maintain unity, end quote. one day after uttering those powerful words, martin lurking junior was shot dead on april 4th, 1968, while standing on the balcony of his hotel room. when we come, back i will be joined by a man who is dedicating his life to continuing the fight of the poor peoples campaign, the reverend dr. will liam barker. barker. and last for weeks.

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king's life was cut short in 1960, the world has always wondered what more he had left to give, creating the massive poor peoples movement, where were the country be today if he remained alive to steer it? by next guest, but doctor william barber has revived the poor peoples campaign and is working to fulfill dr. king stream of economic justice for all. barbara, along with the dog reverend did move in the 2018,

today the chapters are in more than 48 states. joining me is the doctor reverend william barber, co-chair of the poor peoples campaign, the president and senior lecturer, former pairs of the breach, author of multiple books, including his latest, we are called to be a movement from 2020. reverend barber, good to see you, thank you for being with us. you and i have had the discussion about the work you are doing a lot. but i really want to take this opportunity to more clearly draw this line about economic justice, social justice. both of those are being necessary to achieve racial justice. the idea, this is a pluralistic movement. you often say are not simply talking about black people or black workers, but that this unity you develop with poor people across the country is what is important to move the political needle? >> x actually right, though she. more than 100,000 people showed up, june 18th of last year, when we marched on washington,

meaning his own line. we need to have a movement. his words were, nothing would be more tragic than for us to turn back now. sadly, this weekend, there will be many elected officials on both sides of the aisle, attending the mlk event, claiming to adore him, while they are stepping into policy against what he worked to, living wages, immigration, justice for native america, challenging belligerent-ism, challenging racism, challenging poverty. and dr. king described this as injustice. he knew, he could probably fix, if we were guided by public policy and love, justice. and greed, racism, lies about scarcity. today we have our too many people, too comfortable at the expense of more than 140 million who are at low risk in this country, this nation. 52% of our children, 60 years

after the march on washington. it does not have to be this way. that is why we have to and are building this movement. we have spoken one time, you don't really celebrate profits, you don't do that. you reengage their legacy. remember, dr. king was not killed because of what he had accomplished, he was killed because he was not satisfied with the reality of racism's. >> in fact, as it involved this discussion about labor unions, about economics, the march on washington we always talk about, the full title of the march on washington or the march on washington for jobs and freedom. he fully identified that these things -- you have made the argument to me that a lot of the poor people in this country are deliberately disengaged, or have been by political parties. you back to side, including the

democratic party. the democratic party needs to lean more fully into poor people, but it's not a moral issue which will actually change their electoral success if they do so. >> through the percent of the electorate in battleground states, more than 45% of the electorate. we have gone out and talked to people, and they say nobody talks to us. the truth of the matter is, the reality is political happenings and moral holdings are different. what turns people off are things like this. republicans are too often obsessed with obtaining power and support, within the purposes of greed and lust. sometimes democrats are over doubly -- about moderate success. we need to generate 52 senators, locking a 15 dollar minimum wage, would lift 55 million americans out of poverty. we can't be satisfied with that. 52 senators blocking health care, 330 people dying during

covid, not because of that because of lack of health care. we can be satisfied with that, 700 people dying away from poverty, 400 million people a year, we can't be satisfied with that. the voting right act being guided, we left them to pay, we had 50 something years ago, we don't have one vote on that? we can't be satisfied with that, that's why we need to have a movement. this campaign, dispatching our people to every side, all congress people to demand this, we are planning on engaging in more nonviolent action, because there is a moral urgency, public policy, it's not denied. we can't be so gleeful. one minute we say we celebrate child tax poverty, but three months later you drop them right back into poverty? a kind of moral absurdity, you know, the fact that we still spent 50 cent of every dollar i

militarism, we can't cut 10% of the military budget and put it towards programs that would work to lift people out of poverty, and low wages? that cannot be accepted, you can be satisfied, the if you will be due to the legacy of dr. king, the legacy of the scriptures and the profit, you will be to do a moral legacy in this country. >> mr. barber, always a pleasure to see you, thank you for being with us on this sunday morning. the doctor william barber, co-chair of the poor peoples campaign, the senior lecturer and president of the parish of the bridge, on the heels of martin the kingdom it is tuesday, into an msnbc's joy reid, chris hayes and trymaine lee as they host the national day of racial healing at msnbc town hall live, in new orleans. discuss the recent rise in hate speech across america and how we can make strides towards becoming a more equitable and just society. that town hall airs this tuesday at 10 pm eastern on msnbc. it will also stream on peacock.

straight ahead, we will continue our deep dive into the new congress is up to and what is at stake next week, with republican representative john macon of nebraska, another hour of velshi begins right now. i begins right now >> good morning, it is sunday, january 15th. i'm ali velshi. we begin with a dire warning for the american economy, a debt ceiling slowdown, showdown, situ explode this week in congress, potentially with disastrous consequences. in order to understand what is at stake, i will start with a history lesson and a historic visit. on friday, the president hosted japanese prime minister flew geo concede at the white house, an important visit meant to highlight the close relationship and alliance between the two nations, japan and america. among the things that were discussed, russia's war in ukraine, china, the constant escalating threat of north korea and ways to make japan a greater military power, something which is historically interesting, because japan is deliberately avoided doing that in his post world war ii existence. by the way, ea