it's also a priority for anyone sending a message in our political leaders, we will all be held accountable if we are inciting violence and others, because they have tremendous power and platform that you make all of us a lot less safe, in addition to our democracy. but i just want to go back to one point, chris, about the system. because it is historic and traditional, in our system, that if you are low income, if you are a poor person, if you are black or latino, you are likely to face jail time even for nonviolent offenses. if you are wealthy, white collar crime, you don't -- donald trump is wealthy. he is privileged. this is something we faced for a long time in our system. and we must change. we must change it now. >> yeah, that's the ultimate example on this play right. now barbara mcquade, maya wiley, thank you both. that is all in for this week. alex wagner tonight starts right now. good evening, alex. good evening, alex you have aren't you have on the

weekend, my friend. -- thanks to all of you at home. one of the biggest news stories of the century with the january 6th attack on our and capitol the congressional investigation that followed. there were ten public hearings in which the committee presented damning evidence showing that former president trump not only riled up the crowd, within sat back and watched as a violent crowd try to steal an election. it was dramatic. and it was reveler tory. and it was hugely compelling. but we now know, thanks to polling conducted by monmouth university, that those january 6th hearings did not shift public opinion at all. about the same number of people would call it a riot. about the same number of people would call it legitimate protest. in every way, the monmouth poll, the members were basically the same, before and after the january 6th hearings. now there are a lot of reasons why that might be the case. but a huge one -- a reason that cannot be ignored -- is this one. fox news did not cover the

hearings. every other major network did. fox news ignored the january 6th committee hearings entirely. and not only did they ignore those hearings, but they actively pumped out content like this. >> if it was not an insurrection, then what was it? >> special operations uses the military deception tactic of a false flag abroad against the enemies in america. a false flag is any time you want to frame another group so that you can then take action against that group. it is my opinion that false flags have happened in this -- one of which may have been january 6th. >> fox literally produced a three-part documentary special, essentially painting the attack on the capitol as a false flag operation by the left, despite no actual evidence that that was the case. is it surprising, then, that so many millions of americans still don't believe that president trump was directly responsible for an insurrection?

and then there is this. one of the other biggest news stories this century, the covid-19 pandemic -- we now know, quantifiably, that more republicans have died from covid than democrats. according to the pew research center, the covid death rate in all counties biden won weighs 258 people per 100,000. in counties that trump won, it was 326 people per 100,000. obviously, there are a lot of factors, like qanon and social media, and general distrust of the government. but this certainly did not help. >> hydroxychloroquine -- >> if you've never heard of hydroxychloroquine before we mentioned it -- >> i believe our focus on this drug has led directly to fda emergency approval, which may save many lives, tucker. >> chloroquine? talk to me. >> we are talking about hydroxychloroquine. >> hydroxychloroquine -- >> hydroxychloroquine -- >> hydroxychloroquine -- >> hydroxychloroquine, of

course, does not treat covid-19. if you have a horse with worms that's definitely what you want. but it is definitely not recommended for covid. fox news has been lying in ways that materially shaped our political reality for years. 76% of republicans believe there is an invasion taking place at our southern border. only 5% of republicans view climate change as a top issue facing our country. and maybe most importantly, for the future of our democracy, 61% of republicans still believe that biden did not legitimately when the 2020 election. that 61%. >> -- dominion came under heavy fire after allegations that their machines caused thousands of votes in one michigan county to be switched from donald trump to joe biden. >> -- they have adopted a position of willful blindness to this massive corruption across the country.

the smartmatic software is in the dna of every vote tabulating company software and system. >> yeah. it is more than just a willful blindness. this is people trying to blind us to what is going on. >> and the presidents lawyers alleging that american votes in a presidential election are actually counted in a foreign country -- these are serious allegations! but the media has no interest in any of this. but you and i do. >> you end i do. media mount tirzah media matters -- fox news in the two weeks after the 2020 election was decided. once claiming that the election was stolen. and in that quarter, fox news's parent company reported more than four billion dollars in revenue. their ceo, loughlin murdoch, said at the time, fox news experienced record highs in december.

774 fall statements about a stolen election? great for business. so, how do we, as a society, fixes? how do we stop lies from infecting our political discourse, when lying is quite literally profitable? for that, i think we should look to the recent history of another one of our nation's most prolific and serial liars. >> sandy hook, it has got inside job written all over it. >> sandy hook is a synthetic, completely fake, with actors, -- manufactured. all i know is, the official story of sandy hook has more holes in than swiss cheese. >> for a decade, the far-right conspiracy theorists slash media personality alex jones has been saying that the sandy hook massacre did not actually happen. 26 people died in that connecticut school shooting in 2012. 20 of them were first graders. jones's lies or ridiculous. they were outlandish. they were hurtful. but he had a platform. and people believed him.

and those people made the lives of those sandy hook parents, parents who had already lost their children in a tragedy -- those people, who listened to alex jones, made the sandy hook parents lives an absolute hell. so, the parents sued. and this fall, into defamation in damages suits, those parents won more than a billion dollars in damages from mr. jones. it is not a silver bullet. it may not be enough to take jones's media empire off the air. but it will certainly hurt. and it might make alex jones pause before he spins another web a very dangerous deception. now, today, fox news chairman rupert murdoch was questioned under oath in a 1.6 billion dollar defamation case. the lawsuit is between a voting machine company called dominion and fox news. dominion alleges that fox knowingly lied, pushing a conspiracy theory that dominion's perfectly fine voting machines were somehow flipping votes from trump to

biden. and the key word here is, knowingly. dominion has to prove that, not only was fox news lying, but that fox news knew it was lying. and on that front, even before rupert murdoch's deposition today, it sort of seems like dominion may have fox dead to rights. let's watch that sean hannity clip one more time. >> dominion came under heavy fire after allegations that their machines caused thousands of votes in one michigan county to be switched from donald trump to joe biden. >> that is what fox news host -- sean hannity was saying on the very popular national television show after the election. here is what sean hannity said about the dominion voting machine conspiracy theory in his deposition, under oath, as part of this lawsuit. quote, i did not believe it for one second. the new york times reported that, back in december, the lawyer for dominion said that not a single fox witness so far had produced anything supporting the various false claims about dominion that were

uttered repeatedly on the network. the lawyer continued, many of the highest ranking fox feeble, including tucker carlson and the executive who oversees primetime news. many of the highest ranking fox people have admitted under oath that they never believed the dominion lies. all those depositions are still under seal. both sides in that case -- fox and dominion -- have requested to skip a trial entirely and just have the judge decide based on the facts they have already presented. so, we might never see those depositions. but there is -- there remains -- a very real possibility here that fox news could finally be paying a lot for its lies. joining us now are jeremy peters, new york times media reporter, and an msnbc contributor, and david plouffe, former white house senior adviser under president obama. thank you guys both for being here with me as we try to unpack what i think has been one of the most dangerous forces in american politics, the rise and rise of fox news. jeremy, where does this lawsuit stand? just from a shawn kennedy quote

that he is saying, boldly, i did not believe those lies? how does the minions case stand, as you see it? >> it is one of the strongest defamation lawsuits that first amendment scholars will tell you has ever been compiled against a major media organization. it is an extraordinary case. because, as you laid out perfectly well, fox is an extraordinarily powerful entity. it's a cultural force as well as a political force, as well as a media force. and it is an identity to the people who watch it. and so, to have them potentially on the hook for lying to their audience, which has been fairly well documented, but not yet tried in a court of law, is -- this is so far along, alex, that we have never seen a case get this far against a major media company in a very, very long time. >> and this is -- the fact that rupert murdoch

himself is sitting for a deposition is meaningful, it would seem. it seems like there is a case to be made that he was calling the shots here, that he knew these lies were going to be broadcast, and indeed, he wanted them to be. >> it's so meaningful that, typically, you would see companies like fox settling these cases before the chairman's ever deposed. the fact that he sat for two days of depositions tells you how far along this case is, and what kind of evidence that dominion has amassed against fox. to give you an idea of how serious it is, sean hannity has been back for two depositions. the first one was not enough. dominion -- more evidence of his possible knowing that they were spreading falsehoods on the air. janine pirro also has been back for a second deposition. suzanne scott, the ceo of fox news, was also called back for a second deposition. but ultimately, that didn't

happen. so, over the course of this case, dominion has uncovered more and more text messages and emails showing that people at fox knew what they were putting on the air probably was not true but did so anyway. and that is the kind of evidence that a jury will look at and ultimately decide if they should pay 1.6 billion dollars. >> david, from a political perspective, as someone who knows well what it is like to be in a presidential campaign, and what work goes into being in a white house, and how important information is in this landscape, what is the meaning of -- to someone who works in democratic politics? >> well, alex, i'm not sure there is anything more dangerous or devastating to american democracy then the fight against climate change -- fox news over the last couple of years. in fact, rupert murdoch has rain terror and devastation on

three continents. so, it's an enormously important -- it's not just who wins or loses the election cycle. over a course of decades now, fox and rupert murdoch, here in the united states, and in australia and the uk, a really done tremendous damage. i do think there has already been an effect -- 2022 election, which i think, by any reasonable measure, was a disaster, for republicans, even though they narrowly won the house. you did not see the same -- other than kari lake, and i think fox was careful about how they covered that -- you did not see the same playbook that you saw in 20. and i think, in part, it's because the lawyers are concerned about these. cases and i think there was a brush back. -- ultimately, they have to pay big damages here, this could be an important part of securing democracy. because without fox -- and of course, fox is like the pied piper. the sinclair stations are or the online outlets, they all follow, right? so, if fox is not calling the play that we are going to challenge the election and say they are stolen, then i think there is less oxygen.

so this could not be more important to, i think, the really still -- question of whether we are going to remain a democracy. >> to follow on, that david plouffe, i think a lot of people would say, it's not just fox. it's not all late at fox's doorstep. that's absolutely accurate. there's the internet. they're spin-off conservative media networks that are loosely based in fact, if based in fact at all. but at the very reality is that fox is still seen -- mainstream news outlet. it is on in airports. it is on in sports ports. it is on in hotels. and that is very different than one america news network and it's other related spinoffs. that's very different from even the alex jones hour of whatever you want to call it. and i think, when you were in a white house, when you are trying to get a message across, getting fox news to carry your news, your information, is critical to reaching a part of the country, is it not? >> there's no question, alex,

like you, i have -- this very carefully. fox has its original audience. it has obviously got even a bigger audience when people share that content across their social media networks. but fox is the coach. so, when fox latches onto a storyline, to a narrative, that trickles down. so, whether it's oan or breitbart or the sinclair stations or talk radio, they are going to follow. so, when foxes, this is what we are going to do, gang, and that is what they do. so, it's an entire ecosystem of disinformation that they control. and we have really seen nothing like that in america, certainly, in terms of its import. and those numbers you showed were really important, which is, they have not declined that -- much which i guess you would take as a positive in terms of people's reaction to january 6th -- but there's no doubt the fox effect has sort of kept a ceiling on that, unfortunately. because -- those numbers creeping up to 70 or 80% in terms of people correctly talking about what january 6th was. so you are absolutely right. you can't just look at fox. they are at the top of the

pyramid and they basically -- all the sewage flows down from them and it gets picked up by other outlets. >> jeremy, you are nodding your head and agreement when david was talking about a more cautious approach on fox the 2020 elections and nixon election denialism. -- this lawsuit is having a chilling effect, -- otherwise uncensored spouting of lies? >> let's not forget where this whole episode started. fox actually did the right thing and told it's audience the truth on election night in 2020. >> very true. >> which is that joe biden won -- that truth, however, it was incredibly inconvenient for foxes profitability. their ratings fell off a cliff. and in order to sustain those readings, with dominion arguing, and what we presume they have been uncovered in the discovery process of this lawsuit -- is that many fox host and executive said we need to shift

the storyline here and talk about fraud. because that is what trump is talking about. so what ended up happening was they are now overcorrecting for those falsehoods. that they allowed rudy giuliani, they allowed cindy powell, to come on the air and say, just completely irrational, phony things -- and now, if you look -- just look at what happened at election night in 2022. fox was the slowest to call many races. initially, they would have been -- when roger ailes was running that network, they were the first. because they knew that that was what their audience wanted. now they are not so sure. they were very careful. they were the slowest to call the house of for -- rather, the senate for the democrats, because it was not what their audience wanted. >> one more to you --

in terms of the deleterious effect fox has, beyond the misinformation, and the disinformation, the active spreading of lies -- there is a tendency to champion autocrats. tucker carlson took a show to hungary and interviewed viktor orban. there are more subtle and perfectly legal ways in which they champion forces that are decidedly anti democratic. and my question to you is, as long as that sort of strain of politics is successful, and it keeps on being something that fox can legally do, what recourse is there for the rest of the country? >> it is a great question, alex. i think -- not the entire network and certainly not 24 hours a day, but certainly some of their evening hours, you do feel like some of those personalities would love to be state sponsored media in an autocratic regime. they admire some of the leaders in these other systems. so, i think what it is going to

take is, in primaries, the republican presidential primary being the big one in front of us, but over the next two election cycles, let's, say you see more republicans for congress, for governor, for secretary of state, for president, being able to win without embracing, basically, this anti-democracy, pro autocracy argument -- now, that is hard to do when the biggest megaphone continues to shout that from the rooftops. that, in fact, there is something to admire about autocracies -- there are our democracy is deeply flawed -- that things like replacement theory -- white power our sometimes on that network. that is a big concern. but i have always believed that that's what it's going to take. i will feel, certainly, better about our democracy when you begin to see more republicans who, basically, are deeply conservative, don't agree with democrats on hardly any issues, but basically are more institutionalist wing. that may seem like a fairytale.

but i do think you will see some republican primary voters and certainly in 2026 say, hey, the other crowd is not doing too well in general elections. and it does not take that many voters to change up. but that is what it is going to take. because i don't think foxhunt changed their tune at all. >> the people will have to lead the network to the truth. new york times media reporter jeremy peters and former white house adviser under president obama david plouffe. thank you guys both for your time tonight. we really appreciate it. we have much more ahead this hour. remember back in 2015? when evangelical leaders lay their hands on donald trump and prayed for him to be elected president? this time, it looks like some of them are now taking a hands off approach. yes, that is a pun. as the right-wing celebrated's decades long campaign to take away a fundamental right, the left is now playing a brand-new legal strategy to fight back. that's next. that's next.

[sniff] ew. gotta get rid of this. ♪tell me why!♪ because it stinks. ♪have you tried♪ ♪new downy rinse and refresh?♪ it helps remove odors 3x better than detergent alone it worked guys! ♪yeahhhh!♪ new downy rinse and refresh

when you stay at a vrbo the host doesn't stay with you. because without privacy in your vacation home, it isn't really a vacation... ...is it? [birds chirping] no, no, no, no, no, no, no. there's a problem with my paycheck. it's short. someone messed it up? i'm in the middle of nowhere. ♪ unnecessary action hero ♪ was that necessary? nope. neither are paycheck problems. with paycom, employees do their own payroll.

no problems, no surprises. [narrator] schedule a demo at paycom.com and make the unnecessary, unnecessary. >> today, antiabortion

advocates held their first march for life since the supreme court overturned roe v. wade in june. and this year's march also marks the 50th anniversary of roe v. wade, creating a sort of bookend for the now defunct landmark ruling. leaders of the annual march have framed this moment as a time to reflect upon the dobbs

decision as a critical milestone, and the time to look forward to the next steps. and participants were adamant about one message in particular. we are not done. after fighting for half a century to dismantle the protections roe v. wade provided, anti choice activists successfully won a supreme court ruling over a woman's right to choose. they're now saying that they want to do more to restrict access to reproductive health care. already, since the dobbs decision, about 20 states have passed total bans or pre viability bans on abortion. -- are currently blocking those laws in several states -- though, even though there is no enforce, there's still no access to abortion, because no clinics are operating. if you think we are living in a process roe v. wade balkanized landscape, you might be right. but what will it mean for american life if those figures deepen? antiabortion advocates will like to see a federal ban, like the one senator lindsey graham introduced, in september. in the context of a post-roe america and an uncertain national landscape, pro-choice

groups are finding new ways to try to reverse some of the damage done by the dobbs decision. this, week a group of religious leaders filed a religious freedom lawsuit opposing missouri's abortion ban. the groups claim that lawmakers who invoked their own religious beliefs while drafting the bill that they violated religious freedom provisions in the state constitution. for 50 years, the antiabortion movement has been finding creative ways to stifle access to the medical procedure. and now the other side is fighting back with its own very novel strategy. joining us now is nancy northrop, president and ceo of the center for reproductive rights. nancy, thanks for being here. >> absolutely. >> it's a hard day to think about roe v. wade. i think it's always a hard day. but especially in the context of the last year. the missouri lawsuit is different. and people seem to be very excited about the possibility of this, in terms of applying some right back for the women who have lost an essential freedom. how do you see the lawsuit? >> before we talk about the

missouri lawsuit, let's just start -- because we are at this precipice of the roe v. wade anniversary, that this is the first time in 50 years, we are women do not have the right to make decisions in 12 states where abortion is totally banned under threat of criminal prosecution. and so, i am sitting here at this roe v. wade anniversary thinking that some things are quite chilling, which we have to pay attention to, but some things that are, in fact, heartening. and i think the lawsuit filed in missouri is one of those things. we are seeing states find protections for reproductive rights that did not exist before. so i think it's an interesting lawsuit. they are suing under the state constitution, which is what we have been doing in a lot of places across the country. and they are saying that missouri, basically, has established religion, and that the state constitutions barr against establishing religion means that their abortion ban must fall. >> it's religious leaders saying, you are -- >> that's right. >> you are bringing religion to the state where nuns should exist, basically arguing

separation of church and state. >> that's right. >> what about the national band? when lindsey graham first proposed it, it was met with -- the room was not that filled with a promise applause, shall we say. other republicans thought that it was best decided at the state level, including senate minority leader mitch mcconnell. do you think there is a chance that republicans actually move forward with this in congress? >> oh, i would not underestimate anything that might happen with respect to a national ban. the thing that is chilling, that is on my mind, is the fact that this is not the end. they have made it clear that it is not -- a nationwide ban is what they are going for -- in other ways, yes, inducing in congress, they don't have the votes here right now. the president would veto anything. but they are trying to block access to medical abortion across the country. so, a lawsuit was filed in texas, which seeks to reverse the decision that the fda made in 2000, approving medication

abortion -- that's the abortion pills -- and they want to try to ban that nationwide, which would mean in california, in new york. and medication abortion is the way that more than half the women get their abortions in america today. >> i was going to ask. that seems to be the procedure that many women, especially in states where there is no access to reproductive choice, that is how they are exerting their own bodily autonomy. you have a sense of the increase in medication abortions in a post-dobbs landscape? >> i think we don't have all the numbers. yeah it was already more than half before the dobbs decision. and in states where there is not access to abortion -- and people without the means to get out of the state have to take care of themselves and the state -- i think we have to get them the data on what is happening. but the attempts to try to block medication abortion nationwide should be attended to. and that lawsuit is going on right now the state of texas. i just wonder, but nothing passed the house republican caucus but the fact that they started off the congress with abortion measures that were not

federal bans. they were inventions for up that don't exist, but they had the word abortion in them. it seemed like they're trying to placate the hard liners and the pro-life movement. is there anything that could be done short of a cold bucket of water at the polls that you think could dissuade republicans in the house i'm trying to move forward under federal ban? >> i think we are beginning to see how much the fact that the voters have been so clear. we've always known that the vast majority of american support the right to access care, and we have saw polls again and again stops overturned, and consists, in kentucky, in michigan, all throughout the country, so i think that is going to have some mitigating effect, but the reality is, we need to get the right speck, and that's why we're working so hard on the strategies against a constitution to recognize the right to reproductive autonomy. we had that now in michigan, california, vermont. that language did not exist before.

reproductive autonomy and freedom is not the language in the state constitutions and through the courts. south carolina, supreme court, just recently recognized the right to abortion in south carolina under its constitution and its right to privacy. >> so, two steps backwards and some certain number of steps forward in a sense because some of these rights have been enshrined. they are not zombie lost in the late 1800s or 1930s. >> absolutely, i think at the end of the day, though through the day that there are first roe v. wade because the rights will be stronger. >> president and ceo at the center of reproductive rights, thanks for joining tonight, thank you. we have a lot more for you this evening. president biden at the halfway point against the presidential return today, and there is cake at the white house, but what was the message written in the icing? plus, the guy that wants to replace president biden in the oval office is facing some defections in the party he once controlled. is there such thing as a post

trump party? we'll have more on the coming up next. comin up next. age is just a number, and mine's unlisted. try boost® high protein with 20 grams of protein for muscle health versus 16 grams in ensure® high protein. boost® high protein. now available in cinnabon® bakery-inspired flavor. learn more at boost.com/tv - [female narrator] five billion people now available in cinnabon® bakery-inspired flavor. lack access to safe surgery. thousands of children are suffering and dying from treatable causes. for 40 years, mercy ships has deployed floating hospitals

to provide the free surgeries these children need. join us. together, we can give children the hope and healing they never thought possible. it's a mission powered by love, made possible by you. give today.

♪♪ remember the things you loved doing... before your asthma got in the way? get back to the things you love... with fasenra. fasenra is an add-on treatment for eosinophilic asthma. having too many eosinophils, a type of white blood cell, can cause inflammation and asthma symptoms. fasenra is designed to target and remove eosinophils and helps prevent asthma attacks. fasenra is 1 dose every 8 weeks. fasenra can help patients to breathe better. most patients did not have an asthma attack in the first year. and fasenra helps lower the use of oral steroids. fasenra is not for sudden breathing problems or other eosinophilic conditions. allergic reactions may occur.

don't stop your asthma treatments without talking with your doctor. tell your doctor if your asthma worsens. headache and sore throat may occur. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. get back to better breathing. and get back to your life. ask your doctor about fasenra. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help.

♪ every search you make ♪ ♪ every click you take ♪ ♪ i'll be watching you ♪ - [narrator] the internet doesn't have to be so creepy, the duckduckgo app, lets you search and browse pria blocking most trackers all forf your search history is never tracked, so it can't be shared. and when you leave search, duckduckgo helps keep companies from watching you as you brows. join tens of millions of people making the easy switch by downloading the app today. duckduckgo, privacy simplified. >> when you're looking at a run for president, he looked at things. you first look at this the current situation push for new leadership? the second question is, and i had that person that can be the new leader that, yes, we need to go in that direction? and cannot be that leader?

yes, i think i can be that leader. >> that was former trump even ambassador nikki haley kind of sort of maybe saying that she will run for president which kind of sort of matters because nikki haley effectively challenge her former boss, who is the only announced candidate in 2024. that is evidence that donald trump's hold over the gop will finally be starting to slip, maybe. today, but the new york times and washington post are out what new stories about trump's growing rift with the evangelical movement that one supported him. that while an influential texas pastor told the washington post this week, the most conservative evangelicals i know are in favor of ron desantis for president. and inside the republican party itself, a war has broken up between the current trump backed leadership and conservatives looking for a new direction. rnc chair ronald mcdaniel who has trump's backing, is facing an aggressive challenge from his job of a former trump lawyer who has the backing of die hard conservatives,

including tucker carlson and matt gates. it appears that the coalition trump cultivated and road to power no longer seems as tethered to him as 2024 campaign season gets underway. joining us not to talk about all this is tim miller, a msnbc political analyst. tim, i'm so happy to see you and hear all the answers yet to give me about the most pressing question. it is an age old question, but it has new urgency. does donald trump still commit fear within the republican party? >> hey, alex, it's so good to be with you. to start, happy friday. yeah, he brings a little bit of fear. it's mostly fear bottom up from trump voters, so i think as you see these changes, as you see a bit of a bit of fracturing, -- what you're not seeing from any of these people is a repudiation of trump. it's more of a commentary about

we love mr. trump, we love mr. trump's voters, we might need to move on to a new direction to try to win. that's a meaningful difference. that the barefoot the party was six months ago, but it's not a move from the maga movement that trump started. it's not a move away from trump voters, if anything, it's doubling down on reaching those people. the rnc chair race has been taken place on steve bannon's podcast, which was the leading part costs at the insurrection stop to steal movement. ron mcdaniel was honored today. that's where they're arguing. those are the people that listened to the, who they are speaking to. none of that is a repudiation of trump or sense of people want to move from away from him in any meaningful way. he is just not the standard bearer. >> i think there's a big distinction to be drawn between trumpism and malcolm-ism, which is to be in full flower, and trump himself, who seems potentially a little bit bruised since his first

entrance onto the national stage, or at least ripe for minimization, shall we say. it seems to be that the potential leading contenders for the nomination, and i say that with a big asterisk because i still think donald trump is the front runner have found pieces of trump's message that they want to co-op, right? like mike pence is going for religion which, granted, was not something that trump necessarily at all these -- the evangelical base was with him at the end in 2016. pence is going for that. ron desantis is going for the culture warrior stuff, whether that's anti vax or see artist of, all the things on lgbtq trans community marginalization. nikki haley is trying to bring us back to america as a global power, this foreign policy piece that trump largely advocated on, but was a core part of the america first message in its first iteration. do you think that there is one part of the puzzle or trump's

weakness, where he is most vulnerable to an outsider to come and take the mantle away from him? >> yeah, i think he is the most vulnerable into areas. one is just success efficacy, in particular on things like immigration. i think it would be very easy for someone like ron desantis to say, look at all the things you did in florida. the viewers might be gross out by many others policies, the stop work act, don't be so gay, but i implemented that, i got it done. you said you build a wall, there's no wall. mexico did not pay, so i think that there is an efficacy of argument in the area of immigration or trumpism on the ball. -- covid -- it's an open question whether in 2023, that will still be an animating issue, but let me tell you, i went down to the turning point conference the covered that before christmas, and every speaker was talking about attacking the democrats on covid, talking about

prosecuting fauci. i think trump both on speeding up the vaccine and going along with some of the lockdowns and some of the covid mitigation efforts, i think this might seem like we're in the upside down, but that is where he is most vulnerable, is that he can get positioned as, the human establishment with the medical elites, but the raw desantis example, it's not that direction to listen to the people and the maga voter. >> from the man who is advocating -- he is not to mention for the gop. trump's rift with the evangelical seems to be born over is suggesting, and i don't think this is not incorrect, that abortion is not a great issue for the republican candidates in the 2022 midterms. evangelicals did not like hearing that. they would like to press for a national ban. they are very pro life in an absolutist sense of the word. at the end of the day,

evangelicals don't like trump, but they -- is there any chance that the something differently than they did in 2016. it was not their chosen candidate, but they eventually circled up and got on board. do you think something different happens in 2024 if trump is close to being the nominee? >> i want to wait until we secure and hear a little more from actual voters. the evangelical elites, with the exception of -- were against trump, great? but you are sort of culturally evangelical person, maybe not a multiple times weekly churchgoer, but someone who identifies as evangelical. they were trump's core base. it was the most religious, top most religious voters. that breakdown might happen again this time, where the elites are signaling that we need to trust more and need to do with the devil, got our supreme court seat and now it's time to move on.

but where the rank and file as to what a ban. i think that remains to be seen. >> tim miller, always has the answers. writer for the bulwark and msnbc political analyst. buddy, it's great to see. thanks for your time tonight. >> you as well, alex. >> coming up, president biden second anniversary in office. a lot of things have happened since january 20th, 2021. the new york times chief white house correspondent peter baker joins us next. joins us next. the ultimate in comfort and support, in sizes up to an h-cup. visit knix.com to find a wireless bra you'll love. my mental health was much better, but i struggled with uncontrollable movements called td, tardive dyskinesia. td can be caused by some mental health meds. and it's unlikely to improve without treatment.

i felt like my movements were in the spotlight. ingrezza is a prescription medicine to treat adults with td movements. ingrezza is different. it's the simple, once-daily treatment proven to reduce td that's #1 prescribed. people taking ingrezza can stay on their current dose of most mental health meds. ingrezza 80 mg is proven to reduce td movements in 7 out of 10 people. don't take ingrezza if you're allergic to any of its ingredients. ingrezza may cause serious side effects, including sleepiness. don't drive, operate heavy machinery, or do other dangerous activities until you know how ingrezza affects you. other serious side effects include potential heart rhythm problems and abnormal movements. it's nice people focus more on me. ask your doctor about #1 prescribed, once-daily ingrezza. learn how you could pay as little as zero dollars at ingrezza.com ♪ ingrezza ♪

detect this: living with hiv, i learned i can stay undetectable with fewer medicines. that's why i switched to dovato. dovato is for some adults who are starting hiv-1 treatment or replacing their current hiv-1 regimen. detect this: no other complete hiv pill uses fewer medicines to help keep you undetectable than dovato. detect this: most hiv pills contain

3 or 4 medicines. dovato is as effective with just 2. research shows people who take hiv treatment as prescribed and get to and stay undetectable can no longer transmit hiv through sex. don't take dovato if you're allergic to its ingredients, or if you take dofetilide. taking dovato with dofetilide can cause serious or life-threatening side effects. hepatitis b can become harder to treat while on dovato. don't stop dovato without talking to your doctor, as your hepatitis b may worsen or become life-threatening. serious or life-threatening side effects can occur, including allergic reactions, lactic acid buildup, and liver problems. if you have a rash or other allergic reaction symptoms, stop dovato and get medical help right away. tell your doctor if you have kidney or liver problems, or if you are, may be, or plan to be pregnant. dovato may harm your unborn baby. use effective birth control while on dovato. do not breastfeed while taking dovato. most common side effects are headache, nausea, diarrhea, trouble sleeping, tiredness, and anxiety. detect this: i stay undetectable with fewer medicines.

ask your doctor about switching to dovato. ♪ i gotta good feeling about this, yeah ♪ ♪ i'm with it ♪ ♪ i gotta good feeling about this ♪ ♪ yeah, ♪ ♪ so let's get it ♪ ♪ i'm feeling good vibes ♪ what's your favorite knix wireless bra? it feels like a second skin. for someone like me who's active with big boobs, the catalyst is amazing. i feel so confident in my wingwoman. the lift is great and it's so smooth under my clothes. find your favorite wireless bra today at knix.com >> today is two years since i

was sworn in as president. >> [applause] >> and with your help -- with your help, we have gotten a lot done. >> that was president biden this afternoon commemorating the two year anniversary of his inauguration and touting his administration's accomplishments. like the lowest unemployment rate in 50 years and -- job growth. the first two months of his presidency, while covid raged across the country, biden signed into law the 1.9 trillion dollar american rescue plan. this summer, the administration passed the inflation reduction act, which is president biden's massive and signature bill that invested hundreds of billions of dollars in climate change and health care and fighting inflation and set a corporate minimum tax rate. biden signed into law -- gun reform, the first kind of gun reform legislation we have seen in decades. he also signed into law the bipartisan infrastructure bill and the respect for marriage

act. and, of course, president biden also nominated the first black woman to the supreme court, justice ketanji brown jackson. but as biden marks two year anniversary today, there were storm clouds, storm clouds in the form of the classified documents investigation. today, the new york times published a new report on the 60 days between the first discovery of the documents and when the public learned the news. here it is. the handling of the documents case has eroded his capacity to claim the high road against mr. trump, while also raising questions that his team's ability to navigate republican attacks from capitol hill. joining us now is peter baker, chief white house correspondent to the new york times and one of the reporters bylined on his very these. peter, thanks for joining me tonight. tell me a little bit about how complicating the documents scandal has been in terms of how the white house sees its agenda writ large. because they have accomplished so very much. two years of landmark legislation -- big achievements on a number of fronts -- is this but a passing storm.

or do they really seriously think that this is shaping public opinion? >> well, at the white house they would tell you, this is not that big a deal. it's politically outside the people outside the beltway are not gonna pay much attention to this obsession -- us in the media -- the chattering class -- that is their thinking moment. but what it does, i think, is actually sort of let trump off the mat to the extent they had an opportunity to criticize president trump over his handling of the documents that were found at mar-a-lago, even though the cases are remarkably different in terms of some of the details, they have sort of lost that high ground -- that is not going to be something that you would hear democrats -- against trump, except to say that there is a distinction between what trump did and what binded, which is not exactly an easy argument to make, even if the facts may be, again, significantly different. so, they have lost that opportunity they have. i think that's an important point for them. but in terms of whether they face any actual threat from the special counsel, nobody wants a special counsel if you are a

president. you never know if they lead, if it's distracting, it can take people out of their comfort zone, -- white house. there's no indication that they necessarily will lead to's anything seriously serious legally -- so far -- come out -- gave the back to the archives right away. there's no indication that, unlike trump, that they tried to resist. they did not defy a subpoena the way trump seems to have done. and so, legally, they might not be in that big jeopardy. by the sound of a thing, obviously, when you have special counsel. >> peter, a lot of people have said that the biden white house attitude towards republicans has been remarkably pugnacious, especially given the fact that this was a president who is going to unite the presidency. he has basically turned a page on that, starting last year when he talked in advance of the midterms about maga republicans and allied them with sort of vicious stick actors through history. do you think the newly pugnacious white house is

evidence of an emboldened white house? do you think it is a political strategy? how -- what do you make of their stance towards kevin mccarthy? the debacle of the speaker's election? they're really firm stance on debt ceiling negotiations? this just feels like a white house that is not pulling any punches, as it were. >> it's not pulling any punches but i think it's because it sees a lot of punches coming its way, right? they have a new republican house that has made clear that the price of admission for speaker mccarthy to get into that office was to be as oppositional as possible to the biden white house, even on things like the debt ceiling and spending, and those that are required to keep the government open. -- the deal -- the republican majority is not interested in finding common ground. and in that sense, the white house is trying to make a distinction between mccarthy, on the one side, and mcconnell, on the other. in the senate, there is mcconnell -- they're obviously not exactly a friend of this white house. but from time to time, he's willing to strike bipartisan deal where he sees an advantage or a -- and you saw president biden go

down to kentucky, standing side by side with mitch mcconnell a week or so ago to dedicate the opening -- of a new bridge -- down there to emphasize what bipartisanship can get done in terms of the infrastructure bill that passed in 2021. so, i think you are going to see them played who difference tragedies here, and get oppositional against the republicans of the house, and looking for deals with republicans in the senate and see if they can make the republicans their own worst enemy. >> it's an interesting role for mitch mcconnell, to be live trolling his republican counterpart in the house as he is fighting for his life in his speakers election. it's just a shocking set of visuals. peter baker, chief white house correspondent for the new york times, it's always great to see you, peter. thanks for your time tonight. >> thank you very much. >> we will be right back. ll be right back i've never been healthier.

shingles doesn't care. but shingrix protects. proven over 90% effective, shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. shingrix does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. an increased risk of guillain-barré syndrome was observed after getting shingrix. fainting can also happen. the most common side effects are pain, redness and swelling at the injection site, muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. ask your doctor or pharmacist about shingrix today.

nothing. nothing. absolutely, nothing. it really is something. as an expedia member, you can save up to 30% when you add a hotel to your flight. so you can have a bit more money, to do even less. because you've got a whole lot of nothing to do and absolutely nowhere to be. ♪♪ entresto is the #1 heart failure brand prescribed by cardiologists. it was proven superior at helping people stay alive and out of the hospital. don't take entresto if pregnant; it can cause harm or death to an unborn baby. don't take entresto with an ace inhibitor or aliskiren, or if you've had angioedema with an ace or arb. the most serious side effects are angioedema, low blood pressure, kidney problems, or high blood potassium. ask your doctor about entresto.

when people come, they say they've tried or hlots of diets,ssium. nothing's worked or they've lost the same 10, 20, 50 pounds over and over again. they need a real solution. i've always fought with 5-10 pounds all the time. eating all these different things and nothing's ever working. i've done the diets, all the diets.

before golo, i was barely eating but the weight wasn't going anywhere. the secret to losing weight and keeping it off is managing insulin and glucose. golo takes a systematic approach to eating that focuses on optimizing insulin levels. we tackle the cause of weight gain, not just the symptom. when you have good metabolic health, weight loss is easy. i always thought it would be so difficult to lose weight, but with golo, it wasn't. the weight just fell off. i have people come up to me all the time and ask me, "does it really work?" and all i have to say is, "here i am. it works." my advice for everyone is to go with golo. it will release your fat and it will release you. >> we have a quick correction.

earlier in the show, we mentioned fox news bruce -- pushing i jackson clark in as a covid care. unlike fox news, we wanted to quickly correct the record about the proper use of ig oxide. it is also treating rheumatoid arthritis and lupus. it is not a covid cure, and -- which fox news also push for the sick with covid. it is a medication mostly used on sick horses. apologies to all, especially the horses. that does it for us tonight, i'll see you here on tuesday, now it is time