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so let's go. >> a very good day to all of the digital age is waiting. you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. welcome, everyone, to alex witt reports. we begin this hour with breaking news. the country's largest infant

formula manufacturer is under investigation by the department of justice. nbc news has not confirmed the focus of the probe taking place at the laboratory. but a company spokesperson says, quote, doj has informed us of its investigation and we are cooperating fully. a voluntary shutdown of the michigan plant last year led to a nationwide formula shortage. we are going to have more on that in just a moment for you. meanwhile, as speaker kevin mccarthy and president biden both say look forward to meeting the white house is shutting down any hope republicans might have to negotiate the country's debt. the white house spokesperson reiterated the firm stance, no negotiations on the debt ceiling. and new action to the department of justice imposing republican judiciary committee chair, jim jordan, saying categorically that information on ongoing investigations is off limits. and new concern today to the appointment of far-right republicans two important house committees. here's what armed services committee member congressman adam smith told my colleague, ali velshi. >> when you put people like jim

jordan and, yes, kevin mccarthy, in charge of that process, what it becomes is simply a maga extremists agenda. normally, these committees are designed to investigate policy and make sure that the executive branch or in some cases, you know, private sector companies have done investigations and the tobacco companies back in the day, for instance, are doing their job right. what the republicans want to do is they want to protect their far-right extreme's ability to violate the law without consequences. >> and as we approach tomorrow's 50th anniversary of roe v. wade, we are going to talk about the changing culture on the supreme court and the case of the leaked abortion decision that the court has been unable to solve. we now have a panel of reporters in place to go to today's major developments and we will begin with nbc's allie raffa, who's with the president in -- delaware. ali, another welcome to you. as you know, the president is expected to sit down with house speaker mccarthy at some point soon. does anyone expect anything

tangible will be accomplished on a debt ceiling in that first meeting? >> well, alex, right now it seems like the white house and congressional republicans are about as far opposite on the scale of where they think, what they think needs to happen in order for the united states to not default on these debts. the first step in bridging that gap was taken by president biden yesterday, when he said he's willing to sit down with house speaker, kevin mccarthy, in negotiating the raising of the debt limit. he didn't say when that meeting is going to happen, but he certainly is aware of this looming deadline now that we approach that default deadline around june or july. after treasury secretary, janet yellen said, until then, she seeking extraordinary measures to be able to make sure what needs to be paid for in the interim is still paid for. this is really the newest obstacle, the latest obstacle in this second half of president biden's term. he marked the first two years of his presidency, two years

since taking office, yesterday with these remarks at the white house, talking about all the legislative accomplishments he's been able to achieve, working across the aisle over the last two years. take a listen to a bit of what he had to say. >> 350 billion dollars of state and local governments, and we urge them to make what's available to them to make communities safer. it turned out that one of the largest investments in public safety ever, and every single republican in congress voted against it. two years ago this week, 18 million people were out of work. two years ago, this week. now that number is under 1.6 million. >> the president, talking about major legislative accomplishments like the chips and science bill, the inflation reduction act, the bipartisan infrastructure law, things like, you know, the nomination and confirmation of justice ketanji brown jackson, the first black woman to sit on the supreme court. he also talked about the work

that is still needed to get done. things like protecting the women's rights to choose. he actually mentioned in this speech yesterday, the 50th anniversary of roe v. wade that we expect tomorrow. so, he talked about all the things he has been able to get done. all of the things he's hoping to get done over the next two years. of course, these goals coming out a very difficult time for president biden and this white house. they enter 2023, really, with the wind at their back. the democrats doing better than expected in the midterms. president biden was expected to spend these next few weeks touting these bipartisan legislative accomplishments and then came the news of these discoveries of these classified documents. obviously, something the white house and president biden is dealing with with this new special counsel probe over the next few weeks and months, alex. >> all right, allie raffa there, thank you for that. let's go on to nbc's julie tsirkin -- who standing by on capitol hill for us. so julie, the republican-led house judiciary committee has

big investigation plans. but what are we now hearing from the doj on how much they're going to cooperate? >> yet, jim jordan, the chairman of the house judiciary committee, just launch an official investigation into those classified documents last week. the department of justice is telling him, not so fast. in fact, i want to read you a part of this. they said, in a letter addressed to the chairman, mr. jordan, quote, any oversight requests must be weighed against the departments interest in protecting the integrity of its work. they went on to say, long-standing department policy prevents us from confirming or denying the existence of pending investigations in response to congressional requests. now, they do express a desire for, quote, a productive relationship with the committee, with the other committees investigating and conducting oversight of the federal government, including jordan subcommittee on that judiciary committee that he would also chair. the weaponization of the federal government in which the investigators will so call investigate the investigators. and the department of justice

wants to work with jordan here, but this is something that's likely going to have to go on to the courts, potentially. jordan has said that he's willing to issue a subpoena over things like this, if merrick garland and others in the justice department don't appear before his committee. doesn't look like they will, at least on these pending cases involving the presidents documents and the former president's documents. but this is all against the backdrop of some of these appointments we've seen on these investigative committees. kevin mccarthy now the speaker, elevating some of the more far-right members of the gop conference. marjorie taylor greene, for example, scott perry, lauren boebert and paul gosar all getting plum spots on the house oversight committee, tasked with looking into the federal government and also as chairman comber of that committee has said into the biden family. so, this is definitely something to watch in a couple months. all these investigations parallel to one another and democrats on all of these committees, concerned. as you heard from adam smith,

the soundbite that you played at the top of your show. >> all right, thank you very much, julie tsirkin from capitol hill. appreciate that. we are going to go now to some more alarming news and the details about the january six investigation, and some new clues that suggests republican members of congress may still be under investigation by doj for their roles in the capitol riot. the house committees lead investigator, speaking out in his first television interview. tackling a wide range of topics, including house members who may be in legal jeopardy. >> they were involved in some of the -- that was being put on state officials and state legislators. they were a big part of the context of january six, it was a political coup and the stop the steal false narrative. a lot of members of congress -- involved in that. we've gotten a lot of text messages from mark meadows and a lot of them reflected communication between the white house and these members of congress. doj is going to look at the entire context, just like we did, and decide who

specifically intended to disrupt the joint session, who specifically joined the conspiracy? they were going to be looking at evidence of intent to commit crimes. >> well, joining me now, miles taylor, former department of homeland security chief of staff, now cofounder and senior adviser forward. olivia troye, former homeland security and counterterrorism adviser to former vice president, mike pence. -- the congressional investigations reporter with the washington post, also an msnbc contributor. welcome, all. lots to get to, so miles, you first year. quite an explosive interview there. so many crazy details. what do you make of these text messages from meadows? what does this tell you about the future for some of these republican members of congress? >> well, alex, it says a lot to us, but i think the bottom line is that the insurrectionists are now on the inside. and the people who helped try to facilitated are the ones who are now going to be serving on

the oversight committees that are responsible, notionally, for trying to prevent something like this from ever happening again. i mean, take marjorie taylor greene for instance. i think this is the first time in american history that a sitting member of congress who tried to overturn an election is now on a key committee responsible for protecting u.s. elections. i think that's a really, really big concern and, you know, people like that, members of congress like that, are more of a danger that most people realize at this moment. one because of what the january 6th investigators have said, which is that some of them may have been even more involved than we realize. but to, in realtime, they now have access to very, very sensitive information and these are people who've accused the intelligence community of being in enough areas deep state. so, if i was in the executive branch right now, i would have a lot of concerns about briefing these committees and giving them the crown jewels of american intelligence. i think it's a very big worry at the moment and i think there

are real national security implications of the executive branch cooperating with these congressional committees in the way that they normally do, given these members sitting in those positions. >> well, it's so secret who they are. some of them are now sitting on important committees. marjorie taylor greene's on the homeland security committee. she called january 6th, quote, our 1776 moment. referred to rioters as patriots and said in a video, quote, you can't allow it to just transfer power peacefully, like joe biden wants, and allow him to become our president, because he did not win this election. what do you think greens impact could be on the homeland security committee? >> well, it's dangerous. from a national security perspective, look, all four of those people that you just showed have either been involved in spreading lies, conspiracies, whether it be on covid, whether it be on the election of 2020, whether it be spreading hatred, whether it's antisemitism. i mean, all these four

individuals collectively represent everything that the homeland security and national security enterprise worry about, when it comes to the -- domestic terrorism in our country. and to think that these people are now in the oversight committee, that marjorie taylor greene, herself, certainly on the homeland security committee, that, itself, is actually a national security risk. i mean, it's actually appalling, especially given the fact that gop in the past or the gop that i once belonged to, was a party that actually cared about national security. >> jacqui, you've been writing about doj's first response to the judiciary committee chair, jim jordans, request for documents. reiterating the departments long-standing practice of providing -- information about ongoing [inaudible] when does doj give details, investigations to a group, that includes people who may be under investigation? >> yeah, alex, well the fact of the matter is is that there is

no policy shift here. this is, as you just read, a long-standing department of justice policy, bipartisan, that was established under the linder letter, which outlines, essentially, that the justice department does not provide information about ongoing investigations, so as not to jeopardize or compromise that investigation and allow investigators to carry out their work fairly and thoroughly. there is a concern, though, according to oversight investigators and department of justice staffers, that we've spoken to, that jim jordan and others on the house gop oversight committees and judiciary committees are planning on taking this a step further, and trying to get as much information as possible about these low level lime attorneys, investigators, people who are -- buses and superiors in order to conduct these investigations and it raises a lot of questions as well, as both

miles and olivia just noted that the people that are making these requests and overseeing these investigations in congress are potentially under investigation themselves. now, in this letter the department of justice sent yesterday, carlos -- does say that, you know, they're willing to compromise and cooperate, to some extent, that they believe that congressional oversight is a key part of sort of the constitutional arrangements that we've had going on for quite some time now. but there are some limits that have been followed for decades now. we >> yeah, yeah, this this is interesting, is interesting, miles, because tim miles. heavy also led the tim also lead investigation into the the investigation into deadly white the deadly white supremacist rally in charlottesville. supremacist loudly rally in and found charlottesville. he found at at least one common least one common thread, let's watch and try. let's watch and see what he said see what he said. >> we. >> we talked to talk both people who to both are at the people who were at the charlottesville event and a lot of event and people people who were at the who were at the capitol on capitol on january 6th, who january 6th. explicitly gave him credit they gave him or credit talked about him as the or talk about him

impetus for their personal as the participation. one of our impetus. hearing witnesses who said, one of our persons he was said that he was a carpenter in erie, a carpenter in pennsylvania, working every erie, pennsylvania. day. he he was started paying closer working attention to every election issues, day he. started largely through social playing attention media, through facebook, to issues and when we of politics asked him, what through social media makes somebody like and facebook. what you want to makes somebody like you want participate in this? to participate in this? he said, president he said it was president trump. he wanted me trump. he wanted him there, he wanted us there. there, he wanted us there. i went because he asked me to. people told us that. president trump has a direct impact on the ascent of this kind of activity. >> he also said that establishing intent is now going to become the domain of the doj. several elevated to those house committees have appeared in public forums with no white supremacy assist. how is that likely to affect policy decisions? >> i think that a great deal, alex, this is one thing that the select committee has done very effectively. they have tie the january six conspiracy back to this wars, to donald trump.

it has been at the expense of some other things. they were not able to do a complete investigation into all aspects. some part had to be left on the floor. they wanted to prove the central component. we have covered this on capitol hill. olivia has been flagging it. there is the fact that this is still donald trump's party. the gop was worms concerned about defunding the police. there are now the party that is trying to destroy the police. they are trying under law law enforcement. they're trying to thwart investigation. they are trying to disassemble the department and the fbi. they weaponize information against political rivals. make no mistake. whether or not he is on the ballot in 2024, this is very much his party. his influence are --

i would be willing to go a little bit further, alex. trump used to say that he is a bigger deal than abraham lincoln and ronald reagan. those are the republican party used to roll their eyes on that. i take that seriously. this is at least far greater than it was for ronald reagan. that is someone who built the gop up. he has very effectively distorted the party. in my view, he has broken it. olivia troye got in trouble at the white house for even listening to music like taylor swift. taylor swift did not support donald trump. that is how cultish this has become. olivia, hope you have listen to taylor swift since this. >> let me ask. olivia, even if the senate is willing to pass some of their proposed bills, if these groups believe they are getting a wink and are not from house committees, does that embolden

these extremist groups even further? is that worry you? >> yeah. it absolutely does. what is really disturbing we, are watching all this play out. the doj issued that statement back to jim jordan. the judiciary tweeted out and said, well, while we cooperate? this is a targeting messaging campaign it is being used to create money. it will grift and in bolton these flames. >> they will basically antagonize this and a voters. it will anger them. there is that anger that they continue to cultivate. they're hoping that it will be part of the future elections. >> it actually hurts our communities across the country. it is further creating division, further creating anger. it is further giving these people a path. they are part of these --

it is also mainstreaming them. welcome to the party. let's go. that's what it is saying. welcome to the gop. >> yeah. we will stand beside you when you have lawmakers. jackie, let me ask you this. they can establish a tan intent. here's part of what he says. here it is. >> our evidence over 18 months established ample evidence that donald trump specifically intended to interfere, obstruct, and do that with the joint session. the key for the department of justice is his intense. there is the work that he did. it caused disruptions. the question, did he outcrop lee? was very specific intent when he issued those words? when he took all of those actions in advance? did he try to disrupt the transition of power in the joint session? we think yes, that is based on the evidence that we found. >> jacqui, he also said that mark meadows reversed course on

being interviewed. he gave about 1000 pages of documents and text messages to the committee. how can the doj get meadows to cooperate now? >> these are two extremely important questions. this is why a lot of people involved with the investigation at department of justice, people who are well acquainted with it, they do feel like, in terms of the parallel investigations that are taking place, her view right now is that there are declassified documents. that is an easier case to make. it is gonna be hard. the january six committee try their very best to take as much evidence as possible. the justice department certainly has more tools at their disposal to extract more information that the january six investigators were not able to get. getting that hard evidence that supports trump's intent and lays it out, it is a very tall

order. mark meadows is probably the person who have the clearest purview into what trump's intent was. at the end of the day, when the department of justice is asking you to come and sit down for the grand jury, it is a bit different than a congressional request. mark meadows was not held in criminal content by the department of justice after that referral was made by the house. there was contempt of an ongoing criminal investigation at the permit of justice. that is very different. there are now various avenues the doj could take if meadows continues to resist. >> okay. jackie, olivia, miles, we appreciate all of your intellects. good to see you. thank you. untold stories from the trump biden transition. it was worse than you might imagine. the revelations are in a new book. that is next. is next not so smart. (cecily) nah, you're still a genius. but, there is a smarter way to save. (einstein) oh?! (cecily) switch to verizon! for a limited time,

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investigation. reportedly related to the nationwide baby formula shortage. specifically targeted abbott labs. joining me now, msnbc's kathy park. kathy, what are we hearing about this investigation into the country's largest baby formula maker? >> yes, alex, this is a big development. the wall street journal first reported that abbott laboratories was under a federal criminal investigation. we have not been able to confirm the focus of that probe. an average spokesperson did confirmed to the news that the doj as a form of the investigation. they are not fully cooperating. let's backtrack a little bit. in february of 2022, abbott voluntarily shut down production of infant formula from their michigan plant. it was reported that some infant plan had gotten sick. this only deepened the infant formula shortage. they did not find the sort of the bacteria got the infant sick. in may of last year, abbott would lay an's by signing a

legal agreement the federal government. the plan would eventually reopen later that summer. it would still be months before the baby formula crisis had stabilized once again. this is a big development with the doj now involved. >> yes. this is something that we are not watch. thank you. let's go now to some stunning revelations. we are at the heart of these stop the steal movement on trump's behalf. a new book out learn the unconventional challenges that bud face before he was sworn in as president. quote, the biden camp would not say publicly that they fear trump might stage a coup. privately, they were taking precautions. one of the key questions was, well, what is gonna happen with trump in the military? the book is titled the fight of his life, inside of joe biden's white house. the author, chris, he is joining me right now. he is also a journalist and historian.

a longtime friend of the show. it's good to see you. >> great to be with you. >> this book, wow. let's talk about the transition team's fears about the military. what was their plan if the military had gotten involved in any effort to try and obstruct the transfer of power? >> you know, alex, i have spent almost two years talking to most of joe biden's inner circle. that includes ten kaufman. he was the head of that incredibly fraught transition. they were prepared for almost any eventuality. they stopped counting at 70. the most extreme or the very real possibility that trump would declare martial law and sent troops into the streets. and i think of this book as a political thriller. the first act is this unbelievably dangerous period of transition. it is a real untold story of how it really came down to one obscure deputy. that is the white house chief

of staff in the west wing. working for trump. he carried out this operation under donald trump's nose and without his knowledge. she quietly kept the wheels of the transition turning. he communicated through intermediary with the biden camp. he was about to resign several times. he was fed up with trump's behavior. friends of his would talk him off of the ledge. he stayed until the morning of january 20th. until 11:59 a.m.. he helped to make that peaceful transfer of power take place. it's a normal evil story that has not been told before. >> yeah. better that he stayed and could keep the wheels turning appropriately. he could've left out of frustration. this is interesting. a number of trump officials spoke to you for the book. the most notable has to be jared kushner. he claims that he had knockdown, drag out, screaming matches

over schemes to overturn election results. first of all, how did you get him to speak to you? why would he agreed to be interviewed for a book about the biden white house? >> you know, there are a lot of untold stories. a dramatic example is jared kushner. kushner was, during the transition, he was really frustrated by this kind of star wars cast of characters. they were coming in and out of the oval office. rudy giuliani, sydney powell, others. at one point, he had is knockdown, drag out, screaming match with his father in law. he said, look, i am family. i am going to be with you until you hit the dirt. maybe you should listen to me instead of these people who are trying to take you on this funky ride. that's what he call the. the funky ride was an attempt to overthrow a free and fair election. the other great story involving

jared kushner involve the very first day of the biden presidency. joe biden found a handwritten letter, two pages long. it was from donald trump. he read it while his staff looked on. he looked out that than and said that this was shockingly gracious. i called jared kushner and asked him about it. jared said to me, you know, he worked for three days to write that letter. we don't know what is in the latter. one obvious question, if it is shockingly gracious, does trump concede that joe biden was elected president? i think that the committee would want to read in that letter. >> what is interesting is you hear people speak about meeting in person. they talk about how gracious he can be, how charming he can be. i have heard that used to describe him. there is the bravado, the

bluster, the position that he puts forward. it is extraordinary, the difference. you have to believe that he has the ability to do the former if he is going to do the ladder all the time. i want to ask about after president biden moved into the white house. he tried to get rid of the reminders of trump. that includes video game. you say that he used expletives to describe it to one guest. a bigger problem was his discomfort with his secret service details they were sympathizers. explain that. did biden get carryovers from trump's personal details? is that how it works? >> first of all, i'm not suggesting that he is afraid of a secret service will not protect him. i am saying that we generally expect the secret service to check their politics at the door.

joe biden became president. his detail became much larger. that should not be shocking. this was something that troubled biden. he was not sure that he would keep a secret. i think it is troubling. >> president biden is widely expected to rian allen's his campaign. do you think he has already fought the fight of his life? is it yet to come? there is the pandemic, ukraine. standing up to the lingering power of trumpism. you could argue that now is the

hard part. that is his third year. he will be 82 when he runs for reelection. i think that he is almost certainly running for reelection. i do think that he not only has unfinished business, but that one of the defining task of this presidency will be what happens in 2024. i think that he is worried. we have to have a free and fair election. they might be the nominee. joe biden might be the only guy that can beat him. >> extraordinary. i have my own copy. i want to keep this. next time i see you in person, you can sign up for me. thank you. good luck. the key questions hanging over the movie set shooting, alec

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set shooting death of cinematographer halyna hutchins. alec baldwin, the actor intends to finish shooting the movie rust. he is facing involuntary manslaughter charges for her death. the tragedy is shining a spotlight on the issue of weapon safety. let's go to josh lederman. he is standing by in los angeles for us. josh, welcome. give us the latest on the pending charges against now out baldwin. what are they? >> alex, these charges are creating a huge conversation about what responsibility an actor has are on the set. they are under close supervision. they were handed a prop gun body armor, assistant director. that's whose job it is to make sure that his weapon is safe. that is when something goes wrong. the district attorney says that she wants to send a message

with these charges that everyone has to follow gun laws, including a list celebrities any film industry. that is not stopping this movie from moving forward. >> despite bombshell criminal charges against alec baldwin, production of the film rust is still on track. hollywood grapples with preventing such an accident from ever happening again. >> this was something that was more than mere negligence. it was people acting recklessly. >> prosecutors are set to charge baldwin any films armor with involuntary manslaughter by the end of the month. ball winds tierney called it a terrible miscarriage of justice. insisting that he will fight the charges. well he does, he will also continue starting in the film. rust's production company says it onset safety supervisors we brought in. working weapons and ammo are barred from instead. >> somebody bra live rounds, plural, onto the set of the film. one of them ended up in the

gun. >> the gun was in his hand when he pulled the trigger. that was the main action that killed halyna hutchins. >> the screen actor is defending baldwin. an actor's job is not to be a firearms or weapons expert. the film and tv industry is now facing a reckoning over safety. >> this is a dummy rounds. >> this hollywood armorer says that the safety protocols themselves have not changed. >> my gun safety checks are much more vocal. >> the hbo mare of easttown has gotten rid of guns on set altogether. a huge graphics and said. when we all guns are used, the actor should never appointment anyone. prosecutors allege that baldwin did it. unless absolutely necessary and under close supervision. >> the golden rule, never point a gun and anyone. at the movie, you don't until we show you that it is safe. >> alex, alec baldwin will have

his first appearance before a judge after those charges are formally filed by the end of this month. he will then appear virtually before the judge. he could face a mandatory minimum five years sentence if a gun enhanced mint is an added. or if prosecutors tell us that there is up to a total of six and a half years potentially. >> wow. a lot to follow. thank you so much for that. the final answer to the supreme court. this is why some find it really puzzling. reall puzzling it's clinically shown to help manage blood sugar levels and contains high quality protein to help manage hunger and support muscle health. try boost® today. enough data now the search for

the person who leaked the draft supreme court decision to overturn roe v. wade. all nine justices were interviewed in the investigation. rated not science born affidavits. the 20-page report was released on thursday. they concluded that the thing was still unknown. supreme court martial has details after examining the comports computer devices, network, sprinter printers, and tax logs. there were formal interviews of 97 employees. investigators came up empty handed. the report suggest that the ministry may never be solved. joining me now is a political investigations reporter from the guardian. i'm also with harry, he is a u.s. attorney and the host of the talking feds podcast. good to see you. you go, this detail suggest that the investigation was very

thorough. lies so challenging to find a leak? >> yeah. as part of this comes as a result of not having an external and independent person doing the investigation. this was basically gone in-house. it was led by the supreme court module. there were the law to interview the justices. i think that part of this, because it is such an institution, such an institutional investigation, it is very difficult to try and track down who was talking to who. who is of accessing what document. you can trot who put together a paper trail in the way that an external investigator might. the fbi was not involved in this. it didn't rise to the level of a criminal manner. there are deficiencies across the investigation. >> good point you make their. the court-martial who ran the investigation answers to

justice john roberts. he is saying, is this a case of the court policing himself? there is all the forensic evidence that should be at their disposal. how deeply do you think investigators really wanted to dig? >> the court only polices itself. that is part of the problem here. they want temple to catch the culprit and assure up the court's reputation. they wound up doing neither. you know, there is a sense, i think, in which the justices have a tier about all of this. on the other hand, chief justice roberts does not want to invite an executive branch agency inside to ransack the court. it was no surprise that the marshal would do it. one quick point about these quote on quote interviews with the justices, you just summarize this at the top. 192 employees. that does not include the

justices. they will sit down and exchange information with the marshals. they didn't have to sign anything. it is very tricky to be starchy with the justice of the u.s. supreme court. more cynical observers want to say, well, why were they not deep the probe? diet one final point. >> yes. >> we are used to leaks in washington. i just want to say that this was an unthinkable of use. it is really shaken up the court overall. it is really grieve grievous it. just goes away. >> to your point, the word unprecedented has been used to describe this. it brings up a good point here. several employees of said, harry, that they chose their spouses or partners about the draft opinion. if that was a violation of the court confidentiality rules? this is not raised red flags? >> it is a violation. i determined i was there.

we had a very big abortion case. we made a similar promise. i kept it. it happens. there they are. they are signing something under the penalty of perjury. >> they had to fasten up. that is what happened there. it is a very different thing to tell your partner that. you give a full draft to publish all over the country. >> the court says the investigation continues. how? what other approaches might it take? look out there otis been so far. allegedly. >> that is a good question. i am not sure how this investigation is actually continuing. it may be the marshall monitoring. these are things that might be going on down a line. it sounds, based on the letter, it sounds like the investigation is wrapped up. that is part of the investigation that really vaxed me. how could you say that the

investigation is ongoing? it seems to be no evidence on the fact that is actually happening. as harry said, you know, the interviews with the justices were very informal. maybe harry can shed more light on that. i think it was a bizarre point to make. >> harry, the question that perplexes me, are we ever going to know who did this leak? if it is a serious as you have described, it is unprecedented. will we? >> first, as hugo suggests, the investigation is done. they want to wrap this up as a public matter. will we ever know? there is the precedent. with watergate, you had this big figure who went on for years and years. he got pretty old. he fast up. my best gas is that this is not the only person who knows. and it will be in the subject

of both movies. it will be a water cooler conversation for years to come. that is not by virtue of the supreme court investigation? >> okay. all the presidents men will become all of the supreme court leaks. all right, guys, harry, hugo, good to see you. thank you. we will be right back. right back. there are some things that go better...together. like your workplace benefits... and retirement savings. with voya, considering all your financial choices together... can help you be better prepared for unexpected events. voya. well planned. well invested. well protected. i'm jonathan lawson

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