your search history is never tracked, so it can't be shared. and when you leave search, duckduckgo helps keep companies from watching you as you brows. join tens of millions of people making the easy switch by downloading the app today. duckduckgo, privacy simplified. ♪♪ this sunday, another ♪♪ this sunday, another

document discovery. the fbi searched president un biden's delaware home on friday and found more classified d materials. six documents, including some from his time as a senator, were found. biden insists he did nothing wrong. >> i think you'll find there's nothing there. i have no regrets. plus warning signs. american politics teetering on the edge, from the court to congress, to probes, to rising threat. a rep candidate is arrested and charged in connection with the shooting at the homes of four democratic lawmakers. >> the attack on elected officials is an attack on democracy. is >> new mexico just the next camp. >> and post-roe. 50 years after the landmark supreme court decision granting a constitutional right to abortion. the debate has shifted, with the rule now overturned. >> if we learned anything -- we but yesterday our head in the sand. my guest this morning, democratic senator joe manchin, and republican congresswoman nancy mace of south carolina. i did not have sexual relations with that woman. >> the lewinski scandal and its consequences still influencing american political lives 25 years later.

joining me. kristin welker, rep strategist brendan buck. peter baker, and kimberly atkins stohr. welcome to sunday, it's "meet the press." >> announcer: from nbc news in washington, the longs running show in television history, this is sunset "meet the press" with chuck todd. >> good sunday morning. we feel like we're at a breaking point. the supreme court strained after -- they have yet to issue an opinion this term. and another matt shooting at a lunar new year event at a park in monterey park, california. these events don't bring comfort. adding to this, we have the current and former presidents under investigation. after a 13-hour fbi-led search at the home of a sitting president. it wasn't a subpoena, it was with cooperation, and six more items were indeed found, including biden's time as a senator. this comes just days after biding said he had no regrets

how he handled the issue testify classified documents, but it's likely to prompt more t de13heo comparisons between the current and former president. then we have the issue of election denialism, and sadly, it appears that it's given some supporters a per missions slip to commit political violence. the case in new mexico is just a string of -- from the assault on the brazil capitol, and we have the attack on paul pelosi just days before the midterm elections as well, and then this manufactured crisis, the escalating receipt riggs over ed the debt limit. it's a reminder how fractured the republican party is, because the republicans are wanting to rebrand themselves as the party

of fiscal discipline, if you will, after they saw an explosive right of the national debt under president trump. democrats, of course, now see an opportunity to paint house republicans as extreme. the reality is the debt limit will get raised, we don't know

how it will get done. even senator mcconnell believes that. >> america must never default on its debt. it never has and never will. >> reporter: should we be concerned about a financial crisis? >> no, i would not be concerned about a financial cries. senator joe manchin join me, welcome. good to be with you. we have some developments overnight, and now we have the fbi searching president biden's residence. what's your assessment of how the president has handled it?

>> it's hard to believe that in the united states of america wen have a former president and current president basically in the same situation. how does it happen? when i go into the scif with secured documents, they always ask are you clean? when you walk out, they may sure you're not carrying anything out. to be held accountable and responsible is what we all are, and to put those in unsecured spaces is irresponsible. >> to see more similarities? >> i think merrick garland did the right thing by putting in a special counsel, and i think we should wait. let them find out the facts. is one more reckless and irresponsible than the other? i can't answer that question, but i think the special counsel can do a better job than the politicians.

>> president biden said he had no advice on how -- >> i think he should have a lot of regrets. whoever is responsible -- whether it's my staff or me, that we're doing this, and i'm going to hold someone accountable, but basically the buck stops at me. >> basically he should say i messed up. >> we're all human. he sure didn't intend for them to fall into the wrong hands. could it have happened? yeah. but it's irresponsible. there's somebody we should have been a better checks and balances on. >> former president trump defied the subpoena. do you acknowledge the difference? >> yes, absolutely.ce >> one is saying the other said, believe me, well, you know what? verify. >> trust and verify.

and that's what you want. >> every one of is in our lives have to be accountable. people want accountability, and whether they're held accountable, are you responsible or not? >> if you are, can you fix that? you know -- >> just get out there and get in front of it. >> to err is human. did you intend to harm somebody? did you intend to make a mistake? >> i don't think, hopefully, either one of them did, but it sure turned out to be irresponsible. >> the debt ceiling, you're always trying to find a middle p grounds. i know your instinct, but why should -- get the benefit of the doubt, considering they're sore

of manufacturing a crisis? >> first of all, if one side thinking one is more responsible than the debt, that is totally not accurate, and deceptive. we're all responsible. it's a runaway debt and no one is holding themselves accountable, and basically, you said it, use the budget process. i've been here 12 years, and we haven't had a budget yet. >> that's what i question. why? we have a budget committee, two budget committees, we have a joint committee on taxation, why can't we use the congressional bureaucracy that exists? >> why not put a time certain on what you can and can't do and when you do it. i was a former governor of the state of the west virginia. i was responsible for a balanced-budget amendment. i met every week, like clockwork they walked into my office and sat done and go over it.

you either have to make some cuts, some adjustments now so we end the year with a balanced budget or surplus. 12 years, i haven't had a bucket. that's ridiculous. >> you want to see this, you and senator romney, to have a committee that deals with the trump fund issues. how do you separate those two out and deal with our -- >> would you care the bejeezus out of people, and say i'm going down that -- but there's ways to deal with it. >> one of the three most ou hypocritical words are here is waste, fraud and abuse. >> but it's all there. >> but that's not going to balance budgets. at the end of the day there are

choice that is have to be made. what is something that has to be in the discussion of, you know, maybe we're spending too much. >> we know we're spending too much. the bottom line is, 535 people say, what you're doing is wasteful, chuck, you ought to cut that. what about yours? >> your spending that you think is mandatory, another person is thinking is wasteful. >> for every dollar, break it down to the dollar, there any savings in that dallas that you

think is wasteful or abuse, at least we could have a target. is it a penny? five pennies? a nickel? >> but here's what's gets lost. nobody will put it on the table. >> the process isn't working, chuck. how come we're not held accountable to have the appropriation bills done at a certain time before the end of the fiscal year. >> you tell me. what does senator mcconnell say? >> it rolls into an omnibus bill. it makes no sense. >> if you're going to use the debt ceiling for anything except for that he theatrics, it's not going to happen for a while.

we can't let it default, and basically hold us in jeopardy. with that being said, how do you use this moment? do you come to the responsibility? what are we paying for interest? for ten years, it was zero, it was funny money. it didn't put any burden. we were basically not harming how we have to meet that debt through our interest rates. now we're talking real money on interest rates. we're -- i guess i come back to, what is the moment to force this -- >> this is a moment -- if kevin mccarthy coming in new says, okay, it's serious, and he takes it from the standpoint. >> what does he need to do? you know what i mean by the way? how do we know he's being serious or playing politics? >> he has a political hand that's not very good. he has to makes a decision on how he wants to govern. you know, i just -- it was amazing. i saw the ohio legislature -- i

don't know if you paid any attention to it. the ohio legislature, republican controlled, basically chose their new speaker or republican with as many if not more votes from the democrats. that's a coalition. why can't we put coalitions together here? moderate, centrists, coming over, whoever is in the majority, you don't have to kowtow to the extremes. you don't have to work about the primaries -- >> if it's all about the election, next election, that's the worst thing that could happen tows. >> you just came from davos. >> there was a moment that went viral. you guys are high-fives, i think she was talking about the filibuster. is that what you are high-fiving about? >> i think, i saw her hand go up, and i said, sure. we're both committed to

protecting the filibuster. if you have a strong president, then you don't have a check and balance. i guarantee the house and senate will roll wherever the president wants. i've said this before. i appreciate the republican senators under the leadership of mitch mcconnell, with donald trump beating on him every today to defeat the filibuster. he would not, and i appreciate that. and i told harry reid that we should not have done it back in 2013. thing what we have accomplishedn in the 117th the most divided congress we've ever had. we did more substantial bills

that i think will be transformational. >> you think the first two years will be considered. >> i think so, yes. you've the chips act which will bring manufacturing back, and then we have inflation reduction act which will give us -- it's been maligned. that's designed to be energy security. >> and you're frustrated the white house won't say -- >> they will not use the word. aisle begging you all, please, energy security. we do foss the cleaner than anywhere in the world, and we can be energy secure in ten years. we're seeing right now a battery plant coming in, i've got

basically hydrogen coming, expansion, raising or carbon capturing. we have family fighting continuously, and it's going to be needed. if not, we'll end up like europe.y i didn't want to rub it in, but europe said cap and trade, and we're going to be charging you a carbon tax. i said i'm not going to support that and vote for it. i think it doesn't work. i basically wrote this bill was incentives, and it's working. that's why they were all upset. >> if you run for office in 'm 2024, will you going to run as a democrat? >> i haven't made a decision. i have two years ahead of me. >> what's on the table? is reelection on the table? >> everything's on the table. >> is running for governor on the table? >> no, i've done that.

>> so there's basically only one other thing. >> the only thing i can tell you is whatever i can when i make my decision, i can support and represent at the people, but also be true to this country and the constitution of this country. >> that sounds like somebody that's working for a way into national politics. >> well, every senator is on a national -- >> you know where i'm going. >> i know. >> you're not telling me no. >> i'm telling you i'm doing everything can when i make my decision, i make it on what's best i can do to support my country and my state. >> do you want president biden to seek reelection? >> he needs to make that decision. i had haven't decided on anything i'm going to do until i see what the lay of the land is at that time. this country needs to unite. we need to come back together. and it needs somebody to bring the country together. i think he's done well in many areas.

i think he's been pulled to the left too far. i've up front with that. centrist is what people want in america. they want us to work out of the center. republican ideas aren't always bad, and democrats don't have all the answers, but don't be pure, i'm sorry, that's a democrat idea and i'm a republican, to me that is foreign to me. snoring manchin, a fascinating conversation. when will you make a decision? >> i'm not in a hurry. filing dead like is in early 2024. >> not west virginia. not west virginia. i've got time. thank you. when we come back, she says her party has been tone deaf since roe has been overturned. is there any really middle ground? nancy mason from south carolina

joins me next. carolina joins me next.

welcome back. the 50th anniversary of the roe decision, republicans are in an uncomfortable decision. activists are calling for tougher restrictions, while the swing voters the republicans needs to win in swing districts statewide increasingly favor keeping abortion legal. it's an issue that will continue to be pushed into the headlines by the coming republican primary and by state legislatures, every one of them convening this year. >> joining me is congresswoman macy. >> thank you for having me. when you look at the public opinion about roe, and in some ways roe has become more popular since it was overturned, is that the middle ground, the public, you know, maybe nobody loved it on the far left or far right, but was that actually the middle

ground for the public? >> roe, when you look at the details, it would have allowed -- which is not it something that -- lives in a temperature swing district, i polled the issue over and over and over again. i had my first town hall of this congress last week, and it is a top issue for swing voters, a number two issue in my district. the vast majority of people in

my district don't like what happened after roe was overturned. they support women's right to choose individually, but i've spoken to the folks in my district, swing voters are willing to find some middle ground here. forever recognizes abortion up to birth is not something that they want to accept, but they also don't -- can we find some middle ground around 20 weeks, for example, if we're talking specifics when we're talking about legislation at the state

or federal level. i don't know if we can get there. both sides are really entrenched, i sigh that, because i'm repeatedly attacked by pro-life groups, even though i'm pro-life, but that's where the people i represent are. >> whether folks see it as a morality issue or personal freedom issue, so compromising either your morals or freedoms is very difficult to do. do you think this is just we're not ready yet in our politics, we need to go through a few more cycles? your party needs to lose more on this issue before more folks look at it the way you do? >> it's the reason we didn't get more of a majority. we could have had a two dozen seat majority, but we don't. this was an issue top of mind for swing voters. when you're looking ahead to '24, going to the extremes and digging in there isn't going to work for most people. when i look at every issue, not just on roe v wade, but every

issue, we're so divided. i sometimes joke that joe manchin is the most popular senator at the moment, but to hear him speak in a refreshing way, is the way both sides need to be dealing with this. i'm vocal, sake i'm pro-life, but willing to sit down and talk about how do we balance the rights for women and the right to life. so let's have that conversation, let's have it in the open, find a way to move together, having a divided congress, we're supposed to be working together, but both sides are afraid of their primaries. that's not the way we should be operating, but the vast majority

vote out of legislative fear. >> you think you may get primaried on the -- >> i got primaried last time and the time bev that. i expect it every time, being in a swing district, but i will tell you, even with the far right coming after me in the last primary, i won overwhelmingly, by nine points. when we had the general election, i flipped 40% of the democrat precincts and outperformed the former president in my district as well. so i found a way to try to represent all the voices. i can't represent one side or the other. >> you are on the oversight committee. we got news this morning that the fbi conducting this search, finding more classified documents. i know the helped of this committee wants to spend more time looking at this as well. should -- how do you think the oversight committee -- what roles should they play in this particular investigation, and can you separate the biden classified documents issue from the trump classified issue? >> they're very similar, and yet there are some differences. it's hard to say one or the other, because we haven't actually seen the classified

information that they may have been holding. similarly, they both wrongly took classified information away from national archives and away from where they should have been deposited in a classified space, like a scif. but for five years, the current president, the documents were hiding, nobody knew about them. when it was discovered, they sat on it for two months. it wasn't until a reporter leaked it out a story about it, did the rest of the country find out about the documents. i am grateful the president is being more transparent about it, but he did hide it for two months, and then nobody knew about it for five years. any investigation oversight does, will get to the side of it. they knew where the documents were located, and i do want to see both the current and former president treated equally. i'm glad that the doj is investigating it. i want to see transparency and accountability, as was mentioned earlier, the american people are held to a certain standard, so too should the current and former presidents. >> should the oversight

committee treat both the same? right now it looks like the current chair only wants to investigate the biden angle of this. >> well, i think that's because there's very little information about biden. the documents were hiding for five years. we have very little information, whereas with the former president, everybody knows the documents existed, they knew where they were and located. >> we didn't know where they were located, they defied the subpoena. >> the fbi and the doj -- >> they didn't know. >> yeah. well, in some media reports, it was stated the fbi and doj knew

they were located. now, did they have access? maybe, maybe not. it's hard to actually know from the media reports. i do want to see the special counsel and doj treat them equally. there was some discussion about intent. it's not about intent. it's about knowledge of having they documents in your possession. so we'll have to see where the investigation goes. i do want to make that clarification. intent doesn't really matter in this case. it's the knowledge of do you know you have the documents and not giving them back. >> let me move on to the debt ceiling. do you think it's a valid exercise to use the debt ceiling as leverage to try to negotiate spending cuts? >> there's no time like the present. we haven't had a budget since 1998. the democrat president doing it

before that, it was republican richard nixon in 1970. clearly something it wrong. if you look at nationwide 49 of 50 states, they balance their budgets every single fiscal year. you know, we need to get there. $31 trillion created by both republicans and democrats, this is both parties' fault. now is the best time to have the conversation. there are plans out there. for example, the penny plan, i filed that particular piece of legislation that rand paul has in the senate. that would balance the budget in five years and allow the federal government to raise spending by 10% thereafter. i'm not even asking for that. can we do it over ten years? let's have negotiation and build consensus. >> you think the debt limit is a proper way -- why not use the budget process? that's what i don't quite comprehend. >> clearly the budget process isn't working. we haven't had a budget in decades.

there's a lot of fear around shutting down the government, but under the previous administration, the government was shut down 35 days, people still got paid, and the sky didn't fall. i would like to see the president -- and so far he said he's unwilling to negotiate with republicans. that is not how to unify our country. we are very divided right now. we have $31 trillion of debt. the responsible thing to do is get to the table with republicans and negotiate a way -- how do we prioritize spending? we're not even asking to do it in one year, like bill clinton did. can we do it over ten years? that's a reasonable conversation to have. >> do you have one thing you're ready to put on the table as a spending cut that you think both parties can accept? >> well, obviously no cuts to medicare, medicaid or social security. that's a nonstarter for either side.

otherwise, i would lean on the agency heads. the penny plan, is five cents on the dollar in five years, but we can find some way to say negotiate. i believe we should go to the agency heads and say where can we do this and do it over the next decade. that's a very responsible measure. congresswoman nancy mace, always limited time, but i appreciate your time. >> anytime. up next, the classified documents, the story they were found six days before the midterm election, but it would be 68 days before the public found out. our panel is here with the thoughts on the biden administration strategy. angi helps you find the right so for whatever you need done. with angi, you can connect with and see ratings and reviews. just search or scroll to see upf on hundreds of projects. and when you book and pay throug you're covered by our happiness

it's easy to make your home an a check out angi.com today. angi... and done. if you have diabetes, then getting on the dexcom g6 it's easy to make your home an a is the single most important thing you can do. it eliminates painful fingersticks, helps lower a1c, and it's covered by medicare. before dexcom g6, i was frustrated. all of that finger-pricking and all of that pain, my a1c was still stuck. my diabetes was out of control. i was tired. (female announcer) dexcom g6 sends your glucose numbers to your phone or receiver without painful fingersticks. the arrow shows the direction your glucose is heading: up, down, or steady, so you can make better decisions about food and activity in the moment. after using dexcom g6, my a1c has never been lower. i lead line dancing three times a week, i exercise, and i'm just living a great life now. it's so easy to use. dexcom g6 has given me confidence and control that everything i need is right there on my phone. (female announcer) dexcom g6 is the #1 recommended cgm system

by doctors and patients. call now to get started. (bright music)

welcome back panelists here chief white house welcome back, kristin welker, and kimberly atkins stohr, welcome. we have the president, he passed his two-year mark, postponed his reelection announcement under after the state of the union. he tried to address it again on

thursday. >> fully cooperating, looking forward to getting this resolved quickly. i think you'll find there's nothing there. i have no regrets. i'm following what the lawyers have told me they want me to do. that's exactly what we're doing. there's no there there. >> no regrets and no there there. we already heard senator manchin saying there should have been some regret. this timing frustrates democrats. >> to say the least. i'm told there was a drip, drip, drip, and then the additional documents found last weekend. the class within the biden world was, look, we need to stop the bleeding and make sure there's

no additional disclosures. that's why they invited the justice department to do this search inside the president's delaware home. i can tell you talking to fox inside and outside the legislation, they were concerned about that language before we learned about the search last night, and then i was getting all sorts of messages saying why statements like that do not age well. they do think he should be more apologetic. >> peter, does the but trump paragraph work here? >> clearly it's very different from trump. trump was trying to defy a subpoena. he knew what he was doing. he seems to say he owns the documents. biden is saying this was an innocent mistake, but it only goes so far.

yes, they told the archives, that's what they should do, but they hid it from us before the midterm election. the strategy is it was more important to cooperating. but there's a cost to that. >> brendan, has this been a boon to donald trump? >> yeah, if there's action taken against donald trump and not against the president, that's what -- you can say until you're blue in the face that these are different, but voters will see there were consequence foss one president, not the other. clearly they are different, but donald trump is not the standard. you can't set the standard with how donald trump handled things, and joe biden was attacking himself for the underlying

infraction. either that matters or doesn't. >> but this is at a time when public trust of institutions is at a have i low point. this was a point for the biden administration to say, this is how it's down. search everything, take a look. this was inadvertent, then you can do show this is very different from saying, i can unclassify it with my mind, or defying federal authorities and say, no, i have a right to keep these things, they're mine. that is very different, and it was an opportunity to show that to the american public and they missed it. >> i know this is a classic case of lawyers being lawyers and not

wanting to get into the pr game, but it really looks like keeping a close circle was damaging. >> it has been damaging optically. it's important to point out, and kimberly kind of touched on this, in terms of this search that happened at president biden's delaware home, the thinking is it will be short-term pain with long-term gain, because they're being transparent, but i've been sitting in i have the briefings -- >> water torture. >> yes, day after day after day of drip, drip, drip. the white house counsel on's office wants to be careful. they did start to shift their strategy, but there are key questions that still remain unanswered, including why it took two months for the world to learn about this. i want to talk about another issue, the supreme court investigation. i want to put up there their first when -- it was a grave assault on the judicial plods, following up on all available leads. the marshall's team involved additional forensic investigation, but the team has to date been unable to identify the person responsible by a preponderance of the evidence. to me including that phrase seemed to be a yellow flag. >> it's a very legal temple that you would use to judge a lot of other things, the big takeaway is the supreme court has insular or insulated institution for so many years. even the marshal's path to try

to investigate this worked against that fact. there were no rules on how to handle decisions before they were publicly released. 82 people had ahold of this draft opinion. it was even unclear on the initial report if they even spoke to the justices -- >> that firestorm left and right, and they had a new statement, oh, no, we talked to them, too. >> but in that institutions, they are almost deified, that even if you had done so, at the might have sealed wrong. talk about a lack of transparency. there's few places less transparent than the supreme court. >> i look at this and feel like the supreme court is like all the rest of our politics. welcome to the club, guys. now you have your average progress i have and probably a bobblehead doll of ruth bader ginsburg. it's so political now, it feels like no longer a thing that you hold with the highest integrity.

>> they don't use black robes, they wear red and blue. >> that's right. you see consistent liberal and conservative being appointed. now it feels like you look at it "r" this and "d" that. it's very different. >> because this was an internal investigation, it was not subject to the rigors of an fbi investigation. could they have made the argument that a government document was seized? >> or maybe congress will say that supreme court rulings are classified? because then the fbi would have been involved. >> exactly. but i do think the takeaway -- and we were kind of getting to this -- there needs to be more security around this.

fewer people may need to be read in. these people admitted to telling their spouses about the draft document. that's problematic. >> actually, though, they all have one thing in common. we don't think they're transparent, the court, the presidency, the congress, and guess what, zero trust. they have to earn trust back. one party is noticeably absent from the big city. we are back. data download time.

the u.s. conference of mayors e ♪ i know what's right for me. ♪ ♪ i've got a plan to which i'm sticking. ♪ ♪ my doc wrote me the script. ♪ ♪ box came by mail. ♪ ♪ showed up on friday. ♪ ♪ i screened with cologuard and did it my way! ♪ cologuard is a one-of-a kind way to screen for colon cancer that's effective and non-invasive. it's for people 45 plus at average risk, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your provider for cologuard. ♪ (group) i did it my way! ♪

we are back. data download time. the u.s. conference of mayors was here in washington this week for the annual meeting. one group was noticeably absent -- republicans. let me show you. these are the ten most populated cities in america. nine of the ten have elected democrats as mayor, the tenth, san antonio, doesn't elect mayors by party, but i can tell

you that mayor is essentially progressive. so essentially nobody right of center is a mayor. four of the top ten, new york, finals, san diego, l.a. all had republican mayors, a huge change. right now just three have republican mayors -- oklahoma city, jacksonville and fort worth, texas. that is it. in 2000, of course, that number out of 25 was just seven, so less than half of what it was in 2000. look, these 25 major cities, they told 38 million citizens in those cities. that accounts for 12% of the overall u.s. population, and in fact, there are more people in these 25 cities than there are in 21 states. so when you talk about political power, yes, sir, governors have

power, but the mayors are also political juggernauts themselves particularly on the democratic side of the aisle. meanwhile, this week marks 25 years since news brock that president clinton had an extra marital affair with a intern. monica lewinsky joined this program to discuss the president's future just after the story broke. do you believe the president can survive this crisis? >> i don't know. i don't want to call myself a country lawyer, but i'm certainly mott a beltway lawyer and not a accomplice cal pundit. >> does it influence you to know that the fate of the country, the fate of bill clinton is in your hands and monica lewinsky. >> in addition to the fact that i don't believe the fate of the government is in my hands or peloton could lewinsky's and, scares me.

i do respect the presidency. when we come back, just how much did the lewinsky scandal change the course of our political history? trust me, we are still living with the consequences to day. our panel is next. panel is next. powerful relief so you can restore and recover. theraflu hot beats cold.

this weeks marks the 25th anniversary of an event that launched today's politics. there was a story about president clinton having an affair with monica lewinsky. it was around the clock media coverage, speculation and takeoff of a more partisan cable tv news environment. it remains one of the most significant forks in the road, and perhaps we're still living in that moment. peter baker, you and i were very much younger reporters in this moment. i think and it hit me, we're

i think and it hit me, we're still in this loop. >> we were thinking, my god, what have we released here. the white house investigation, but i think to your point it changed our politics. it wasn't just a one-off sex scandal, which -- but it maid things more tribal. any investigation, any scandal about us versus them. that's what we've seen time and time again ever since. we saw it with trump and other presidents. i think we redefined our ideologies to which side are we on? >> before 1998 we had had one impeachment. since then, we've had three.

we've lived in this moment constantly. the way democrats rallied around bill clinton, we saw republicans rally around donald trump. you can't help but ask yourself, without clinton, does trump ever happen? >> it's like while i don't like you did, you're my guy and i would never give the other side a win. it's turned politics into a soap opera. that's what we still have today. a lot of politicians are much more entertainers in their own mind than push servants. it corrodes or politics. there's so many outlets, so many more platforms for the media to perform. >> the partisanship of cable exploded, the idea that cable news is a primetime designation didn't exist until monica. also, there was an incredibly passionate thing that happened.

when we talk about me too, and i've had younger staff, they say when they learn the history, they don't understand why there was no discussion of the power dynamic? that's how immature the debate was. i've had conversation with his people the viewpoint over monica lewinsky then has changed so profoundly, this 22-year-old intern -- >> weal have 22-year-olds walking around our office, and the attacks, i couldn't imagine being a part of that. she seems to have come out of that with a lot of grace and respect now, in retrospect, but it really shows the difference in -- up until then, aside from clarence thomas, there wasn't a sex scandal this public. not differently enough, but at least there is a change. >> i think that's one of the biggest impact, this cultural

shift. monica lewinsky herself describes herself as patient zero for internet shaming. she'd talk about being bullied, what that experience was like, and the way she was treated has not aged well. in many ways, it is a -- from the me-too movement, as you say, so many people have changed their perspective about how they viewed that moment, how he viewed her and how they treated here. >> peter, i wonder, it will take some outside event to shift the fork in the road, but i don't know how it worked. >> we had 9/11, and it changed our politics for about a year or so, but i don't know what would be the equivalent. we have the debt ceiling issue,

we have a crisis of our democracy, we have a crisis of the war in ukraine, so many crises, and we can't come together on things. >> everything is worse since then. that's the bottom line. before we go, read our daily newsletter. scan the qr code on the screen, on you go to nbc.com. thank for you watching. we'll see you next week, because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." you've been asking me about motive. we're still not clear about the motive. the investigation cont