right now on "andrea mitchell reports," tragedy striking california again. this time in half moon bay, a northern california coastal time where at least seven people are dead in two separate shootings. the suspected gunman arrested by police in a parking lot. >> this kind of shooting is horrific. it's a tragedy that we hear about far too often. today, it has hit home. also this hour, a georgia judge hearing arguments on whether to let the public see what a special grand jury recommends on former president

donald trump's alleged involvement in trying to overturn george's 2020 election results. congressman adam schiff on republican efforts to keep him from serving on the intelligence committee he just chaired. and the string of mass shootings in his home state. good day, everyone. i'm andrea mitchell in washington. in about 15 minutes, we expect a sheriff's update on the latest mass shooting in california, the second in as many days. this time in half moon bay. the victims members of the aapi community. seven people are dead and another with life-threatening injuries after police say an

agricultural worker opened fire on his co-workers at two farms. many of the workers live in these rural complexes with their families and children. some of the children witnessed the tragedy after they had just gotten home from school. nbc news has exclusive video of the moment the 67-year-old suspect surrendered in a sheriff's office parking lot. last night the county sheriff describing the shock among workers going about their routines. >> people saw him there today and is seemed like a normal day for everyone. then this tragedy happened. >> nbc's jake ward is in half moon bay. jake, it's just too horrible to imagine this is the second time in california in as many days. talk about the small coastal community and how the residents are dealing today. >> reporter: part of what is so disorienting, andrea, is this is a place where you come to get away from it all.

i bring my children here to go to the beach, to go to the pumpkin patch, buy trees and shrubs from the loca nurseries. the suspect allegedly arrived here at the spot where i'm standing, the first of two scenes, and made his way into the greenhouse complexes. killed four people and critically wounded a fifth. then drove himself a mile from here and shot three more people, again all alleged before driving himself to the sheriff's substation where we saw him being put on the ground by deputies. it's not quite clear yet exactly what the connection is between the shooter and victims. it may be that they were co-workers. we are hearing more and more that officials are referring to him as a co-worker of them, that he worked at these places. that has not yet been confirmed.

of course, the added horror here that 25 people lived here in in complex, including children, who were around at the time. may have actually witnessed the event and its aftermath. as we understand it, they were all taken to a shelter last night, kept there overnight. it was in that environment that they had to wait and find out whether their friends, co-workers and perhaps even their family members had been killed in this. of course, andrea, it goes on and on. last night, there was another mass shooting. this time in oakland, about 45 minutes north of here at a gas station where one person was killed, seven injured in another shooting. this all leading the governor to just describe this as tragedy upon tragedy. he referred to the second amendment as a suicide pact in comments to cbs. political rhetoric around gun reform tightening at this hour. this quiet coastal community of 12,000 just reeling at this hour

from just an unimaginable -- a truly unimaginable shooting taking place in its midst, andrea. >> jake, the governor, he was in l.a. because of the monterey park shooting comforting people in l.a. county when he heard about this -- another shooting. this just -- it is just impossible to comprehend what is going on out there. we will hear more about what they may know about the linkage between the suspect and that location, whether he is a co-worker and any possible motive. because we will have a news briefing within this hour, maybe in 15 or 20 minutes. right? >> reporter: that's absolutely right. we are expecting to hear from authorities in the next 15 or 20 minutes. we heard the vice mayor having been described out to the community several times, their staff being here for a portion of yesterday before the shooting took place. i believe we have a little bit of that sound.

let's have a listen to that if we can. >> provided information and resources for him. we never -- he was always pleasant who has never in the negative with us. we celebrated christmas with these workers, including the shooter. we brought gifts, food for them for the celebration. yesterday, part of my team has been there a few minutes prior to the shooting to bring some items for the families, for the farm workers. >> reporter: just this deep connection in this community between people, because it's just such a small town. as you mentioned, the governor really not being able to come to grips with one tragedy before another strikes. we are seeing it go on and on in california. >> jake ward, thank you. about 400 miles down the

california coast, the death toll in monterey park's lunar new year shooting has risen to 11. another survivor has been released from the hospital. we are learning about the hero seen in this exclusive surveillance video. the man disarmed the gunman inside the second dance hall. he told lester holt at first he froze. >> i had to believe i was going to die, my life was ending here at that very moment. something amazing happened. a miracle, actually. he started to try to prep his weapon so he could shoot everybody. then it dawned on me that this was the moment to disarm him. i could do something here that could protect everybody. in one shove, i kind of just pushed him away and quickly aimed the gun at him and said, go away, i'll shoot.

get out of here, go. >> are you pointing the gun at him as you are saying this? >> yes, i was. >> did he say anything during this encounter? >> no. his facial expression, his eyes did most of the talking. >> what did those eyes tell you? >> they told me he wanted to do harm. he was troubled individual trying to do harm to others, make people feel the pain he was feeling. >> just incredible. lester holt, of course, with mr. tsay, this incredible hero. kathy park is there. this truly selfless act by brandon tsay. police have yet to pinpoint the suspect's motive. what are investigators saying? >> reporter: the shooting took place saturday night. as of this hour, we still don't have confirmation on a motive. it remains a mystery. law enforcement sources are telling nbc news that it's

likely that it was personal in nature, not terrorism related or a hate crime at this point. officials are saying everything is still under investigation and they are covering all angles. authorities were able to uncover several pieces of evidence at his home. they were able to find several pieces of electronic devices, several rounds of ammunition. i thought what was interesting was they found equipment to manufacture firearms suppressers. obviously, those are being analyzed at this point. part of the larger investigation. also cnn is reporting that the gunman frequented this ballroom behind me where the shooting took place. that's actually where he met his ex-wife. they married decades ago. but they did divorce in 2006.

cnn is reporting that she said he was quick to anger. we are getting a little bit more color about this individual's background as the investigation moves forward. andrea? >> kathy park in monterey park. thank you very much. joining me now is a reporter for nbc asian america and james brently. two incidents, major trauma. the chinese embassy issuing a warning for chinese foreign nationals in the u.s. due to the recent cases of gun violence. how is the community handling this? >> andrea, it is -- i think people are just so shaken right now and confused. i can't tell you how many people just have told me that they have barely begun to grieve that first tragedy before the second struck. it's especially confusing in

looking at asian american attitudes towards gun violence. we have some of the highest if not the highest rates of support for stricter gun laws and gun reform. nearly 20 percentage points higher than the national average. of course, when you look at someplace like monterey park, that's largely long regarded as a hub for asian americans. this is a place where so many asian immigrants have felt they could put down roots as a first stop in the u.s. it's somewhere that people have felt like they can be themselves when that's not necessarily the case all across the country. of course, that there's this other layer to this, which is this is occurring during lunar new year, a time for joy, celebration and community. this is a time when we are ushering the year of the rabbit. it was said to bring in a time of peace, reflection and prosperity. i have talked to so many asian americans that feel that this

really loving, joyful time has been robbed of them. it would be remiss to not mention that all of this is happening against a backdrop of years of this heightened anxiety around public safety. asian americans have dealt with this sort of -- this anti-asian violence. regardless, regardless of the background of the shooter, there has been this -- asian americans haven't felt safe. this has really just come out of that. >> james, the half moon bsis suspect was in his 60s. the monterey park suspect was in his 70s. >> we go back to 1966. we have looked at 185 cases of mass shootings, four or more people killed, and there's only six perpetrators over the age of 60. these perpetrators are the oldest and third oldest mass

shooters in our data, which is -- it's unique. at the same time i think it's important to reflect on, here we are again. i think einstein said, insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. we normalized mass shootings in our society from active shooter drills for children to the guns everywhere policies to routine thoughts and prayers. even this right here, the endless media cycle around these issues, the scores of mass shootings that have come before the most recent ones have incrementally lowered the threshold for this type of a crime. they have reduced the barrier for entry. absent any legislative action here to address how easy it is for people who shouldn't have firearms to get access to them, this is going to keep happening. we can't put the genie back in the bottle now. that's the real tragedy here. this just keeps happening again and again and again.

something has to be done to stop it from happening one more time. >> indeed. the senators, including diane feinstein, who led the successful effort to get an assault weapon ban legislated in 1994, which expired ten years later, congress let it expire, she has introduced new legislation with a lot of others yesterday and senator blumenthal. there is a lot of support in the senate. of course, the house is another issue. thank you both so much. breaking news georgia's fulton county. a judge is hearing about whether the public should be allowed to see the results of an extensive special grand jury investigation into former president trump's alleged meddling in the state's 2020 election results. joining me now is nbc's blayne alexander in atlanta.

take us through the key players in court today, the georgia procedures that are unusual here, because this is not an indicting grand jury, and what did the d.a. say in court today? >> reporter: andrea, that hearing is less than 15 minutes under way. we heard from the fulton county d.a. the big headline is that she does not believe this report should be made public. she stood before the judge and said that speaking as somebody who represents the people, she says that in the name of justice and the name of, in her words, protecting future defendants, she doesn't believe any portion of this report should be made public. this isn't something that we had heard before. up until about five minutes ago, we didn't know which way she went. notably that she's one of very few people who actually know what's in the report. as she said to the judge, she said -- she spoke to the judge, who has been overseeing this from the beginning, and says, judge, as you know, as someone who read this report, that,

quote, decisions are imminent. she says that she doesn't believe it's appropriate for any of this report to be made public. we know that throughout the hearing we're going to hear from other people, specifically members of the media. an attorney representing members of the media who are trying to make it public. they are citing an extraordinary public interest in this case. even pointing to the fact that the grand jurors themselves, the body that heard all of the testimony over many months and wrote this report, says that they want it to be made public. they voted for it to be released to the public. they're going to argue on this front. this is ongoing as of right now, andrea. another thing to point out from what we heard within this hearing is the extraordinary measures that they have gone to keep this report from leaking. the judge said from the very beginning that he actually hand delivered a copy of that report to the d.a.'s office. he said he believes that that is the only report that's in circulation. the only copy in circulation. it wasn't digitally transmitted

or e-mailed. he took a hard copy presumably to keep it from leaking out before any decision is made. i think we have sound from inside the courtroom if we can toss to that. >> we think for future defendants to be treated fairly, it's not appropriate at this time to have this report released. i as the elected district attorney have made several commitments to the public understanding the public interest around this case. at this time, in the interest of justice and the rights of not the state but others, we are asking that the report not be released because you, having seen that report, decisions are imminent. we are going to half moon bay, california, the sheriff is speaking. >> only known connection between the victims and the suspect is that they may have been

co-workers. the coroner's office is still working on identification of the victims and notifications of next of kin. as some of these victims were members of our migrant community, this represents a unique challenge when it comes to notifications and identifications of next of kin. all the evidence we have points to this being the instance of workplace violence. the mounted mushroom farm, the first location, is where the subject was employed. i'd like to hand it off to now our district attorney. >> thank you. thank you, sheriff. good morning. i'm the district attorney. the case -- my job is to inform you where the case will go. the sheriff's office is submitting the case to us today. we will review it. the arrangement will not be this afternoon as was first put out. it will be tomorrow afternoon. at 1:30 here in this building,

courtroom 4a, the custody courtroom. the charges have not yet been determined, because until we review all of the information, we will make that decision later today or tomorrow morning. again, the charges obviously involve the homicides involved, as the sheriff just said. i want to make a specific reference to the fact that i have been briefed on the sheriff's office investigation of this case. cases like this -- we never had one in this county of this many deaths at one scene or one time. it's a very hectic scene. the sheriff's office did a magnificent scene investigating this case. i'm very proud to have the sheriff's office as our colleagues and the sheriff as my colleague. the work was done extraordinarily well. again, in terms of precise detail, we're not going to be giving out a lot of precise detail on what was said. this is a case that is at the beginning stage. it has a long road to travel

over the coming months and years. to that extent, we don't want to try it out in the public eye but instead, we will ultimately handle this case in one of the courtrooms in that building. now i will turn it back for any questions that may exist for us. >> good morning. i'm the sheriff's pio. i will take any questions. it was a legally purchased firearm and owned. we are not releasing that information at this time. it was a semiautomatic handgun. as far as make and model, we're not releasing that. he did not actively surrender to us. he was located in his vehicle in the parking lot of the half moon bay substation, one of our deputies located the vehicle

there and recognized it from the information we had from the scene. at that point, he started giving the subject commands. the subject exited the vehicle and was taken into custody without incident. we had the suspect information as well as suspect vehicle information. all the evidence we have right now points to a workplace violence incident. we're not releasing that information at this time. we are still working on -- with the coroner's office on notification of the victims' families. we're not releasing specific identifying information of the

victims. like the sheriff said, they were all adults. and a mixture of asian and hispanic victims. i don't have that specific information at this time. again, we're not releasing that information at this time. i'm sorry, i don't have that information. as far as his criminal history, we're not releasing that information. there were no specific indicators that would have led us to believe that he was capable of something like this. he was not known to us or to have any sort of, again, indicators that may have led us to believe that this is something he might have done.

we're not releasing any information as related to his status like that. i don't have the specifics for that. we're not releasing that information at this time. i'm sorry? we don't have any information that they were witnesses to the incident. we know these farms -- there's a mixture of folks who work there as well as reside there. we do know that there were children in the vicinity. as far as being specific witnesses to it, we don't have that information. i'm sorry, i don't have that information.

as far as what led to this specific incident, i don't have any information like that. i will say that the coast has experienced its share of challenges over the last few weeks, specifically as it relates to all the incredible weather we have had. there's been flooding. there's been people out of work. the coast has certainly had its share of challenges recently. this just adds to that stress. i'm sorry, we're not releasing that information right now. i will take maybe a couple more questions. i don't have that information for you right now. i'm sorry. last one. thank you very much. sheriff, do you have anything to add? >> as we gain more developments, we will be apprising you of the

information. again, i just wanted to give my condolences to the victims, the families, the co-workers and the coastal community who is suffering gravely. we will be working together as a county to heal. thank you. >> back with me with jacob ward and james densley. what we heard from the sheriff is, first of all, they don't know a motive. they don't know a cause. we also heard from the d.a. is that all the evidence points to a workplace related incident. but they don't know the details of that. you heard the public information officer from the police saying there has been a lot of stress recently because of the flooding, people have been out of work, this, of course, adds to the stress. but they don't know the actual

cause. seven mailmales, one female. seven deaths, one person with life-threatening injuries in the hospital. a mix of asian and hispanic victims. the subject did not surrender. he was in his car where the police then spotted him, a deputy recognized the car and they surrounded him and at that point they got him out of the car. jacob, did you hear any other details there that i might not have heard? >> reporter: the thing that also jumps out at me is what the district attorney had to say there about this being the largest mass shooting in the history of this area, essentially, that gun violence has suddenly affected this place the way he has never seen before. also just the close-knit relationships in this community. obviously, the ripples of this going everywhere. you heard the sheriff's deputy saying there that children were present here on the scene at the

time that the shooting may have taken place, may have witnessed the violence, certainly may have witnessed the aftermath. all of that really leaping out at me, just the horror of this and the unprecedented historic nature of this shooting, that really jumped out at me. >> to the professor, james, the horror of this -- first of all the mix of victims, asian and hispanics. these are farm workers. they have had tremendous pressure. they have been out of work because of the flooding. they can't work in the fields. we don't know what caused it. they are pointing to a workplace related incident. >> that's right. in our research, you find that workplace shootings are the most common type of mass shooting. it's usually some sort of stressor or grievance associated with the workplace, which is underlying that. this is a common theme that we have seen in the history of mass shootings. going back decades.

i think the other thing to note here as well is that a mass shooting is always intended to be a final act. there's really no other outcome from a mass shooting. that you either will take your own life, it will be taken for you by law enforcement or you are destined to spend the rest of your days in prison. it's clear this individual had nowhere left to go. this was the final act in their life, so to speak. another tragedy, another workplace tragedy, which is a very common form of mass shooting. some consistency with maybe the grievance being associated with the workplace and the people there. then this being their final act and a way of trying to settle that score, whatever it was. >> james, jacob, thank you so much. congressman adam schiff joins us now.

first, congressman, you represent a district in california. now two horrific mass shootings in -- saturday night to yesterday. it's just incredible. monterey bay -- monterey park and half moon bay, talk to me about that, about the gun issue and about your reaction as a california legislator. >> it's devastating. i represented monterey park for over a decade. it is now in the neighboring district. i know the people, what a wonderful close-knit community it is. i was there a couple days ago and saw the grief. i could only imagine what half moon bay is going through now. there are reports of another mass shooting, including a fatality, in oakland, california. all within a matter of days. it shows gun violence isn't going to go anywhere unless we do something about it.

this is what really adds so much anger to the mystery of these shootings, which is, we can do something about this. we can do something about this. we can't stop all of it. but we can stop a lot of it. we can do so by universal background checks. we can do so by strengthening mental health care. we can ban assault weapons and extended clips. i have been carrying a bill to remove the immunity the gun industry has. the only industry that's immune even when acting negligently. this is why this is so maddening. we don't have to live this way. we can't live this way. >> congressman, bear with me. i'm going to ask you to wait for a few moments. there's breaking news. i want to get you to react to it. this involves a small number -- apparently, a small number of classified documents found in

the indiana home former vice president mike pence. this is enormously significant. we now have of course what happened with donald trump, with the former president, a large number and resistance to turning them over for more than a year, then, of course, five batches of classified documents, we don't know the amount of pages and only one that's listed as top secret, found in joe biden's home and transition office, post vice-presidency office for vice president. we have a number of letters between his representative to the national archives and the national archives. how did they find them? >> andrea, we just obtained these two documents, two letters sent by the former vice president's attorney to the national archives. i want to walk you through some of the details.

the first is dated january 18. according to this document, it says following the reports about documents being found at the home of president biden, that the office of the former vice president mike pence did its own search. on monday, january 16, they engaged their outside lawyers with experience in this process to do it. according to one of the letters we received, they did discover records that appear to be, in their words, a small number of documents baring classified markings that were, in the words of this letter written by the former vice president's attorney, inadvertently box and transported to the personal home of the former vice president at the end of the last administration. it goes on to say that the vice president pence was unaware of the existence at his personal residence. it remains in indiana. it says the vice president understands the high importance of protecting sensitive and classified information and stands ready and willing to cooperate fully with the national archives and any

appropriate inquiries. a couple things to try to digest. first, we heard about former president trump who refused to detail any of this, provided some documents, then there was a search warrant executed where they found 103 documents. then it was about president biden who initially didn't detail any of the discovery that was made until it was first reported by the media. then there's been the drip, drip, drip of new revelations. they did go immediately to the national archives. here it was only after media reports that we then heard from the office of mike pence. they went to the national archives, exactly what the president joe biden did, as well. it just adds another layer to this story. notably, the former vice president mike pence has been very critical about the handling of the investigation into president biden right now. basically has suggested there's a double standard between the handling of the investigations of the former president and joe biden. >> this came out because of a media leak? >> there was a leak within last

hour and within the last 30 minutes or so we obtained these two documents between the lawyer for the former vice president and the national ar kie archive >> peter alexander on the story. adam schiff, you were the chairman of the intelligence committee. before that, you had been on the intelligence committee. you handled classified documents all the time in the capitol. i want to ask you your reaction to this. then i want to ask you about the way documents are handled. let's talk about what happened with vice president pence. >> i think both those questions are interrelated. it appears there's a systemic problem with former occupants of the presidency and vice presidency having classified information at their homes when it shouldn't be there or at their libraries or their university repositories.

this now appears systemic. we're going to have to ask for another assessment by the intelligence community of any risk posed by the presence of these documents somewhere they shouldn't be. i think there needs to be a review of what happens when people leave that office, the presidency and vice presidency. again, there are very important differences here from resisting returning the documents, fighting it, his lawyers misrepresenting that they had -- it appears pence and biden have been fully cooperative, entering the documents over whether they -- when they are discovered. >> speaking to that problem, did you take documents home?

>> no. i never take classified documents to my house. i don't know why reason why people would. i am so paranoid when i go into and out of the scif to make sure i have no electronics, that i have nothing with me on the way out. i'm very, very careful about it. i would assume that everyone else is. clearly, there's a problem here. >> you said you had been nominated to be on the intelligence committee, but there's talk among republicans that they will ban you and others who were active in the impeachment process and also who had been critical of former president trump. do you have any indication from the speaker as to whether you will be able to serve as former chairs of the intelligence committee have always served on the committee in a ranking position or another position once their chairmanship is over? >> i'm grateful to leader jeffries for once again nominating me to be the lead democrat, the ranking democrat on the intelligence committee. it's a serious committee with

important responsibilities always, but particularly now when one of our allies, ukraine, is at war are russia. when china and iran are doing things. this is not the time to mess around. i think its important to see he is willing to interview with the intelligence committee and the establishment of the select committee on the weaponization of the federal government that will have access to classified information. he is putting some of the most irresponsible of his members on that select committee. that's only going to cause the intelligence community to further distrust congress, reluctant to share information with congress, which means we can't as policymakers do what we need to do to protect the country. it's related to mccarthy's weakness as speaker and his

reliance on marjorie taylor greene, on donald trump, his willingness to do their bidding. >> if you are not -- if he tries to stop you from being on the intelligence committee, what options do you have? he's the speaker. >> i will be working with leader jeffries to figure out where i can play a role, make sure that we continue to hold him accountable. if mccarthy believes this will stop me from pointing out when they abuse their power, when they endanger the country, it's not going to stop me at all. i will simply work with leader jeffries to find new ways to continue holding them to account. >> i do want to ask you, because there's so much talk that you are considering if a senate seat opens up, if diane feinstein were to step down, would you throw your hat in the ring? >> i don't have anything to say at this point. i'm not ready to make any announcement today. i will be -- have more to say on the subject soon.

senator feinstein and i, as you know, have worked together very closely on intelligence issues, on issues affecting california. we are both working hard to make sure that we can recover from the storms. that's been both of our focus over the last few weeks. i will have more to say very soon. >> adam schiff, congressman, thank you very much. appreciate it. >> thank you. i want to bring in former u.s. attorney paul charlton, brendon buck, and peter alexander. paul, let's talk about mike pence and documents found in his indiana home. we don't know the classification level. we don't know how many. as congressman schiff said, i think you could say this as an expert -- i have covered the intelligence community -- there's a systemic problem. this is no longer a republican

or democratic problem. >> there's indeed a systemic problem. i hold a top clearance level. i was extraordinarily careful to make sure the documents we were reviewing were kept in a sensitive facility. it does seem now republicans, democrats, former presidents and vice presidents have a problem in making sure that we are guarding our nation's secrets. in addition to making some more work for our attorney general to determine the appropriate course of action, we as a country are going to have to review how it is we allow former top level officials to keep and guard our nation's secrets in their personal residences. >> here is the issue now for republicans. mike pence is a possible republican presidential candidate.

donald trump has obviously been damaged in his legal expexposur possible obstruction of justice because of the amount of time he spent resisting turning over those documents. does all of this diminish the political potency of the issue against joe biden or donald trump? >> yeah, it's hard to say it doesn't. first thing that comes to my mind is, do we have another special counsel on our hands? mike pence is very much indicating that he may run for president himself. if that's the standard we are setting that you can't trust doj on its own, then we may be looking at that again. it really feels like the air is coming out of this issue. i think all of us are learning about this in real time. if this is just a thing that sort of happens, it's hard to see this being particularly damaging for either trump or biden. obviously, this is only a small part of donald trump's legal woes. perhaps we move to the next thing. it's hard to imagine people are going to get too worked up about

it if we continue to find this takes place. if we have a systemic problem and it makes you wonder what's happening with former president obama, former president bush. these are real questions we need to ask at this point. >> let's hear mike pence, some sound from him in an interview he did in november. >> let me ask you, as we sit here in your home office in indiana, did you take any classified documents with you from the white house? >> i did not. >> so, michael steele, let's talk about that. he says it was inadvertent. he didn't know they were there. again, how do classified documents which are so clearly marked, usually have an orange band across the front, how do they get mixed in? >> they do. apparently, they do. i think that -- i have been saying for a while now that

this -- i bet this problem goes beyond trump, goes beyond biden. i'm almost certain if you go back and look at the former presidents that they will find some documents. that's part of the problem. the other part is the classification system. they will classify a ham sandwich if they need to. the question becomes whether or not some of these documents objectively are or should have been classified whatever level they are classified. that's how this gets a little bit confused. something may look, because of the facts that are stated, the issues that are raised inside the document, to be not as sensitive as some other documents, but are indeed, quote, classified. you know, i think part of this investigation at all levels is, okay, what is the nature of the documents?

then is, how did they get here? you don't have the vice president or the president sitting on the floor boxing these documents up themselves. clearly, there's some direction that's given or a lack of clarification that's not given that says, hey, these are the documents that we need to separate because they shouldn't have been here in the first place and make sure they get where they need to be. there's a lot more we're going to learn. i'm not going to be surprised if we find out there are more documents at pence's locations as well as biden and certainly we know what's going on with trump. >> the one advantage mike pence might have is i don't think he has as many homes and doesn't have offices in different universities. i don't think he has yet established any of those outposts. he is considering very strongly a presidential run. he wrote a book.

you can imagine how much he is in the mix going forward. >> this certainly gets him back in the headlines. that's for sure. i didn't think this was going to knock joe biden out of re-election. i didn't think it was going to knock donald trump out of a chance for the nomination. i don't think it's going to hurt mike pence that much. obviously, i think it's -- i know you appreciate this. there seems to be a difference between how mike pence and donald trump handled that. i have said before, i don't think that we should judge people based on how donald trump handled something. it seems that mike pence wants to be a responsible actor. it puts him in the same camp as joe biden. mistakes happen. i'm doing it the right way. all of it is a mess at this point. all of us are scratching our head and saying, how did we get in this situation? i don't know that this is going to derail any mike pence run for president. >> peter alexander, you have been working the phones. i imagine merrick garland is asking himself, you know, how do i get myself in the middle of

all of this? >> you can imagine side by side special counsels. i have been reading through the letters. i want to update people on the information as we are learning it. the discovery was initially made as we understand it last week. the former vice president, mike pence, had his lawyers search his records in his indiana home last week. this is alert dated the 16th. they got involved in this process. they discovered the documents. then he secured them. they were found in his home. at that point, he secured them in a safe at his home. the fbi would retrieve the documents from the former vice president on thursday. a few days later. pence aides told the archives the documents were found on the 16th. here is another detail. a second letter from the attorney for the former vice president dated on the 22nd says

the doj bypassed the standard procedures and requested direct possession, the former vice president agreed to it. the fbi agents came to the indiana residence at 9:30 p.m. to collect the documents that had been secured in his safe. the transfer was faciliated by the former vice president's personal attorney who had the expertise to conduct a review of this kind. a new detail that will give legs to this is that the documents were found in a pair of boxes among the vice president's papers from his time in office. those boxes of materials minus the classified documents were in four boxes that have been turned over to the archives by pence's aide on january 23rd. that's just yesterday. which is to say, there's still review of the documents, of the boxes to see what other classified documents may be in there. there's no indication at this time the classification markings. just a lot of new information

coming in as you see a more similar scenario how the former vice president and president joe biden handled it as compared to the way former president handle >> vice president pence let them go to the house. he was here for the march of life annual commemoration. they went to his home in indiana with his attorney there. his attorney handled classified documents before. also joining us now is former obama white house press secretary robert gibbs. this does -- it may not be a legal issue, but it moves the political football, if you will. >> yeah. i mean, it strikes me listening to your reporting and to peter's reporting that, again, it is this, if you will, kind of sloppy bookkeeping or sloppy packing as you leave the vice

presidency. i think the distinction that peter made is really important. there's discovery of documents, there's calling the archives, there's calling the department of justice, there's turning those things over. versus fighting the turning of those over. even going so far as former president trump did in saying that those were not their documents, meaning the government's. they were his documents. again, i think this probably helps the political case of joe biden some. >> kimberly, as an attorney, do you think that merrick garland has any options other than a special counsel given the prominence of the former vice president, similarities and the fact that he is a likely candidate? >> i guess it depends on what the standard is. is it somebody who is an active candidate for president? clearly someone who is currently in office, that seems to be the

standard. mike pence doesn't fit into any of those at the moment. i think it will have to be a judgment call by the attorney general. but in the interest of trying to be transparent and open, i wouldn't be surprised if that happened. to get to an earlier question as to whether this takes sort of the political sting out of other people that it has happened to, i think it's the opposite. i think that it -- i think it clarifies things. so far, there have been calls to have a special counsel and treat president biden exactly the way trump was treated. treat different people in different parties the same. this takes the parties out of it. you treat the situation the sameies the same. this takes the parties out of it. you create the situation the same. based on what we know so far, pence and biden are in a more similar situation than donald trump, who claimed to declassify things and that's where you get to the difference between an administrative infraction and a

potentially criminal action. i think if that's where you draw the line here. whether it was a potential crime. i think that line is pretty clear. >> as we're multitasking today, i want to ask you to return georgia, where we started sol time ago with that hearing today, with the da, has said that prosecutorial decisions are imminent that she's against the recommendation by this special grand jury to release their recommendations, their report. the prosecutorial decisions are eminent and there could be multiple defendants. what do you think this judge is going to do? the. >> the important aspect of that from the district attorney is the last part. that there are future defendants

and wants to protect the rights of those future defendants. that is a very clear statement that there are charges upcoming. she plans to charge individuals with offenses based on their recommendations of the grand jury. and she's doing right thing here by saying as a prosecutor and as every of prosecutor knows, her obligation goes not just to prosecuting those who have been accused of a crime, but protecting rights before formal charges. these are a presumption of innocence. we ought thot to discuss in the public arena, charges that might be brought against them until i decide i will be bringing charges and what seems clear after today's hearing, that there will be charges forthcoming from the district attorney. we just don't know what those charges will be. >> she does have to go through the process of another grand jury. our thanks to all of you.

wheen mile, former secretary of state mike pompeo is blasting "washington post" columnist jamal khashoggi. he writes the media made khashoggi out to be a bob woodward martyred for bravely criticizing the saudi royal family. he was a potential candidate in 2024. he mocks the portrayal of khashoggi and writes, he didn't deserve to die, but we need to be clear about who he was. too many in the media were not. joining us now is david ignatius, foreign affairs columnist, a friend and close colleague of jamal's. we also have a statement from the publisher's ceo of "the washington post" saying it is shocking and disappointing to see mike pompeo's book

misrepresent the life of columnist jamal khashoggi. it is shaflful he would spread falsehoods to dishonor a man's life and service. you knew jamal very well. a secretary state when the decision was made by the trump administration not to reveal the conclusion. the de facto leader of saudi arabia was responsible for ordering the murder and burrturing of jamal khashoggi. he was the former cia director. >> the publisher in the statement that you just. and sold mike pompeo stays in the book, i read it this morning to get ready for our conversation, the following. i just would ask viewers to pay attention. mike pompeo writes, this

butchery was outrageous, unacceptable, horrific, sad, despicable, and unlawful. so pompeo himself makes the case that the terrible crime was committed here. he says that there's no direct evidence linking saudi arabia to them. not fund thely different from what the cia said. they gave the order for the operation, which is pretty much the same thing. i can't help but think that pompeo wants to pick a fight with the media. he's running for president. he knows that the trump base loves fights between trump and now pompeo and the media. but it's gratuitous and contradicts the words that pompeo uses himself to describe

what happened in this murder, this grotesque butchery. so i wish pompeo had stuck with what he knows. he wasn't a perfect person nobody is. no journalist would claim to be perfect in every way. that's not the issue. the issue is he was murdered in a brutal way. he was hacked to bits. and the former secretary of state chooses to kind of make a fight for political reasons with the news media. >> to say that he was a saudi arabian bob woodward, that's a pretty special thing. david ignatius, thank you. >> it's special, jamal never claimed to be. exactly. that does it for this

edition of "andrea mitchell reports." remember to follow us online on facebook and on twitter. peter alexander will be here for chris jansing, right after this moment. after this moment (cecily) what's up, einstein? (einstein) my network has gone kaput! (cecily) oh, you tried to save a buck on it? (einstein) i got what i paid for. not so smart. (cecily) nah, you're still a genius. but, there is a smarter way to save. (einstein) oh?! (cecily) switch to verizon! for a limited time, get welcome unlimited for just $25/line. (einstein) $25?! (cecily) and it's guaranteed for 3 years! (einstein) brilliant! (cecily) well, you would know. (einstein) i'm switching!

(cecily) i think the bike's probably faster. (vo) now is the best time to switch to verizon. for just $25 a line. guaranteed for 3 years. the savings that last. on the network you want. verizon. ♪♪ over the last 100 years, lincoln's witnessed a good bit of history. even made some themselves. makes you wonder... what will they do for an encore? ♪♪ subway keeps upping their game with the subway series. an all-star menu of delicious subs. like #8 the great garlic - rotisserie style chicken,

bacon and garlic aioli. i've tasted greatness. great garlic though - tastes way better. can't argue with that analysis. try subway's tastiest menu upgrade yet.

good day to you. i'm peter alexander. werth we are live in washington, d.c. we have breaking news developing