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>> frankly, i'm shocked. i'm sickened by what i saw. i have seen the video. and as he stated, you will too. in a word, it's absolutely appalling. >> the brutal beating death of 29-year-old tyre nichols brings back the horrifying memories of rodney king. except king survived. nichols is dead. now five memphis police officers are charged with his murder. >> also tonight, american radicalization. how mike flynn convicted of lying to the fbi, is fusing christian nationalism and conspiracy propaganda in his radical road shows. plus, the racist republican dog whistles aren't dog whistles anymore. the right-wing racist attacks against people like ilhan omar, former secretary elaine chao, and many others, is now right out in the open. and we begin tonight in los angeles, california, where i'm

here for the premiere of the 1619 project hulu documentary which is still legal to watch in the united states, ron desantis. at least for now. and we arrive here as america deals with the real world consequences of radicalization. which happens to be one of the consequences of allowing historical lies to fester over time. tomorrow, we will get a disturbing glimpse of that hate, when a san francisco court releases the video of the attack on paul pelosi. the brazen assault took place days before the midterm election. the husband of then speaker nancy pelosi was asleep when david depape broke into the pelosis' san francisco home and beat him with a hammer. in addition to a hammer, authorities recovered a roll of tape, white rope, a second hammer, a pair of rubber and cloth gloves, and zip ties, according to the police. depape wanted to hold nancy pelosi hostage and break her

knee caps to make an example of her as leader of the pack of what he called the lying democrats. he also had an additional hit list that included actor tom hanks, california governor gavin newsom, and president biden's son, hunter. depape left a trail of blog posts laden with far right messaging fueled by dark conspiracies. many of the posts were filled with screeds against jewish people, black people, democrats, the media, and transgender people. all popular topics among the radicalized right. it should come as no surprise to learn that depape's embrace of conspiracy theories was nurtured on sites like 4chan. while conserves tried to accuse him of being a left-wing fanatic, depape's d descent beg

with gamer gate, the abuse against female gamers and critics. a precursor to the rise of right wing or bias fueled troll attacks. the vicious attack on paul pelosi stands as a reminder of the very dangerous world we live in, where regular individuals become radicalized and feel compelled to act on it. just look at the failed republican candidate who orchestrated a string of drive-by shootings at the homes of democratic elected officials. all because he bought into the big lie that his election was stolen. instead of enforcing stricter standards, social media sites like twitter and facebook, which play host to this vitriol, are leaning into this discourse under the guise of free speech. just yesterday, donald trump, the man who triggered a violent assault on the nation's capitol, was welcomed back to facebook and instagram. now, mind you, his invitation was made only a few weeks after he reupped his false claims about ruby freeman, the black

georgia election worker who has been forced into hiding because of the death threats she received because of trump. nick clegg, president of meta, basically said it wasn't their job to censor things. >> in the end, all sorts of people say all sorts of things on the internet all the time, and politics is particularly full of the good, the bad, and the ugly. it's a rough business. we're not trying to kind of, you know, censor everything that everyone says in an open and free democracy. >> you see? radicalization and hate are big business. in fact, michael flynn, trump's first brief national security adviser, who was convicted of lying to the fbi about his contacts with senior level russian officials, has sought to cash in on those lies. he has joined some of the most prolific spreaders of conspiracy theories, barnstorming the country in the pseudomag tent

revivals that are host to some of the most vial and grotesque of those lies. the events, which are called the reawaken america tour, r.a.t., a christian revival meets qanon swap meets meets political rallies. the most recent event was held this past weekend in nashville, tennessee. >> jesus is king. how many of you agree americans elected president donald j. trump to be our president? how many of you agree general flynn is america's general, ladies and gentlemen? jesus is king and we will win this thing. >> i got board with calling out democrats so i started calling out demons, but they're really oneb and the same. >> billions of people are having their dna reprogrammed as we speak. it's because of this war we're in, a war of narratives, and it's a difficult war.

>> should we call the president, the real president? >> joining me now is amanda tyler, executive director of the baptist joint committee for religious liberty, and donel harvard at the rand corporation and former chief of homeland security and intelligence for washington, d.c. thank you both for being here. amanda, i want to start with you because, you know, when we see clips of things like this reawaken america tour, you hear a lot of merging of christian identity and christian nationalism and violent characterizations of the left. and ideas that sound a lot like they would like to overthrow the government and install a sort of violent christian theocracy on us. but can you talk about why there does seem to be this merger of this christian identity talk and this violent rhetoric? >> well, the organizers of the reawaken america tour, mike

flynn and clay clark, are definitely tapping into this very deep well of christian nationalism to sow doubt about the security of our election system and to cast doubt as well on the safety of covid-19 vaccines. they are infusing their political cause with religious fervor. and using language that is spiritual warfare language. casting their opponents as demonic or satanic, and we need to take this extremist rhetoric incredibly seriously because this rhetoric does lead to violence. i think that they are realizing the power of this language and using it for their political advantages. but be sure about this. this christian nationalism is definitely not christianity. it's a gross distortion of

christianity. it takes the gospel of love and replaces it with this false idol of political power. and the christian nationalism on this tour, it is not subtle. it has been there since the beginning. michael flynn, he talked at one of the very first tour events back in 2021 about what his true aim was. he said we should be one nation under god and one religion under god. so they have made clear that their aim is to replace our democracy with an authoritarian theocracy, and we have to pay attention to this very real threat. >> yeah, if you're listening to ultra, i think i say this all the time, you'll see the sis nothing new and there's been this fear based design of creating a christian theocracy here, and in their way, it's the only way to save america. i want to bring both of you into this conversation because michael flynn has been at this actually for a long time.

he's not new to this at all. a lot of people will recall he was a general, the head of the defense intelligence agency for quite a time when he was under the auspice of president obama. and he actually was sort of warned, i mean, donald trump was warned by president obama, be careful of this guy because he had been espousing conspiracy theories, michael, before. can you explain a little bit about why -- let me play a little bit of sound of him. this is actually michael flynn on newsmax, december 17th, 2020, calling for martial law in response to donald trump losing the election. take a listen. >> he could honor the -- within the swing states if he wanted to, he could take military capabilities and place them in those states and basically rerun an election in each of those states. it's not unprecedented. these people out there talking about martial law, like it's something that we have never done. we have done -- martial law has

been instituted 64 times. >> let me ask you about that, because there seems to me to be a greater danger when the person that is spreading the lies and is sort of leading the charge is somebody that the united states has actually trained in military intelligence, trained to defend the country, and this is somebody who has said that covid was created by the world health organization, the u.n., and bill gates to steal the 2020 election. he pleaded the fifth multiple times when he was asked if he believes in a peaceful transfer of power. he talked about saying that donald trump should do things like use the military to seize voting machines. this is somebody that was trained by the united states military, and now he's using everything that was poured into him to try to lead this supposed christian nationalist revolution. talk about why that is more dangerous than just a civilian at this. >> joy, there's a lot to unpack

here, but what's really interesting is that many think he's the leader of, you know, the conspiracy theory of qanon. what you're having is that these lies are promulgated online, and you know, generally, historically, we kind of laugh at some of these conspiracy theorists, we call them tin foil hat folks and they're in their mom's basement and so forth. but what you have seen over the last five to six years is that these movements have been legitimized by high ranking government officials. and he's really the cheerleader of this. the fact of the matter is, it's not just him. if you look at those who are being prosecuted from january 6th, military individuals, former and current. we just saw three prosecuted last week, are overrepresented as an occupation on that day. so there's something specific about government service, people like michael flynn who think

they're protecting america or the constitution that allows them to be manipulated by some of those online theories and it's very problematic. in fact, we have been talking about the similarities between some of these hate groups that we see in the united states and some of the foreign terrorist organizations and how they manipulate religion. the lead-in was really appropriate that you can take a regular individual who finds themselves pious or religious and twist doctrine and blend some of these hate ideologies and spit out a violent extremist on the other end. >> amamanda, can you talk about that specific thing. you think about groups like the oath keepers, these are former military people and people who are former police. you thing about the proud boys. they developed a close affinity with police before they started, you know, beating people up on the streets, you know, going after speaker pelosi in miami, ripping down black lives matter flags and showing up as donald

trump's personal army. there does seem like there is this through line of people who are military related, people who are hyperwhite christian, mainly, because you see a few people of color. why does that through line seem to be there? >> i think you're tapping into this idea of white christian nationalism, that christian nationalism often overlaps with and provides cover for white supremacy and racial subjugation, so we see a lot of hate groups using the ideology of christian nationalism to bring more people to their cause, to try to cloak their actions with this veneer of respectability using the name of jesus, using scripture to justify what they're doing. to code their racist language in religious language. and for christians like me and for those in our christians against christian nationalism

movement, this is incredibly alarming and disturbing to see our faith used in this way. and we see how christian nationalism is used by these groups to unite people from a lot of different groups and ideologies, to unite them with a common language. using this christian language, this christian imagery that infuses all of their actions, that suggests that god approves of their undertaking, even that god is directing their actions. and so it gives people this sense of god's providential hand at work in their life, that god is directing these hateful actions. so i don't think that christian nationalism alone can explain what's going on with these attacks to democracy and specifically this white supremacist violence. but i don't think we're going to fully understand and get the full picture if we don't really

grapple and understand christian nationalism. and we're seeing it on this tour, how christian nationalism is infused throughout all of the events with the name of jesus, with using scripture, with using worship music. often to do this work in houses of worship. it's really alarming. >> yeah, and i'm going to have to bring you both back. very quickly, last word. >> really quick, and when you add there's a big rise in the gun culture along with christianity, so owner guns is not only a second amendment right, it's a god-given right. these things are combining in a very volatile and dangerous way. >> the thing we didn't get to is the misogyny aspect to it. we need to go back and look back at gamer gate. an intense misogyny that also feeds into this anti-abortion hysteria and hysteria about women leaving the home and getting out there and doing things they think only men should do, like working et

cetera. there's a whole bunch do it. we'll have you both come back. thank you. >> up next on "the reidout," republican politicians are now confidently letting their racist freak flag fly. and very few of the party's leaders are willing to call them out. to call them out.

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now they don't care about being quiet at all. and perhaps for good reason. such comments do not appear to be rejected or rebuked or criticized by party leaders anymore. listen to this attack from charlie kirk against ilhan omar. >> she's not exactly making a compelling case that the mass infusion of somali immigrants are able to assimilate successfully into western tradition in life. >> what is he even talking about? she went from being a refugee to becoming a member of congress. as my colleague mehdi hasan points out, kirk makes clear what the real problem is with ilhan omar for republicans. she is a black african muslim somali refugee, which has made her a regular target of republican. yesterday, marjorie greene was taunting omar over the republicans' push to remove her committee assignments. this is the same marjorie greene

who claimed omar as well as congresswoman rashida tlaib, who is palestinian american, are illegitimate members of congress because they didn't take their oaths of office on a christian bible. and what should we expect? given who the leader of the party is. as a prime example, donald trump has been on a months-long bigoted attack of one of his own former cabinet members, elaine chao, repeatedly distorted her name in a racist way, and while the party leadership has once again been mostly mia, caio is now belatedly calling trump out. she wrote when i was young, some people deliberately misspelled or mispronounced my name. asian americans have worked hard to change that experience for the next generation. he doesn't seem to understand that, which says a lot more about him than it will ever say about asian americans. joining me is gemel smith and kurt bardella, democratic strategist and two california residents, i should note.

kurt has abandoned california for the dmv, but thank you both for being here. i want to go to you first, kurt, on this. look, women don't need their man to fight their battles. but i will note that elaine chao has had to come forward and say that on her own. and her very powerful husband, kentucky's senior senator and senate minority leader mitch mcconnell, did not defend her. and did not defend asian americans when the attack was initially made. what do you make of her response and the silence beyond her own self defense? >> i mean, obviously, i agree with every word she said. i wish it didn't take something like this, something that personal, to get any republican to speak out against a dangerous and incendiary rhetoric, the racist rhetoric targeting the asian american community for years now. we have seen this rising dramatic escalation in hate

crimes targeting asian americans that directly coincides with the rhetoric of the republican bartee, of donald trump, using the terms like kung flu and china virus. it shouldn't take a personal attack to get someone who was a cabinet secretary, one of the highest ranking asian americans in the united states of america, to say something. i want people in power in those positions to step forward and say something because it's the right thing to do. i want mitch mcconnell to step forward and say something, not because it's his wife, not because it's a relative, because it's the right thing to do. with the rising threats and violence, that's something i have seen personally. every time i'm on your show, i get the threats, i get the racist comments directed at me. that's just wrong, and we're seeing this ultimate end game is going to be people who look like me are going to be subject to violent attacks and harassment. people should step up and say something about their own party's leadership doing that, encouraging that, making fun of them. the people they kowtow to and try to go on their shows and win over their audience, they're

complicit in that, and every single person who is the victim of a hate crime, the target of these attacks, those people, the people who let that happen, they have blood on their hands. >> i'm now going to use a word illegal to say in florida. intersectionality. that is illegal in florida, but i can say it in the free state of california. the reason that intersectionality is important is to understand people have experiences that sort of cross over these multiple lines. and the intersectionality of supporting other people, alliship, is black folk have been here since 1619, here for the 1619 project premiere, and we have learned over that time the attacks on us metastasize. attacks on jewish people metastasize. and so we support each other, lgbtq folks who are intersectional. you can be black, asian american, white, but you learn it comes back at you eventually too. they get everybody eventually. they get everybody for some reason. that's the reason we try to

support one another on these attacks. it used to be republicans understood a different version of intersectionality, which is that we need to say something when somebody in our midst says something real racist because that means we can't go recruit other asian americans to join us. we can't get other black people to join us. only like 10% of african americans want to be republicans right now. why did they stop doing it? >> they stopped doing it frankly because they felt they didn't need the numbers. that draws us to the real problem at hand. the problem isn't necessarily the people in power. it's the people putting them in power, the people voting to put the marjorie taylor greenes in office and letting them do what they're going to do. the people who are in georgia, in tennessee, and all these other states putting people in office are saying that's okay, that's how we want to be represented. why do we want to be represented like that? you don't really care about them making laws for us or making our lives better. we want them to make us feel better about being white. ultimately, that's what it comes

down to. the consequence of that is, yes, we have seen these shootings we have seen this week in monterey park, in half moon bay. yes, they're committed by asian men, but there's a reason why a lot of folks thought they might have been committed by white supremacists, because white supremacy cannot survive without violence. >> is it that simple, kurt? the sort of maximize the white vote strategy, we're saying you don't have to chase black and asian american and latino voters other than cuban americans in miami-dade county who already pretty much vote republicans, you can just max white voters out and make a simplistic notion you can just go after white working class voters by saying, throwing out hatred against other groups and pit you against them and you stick with us because we're your team? >> yeah, it's like this kind of dual play. there's that element of it, but it's directly tied to the effort of the big lie, of voter suppression, of the systemic attack against democracy we have seen from the republican party

since 2020, all of that is designed to make sure that anyone who isn't white isn't table participate in the democratic process. when we talk about the assault on democracy and we talk about the effort to try to dictate who votes for who and who is allowed to participate, it is directly tied to racism. it is directly tied to republican party's deliberate effort to pander only to white voters. they know if the playing field is even, they can't win. we have seen that in election after election at this point. so they keep trying to change the rules so that only their side can participate and thereby that's the only way they think they can win. >> you know, right, because the problem with this strategy is that it's a limited time strategy. the demographics are what they are. if you're 5 years old, your already live in a world where white americans are the minority. over time it gets worse and worse, and when they can't win, they get madder. they get madder when they can't win. it's a vishing cycle. at a certain point, it doesn't work anymore. how do they back out of it?

>> i don't think they back out at this point. really what backs them out of it is they start to lose these elections they care so much about. the voters say this is enough for us. we're not going to vote for you anymore, or frankly, they get outnumbered. >> isn't this why they're so freaked out about wokeness? they care about white kids being woke. young white americans if they say i care about black lives matter, then they're not just losing among black and brown and asian american and most latino voters. they also start losing young white voters which actually happened in the last election. under 30s went with the dems. >> that's what's animating ron desantis' push in florida. you look at what he's doing. white students make up 2.2% more i guess, 2.2 times more than the black students in a.p. classes in florida. they're worried about white kids learning black history and possibly growing up to change things. >> they're worried they're going to start voting for things that

raise rich people's taxes. >> and joy, too, one quick thing. there's a reason why every single chairman that was appointed by the republican party in the house is white. every single one. >> uh-huh. they made that real clear because we thought byron donalds was going to be their speaker, but he didn't get a gavel. but thank you very much for being here. we appreciate you. thank you both very much. up next, five former memphis police officers are now in custody for murder, on murder charges in the brutal beating death of tyre nichols. we're back after this. ♪ ♪ this... is a glimpse into the no-too-distant future of lincoln. ♪ ♪ it's what sanctuary could look like... feel like... sound like... even smell like.

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three straight minutes. the video of the assault, which attorneys for the nichols family have likened to the 1991 rodney king beating, will be released tomorrow night. tragically, it isn't hard to imagine the patterns of police abuses, including ubchecked brutality, that turn human beings into hashtags. but imagine a situation where everyone involved is black. the victim, along with the cops involved, as well as the police chief, who called the incident heinous, reckless, and inhumane. it's also a case where the response occurred the way it's supposed to, namely efficiently. all five officers were fired last friday. less than two weeks after the assault on nichols. today, those officers were indicted by a grand jury on charges ranging from second degree murder, aggravated assault, aggravated kidnapping, official misconduct, and official oppression in the death of tyre nichols. the nichols family will hold a presser tomorrow, but here's one of their attorneys alongside tyre's mother earlier this week.

>> he was a human pinata for those police officers. it was an unadulterated, unabashed, nonstop beating of this young boy for three minutes. >> oh, my god. >> joining me now is paul butler, msnbc legal analyst and former federal prosecutor. paul, we are done this a lot. very many times. these are the charges that these officers face. second degree murder, official misconduct, aggravated kidnapping, aggravated assault. the officers, all of whom if they were out of uniform, could easily be pulled over and be in tyre's situation. what do you make of these officers and what they did to this young man? and the speed of these charges?

>> so the officers are not charged with hate crimes or civil rights violations, so racial animus isn't anything that the prosecutor has to prove. the memphis police department is actually majority black, but citizens still have the same complaints about that department as they do other departments. in 2015, memphis police officers took a man in custody and proceeded to beat him with paddles and chairs, and they were suspended without pay, but no criminal charges were brought. what's different today, joy, is that there's literally a new sheriff in town. memphis police chief davis was appointed, she came in with a reform agenda inspired by the murder of george floyd. so i think the movement for black lives and the activists that it created deserve much of the credit for why the chief and prosecutor acted so quickly in this case to try to bring these officers to justice. >> right.

there's a sense from what you're saying that police culture seems to supersede race in a lot of situations. when police are allowed for decade after decade to operate with impunity, you get almost sort of a gang mentality. you can do whatever you want to whoever you want. it doesn't matter, and the officers who do speak up, and i have talked to officers who have said this, that the one guy who decides to speak up is branded an outcast or a snitch. look what's happened, you know, to some of the officers who have spoken about january 6th and how they were treated. you know, by fellow officers. is that what this is, a culture problem that's bigger than necessarily just the race of the officers? >> it's 100% a culture problem. old school policing lore says if a guy tries to run when officers want to arrest him, he pays for it. bad apple cops follow that principle, but that's not what the majority of hard working law

abiding officers do or should do. in this case, mr. nichols was beaten just 100 yards from his mother's house. he may have been trying to run there, and obviously, he was right to be afraid of these officers. >> let me play tyre's mom. she wasn't able to get through watching the whole video. here is what she had to say. >> i watched about a minute of it, but i couldn't -- once i heard my son say, what did i do? i just lost it. and i couldn't -- i didn't need to see a video to see what they did. i saw him in person, where my son had lumps on his head and his neck was broke and he had his head was so swollen until it was starting to split open. that was enough for me to see as

his mother. >> president biden issued a statement saying public trust is a foundation of public safety and there are still too many places in america where the bonds of trust are broken. this is a painful reminder we have to do more to make sure our criminal system lives up to equal treatment and dignity for all. i'm going to put on the screen how quickly it took for officers to actually be fired. what can we learn from the way this case is being handled with these african american officers? and all of the victims in these cases are black? >> so once again, the videotape makes a huge difference. i hate to think of what would have happened if this horrific act hadn't been caught on video. but we know that many people, especially black and brown people, have complaints that police use excessive force, and typically those officers are not even disciplined, much less charged with crimes. so when we look to how we can do

better, there's some common sense police reform, including what was contained in the george floyd justice in policing act, that congress has failed to act on. i should be a little bit more specific than congress. it's the republicans in congress who have stood in the way of passing legislation that would make a difference and prevent more tragic cases like this one. >> and the money that they receive from the national police unions, et cetera, in many ways is one of the issues. we could have a whole conversation about that. this young man left a photograph of sunsets and skateboards. he had a 4-year-old. this is a human being who should sill be here. >> still ahead, president biden calls out republicans' twisted economic priorities as he works to attract blue collar workers. more next.

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(soft music) ♪ . now these maga republicans introduced another bill that's going to eliminate the irs, eliminate it completely. the only guys to look at the complicated tax forms people have and replace the irs, no taxes, right? exempt with a 30% national sales tax, and everything from if you buy a home to a car to eggs. who do you think pays for that? who do you think is going to get

ripped off? that's right. they want to raise taxes on working to middle class people. >> that was president biden in a speech where he announced a stronger than expected economy. going after republicans for their brazen attacks on the working class. in particular, he called out their latest harebrained idea of killing the irs and replacing that tax revenue with a 30% sales tax on everything. americans would get some of the tax money back through a rebate, but it would get rit of the personal income tax, taking away benefits low income people receive from the current tax code, like the earned income and child tax credits and severely reduce the amount the rich pay on their wages as well as on their investments, allowing all of their savings to go tax-free. 2006 study found the lower and middle classes would end up paying more under such a scheme, while the richest would pay less. it's pretty much par for the course. you know, despite the whole media narrative going back to

the 2016 election that trump won because of economic anxiety. republicans haven't helped the working class like they have helped their wealthy donors. insert trump's tax cuts that ended up benefitting the rich the most. in fact, it took biden's presidency to pass legislation that will actually directly help those blue collar americans. his infrastructure bill, chips and sciences bill, and the inflation reduction act. today he emphasized the thousands of jobs that will be created through his infrastructure act. and stressed that many of these jobs will go to americans without college degrees. contrast that with what republicans are trying, not just with the sales tax idea, but with their attacks ever since these programs are created it's been a fever dream of the rich to get rid of them. and now they're calling for major cuts. this has the so-called populist republican stay at the extremely related will 1200

dollar enough waldorf astoria who tallinn california to elect their next rnc chair. parallel the extremism is leading to dangerous brinkmanship. something biden also called out today. we'll talk to his top economic adviser, next. adviser, next. of up to $26,000 per employee. all it takes is eight minutes to get started. then work with professionals to assist your business with its forms and submit the application. go to getrefunds.com to learn more.

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pay our debts. the very notion that we would default on the safest most respected debt in the world is mind-boggling. >> joining me now from the white house is brian deese, director of economic council. mr. deese, thanks for coming. on i do want to ask you about this, we have this debt ceiling fight coming on. with the current speaker, kevin mccarthy, having promised the most extreme parts of his party, that he bargain on the debt ceiling to get cuts. and they seem to be eyeing cuts in social security, medicare, they want deep cuts to various necessary programs for the most indigent americans. how hard is the white house prepared to go, to stand firm to saying no to those cuts? >> first, we need to put this in context. we learned today, we've seen a lot of data that supports. that's that our economy is coming back and a strong, resilient, an equitable way. whereas the president said, actually seeing what it looks like when we have a recovery that grows from the bottom up

in -- meaning, away just are going faster for people at the bottom of it. income distribution, economic growth is solid, job growth is adams story. kylie unemployment rate is at historic lows. one of the most important things when you're making progress, is to not violate the hippocratic oath. don't set us backward. and this is one of the problems with this entire conversation. which is, the idea that the united states would sacrifice the full faith, credit of the united states should not ever be negotiable. even the prospect that we would do that, could weaken our economy. it could weaken internationally the views of how stable the united states. is it something our adversaries would cheer. so, what we've made very clear is that basic notion, that the united states honors the past obligations that the united states has already made, is nonnegotiable principle. but we're happy to have a conversation about what the right economic policies are for the country. you listed a number things the republicans have said they're for. let's have a conversation about

this. the president has things he wants to move forward, that's a conversation we absolutely -- >> are you saying that the white house is willing to have a conversational cutting social purity medicare? >> now, we're saying that we want to set forward our priority, the president's been clear about what is priorities are, and what his plan is, he's put out buckets in the past, we'll put a budget out shortly, and it'll show his plan to invest in the united states, protect medicare inside security, strengthen it and not -- and reduce the deficit by making sure that the wealthy, large corporations pay somewhat higher taxes. that's his plan, italy every -- all the numbers, people can debate those items but that's what the president's for. we need the house republicans to do, is put out their plan, put forward specifically what they would cut, where they would cut, and then we could have a conversation about. that the presidents unclear, if the conversation about cutting medicare and social security, he's not for. that but if the conversation is about how we can keep making progress for example, reducing

prescription drug price prices for seniors, and people across the country. that's a conversation that were more than happy to have. >> you all are realistic. we're not talking about, the olden days republicans. we're talking about kevin mccarthy screw witches margaret taylor greene and other people. or governing by conspiracy theory. and they've already said, institute a 30% sales tax on everything. anything you buy, carton of eggs, gallon of milk, 30% -- which would destroy poor people and also elderly people who are on fixed incomes and social security. if that's where they start, how do you even have a serious conversation with anyone in the house of representatives? >> this is why it's so important that we get to specifics. and house republicans really put down with therefore, because some of these ideas are so far outside the mainstream. and there's so extreme. a 30% sales tax on everything that people buy, 30% increase in the price of a car, 30% increase on the price of hamburger, milk at the grocery

store. so far extreme, but i think what we'll see is that both democrats and moderate republicans will reject these ideas. we need to see what a majority of the republican party in the house is actually prepared to stand up and say there for. we know the first bill they passed would increase the deficit by 114 billion dollars. by lowering taxes for the very wealthiest americans. they passed that bill with a majority in the house. that's clearly a statement of priorities, we now need to -- increase the deficit. we may not now see where they're prepared to cut. the initial indications, suggests that really extreme -- >> we're gonna have to have you back. i have a whole lot of questions about social security and the cap, income gap, things like. that -- brian deese -- brian deese -- >> tonight on