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tv   The Rachel Maddow Show  MSNBC  February 6, 2023 9:00pm-10:00pm PST

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thanks for joining us this hour welcome to fun dining.
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continuing tonight to watch the development in turkey, and in syria. >> the death toll there is just astonishingly high. from an absolutely huge earthquake, and in almost equally large aftershock. that hit today. the initial quake was centered in south central turkey. that an issue jolted between four and 4:30 in the morning, so before, home and their beds. that initial quake was a 7.8 magnitude. which is just enormous. and was follow, hours later. by an aftershock that was 7.5. and having such a huge quite like that followed by such a quick succession by almost an equally large quake means anything that was significantly damaged, but still standing after the foreshock. it came down in the aftershock.
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in turkey alone, they're saying there are more than 5000 buildings that have collapsed across 14 different turkish cities. across the southern border of turkey, into northern syria, there are, again, thousands of buildings collapse there. as well, between turkey and syria, we are talking about a death toll already that is about 4000 people killed. with many many many more thousands of people injured. tonight, of course, is the twin horror of trying to rescue people trapped in the rubble and a collapsed buildings will also fully expecting that more damage buildings will continue to collapse our rescue efforts are underway. but the survivors and the rescuers, are engraved peril. now, and it is cold tonight. in this part of turkey, and syria. the national security council announced tonight that the united states is immediately deploying to experienced urban search and ask you teams. each of those is a team of 79
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people. some of the they're shipping out immediately, can be soon enough. maybe old no term ember that there was a devastating, devastating earthquake in turkey from 1999. this is one of the biggest natural disasters of my lifetime. that 1999 quake there killed the 2015 and 20,000 people. it was seen as a global level catastrophe. i have to tell you, in magnitude, that earthquake in 1999 was smaller than the one that hit today. but part of the problem with responding to this one today, is that it was such a big quake. it is flattening buildings, it is such a large area. ten different provinces are in emergency response, and then it's there it's almost an inch quickly large affected area. but in syria the response is complicated by the ongoing civil war there. and the refugee crisis that has created. the international rescue committee is calling the situation in syria in,
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particular, and emergency within an emergency. again, the death toll already is almost unbelievably high. it is nearing 4000 as of right now. but there is reason to worry that the numbers going to rise substantially. it is potentially going to be rising by a multitude. this is a big disaster that is going to change this part of the world. and countries all over the world. from us to iran, from switzerland, to hungary. so everyone all over the world. the house rescue teams descend that they are sending the rescue teams right now. as i said, there watching this story about tonight. we'll let you know more as we learn more. >> that's why when we join live night by kathleen -- shoes when the nation's leading researchers on far-right extremism and white power movements. we had her hair is a guest on the show the pass. the duchess can be had because the partner justice held a dramatic surprise press conference about a plot they believe they disrupted by a
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neo-nazi group leader, and one of the persons to launch an attack on the electrical power grid and maryland. and just the last three months he received the last nine different tax targeting electrical power substations to deliver and cause power outages and damage a little infrastructure. so power can't be returned easily. one of the unsettling emerging themes in these attacks the frequent involvement of wall white supremacist, and neo-nazi groups. this is emerging -- current terrorist tactic of choice. .
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bombshell revelation. he explains, or the end of the book. that it wasn't just that he wanted against former --
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allegedly submitting fake evaluation of its properties and assets to get banks loaning money. december 13th, 2021. 2021. as mark henry explains in this book that is because, two and a half, three weeks after that green light from -- the new york da. a new new york da was sworn in. but tsai vance left office without running for reelection, the newly elected da, alvin bragg who is there. it's one in a new year's day 2022. and of course, for something as big a deal as the first time a president or former president has ever been charged with a crime the whole history of this
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country. i knew da but -- something that dramatic and that historic was happening under his watch. as mike department as a story in this new book. alvin bragg, the new da, was not okay with that happening on his watch. at least not nine. the new da, a new one, says he just didn't think the case was ready to go ahead. but -- says he disagreed with that assessment. he pled his proverbial case. he got very frustrated. i think it's fair to say, and he left the da's office. again, to much fanfare. but now as we sit here tonight, do things that happened. number one, the new york da, alvin bragg has gone ahead with what appears to be a criminal grand jury prosecution about donald trump. the grand jury's hearing witnesses and the presentation of evidence, presumably towards a potential indictment of trump. this started last week.
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and, the second thing, mark pomerantz, just tonight is publishing this book. but his experience investigating trump. his understanding of the evidence against trump. and his account of the wrangling, among prosecutors and investigators. about what they should do about trump's alleged criminal behavior. and i'm not exaggerating to say that this book is making everybody lose their minds. it is making everybody very angry. people really are losing their minds over this book. it is full of red hot allegations and information, i mean, mr. pomerantz is criticizing the da for a decision not to go ahead, a year ago, with potential trump charges against trump. but the da does seem to be pursuing something against those lines. we're talking about the da appears to be pursuing with a grand jury right now. versus what mr. pomrenze want to charge trump with a couple years ago. but people are also mad that
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here is mike pomerantz. who's involved in this investigation. now talking, and writing about what the investigation worked, what they thought, what they, found out they were talking about behind the scenes. that very unusual circumstance, from somebody who's working your prosecutors office. there is, right now, sort of a serious counter argument against mr. pomerantz and his case and what charges he wants to bring. there's an argument against him on the substance. there's also justice free floating lawyer fury out there over sufficient publish anything about the case. but then i can tell you, that is gladiatorial combat among lawyers that i'm very interested in watching. but i'm not at all interesting in joining. that i am not one of those gladiators. i'm not, in fact, a lawyer. top white -- buffer better for worth we do not get the benefit of what mike pomerantz has can describe
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to us. as the strength of the evidence against trump. it's potential weaknesses. the potential charges against trump. and the wherewithal of the prosecutors, in new york at, least appear to trump in their sights. from mr. pomerantz's book, for example, we learned that there were at least nine, he lists nine, different methods of criminal inquiry to trump by the da's office when mr. pomerantz came on board in late 2020. nine key. he tells us that serious consideration was given in 2021 to charging trump with money laundering, in conjunction with this hush money payments to a porn star in 2016. he tells us that serious consideration was given, in 2020, one to charge trump with enterprise corruption. meaning they consider a state rico indictment against him. as if you were a mob boss. and, mr. pomerantz tells us that in conjunction with the da, telling prosecutors in his office that they can go ahead
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with their plans to charge trump. mark pomerantz says they did in fact draw a draft charging languages. draft charging language. for potential charges against -- >> so that is all new. we don't know any of that. and again there is some wild free-flowing lawyer rage. rage and lawyer circles. about mike pomerantz having let us know that information at all. but of course, it just makes me want to know more. joining us now for his first live interview and it matches both publications night had been night is mark pomerantz. better in new york lawyer, former federal prosecutor, former special assistant attorney in the new york days office. working specifically on the investigation of former president, donald j trump. mr. pomerantz, thank you for being here. >> thank you for inviting me. i appreciate it. i appreciate the opportunity to talk to you. >> i don't think i am creating more free-flowing rage about you by letting the audience
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know there is a lot of it. but i have to ask, if anything that just today take issue with other citing that describe wrongly. >> no, though they may take issue with is that my found would take issue this crime is such a big deal. it just doesn't feel that way to me. i'm writing a book as a 70, almost 72-year-old top not quite retired lawyer. but i thank you for having it. >> you are a man who knows which speak. it has been, they're done, that in terms of the law. both as a federal prosecutor, and someone in private practice. it's been involving a lot of complex cases. let me ask you about something absolutely introduction which is that since the book was completed. i know from sort of a close reading to the use of tense and the way they describing it. says the book was completed, you have seen these moves by the new york da. to make a presentment of evidence of some kind to a grand jury in new york.
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that would seem to be leading towards potentially asking that question to indict mr. trump. what we know in public reporting about what's grandeur right now. people are describing the grand jury has heard witnessing testimony. and reviewing other -- about lash money payments. how does that differ to what you thought that the da should learn? well, when we were looking at charging donald trump, we were looking at a whole range of falsified business records. the bulk of the case had to do with his personal financial statements, which we believed overstated the value of his assets, and his net worth, by billions of dollars a year for many years running, and enabled him to get bank financing, another business advantages. at the same time, we had looked at the hush money payments, and by the end of 2021, the charges that we had in mind to bring,
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we would've included the hush money payment. and it's falsified business records relating to the reimbursement that is paid to michael cohen, for the hush money that was paid. >> so cohen paid out the hush money, he was paid back by the trump organization, and i came up with all sorts of false ways to describe what that payment -- describe an account for that payment in their books. >> that's right, the repayment cohen was disguised as the payment for legal services rendered on a monthly basis, pursuant to a retainer agreement. except there was no retainer agreement, there were no legal services rendered, and he's just been repaid for the money that had been paid on donald trump's behalf, to stormy daniels, and some other money as well. so, in order to disguise the manner, the mechanism for the repayment. false business records were created, and that was the crime what we are looking at. >> in technical terms, you
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described, it there's a problem with that. because unless those false business records were created to conceal another crime, that would just be a misdemeanor, it's sort of wouldn't be worth bringing against trump, in order for it to be a felony, and had to be some effort to conceal some other crime, is that right? >> certainly, you need that can intend to conceal another crime, to raise the offensive a falsified business record, to a felony from a misdemeanor. a misdemeanor would be worth rain against donald trump, reasonable people can take issue with that. when we first looked at the falsified business records, and saw the legal problems, and there was a legal problem because it's not clear -- whether federal crimes count.
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he pled guilty to a federal elections -- it's not clear from the language of the statute. then another crime, that raises misdemeanor to a felony, can be a federal offense. it may be that that works, it may not be that that works, it's an undecided issue under new york law. so when we first looked at, it we saw edgy, there's a real risk here, a legal risk that if we bring felony charges, they'll be reduced to misdemeanors. and, we are investigating a whole slew, as you mentioned, of other felony charges. so, the first time in my tenure, when this came up, we took the decision, let's table the hush money situation. we refer to it in the office, internally, as the zombie case. because it rose from the dead, it went back into slumber, and arose from the dead. it happened a number of times. so we decided to keep this is on the case, in the grave, for the moment, until we got
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further down the road of investigation. that's where the end of investigation, as they, said we intended to join those charges with the more consequential charges that we hope to bring, regarding the years of false financials. >> i heard that there were at least nine different criminal areas inquiry, about potential criminality, the da's office was looking into, at the time that you joined. he said one of them was the hush money payment to stormy daniels, another newest taxes, improper business -- in his relationship with deutsche bank, could you have defrauded on by getting financing. he overstated financial statements. whether he had engaged in money laundering through deutsche bank, using overseas bank accounts. the accuracy of the materials you put supplied to the gsa about the old post office. and a host of other things, including insurance fraud, the
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restructuring of his loan on a chicago skyscraper, you go on and on. when you describe that litany of areas of potential criminal inquiry for trump, and when you describe your reasoning, and the debates between you and your team, about the hush money thing. are you giving a potential lifeline to donald trump's defense lawyers, that if they do end up getting charged with anything related to any of those items, including the hush money man, or that your book could be used as evidence, essentially to try to question the charges in court, and say look, prosecutors have been looking at the stop for a long time, responsible prosecutors decided there was nothing there, but in charge of it. this is selective prosecution, this is an overreach, have you given the defense a leg up here? >> i don't think we've given the defense any kind of like up. when you look at the public reporting about the reporting for a grand cherry presentation, there may be underway. i don't know what maybe going
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on behind closed doors in the da's office. and i don't know what evidence is being presented, i don't know whether charges will be brought. but as it relates to the hush money circumstances, those facts have been known, literally four years, michael cohen wrote about them in his book. he testified about them, stormy daniels wrote a book, stormy daniels appeared on michael cohen's podcast to talk about it. and the federal prosecutors brought their own prosecution based on those facts. i'm not letting the cat's out of the, bag if you would, those cats have been running all over the place, really literally four years. >> but the reasoning about whether not to bring charges, based on those facts? is that helpful to any defense counsel? >> i don't think, so the legal issue that i've noted in the book, is an issue that appears on the face of the statute, it's already been written about, it was written about before my book has come out. on the financial statements
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side, we don't know, i certainly don't know what investigation is taking place. if, any or no if charges are ultimately brought. what i do know, is that the evidence underlying the charges, we intended to bring, is all out there in the public record. in a civil case but the attorney general of new york, laetitia james brought. she filed a civil complaint of all over 200 pages, which lays out an abundant detail, the assets that are most valued, the basis for the over valuation of the assets, that's how she concluded why she concluded that the assets were overvalued, and the evidence that we were looking at in connection with a potential criminal case, has been laid out in chapter and verse, in that complaint. again, there is nothing in my book about the financial
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statement investigation, colonel investigation that we were doing. there are no new facts that can appear in the attorney general's complaint. i was pretty well satisfied when i wrote the book, that i wasn't going to interfere with any potential prosecution. look, i wrote the book, in part, to say there should have been a criminal prosecution. there needs to be a criminal prosecution. the last thing i would've done is to do something that would've get in the way of a criminal prosecution. that i think should still be brought. >> and there might yet be one, i've much more to ask you, please stay right there, i guess as mark pomerantsev and show last year a lot blood in both the gauge and former president donald trump, the new york da's office, his new book about his time there is it called the people versus donald trump. it's not tonight at midnight, we'll be back, stay with us. l be back, stay with us.
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pomerantz's new book, people versus donald trump, it comes out tonight on midnight. we were looking at instance after instance of suspected illegal conduct. of course, they had to be approval, but if they were approved, their collective weight left no doubt in my mind that trump deserve to be prosecuted. measures short of criminal prosecution of a used against trump, and he had dismissed them as trivial. look at the totality of trump's conduct over the years, i thought it was crystal clear the measure short of criminal prosecution meant nothing to him, i would not determine the slightest from engaging in another antisocial behavior. indeed, the more successful, became the more brazen is a bit heavier, he's stiff many small contractors and business owners and decided to advance services or products for the trump
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organization. because after all, trump is so wealthy, michael cohen said that a big part of his job is tied small creditors who did business with trump that they were going to get paid, and forcing them to accept whatever modest sums trump would give them. the enterprise corruption statute, targeted just this kind of behavior. using a pattern of criminal behavior to increase and entities criminal power, enabling it to inflict greater social harm. you describe that consideration, of using state eco charges against donald trump. you, say the task of building out the proof, the whole enterprise of corruption was simply too ambitious for the human investigative bandwidth we had. and, otherwise you think at the substance of the trade, there but it's simply too hard to do. >> one of the things he needs to be remembered, --
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house on the department of justice, they have a staff of dozens of lawyers and investigators, working on a single mission. we had a small staff of, lawyers many of whom with other responsibilities. we had to work within the jurisdictional and procedural limitations, imposed by new york law. which are substantial. as a for instance, if we want to speak as we did to witness who lives in ohio in a federal case. fbi agents go service subpoena. if we want to speak to a witness who lives in ohio, we have to go through an elaborate legal procedure to see that person can be compelled to speak to us so for a whole variety of reasons having to do with the substantive law of new york, the procedural of new york, the race resources that we had, it became clear
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overtime that an enterprise corruption case with simply biting off more than we can do. there came of maine where both carry done and i, spoke with tsai vance, the district attorney about enlarging the team, and adding resources to, it and giving us more bandwidth. but again, we are coming up on the end of cy vance's term, we want to hire some senior people with extensive prosecutorial experience. we didn't think it was fair to the incoming industry to, carry did start hiring senior people at the very and assignments turn. and in any event we ultimately decided that largely for practical reasons an enterprise corruption case with simply loosely whether we could accomplish two and a reasonable time. bearing in mind we are trying to work quickly. and bringing a racketeering
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case, particularly one that incorporates other stuff, trump foundation, trump university, and a hush money, if i felt it was. it's such a big ball of wax, then ultimately we decided, let's focus on a smaller more contained set of charges. and that's when we started to focus on the financial statements. >> in doing some additional reporting, preparing to talk to you tonight. we are able to learn from sources, that the team working right now at the new york da's office, it's about 20, about 20 lawyers investigators that the da's office. we don't know what they're bringing before the grand jury, and we don't know if any charges will arise, or what they will be. but i'm also struck by your complimentary words but the new york attorney generals office, and the investigation that was led by tish james their. and a quarter billion dollar civil suit, on the basis of trump's financial statements,
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that you described earlier. now, one thing that happened when tish james reveal the factual basis for that civil suit, is she referred to sdny. she referred back to federal prosecutors that sdny. suggesting this federal prosecution to be done that, given that fact pattern. we've seen, through public reporting a public relative revelations, how much pressure main justice push on fdny to let trump out the hook. the color on the hush, money while he was president. that is no longer president. >> do you believe sdny will ever do anything at this? >> i haven't seen reporting to indicate that there's an active investigation. as i've mentioned in the book. this is a case they cried out federal investigation. for all the reasons i talked about there, and have alluded to here. i don't know, why, there is never an intensive federal investigation of trump's finances. when the new york times to
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debate exposé in october of 2020, of trump's tax returns. i recall reading that and thinking to myself, well, this is gonna start the feds on a substantial investigation maybe did and we never found out about it. but as i say, there's nothing to indicate that investigation happened. one of the enduring mysteries is why it didn't happen with respect to the a.g., i was a little surprised, but gratified by the extended cooperation that we got. the lawyers there have been a lot of work on the financial statements, and it's reflected in the complaint they filed. they were often ahead of us in terms of their fact finding, and they were willing to share with the could legally, or turf battles, it actually was
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virtually unique in my experience to see on one line for 20 agency collaborating well with another, as happened between the a.g.'s office, and what they deserve a lot of credit for that. >> that's of, okay stu to be in trial by october this year. as to whether not that will be a criminal trial along that fat fact pattern, aligned in that trial or any other, it remains to be seen. we know more about this investigation we've ever known, before thanks to this very, very controversial book. mock mark pomerantz, he's the author of people versus donald trump, and instead, accounts sir, good luck and thank you. much more to get here tonight, stay with us. t, stay with us humpty dumpty does it with a great fall. wonderful pistachios. get crackin'
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old neo-did not see in tampa florida, shot and killed two of his three roommates. when the police searched the apartment after that double homicide they ended up also arresting, in addition to the shooter, they ended up arresting a third roommate, who wasn't shot. it turns out that third roommate had been stockpiling a huge amount of homemade explosives in their shared garage. in a separate incident, a little more than a year earlier, march 2016. a 28-year-old woman was arrested, for robbing for defense convenience stores and maryland, while armed with a machete. now get, this all comes together, turns out the machete
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wielding, and the explosive order, then began a relationship, while they are each serving time in separate prisons. now today, those two individuals were arrested again, criminal prosecutors alleged with the two plotted to attack, five electrical power substations around baltimore, maryland, their planters allegedly tanaka during a five electrical substations, on one day, if they thought that would cause a cascading effect, to quote, completely destroy the whole city, and knock baltimore into a pre-electric might stated, being and not when that would be easily repaired. and that whole idea to shoot up electrical substations, to knock out the power semi permanently and cause major chaos. if that fine is given a déjà vu, you're not mistaken, there's been at least nine attack some electric power substations. at least nine attacks, across three different states, just in
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the past three months. early last year, homeland if security issue double, warning that domestic and violent extremists, have credible specific plans to attack electricity infrastructure, since elise 2020. in most of these attacks, the suspects haven't been identified, and that means motives camp intensified either, but last month and pr affiliates and we're gonna watch, didn't obtained an fbi memo showing that neo-nazi groups were attacking calling for attacks just like this. neo-nazis that the fbi were tracking believe that idea attacks on electrical infrastructure will contribute to their goal for a race war in the united states and societal collapse. that's part what makes these arrests significant because the former explosives hoarder arrested today, he's the founder of a neo-nazi group, called the --
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and the former machete wielding robber, who's also rested today, she wrote with the fbi, what is believed to be an ideological manifesto of course, knocking out power, and also her admiration for the unabomber, and for hitler twice now as kathleen below shortages history northwestern university, he's the author of bring the war home, the white power movement of paramilitary america. which is really a seminal techs in this field. i really appreciate you being here, thanks for being here. >> as for having me. >> i said at the top of the show tonight that this appears to be merging as a favorite tactic of the white power movement. -- in the united states. is that a fair generalization. >> yes, although the electrical part maybe, new infrastructure attacks by this movement are not new. this is a strategy pioneer by
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the order, in 1980, three and move forward. and that group is sort of the base of -- the tactical base for the division, which translates to the base. infrastructure attacks or one kind of violence, amid several others, they're all laid out in a strategy, in common, in order to bring about with the movement seeks, which is to overthrow the united states, the creation of a white ethnostate, mass violence against communities of color, and even genocide of non whites. infrastructure attacks sit next to show of force violence, like the january 6th attack on the capitol, and mass casualty violence like the oklahoma city bombing. all these exist together, within one broad ideology, of the white power movement. >> i've heard this described as accelerationist tactics, i know that's an awkward word.
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i wonder if you could sort of explain the thinking there. -- is a beautiful leap of logic, where makes it not translate to sort of non expert news consumers here. the idea is that you attack infrastructure, you cause people material pain, you cause chaos and upset, and then somehow there's a slippery slope that results in a race, for and why people taken over, and genocide against non-white people. why do they believe that infrastructure attacks and result in chaos, ultimately celebrate us to some sort of race war future where they think they're gonna win. >> infrastructure, attacks and mass casualty violence, and show up our tax, are all meant to do the same thing in the ideology of this movement which is laid down and looks like the turner diaries and movement, ideological writings of other kinds. they are all supposed to awaken other people to let these activists see, as the
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staggering state of emergency problems that face white people. the woman arrested today not piece of writing, apparently said to an informant that you do anything for my people. this is the idea of white people as her race, and as our nation, it reflects the sense that my people are being extinguished, and will be apocalyptic about vanished of action is not taken. so infrastructure attacks, like you know the power explain baltimore, taking no heat, taking out the ability of hospitals to perform their operations, right? if you don't have hospital extra city, can't run the basics of any of our systems. these are meant to make other way people awakened to these injustices as perceived by these activists so that everyone will rise up a little bit of big time, against the, broader what they would call, the system, which is the united states government. >> absolute insanity, and
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holding force on a significant sliver on the white power movement, as you're describing, for at least the last 40 years. kevin, videos social professor of history at northwestern, author of the seminal text bring the war home, the white power movement in paramilitary america. as much free time tonight. >> thanks for having me. >> we'll be right back, stay with us. with us. tasting option s with less sugar or no sugar at all. in fact, today, nearly 60% of beverages sold contain zero sugar. different sizes? check. clear calorie labels? just check. with so many options, it's easier than ever to find the balance that's right for you. more choices. less sugar. balanceus.org my a1c stayed here, it needed to be here. less sugar. ray's a1c is down with rybelsus®. i'm down with rybelsus®. my a1c is down with rybelsus®.
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story we have a couple of weeks ago, about an actual member of
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congress who is definitely also a international man of mystery. his name is republican congressman george santos, and his every utterance about his resume in record is now being scrutinized, because almost everything is ever said about himself is turning out to be a big for, which is rhyming slang for the man, he lies. you might remember last month, a couple weeks ago, we got this video of an interview he did with a bruising falling gas. which caused radio left present a, in this broadcast interview, a congressman said he'd been in fruit in the earliest and bring to a, and he said the mug or runoff, among other things, with issues. leaving him standing there in the middle of fifth avenue with out of his socks. cnn nypd goes say a quarter of the cesium. because he'd been the victim of an attempted murder. and you, know who might have
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say? maybe. but think about, it if you are mugs in the middle of fifth avenue, if someone tried to kill you, hear from the ecological of police, right. i mean, you must of called the police if the result was that a police officer got staged outside your home, that doesn't just happen. after we found that image feel, and those statements by congressman santos, we check to see if he'd ever filed a police report, about his alleged traumatic fifth avenue mugging, or about being the victim of an attempted murder. now i can tell, you here's what we have found out. this information was obtained by our colleagues at wabc, it's been reported here exclusively. according to law enforcement services, there is no known what record, all of the new york city police department, in the past few years, showing that interest candace -- the same goes for anthony devolder, which is another name he's used in the past, no police report on file for
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either those. including a robbery of shoes or anything else in new york city. nor is there any record of george santos allowed him nypd 20 attempted murder against him. according to those same lot force and sources, there is just one police before dimension, which mentions for santos, it concerns the incident trying to win, where santos's neighbor allegedly through some garbage and him. and while no one likes time garbage thrown at him, and this, case i have to say that santos reported his neighbor missed. so one failed attempt by his neighbor to control throwing guard him. it is a police report about that. nothing about an attempted murder. nothing about to hit a mugging, specific shoes to shoes and pans up into the end of last month. they tell us, to the best of our knowledge -- but not right at him. george santos, apart from that, had not filed a single police
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report or complain to the nypd in any of his last three years. and we reached out to congress when santa's office, to ask him about this. his office told us, this isn't a congressional issue, and we should therefore ask his lawyer. we, did his lawyer told us, no comment. and look. maybe he decided to deal with again in had none his own. maybe he saw police escort with his mind. but we checked it out doesn't seem to have gone down the way you might expect, it will be right back. right back that's why i'm asking you to join the freedom from religion foundation, the nation's largest and most effective association of atheists and agnostics working to keep state and church separate, just like our founders intended. please join the freedom from religion foundation today.
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