right now on "andrea mitchell reports," president biden heading to ron desantis and donald trump home turf this hour, another battleground speech, this time to drive home his attacks against some republicans. it could be including florida senator rick scott who has proposed making social security and medicare up for renewal, instead of lifetime benefits. also this hour, the first classified documents on the spy

balloon after it reveals it was capable of collecting evidence. the president's critics say it should have been shot down sooner. >> they had a chance to shoot it down over water and they did and recovered major pieces of it. >> have relations now between u.s. and china taken a big hit? >> no. no. >> owl speak to former defense secretary leon panetta whose criticism of the spy balloon and its response has caught the president's attention. and as the death toll rises to 19,000 people, and hope fades to find any more survivors, we'll talk to david milla land, the president of the international committee helping thousands displaced across turkey and syria. ♪♪ good day, everyone. i'm andrea mitchell in washington. as the 2024 campaign is right around the corner it seems with

president biden arriving in battleground florida at this hour to tout his support for social security and medicare. republican governors and senators have put the stake firmly in the gop column for more than a decade. but the president's trip today is sending a message, he wants to put the sunshine state in play. joining me now mike memoli in tampa. pbs anchor, and former congressman david jolie. and politico white house editor sam stein. so mike memoli, what is the president hoping to accomplish? i think it's pretty clear, florida, social security, medicare, the lightning rod of politics. who is going to be on the tarmac when he lands in a few minutes will ron desantis be there and rick scott -- well, not rick scott, he's in session. >> reporter: this is all about florida men. we see rick scott explicitly

part of the conversation. every seat has one of the pamphlets waiting for them when the president arrives, that's rick scott making it clear what the president has proposed sunsetting all federal legislation including social security and medicare every five years. part of the goal for the white house, andrea, to broaden it out and talk about ways in which other republicans have not only talked about targeting retirement programs like social security and medicare but wanting to attack and undermine health care security in general. whether it's repealing the inflation reduction act which has all sorts of new caps and insurance benefits for americans, especially seniors, or repealing the affordable care act. so that's going to be part of the president's explicit message today. but it's also, of course, interesting to note this is just the fourth time president biden is coming to florida since taking office. two of those occasions have been about disaster relief when he's appeared with governor ron desantis, it's going to be, obviously, a big part of the conversation moving forward, just how much democrats want to

contest florida. but it's also interesting to see whether president biden, who has been very clear in calling out the former president, donald trump, another florida man, whether ron desantis is increasing in the sights of the white house. you look at this new monmouth university poll out today, it shows among republicans nationwide, donald trump and ron desantis are neck and neck on top of the field. 34% each. third place, nobody, undecided that big wildcard as we're now almost a year away from those first primaries and contests. andrea, as i've been talking to white house officials about where ron desantis fits into the 2024 calculus, they really say it's a wish fulfillment enter size as ron claimed the other day, among republicans who really believe it's going to be anybody but donald trump. donald trump favors the odds-on favorite for the party. but they're not taking their sights off the census either. it has embedded operative in tallahassee, keeping eyes on desantis, especial with the

session coming up here for the legislature. and the big question, of course, is about how much biden will compete here in november of 2024. he visited here multiple times before election day. he lost this state by just over three percentage points. a lot of democrats think it's slipping away, but they think with issues like retirement security, they can really put it back in play. >> show us that for sure again, that was rick scott, he was in charge of the republican senate campaign. and that what was the president was waving in wisconsin, and talking against ron johnson, calling him out by name. >> reporter: that's right. >> this is what happened at the state of the union, when they feel, at least the democrats feel, the white house feels, that he drew the republicans in and got them into a position where they were forced through kevin mccarthy to stand up and support medicare and social security. mike, and i want to bring david jolly in here. because there's a lot of pushback from republican

lawmakers who say it was a one-off and it was rick scott. but it wasn't just rick scott, it was mike lee, others, ron johnson, and variations and they're on tape having done that in the last cycle. having talked about getting rid of social security and medicare because they want to protect defense. and those are the only places to get big dollars. the other discretionary programs don't nearly add up to the kind of money, you know that you can get out of defense and social security or medicare, right, david? >> yeah, that's right, andrea. social security, medicare, medicaid, interest on the debt, those four or five programs add in a few others represent two-thirds of the budget. so when republicans talk about aggressively moving on the budget you really have to touch the entitlement programs. what you saw with rick scott saying, look, we need to revisit this. i would say, andrea, you've probably seen more state of the

unions than anybody here today. i've had my fair share. and you often see presidents get away with a little bit of hyperbole. but that's not the case here, joe biden was very careful on tuesday night. he even said some of you but not all. and that some of you is factually correct. rick scott as chair of the senate republican committee issued a document saying all federal programs should be sunsetted. so joe biden is going to make that point on the ground here in florida. that in fact, florida senator, rick scott has suggested, sunsetting social security and medicare. that's factually true. the entry here as mike alluded to is two-fold. rick scott himself is on the ballot in 2024. yes, there's desantis, yes, there's trump. but biden is on rick scott's home turf in florida. while rick scott is in an election cycle himself. and then secondly, there had been this narrative that democrats were not going to compete in florida in 2024. this might be the gift that gives them the opportunity to

compete. >> and iman meroz, jump in here, in wisconsin, the president talked about so many things. one of the things he asked about, whether his age is a concern to voters in all of the polls, whether his age could be a factor in next year's election. >> every indication, you're running for re-election, you'd be 82 the day of the next election, 86 if you're successful and elected and finish that term. does that give you any concern? >> watch me. that's all i can say. >> it sounds like you're running. >> i've made that decision, it's my intention, but i haven't made that decision. >> and we saw governor huckabee sanders leaning into that in her remarks rebutting the president's speech. >> that's right, andrea, that republican response from

governor sarah huckabee sanders, it was ted poll, the youngest serving governor, she made that point a couple times. she talked about a new generation of republican leadership that's now stepping up and taking the reins and contrasting that to president biden's age, he would be 82 in the next election cycle. you saw that answer there addressed in that conversation. i'd point out for a re-election campaign that he hasn't officially announced yet. we do need to say that. but he clearly seems to feel, the white house seems to feel, they have the wind off their back now. coming off that state of the union address, you saw in the tone of the delivery and the way that president biden happily engaged with republicans in realtime. coming back and forth in particular about the cuts in social security and medicare. pointed to a few republicans. david's point is valid. it's a handful of republicans who talked about that. even mitch mcconnell dismissed

rick scott's idea when it came out to sunset that proposal every five years but that got him in a good back and forth with republicans. he seemed to relish it. he seen told her in that interview, he didn't expect it from a handful of those republicans. >> and sam stein, in another clip from judy's interview with the president, she asked him about the documents found in the former president's home. and until then, he's been ducking questions about that. >> i want to ask you what you said about last september, you said just possessing classified documents is totally irresponsible. so what it was totally irresponsible the fact that you had some? >> well, they've informed me not to speak of this issue to anyway try to prejudice the investigation that's goes on. one of the things that happened is, what was not done well, as they packed my offices to move

them, they didn't do the kind of job that should have been done to go through every single piece of literature that's there. but i just thought the investigation, you know, will decide what's going on. and we'll see what happens. >> so, sam, how much of these classified documents weigh on the president's decision over the timing of playing in the re-election? because he's got a special counsel investigation over his head now? >> well, two things, one, you're right, this is the first time he's spoken in detail about it. we've seen news reports that said an aide was responsible for packing up the packages. this is the first time the president himself had said so. to your other question, i don't -- you know, our reporting is not a huge factor in determining when they should announce. obviously, they don't enjoy the fact that he's under this scrutiny, they feel like they've lost a cudgel against the former

president. but there are other factors more relevant to when they would do so. >> i think they did already delay it, though. this does delay -- >> a little bit, a little bit, that is true. but they wanted to get through the state of the union as well. exactly. >> sam stein, david jolie and mike memoli and anna newaz. big news, china says they were just gathering weather data, but the u.s. was able to pick up electronic communication can which is a big deal. we'll talk with leon panetta about that. and complaining to the congressman's son that panetta was being too tough on him. you're watching "andrea mitchell reports" on msnbc. c.

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a senate defense subcommittee held a hearing today on the chinese spy balloon. the which's chairman senator jon

tester peppering defense officials with questions about not getting a lot of answers. >> do we have a plan for when this happens again? and what we're going to do and when we're going to do it? i will tell you this, and i appreciate, but the truth is, we think we know what will they were going to collect. we don't know. that scares the hell out of me. the truth is, i got a problem with the chinese balloon flying over my state. much less the rest of the country. why didn't we shoot the previous ones down and gather intelligence from those so we knew what was going to happen? and, by the way, this is going to happen again, quite frankly, i'll just tell you, i don't want a damn balloon going across the united states when we potentially could have taken it down over the aleutian islands. >> defense officials said they would be able to discuss more in today's classified briefing. and in the last hour, the house unanimously approved a

resolution condemning chinese cruise of the balloon calling it a brazen violation of united states sovereignty. when is the last time they did anything with this last congress. joining us now, leon panetta, former cia director in the obama administration, former white house chief of staff to president clinton. mr. secretary, thank you very much. what questions do you have about the delay in shooting it down? waiting until it came over land and then saying well, they couldn't do it there. so they waited until it was over water. >> well, there's no questions that there are important lessons to be learned from what just happened. and the fact that they've now determined that these balloons in fact were collecting sensitive information, had that capability, plus cameras and sensors. there's no question that they were trying to gather intelligence and impact really on our national security. so, for that reason, i think the president made the right

decision to shoot it down. i do think the lesson we have learned is that this cannot happen again. we cannot allow a balloon to enter u.s. airspace that's a spy balloon. that simply is unacceptable. and i do hope that they understand the importance of making sure that this type of balloon does not gather the kind of national security intelligence that would harm us. >> when should they have shot it down? >> i think at the time that they noticed that in fact it was headed towards our u.s. airspace, that that was -- that's the moment, frankly, when it became a real threat. to our country in terms of gathering intelligence. i think that having had three or

four of these instances, evidently before, is of concern. because it's taken a while for the united states to identify just exactly what these balloons were up to. and so, i -- i assume that acting on the way they had approached these issues in the past, they kind of hesitated, and decided to follow it further. and i think the decision should have been made at that point to stop the balloon from coming into u.s. territory. >> you think that they waited because they weren't quite sure whether it was a spy balloon or a weather balloon? >> yeah. no, i think we've had three of these -- three or four of these balloons, evidently, have appeared in the past. and some of them have been undetected. and i think that the pentagon

had the idea that this was something similar. they were trying to determine just exactly what was up here. and sometimes, you know, when you hesitate, you're then trapped. because once that balloon entered u.s. space, then the whole debris issue and the possibility of, you know, perhaps hurting either individuals or property, became a reality. and so, it traversed the entire country. the end result is just unacceptable. we can't allow that to happen. >> was it intelligence gatherer that has been undetected in the past until recently when they went back and looked at it? >> yeah, i think that's of concern. if these balloons are out there, and we know that they were obviously aimed at gathering

intelligence, these are not weather balloons. these are aimed at gathering intelligence, that we have to identify that kind of threat early. and then take action. because, look, to have these balloons hover over a missile site and gather communications and signals and check our radar and check our weapons systems, it's very sensitive national security information. we cannot allow that to happen. so, as i said, i think, hopefully, there's a lesson to be learned here. and the lesson is we should never allow that to happen again, period. >> you voiced your criticism last sunday. and as you know, the president took your son, jimmy panetta, a congressman from california, to

task for that. let me play what he said as he was leaving the chamber after the state of the union. >> tell dad to take it easy on me. >> i'll let him know to take it easy on you. >> it was tell leon to take it easy on me. your son said, yeah, he got the message. you got the message. you're not taking it easy on him today. >> well, you know, i think -- i want the president to be successful as president of the united states. particularly when it comes to national security issues. and i've known him for 40 years, and he's known me during that time very closely. and he knows that i usually say what i think. and i've always done that. and in the end, the reason i say

it is because, like him, i want to protect our country. and so, hopefully, we can share that kind of information and be able to work together to try to make sure that our country is protected in the future. i think he knows the right thing to do. and hopefully, the united states will be protected in the future. that's my purpose, frankly, having seen a lot of our men and women in uniform having to put their lives on the line in order to protect our country. i think it's really important that we do everything necessary to protect our national security. >> the chinese defense minister is not accepting calls from lloyd austin. and today, a military witness testified at a senate subcommittee hearing that, in fact, this presents a danger on issues like cyber, and nuclear issues, if military officials are not talking to each other.

and if china feels they can cut off this military-to-military communication every time they get upset as when the speaker, former speaker, went to taiwan? >> yeah, i think that's trouble. that's trouble. we have a very tense relationship right now with china. and both sides are taking steps to try to improve our positioning. i mean, the united states has moved to have access to four bases in the philippines. we've increased our presence in areas of the pacific. and china, obviously, just did this balloon. but it's taken other steps to militarize the south china sea and to build up their military. this is a tense relationship. and i do hope that the united states and china can find a way to have a dialogue on these

issues. i think it's important that we try to avoid a miscalculation. every time something like a balloon appears, could result in a miscalculation. so it's important that the united states and china at least develop a process to try to work together on these kinds of issues, to avoid what could be an instance that could have us in war. so, i'm hoping that the united states can open up those lines of communication. i'm hoping that secretary of state blinken can get the opportunity to go there and visit with president xi. but the important thing is that we do that from a position of strength. and that means that china needs to know that we're not going to back off when it comes to our national security. >> leon panetta, as always, it's great to see you. thank you very much for being with us today. >> good to be with you, andrea. and the search for survivors

days after the earthquake that's killed now more than 17,000, rescue workers are now looking for any glimmer of hope in the devastating destruction. david miliband, head of the international rescue committee joins me next. this is "andrea mitchell reports" only on msnbc. maybe it's perfecting that special place that you want to keep in the family... ...or passing down the family business... ...or giving back to the places that inspire you. no matter your purpose, at pnc private bank, we will work with you every step of the way to help you achieve it. so let us focus on the how. just tell us - what's your why? ♪♪ my a1c stayed here, it needed to be here. just tell us - what's your why? ray's a1c is down with rybelsus®. i'm down with rybelsus®. my a1c is down with rybelsus®. in a clinical study, once-daily rybelsus®

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a staggering death toll from the turkey and syria earthquake has soared past 19,000 now. the state department confirming three americans, at least three americans are among the thousands killed in turkey. rescuers are working in freezing conditions using bulldozers and buckets racing against the clock. there are signs of hope. in syria, more survivors were pulled from the rubble overnight. and in turkey, this little girl was lifted through the ceiling of a collapsed building by israeli rescuers. american rescue teams with search dogs and heavy equipment are also on the ground in turkey. joining us from turkey is gabe gutierrez at a search and rescue site. gabe, so many challenges and such heartbreak. talk to us about how they're doing. >> reporter: yeah, andrea, it is heartbreaking. and as you said, so many signs of hope here, but also many

signs of tragedy. andreas right behind me, you see all of this debris from a collapsed apartment building and again as the sun sets the temperatures are dropping. and there are bystanders burning fires trying to keep warm. as they await any sort of news from what's going on to this side of me as my colleague david long walks with me just a little bit. as we walk over here and see what is unfolding, this is something that is happening now around the clock, andrea. people waiting around to hear any signs of life. we have been speaking with people here throughout the day. and there is some frustration that a professional search and rescue team actually did not arrive at this site until just today, the fourth day after these earthquakes. but they are still trying to search for any signs of life here. we just heard a canine trying to, you know, search for any signs of life here at this site. earlier today, we were just across the street at a stadium

that has been converted into a massive tent camp. and you saw from our drone, just the scale of this disaster. and there we see one of the search and rescue dogs going right past us. but there are thousands of people at this camp right now, again, braving the bitterly cold temperatures tonight. a short time ago, there was a shipment of blankets and coats, people trying to keep warm as this international aid in a bottleneck tries to get into these areas into southeastern turkey. ten major cities affected by this, andrea. the scope of this disaster is just massive. and today, the u.n. said that first aid convoy was able to get from southeast turkey into northwestern syria. a very key moment here, but, again, so many heartbreak here. and as these families wait for word, you see them walking back off of this pile, potentially after getting some very bad news. andrea. >> gabe gutierrez, thank you so much. and joining us now is david

miliband, president and ceo of the international rescue committee. and, david, i've learned that two of your colleagues were killed in northwest syria. i want to extend my condolences to you, to the organization which does such magnificent work around the world. the death toll is staggering. >> yeah, thanks, that's meaningful to us. two of our 430 colleagues. we have a team of over 400 in northwest syria. and in turkey in the southeast of turkey, southwest of turkey, in gaziantep. and like every part of the northwest syrian community, the southwestern turkish communities, we've been touched by this crisis. i think the critical point to make is that the crisis that you've described and that gabe gutierrez has described, the earthquake crisis is piled upon 10, 11, 12 years of agony for the people of syria. both those who are trapped in the northwest of the country under the control of armed opposition groups.

and those who are refugees, 3 plus million of them in turkey. so this is a double crisis. and it's a very good reminder that when the world moves on from a crisis like syria and leaves it like a forgotten crisis that doesn't mean it's resolved. and what we're seeing is, yes, the impact of a natural diaster every, but it's the compound of a political disaster as well. >> and i've been to that area in the northwest with our u.n. ambassador linda thomas-greenfield. and the infrastructure there was nonexistent. these are thousands and thousands of people, literally starving at times, not getting as much aid as they need, despite the wonderful efforts of the u.n. and other groups and living in tents. >> well, yes, you're absolutely right. and, of course, dependent in the northwest of syria, 4 million of them, on the crossing point that the u.n. are allowed to use there are other commercial crossing points. but as a result of the russian veto at the u.n. two years ago,

we're down from two humanitarian official u.n. crossing points to one. and for part of monday and tuesday, that u.n. crossing point, the u.n. is largest aid provider in the northwest of syria and help supports ngos like mine it was closed because of the earthquake. so, you can see that this is a very, very challenging situation where the politics is riddled through the natural disaster. >> i was at that crossing point, in fact, with the u.n. ambassador. what obstacles are you now facing? is the crossing point reopened and is aid getting in? >> yes, the crossing is reopened. and there's a u.n. convoy of six trucks going through today. the vital need for all manner of humanitarian supplies, i'm afraid, health facilities, health medications, but also body bags. you're talking about full range of basics here. and i think it's really important that your viewers understand the danger of a secondary disaster, what the

world health organization calls a secondary disaster. the first disaster was the earthquake. the second now, as we -- as the number of people who might have survived the earthquake reduces, the threat of the cold, the disease, the freezing conditions, that's a second threat. and that makes survival success. that's what the issue is in the next hours and days to simply survive. and that's what our team are trying to do, our team, our clients really, our teams are in the same boat and that's the problem they're facing at the moment. >> and i know you're getting phone calls and it's urgent to keep your phone nearby. >> it's not my phone. i'm on something -- i'm on -- it's not my phone, i'm pretty careful not to bring my phone. but something on this machine is going off i apologize. >> no, i'm so sorry. but i also want to point out jose andres and central kitchen are there, and there is, you know, aid going, but can americans do more?

we'll put that up online. >> great. if they can. we're looking for an outpouring of human support because i promise our teams on the ground are ready to work on this. and they're overcoming the grief. and they're reaching out with health and hygiene supplies. they're doing cash distribution which we're able to deliver direct into people's hands. and it's vital that we save as many lives as possible in the weeks ahead. >> david miliband, again, our condolences, and thank you from the bottom of everyone's hearts for what you people do. >> thank you very much. thank you out there. well, the plane truth, top executives from southwest airlines coming to capitol hill for the first class grilling on the cancellations around the holidays. that's next, you're watching "andrea mitchell reports" on msnbc. astepro starts working in 30 minutes.

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meltdown that left thousands of customers stranded at airports. coo andrew waterson led off with an apology to the public. >> i want to sincerely and humbly apologize to those impacted by this. let me be clear, we messed up. in hindsight, we did not have enough winter operations. our high rates of cancellations in denver and chicago where 25% of our crews are placed caused our crews can be displaced. at this point, the disruption changed in from a weather event to a crew event which was unique to us. >> nbc news correspondent on capitol hill ryan nobs has been tracking the hearing today. ryan, more than 16,000 flights were cancel that was a totals mess. coast to coast, how is southwest going to make sure this doesn't happen again? what are lawmakers demanding? >> reporter: yeah, what's interesting, andrea, you do not

hear southwest making any excuses or blaming others for their problems. as you heard the coo say there, they messed up. they plan to make things better, including a $1 billion investment in that software system that reassigns crews and pilots when things start to go wrong. basically the coo described a scenario where an unplanned western pattern that turned out to be worst than expected led to a cascading series of events that they basically lost control over. he also in this hearing today promised that he was going to do everything that they can to make sure that customers affected get refunds and also they get lost baggage back. there were some people on my twitter feed, andrea, complaining they haven't gotten baggage back. this is what some members of congress wanted to hear but not quite enough. listen to one of the exchanges from earlier today. >> it took hours to reach a live person, if they ever reached a

live person at all. mr. waterson, will southwest guarantee that passengers on cancelled flights will be able to reach a live person within a reasonable amount of time? >> there's no amount of people we could have put in place to handle all of the calls at that time because of the scale of disruption. >> okay, so you won't guarantee that? >> reporter: so there's going to be a lot that southwest needs to do going forward, andrea. but it's really going to be how much work they doll after all of this to get their reputation back. the coo trying to clean things up today, it's going to be a long time before this problem is in the rear view mirror, andrea. >> how about getting some of that baggage from christmas week back. speaking of a long time. ryan nobles, thank you very much. also this hour on capitol hill, the first hearing of the so-called weaponization of government subcommittee. that's a new committee created by the house republican majority to go after the white house. chairman and other, of course, the rest of the administration. chairman jim jordan kicking off the hearing earlier with a long

list of accusations against the fbi. he's also alleged the federal government is trying to silence conservatives and is treating donald trump unfairly with very little evidence for that. and he's issued a long list of subpoenas. joining us here capitol hill correspondent ali vitali and law professor joyce vance. so, ali, this panel was formed by speaker mccarthy, that's one of his consortiums to the right side of the caucus. i'm got jim jordan in charge, obviously a very tough customer on all of these subjects. what do they say they're zero flg on today? >> reporter: yeah, andrea, this is the opening salvo from this committee. and you're right, this is something that garnered a lot of attention when it was created because of the fact it was really one of the concessions that mccarthy made to the right flank of his party in order to become speaker in the first place. you see there, jim jordan next

to stacy masken, watching the way they pair in these hearings and future hearings is going to be fascinating. even just listening to the opening remarks while you were in the last segment, it's clear that each side has very competing interests as they go forward. jim jordan, of course, mentioning the idea of big tech and censoring conservative. the entire preservative of his hearing and effectively investigate the idea of a deep state that does not exist. that's why you heard in her secondary remarking following up on the chairman, stacey plaskett saying this is not deep state but focuses on defunct conspiracy theories. nevertheless, what we'll see here in the next few minutes, over the course of the next three hours is going to be the discussion of many themes we often hear on trump rallies on the campaign trail, a lot of red meat for the base. the key themes, again, the idea of wokism.

the way the government functioning in different ways, if you're democrat versus republican. not just in this hearing, but as they go forward with this committee, the things they're trying to highlight. >> and join, a claim so far against the justice department and the fbi credible? >> reporter: they're not credible, andrea. i think that's apparent for everyone involved. the entire premise for the committee say nonstarter. if in fact law enforcement had been weaponized against conservatives, donald trump would have been prosecuted. there would not be a trump-appointed u.s. attorney in delaware investigating hunter biden. and anyone who's worked in law enforcement knows there's a conservative bias in the law enforcement agencies. but what good people do, what career people do, is they set aside their biases when they walk in the door, whether they vote democratic or republican. when they're on the job, they do their jobs. so this effort to politicize law

enforcement's work serves the country very poorly in the long run. and jim jordan knows that. >> ali vitali and joyce vance, thanks to both of you. and on offense, continuing with that theme, hunter biden's legal team now fighting back against some on the far right who have gone after him as a way to politically attack his father. that, and an upcoming hearing, or a hearing about getting under way. this is "andrea mitchell reports" on msnbc. r you're a sea-foodie or a lobster newbie, there's something for everyone. try one of six dishes, like new lobster and shrimp tacos for $17.99. and leave completely lobsessed. welcome to fun dining. i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now, there's skyrizi. ♪♪

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claim over $2 billion but it's only available for a limited time. go to getrefunds.com, powered by innovation refunds. hunter biden's legal team is getting more aggressive, asking rudy giuliani, roger stone and steve bannon to preserve all evidence in preparation for potential lawsuits from the president's son. all of this is linked to hunter's controversial laptop. they've as sent a letter asking the justice department to investigate how donald trump allies copied, manipulated and disseminated data from the laptop. this is a new house oversight committee chairman is on hunter biden to provide documents related to any involvement by his father and his business dealings. joining me now nbc news senior investigative producer sarah fitzpatrick and former u.s. attorney paul troton, talk to me

about the letter sent by hunter's attorney, abby lowell, a well-known washington defense lawyer. >> absolutely, a very well-known washington defense lawyer. andrea, these letters are really hunter biden going on the offensive. it's the first steps in a legal strategy that we know has been over a year in the making. the letters are very detailed requests to over a dozen individuals to preserve all types of evidence, everything from texts to calendars that might relate to hunter biden. what we can tell from these letters is the detail and the letter of specificity reflects that lowell and his team are not just sending a message, they are preparing for potential criminal trials that they believe armed with this evidence and what's already in the public domain they think they can win. >> and sarah, separate the allegations made by republicans from actual evidence here regarding the laptop. is there any evidence regarding the laptop that involves hunter biden breaking any laws? >> so specifically to the

laptop, nbc news has examined various versions of this, and there's no concrete evidence that we've been examined of any true crimes that have been committed related to allegations of corruption, foreign influence, et cetera. now, it's important to recognize that there is a separate federal grand jury investigation going on in delaware that we have learned is related to hunter biden's taxes, but that is not specifically related to anything that's on the laptop. andrea. >> and paul, so you're the lawyer here. let's talk about there are other issues involving hunter biden. there's a gun, a possible gun violation. there are are those tax issues where back taxes was repaid as is often done without criminal penalty. what -- how do you see the breadth of this whole investigation, which has become, you know, such a hot topic

because of republican, frankly republicans overstating what's going on? >> so andrea, as you and sarah point out, there has not yet been a civil lawsuit. this is a precursor to a civil lawsuit. it is a request by hunter biden's lawyers that evidence that may relate to a possible future lawsuit be preserved. and as you point out, all of this takes place in the backdrop of a federal grand jury investigation in the district of delaware. something that the hunter biden team will have to be very careful about and will most certainly be thinking about as they move forward is whether or not they want to truly initiate a civil lawsuit here because we all know about our right to remain silent. we all know about our right to be very careful about how it is we interact with federal law enforcement when they're conducting an investigation. bringing a civil lawsuit can make that more difficult as you are going to be and perhaps will have to sit down for a deposition or share evidence. so no civil lawsuit has been filed yet, and whether or not a

civil lawsuit is filed in the future we'll just have to wait and see. >> what about the investigation, that grand jury investigation. do we know exactly, are they zeroing in on the taxes, on the gun? i mean he's written a book, so it's all out there that he had a severe drug problem and it was obviously of grave concern to his family, and he also had business dealings that in ukraine and china could be conflicts of interest, but what about breaking the law? paul? >> it's hard to assess what the weight of the evidence would be, andrea, because the u.s. attorney in delaware, a trump holdover has been appropriately closed-mouthed about the evidence he is receiving and what it is he may do as a next step. it may be that no prosecution is forthcoming or one may end up at the end of the day coming forward, but for the charges we wouldn't yet know. we just have to wait and see, let the process play out. we can be sure that the

individuals who are in charge of this investigation, while it is a former trump employee, these are men and women who are career prosecutors who will make the decision and make the best decision based upon the facts that are put before them. >> and separately, sarah, what we have, the action going on on the hill now with the new house majority is, again, renewing claims that have not been substantiating that there was a comining of funds, that joe biden who was helping his son financially was involved with him in businesses. none of that's been ever established. >> not from evidence we've seen, andrea. the committee is just getting started. literally they're still setting up their office, so we expect that there's going to be an ongoing investigation. they're going to attempt to, you know, get documents. they're going to attempt to have people come in and testify. this morning hunter's attorney sent a very strongly-worded response back to the committee, and so i think that that's going to be an area of tension and

we're just going to have to wait and see if actual concrete evidence is going to be able to be brought to the table. as of yet it seems like a very, very steep hill to climb for this committee. >> sarah fitzpatrick, paul charlton, thanks to both of you. that does it for this edition of "andrea mitchell reports." follow the show online, on facebook, and on twitter @mitchellreports. and starting next week, msnbc reports has a new lineup. join josé diaz-balart at 11:00 a.m. eastern, i'll still be here at noon as we have been for so many years, followed by chris jansing again at 1:00, and also katy tur at 3:00 eastern. that starts monday right here on msnbc. and "chris jansing reports" starts right after this. pp, and get one free. free monsters, free bosses, any footlong for free! this guy loves a great offer. so let's see some hustle!

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good day. i'm chris jansing live at msnbc headquarters in new york city, and today is the day that lawmakers and the american public get some answers about china's attempts to spy on the u.s., and what is the biden administration's strategy to stop them? all morning we're watching a lot of action on the hill, striking at the heart of those questions two big hearings and a closed door briefing. and in just the last hour, house republicans also officially made their big move against what