what took place with the by balloon? >> and, this is also a fastening one to me as well. where did that come from? how did that enter into u.s. airspace? did it traverse, there would be a large area of canada. when was that first in air? how long were we tracking it? remember, norad, canada is part of norad. they should have been tracking it the whole time was over canada. i mean, at this point, we have a lot of questions. >> all right, courtney kube, thank you for jumping andres. we appreciate it on this sunday afternoon, julie tsirkin, thank you as well. that wraps up for me, everybody. i am yasmin vossoughian, i'll be back in a chair and excited and sunday, 2 pm eastern. you also see this wednesday through friday at 10 am eastern right here on msnbc, our coverage continues with simone starting right now. >> greetings,.

everyone you are watching symone, we are following breaking news out of michigan. new details about a fourth object shot down by u.s. forces in just over a week. this happened a short while ago. we want to have a very live update for you this hour. also the death toll from that devastating earthquake in turkey and syria. now more than 30,000 people. it's hard to even imagine rescue efforts are still underway in the ruins, as thousands forced from their home are in desperate need of aid. we are live on the ground with the latest. and are living black history series. we are talking to civil rights leader, author, and president of the national newspaper publisher association. i am symone sanders-townsend, it's a busy sunday and i have something to say. ♪ ♪ ♪

greetings, everyone. we begin with breaking news a native elephant story out of lake heron, michigan. a nbc news has learned the united states military has shut down a fourth aerial object today. the sheer scope. we will have more news on that in a moment. obviously, this is something we are following and watching quite closely. now we will turn to what is happening in turkey and syria. i think it is safe to say the sheer scope of the disaster in those countries right now is truly hard to fathom. the death toll from this devastating earthquake is now more than 34,000. it is expected to keep climbing. rescuers are desperately searching for victims among the rubble in turkey, using any means they have to find loved ones before the time runs out. in syria, an 18 month old baby was pulled from under rubble alive. just yesterday. he's recovering in a hospital right. the hope of finding living victims has faded in other parts of syria.

now they are focusing instead on the growing humanitarian crisis. thousands of victims have no shelter, no electricity, no water or sewage system and complicating it even further, freezing temperatures rain, and even snow continue. the 7.8 earthquake and multiple aftershocks struck in a location where people were already living in dire situations. united nations high commission on refugees says this disaster is expected to leave nearly five and a half million people without homes. that is on top of the nearly 7 million displaced by the ongoing war in syria. i want to bring in now a senior communications adviser for the united nations. high commission on refugees. she joins us from damascus, syria. thank you so much for being with us. i know you are up quite late. the pictures coming out of syria are absolutely horrific. we are talking about entire villages left in rubble. people using their hands as

shovels to pull survivors and bodies of loved ones from under layers and layers of concrete, millions of people have been displaced. what is your number one priority right now at the unhcr? >> the number one priority is to reach all those who need our support at this moment. as you said, the earthquake hit parts of syria where some of the most vulnerable families lift. they are most vulnerable because they have been living in a crisis. 7 million of syrian population are displaced in their own country. that means they were living in tents, partially destroyed buildings, very weak structures. even if their homes had not been destroyed by the earthquake, they were very much weekend. they are not safe for them to stay in. that's why we are saying, more than 5 million of them need some kind of support, shelter support.

this is only the top and immediately they need food, they need water. the earthquake has damaged buildings coast to coast, it has damaged schools, infrastructure, the water systems. people are worried about the dam. there is a huge effort there to support these people to be able to start rebuilding their lives. the losses were not just in lives but also property. it has a very long term impact. >> just the sheer magnitude of the devastation you described i juxtapose that with these remarkable stories of strength we are hearing about in that region. like rescuers working around the clock to free a baby from under piles of rubble that you mentioned earlier. we now have pictures of the baby girl born in the rubble in syria. she's made it to the hospital. for other folks, it's a different story.

the turkey syria border is already hard to access. turkeytalk to us about the strue to get emergency supplies into syria specifically. >> it's very hard. for many reasons. one is that, at the time of the earthquake, there was a big snowstorm. the combination of the earthquake with the snow storms damaged and really blocked many roads, including the main road, the trucks used it to bring in aid from turkey to northwest syria. we say northwest syria because that is an area held by an opposition. the only way to bring in aid in their, according to the u.n. security council resolution, is that one border crossing. when that road was blocked, that meant a delay for bringing more aid into that part of the country. there were relief items like tense, like food, like blankets, we had this prepositioned relief items inside that area. partners on the ground

distributed it. it was nowhere near enough to match the immense needs that emerged from the earthquake. people need everything. they need the shelter, the water, the food. most of all, they had their loved ones trapped in the rubble. they did not have the needed equipment to extract them, save lives. it's very painful. syrians have been going through this for 20 years. they felt that they -- >> on that note, then, what about the global community and their response here? we have heard criticism when it comes to getting aid into the region. you talked about the things that are needed to do this recovery. what are your thoughts on the response from around the world? >> i will try to be brief. you know, one of the major complications and obstacles is that, in syria, the situation is complicated politically and security wise. many of these people lived in hard to reach areas. to get to them, it takes a lot and needs a lot of

collaboration from all the different stakeholders, including international powers. that's why we say, please put politics aside. keep your eyes on the goal. the goal is to reach these people who have desperate needs and have suffered so much loss is. they need us to stand that we are there for them, we will stand by them. not just this week, not just next week. they need support on the long run. sometimes there are new crises emerging. people shift attention. we need to stay focused with these people. that's why we say, please, we need commitment to keep with them, give them the support we need, and most important, solutions to this crisis. >> thank you so much for your time and everything you are doing. i appreciate you. >> thank you very much for having the chance to highlight this crisis. >> absolutely. we will go back now to that breaking news i told you about at the top of the show. the united states military had shot down another unidentified

object. with me now is nbc news correspondent julie tsirkin. if julie, what can you tell us about this objects shot down in michigan? >> yeah, it's good to be with you. look, the reality is we have more questions than answers. that goes for congressional lawmakers as well up on capitol hill. because, look, we know now that this is at least the fourth object and the u.s. military has shut down in the last eight days, since that first chinese surveillance balloon was spotted. what we do not know is where this object came from. is this the same objects that radars picked up over montana overnight that they were still investigating today? or is it a different one? we know lake huron is on the border pretty much of canada. did this object originate in canadian airspace before coming over over michigan airspace? that we just do not know yet as well. look, as we get into this, it's very clear the u.s. military and intelligence are beefing up their operations here. they spotted multiple objects in the last couple days. something lawmakers are asking

is, are there more objects now? did we just not know how to look at for them before? that is one of the main questions senator jon tester, the leader of the defense appropriations subcommittee is looking to answer. senator schumer said he asked jay sullivan overnight as well. as lawmakers get back into town this morning on this side we are sure this week will be all focused on china as well. again, this object, the last three -- the last to at least, the one in canada included, it's not clear if that came from china or elsewhere. it's something our military is looking into. a really important factor with this objects shot down over lake huron's authorities believe they will be able to recover its and there is no collateral damage, which is important, as you look at the pattern by which they have been taking these objects down, largely over bodies of water in remote areas to ensure there is no civilian or property damage. so a very developing situation here, simone. >> julie, how did we first learn of this fourth object that the military has shut down? >> a couple hours ago, the faa

temporarily closed airspace over parts of lake huron. we then saw tweets from congressional lawmakers in michigan, including congresswoman elissa slotkin who tweeted an hour ago that this was in fact an object they were monitoring a. couple minutes later, i was able to confirm and break with courtney qb that this object was shot down and taken by the military. it seemed like a matter of hours. it's interesting that the airspace was so quickly reopened. perhaps it suggests they were able to identify what this was immediately, it was not an urgent threat to civilian aircraft at that point. it's one, as you can tell, they quickly moved to shoot down. again, one important question we don't know yet, is this the same object that radars picked up over montana overnight? or is this an entirely new one? a lot of questions here. more questions than answers, symone. >> more questions than answers, to say the least. you told us something we didn't know, julie. julie tsirkin, thank you very much. we will continue to monitor

this news update. we will bring them to you as we get them. another flying objects, folks. welcome to sunday afternoon. coming up, we are going to continue covering the other news. particularly the intensified questions and concerns about these high altitude flying objects. we will break down the latest details. stay with us, folks. in life - a “why.” no matter your purpose, at pnc private bank we will work with you every step of the way to help you achieve it. so let us focus on the how. just tell us - what's your why? when you really need to sleep. so let us focus on the how. you reach for the really good stuff. zzzquil ultra helps you sleep better and longer when you need it most. its non-habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil. ♪♪ whenever heartburn strikes, get fast relief with tums.

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breaking news out of lake huron, michigan, where the united states military has shot down another aerial object. an object went down in a lake where officials are working to recover what is left of it. this comes days after other aerial objects were shot down in alaska and canada. just over a week after a fighter shot down the chinese surveillance balloon off the coast of south carolina. just hours before this news, broken actual security council spokesperson warned that it is too early to accurately characterize any of these latest objects. folks, that still applies right now. as for the object shot down over canada, officials in canada say it appears to be a small cylindrical object. members of congress across the aisle are asking for more answers. for public speculation makes things worse. here's what democratic congressman jim hines, the ranking member of the intelligence committee, told my colleague. >> the one thing, check, that

is troubling me here, i see a pattern as i look at social media this morning. you know, all of a sudden, massive speculation about alien invasions and additional chinese action, russian action. in the absence of information, peoples anxiety leads them into potentially destructive areas. i do hope very soon the administration has a lot more information for all of us on what is going on. >> for more on all this, let's bring in my political panel. tolu olorunnipa is the white house bureau chief for the washington post. daniel moody is host of the podcast, and msnbc political analyst and former chief communications adviser, former speaker paul ryan. welcome. i don't think anybody had another aerial object on their bingo card this afternoon. tell you, there is a lot we don't know about these objects shot down since friday, right? there has been three. what are the biggest questions that you have? >> and there are a ton of

questions. first, who owns these various objects? are they all flown by the same person or actor? are these government-owned? are these owned by individuals? is the military just on higher alert than it would've been because of what we saw with a chinese spy balloon from last week? or are we seeing more instances of these kinds of actions, is this a sign of some kind of coordinated effort? there are a number of different questions. it's not surprising members of congress, members of the public our calling for more transparency, they want the administration to tell us what they know, even if they don't know everything. from the administration point of view, they, understandably, are trying to find out as much as they can as quickly as they can. that involves going to sparse, rugged terrain to figure out where these things landed, what they were, put them back together and get as much intelligence as possible, while also handling the diplomatic efforts taking place because of what happened with china. so, there is a lot to be done. there are a lot of questions to

ask. as reporters, we will keep asking those questions and try to find out as much as we can as quickly as we can about these various objects. >> red, and members of the public had questions. there was a congress, rightfully, having questions. we have already seen some extremist members of the republican party conference in the house specifically spreading unfounded conspiracy theories. particularly about the spy balloon, that it was filled with bio warfare chemicals somehow. it's unsubstantiated claims. you used to work for speaker paul ryan. in a moment like this, the gang of eight will get a briefing. i was on meet the press during that jim hines interview. there is no gang of eight briefing that happened because the house is out for two weeks. in this scenario, what happens? should we be -- are you concerned about some of these extremist members and their wild conspiracy theories? we should all be taking this seriously. >> jim hines obviously makes a good point.

it doesn't need to be members of congress. there are lots of people who will be spreading conspiracy theories. i have concerns on both sides here. the administration is obviously not saying a whole lot. it's rare that you get both the republicans -- criticizing the administration saying we need more information. either they don't know a whole lot, which is concerning on its own, how are these things happening, we just don't know about it? let's figure out why that is. or they do figure that they do know things and are unwilling to talk about. it we are learning a lot about these things from tweets, members of congress who happen to be representing areas under which these things were flying. that is no way to be communicating to the public. i don't want to overstate the long term political impact. we don't know what this is or how long this story is going to be with us. it seems at this point, this is one of those things that needs a lot of attention from the administration to make sure they are not fumbling the football here. and they are making sure they are being clear as they can. even if you don't know what it is, it's better to say, you don't know what it is rather

than to allow their -- rather speculation running rampant. they are communicating a little bit. this thing needs a lot greater information than just one of briefings from members of congress. >> i see you shaking your head. do you agree with brandon and congressman himes for that point that the white house needs to be more forthcoming when it may know? i should caution, this is absolutely breaking news, but we don't know what this is. we don't know if anyone was in danger. speculation here is just the worst things folks can do at this one. >> i think we are in an unprecedented climate of high anxiety, right, and where people get a lot of disinformation on twitter and social media. unfortunately we have republican members of congress that are so willing to share those conspiracy theories and push them forward in order to damage the administration. i think we will get more information once information is actually available to us. if it is in the interest of the public to know what is happening exactly. let us all remember that we

found out after the fact, after the trump administration, that not once, not twice, but three times was there a chinese surveillance balloon during that administration. we didn't learn that until just recently. i think it is a product of this administration to say, you know, we have shot this down, we are safe but we are gathering more information. >> we are going to continue to gather more information here at nbc news. we will bring you the latest when we have it. i want to move to this subpoena former vice president mike pence and the special counsel investigation. it's the investigation to the former president, donald trump's actions. specifically on january six. nbc news has reported that team trump plans to fight the subpoena, claiming executive privilege. brandon, do you think that there is more the world has not heard from vice president pence about january six and donald trump? maybe that's why the trump folks want to fight the subpoena. >> the special counsel

certainly thinks there is. obviously, mike pence has spoken about this in public and even wrote a book on it. i think it will be difficult to now claim executive privilege. i will defer to lawyers and experts to say how much that will fly. this whole situation is underscoring the impossible political situation mike pence is in. if he's actually about to run for president, he's in a position where he can be one of the people to help indict his former boss. meanwhile, he wants to tout that he was a vital part of this administration helping get a bunch of things done. it's really hard to have it both ways when it comes to donald trump. i think that will be really hard for him. mike pence, how he handles this will be very interesting. whether he leans into it and says, i'm going to tell you what i know because i think the president was a danger to us on that day, or whether he tries to be a good soldier and duck all the questions and do the bare minimum it. we'll be very interesting to watch because of the political situation he is in. >> as my dad used to, say you cannot have your cake and eat it too.

thank you on a very busy news day. the when we come back, folks, we are still monitoring the latest developments and breaking news about the objects shot down in michigan. we are going to get into the new legal battle taking shape in the january 6th investigation. how is former president trump's team gearing up to respond to the special counsel subpoena? and what that could actually tell us? that's all up next, stay with us. us it's clinically shown to help manage blood sugar levels and contains high quality protein to help manage hunger and support muscle health. try boost® today. there's a story in every piece of land. written by those who work it. like the upshaws. the nelsons. and the caggianos. run with us and start telling your story. ♪♪ inner voice (kombucha brewer): if i just stare at these payroll forms... my business' payroll taxes will calculate themselves. right? uhh...nope.

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we are still following breaking news on the fourth object shot down by the united states military. senator jon tester of montana has tweetedsuggesting the object shot down over lake huron, in michigan, is the same object spotted over montana's airspace last week. we will continue to monitor and bring you developments as we get them. and now to turn to our legal news. it sure looks like former president trump does not want his vice president talking to the justice department. we have to ask why. trump is set to -- have mike pence. donald trump will try to once again claim executive privilege. you might recall in 2021 that the former president tried and failed to block the january 6th committee from accessing records related to his involvement in the capitol riots. and then, it was just last, year a fellow appeals court said no to donald trump's executive privilege claim as he tried to stop pence's former

chief of staff, marc short, from testifying about how donald trump's effort to overturn the 2020 election. something quite of the ordinary did happen on team trump precisely. his lawyers actually turned over, yes, they turned over, voluntarily it seems, a laptop and an additional ford are bearing classified markings to the justice department. they were found at mar-a-lago. let's bring in msnbc legal analyst and former u.s. attorney, barbara mcquade, for more. barbara, i've got more questions about the laptop. i want to start with executive privilege. this is expected from donald trump for that mike pence subpoena. is there any reason why this case will turn out differently than the other cases? hasn't donald trump been told over and over that executive privilege it's not going to be extended to him? it only applies to the person in the oval office at the time. >> i think that's absolutely right, symone. his game here is delay, if he can stall all of us as long as possible, there is a clock out there. if he should win the 2024

election and take office in 2025, anything he can do to throw sand in the gears now to slow things down, slow down any inevitable indictments, slow down any trial, is to his advantage. i think even he knows he will likely lose at the end of the day. but delay is something for which he can declare victory. >> okay. let's talk about these classified documents that were turned over to the justice department. what do you make of donald trump's legal team decision to do that? i would like to note that they had to turn over the laptop because classified documents were reportedly transferred to the laptop by a staffers that work for the former president. what is happening here, barbara? >> this one sounds very egregious. we don't know the facts, all the details of this. it appears, from reporting, it may have something reported to donald trump schedule. but there are often things in classified documents,

classified that a person would read it and on their face not realize why it's classified. it might relate to a process the secret service uses relating to movement of executives. there are lots of things that could be classified. and that's why -- it has that step in there. you are supposed to respect it. there may be a reason you don't know about. here it would seem so egregious, sharing it with this third party staffer who works not for donald trump as president or the u.s. government, but for his political action committee. it appears this person digitized it, scanned it, and then uploaded it. simone, when prosecutors are thinking about factors for charging mishandling of classified documents, not every instance of mishandling classified documents becomes a criminal case. what they look for our aggravating factors. one of those is willful-ness in the violation, which we have already seen from donald trump. another is obstruction of justice which appears to have been the case with that grand jury subpoena that was served last summer in not complied with. now we have a third aggravating

factor, which is sharing it with an outside party who is not authorized to receive classified information. that is three strikes. you know, in baseball it is three strikes you are out. maybe we need a different metaphor for super bowl sunday. at some point, these factors add up. it's going to be difficult for jack smith to avoid charging donald trump. >> it is quite concerning, barbara. the more we learn about what donald trump did and how he is willfully seemingly trying too hard documents that belong to the federal government, it is very concerning. i want to talk about a different investigation now, though. mark pomerantz, i know you know, the former leader of the manhattan district attorney's investigation into donald trump, he wrote a tell-all book after he left the da's office. the book is called the people versus donald trump. you and others have criticized the book saying it is bad form to write about a pending investigation. this morning on meet the press, chuck todd read what you said to pomerantz. i want to play for you how mr.

pomerantz responded. >> well, i think the criticism is unfounded. i can tell you in a nutshell why. first, with respect to the stormy daniels investigation that has gained impetus over the last month or so, the facts have been in the public domain for literally years. i did think the investigation was over. that's how it was presented to us from -- >> it had not been over with you being here today? >> i would have thought more about it. i don't think i would have reached a different conclusion. >> barbara, what's your reaction to those comments? i found them quite interesting. action to those comments i found >> it appears he has vid any laws by disclosing what he disclosed. i think, as a prosecutor, the integrity of the investigation is always paramount. until the statute of limitations says run, it's always possible any case could be resuscitated.

even when mr. pomerantz left that team, alvin bragg said at that time, we are not intimidated. it can always change when we find additional information. i think you always have to be thinking about whether your conduct could in any jeopardize the investigation. i'm not saying he cannot solve the story. i think it is damaging to tell the story now. i think if this case does get charged, when we hear about some of the details of this book coming out and their use of a distraction in the trial, the focus should be on donald trump and not the prosecution team. >> barbara mcquade, the peoples legal analyst. thank you very much. >> thanks, symone. >> half to the break, i will be joined by a panel of americans who all had different touches with the president or vice president this week to give their thoughts on president biden's message to them at the state of the union, about what they want to see in here, next. , next these are the upshaws. and this is their playground. there's a story in every piece of land,

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the united states government gathered on capitol hill this past week for president biden's second state of the union address. sure, there were plenty of famous faces in the house chamber on tuesday. when the president gave his speech, he was focused outside the halls of congress, beyond the beltway. the president had a very clear audience in mind, you, the american people. listen to this. >> we've already created, with your help, 800,000 good paid manufacturing jobs, the fastest growth in four years. for too long, workers have been getting stiff, but not anymore. we are beginning to restore the dignity of work. i am so sick and tired of coming to these breaking the law from preventing workers from organizing. pass the pro-act. workers have a right to form unity. [applause] we must guarantee all workers have a living wage. >> after that address, the

president, vice president, the entire cabinet hit the road to reinforce and reiterate that message. we will talk to some folks that met with and saw the vice president or president this week. veronica is an assembly technician in minnesota. she was at vice president harris's event. and amber is a mr. of the local 1:13 in wisconsin. she introduced president biden earlier this week. and larry dupree is a political core nader for the retirees of teamster local 79 in florida. he chatted with president biden on a rope line earlier this week. thank you all so, so much for being here. amber, i want to start with you. you told president biden at an event in wisconsin recently that you know he's aware of the types of challenges american families face. you also mentioned how government sponsor training programs really change the course of your life. did any of the topics he

covered in the state of the union resonate with you? >> hi, symone. thank you for having me today. yeah, absolutely. everything the state of the union read's unaided with me. the biggest thing that i got excited about was childcare. i am a single mother and while i have a great union job and a great wage with benefits, childcare eats up about 30% of my income every month. affordable childcare and having that available for me and my child is really, really necessary. >> did you know democrats and republicans cannot come to an agreement on who should receive financial assistance on childcare and that is one of the main reasons that this bill has not moved forward? >> yeah, i know, historically they have not agreed. i didn't know there was actually anything in the works

at this moment. >> it is harrowing. veronica, i want to bring you in here. you are also a trades woman. you met the vice president this week, y'all were in minnesota. what did you think of the vice president's message? what did you learn at that event? >> you know, the event was actually an opportunity of a lifetime and i was there to represent my union. communication workers of america, 70 304, awesome, and new fly of america. it was definitely, definitely just an interesting opportunity i had. and i actually learned a lot. there is so much hard, dedicated work that gets put into an event like this. it just blew my mind. to be able to know that and the

infrastructure bill is going to be 5.5 billion to support these buses that we build at our company, and that really meant something to me. >> electric buses, i can tell you from personal experience, i know the vice president cares, is very invested in the climate affects. just the effects this will have on real folks. i know you've got a chance to chat with her about that. larry, you met the president on a rope line this week in tampa. you say you showed up because you had an interest and information about medicare and social security, right? >> yes, yes. thank you for having me. that is so much true. even though i am now retired and and i am on medicare and receiving social security. >> were you pleased with what you heard from the president? >> very much pleased from what i heard from the president. he wants to strengthen and

secure the medicare and social security. like i said, i just want to know the future -- i just retired. at the future of social security is very important because that income i receive is going to be a great help to me in my family. >> it really strikes me, larry, that y'all were in florida and tampa. the whole conversation this week around medicare and social security really centered around a proposal from your senator, rick scott. did you know about that proposal prior to the president bringing it up in the state of the union or at the event in tampa? >> yeah, i kind of heard what trippy ricky said about what he wanted to do. he phrased -- 50-year quote -- but you know, symone, his same proposal contradicts what he was saying about biden. when he was basically saying that if they do this act that he wanted, at the end of it, it

could go -- in other words, if it is good enough, there is nothing we can make a decision to keep it going. that's his trick. like i said, i did not care for that. i was aware of that statement. >> folks in florida are paying attention to what you are saying, mr. larry. show of hands from folks, member interested. did anyone feel better about how things in the country are going after hearing directly from the president or the vice president this week? anybody? anybody feel better? all our hands went up. veronica, why did you feel better? >> she just brought something. she brought hope. hearing what she had to say, it brought hope. to believe that if she made it to our company to be able to speak to us union members and let us know that they are doing

their best to make a difference, it did. >> it made a difference. >> it was amazing to me. i hope that they stick to what they say they are going to do. it did, it brought me a lot of hope. >> amber, you look at the last word on this. >> to be the first stop after the state of the union at our aining center, that was an incredible honor. i felt like i had a lot of hope. i felt really exhilarated. i felt like he actually cares about average, hardworking americans out in the field, that are outbuilding america. out of all the places he could have gone in the united states, he chose our center where we are on the ground every day, working with our hands, building roads, building buildings, the things that we

use in our communities every day to get to and from work, our bridges, things like that. so i just really felt like i was cared about. the connection that we all had our whole union, all my brothers and sisters, the energy in that room was just amazing. >> you, know we often talk -- we cover these events, obviously, here, on msnbc and nbc news, it really makes a difference to hear from the people in the room. veronica puentes, amber riskey, and larry dupree, thank you all very much for your time and insights. i appreciate you. >> thank you. >> folks, we are continuing to monitor that breaking news about a fourth object shot down by the united states military this time the abject today was shot down over lake huron in michigan. if we have any updates, we will bring them to you as we get them. up next, we are going to continue my series, living

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and ceo of that national newspaper publishers association. as a high school student, doctor chavis became a statewide coordinator for the southern christian leadership conference and dr. martin luther king junior. in the 70s, while working to desegregate schools in will, north carolina, doctor chavis was unjustly tried and convicted of arson. as a leader of what was widely known as -- a 34-year prison sentence. after serving years behind, barnes was released on the grounds of prosecutorial misconduct. he did not let this deter him, his activism work was just getting started. he went on to coined the term environmental racism, served as the executive director and ceo of the naacp, and helped organize the million man march. get this, he is also a hip-hop guru, he has hip-hop ties. he is the president ceo of the hit pop action network, and has been critical in the mobilization of members within the hip-hop community for marches and broader outreach efforts.

doctor benjamin chavis is here with us. now doctor chavis, thank you so much for joining us. i could go down the list of the fast facts about you. something folks might not know as you played the pastor in belly, the movie belly. >> a hip-hop classic. >> talk to me about your activism work as it relates to the hip-hop community? >> my whole life has been in the civil rights movement. hip-hop in south bronx in the early 80s, i wanted to build a bridge between civil rights and hip-hop. i got involved with russell simmons, run-dmc, and i be fresh, queen latifah, mc light, bus that rhymes, all the early players. check the, you know. i wanted to be an advocate for hip-hop because as a young person i saw the role of music and culture supporting the civil rights movement. when motown sound -- i saw hip-hop as being an extension of the cultural manifestation of what it means

to fight for freedom, justice, and equality. i still am a strong advocate of hip-hop. it's global now. >> it's global and part of the culture. you corresponded with the great late nelson mandela. >> we were both political prisoners from the 1970s. >> you build a friendship? >> my real joy was introducing nelson mandela to the and aa cp convention in indianapolis. he gave the address. i was so pleased to have him come on. this is the year before he was elected as president of south africa. we are lifelong friends. close comrade and -- in africa, america, and throughout the world. >> dr. chavis, i really feel you have lived three different lives. you are not done yet. what sparked this for me, i'm like we have to talk about doctor chavis. i saw you in a documentary film on reverend sharpton's life, loudmouth. i was like, is that doctor chavis? >> we blocked the sideways

protesting police brutality in new york. he was growing up having to work with dr. king since i was 14. yes, the civil rights movement, unfortunately, symone, is not as large as you think. we ran into one another. we were comrades, jesse jackson, andy young, myself, reverend sharpton, all of us have rules to play, even today. >> even today. first of all, what role do you think the current civil rights leadership should be playing as it relates to everything that has happened in our community right now? we are doing this series. people are literally fighting to keep history from being taught. >> let me reiterate your words. black history is american history. these people talking about banning books, changing the -- you can't teach about slavery, you can't teach about black history. that's going to harm white people as well as black people. everybody needs to know the truth. the truth will set you free. this is no time. can i ask a question, we need

the civil rights movement more in 2023 than we did in 1963? 63, that's when dr. king gave his march on washington i have a dream speech. this year marks 60 years. i think we have come a long way but we have a long ways to go. >> dr. chavis, activists, humanitarian, author, you are also -- how do we get from all that to the ceo and president of the national newspaper publishers association week? >> i started with writing for the black press when i was 11 years old, in the sixth grade, the carolina times. since 2014, i've been blessed for the last ten years to be the president and ceo of the -- and your mother publishes the home of -- one of our historic black newspapers. i am proud of the black press. the black press is the trusted voice. you know, symone, in this social media age where there is a la whole lot of misinformation out there versus information and media, i am so

we glad that this year, 2023, marks the 196th anniversary of the black press of america. 196 years since 1820 when it was first published. i'm so proud to be a part of the black press, represent them, make sure they get their advertising dollars, to make sure they stay in business. i have to salute the biden administration. we've gotten more advertising out of the federal government under the biden administration and than any other administration. >> it makes a difference. folks are reading those papers. the omaha star gave me my first writing opportunity when i was in college. dr. benjamin chavis, i thank you. i appreciate you. i am so happy that we could highlight and tell your story. >> well, thank you. black history is american history. >> is american history. doctor chavis said it first, y'all. thank you out there for watching symone on a sunday. i am symone sanders-townsend, you can catch me right here on msnbc weekends at 4 pm eastern and anytime over on the peacock. and for a quick programming note, starting next saturday, msnbc has a new weekend morning lineup. katie phang show starts off

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