good day, i'm andrea

mitchell in munich for a global security conference. for the first time this year, the germans have not invited russia because of vladimir putin's invasion of ukraine. we begin with my exclusive interview here today with vice president kamala harris. whether the u.s. with a divided congress will support ukraine for as long as it takes. we also talked about the 2024 campaign. starting with beijing's reaction today to president biden's speech about the shoot-down of china's spy balloon and whether the white house and president xi can reset their relationship. the president said that the three other objects were not a threat to the u.s. so why shoot them down? >> well, as the president said, we have approached this with the first priority being the safety of the american people, including civil aviation. so for those three as the president said, that was a big concern. the president's speech last night also made clear that after

the chinese balloon incident, as it has been come to known, we wanted to sharpen the rules that apply to these types of incidents. we also want to improve our detection ability. and then equally important, we're here in munich, what we need to do to ensure that there are global standard for this. that's the work we're going to do going forward. >> why shoot first when we didn't have a policy in place? >> well, let's be clear, first of all, as it relates to the chinese balloon. we shot it down because it needed to be shot down because we were confident that it was used by china to spy on the american people. >> why not shoot the chinese balloon down before it crossed into the u.s. and then all across the country? >> we wanted to do it in a way that would ensure that there was no harm to the american people, but in a way that we could also preserve what we could then investigate from a forensic

perspective. that's what we're doing. i commend the military and those who have been doing the work of retrieving and doing the forensic analysis, in particular of the payload, but the balloon itself, as well. >> the president, of course, has reached out to china saying he expects to talk to president xi. they have said today that it was accidental, that we're overreacting, that there can't be this kind of dialogue given our reaction or shouldn't be this kind of dialogue. >> we will maintain the perspective that we have in terms of what should be the relationship between china and the united states. that is not going to change, but surely and certainly that balloon was not helpful which is why we shot it down. but our relationship and our policy toward china remains what it has been. and i actually spoke directly with president xi about this in bangkok after the president spoke directly with president xi about that in bali several weeks

ago which is that we invite competition with china, but we do not look for conflict and confrontation which is why our policy has been clear that we will invest in the american people, we will invest in our own infrastructure. we will align with our allies around the world, and that's going to be part of the discussions i have with world leaders while i'm here in munich. and we will compete, and that has not changed. >> they aren't even accepting phone calls, military to military, even during the cold war. we had a hotline. isn't there a real risk of miscalculation of an accident? >> well, first of all, we do maintain diplomatic communication -- >> not about in military -- >> military to military is something that we will strengthen, and we realize how important that is. we certainly realize that. and i would assume and hope that the chinese do, as well. >> but at this point is there a risk of miscalculation of an

accident? >> there is always a way to improve relationships when we have direct lines of communication. that is why the president, our president, joe biden, spoke directly with president xi on many occasions, and most recently in bali. it is why i spoke directly with president xi when i was in bangkok just several weeks ago. it is a priority of ours to ensure that we keep open lines of communication and that we make america's position clear. again, we made america's position clear about that balloon when we shot it down. >> let me ask you about ukraine. russia is hammering ukraine, artillery, missiles. can't vladimir putin outlast ukraine as this war goes into the second year? this is becoming a war of attrition. doesn't vladimir putin have more ammunition, more artillery to outlast ukraine? >> well, you're right, andrea,

that vladimir putin decided unprovoked to start this war. and he has the ability to end it by stopping and getting out. >> he's shown no sign of giving up or negotiating. >> that is part of why we will make sure that we do everything possible within our power to strengthen ukraine's position on the battlefield so that if and when there are negotiations ukraine will be in the strongest position in a negotiation. but to your point, what russia has done in ukraine both in terms of the strategyics interests we have in maintaining the integrity and sovereignty and territorial integrity and the violation of that which we thought was part of the norms and rules that had been well established at least since world war ii, what russia has done

that has been a violation of what should be any person's moral interests in terms of how innocent civilians have been treated, andrea, you know there's a report that includes the fact that a child as young as 4 years old was the victim of sexual assault by russian forces. these are war crimes. and so our position and our resolve is quite clear. we will continue to support the ukrainian people as evidenced by the fact that we have sent military support ranging from stingers to javelins to himars, to our commitment to abrahm tanks. we will continue to do the work that i've doing here in munich of working directly with our allies including germany, our host, who by the way chancellor shultz should be thanked for

what germany has done to step up its involve. in terms of the military security piece. we will continue to work with allies around the globe. but what russia is doing is to forcibly attempt to change borders through acts of aggression that are not simply about attrition but are war crimes. and we take seriously this issue. >> do you have concerns that the american people with inflation, the other problems at home, over the long haul as we're going into a second year, and it could go on longer than that, will the american people be willing -- especially with a republican majority now in the house -- will they be willing to stand up for ukraine and make sacrifices? >> i -- i know the american

people. i know who we are, and i've seen how the american people feel about this. i've seen it traveling all over our country to places you might not imagine where ukrainian flags are flying in their windows. in the front of stores. >> you've got congress now to deal with, and the speaker of the house is one of the first speakers not to come to this large bipartisan delegation. >> i'm talking about the american people. and hopefully our elected representatives will reflect how the american people feel about things like independence which is a founding principle of our nation, and we take it seriously, the independence of ukraine, how the american people feel about the atrocities we are seeing where a woman who was at a maternity hospital preparing to give birth was slaughtered.

i know the american people feel a sense of moral outrage and a sense of responsibility for our nation to stand with the ukrainian people around these atrocities. and i'm confident in that. i'm confident in that. >> to that point, there's a state department-backed report that more than 6,000 children, ukrainian children, have been taken, deported, sent to re-education camps by russia. will vladimir putin ever be held responsible? you're a former prosecutor. will vladimir putin ever be held responsible for war crimes? >> well, we are doing everything we can as the united states of america to support the investigations and the tribunals both in ukraine and globally that are gathering evidence and

will hold accountable and you're right, as a former prosecutor i will say hold accountable and ensure there are serious and severe consequences for the people who have committed these crimes. >> we're heading into a campaign year. now nikki haley has announced she's running for the republican nomination, and she says pointedly, "it's time for a new generation of politicians to lead our country." that's very pointedly at both donald trump and joe biden. people over 75. are you that new generation for the democrats if the president decides not to run? >> so let me say that i think that is very coded language, and what i know from traveling our country is the american people want leaders who will see what's

going on in their lives and create solutions, not just offer solutions but create solutions. and in joe biden we have a president who is probably one of the boldest and strongest american presidents we have had in his response to the needs of the american people. ask any senior in america who has diabetes, who has been looking at the likelihood, the possibility of going bankrupt or paying for their insulin. and because joe biden is strong and bold finally we have capped the cost of insulin for our seniors at $35 a month and will cap the cost of prescription medication for seniors at $2,000 a year. because of bold leadership that understands the needs of the american people under joe biden. we are now going to get rid of lead in pipes in america.

grandmothers and grandfathers for years have been complaining about the toxic effects of lead poisoning on their children. because of joe biden's leadership. presidents have talked about dealing with infrastructure including -- remember infrastructure week? joe biden got it done. that's what the american people want. they want their leaders to get things done. whether it be infrastructure, whether it be investing in america's work force when it comes to developing and manufacturing u.s. manufacturing of semiconductor chips because we know that we can't wait for other countries during a crisis like a pandemic to supply the supply chain with what we need, that's the work that's been done. and i -- i cannot stress enough that the american people deserve to have leaders who get things done. >> why do you think the president has such low

popularity, favorable ratings, and you have even less favorable ratings? why do you think that is? >> i tell you what i see when i'm out on the road. i see people thanking the president -- >> it's not translaing -- >> i think that what we have to do is focus on what is actually strengthening america and the american people and american families. and when i talk with american families about what they want and what they care about, things like bringing down the cost of health care, bringing down unemployment, doing the work of strengthening and growing america's work force including american manufacturing, that's what the american people want. >> dozens of democratic leaders are saying that they not only don't think that he's the strongest candidate, you know, considering the larger field that could be possible given his age and other things, but they don't think you're the right person to be on the ticket.

why do you think that? >> i think that it is very important to focus on the need of the american people and not political chatter out of washington, d.c. >> and you obviously ran for president in 2020, you want to be president -- do you still want to be president someday? >> joe biden intends -- has said he intends to run for re-election as president, and i intend to run with him as vice president of the united states. >> you were at tyre nichols' funeral. you saw the grief, spoke to it eloquently. is it time for democrats to compromise on police reform with this congress as they did on guns last session? >> i think it's time for american leaders to address what we should do to improve this

issue, and i as you know was a co-author of the original george floyd justice in policing act. and i am a former prosecutor. and i believe that what we have done as an administration within our capacity in terms of the executive branch to deal with federal law enforcement and say no no-knock warrants, what we've done tlos should be body cameras, this approach to policing is something all people want if we value safe communities, including that we have accountability among all people. >> let me ask you, what does governor ron desantis not know about black history and the black experience when he says that slavery and the aftermath of slavery should not be taught to florida schoolchildren? >> i don't know what he knows and what he doesn't know, but i know this -- any push to censor

america's teachers and tell them what they should be teaching in the best interests of our children in partnership with the parents of america is, i think, wrong-headed. the people who know our children best are their parents and their teachers in terms of the time they spend and the investment they've placed in the brains and capacity of our children who are our nation's future. and it should not be some politician saying what should be taught in our classrooms. >> and you said that nikki haley was using coded language. what do you think about her suggesting a cognitive test for presidents? for candidates for president? >> i did not watch her speech. when you present the suggestion that anyone is saying that it is time for a new generation and they're running against the person who is president, and

when presented as though it's an attack, i would like to let us all be clear that the attack is misplaced if the point of it is is that we need leadership that is strong because we have a strong leader in joe biden. >> thank you very much, madam vice president. >> thank you. >> thank you for your time. >> thank you. >> vice president kamala harris on foreign policy and politics. she'll have a big speech here in munich, of course, on the policy prerogatives. and show of force, president biden is heading to poland next week to mark one year of ukraine's fight against russia as world leaders gather in munich to stand behind ukraine. more from today's security conference in a live report from ukraine's donetsk region next on this special edition of "andrea mitchell reports." we are live from germany. we are live from germany

everything's changing so quickly. before the xfinity 10g network, we didn't have internet that let us play all at once. every device? in every room? why are you up here? when i was your age, we couldn't stream a movie when the power went out. you're only a year older than me. you have no idea how good you've got it. huh? what a time to be alive. introducing the next generation 10g network. only from xfinity. the future starts now.

in a virtual address here at

the munich security conference, ukraine's president zelenskyy compared the war with russia to the battle of david and goliath while thanking western allies for their support. zelenskyy made clear the military aid is not coming fast enough. >> i wanted to hear from the world, ukraine, we will be with you. unfortunately i heard it only after russian missiles struck our land. that is why we need to hurry up. we need the speed, speed of our agreements, speed of our delivery to strengthen our speed of decisions to limit russian potential. there is no alternative to speed because it is the speed that the life depends on. >> joining me now from ukraine's donetsk region, nbc news chief foreign correspondent richard engel, and here in munich with me former u.s. ambassador to

russia, michael mcfall. richard, first to you. you're where a russian missile hit a residential building just this week. have the russians made progress in their offensive in the east? >> reporter: not really. they are launching an offensive, but they are not gaining very much ground. and in the few places where they have made some advances, they are paying a very heavy price for it. russian losses are anywhere between 800 and 1,000 a day according to ukrainian officials, and those figures more or less have been confirmed, not to the number but say they are in the right ballpark from western intelligence officials. according to the uk, russia's losing more men, these are both mercenaries and professional soldiers fighting in this war, than at any point since russia invaded. there is a new offensive in the east, but so far russia's not being able to advance very far

except around the city of bakhmut. and we were right next to bakhmut. it had been speculated that the city would fall perhaps this week, that russia wants to capture bakhmut so the general in charge, and there have been quite a few in the war, can show to vladimir putin, his boss, that he was able to capture the city that other generals have not. still despite this focus and a tremendous assault on the city, bakhmut is still in ukrainian hands. >> richard -- michael, let's talk about support back home because despite russia not being invited here to munich this year which is significant -- >> yes -- >> the allies are united. what about support back home? we've seen an "ap" poll showing that support for ukraine has dropped 12 points. is that worrying to those who support staying with this as long as it takes?

>> you know, i spent most of my day today with ukrainians here at this conference. they're really worried about those numbers, and that's why when president zelenskyy was talking about speed, i think he's looking at those numbers. i think he believes that now is the window of opportunity for them to do their counteroffensive, to break through, to divide up where the russians are, to break the land bridges they talk about. and they realize they need to do that now because our support might not be there next year. >> and what is zelenskyy's goal? does he need to move into crimea, to retake crimea, or start to to get leverage? is that his thinking? to get leverage at the negotiating table with vladimir putin so there's some end game, and is that a red line for vladimir putin? >> well, he must certainly want to succeed with this counteroffensive to take back first the territory that russia conquered since the war started, the second war started. let's be clear. they talk about the war starting

when they took crimea, 2014. that's the first goal. he will say publicly until the very end he wants to take crimea. i think it's important for him to create leverage, like you just said. crimea is the ball game for the russians. they think they're winning. people need to understand putin thinks he's winning. he won't feel like he's winning if crimea's under threat. >> richard, in a war of attrition, can't russia outlast zelenskyy and ukraine? russia has more ammo, they have more men, and they don't seem to care about how many men they sacrifice, as cannon fodder. >> reporter: echoing what the ambassador was just saying right now, concern that i'm hearing from ukrainian military officials, from ukrainian civilians. a year ago when russia attacked, it tried to topple the entire country. and this is a very big country. so russia had to send columns of tanks driving from the east almost all the way to the west. troops came in from the north, from belarus, invaded up from

the south from crimea. there was an air campaign, and it was very poorly coordinated, and russia failed in this attempt to topple the government in one lightning blow. now russia is just focusing on the frontline areas. there are sometimes attacks on kyiv, sometimes attacks on other more peaceful cities. but the vast majority of the fighting is concentrated along a frontline in the east and in the south. and this is the kind of fighting that russia is finding simpler. all it needs to do is just drive forward along one line of attack. it can use artillery, it can use tanks, and it can send in cannon fodder. send in regular troops, and it can send in private mercenaries who are dispatched in teams of six to eight, essentially told to rush the front lines. and if they turn around, they're shot by their superiors. so this is a kind of a conflict

that russia does have an advantage on, especially since russia has more ammunition, and the ukrainians are running low, dangerously low, they will tell you, on ammunition. and because they don't want to use their troops as cannon fodder. they're very nervous about this upcoming offensive. so far it has not gained much traction. >> and vladimir putin certainly doesn't have to worry about public opinion in his controlled state. mike mcfall, with the anniversary approaching, the president is going to poll -- that's been announced. should ukraine be worried about something dramatic and horrific from putin to mark this anniversary? >> they are worried. i think there will be attacks on the capital city of kyiv on february 24th. but they're also optimistic, they're hoping that president biden will deliver a message of hope but also more military assistance. so they're really focused on warsaw, and we'll have to wait and see what the president says. >> we certainly heard that kind

of a message from kamala harris, the vice president, today. ambassador, thank you so much. richard engel, stay safe. thanks for everything you're doing. and speed dial, details from the exclusive phone call that president biden placed to my colleague, peter alexander, about china's spy balloon. and a possible call between biden and china's president xi. plus, 60 members of congress are here in munich, the largest group ever to attend this annual security conference, sending a strong signal of bipartisan support. two members of that bipartisan group, senator angus king an independent and house intel chairman mike turner joining me coming up. this is a special edition of "andrea mitchell reports." we are live from munich. re live. unlimited hotspot data. (woman 2) you know it's from the most reliable 5g network in america? (vo) when it comes to your business, not all bars are created equal. so switch to verizon business unlimited today. my husband and i have never been more active. shingles doesn't care.

i go to spin classes with my coworkers. good for you, shingles doesn't care. because no matter how healthy you feel, your risk of shingles sharply increases after age 50. but shingrix protects. proven over 90% effective, shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. shingrix does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. an increased risk of guillain-barré syndrome was observed after getting shingrix. fainting can also happen. the most common side effects are pain, redness, and swelling at the injection site, muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. shingles doesn't care but, shingrix protects. shingrix is now zero dollars for almost everyone. ask your doctor about shingrix today. a lot of new dry eye patients in my office tell me about their frequent dry eyes,

which may point to dry eye disease. millions of americans were estimated to have it. they also tell me they've tried artificial tears again and again, but the relief is temporary. xiidra can provide lasting relief. xiidra treats the signs and symptoms of dry eye disease. don't use if allergic to xiidra. common side effects include eye irritation, discomfort or blurred vision when applied and unusual taste sensation. why wait? ask your eye doctor about a 90-day prescription for xiidra today. introducing astepro allergy. why wait? now available without a prescription. astepro is the first and only 24-hour steroid-free spray. while flonase takes hours, astepro starts working in 30 minutes. so you can [ spray, spray ] astepro and go. wayfair's president's day clearance is on now. save big on area rugs up to 70% off. and score deals on major appliances up to 30% off. shop wayfair's president's day clearance and get it fast before it's gone. ♪ wayfair you've got just what i need ♪ this week is your chance to try any - subway footlong for free.

like the subway series menu. just buy any footlong in the app, and get one free. free monsters, free bosses, any footlong for free! this guy loves a great offer. let's see some hustle! think he's posting about all that ancient roman coinage? no. he's making real-time money moves with merrill. so no matter what the market's doing, he's ready. and that's... how you collect coins. your money never stops working for you with merrill, a bank of america company. (woman 1) i just switched to verizon business unlimited. it's just right for my littleg business.ou with merrill, unlimited premium data. unlimited hotspot data. (woman 2) you know it's from the most reliable 5g network in america? (vo) when it comes to your business, not all bars are created equal. so switch to verizon business unlimited today. addressing the china spy balloon in his speech, but he had a more extensive remarks saying that the u.s. is still

analyzing parts of the balloon's payload for the first time since it happened. the president also addressing the others three objects that were shot down. >> we don't yet know exactly what these three objects were, but nothing -- nothing right now suggests they were related to china's spy balloon program or that they were surveillance vehicles from other -- any other country. i expect to be speaking with president xi, and i hope we have -- we are going to get to the bottom of this. i make no apologies for taking down that balloon. >> the president later calling nbc's peter alexander by phone to expand on his comments. and joining me is peter alexander, chief white house correspondent. so peter, it's not every day you get a call from the president. i expect. what did he have to tell you? >> reporter: you know, during the remarks when they concluded, i tried to shout a question to the president that he was interested in answering about whether this was an overreaction to shoot down those three latest balloons, as critics have suggested, and whether he was

responding to political pressure because there was other shouting from others, he couldn't answer. he said to me, you can come by my office and ask me that later when there are more polite people around. i followed up with the white house and said just say when and received a call from the president saying, go ahead, ask your question. i asked whether it was an overreaction and he said the political pressure would have been not to act. he said that would have been easier. he said it was a recommendation from the military, and that's why he did what he did now, explaining why he had waited this long to speak in more detail about the circumstances. he said he wanted more information from the intelligence community to have the best information he could have, and then detailed their assessment at this time that these latest three balloons were likely benign or harmless, likely from recreational or from research institutes. they could have been weather balloons, he acknowledged. finally, i asked about the relationship with china and specifically with president xi. he said to me there are going to be hundreds of these things, i

don't mean balloons, but things of consequence. they're going to happen individually, that don't necessarily reflect any fundamental change in policy that they engage in. and so the consequence for it, he said, is to shoot it down, learn as much as we can about it, which i think we have learned. the president would go on to tell me in his words that he believes that the last thing president xi wants is to fundamentally rip up the relationship with the united states or with him. and we have new reporting from my colleagues here at the white house led by carol lee that multiple white house officials say as for a conversation with president xi, there is no call scheduled at this time. the president said he expects one to happen soon, but according to these officials, no timeline, no timetable has been set. andrea? >> peter, i'm hearing the same from our sources here in munich, lot of administration officials here, that they do expect a call

to be scheduled. and more immediately there is a possibility, even a likelihood that the secretary of state, antony blinken, who is here today, and his chinese counter counterpart will be meeting. that isn't scheduled yet. nothing is official until it's official especially given how unpredictable the relationship is. there does seem to be from what the president told you, what he said publicly, what the vice president told me today a real interest in trying to reset this, get past the chinese controversy over the spy plane, and get back on track. as xi told me, it's important that we keep those communications going, peter. >> reporter: i think you're exactly right. that was the biggest takeaway from the president's words which frankly is why he was willing to take this further question. he wanted to make it clear to the american people and to the chinese, president xi in particular, that the u.s. sees no advantage in further escalating the situation, as he said in his remarks yesterday. this should be a relationship that is one defined by competition, not by conflict.

andrea? >> and of course we can see peter on "weekend today" tomorrow. of course with kristen welker. joining me ohio republican congressman mike turner, chair of the house intelligence committee leading the house delegation in munich. mr. chairman, thank you very much. >> thank you for having me. >> you know the intelligence better than anybody other than you -- members of the gang of eight. there's no question it was a spy balloon. the criticism has been that the president didn't have it shot down sooner and that we were tracking it all the way from hynan province across the pacific. then the aleutians, into canada, into the u.s. the white house is saying we've got a lot of intelligence by doing that and being able it retrieve the debris, which is that retrieval is now completed off south carolina. what do you say to that? >> andrea, whenever you let a

spy balloon complete its mission, you're allowing the people who decided to take that risk -- in this instance the chinese -- to collect all the data and information that they want. you don't eastbound know what that is -- you don't know what that is until the mission is complete. even if you do recovery and look at the wreckage, you're never going to know all the information they've gotten. the risk was too high. this should not have been permitted. it should not -- they should is not have permitted it to complete its mission. >> where should they have shot it down? >> as you indicated, they had a number of opportunities like the ones shots down over alaska, in the water. this was not their only shot. it came at great risk. >> do you think that it would have been a risk to shoot it down if they hadn't confirmed with the surveillance that it was not just another probe or another, you know, weather balloon or other kind of balloon because china's done this before. would it have been a risk to shoot this down and create at incident as it crossed into our airspace? >> you can do the diagnostics,

there's no question you should understand it. the same point we've got to control our airspace. and what we've done is send a signal that this was permissive, and this shoul not be permissive. it's hard to criticizes them from being trigger happy when you want them to defend the airspace. there's been taking down things in response to criticism rather than just really looking at what is a national security issue. remember, we weren't shooting things down before. clearly this is a change. >> a change because we also widen the aperture on our radar, but it change because of the political heat they were taking? >> right. and rightly so. everyone who looks at this has an assessment of what china benefited, what did they get from this, realize that's the risk is incredibly high. what they looked at were our most sophisticated military sites. that means the risk is damaging to us. >> how dangerous is it that for a period at least there's been

no military-to-military communication in relationship, you know -- critically important, the most important adversarial relationship we have, even during the cold war with the soviet union we had a hotline. >> there certainly isn't any escalatory things happening at this point. obviously the balloon was an escalation, entering into our airspace, sending a notoriously open spy balloon over our most sensitive military sites. i think certainly reflects that china is going to have a reaction to this, but it's the right reaction. it should have happened sooner, but it's the right reaction. we're drawing boundary lines. you are not going to be doing this. >> and how important is it that we get the relationship back on track? should antony blinken meet with them here, should president xi talk, to get back to normal? >> i think it's always best to get back to normal, but it's just as much their interests as it is ours. that's the thing i think is going to be part of the dialogue. they're certainly going to be coming to the table. they should not have done this. they know they should not have

done this. there's nothing defensible that they have in response. they need to come to the table and make certain that our relationships heal. >> you heard from president zelenskyy virtually speaking to the conference here today, and he is concerned ukrainians here at the conference are really concerned that support is going to wane in the long run back home as we go into the second year and who knows how long this war of attrition is going to go on. let me play senator lindsey graham speaking at the conference this morning. >> i am here to tell you the weapons will continue to flow from the united states. the economic assistance that ukraine needs to stay in this fight will be there. i'm a republican, i promise you there will be bipartisan resolve to keep the assistance going, and there's bipartisan resolve to hold putin accountable. >> are you confident that your

caucus because it's the house republicans have been most outspoken about scaling back on this commitment which has cost billions and billions of dollars. >> it's on both sides. there are 20 democrats that sent a letter to president biden saying, you know, settle this. let's have peace negotiations, and then upon reaction by the administration, they withdrew the letter. you can't withdraw a letter from putin hearing it, however. so they're their are -- >> there's new legislation being proposed by matt gaetz. >> just as the letter said, hey, let's -- we've got left and the right, but they are the extreme in this instance. overwhelmingly congress supports this support in ukraine. you know, we're not supporting the war in ukraine. the -- if you support the war in ukraine, you supports russia. we support defending ukraine from the war in ukraine. they're on the front lines of democracy. president zelenskyy has rallied his people, and the unbelievable human tolling, the atrocities, the pictures that you see of

what's happening with the mass graves, the killing of civilians, the residential structures that are being hit, this clearly shows that they're never going to win over ukraine because they're -- their atrocities are so outrageous. >> the kidnapping. thousands of children and sending them to so-called re-education centers. but to that point, is the commitment going to be there for the long term given domestic concerns, and do you think -- do you think the speaker should have been here? >> well, i mean, he has -- he certainly has been in europe -- he's been to our efforts in poland that support ukraine. he has openly stated his support for ukraine and that it will be there. what we're going to see, i think, is certainly we're going to get rid of the fluff. we passed a $40 billion bill and sent like $6 billion to $8 billion to ukraine. all the things that get added

onto bills don't need to be there. we need to fully fund and send weapons and humanitarian assistance to ukraine, and i don't think that's stopping. i think what needs to stop is this war and all these atrocities that russia has initiated. >> do you think there will ever be accountability -- will vladimir putin ever be held accountable for these war crimes? >> it's interesting and you see it here at this conference, that the documentation of those atrocities as russia is pushed out of areas, ukraine is able to come in, the international communities is able to come in and really document what has happened. we're not looking at just reports of what was happening behind the lines of where russia controlled. we're looking at the evidence of mass killings and brutal -- just unbelievable crimes that have occurred against ukraine. >> house intelligence chair mike turner. thank you so much for coming over. we really, really appreciate that. >> thank you. and coming up, senator angus king joins me between his meetings here at the security conference when this special edition of "andrea mitchell reports" continues. live in munich, only on msnbc.

power e*trade's award-winning trading app makes trading easier. with its customizable options chain, easy-to-use tools, and paper trading to help sharpen your skills, you can stay on top of the market from wherever you are. ♪♪ inner voice (kombucha brewer): if i just stare at these payroll forms... my business' payroll taxes will calculate themselves. right? uhh...nope. intuit quickbooks helps you manage your payroll taxes, cheers! with 100% accurate tax calculations guaranteed. ♪♪ we all have a purpose in life - a “why.” maybe it's perfecting that special place that you want to keep in the family... ...or passing down the family business... ...or giving back to the places that inspire you.

no matter your purpose, at pnc private bank, we will work with you every step of the way to help you achieve it. so let us focus on the how. just tell us - what's your why? ♪♪ ♪ma ma ma ma♪ [clears throut] for fast sore throat relief, try vicks vapocool drops with two times more menthol per drop*, and the powerful rush of vicks vapors for fast-acting relief you can feel. vicks vapocool drops. fast relief you can feel.

type 2 diabetes? vicks vapocool drops. discover the ozempic® tri-zone. in my ozempic® tri-zone, i lowered my a1c, cv risk, and lost some weight. in studies, the majority of people reached an a1c under 7 and maintained it. ozempic® lowers the risk of major cardiovascular events such as stroke, heart attack, or death in adults also with known heart disease. and you may lose weight. adults lost up to 14 pounds. ozempic® isn't for people with type 1 diabetes. don't share needles or pens, or reuse needles. don't take ozempic® if you or your family ever had medullary thyroid cancer, or have multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if allergic to it. stop ozempic® and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, or an allergic reaction. serious side effects may include pancreatitis. gallbladder problems may occur. tell your provider about vision problems or changes.

taking ozempic® with a sulfonylurea or insulin may increase low blood sugar risk. side effects like nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea may lead to dehydration, which may worsen kidney problems. join the millions already taking ozempic®. ask your health care provider about the ozempic® tri-zone. ♪♪ ♪ a bunch of dead guys made up work, way back when. ♪ ♪ it's our turn now we'll make it up again. ♪ ♪ we'll build freelance teams with more agility. ♪ ♪ the old way of working is deader than me. ♪ ♪ we'll scale up, and we'll scale down ♪ ♪ before you're six feet underground. ♪ ♪ yes, this is how, this is how we work now. ♪ a bipartisan group of more than a dozen u.s. senators are also here in munich as the codel mccain, so named in honor of

former senator john mccain. he was a leading participants here every year at this conference for decades and decades. maine independent senator angus king serves on the armed services and intelligence committees and joins me now. let's start with ukraine. you heard from president zelenskyy. his concerns are that the ammunition, the weapons get there in time in this war of attrition. that's by next month. >> that's the question i've been asking. i'm worried the russians are preparing for an offensive and the new weapons, particularly the leopard tanks and the abrams, aren't going to get there in time. that's the issue. and i just finished a meeting with the chairman foreign minister, and that was my message, hurry up. >> hurry up. and the patriots aren't delivered yet. poland has the patriots. we know that the troops are being trained -- >> the training, these high-tech weapons you don't just jump into and operate. the training is the time lag. but i think everybody realizes that time is of the essence.

>> do you agree with the administration then, with our allies, that jet fighters are not necessary -- i know that president zelenskyy wants jet fighters, but that they would be sitting ducks on the tarmac and that's not the most important weapon. >> i think most important weapon now are those tanks. the war that's going on as a world war i trench war in the -- in the east. and i'm not sure about the at at the issue -- the calculation is always harming versus escalation. the danger, of course, with jet fighters is if a ukrainian pilot decides to take off into russia, then that's clearly going to be an escalation. i think the administration's handled it well. >> let me ask you about china. and we just interviewed mike turner, the house intelligence chairman, who thinks we should have shot down the china balloon before it got to the continental united states. >> i disagree. number one, just without

revealing classified information, the administration determined, a, that it didn't carry a bomb or any explosive, and two, that they could mitigate any intelligence collection. i believe that if the president had shot that thing down over montana and thousands of pounds of steel had rained down on boseman, the same people criticizing him now would be see saying he acted too soon, he put american lives at risk. i think as long as they mitigated the risk of national security letting it go over the ocean, bring it down where we can recover it, and a large part of the debris has been recovered. we're going to learn a lot. and we learned a lot from it as it went across the country. >> fs the president too trigger happy in shooting down the three other balloons that were probably he now says benign, research academic private -- >> well, you know, these three aren't the first of these kinds of things that have gone over

our country. i think there was a difference. here's the difference. the chinese balloon was at 60,000 feet. that's well above commercial air space. these items, whatever they were, were shot down were at 20 to 30,000 feet. that's a hazard to navigation. that's a hazard to commercial aircraft, so i think the president was justified. >> if these were not the first, why not shoot them down now? we didn't shoot any others down. >> i think frankly we're getting better at spotting them. there was a period where we were all focused on missiles, ballistic missiles and high altitude. frankly, i think there was a gap in our visibility. >> how important is it for tony blinken to meet, talk to him here tomorrow when they'll both be here -- excuse me, it's very

cold out here, have the president talk to president xi and get this back on track. >> what really worried me is when the balloon incident was going on, lloyd austin, the secretary of defense tried to call his number in china, they wouldn't answer the phone. >> that's really concerning because you need those military to military contacts. >> and you've got to be able to deescalate if it's an accident or not intentional because one person's deterrence can be viewed as the other person's provocation, so i find that very disturbing and i hope that tony blinken can meet here and the president can get back on track, but this business of not answering the phone and not allowing these kinds of lower level contacts to deescalate tension is very dangerous. >> china has so many different platforms that they're spying on us and invading our privacy. what about tiktok, you have coauthored a bill with marco rubio from the intelligence committee to ban tiktok.

>> the way i think of it is we had all this to do about this balloon, how about 62 million americans carrying around a device that could be a pipeline to beijing? here's the issue, andrea, the chinese government has a law that any private business has to share whatever data and information it has with the chinese government upon request. holy smoke. i mean, that gives you -- that gives them access -- and i'm not saying that they're doing it now -- but they could have access to gps information from everybody's phone, what people are looking at. there's also potential for disinformation. our bill doesn't say ban it. it says ban it or sell it, sell the company to an american company, a european company, but not owned by a country that could use it to violate national security and millions of americans' privacy. >> what china has proposed is having it be a u.s.-based chinese owned company.

>> yeah, okay. that won't work. just a few weeks ago -- i think it was within the last month, china has actually bought a share of bite dans, which is the chinese parent of tiktok and put the government official on board. let's be clear about this. either we can't have it here or let's put it in ownership we can trust. >> how important is it to repair the relationship with china, given taiwan, given their concerns over expanded basing in the philippines. these tensions can really escalate quickly. >> absolutely. it goes back to what i said about them not answering the phone. what keeps me up at night is an accident, a chinese pilot who buzzes a destroyer in the south china sea and mistakenly takes the mast off. that's the kind of thing that could really lead to a spire out of control, and it's very

worrisome. i think of china and the u.s. as these two heavily armed giants sort of lumbering toward each other, and neither side wants the war. neither side, it will be catastrophic for both sides, we've got to figure out a way to compete but not have it turn into conflict. >> do you think president xi knew about the spy balloon coming on the eve of an important secretary of state mission to beijing? >> i doubt it. >> you think that the chinese army, the prc. >> i think somebody made that decision. i doubt he knew personally. i have no intelligence on that. i can tell you whoever is in charge of it is probably looking for a job in china right now. >> but you think that that government, that huge bureaucracy is not as -- not as solidified as one might expect? >> given the magnitude of

everything that they're doing, it would be hard for me to believe that he has absolute knowledge about every single thing that's going on. he might have, but you know, they're spying on us every day. they're gathering data all the time here. satellites are going overhead, so this is not out of character for them. what's out of character is that we caught them. >> angus king, senator from maine on the intelligence armed services committee, thank you very much, sir. >> thank you, andrea. nice to be with you. >> we've had a very special edition of "andrea mitchell reports" live from munich. i'll be back in washington on monday. follow us online on facebook and twitter @mitchell reports. my friend and colleague chris jansing reports starts right after these messages. rz

not all bars are created equal. so switch to verizon business unlimited today. when your v-neck looks more like a u-neck, that's when you know, it's half-washed. downy has 7 benefits that condition and smooth fibers so clothes look newer, longer. feel the difference with downy. i was thinking, i should probably set up that 90 day refill. walgreens is all about making life easier. i can help set that up right now for you. i'll be honest, there are days

i forget what she's supposed to be taking. hey, i get it... and you're not alone in this, ok? so james, all these prescriptions. are they covered? that's right. with your medicare plan you get low-cost copays. thank you. let's talk about making things easier. walgreens is here. ♪♪ this week is your chance to try any - subway footlong for free. like the subway series menu. just buy any footlong in the app, and get one free. free monsters, free bosses, any footlong for free! this guy loves a great offer. let's see some hustle! (woman 1) i just switched to verizon business unlimited. it's just right for my little business. this guy loves a great offer. unlimited premium data. unlimited hotspot data. (woman 2) you know it's from the most reliable 5g network in america? (vo) when it comes to your business, not all bars are created equal. so switch to verizon business unlimited today.

. good day, i'm chris jansing live at msnbc headquarters in new york city. a new update from the governor of ohio, no sign, he says, of contaminants in the air or water of east palestine, despite the chemicals released during that train derailment two weeks ago. so why do residents say they keep getting sick? more on that and what one lawsuit says about the kind of chemicals they're dealing with coming up. plus, george santos grill