that does it for me, thank you for watching. catch me tomorrow morning as the live coverage from ukraine continues and then you timeslot 10 am to noon eastern. stay where you are. alex witt joins us in a moment. alex witt reports. alex witt reports. a >> very good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters in new york. welcome everybody to alex witt reports. developing this hour. new conserves this weekend as we mark one year since russia launched its full scale invasion of ukraine. the u.s. ramping up sanctions and terrorists on russia. while boosting its support for ukraine with a new two billion dollar aid package. but new questions this week and as -- as new reports suggest that beijing is considering giving russia drones and ammunition. president biden addressing the possibility in a new interview. >> i don't anticipate, we

haven't seen a yet, but i don't anticipate a major initiative on the part of china providing weaponry to russia. >> if they did, would that be crossing the line for you, mister president? >> it would be the same line everyone would have crossed. in other words, we will post severe sanctions on anyone who has done it. >> meanwhile, a group of media organizations, including nbc news, have asked house speaker kevin mccarthy to share 44,000 hours of security footage from january 6th. and at the request comes after fox news host tucker carlson says he has been given access to the videos. democratic congressman j.d. raskin expressed a concern to msnbc of this video being named a public. >> we have security concerns about turning over the location of security cameras in the u.s. capital that that police used. we have concern about the could

escape and evacuation routes that were used on that day. we don't want to just, you know, there are hands up and say we will let everything go. and let the insurrectionist have the materials that will allow them to plan the next january 6th. >> we are waiting a decision that could be the most consequential, abortion rulings into the roe v. wade was overturned. a texas lawsuit could cut off access to pills used for abortion and miscarriage nationwide. conservative groups followed suit to revoke the 22 year old fta approval of the drug. in anticipation of the ruling, the white house says they will take action to ensure access to the drug is as uninterrupted as possible for women across the country. we have a number of reports covering the late developments for you from russia and d.c. to ukraine let's go to nbc's allie raffa and wilmington, delaware. ali, the president and first lady making the news, let's share the latest, what do you know?

>> yeah, alex. taco 2024 from both of the bidens over the last 24 hours. president biden making his intentions clear with the interview with abc news overnight. take a listen to what he had to say. >> my intention has been from the beginning to run, there is too many things we have to finish before our start the campaign. >> is your age part of your own calculation on to whether to run again? >> no. but it's a legitimate reason to raise issues about my age. it's illegitimate to do that. the only thing i can say is watch me. >> the first lady making those plans all it's a bit more clear, really, the most direct we have heard from her interview she gave the associated press during a trip to kenya yesterday, as she said, quote, he has not done, and he has not finished what he started. adding that essentially, the only thing left for the president to do is set a time and place for this reelection

announcement. alex, it's no secret how much of an influence the first lady's on the president. and his decision-making. he likes to joke around about a pretty often. it's absolutely true. i remember seeing the dynamic and how much she is valued for the 2020 campaign trail. the word carries a lot of weight, there is a big deal here, especially when you consider how closely we have been watching for this ever shifting timeline of the possible reelection announcement. remember, we expected that you have happened already, then aides were saying that the president did not want to deliver his state of the union address as a presidential candidate. that was pushed back. the latest guidance we have from aids is that this will happen sometime in april, wait around the time that we know former president obama also announced his reelection campaign, alex? >> it all makes sense, there's a certain element of preemptive nature to that which the first lady have said, we shall see when it becomes official. thank, you allie raffa, from wilmington. let's go to the new demands

from news organizations for the house speaker to share thousands of hours of january 6th video. let's go to nbc julie tsirkin from capitol hill. julie, welcome. what knew can you tell us of this? what are lawmakers telling you about it? >> one lawmaker, we are not hearing enough from's to house speaker kevin mccarthy, who turned over all of the tapes, 44,000 hours of capital security footage and much of it never seen before by the public. he turned it over to tucker carlson and his team at fox news we learned that from tucker carlson himself on monday. that is why it has been days that we have not heard from kevin mccarthy. we haven't had our questions answered. we have repeated requests for comment in from him and the office. he made brief comments to the new york times saying he, quote, promise to turn over all the footage to the american public. he said that sunlight deserves to be shined on at these materials. but the sunlight is being shined from tucker carlson's

perch. i want you to take a listen to what jamie raskin had to say to our call in the other night about this. remember, he was a member of the january 6th select committee that spent two years debunking the very conspiracy theories that tucker carlson says on his show since the january 6th attack. watch. >> can you imagine if the january 6th select committee had done this given materials to one network, much less one host to stephanie ruhle, or rachel maddow? there would have been a stand-alone. it so when kevin mccarthy says he wants to give it to the american people, but it will be filtered through the prism of tucker carlson, i think it shows how distorted and arrange his politics have become. >> i think it's important to understand, as we hear from democratic leaders on capitol hill who are concerned about security, not just for members, but also officers here, the january 6th select committee was very careful in their chain

of custody to ensure that only the people who needed to see the footage we're able to have access to. it then they carefully presented the material to the american public. careful not to disclose any sensitive security routes that members, including the former vice president, or take it on when rioters stormed the capital. now, we have this moment where news organizations, including nbc news, are sending a formal request of the speaker. asking him to turn over all of this footage to grant access to all of the media, not just fox news as we await and the next coming days but tucker carlson plans to reveal. >> listen, if kevin mccarthy wants to be honest, he was a rather than being transparent to the american people, yes transparent to fox news viewers, and of subject. thank you very much, julie, we will see what comes to the request from media organizations, and also a few minutes, i will talk to tim hate, the lead investigator for the january 6th committee about early seeing all this video is

an alarming security concern. i will also ask him about ivanka trump and jared kushner being subpoenaed by the special counsel. what does that mean for donald trump? let's go to the war in ukraine, entering officially u2 with a blitz of new russian attacks. new overtures by china for a pea -- peace initiative over newest field of china's relationship with russia. all this as president zelenskyy makes another push for american f-16 fighter jets. and missy's erin mclaughlin has the rest from kyiv. good morning to you, erin. >> hi there, alex. last night, president biden telling abc news that he is ruling out sending f-16 fighter jets to ukraine for now, something the ukrainian leadership has been asking for. take a listen to what the president had to say. >> we are sending him what our seas in the military things he needs now. he needs tanks, he needs a teller, in his air defense, including another high marks.

there are things he needs now that they are fenn sending him to be in a position to make gains. the spring and the summer. >> you don't think he needs at 16 is now? >> no he does not. there is no basis upon which there is a rationale, according to armed military, to provide f-16s. >> you are not ruling it out. >> the other items of the president mentioned there, the artillery, the himars, the air defense, those are things ukraine a badly need on the front line, speaking to the adviser to the ukrainian military. he said essentially that is happening right now, both sides are running out of ammunition. i am speaking to a senior adviser to president zelenskyy earlier this week. they say if they can get the ammunition and supplies, the weapons from the west in a timely fashion to the front lines, he expects potentially there could be a turning point in this war. and the next six months. it's an optimistic view, a

potential wildcard, according to an adviser to the ukrainian military, it potentially chinese involvement. the united states has been warning that china is considering sending a lethal aid to russia. if that happens, in the words of this advisory, it could be a, quote, game-changer which is perhaps why president zelenskyy says he would like to meet with the leader of china. alex? >> okay, erin mclaughlin, thank you for that. joining me right now is california congressman sarah jacobs, a democratic member of the house of armed services of foreign affairs committees. welcome, it's good to see you on the broadcast. one year into this conflict. the u.s. is sending a two billion dollar aid package to ukraine. it includes drones, artillery rockets, and a large amount of ammunition. let's take a listen together to what joint chiefs chairman mark milley told joe scarborough about what the endgame can look like.

>> if we are lucky, the diplomats will enter the fray here and they will get to a negotiating table at some point. i think at the end of the day president biden, president zelenskyy, every european leader has said the same thing which this war will end at the negotiating table, that is probably right. >> do you agree with that? here's another question beyond that, can ukraine hold out for alexei another brutal year? can the u.s. be doing more? >> look, i think everyone agrees that negotiated settlement is the way this war is going to end. and as someone who spent my career working on international conflict resolution before coming to congress, i can tell you the way we get there is by both sides believing they have more to gain from a negotiation then from the military conflict. that is why we, and the united states, is focused so much on making sure we are getting to ukraine what it needs for the fight right now. so they can be successful now and through the spring, which will be an incredibly crucial

time so that they have the best possible position at the negotiating table when they decide it is the right time to do so. >> would that not take vladimir putin getting a realistic view of what is going on? we have long suspected that his generals on the ground and ukraine are not giving him an accurate picture that he sort of seeing things from 50,000 feet. he has to come to the table and say, you know, it's in russia's interest to render this. what is the likelihood of that happening? . >> that is right and that is why the united states and our allies around the world introduced a new sanctions package on this anniversary to continue pushing on the pressure to vladimir putin so that he finally sees that negotiation and ending this war is the way to go. >> let's turn to china's role in all of this because you know the country is calling for a cease-fire while presenting the 12 point peace plan. however, sources are telling

the german news web say that russia is in negotiations with chinese manufacturers for kamikaze drones. let's take a listen to secretary anthony blinken. >> china has been trying to have it both ways. on the one hand, trying to present as publicly, neutral, and seeking peace, but at the same time, it's talking up russia's false scenario about the war. it is, as i said, providing not only assistance to the companies, and are contemplating lethal assistance. >> what kind of options does the u.s. have if china decides to play a bigger role helping russia? >> look, president xi has announced a big peace plan. the best thing he can do to make sure we actually have this war and is for him to get vladimir putin to end the war. that is not providing the assistance. in fact, providing military assistance to the russians would only prolong the war. and continue the suffering that we are seeing. we have been very clear that the president, secretary blinken has been clear, that

they will be severe consequences if china does provide this military assistance to russia. the same kinds of consequences that we have apply to other countries like iran, to provide military assistance to russia. >> okay, you heard the proceeding report from my colleague julia circuit. and that group of media organizations, including nbc news, asking how kevin speaker kevin mccarthy's shares at 44,000 hours of january six caught security footage that tucker carlson said was given to him. how do you feel about tucker carlson being essentially that filter, the interpreter for this sensitive video? what does mccarthy do with this move? can anything be done about it? >> look, i am appalled that speaker mccarthy would provide this footage to tucker carlson. i was there on january six, it was my fourth day in office, i was trapped in the house gallery. it was the closest i have ever come to feeling like i might die. and i still have trauma from

that experience. and we know that this footage is incredibly sensitive. and that getting out would, the only help insurrectionist, but our adversaries around the world know how to attack the capital. know how to attack us members, and capital police at all of the staff and all of the people who. work in the capital complex and so it, this is another example of how kevin mccarthy does not care about the members of congress, does not care about the institutions, and so he beholden to the far-right extreme of the party that he is willing to do anything to keep their support. >> a sobering thought there, and we let's go to the texas lawsuit that can cut off access to pills use for abortion, miscarriage keratin extensive wide, the decision from the judge can come at anytime. how concerned are you if the judge decides to revoke that vet at the approval. by the way, 22 years long and has been approved. i am extremely.

worried this could cut off access to over 40 million people who need the struggle for health care. for treating ectopic pregnancies, for having abortions. as a 34-year-old, women this is incredibly personal to me because reproductive health care is my health care. we are working closely with the biden administration to make sure that we are prepared for any potential ruling that could come out, and that will have a legislation that executive actions still in place for whatever the ruling might be to try to prevent the worst harm from being done. but, look. it is can credibly concerning and i think it's just goes to show that these extreme republicans will go to any length to prevent people from having the right to make choices about their own health care. >> all right, california democratic congresswoman sarah jacobs, good to see you again. thank you for your time. meantime, the house january six committee made it explicitly clear about donald trump's

roles in the capitol riot making criminal referrals against the former president for obstruction, conspiracy, false statements, and assisting insurrection. i will talk with the lead investigator for the 16 committee,, next about whether trump will get indicted by a grand jury. grand jury. wewe this mom's one step closer to their new mini-van! yeah, you'll get used to it. this mom's depositing money with tools on-hand. cha ching. and this mom, well, she's setting an appointment here, so her son can get set up there and start his own financial journey. that's because these moms all have chase. smart bankers. convenient tools. one bank with the power of both. chase. make more of what's yours. (woman) oh. oh! hi there. you're jonathan, right? the 995 plan! yes, from colonial penn. your 995 plan fits my budget just right. excuse me? aren't you jonathan from tv, that 995 plan?

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organizations including nbc news now divan demanding that they get access to congressional records that kevin mccarthy assured exclusively on fox news. mccarthy reportedly gave private previously unavailable video footage from the january 6th riots to tucker carlson. joining me now, tim heaphy. former federal prosecutor and former lead investigator on the january six committee. tim, i'm awful glad to have you here. let's get into this because as you know, fox news says mccarthy gave them access to the 44,000 hours of video. first of, all does that sound

plausible to you, and of, so why were those videos all those hours excluded from the committee's report? is there danger, is there a security risk involved in releasing them? >> yes, alex. thanks for having. me absolutely. that is more than we got. i believe the number that the committee was given was more limited than that. we got several days of footage and access to all that footage. but we had very careful constraints on access to that information for security concerns. we had a dedicated terminal in our space. we had password protected access for only a handful of staff. and, importantly, before we used any of the footage, any of the capitol police surveillance camera footage, we had a discussion with capitol police about whether disclosure of that particular clip would jeopardize institutional security. they very jealously guard to

the location of these multiple cameras that they have over the capitol complex. and the revelation of those locations makes it easier to circumvent that surveillance and makes the place harder to defend. so for that, reason we are very careful about that use of that information. and at times changed our decisions about what you use, how much she, use or what angle she used to commune accommodate the security concerns. >> you are telling me that tucker carlson has more access to the video, the secure video in the u.s. capital than even you and that committee had? >> i don't know what he has access to. all i know is what i have seen in the brass. to be clear, we were told we can't have anything. so it wasn't as if anything was screen from us. but, we again, because of the legitimate guns concerns voiced by the capitol police, we picked the stuff that we thought was most relevant. we looked at everything for

january 6th, then for a day or two before, a little bit after. but then in terms of use of that, public disclosure of that, we worked very closely with the capitol police to reach an accommodation that used the stuff that was important and relevant and informed our findings but did not unduly jeopardize their security concerns for the capitol complex. that is a negotiated issue, and i don't know whether the access that the speaker has given to fox has any such restriction on the use, subsequent use of the footage. >> wow. okay, let's talk about the doj's investigation into the january 6th events. it appears to be gaining momentum because of just the last few days, we have heard about the efforts to get mike pence, jared kushner, ivanka trump, all of them in front of a federal grand jury. your committee got two out of these three. what do you make of these developments. >> i think they are predictable, alex. look. the department justice is going

to try to identify any source of relevant information before making a decision. and they frankly have some leverage that we don't tab. a criminal grand jury subpoena arguably overcomes privilege assertions that a congressional subpoena does not. and i think they are litigating those issues now. so, jack smith and his team are being very thorough as they should be. they are looking for information from every possible. source all the way up to the people most directly involved in closest to the president himself, and they are going to go through that process and it will inform decisions about possible criminal charges. so none of this is surprising to me at all that they withstood issue subpoenas to be folks very close to the former president. that is what a thorough investigator. does >> tell me what you learned from ivanka and jared? those two with whom you are able to speak. >> ivanka and jared pretty early after the election were

making plans to move to florida. they were looking at schools for their kids, and potential residences. we were told by lots of other witnesses that they were part of team normal, let's call it. bill stepien the campaign manager for the trump campaign divided the post election world into team crazy and team normal. and the team normal folks were the ones that were realistic about the lack of election fraud in the fact that the administration was ending. and we were told repeatedly by others that ivanka endured were sort of on that side. and they confirmed that they accepted what bill barr said. that there was no evidence of election fraud. that the administration with and. they were very focused on finishing the work of the administration. that was an important that was important, people close to the president that we're moving on. postelection we have lengthy interviews with both. six or eight hours with each separately. and you saw some of that in our hearings. but the whole transcripts are available. it was very important to us, alex, that all of our work.

not just the snippet that are in the report, but all of it, we made public so the people couldn't accuse us of sort of cherry-picking good facts and ignoring. that it is on the record. you can read every word of our conversations with jared and ivanka. >> then let's take a look at the former vice president because mike pence said this to my colleague ali vitale. about all of this, here is. that parc >> the idea of subpoenaing of former president to testify in court against the president i believe is unprecedented in america. but as i said last, week i believe it is also unconstitutional. >> okay, he believes it is unconstitutional. what would be the checks and balances process for a president. is it even unconstitutional in your opinion and what you have studied? i mean, he was called. >> no. absolutely. not to first of, all it what is

interesting about that clip is that he says he is being called to testify against the former president. that is just inaccurate. he is being called to provide information about an attack on the u.s. capitol. that is not for against anyone. this is not a partisan proceeding. this is the department justice trying to get relevant information about what happened. there's very little precedent about speech and debate clause and some of the arguments that he and his lawyers have made that i assume will be adjudicated quickly. again, the department of justice can take this to the chief judge of the district who will adjudicate privileges surgeons promptly. we did not have that ability. we were not able to get the chief judge of the district as in a criminal proceeding doing to adjudicate criminal proceedings. we got a criminal process which took weeks and months and lawyers knew that and therefore we're able to delay appearance before us. so this is going to be resolved quickly. his speech and debate argument will be resolved quickly. and and, again, the department justice understandably is

pushing for that information. not four or against anyone, but because it is directly relevant to their destination. >> we all know that your committee, tim, made criminal referrals against donald trump on obstruction, conspiracy, false statement, assisting an insurrection. do you expect donald trump to be indicted? . yes >> based on the evidence that we found, there is clear evidence of the violation of those criminal defenses that you have on your screen. very early in the investigation we found substantial evidence that the president and others had the specific intent to corruptly obstruct, influence, or impede of official proceeding. the official proceeding being the joint session. a conspiratorial conduct. and unless there is something inconsistent in the stuff we didn't get. things that are behind a privilege assertion, which i don't expect, then absolutely. the attorney general has said he will follow the facts in the law. and if he does, that i have

seen those facts. then an indictment is likely. coming >> if an indictment does not come down, tim, where do you think the breakdown might be? yes you have just given the caveat of certain things don't prove to be sustainable, but you are pretty confident that they are. so, how would he not be indicted? >> yeah, again, there are things that we didn't get. there are direct communications with the president to which we didn't have access. and i suppose there could be some sculptor information there. i'd be surprised. that but, there will be a more fulsome record that informs this decision than the record that we were able to develop. i think we got really important evidence, really close to the president information about events, action,, inaction that bears directly upon the issue of intent on the other issues at stake. so, again, alex. barring something really surprising and unforeseen, i think that evidence leads to

criminal charges. >> tim, let me ask you about the four person of that special grand jury that is investigating the efforts to overturn georgia's election results. who says, indictments were recommended against more than a dozen people. yes this was after the fact that the gradually proceedings have wrapped up, that said, who do you think is most likely in jeopardy here, and have you as a prosecutor, former prosecutor, ever heard anything like this. a person saying publicly, something so profound. do you worry about any potential effect, negative impacts on indictments? >> yes. so, this is a little strange because in georgia they have the special grand jury to step process. the foreperson that has been publicly speaking out is not the foreperson of a criminal grand jury with the authority to issue charges, but rather special grand jury who's tasked with finding faxon issuing a report. and that report, according to

the foreperson, is recommended criminal charges. i think that means that now, the second grand jury, a criminal grand jury in fulton county's consider those charges and will get an, almost assuredly based on the facts issue and diamonds. i don't believe that the foreperson has said anything that would constitute internal committee deliberations. but, again it is a special grand jury not a criminal grand jury. so i don't know that is going to affect anything the long. room it is unusual, but so is the process of subsequent grand jury. but, alex we keep talking about the same thing. that core fact here that we are presented in georgia, that our committee gathered and presented at the hearings of the special counsel is now evaluating in the view of that committee as evidenced by recommendations constitute violations of criminal law and therefore probably in georgia and washington we are going to see criminal charges. >> tim hate the, and an excellent. discussion thank you so much bring it to. as i look forward to seeing you again. much appreciated. >> meantime, a weather story

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may cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. ask your asthma specialist about a nunormal with nucala. >> wild weather story is unfolding in california right now. the los angeles area is bracing for flash flooding after seeing snow, higher elevations could see up to two feet of snow. let's take a look at what it looked like yesterday in tone paths. snow plows busy at work. gosh, i don't even know they have those in southern california. anyway, heading to the north montealvo that is east of san francisco looking a bit more like well, something the might matter more there. let's go to david griffin who's joining us from southern california but it looks like a rushing los angeles river. welcome, dana. what is it looking like they're? >> alex, thanks for having. the i know you are from the l.a. area. and i am pretty sure you are in

as much disbelief as a lot of people who live. here that flash flood warning is still in effect as rain is expected throughout most of the day. this is actually the first time that i have seen it kind of have this lull right now. this is been going on for 30 minutes. but more rain is expected. behind, me this is a river corridor that is usually bone-dry. but as you can, see the l.a. river is now flowing through. i can see a lot that just passes. and this is helping to divert some of this water out of the area. >> in historic west coast winter blast. whipping winds up to 75 miles per hour. it's the first blizzard warning ever for the san bernardino county mountains. some cars covered in at least a foot of snow. sunny san diego followed suit with its first blizzard warning in history. the golden states uncharacteristic whether carry creating hazardous whiteout conditions.

about 45 miles east of bakersfield, this big rig had to be towed after going over a highway in bank mint. this was the scene friday morning on highway 17 in the santa cruz mountain. >> multiple trees, downed multiple vehicle. stuck >> in venice, hail pummeled these tennis players. >> it is hail on the court. >> in napa county, multiple spin outs on highway 29, leaving driveways and drivers in disbelief. >> it can go deep. is >> in the bay area, fremont peak turned into a winter wonderland for hikers. the grapevine freeway that extends from los angeles county to the san juan king valley, shut down for hours friday because of dangerous snowy conditions. >> i haven't seen any snow since the late 50s when i was a kid. >> it snowed in hollywood and i made a snowball and the proof is the hollywood side in the back. >> los angeles county is now bracing for flash flooding after receiving snow in an estimated 2 to 3 inches of rain.

multiple vehicles here, submerged on interstate five. heavier snow fell in the sierra as many came out to see the rare winter weather, leaving behind snow that will soon melt assist or moves on. >> and, alex, the system is expected to dump more heavy snow and bring blizzard-like conditions in the mountains, possibly leaving at additional foot of snow in the sierra nevada. alex? >> my, friend you have let reddit me speechless. we will just wrap it up right. there thank you very much, dana. coming up next, is he lying or telling the truth? the testimony that had a lot of people glued to their tv this. weak and how self and evidence has become a key part of this case. >> do you know what do you knowa

let's go now to the trial that has called this nations attention this week. alex murdaugh, a prominent south carolina attorney took the stand for a second day facing off with a lead prosecutor. murdaugh is accused of killing his wife and son.

earlier, a large crowd gathered outside that courthouse as onlookers trying to get a seat in the courtroom. east palestine or residents are filing a class action lawsuit against norfolk southern. we'll get to that is. well nbc's katie becca has been covering this trial and has the very latest. we're >> in the hot seat for a second, day alex murdaugh facing a blistering cross examination. the second that you are confronted with facts that you can't deny, you mediately come up with a new lie. isn't that correct? >> i would disagree with that proposition that you are putting out. >> prosecutors hitting hard on murdaugh timeline inconsistencies on the night of the murders, and murdaugh pushing back in his own defense, even becoming combative when challenged on his memory finding his wife's body. >> you dang rachel remember what lyle went to her and for what reason. >> because the only thing you're concerned about is yourself >> answering some

questions with clear certainty, addressing his 20 year addiction to opioids, admitting he had pills in his pocket even as he spoke to investigators the night of the murders. >> so you are taken 60 a day, or something? that >> there were days when i took more than that. they were days and i took less than that. >> and at other times, appearing on study. struggling with answers about why, after he returned from the candles to the house close to the time of the murders, his phone was tracking 70 steps a minute as he was placing several phone calls in a row. >> pierre not on a treadmill? >> not even. admiral >> talking in. place >> prosecutors replaying interviews, statements that murdaugh now admits relies. >> other than lying to them about going to be candle, i was cooperative in every aspect of this investigation. >> very cooperative except for maybe the most important fact of all. that you are at the murder scene with the victims just

minutes before they died. >> in a brief redirect, murdaugh's defense team pointing to phone data showing megaphone, which was thrown by the roadside, was never moving in sync with alex at any point after the murders. murdaugh, again denying he is a killer. >> if i was under the pressure that they are talking about here, i can promise you i would hurt myself. before i would heard one of them. >> we expect to hear several more witnesses on the stand at the beginning of next week. and then the closing arguments and the case goes to the jury. keep in mind this jury has heard a mountain of evidence from over 60 witnesses, so it's tough to say just how long these deliberations will take. >> all, right katie. back thank you for that report. joining me now is my msnbc colleague and host of the katie phang show, katie phang. katie, welcome my friend. so, as a former prosecutor, give me your immediate reaction

to all of that first cross examination by the prosecutor. they were killing him about lying to authorities that he had not been out the crime scene when he had. >> yeah, alex, it is so good to be with. you, look the critical issue that you are always going to be confronted with as a juror is, part of your duty is to determine the credibility and the trustworthiness of any witness that appears in court during the course of the trial. i like murdaugh immediately, on direct examination took the stand and look the jury in the face and, said i've been. lying i've been lying for 20 months plus to not only investigators, but family and the community at large when i denied being present at the scene of the crime within minutes of the double homicides occurring. i don't know about you, alex, but somebody falling on the sword sometimes could be construed as, you know what, he is owning up to a lie. the problem for alec murdaugh's, his entire life was built on lies. stealing from clients, cheating his law partners, having a drug addiction where he was lying about the extent of his addiction. i, mean that the guy's life is

completely a lie. and so now he is asking a jury to say, okay we'll forgive you for that but we will you know it will also believe when you say that you didn't kill your wife and your son. but of course, alex, at the end of the day, the prosecution has to prove the motive and that motive is still kind of up in the air. is it worth it to your wife and your son to be a lot of the financial president pressures that you have? >> a couple. things beyond a reasonable doubt, correct? i mean, does this jury have to be unanimous in a guilty verdict? >> yes. and so, it is beyond into the exclusion of every reasonable doubt. and everybody gets hung up on the idea that it is any reasonable doubt. but it is reasonable. so if you are a member of the jury, your job has to be reasonable. i cannot be grounded in some far affection or some type of fantastical idea. but, because this is a criminal case, there has to be a unanimous verdict from all the jurors. >> so, how risky of a move was it for murdaugh to take the stand. i, mean what you have witnessed, could it help him?

he has remained pretty calm. he's clearly using his own lawyer skills on the stand. that has appeared to have frustrated the prosecutor at times. i, mean how might the jury react to him. you talk about falling on the sword. but could it be like, look, this dude was high on drugs. he admits he's got this opioid addiction. could that have affected his cognitive abilities? could that factor in his defense? >> i mean, intoxication as a defense because he was high on drugs. i mean, look, alex. you pointed out something that was really important is the second. ago alec murdaugh was an accomplished trial lawyer. if there is anybody who knows the ins and outs of a courtroom, it's alex murdaugh. you also know that, as there is that old saying, doctors make the worst patients. attorneys make the worst clients, right? i mean, i'm sure his attorneys counseled him. there is a mountain of evidence against you. and so they are just trying to play authenticity stuff. but, you know, alex.

it got really old. this paw paw this in the dog this in the chicken that. it was a little bit to down home good home southern boy kind of thing that was going. on and you have to presume that jury is going to look at him and say, you know, what are you really crying crocodile tears? are you really upset that your family is gone? or more importantly, are you upset because you've been caught? >> here's the thing, towards the end of testimony yesterday, you heard the prosecutor go through a litany of names. asking him, did you ever lied of this person? he had to admit, yes. did you lie to this person, did you lie to this person, did you lie to this. person yes, yes, yes. how powerful was that at the end of the day? leading into a weekend. i mean, those are going to be the thoughts. that is going to be the last thing that brings in the years of the jurors over this weekend. >> exactly. you are going to have jurors that are going into this weekend, hearing the defendant himself who is on trial. and he is looking at a mandatory minimum of 30 years in prison in south carolina for these murders up until life without parole. he is admitting that he is a liar. so the jury's are saying, alex, well when is he lying.

is he lying now or was he lying then? i mean, anybody who so easily casually lies like alex murdaugh, really makes you, it gives you cause for to say, i don't really know if i can trust a dismantling the truth. and one last thing quickly, alex, jurors may get insulted that this man took the stand in his own defense. they may, say if he doesn't play me for a full? i've seen all the evidence that's been presented, i know this guy as a known professor, and now he's taking the stand and he is trying to do me. on. and you make it a guilty verdict of just. that >> okay, katie phang. thank you so. much and for all of you, inviting you to watch the katie phang show every weekend at eight eastern, right here on msnbc. it's a darn great show. a good way to start your weekend. marjorie taylor greene's national divorce talk, who is buying into this and why your comments are problematic now more than ever. more than ever

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to see in america as a civil war. nobody wants, that at least everyone i know would never want. that but it is going that direction. and we have to do something about it. >> new outrage this weekend's marjorie taylor greene refuses to back down from her proposal for a national divorce. this week, the georgia republican caused a stir when she tweeted, we need to separate by red states in blue states. and shrink the federal government. a number of new op-eds pushback on the idea saying, marjorie taylor greene completes her divorce from reality. never mind marjorie taylor greene's national divorce. joining me now, it setmayer, senior visor for a lincoln project western scarlet uva center politics and former gop congressional communications director. and alencia johnson, political strategist, former senior adviser for president biden's 2020 campaign and chief impact officer of ten 63 west broad. we are going to get into this now starting with you, tara. because in this new congress, marjorie taylor greene is not just some far-right outlier.

she is part of the house majority and a member of the homeland security committee. so, while her nonsensical rhetoric isn't anything new, is it concerning because of her role now? we >> absolutely. we have been screaming from the rooftops about. that she went from someone who was excoriated and admonished and stripped of her committees to being someone on the homeland security that actually has power and access and is responsible for the protection of the united states. now calling basically for secession, which last time i checked, the confederacy lost. so, she is over here now as a confederate want to be, advocating for civil war. whether she says she is or isn't, that is what secession is. and i suggest that people like kevin mccarthy, who reportedly in the new york times said that if you are in a fight in a foxhole, that marjorie taylor greene's who thought next to him. well, i guess that fight would be a civil war. because really, there's nothing short of. that this is insanity. and very dangerous rhetoric.

the republican party, when it was founded was to fight against secession. during, prior to the civil war. abraham lincoln, who the lincoln project is named after is very specific appeals against secession. i suggest that republicans get rid of their putin tucker talking points and maybe pick up some speeches by president lincoln back in 1861. like a special session of congress where he talks about how secession would destroy the world's only democracy at the. time and how it would demonstrate that a government of formed by the people is impossible. is that where we are now? because that seems to be what marjorie taylor greene, and now the mainstream republican party. because i haven't heard the bladder bucher. apparently that is what they believe now. i think that is dangerous, and i don't believe. that i don't believe that that is where the country is going. if we fight back against. it >> point well taken there. but, there are people taking this proposal seriously. the twitter hashtags civil war, that was trending. people were reacting to green and finding that way. can this be effectively

countered and shut down? in fact, my colleague joy reid says, a national divorce would destroy red states. saying, economically it wouldn't be a fair fight. what are your thoughts on that? >> well, i agree with the very intelligent joy and read that it wouldn't even be a fair fight. to your point on what would counter, that's what would counter this is republican leadership not rewarding agree just behavior like this of marjorie taylor greene. we know that the comments that she made leading up to the january 6th insurrection actually fueled a lot of that violence. and instead of being reprimanded, instead of being pulled from her leadership positions, or even told to not run against the congress, she has been rewarded with leadership positions in this congress, in the republican party, and she is now the new face of the republican party. so, no matter what republicans try to do with, this this is where they are going and they are okay with this. and now we have seen the rise of white nationalist violence. we have seen how social media has actually fueled more of

these conversations, that actually do lead to real violence. and the reality is, she has made it clear and people start actually attacking people who have different ideological beliefs which we have seen all over the country. when people start using this, rhetoric we can pinpoint that right back to marjorie taylor greene. >> do you think we are going to hear from kevin mccarthy on this or any other republicans, terry you first, then you. lindsey you both are shaking your head. no >> i'm not really my breath, alex. let's be honest, he signed the embargo in with the marjorie taylor greene maga republicans in order to get the speakership. he sold his. sal and it is obvious, it is evident by what he is. that he's given a glowing grace. and he knows that he can survive unless it gives him. happy but my friend peter winner senators pieces week that the republican party now has room for not only seditionist but secessionists now because you have the crazy and the cowardice. and that is who makes up the mainstream publican party. and this is an example just didn't start with marjorie taylor greene. it's been bubbling up for quite

sometime. >> last word to you. any other republicans expected out against this? >> i don't unfortunately the reality is, as with anything, the blood is on their hands whether or not they say anything. >> tara setmayer, valencia, thank you so much. appreciate. about the fight over january six footage is taking a new turn. the latest from capitol hill, coming right at the top of the hour. p of the hour hour and homemade barbeque sauce. they're called 'small businesses.' but to the people who build them there's nothing 'small' about them. that's why at t-mobile for business... you'll save more than $1,000 versus verizon. and with price lock guarantee, we'll never raise your rate plan. so you can keep your focus on toe-turns and making sure the sauce is extra spicy. at t-mobile, there are no small businesses. ♪♪

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