♪♪ good day. i'm chris jansing live at msnbc headquarters in new york city. right now ron desantis is doing everything he can to look like a presidential candidate short of actually launching a campaign. nbc news has just learned his team is considering making stops at a number of critical early primary states in the coming weeks. and with two big gatherings of conservatives coming, the split in the party is on full display including the gop event where donald trump isn't welcome. plus, the incredibly high-stakes supreme court hearing on the biden administration's attempt to wipe out nearly half a trillion dollars worth of student loans. one justice pressing the solicitor general on why that's not an abuse of presidential power. and the white house receiving federal dollars as they try to

solve the problem of million of moms out there with the lack of affordable child care. how businesses may be part of the solution coming up. but we begin with the battle for the soul of the republican party amid new signs of momentum for ron desantis. his book, hitting number one just hours after going on sale, but also new signs of the challenge he and the rest of the potential republican field face. a poll out showing donald trump holding a 20-point lead. all of that coming ahead of two conservative events that will demonstrate the choice the party has ahead of it. one for cpac bound tightly to the maga crowd and the club for growth which mostly severed ties with the former president. while trump headlines cpac in d.c. nearly every republican hopeful will be at the donor

retreat in florida, ron desantis, mike pence, estimate cot, trump very pointedly wasn't even invited there. but anyone ready to declare the end of the trump era needs to take a look at this new morning poll. it shows donald trump with 48%. that's more than desantis, pence and haley combined. so lots to talk about and bring in capitol hill correspondent ali vitali and charlie sykes, an msnbc political analyst. so, charlie, you were quite colorfully writing that when cpac convenes you'll sooner find a golden statue of trump than a conservative prince many. i ask, are we just seeing republicans shift away from cpac because of the sexual assault allegations against its leader or is this a larger shift away from trump and the maga crowd in general? >> well, it's clearly a split between the crazies and the

normies in the party but more a separation than a complete divorce. i think everybody needs to be reminded that the future of the republican party is not going to be decided by the donors or by these organizations, it's going to be decided by the republican primary voters and your poll just showed where they are at the moment. but, you know, cpac has clearly been trending in this direction for some time. it's been notoriously known as the "star wars" bar scene of the conservative movement and it has become more extreme under matt, more part of the entertainment wing and less substantive. this is a rather dramatic contrast between what's happening at cpac and what's happening at the club for growth and it wasn't that long ago that it would have been inconceivable for someone like mike pence or ron desantis to simply say, no, i'm not going to cpac so something is going on. what it is is not exactly clear at the moment. >> it's kind of tough to top,

ali, when somebody throws out the "star wars" bar scene but i know you'll give it the ole college try. look, desantis is looking more and more like a candidate, talk about what we're just learning that he's up to. >> reporter: yeah, look, he's doing the things that we would expect candidates at this point to do, and largely that means that he's meeting with donor, huddling with them over the weekend. he's plotting trips across the country. most recently he was in new york. he'll also go to chicago and then also follow that up with some close doors stops with republican state parties in texas and alabama. before then going to california, that's part of his book tour and there's going to be other stops associated with that too but i think what caught my attention is that he's got this book out about a blueprint of florida blueprint for america. that's why his advisers and frankly desantis himself says

he's so focused on the florida legislature session because it allows him to bolster his credentials, foundations and what he runs on for president if he makes that decision. now, the other thing that caught my attention and you mentioned this are new reporting that a source familiar confirms to me that the desantis team is mulling trips to states that most people who want to be president tend to go to. that's iowa, new hampshire, nevada, maybe even south carolina, so clearly this is coming together in a very unofficial capacity even as something official probably comes more towards the summer, 9 month i keep hearing is june, chris. >> yet, charlie, this poll shows us donald trump still has a firm grasp on the republican electorate, right? i mean maybe let's say even beyond firm and for years we talked about how republican leaders waited to see what the voters would do and maybe they follow them. are the voters speaking or is it way, way, way too early to talk like that? >> well, it is early, but i

think that you are seeing the dynamic, look, i mean, one of the key things to understand if you have a diagram of supporters, there's a lot of overlap. there have been surveys that asked trump supporters who is your acceptable second choice and they largely say desantis. same thing with desantis. this is why this is the race to watch. this is why donald trump has been attacking desantis because he understands that desantis poses the greatest threat to him because as desantis rises, it is likely by taking votes away from donald trump. and so you are seeing ron desantis taking all of these steps that look like he's running for president. what we don't know, two thing, number one, how does he scale up? how does ron desantis go from governor of florida to a presidential candidate and how will he react to donald trump's attacks? does he have a glass jar and there are some republicans who think you can defeat donald trump without ever saying his name. without ever answering him back.

i think that's naive so what we don't know is what's going to happen? what happens when these two engage with one another when ron desantis, if he's ever willing to fire back at donald trump, what will the reaction of the base be and that's a complete question mark at the moment. >> and i think it's the key question, ali. when i was reading the fantastic summary you and other folks in our late night d.c. unit wrote about what's in this book, one line struck me in particular and it's this, speaking of desantis, it's a talented student ready to take on the mantel however reluctant his mentor is to give it to him. so far it's sort of been a one-sided fight at least verbally, but where is the expectation of where this might be going? >> reporter: yeah, chris, when you talk about what i wrote in our note overnight that's my sense after reading this book, because at nowhere in the 2 8

pages is there an outright criticism of trump. there are more than 100 mentions of him throughout those roughly 288 or so pages, but never does desantis take him on directly and i will attempt to match charlie for "star wars." i don't know if you want to call it yoda and skywalker or skywalker and vader but at a certain point only one of them is going to be able to continue. maybe more voldemort and harry potter but at the end of the day charlie is right, i think, because you have to be the last person standing. you can't be the person standing alongside trump. that's not how you win the nomination. at a certain point they will have to go at hem. what the book does is answer a question of how desantis might try to do that without alienating the package ga base and by making himself look like he's his own governor, he's his own policymaker in the state of florida. he details ways he was able to get more aid for floridians in a faster way because of his

relationship with trump. he's really trying to show, i think, he is an adept political student who previously has benefited from trumpism and sees why this happened in the first place in 2016. but also making it seem that almost by accident and almost called to this moment he is now the best person to lead and you contrast that with the way former south carolina governor nikki haley is trying to make this a generational argument and pence making it a stylistic leadership argument. each rising to do kind of the same-sail but different going at trump but not directly. >> ali and charlie, love having you both on the program. love all of those references. appreciate you. i'm a baby yoda fan myself but that's for another yoda day. we're following the supreme court hearing, those arguments on two cases on the campaign promise to forgive student loan

debt. six republican-led states are suing the biden administration arguing that the president doesn't have the authority to erase school debt, that it's up to congress. and in department of education v. brown two who weren't eligible say the government broke the rules when they rolled out the program by not giving them a chance to comment. msnbc political analyst and politico's white house bureau chief jonathan lemire will break it down for us in a moment. but first lindsey reiser is here with me in the studio. so many millions literally of people on pins and needles. >> yep. >> waiting to see what the decision is here. help us understand how we got here and what's at stake. >> this is who qualify, borrowers of federal loans would get forgiven $10,000, $20,000 if you're a pell grant recipient but here are the income requirements for individuals making up to $125,000 or for households making up to

$250,000. chris, this was first proposed on the campaign trail in 2019. senator elizabeth warren proposed forgiving up to $50,000 of student loan debt. candidate biden then trailed after that about a year later suggesting a minimum of $10,000 forgiveness. then we had the pandemic and part of the c.a.r.e.s. act that president trump signed paused student repayment and accrual of interest. that was from president biden has august. then the arguments in the supreme court. here's a look at the national debt and how it's broken up among families. mortgages makes up the lion's share, number two -- >> this is incredible. i don't think most would know -- we know the biggest amount of money anybody ever spends is usually on a house, but student loan. >> this is how ubiquitous it is. we look at the debt, 207, the amount was half a trillion and now it is 1.634 trillion.

this is why the white house says this is needed. this is the graph right now showing the trajectory of the cost of a four-year public university. this is how pell grant values have relatively remained stagnant then what real people are saying. we have lisa brown of north carolina, i'm going to struggle until the day i die with this debt. another one, brianna, how am i supposed to plan on having kids and pay for their future but then the opposition, senator john thune saying not one penny is being canceled or forgivening, it's being transferred from the 13% of people who don't have debt to the 87% that does not. >> you have people arguing, i paid off my debt. why should somebody else get it forgiven? that's part of the argument for the republicans here, we're just going to have to wait and see. fascinating stuff, lindsey. jonathan, the implications of this ruling from the 2024 race. let me start on the democratic side. what would a win mean for joe biden for his administration and

if the court rules against this, could it energize the democratic base that's concerned for a lot of other reasons, frankly, about a conservative supreme court? >> yeah, the white house is, of course, watching today's hearing, arguments with extreme interest and there's been some reporting that the judges voiced a lot of skepticism about the legality of the administration's plan so we shouldn't rush to conclusions but may not be a good sign for the west wing but you are right. they think this is a winning political issue, now, of course, they also will say they believe in it on the merits and think this is the right thing to do, good thing for americans particularly the working class who stand to benefit the most but political upside, of course. if it becomes law you will see the number of people, number of voters across the democratic party be energized and excited and maybe in 2024 want to reward the democratic party and president biden with more votes and conversely as you just

hinted, if it goes the other way, and if this is struck down and the president is ruled not to have the legal ability to do it, it could inflame voters that much farther. might there be anger at the biden administration for not keeping a promise, yes, it could. aides are concerned but think it will be outweighed by frustration with the supreme court the american people believe are out of step with values. polling would suggest how the american views the right to choose versus what the supreme court did by striking down roe versus wade last year and this would be yet another example of that. >> yeah, and i wonder if it works again the way that, you know, it has in the past that the supreme court has suddenly become such a flash point in these elections because conversely on the republican side and i'm looking at these great quotes that lindsey picked out. look at senator joni ernst, if we were canceling student loans as president biden continues to claim we the people would not be paying for it.

senator mitch mcconnell calls the student loan socialism. slap in the face to every family who sacrificed to save for college. do they think they have a winning issue here as well? >> i think there are some americans who do feel that if they were to not benefit from this, if they look around and see that others had portions of their debt forgiven and they don't, sure, i think that there would be perhaps some resentment and anger there, but i think there would be others, of course, who would feel exactly the opposite who say, look, this is, you know, the debt is crippling, the college payment system is out of whack right now with what the average american can afford and a little bit of a help up particularly among people who have not benefited much in the past would be appreciated. so this is a tricky one and does play down party lines to be clear, but polling does suggest that on the whole it's more popular with americans and that's what the biden white house is banking on and also, of

course, just bigger picture, also the issue of executive power here, another thing up for debate, you know, whether the president of the united states who we're seeing here get off marine one about to head to virginia for an event on health care and other efforts to help out the working class, that if the president -- if he's found to not have the ability to do it it would limit the ability for this president and future presidents going forward and as we know, chris, every presidential election at least somewhat is about the ability to appoint future justices to the supreme court, so far this president only has one. but were he to get another four years, the odds are he would have chances for more. >> jonathan, good timing with this live picture of the president, as you say, heading off marine one getting on to air force one. thank you, lindsey, absolutely fascinating stuff and we'll keep a close eye at what's happening

at the supreme court. another emotional day at the alex murdaugh murder trial as the prosecution calls new witnesses to the stand. we're at the white house. ron desantis strips disney of its self-governing status and taking on big corporations is taking on big corporations and culture wars, a smart strategy or a risky one? the u.s. marshal service suffers a security breach. the information compromised ahead. you're watching "chris jansing reports" only on msnbc. coming t, it's a learning opportunity. come on in. [ chuckles ] the more, the merrier. paris, huh? bonjour! we got any out-of-towners in the elevator? tom. it is not easy. 10th floor, huh? must be a heck of a view. okay, see how everyone else is facing this way? progressive can't save you from becoming your parents, but we can save you money when you bundle home and auto with us. okay, that was terrible. okay, let's hang back. we're gonna try that again. my husband and i have never been more active.

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more fireworks on day 25 of the highly watched alex murdaugh double murder trial. the defense intensely questioning a prosecution rebuttal witness. former law partner ronnie crosby. he testified murdaugh stole millions from his own firm. >> are you angry at him for stealing your money? >> i have no feeling one way or the other. >> you don't have any feeling about alex murdaugh betraying you and stealing your money? you're -- i admire you. i don't know that i could look beyond that. >> objection, your honor. >> nbc's ellison barber is outside the courthouse and joined by lisa ruben. what happened as the prosecution is calling its final witnesses? >> reporter: we've heard from a few witnesses today but let's go further on that witness who you played a sound bite from.

he says he's known alex murdaugh since the '90s. he was a law partner of his. they have worked together closely. there was a tense exchange between crosby and the defense attorney dick harpootlian where he kept pressing him saying you have to be so angry that alex murdaugh stole all of this money from you that he looked at you and lied for so many years. ronnie crosby said he had experienced anger but said he did not have it anymore. listen. >> you are not angry with alex murdaugh? >> i have had anger with him, extreme anger because of what he did to my law firm, my partners, my client, his clients, our clients, what he did to his family, what he's did to so many people, yes, i experienced a lot of anger. but you can't walk around with anger. you have to find a way to deal with it and move forward and i have done that and if you

suggest you are dead wrong if you think i told this jury something because of money, we're talking about two people who were brutally murdered, then you're headed in the wrong direction. >> reporter: so you hear just some of the emotion in his voice. he was frustrated by the fact that the defense was seeming to imply that he was testifying against alex murdaugh because he was so angry that he had stolen money from him for so many years and lied rather for so many years, you heard him there maintaining that that wasn't what motivated him, instead of saying he forgave him he said he simply felt nothing when it comes to alex murdaugh. chris. >> ah, lisa, that exchange, i don't know, does it make the -- let's just see we're seeing it out of context but certainly seems like a believable witness. he wasn't having any of it. >> he does and harpootlian was definitely trying to shake

crosby. he was trying to get that flash of anger from him that in some respects the prosecution got out of murdaugh himself last week and he didn't get it. he got maybe exactly what the prosecution wanted which is enough emotion to make him seem credible and human but not so much he seemed like a hot-headed person motivated solely by anger at his former law partner as opposed to having the truth come out. >> we heard from the doctor who performed the autopsy and disputed the findings from the defense. tell us what she had to say. >> reporter: so when you have the defense pathologist take the stand he questioned a lot of the findings in the original autopsy questioning blood spatter and trajectory claiming what the original autopsy and the state pathologist said was an exit wound was actually a contact wound which would imply that a shooter was in a different position than the prosecution had argued prior. she pushed back very aggressively on that and

defended her work repeatedly saying that she stands by her original report saying that the gunshot wound on paul murdaugh's head was an exit wound. she said that is because of the wounds that are on his neck and shoulder. she also in very graphic detail told the jury that in her view, there is no way that gunshot wound on the back of his head could be a contact wound from a gunshot. she said i know what you have seen is horrific, but if that was true, if what the defense is claiming was true that that was the contact wound, the damage to paul murdaugh's face and skull, it would have been so much worse. chris. >> we've got 50 more minutes before they come back from a lunch break but they are indicating maybe one more witness. that's what everybody is waiting for is for the jurors to go to the scene of the crime. what are you going to be watching for? >> i'll be watching to see how carefully jurors are sort of looking at the distances between two places, right?

the prosecution has established a time line where we know that at 8:44, murdaugh took a cell phone video perhaps accidentally for about 50 seconds, the murders were allegedly committed minutes later. murdaugh says he was back in his bed. he then rose. he went to go visit his mother and so the jurors are going to be looking sort of how much distance is there between all of these things on the property, one of the complicating factors, chris, there are trees that are higher and bigger and denser than they were at the time of the crime and that may impact how the jury sees it as well but i'm reminded of the o.j. simpson trial where jurors famously also took a field trip and changes in the crime scene can be ones that impact how the jurors see a crime, so we shall see. >> it's a risk. lisa and ellison, thanks to both of you. in fact, in our next hour i'm going to be talking to a defense attorney who actually took a jury to a crime scene in another

very high-profile case. we've got a lot to talk to him about coming up in our next hour. the white house plan to get companies to provide affordable child care. we'll talk about it with someone working inside the c.h.i.p.s. program next. (vo) with verizon, you can now get a private 5g network. so you can do more than connect your business, you can make it even smarter. now ports can know where every piece of cargo is. and where it's going. (dock worker) right on time. (vo) robots can predict breakdowns and order their own replacement parts. (foreman) nice work. (vo) and retailers can get ahead of the fashion trend

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we've got breaking news out of the white house. announcing just moments ago that president biden will nominate julie su to be the next labor secretary. su is currently deputy labor secretary and would replace marty walsh set to leave to head up the nhl's players union. the white house called her a tested and experienced leer and a champion for workers. assuming she's confirmed su would be the second asian-american woman to lead the labor department following ee lay -- elaine chao. making a whopping $40 billion available to the makers of computer chips, but if those businesses want that cash they'll have to provide child care to employees. something that a lot of business leaders have been saying anyway that's necessary if they're going to hire the employees they need. according to a report, 45% of mothers with young children who

left the workforce during the covid-19 pandemic cited child care as a major reason for their departure. 35% of child care centers that shut down during the pandemic are still closed. supporters say it's a powerful way to leverage the funds included in the bipartisan c.h.i.p.s. act to empower workers. let's talk about it with adrienne elrod for the c.h.i.p.s. program. good to have you on the program, adrienne. so how is this new requirement going to work and how will it help address what everybody knows is a serious child care problem in this country. >> yeah, chris, thank you so much for having me on today. great to be back. as you noted first of all the c.h.i.p.s. act we just released the notice of funding opportunity today which means that leading edge and mature companies were open for business, you can apply for the funds but as part of that we wanted to make sure that child care components were part of

this and that means if you are receiving over $150 million whether you are a large-scale fab or a smaller supplier from this funding you have to provide some sort of child care component. what does this mean? we know this is not a one size fits all. some communiies that have robust child care facilities so maybe something as small as reimbursing for mileage or providing a stipe spend to your employees and some communities there are not enough child care facilities, in fact, as you noted, that is the case in many places across the united states. we feel that we are not being good stewards of taxpayer dollars here at the commerce department if we do not make sure we can fill these jobs, fill these with workers which means we need to knock down one of the most important barriers to getting people back into the workforce. that is providing child care access so, again, we we will rise this is not a one size fits all policy. that some companies may decide to provide child care on side

access. some may decide to do this in a different way. but we want to work with these companies to figure this out and we also want these companies to work with their local communities to also determine the best strategy going forward for their employees. >> let me give one example since you brought it up. it isn't one size fits all. your colleagues gave us this. in the syracuse area where micron announced a huge chipmaking last year the need for child care is nearly three times the size of the actual child care capacity in that region so how far could this go to alleviating the problem? how fast might these remedies take effect? could it, for example, be used to actually build a facility? >> yeah, absolutely. again, chris, we are working with companies and will be and politics to help them get to this place. we're also going to release a workforce development guide probably within the next week to ten days that lays out ideas and best practices that current companies are doing in the

united states. i'll also add, chris, tsmc, one of the largest fab producers in the world based in taiwan are also building a facility in arizona, they have been providing on-site child care access in to their employees in taiwan for quite some time and doing this because they have to get workers in these jobs. a lot of these jobs require odd hour, a lot of these jobs, you know, are very technical and simply cannot get the employees in those jobs to do that unless they provide child care access, so, yes, there's a lot of net benefits that come out of this. getting more women in the workforce is always a good thing but one of the large reasons woo i we're doing this because we are not being good stewards of taxpayer dollars if we can't fill the jobs in the fabs we're putting all this money to. >> adrienne elrod, i'm sure there are other folks who want me to ask questions about when it's going to come to the business near them but we'll save that for another day. thanks for being on the program. appreciate it. >> thanks, chris. desantis versus disney.

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so clothes look newer, longer. feel the difference with downy. governor ron desantis isn't shy about putting the culture war center stage in florida doing it again on monday by signing a bill to revoke disney's special self-governing status and while he insists the decision was all about fairness, he has also made it clear that the company's so-called woke agenda and their opposition to his don't say gay bill did play a part. >> you clearly had a movement within the corporation itself, of course, burbank, california, based elements of it that said it's their job or it's their goal to inject a lot of this sexuality into the programming for young kids. those are not the values that we want to promote in the state of florida. we want to promote the safety of

our students and the rights of our parents. we believe being joined at the hip with this one california-based company was not something that was justifiable or sustainable and so we said we're going to do something about it. >> i want to bring if phil rutger for "the washington post" and msnbc political analyst. so, let's talk about the risk/reward factor. what's the calculation that ron desantis is making here? >> well, chris, governor desantis over the last couple of years and especially in the last six months or so has tried to pick some of these cultural battles in florida as a way to communicate his own values to a national republican audience as he thinks about running for president, so this fight with disney is exhibit a but you can also look at his agenda on schools, on education, on the ap african american studies course. it's been one issue after another where he's tried to

stake out sort of ground, a position on the conservative right as a way to appeal to a national audience of sort of hard right republican voters who he knows will be so influential in a presidential primary next year. >> without a doubt but clearly as he touts this record in florida, he's done it in his book, he's been traveling, he's going to be traveling some more, i mean, if he got the nomination, then what? i mean, how does that set the facts help him win a presidency? >> well, look, i mean, it would be very difficult, i think, for him to win over more mainstream independent voters purely on this cultural agenda but i assume he will be looking to play up more palatable aspects of his record to point to the economy in the state of florida, to point to the way he's handled other aspects, you know, on his record as governor and really try to draw a contrast with

biden assuming biden seeks re-election. that's a contrast i know that the desantis people in the republican party generally are eager to try to frame for voters but the challenge for desantis is going to try to make himself appeal to the general election audience as more than just a cultural warrior. >> yeah, and challenge for many republicans. phil rucker, always good to see you, my friend. thank you for that. this is just in from capitol hill. some lawmakers brags about carrying guns in the capitol complex. the new letter that asks them to stop. ryan nobles has that exclusive report for us next. plus, the u.s. marshal service suffering a major security breach compromising sensitive information. details on that coming up. could a ban on tiktok, one of the world's most popular pastimes soon be on the way? that's coming up in our next hour.

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nbc's ryan nobles joins us now. so many questions. what do woo know about republicans carrying guns at the capitol? what do democrats want to happen here? >> reporter: yeah, so, chris, let's talk about the policy here on capitol hill. basically all 535 members of both the house and senate whether they're republican or democrat are not required to go through any kind of security screening in order to get into the capitol complex. they can just walk by there, in fact, even the people they are traveling with in their party are often not required to go through these security screenings. now, it is the rule on capitol hill that you cannot have a gun anywhere other than inside the personal office of a member, but because there is a lack of security screening there's no way to enforce that rule. and we talked to several republicans that have said that they believe they have their armed members of congress right now that are carrying guns on capitol hill, congressman matt gaetz in particular told me he actually feels safer knowing that his fellow republican

members or other members in general are carrying guns. well, not everyone feels that way including some democrats like california congressman jared hufman who has sent a letter to president biden asking that the next architect of the capitol vote on the capitol police board to essentially close this loophole, to require every member of congress to walk through a security screening to make sure that they're not carrying a firearm and complying with this rule that strictly states they cannot carry guns. this is a back and forth debate between republicans and democrats. there was a pretty animated conversation that took place this a congressional hearing not too long ago where democrats attempted to keep in an amendment that said firearms were not allowed inside the committee meetings and republicans pushed back. it is a mute point, chris, unless this loophole is closed and we talked to former capitol police officers who say this just maybes their job more difficult. not knowing specifically whether or not anyone who passes by

these security screenings without having to go through the metal detectors is carrying a weapon and makes their job more difficult. this is a debate that will continue on now as we wait to see who president biden appoints as the next architect of the capitol, chris. >> for folks who don't work on capitol hill and don't understand architect sounds like the person who built the capitol that has long since gone to that great architecture place in the sky, but what is the architect and what does he do? does he have that kind of authority? >> reporter: the architect to the capitol basically serves as the basically serves as the administrative head of everything that happens here on capitol hill. the way the buildings are laid out. the way people are able to go from one part of the complex to the other. the architect serves on the capitol police board along with the two sergeant of arms from the senate and the house. now that capitol police board is the body that essentially votes for and puts into place all the

security protocols on capitol hill and right now, the sergeant at arms on the senate is appointed by a democrat. the sergeant of arms at the house, appointed by a republican. this architect of the capitol, the new one, will be pinted by president biden and could be the deciding vote if this policy were to come up again. >> thank you for that breaking news. there's been a stunning revelation from a newly unsealed federal complaint. a convicted felon tried to board a flight from newark to ft. lauderdale but not with a gun. instead, with an ar-15 rifle, a taser, and a fake u.s. marshals badge. tsa was able to stop him at the gate. the man who is a convicted felon, again, has been charged. it happened in december but is just being made public and comes as the tsa has been intercepted a record number of firearms at check points. we're also learning about a major security breach at the

u.s. marshal service. they say sensitive data was taken from one of their systems just a little more than a week ago. an investigation is underway. notably, the incident did not involve the database that has the witness protection program in it, but here with more, nbc news investigative correspondent, tom winter. so, tom, what sensitive data was there? >> the information according to law enforcement we've spoken to is focused on the investigative files of the marshal service. the types of information that might be out there if you're looking for somebody, you want to know their family members. places where they've hung out in the past. prior addresses. all the type of information that can help the marshal service say we're looking for tom winter. these are the best places to look for him. so that information is in there as our understanding. on top of that, information about u.s. marshal service employees and staff and the people that work for the marshals service may be in those files. it can be helpful to know what

they know about you if you're a criminal. that's something that is going to, we haven't seen the data yet. hasn't been published online. it may not be. but it's something that could be advantageous to whoever may have taken this. >> do we know who's responsible? is there any buzz about who it might be? who are the likely suspects? >> right now, there are no indications. we've seen incidents where we've seen teenagers get access to figure out if they're under investigation. >> this could be like a 16-year-old kid? >> or a nation state. talking about the people that have been involved with ransomware attacks. china, iran, north korea. russia, obviously. these are all places that could have a hand in it. there are complex criminal gangs, organized criminal groups that might have a hand in it. it's just too soon to say about

how sophisticated this breach is. >> tom winter, always great to have you here onset. thank you. it took all winter, but today, the new york area woke up to a slushy morning after its first real snowfall of the season began overnight. snow is still expected throughout the day in the northeast. experts predicting parts of new jersey and connecticut could get up to 8 inches of snow. it all comes from that vast system that's reeked havoc on 35 states from coast to coast. pandemic era snap benefits that have kept food on the table for millions of americans set to expire tomorrow. the dire consequences this could have on families that are still struggling. we have those details, next. ha. . so you can do more than connect your business, you can make it even smarter. now ports can know where every piece of cargo is. and where it's going. (dock worker) right on time. (vo) robots can predict breakdowns and order their own replacement parts. (foreman) nice work. (vo) and retailers can get ahead of the fashion trend of the day with a new line tomorrow.

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tremendous amount of worry. even panic now because essential benefits that have helped put food on the table for millions of americans since the pandemic began are set to expire tomorrow. >> are we ready? >> yeah! >> reporter: jessica ramos is a single mom. feeding her six kids has always been a struggle. what do you think about when you go to bed at night? >> if we're going to be okay for the next week. >> reporter: her family is among more than 42 million americans who receive snap benefits, what used to be known as food stamps. during the pandemic, the

government boosted those. jessica received an extra $300 a month. >> prices are going so high that we need them. >> reporter: these benefits kept 4.2 million people out of poverty and reduced child poverty by 14% according to the urban institute, but this month marks the end for those expanded benefits because of a provision in last year's spending bill. >> the scary part for the next month, how are we going to live? >> reporter: what are the sort of decisions you're going to have to make to keep feeding your kids? >> either pay a bill or buy some groceries. that's -- >> reporter: that's where you're at. >> yes. >> reporter: she's not alone. food banks across the country are preparing for a rise in food insecurity. >> we have people calling our organization every day looking for more food resources. >> reporter: george is the executive director of share food program in philadelphia. he says they've already seen a

70% increase in demand over the last year as food prices have sky rocketed. >> for organizations like ours, that means having to work round the clock to make sure we're sources more food to serve more people. >> reporter: the typical snap household will see monthly allotments drop by at least $95. for older americans and big families like jessica's, the difference will be hundreds of dollars. the people in washington who are making these decisions, what do you want them to understand about what life is like for you? >> for them to put themselves in our shoes. that we really are struggling out here. please consider it. think about children. mostly children. >> reporter: nbc news, philadelphia. we've got a lot to cover in our second hour of chris jansing reports. let's get right to it. at this hour, chicago