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the missy seaworld christen you. york welcome, everyone, to ellis with reports. right now making his way to, selma alabama, to remember bloody sunday. now 58 years later. it is the day the troopers attacked hundreds of mostly african american protesters, marching against voter suppression. more than just a few minutes. also this morning confirmation from illinois that he will not challenge government by and for the 2024 democratic nomination. >> no, i am supporting joe biden. he is running for reelection and he is going to get reelected. i am just happy that people think of me in that way. that is certainly very flattering. i intend to serve it my turn as governor of illinois. joe biden has an awful lot that he gets to run on here. he has a tremendous amount and for the country. i don't think there's anybody

this serious it is actually considering running against joe biden. because he's done such a great job. >> one democrat is jumping into the race. author and spiritual adviser marion. williamson one of the issues he is raising is the big change to the dnc nomination schedule. >> south carolina is an important state in the primary season, i'm not denying that. but to say that this is nothing new with the james clyburn machinery or jaime harrison, these are ways that the larger democratic process is being stymied. this is not 100 years ago when -- it this is around the table smoking cigars deciding who the nominee will be. >> on the republican, side donald trump dominated the cpac poll with 62%. he talked about being under investigation for seven years, suggesting investigations would and if he is reelected. >> and if you put me back in the white house, their rain will be over.

and they know. it and america will be a free nation once. again we are not a free nation right now. we do not have free press, we cannot have free anything. >> we will drop now as one less challenger to worry. but former maryland governor larry hogan said today that he will not seek the republican nomination. some new details on the investigation into classified documents found at the possession of the former president. former vice president. as well as mike pence and president biden. the bipartisan agreement that the fbi has not given congress as much information as members would like. >> do you know what the trump facts are? do you know what the biden dots are? >> no but there are some things that we do know. >> no? they didn't share with you those things in a classified setting? why? >> first off, in the things that we do know, one of the things we know is that the fbi has not been forthcoming. >> let's just say that neither one of us are satisfy that

we've got enough information. we've a flavor for what was there and i won't speak for mike, but i will tell you that having been given a flavor this was a very serious issue. this is not stuff that we can say clearly does not matter. it. matters >> reporters in place to talk about the day's big headlines. for you from capitol hill to selma, alabama. we're gonna begin on the hill with nbc's julie tsirkin and the latest on the weaponization committee. julie, the sounds like it could be a move to defund the agencies. >> yes, alex. this is something we have been hearing from the hard right members of the house republican conference here in capitol hill. look, the creation of this very subcommittee could be looked at is one of those concessions that mccarthy had to make to some of those folks, in order to get the speakers to gavel. this, morning jim jordan, he was chairman, not only that subcommittee but also the overall judiciary panel, is investigating the biden administration's border policies. in addition to this alleged bias from the government against conservatives.

he is forging ahead with not only outlining their next hearing which has to do with the so-called collusion he is alleging between big tech and the government, against conservatives. but also suggesting their final step here could be legislation to actually take funds away from these federal agencies, including the fbi. take a listen to what he propose this, morning and what stacey plaskett, the top democrat on the panel, had to counter as well. watch. >> in the, and the real power of the legislative branch is the power of the purse. we are going to have to use. that saying this funding cannot be used for x or y. limit the funding overall. those are things you have to do, or you do not have the leverage to change again, this egregious behavior we're seeing from these agents. >> a group of the gop that seem to be so concerned with wastefulness and saving taxpayer money, they're the ones wasting money on

individuals who are not whistleblowers. they do not meet the legal definition of luck whistleblowers. >> plaskett is referring to alex. this report that they put. there's 316-page report from leading democrats on this panel. there is day, night saying that the so-called whistleblower's, three of which were interviewed behind closed doors, are nothing more than conspiracy theorists. well you have, jordan today, saying that they have essentially allegedly proved this connection. that the fbi was targeting, for example, pro-life demonstrators in the wake of roe v. wade. something that attorney general garland already disprove before the senate judiciary committee this week. a lot of back and forth and partisanship on this panel and you heard him say that their ultimate goal is to actually defund or move around funding for these agencies. something, i should, note that is not going to. passed the democratic-controlled senate. but certainly dynamic worth watching. >> absolutely. we thank you for doing so for,

us julie tsirkin. let's go now to this year's cpac, which is all about donald trump and his allies. the former president gave a nearly two-hour speech filled with his characteristic grievances and attacks. >> in 2016 i declared that i am your voice and today i ads but i am your warrior. i'm your justice. and for those who have been wronged into the trade i am your retribution. i am your retribution. >> oh boy. joining us now is eliza collins, national political reporter for the wall street journal. welcome with a smile on your face there. when is your take away from cpac? what does it say about where the gop is right now and where it is heading next year in 2024? >> cpac is the donald trump show and i think it says that he is still the leader of the republican party, we're definitely seeing more pushback from national republicans who say it is time to move forward.

when i am i talking to voters on the ground, the republican primary voters are people who will show up and vote not in a general presidential election, but a separate election. they are like donald trump. i think we are seeing a lot of people give it a shot, trying to find a different path for the republican party. but right now, trump is still the leader. >> tell me, eliza, was it just on the broadcast earlier that the 62% that he won in the straw poll, given the uniform approach and it was really the trump show, there was not that good for donald trump given the big picture? do you agree? >> he did not get 100% that is a pretty big gap between the former president and his top rival ron desantis who is a alternative republican field who has won best shot and leading trump, right? republicans have a long way to go.

>> speaking of the sidelines, donald trump continue to run for president even if he is indicted. let's take a listen to what he said. >> let's take a moment to ensure your donors and supporters are supposed to stay what will happen with those investigations? >> and when you think about leaving. these are fake stories. it's a disgraceful thing that is going on. the countries never seen anything like, it and probably it will enhance my numbers. but is a very bad thing for americans. >> you know what i love was probably the way that question was posed. can you assure your supporters? having said, that your reaction particularly since trump did not commit to supporting the gop nominee, if it is not him. >> i think that his supporters, his donors, probably are short by. that and the rest of the republican party is very nervous by that. trump has never been a bunch of a team payer for the republican

party, and i think we can continue to expect that republican thinking that they can unite including the 2022 midterms and they really need to do something differently. >> you bring up something and i hate to interrupt. nikki haley, said pointedly in her speech, if you want to stop, losing you need to go to a new generation. look to me. she may not be the individual that embodies a win, we don't know. but does she have a good point? >> she is not the only one making that point. we have heard governor sununu, today, on one of the sunday shows, talking about more power publicans need to be reaching out to younger voters. nikki haley is certainly a new generation she is offering something different than trump but she was an administration and she wasn't a similar lane of the party.

we're seeing lots of republicans trying to present themselves as an alternative choice i will just look to see republican voters feel about that. >> the last line he repeated as he so often, does history things twice cause i guess he thinks we don't hear them, is when we talked about being your retribution. what does he mean by that? do you think he could potentially mean that if you have been convicted of a 16 relates crime, i am your retribution? >> i think there will be people that will take that from which trump often does is he says things that can be very ambiguous, and people take what they want from them. whether they like him or dislike him. his, speech as you mentioned, was almost two. hours i watched it. he talked a lot about those investigations. he has talked a lot about the 2020 election, which he continues to falsely claim was fraudulent. former president trump, a lot

of what he says is not necessarily accurate. but people who follow him will take what they want from it. >> yeah. okay. eliza collins, thank you so. much good to speak. with you we will see you again. in the, meantime this week marks the 50th anniversary of bloody sunday in alabama. right, now the president is on route to selma. he will walk across the edmund pettus bridge, and honor those who risked their lives for voting rights. let's go to nbc's antonio hilton who is joining us from selma once again. what can we expect, antonio, to hear from the president today? >> hey, alex. the president should be here in about two or so hours. everyone here is waiting to hear him talk about voting rights. and to dry connection between the moment that we are in right now and what happened here on bloody sunday 58 years ago. and you described in the show some of the history here, but for anybody not familiar, 58 years ago 68 protesters led by 25, -year-old gianna louis, who we all know as a civil rights

icon and a congressman, he tried to lead a peaceful walk across this bridge. simple merge, asking for the right to vote for the black community here in the selma area. and he was met by white state troopers, with excessive violence. the nation was shocked by the images that came out that day. people here are talking about the connection between what we saw that day, they didn't does images linked to the passage of the voting rights act in 1965, and right now in 2023 we are seeing with 150 bills introduced it more than half of the states across this country that would restrict voting rights. people talking about drawn at louis's legacy and hoping to hear the president not just talk about that but commit to some kind of action. this is also coming at a critical moment because for years now this community struggle to get investment and they a tornado tore through and

devastated so many people here who were struggling to get the resources to build their homes and businesses. take a listen to one conversation had with one marcher. >> it is devastating to see that this community is in the same condition that it was 50 or so years ago. they need to make it right by the people that stay here, i keep the city alive and well. the people need help. i just agree that someone should not look the same as it did 58 years ago. >> residents want biden not just to meet with the leaders and residents here, and walk across the bridge, they also want him to take a look at some of the destruction in the area and convince some additional federal funds here so that people in selma can get back on their feet. as i talk to people early describe recovery effort that has been slow and difficult and also uneven. some of unable to get their claims and in their homes back in shape and there are others

who continue to look like the tornado just blew through moments ago. so there is pain here and frustration but also gratitude as people are excited and are already gathering at the foot of the bridge here. and waiting for the person to get here in about two hours, alex. >> it's a very big day and i'm glad are covering all of it started to finish. thank you so much antonio hilton. more than 30 million people are about to really struggle to feed their families and it is happening here in america. that story will be next and chris rock brings a silence on the will smith oscars slap. and recalibrate your advanced safety system. so automatic emergency braking and lane departure warning work properly. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ with a majority of my patience with sensitivity, i see irritated gums and weak enamel. sensodyne sensitivity gum & enamel relieves sensitivity, helps restore gum health, and rehardens enamel. i'm a big advocate of recommending things that i know work.

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americans are now wondering how much food they can avoid this month after cuts to federal benefits went to effect this month. . luckily vital social safety net part of a government effort to align some pandemic era programs. let's go to morris up, are in prince george's county, maryland, one of the places impacted most by.

this welcome what are you learning from shoppers about simply affording their groceries? >> you can imagine that those who are impacted by this are feeling a little camera shy. this is a sensitive topic when it comes to your financial situation. but have a chance to speak with some shoppers who are directly impacted by this. only there was a family, or father and a mother with a young child talking about that they are already shopping differently. this is their first time shopping since those extra pandemic boosters been scaled back this week. we are talking about more than half the states across the country are impacted. roughly 30 states, including the one wherein, maryland, were impacted by. this we are talking about roughly $95. at least $94 a month less for those families. it really depends on the side of the family and what we're talking about. in some, distances depending about those factors, it might be significantly more. hundreds of dollars less we are

seeing permanent. the urban institute says that this extra allotments kept 4.2 million people from falling below the poverty line. this also overall lowered poverty by 10%. u.s. department of agriculture is stressing this was always meant to be a temporary measure. this is something that was passed by congress at the start of the pandemic meant to give those families that were hurting most as a result of the economic crisis a little extra hope when it comes to getting that food insecurity. in some states are already rolled this back. some states lowered it and scaled it back in 2021. now we are talking about roughly 30 states that are going to be scaling this back. but food advocacy groups, those groups that fight for food securities, arguing this comes at a time when it is. hi higher than it was at the start of the pandemic. you know when you look at this time last year, comparing two now, roughly a 6% difference at

the grocery store. something the people around the country are certainly feeling. food banks and pantries are bracing for seeing more people entering, asking for help. we'll get a chance to speak to an executive director with philadelphia sheriff of the program, who had some strong words to say. take a listen. >> when washington makes a decision that is a huge multi billion dollar decision with a lot of people don't realize how much it impacts the wallets of the folks at home. really organizations like ours have to pick up all the slack. we've already, in the course of the last, year seen a 70% increase in need. thinking that we're going to have these digital snap cuts, we are looking at probably potentially 20% more in need. >> alex, a couple of quick things here. they're working on passing legislation to raise the minimum so that families in those affected states do not really feel a difference. the total cost for this federal

program in 2021 alone is almost 114 billion dollars in restaurants show the 12% of the entire countries are using food assistance programs in some capacity. the majority of those families being families with children. >> i didn't wasn't. hi thank you for sharing. that pretty stunning. appreciate, it. melissa it was a slap heard around the world today comedian chris rock is going back for the first time since will smith's shocking assault at the oscars. eviscerated smith in his new standup special. here's nbc's janis mackey. >> a year after the slap heard around the world. comedian chris rock finally had a stage with an audience of millions. >> you all know what happened to me, getting slack by shooks smith. >> using his long awaited special, selective outrage, streamed live on netflix to

take big things back at actor will smith. >> people were like did it hurt? it still hurts! i have summertime ringing in my ears. >> the slap, as you will recall, happened when rock made a joke at last year's offer oscars about jada pinkett smith's appearance. >> smith eventually made a public apology. >> my behavior was unacceptable. >> it was banned from the oscars for a decade. rock was long silent on the slap and now, the way he tells, it he bore the brunt of smith's alleged marital troubles. some of his hardest hits stay saved for date jada. >> she started it! nobody was picking on her! >> the timing of the netflix special is no coincidence.

just a week ahead of this year's oscars. >> a lot of people say, chris, you don't do nothing back. i got parents! you know my parents taught me? do not fight in front of white people! >> yet after all the punchlines, it is not clear of rock and smith, who were close friends, have actually spoken. representatives for the smiths did not respond to requests for comments. >> i have read it for will smith my whole life and now, i watch emancipation just to see him get walloped. >> about the slap that still is at center stage and sing stinging. janice, mackay for nbc news, los angeles. >> new reaction from the sunday talk shows about that january six footage that is about to be released this week. a key question, is anybody reaching out to the capitol police to vent this stuff?

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growing concerns about the trove of january six footage released to fox news host tucker carlson. house minority leader hakeem jeffries says that there are security risks of capitol police do not review the footage before there's. >> it is not clear to me that any material footage, in the news personality another network, may have how has been vetted. but it must absolutely be vetted before anything is released into the public domain. there are serious security concerns, we are releasing footage into the public domain. in an era where political violence is on the rise. >> let's bring in asha rangappa, former special agent for the counter intelligence division of the fbi, and senior lecturer and assistant dean at the yale jackson school of global affairs. , asha. welcome good to see you. if this footage is aired before capitol police have a chance to look at it, how much is that a concern?

>> it is definitely a concern,. alex we know that when people have nefarious designs, they often try to learn from their mistakes. and try again. we, saw this for example, with the world trade center. which terrorists tried to attack in 1993. the reassessed their ammo, and then of course were successful when they did it in 2001. what date? do they tested security and were able to go to airports, for example, to try to see what they could get away with in order to improve their plans. i think that is the kind of thing that we should be concerned about. i would go even farther then representative jeffries, and say that it is not just about what is released. at this point, this footage is in the hands of tucker carlson. he could, shared presumably, with anyone. and we know that these people who have been convicted of seditious conspiracy or people that he believes are patriots. i would be very concerned with who is gonna get their hands on this, whether or not has

publicly aired. >> i'm concerned as well. give me your sense is a former fbi agent. how unusual is it for leadership to release material to the public without proper vetting? isn't that against protocol? >> i would think so. especially the leader of an institution, that was itself attacked. this is one layer that protects the people in that building. and in releasing this, i think mccarthy has really created more of a vulnerability again for people who may want to try this again. it is quite astonishing. >> a reminder, you worked in the building too. anyway, let's turn now to the classified document topic. last, month you wrote an op-ed about the files discovered at the properties of president, biden trump and pence. today, lawmakers on both sides say they are concerned about the lack of information they receive since then. take a listen to this.

>> do you think you guys have to rebuild? prove to them that you are trustworthy of the secrets? >> i would say is more tension between the fbi and congress and it is the intelligence community. >> -- >> absolutely, and i think that's going to come to a head of the next couple years. >> two things about the fbi. first, of all mike's, right there subjecting rational oversight. secondly, they do have to preserve the integrity they are investigating. and there are investigations on board right now. we need to work with them. >> here is a question. first of all, do they have a point. should they be getting more from the fbi? >> well, i think they have legitimate concerns. and unlike many of the other surface hearings and things like that, we are now seeing a pattern where there appears to be a lot of, at the very least, sloppiness and carelessness when administrations leave office. in terms of the half handling of classified information.

and oversight, body and in order to create legislation to try to fill those gaps, i think there is they are entitled to information. to the extent we need such specific information that they want to politicize it and use this into a political, up in that process they. line but i think they need to balance, that in the interest of what the fbi needs to do to resolve its investigations. without compromising them. >> do you think it is legitimate if the fbi were to say, we are concerned about leaks of this gets released? >> yes, of course. we have to remember that in the trump situation, they were not releasing that information either. it came out because trump, himself, filed a lawsuit demanding to know what they took. and the court ordered them to provide inventory. we would not have known that but for the fact that trump himself and asked for it. they want to keep it this close hold. and i think that they will also

be willing to work with congress to the extent that they need to. but it is a balancing act for them. >> okay. thank you for the. trot we will see you again. in the, meantime coming up for all of. you manny hassan on how to win every argument. but, first some live pictures as crowds have gathered in, selma, alabama to remember bloody sunday. most people will tell you what happened here is why elections matter. and why history matters a lot. it is next. it is next hi, i'm katie. i live in flagstaff, arizona. i'm an older student. i'm getting my doctorate in clinical psychology. i do a lot of hiking and kayaking. i needed something to help me gain clarity. so i was in the pharmacy and i saw a display of prevagen and i asked the pharmacist about it. i started taking prevagen and i noticed that i had more cognitive clarity. memory is better. it's been about two years now and it's working for me. prevagen. at stores everywhere without a prescription.

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will arrive in selma, alabama, to commemorate the 50th anniversary of bloody sunday. march 7th, 1965 was the dale abominate troopers violently attacked civilians. marching against voter suppression and racial inequality. late congressman john lewis is among the 600 marchers. he suffered a skull fracture. 57 protesters were also wounded and taken to the hospital. for treatment. i want to bring in darren, voted professor and acting chair of the department of history at alabama state university. and to san, jeffries associate professor of history at the ohio state university. gentlemen, thank you for being here. darren, i'm curious what you expect to see and hear when biden takes part in this commemoration today? >> well, what i expect to see is a very large route.

i was in selma with president barack obama. and it was like times square on new years eve. -- for the presidents visit. it's really important of a president to visit selma. because of the low that the white house and the president played in securing the voting rights act of 1965. >> yeah. absolutely. looking at that picture of that rather rock star performance. there if you want to equate senior times square, there president obama. hassan, give me the sense of your significance of the sitting president being in attendance. the symbolism is quite striking. >> the symbolism is, striking and the symbolism is important. it is important for the nation to know that the chief executive officer of the

president the united states, of the federal government, is behind securing and protecting the voting rights of all people. especially african americans. when historically, it has not just been states that have attempted to disenfranchise african americans. but the federal government has supported that effort. so, to know that the federal government is now on the right side of history, and willing to fight, not only for recognition of the past wrongs, but most immediately to fight against those who are pushing disenfranchisement efforts in the contemporary moment, is really important. >> darren, do you think it is important to recreate the march on salma every year? it is no, it is certainly. but why the walk? what is important about that to you? >> i think the walk is important, the marchers. because it reminds us of what was at stake. if they could not have been a more important event. occurring in our country at

that time. dr. king understood that freedom is ephemeral. without the right to vote. so, this march really started out a is a memorial to jimmy lee jackson, who was killed in alabama. was shot, several days later. by an alabama state trooper. so, this march culminated with an event. i think it is really important for us to remember the historical context in the 1960s. something, for example, before the voting rights act. lance county, alabama, 85% of the population is black. approximately 6000 black adults who are eligible to register to

vote. not -- was register to vote. the alabama democratic party had a logo which was white supremacy. that did not change until 1966. dr. king decided to return to georgia in 1960. he could not vote in the national election. because he had not established residency in georgia. and he had not paid his tax. >> it is extraordinary, as we are watching these black and white videos of what happened. i mean, it is stunning to see it created. as we, look also, i believe we also pictures from 1960, five of african americans lining up to register to vote. i am curious hassan, because bloody sunday was served at this pivotal moment for the passage of the voting rights

act. give me a sense today or assessment of president biden's record on voting rights? >> well, it certainly is today, literally, a little bit checkered. when we think about his announcement that he would not support the desire of residents in d.c.. to have a particular reform that they want to, to be in the city council. to express support for. so in that, since he's coming under a little bit of fire. and i, think rightly so for not recognizing the significance of one person, one vote, in the context of. d.c. beyond, that he is done much, better to be sure, with the justice department. in making sure that african americans, people of color, the

working poor into the disabled, have their access to voting rights. we know that voting rights are certainly coming under assault and have been under assault. dating back most recently to the supreme court ruling in shelby versus holding. we need him to be aggressive. we need to be consistent going forward. >> can i ask, you also, hassan, if you want to add to that the president will be running for reelection. it is widely expected he will campaign his record on civil rights. what is your suspect of that record? >> again, we could do more. certainly the record is stronger than the opposition party. then any candidates that we know will be coming up from opposing him, from the republican party right. now they did everything in their power to make it harder for people to vote. to make it a limit to the civil rights and human rights of african americans and immigrants and lgbt community.

but again, enough is not enough. he has to keep pushing the envelope and keep doing more. >> professor, thank you so much on this really important day for speaking with us. is it a conference or a carnival? political junk food, why cpac felt so different this year. they want and only mehdi hasan is joining us next. joining us next

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republican party is on full display at cpac this weekend. what was once the premier? and for celebrating conservativism is now the trump show as trump further shapes the party. he went after the old guard in his keynote speech. >> we will liberate america from these villains in scoundrels, once and for all. when we started a journey, there is never been before. never been anything like this.

we had a republican party that was ruled by freaks. neocons. globalists. open borders outlets and fools. but we are never going back to the party of paul, ryan carl rogan into bush. >> if. only joining me now is mehdi hasan, the host of the medina sancho on msnbc and peacock. also author of the new book, yesterday crack the top ten of the amazon books l inglis. it is, called when every. argument to the art of, baking persuading, and public speaking. , well down my. france congrats. on this it is so. good is so good, this. book we are gonna get to that in a, second i want to ask you, why do you think the republican party stands right now? given what we've heard from donald trump right there? the fact that cpac has essentially become the trump show? >> yes, indeed. first of, all i have to say, alex it's always amazing to hear donald trump refer to other people as fools and freaks, in that clip you just

played. they're a great irony there. cpac long ago became t pack. it is the trump legal action committee. it is basically a personal fiefdom. we saw them in terms of the numbers, all of the rooms where. empty cpac is not what it, was just like trump isn't who he was. but we still got more people, way more people to his speech than nikki haley or mike pompeo or any of the other pretenders. look at the cpac straw poll that they do every year, 62% support from cpac attendees versus ron desantis. 20. percent this idea that ron desantis is not the kind of future of the party is nonsense. some of us have been saying for a while, do not write off trump. yet he still has huge sway over the gop base. desantis is a hugely over inflated figure. but look, the bigger question is in american politics, through you wind without appealing it's on your base? and trump proved in 2016 you could, in 2020. couldn't we have an american political system with the democratic part of it is under

heavy strain. he is not going to win just because cpac goers like. him as nikki haley pointed out in her speech, they lost the popular vote in seven of the last eight. elections it is interesting. we know that the base loves him and the cpac folks love him and the freakish press accuse him of being. whether that wins in the election 2020, for i don't. no all bets are off always in our country. >> marjorie taylor, greene met rates, lauren boebert all spoke. are they essentially representatives of the republican party today? >> 100%. some of us have been saying that for a while. but the fringe became the mainstream long ago. and it really frustrates me when we talk about these figures as if they are some kind of far off loot. marjorie taylor greene is the most influential lawmaker in america today. kevin mccarthy relies on her for. everything kevin mccarthy would not have his job of or not for marjorie taylor greene. lauren boebert, these. guys they speak for the republican party. and i understand, people in our industry in particular, we want

to believe that there are these never trumpers. or these moderate conservatives still out there. we want to believe larry herbert or mitch ronnie still represent some segment of the population. but they. don't we know they. don't look at the polling and where trump stands and what desantis is. doing the reality, as he was the biggest rival rivalries on a? trump it is someone as authoritarian as he is. while desantis is just less crazy than he. is >> let's get to the. book bring that into the conversation. when every argument, the art of debating in persuading and public speaking. cpac was a who's who of election denialism. we live in a, time, mehdi where disinformation is abundant and lies our past office truths. even when, proven by the, way to realize. how do you win arguments against that? sane logic goes right out the window. does it take more than just having facts and truth in your arsenal now? >> 100%. in the book i have the chapter called a roll of. three i say we think should be and three.

let me give you three quick things to think. about what to speak in a very blunt way but what's going. on you just said the word. lies lies. the l word. it took far too long for journalists to call lies lies. we danced around the issue and called everything but a. line inaccuracy, false. it lies. let's call what is going on what it is. serial lying. remember, too i would say that sometimes you do not need to have the argument. you can walk away from an argument. i, for one, do you not platform election deniers on my show. i wrote an entire book about how much i love debating and how much you can win. but i would also say that i refused to debate people on whether hot is cold, up, down black is. white did not debate reality. in the more, three if you are forced to do so when you are joe biden on the debate stage, with donald, trump you cannot exactly avoid having the argument. we saw how donald trump treated the debates in 2020 and 2016. there are the things you can do. differ things journalists can do. number, one you can pick your. battles do not try to fight them on everything.

pick the most ridiculous thing they are, saying and fight them on. that too, you can call it what is going. on say a lie is a lie. call out the best strategy. the flood zone approach your parents are taking. number three, do, not budge. alex you and i both know the key to a good interview is a follow-up question, not letting your guests each steamroll over. you make sure that you can answer to your question. far too often, these gas lighters, these crafters, these serial fabricators, they want to say some nonsense and they do not want to be challenged on. it they want you to move on to the next subject. and i'm saying to people involved in these kinds of debates, whether your politicians or activists or journalists, you're not budge until you get to the truth. so you get your. insert until you've challenge that falsehoods. >> unfortunately, nick just said in my ear that we have to go. but think goodness we have your show to look forward to. later we can also want to win. peacock in this book is just priceless. it is so good, mehdi. thank you for coming on the drop a little earlier than usual on a sunday. appreciate, you too. that is going to do it for me on this edition of alex witt

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