right now the nashville community still reeling as we learn major new details about monday's massacre at the covenant school. police now revealing that the shooter obtained seven firearms from five different stores, all of them purchased legally and

had been under a doctor's care for an emotional disorder. law enforcement also revealed that the shooter's parents cannot think that 28-year-olds should own weapons. the disturbing details putting a renewed focus on the nation's gun laws. president biden pointing some fingers at the same time. >> i, again, call on congress to pass the assault weapons ban. this should not be a partisan issue. it's a common sense issue. i want you to know who isn't doing it. who isn't helping. >> ahead, i'll talk to a tennessee state representative who rushed to the scene after the shooting. why he says thoughts and prayers are never enough. plus, former vice president mike pence in iowa fueling more 2024 speculation, even as both he and his former boss face a major legal blow. a federal judge has ruled pence must testify in the justice department's probe of donald trump's efforts to overturn the

2020 election. the latest on how pence is responding. and a perfect storm of devastation in mississippi. how residents are just beginning the grueling recovery from the deadly tornados that tore through the state and what kind of help they're getting ahead of an upcoming visit from president biden. we begin in nashville with nose disturbing new developments in the wake of monday's deadly school shooting. starting us off nbc's lindsey reiser and kathy park live in nashville. we'll start with you, we've got a bunch of new detail about the weapons the shooter had, what their parents saw on the day of the attack, and now we're also hearing from a former middle school teammate of the shooter speaking out about this, what all can you tell us? >> garrett, good morning to you, it certainly is another difficult day here in nashville. hearts are heavy. you can see the raw emotions. behind me is the front of the school, the entrance of the school, the covenant school, and

there is a growing memorial. there are six crosses that have now been placed remembering the six lives stolen. this as the investigation presses on, and yesterday the police chief we learned that the suspect, audrey hale purchased seven firearms legally, and three of those weapons used in monday's attack. we also learned that audrey hale was under a doctor's care for an emotional disorder and as far as a motive, it's still unclear at this point. they are kind of digging through the writings, the manifesto at this time for more answers, but we do know that this church was targeted. however, when the suspect got into the building, it appears the suspect actually just shot indiscriminately at random killing six people. i spoke with a middle school teammate, and she told me she actually received a very disturbing message just minutes before the mass shooting, but obviously wasn't able to kind of put the two together until hours later. and audrey hale in that message

on instagram told avriana that something bad was going to happen, take a listen. >> it was just like, hold on, i don't really know. i sent the message to my dad, and i was like do you think i should say something? he said yes in all caps. that's when i started making calls. i called the suicide prevention hot line, and they told me to call the nashville deputy office. >> reporter: and garrett, she's still processing a whole lot at this time, still in shock and disbelief. she actually told me she contacted or was in touch with the suspect a couple of weeks ago at a mutual friend's memorial service. and later on this evening, garrett, as the community continues to mourn, there will be another vigil planned downtown. >> a lot of mourning left to do there. nbc's kathy park in nashville. thank you. obviously this community is

going through so much right now. they've got so much ahead of them from everything we've seen, from every other shooting that happened around the country. now we're hearing from tennessee's republican governor, bill lee. talk a little bit about what his message has been and how it's been received. >> garrett, he said all tennesseans are hurting, but he said there are parents who woke up without being able to hug their kids. there are kids who woke up without being able to hug their parents and spouses who woke up without being able to hold their loved ones. his wife maria, very, very close friends with the substitute teacher there who was actually supposed to have dinner at their home the night of the shooting but obviously never made it there, and he said that they were friends, maria, cynthia peak and also katherine koonce, the head of the school. they all taught together and were very close. while we saw the absolute worst of humanity, we saw some of the best of humanity. those brave heroic officers.

we've been showing you the body cam video, it was released yesterday, in which those officers with no regard for their own lives, went in to confront that shooter, put themselves between the kids and teachers and that shooter, and by all accounts, law enforcement commending those officers for their heroics and quick action. he also talked about the timing for debating policy. let's listen to what he said about that. >> i understand the desperation to have answers, to place blame, to argue about a solution that could prevent this horrible tragedy. there will come a time to ask how a person could do this. there will come a time to discuss and debate policy, but this is not a time for hate or rage. >> reporter: the governor went on to say there will be a time to talk about legislation and budget proposals. clearly there's more work to do, but obviously, garrett, this is in response to a lot of

criticism here, the state doesn't have red flag laws in which law enforcement could take weapons away from somebody who poses a risk to themselves or others, although the national police chief did say yesterday that the shooter wasn't even on their radar, garrett. >> it's always that debate. is it too soon after this shooting or perhaps too soon before the next one that you have those policy conversations. lindsey reiser, and you'll join us later in the hour, and we'll continue this conversation about the policy now with tennessee state representative beau mitchell. he's a democrat who represents part of the nashville area. he rushed to the scene right after the shooting. i understand the daughter of one of your staffers goes to covenant school, thankfully was unarmed here, but this person had to tell her daughter that three of her friends had been killed. take us back to that moment, how it was for her, how it was for you in response on monday when this all began. >> you know, i was on my way in to the capitol when my assistant texted me and said, you know,

she was on the way to the church to the reunification site to see if her daughter was okay, you know, so, she's a single parent so i just went straight there myself to be with her. it was horrible. sitting in a church sanctuary with all of these parents for hours. this was not a short process. it was a three-hour process for them to be told whether their children was alive or not. >> i was at the reunification center in uvalde. it's the single worst thing i've ever covered. you've also been someone calling for gun reform since before this tragedy. there's also an embarrassing anlt of data about how the american public feels about this. there's a new harvard poll that shows 63% of americans in the younger demographic age 18 to 29 say they support stricter gun

laws. that cuts across education, race, gender, you name it. do numbers like those have any sway over your colleagues in the state house who don't support changes to gun laws or things like extreme risk protection orders. >> they don't. until the public shows up at our state capitol and demands actions, until parents and grandparents show up and say we're tired of seeing children buried. you have a governor who has personal contact with one of the victims, he's in a position of power and influence to do something, you know, he's saying it's not the time. our legislature's only in session for another 30 days at the most. now is the time. it's time to act. it's time to quit talking and acting like you care, thoughts and prayers. thoughts and prayers aren't helping these parents who are

burying their children. it's time to do something for a change. >> one of the things that your legislature has acted on fairly recently was making tennessee the first state in the u.s. to restrict drag shows to adult only venues in the name of protecting children. representative, how do we get past this idea that the two parties seem to be talking about wholly separate ideas of what it means to be safe and what it means to protect children if one party's talking about something like you're protecting your kids from drag queens. the other party is talking about protecting your children from guns. how do we bridge this divide at a state level where people are far more likely to know their legislators, know these issues and be personally affected by them right there on the ground. >> that's just an embarrassment, you know, after this tragedy, i hope the people who were behind that legislation are just ashamed of themselves, you know.

. saying that's harmful to children while at the same time we have bills before the legislature to make it legal to care long rifles up and down the streets. people can march up and down the street with ar-15s and ak-47s and another piece of legislation to make it legal for an 18-year-old to purchase a gun. if putting more guns on the streets were the solution, tennessee would be the safest state in the nation. unfortunately, we're one of the worst states of gun violence in the nation. >> we've got to leave it there. i appreciate your time coming on to talk with us about this. it's a challenging set of issues. we appreciate folks like you for working on it. we talk to the minister of one church who lost a member of its congregation. and why is the senate looking to roast the ex-ceo of starbucks. first, pence in a legal

pineser after a federal judge ordered him to comply with a subpoena from the special counsel probing donald trump's efforts to interfere with the 2020 election results. what the former vice president is saying just as he makes another stop to that key presidential caucus state of iowa. all that and more when we're back in just 60 seconds. e're back in just 60 seconds. [ horn honks, muffled talking ] -can't hear you, jerry. -sorry. uh, yeah, can we get a system where when someone's bike is in the shop, then we could borrow someone else's? -no! -no! or you can get a quote with america's number-one motorcycle insurer and maybe save some money while you're at it. all in favor of that. [ horn honking ] there's a lot of buttons and knobs in here. (vo) with verizon, you can now get a private 5g network. so you can do more than connect your business, you can make it even smarter. now ports can know where every piece of cargo is. and where it's going. (dock worker) right on time. (vo) robots can predict breakdowns and order their own replacement parts. (foreman) nice work. (vo) and retailers can get ahead of the fashion trend of the day with a new line tomorrow. with a verizon private 5g network,

you can get more agility and security. giving you more control of your business. we call this enterprise intelligence. from the network america relies on. this morning former vice president mike pence has made his way back to iowa take as he weighs taking on his former boss in the presidential race. he's got a new wrinkle complicating the decision he's got to make. a federal judge ordered pence to testify in the special counsel investigation into donald trump's efforts to overturn the results of the 2020 election. now, pence hasn't said yet if he'll appeal that ruling, but he previously said he would fight it all the way to the supreme court. joining me now is nbc news senior legal correspondent laura jarrett who broke this story

yesterday, and laura, pence got a small victory here, a partial victory that he doesn't have to testify about everything that he may know about january 6th. break down this ruling and what his team's next steps may be. >> there's two different legal arguments at play. the first is one about executive privilege. that's something that the former president has tried to assert in any number of different cases to try to keep secret those conversations with his top aides. the judge rejected that argument completely. that's off the table. trump could still appeal that. the more interesting idea is this novel legal argument that pence's lawyers tried to assert about him being protected by the speech or debate clause of the constitution. what that basically means is because he presided over the senate on january 6th, his idea was that he should be -- from anything having to do with his legislative duties on that day. the judge bought that idea in theory, but the victory is somewhat ephemeral. the special counsel really wants to probe the conversations that

happened between trump and pence in the days and weeks leading up to january 6th, and those, as far as we understand it, are going to be fair game because the judge says as long as it has to do with trump's alleged illegality, the special counsel can get testimony on that. now, of course as you mentioned, the former vice president hasn't said whether he's going to appeal this ruling, but it's worth noting, this decision came out on monday, and he has very effective lawyers. if he wanted to appeal and try to seek an immediate stay, he could have already done so, and he has not. we will see what he says in iowa about that today. >> politically, the better play for pence may be to get caught trying to fight this ruling but still ultimately go and testify. laura jarrett, thank you for your reporting. for more on this, let's bring in msnbc legal analyst lisa rubin and paul henderson, a veteran prosecutor and trial attorney. pence gets this narrow victory here on the speech or debate clause. he may not have to talk about what it was like in the chamber while he was acting as president of the senate. how valuable is his testimony

more broadly in the special counsel's investigation? >> anybody who's read "the wall street journal" piece that pence excerpted from his book, garrett, knows just how valuable pence is of a witness. he met multiple times with donald trump alone where trump tried to persuade him to go his way with respect to the events on january 6th. he also had a meeting famously with trump and john eastman where they also tried to persuade him that he didn't have to reject the electors, or i'm sorry he didn't have to accept the fake electors. he could reject the ones that were legitimately sent, which would effectively freeze the presidential election and create a new opening for donald trump to declare a victory. pence is an exceptionally valuable witness here and his book and his op-ed in "the wall street journal" are proof positive of that. >> the january 6th committee couldn't get him in. paul, pence appeared on the cable channel news max last night and said that the initial doj subpoena for his testimony he thought was unconstitutional.

here's a bit more of that interview. >> i can tell you that i'm pleased that the court accepted our argument and recognized that the constitution's provision about speech and debate does apply to the vice president but the way they sorted that out and the requirements of my testimony going forward are subject of our review right now, and i'll have more to say about that in the days ahead. >> what do you make of that response, particularly coming on probably the most pro-trump kind of cable news outlet. what do you think about the possibility of an appeal or the idea that, you know, maybe this is as far as the former vice president wants to take this legal fight. >> well, i think the appeal is something that he's always got in his back pocket. i think that appeal is tide to what his next steps are in terms of what his intentions are with the party. two things that stand out to me here with this whole conversation. one, how far pence is willing to twist an interpretation of the

law to try and come up with any defense. let's not forget that this is a very novel defense that he's trying to prevent to avoid having to testify, and this is something from the constitution again, a novel concept in article 1, section 6 of the constitution, but specifically for a a freedom of speech protection for operations of congress. he has played an administrative role. he's trying to reach over to use that protection for him. what i think is interesting is how much he's willing to twist just to create and prevent from having to talk about what happened for him not being the subject of criminal acts. and that's really important because that's the real target. that's what the court is ruling on, the target of illegal behavior versus politically incendiary behavior that has an implication for pence on whether or not he decides that he's going to run to try to seek the nomination and/or to try and prevent repercussions for trump. again, for illegal behavior. that's what makes all of this so interesting. it's so much more than just

novel defenses he's trying to present and trying to twist an interpretation to use. it's why is he trying to avoid this testimony and to how far and what lengths he'll go to to not testify. that's where we are right now. that's why the appeal is so interesting, and the appeal also that may be coming from trump on his behalf, which raises the whole issue of standing to try and prevent pence from testifying as well. >> so that's a lot going on in the special counsel case. there's also the new york city grand jury case i just got back from a week and a half up there from trump's hush money payments. lisa, trump is very outspoken about the manhattan d.a.'s investigation, this morning becoming a big fan of the fwrj process. he writes on truth social, i've gained such respect for this grand jury and perhaps even the grand jury system as a whole. the evidence is so overwhelming in my favor and bad for the highly partisan and hateful district attorney that the grand jury is saying hold on, we are not a rubber stamp. this has been really interesting

to watch. the grand jury and the d.a. alvin bragg are following the secrecy rules they have to follow in new york state. they're not talking about the deliberations they are or are not having. but donald trump's been filling that void with post after post, interview after interview. i wonder as you look at it now is a post like that almost a dare to alvin bragg saying if you've got the votes, vote out the indictment or let this thing go. >> whether or not it's a dare to alvin bragg, it's not one he's going to take. alvin bragg has been very clear, he's going to follow the facts, follow the law, and he's going to ask the grand jury to return a true bill, meaning a vet on the indictment if the facts and the law justify it. i don't think what trump is doing out there other than endangering alvin bragg is really impacting alvin bragg's behavior. the other thing about that post that i think is remarkable is trump's newfound respect for grand jurors when he perceives there's a problem with the grand jury process. we should all respect jurors and

grand jurors irrespective of the outcome. the fact that trump only respects them when he thinks they're tilting in his favor is unfortunate and perverse and shows how donald trump only views our values of democratic processes only. >> thank you both for being with us to break all of this down. coming up next, steaming over starbucks. we are live on capitol hill where a showdown is brewing between senators and the ex-ceo of starbucks over the coffee giant's labor practicesment. plus, president biden is once get putting congress on notice over its inaction on gun. >> i call on congress to pass the assault weapon ban, pass it. it should not be a partisan issue. >> will lawmakers listen now, and what house speaker mccarthy is and is not saying about this issue. stick around.

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right now up on capitol hill, a highly anticipated senate hearing is getting underway with former starbucks ceo howard schultz in the hot seat. he's facing questions about the company's labor practices. this hearing comes after weeks of classes and back and forth between schultz and committee chair bernie sanders who's vocally pro-union. the not so subtle title of the hearing is, quote, no company is above the law, the need to end illegal busting at starbucks. nbc's ryan nobles has been covering all of this for us and joining us live at the capitol. sanders has been pushing to get schultz in front of the committee for a while now. how contentious do we expect this to get. what has starbucks had to say about this accusation of union busting in their stores. >> garrett, we're only about 15 minutes into this hearing. it's already living up to expectations. bernie sanders not holding back in his criticism of howard schultz specifically. schultz did everything he could not to appear at this hearing

this morning, especially because he's no longer the ceo of this company. sanders insisted that schultz be a participant. he believes he's the architect of the company's efforts to try and prevent unions from organizing at their stores across the country. listen to how sanders started this hearing this morning. >> starbucks has waived the most aggressive and illegal union busting campaign in the modern history of our country. that union busting campaign has been led by howard schultz, the multibillionaire founder and director of starbucks, who is with us this morning. only under the threat of subpoena. >> reporter: so the opening salvo delivered there by senator sanders. it's a packed hearing room this morning, garrett. many of these union members are in attendance to listen to what schultz has to say. we'll also hear from a member of

one of these unions who feels as though starbucks suppressed the ability for the union to organize. to your point about howard schultz, in his opening statements, he's prepared to say that he supports their employees' efforts to unionize and that they do want to fairly collective bargain with them over their contracts, wages, health benefits, all along the lines, but he's also going to say that he believes starbucks is already a good employer and offers competitive wages and health care benefits that many companies like starbucks don't currently offer. >> very different ideas about what a company like starbucks should be doing there. there's so much going on, i have to ask you to reach across to the other chamber where we've got another big hearing today. this one on the house, focusing on the failure of silicon valley bank. the senate grilled regulators yesterday. what do we expect to learn? >> yeah, this is the house financial services committee. it is the regulators again. the big question is are the laws on the books in place sufficient

enough to prevent this from happening again. and was it the problem that those laws just weren't enforced. that's why they're going to really specifically drill down on questions that are associated with how the bank collapsed and why it collapsed so quickly. this is one of the issues that has bipartisan support. there is an effort for reform to happen. the form is and fashion of which we still do not know. >> ryan nobles on capitol hill for us. thank you, ryan. the other major issue on the hill this week, once again in the course of the wake of the nashville shooting is our nation's gun laws. democratic congressman alyssa slot kin is set to release two new gun laws today. meanwhile, president biden continues to push for stricter gun laws and more specifically a ban on assault weapons like the one from the 1990s. he also acknowledges there isn't much more action he can take on

his own. >> i have -- my exec ty executive authority to do anything on my own on guns. congress has to act. the majority of americans think having assault weapons -- >> joining us now is julie tsirkin. you're set to talk with congresswoman slotkin. talk to me about what they would do. why these bills would be different from other gun safety measures that have not moved and what the speaker is saying about any of this, if anything. >> reporter: yeah, i'll sit down with slotkin who is introducing these two bills alongside those students from school shootings that happened in her district 11 months apart. now, her bills have to do with the transfer of firearms. the first would prohibit anyone convicted of a misdemeanor that either carried, possessed or used a firearm from being transferred that weapon from a family member or anyone else for

up to three years. the second also in that vein has to do with preventing a firearm transfer unless there is a one-week cooling off period. now, i just want to point out here, both of these bills slotkin began working on in the wake of the oxford high school shooting last november, of course reignited to do more on gun safety after the michigan state shooting last month. this had nothing to do with the shooting in nashville, but just goes to show you due to the frequency of these mass shootings just how these lawmakers are struggling to even keep up with tackling them. now, ahead of that, we've been asking republicans yesterday to react to the shooting in nashville. take a listen to what speaker mccarthy said or didn't say when asked to respond. >> what happened in nashville is obviously incredibly -- >> reporter: garrett, i want to ask those two students for how they feel coming here today to the capitol surviving these

shootings at such a young age from not hearing from top republicans, the most powerful republican here in washington and other republicans who said there's just nothing they can do on this issue. >> i look forward to hearing the answer to those questions, julie, and it goes to the bill lee point from the beginning of the show. it was too early to talk about the shootings the days after and we're already months after the shooting in michigan. that's part of the challenge for lawmakers trying to move this stuff forward. julie tsirkin, thank you very much. and next, the senate chaplain took a moment to hold senators to account after the shooting in nashville. listen to this. >> when babies die at a church school, it is time for us to move beyond thoughts and prayers. >> up next, we're talking to a nashville minister who knows one

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we have some breaking news this morning that could have a

major impact on fighting our country's opioid epidemic. the fda has just approved an over the counter version of narcan. americans will now be able to buy 4 milligrams of narcan without a prescription. it should be available by late summer in major retailers online and convenience stores nationwide. the fda commissioner said the move was to address a, quote, dire public health need. and meanwhile, we're learning more about the six victims of the shooting at covenant school in nashville. school custodian mike hill was a father and grandfather, a former pastor said he was also a father figure to students at the school, and quote, the kids loved him. substitute teacher cynthia peak was described as a sweet soul who cared about people and was outgoing, gentle in her faith and a former student said katherine koonce fought for her students, oftentimes when we

quit fighting for ourself, and the 3 9d-year-oldings, william kinney, evelyn dieckhaus. that radiance i believe was jesus in her. a neighbor said evelyn loved singing songs from "hamilton" and, and evelyn's 11-year-old sister through tears said i don't want to be an only child. nbc's lindsey reiser is back with us from nashville. we're both parents. this is just gutting to hear and report on. i understand you're talking to pastor here this morning. tell us what you're learning. >> garrett, gutting to hear about these little kids and adults who lost their lives, gutting to be here at the scene to see these six crosses behind me and see school buses pull up and kids pay their respects in front of this memorial here. nothing any child or any person should have to do. evelyn dieckhaus's family

released a statement overnight saying our hearts are completely broken. we cannot believe this has happened. evelyn was a shining light in this world. we appreciate all the love and support but ask for space as we grieve. i want to bring in dr. clay stauffer. you know the family, the dieckhaus family, they're members of your church. what can you tell us about her and the family? >> i can tell you that the family is amazing and right now they're surrounded by their extended family, their friends, and as you just said, they want time to grieve and to process through this, and i know that they want to tell evelyn's story at some point, but everything is still too fresh. >> i mean, you're dealing with this as a member of the community too, grieving and mourning in your own way. you're the one that has to offer -- that doesn't have to but chooses to offer counsel to other families who are hurting. you were at the reunification site on monday night when some families were reunited and some

weren't. talk to us about what you've witnessed over the last couple of days and how you're trying to help these people cope. >> woodmont baptist church which is right next door to our church opened the sanctuary as a unification site. i went over there to help as a process. nathan parker was working hard to get the children bussed from covenant and get the families into the sanctuary. that was obviously a very, very hard day as parents were waiting to find out if they were going to see their children. that took a long time for them to get reunited with them just because of the police process. >> you have many families whose kids attend this school, who attend your church. you have three kids of your own, young kids. what are you telling people? what do you say? >> we have a number of families in our church whose kids go to covenant school and they love covenant school. it's an incredible school. and now they're having to talk about what's happened and how to

make sense of it and all we're trying to do is support them and love them, get them counseling, get them resources, and just let them know that they're not walking through this by themselves. >> we've been talking, obviously, a lot about, you know, why? why did this have to happen? what can be done to prevent the next. what's your message to the community? >> i think we have to do better. i don't like how this always gets politicized, but i think everybody agrees that this can't keep happening. there has to be some kind of middle ground on this issue, and i think we've got to work to do better because children deserve to be able to go to school in the morning and then come home and see their parents in the afternoon. that's what they plan on. they don't -- 9-year-olds don't think i'm not going to get to see my family later, and so we've got to work as a community and as a nation to do better. >> i know this is your first time counseling families who are grieving the loss of children. hopefully this is the last time

you'll have to do that. thank you, appreciate it. >> glad to join you. and garrett, as the community tries to heal, to make sense of all this, we know there's another vigil tonight, but i can tell you there are still people coming to pay their respects. it's heartbreaking to watch and to witness. he had to explain this his own kids as well. garrett, i know that he hugged his kids a little bit tighter this week, and of course i think you and i are doing the same. >> yeah, we all should. lindsey reiser, thank you for that reporting. i know it's tough stuff. i really appreciate it. thank you. this morning in mississippi, the long cleanup and rebuilding process is really just starting after those devastating tornados that killed at least 21 people and destroyed thousands of homes across the state. one of them, what we've just learned about, is 2-year-old aubrey green in silver city, mississippi. now, president biden has promised to visit the area as residents wait for federal resources and even the return of

electricity and water service. maggie vespa is with us from rolling city, what are residents able to do now? what are they facing and what do we know about this potential presidential visit? >> reporter: sure, we'll start with what we're seeing on the ground, garrett. i mean, this frankly is what they're facing. i know it's hard to make it out at first glance. that's a semitruck. you can see the undercarriage of it. that semi-trailer flipped onto its side and someone hung an american flag in the aftermath of it. this is what the town of rolling fork, mississippi, looks like. it's total decimation. people faced with these stark, staggering reminders of what they've been through. despite that, we are seeing some signs of progress. the utility company's ceo said he wanted to have that happen here by today and we can tell you, we just went to a gas station on the outskirts of town. they do have power back on, and

they also have their water turned back on. that is a sign of progress there. at the same time, people just, you know, day after day digging through their belongings through the wreckage of their home trying to salvage what they can. we talked to one woman, brenda morris, her family of 11 was inside their house when it collapsed here at rolling fork. they've now had to move in with a relative, all 11 of them. here's what she told us yesterday, take a listen. >> how long do you think it will take to rebuild? >> i really just don't have an idea. i really don't. the whole community, the whole town, a little town like rolling fork, you know, is demolished and gone in the blink of an eye, it's just gone. never would have imagined something like this. >> reporter: we should mention her 8-year-old nephew jeremy recovering in the hospital, the only one of that family who was

injured. he should be okay. president biden now planning on visiting mississippi, that sort of detail came up during a scrum with reporters. someone asked him if he was planning on coming. he said yes. we don't know the day that he's planning on coming. we don't know where specifically he plans to visit, but this is obviously the hub of the damage, so it would make sense. a lot of people waiting on those federal resources to make a difference in what they're seeing in their day-to-day here. perhaps that visit might instill some confidence in that process. >> and it always takes so many resources for the president to travel to a disaster area. you've got to find that sweet spot where you're not taking away from the recovery effort. i know that's part of what they're working on there. maggie vespa down in mississippi. thank you for your reporting. up next, time's up for tiktok on government-issued devices anyway. as the u.s. debate intensifies over banning the popular chinese-owned app entirely, we try to answer the big question. what's so dangerous about tiktok anyway? >> there are tens of thousands of apps that have, taken as much

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jacob ward set is out to find out. >> asked whether it's compromised national security and the answer is pretty clear. >> have you seen evidence of it? >> to. to date, no. we tend to wait until after the crisis to do something about anything. >> it's what could happen that seems to be the basis of the federal employee tiktok ban taking effect. >> the right model here is less a smoking gun and more of a loaded gun. >> reporter: the threat is two-fold. the ability to feed propaganda to the population through an app used by 1 in 3 americans and the ability to monitor those 150 million people on a near daily basis. >> i think if you were an intelligent risk and you wanted to have the ability to buy on and build profiles on a significant portion of a population, there's no better way you could do it than by creating the incredibly fun app. >> tuck tok isn't that

functionally different from any social media platform. >> there are tens of thousands of apps that have take in as much data as tuck tok that have less scrutiny. >> reporter: but it's almost impossible to look inside any social media company because while the u.s. requires transparency about financials of public companies or safety recalls in cars, it does not mandate any data transparency standards. >> it's just about anxiety about the role these platforms are playing and not having enough data to know if things are true. >> reporter: chinese law require they cooperate with intelligence services, but in his testimony last week, the ceo insisted tiktok is not controlled by the chinese government. >> bottom line is this. american data stored on american soil by an american company overseen by american personnel.

>> reporter: the white house is demanding its parent company either sell or face an outright ban. >> it's really important that we view what evidence we have in the context of the totality of the circumstances of the motivations of the chinese communist party when it comes to information and communication technology platforms. the index should be high. >> reporter: a ban would achieve parody. after all, china banned our social media. >> if tiktok wants to work in the united states, china has to be open to western social media. it just seems like a fairly obvious point. >> reporter: what we do know is that experts have told lawmakers for years that there's a correlation between rising rates of depression in young people and the rise of social media of all times. >> in the hours following social media use, teens report increases rather than decreases in loneliness. >> reporter: perhaps that is the risk to go after first. >> overwhelmingly, the danger here is the fact that the kids

are not all right. one thing the united states could do very easily is just say social media is banned under 18. you resolve 95% of your tiktok problem that way. >> our thanks to jake ward for that report. we should note we reached out to china's ministry of foreign affairs. they say their government has never asked a company to collect private data in violation of local laws. before we dpo, a quick programming note. this sunday join my msnbc colleague for the culture is aapi. she's leading a thought-provoking conversation with women who discuss their lived experiences and defining moments in life. among them an intimate conversation with actor and lgbtq activist margaret cho. tune in this sunday at 10:00 eastern on msnbc and streaming on peacock that's it for me this hour. i will be back tomorrow. jose diaz-balart starts next. t. jose diaz-balart starts next

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your brother has landed in the dark lands. they're under bowser's control. [ screaming ] hang on, luigi. [ ominous music playing ] [ screaming ] yes! fire! [ chuckling ] good morning, 11:00 a.m. eastern. i'm jose diaz-balart. 48 hours later, still no clear motive in a deadly school shooting in nashville. what we are learning about what happened before the shooting and the victims. outrage is building after at least 38 migrants die in a fire at a detention center in mexico. men left to die in locked cells as the flames broke out.