good day, i'm chris jansing live at msnbc headquarters in new york city. today american democracy is in completely new territory, and the american legal system is

being tested like never before with the indictment of donald trump now secured, we'll look at the legal challenges and the stakes for the country as well as for d.a. alvin bragg as he undertakes one of the most consequential cases in u.s. history. and while the legal issues play out in court, it may end up being the single most animating issue of the presidential campaign as well in fact, it's already turning the 2024 race on its head, turning trump's adversaries and his defenders and setting the stage for an election unlike any other. even in new york city, which is no stranger to security challenges, police are dpeering gearing up in a way rarely seen, bracing for potentially huge protests outside the courthouse and trump tower in particular. how are they preparing, and what besides protests are they preparing for? but we start with the test ahead for manhattan d.a. alvin bragg can he make his case at trial and turn the first ever

indictment of a former president into the first ever conviction here's what we know right now. while the indictment is yet to be unsealed, nbc news has learned it contains roughly 30 counts of document fraud-related charges and trump's attorney is making clear that trump will not take a plea deal in fact, his team is planning to challenge the indictment to try to get the case thrown out before it ever gets to trial all of this is just the first glimpse of what will be fought, not just in court, but across america with people divided over whether this indictment proves the american justice system is fair or fundamentally broken >> i feel very concerned about the rule of law in this country because it endangers the rule of law for all americans. today it's donald trump, tomorrow it's a democrat the day after it's, i don't know, your friend. the day after that it's you or me. >> it is also, i think, a vindication of the rule of law and a principle that people should be held accountable whether they are rich and

powerful, whether they're president ths or former presides or whether they're ordinary citizens. >> so much to talk about i want to bring in nbc's garrett haake who's been camped out in front of the d.a.'s office in manhattan. nbc's dasha burns is outside mar-a-lago in west palm beach, laura jarrett is nbc's senior legal correspondent. and glen kir in kirschner is a federal prosecutor and msnbc legal analyst. garrett, what's the latest what have we learned today >> reporter: chris, as you pointed out, the grand jury voted to hand up this indictment yesterday. it remains secret and under seal, but we've been able to report there are some 30 separate charges in this indictment, mostly relating to document fraud now, most of what's going to happen between today and tuesday are behind the scenes negotiations with trump's attorneys and the d.a.'s office as well as some planning by secret service and the various security apparatus in new york city you can hear some of that behind me, an ambulance coming behind me as they try to prepare for what will be the second sort of truly

historic day in this process that will be the day where donald trump has to come into the city to be arraigned he will stand before a judge in the courthouse behind me after surrendering, after being fingerprinted, after having his mug shot and a dna sample taken, all of that done while he is under the protection of his secret service detail. another unprecedented moment in this case. now, in that same interview, joe tacopina said he wouldn't hole up in mar-a-lago and drag this out further, but everything else about how that's done and the manner it's conducted is uncharted territory and has to be worked out from a logistical perspective and again from a legal perspective here as the d.a., informing the trump attorneys of this first step last night, and i have no doubt more conversations going on probably even as we speak. >>. >> almost certainly. glenn, i want to play just a little more from trump's attorney, joe tacopina who was talking about those 30 counts.

>> if it's correct, it means they've taken each transaction, each check, each payment, each entry and made it a separate charge i still think it's going to all rise and fall on the issue of this settlement agreement, a very legal, a very common settlement agreement, and how it applies to campaign finance laws >> is that what this is all about, glenn is this really just taking one case and turning it into a whole series of different point by point by point points of interest and turning that into 30 charges >> we don't know because the indictment hasn't been unsealed, but we will know soon enough i guess i wonder whether defense attorney tacopina has ever drafted an indictment. i've drafted hundreds and i find it amusing that he complains that it may be the prosecutors set out a separate criminal charge for each check. well, chris, when we indict -- let's assume that you have

donald trump signing ten checks over the course of ten months as a part of a criminal scheme to defraud or in furtherance of campaign finance crimes, or to cover up crimes, you don't just draft one count and say, well, donald trump wrote a whole bunch of checks over ten months. that would actually be the subject of a motion for, for example, a bill of particulars, and it would be proper for prosecutors to set out in separate counts each check that violated the law that donald trump wrote. now, that doesn't mean he will be punished or sentenced separately for each check. all of the sentences might be run together, run concurrently, but i think right now mr. tacopina is playing to the court of public opinion, not to a court of law. >> and that can be the job of a lawyer both to the court of public opinion and in court, but when we're going to look at what might happen in court and we don't know what's in this indictment, but what will you be looking for? >> so let's say that it is this

falsification of business records charge, which we all believe it to be based on our reporting. that's normally a misdemeanor. were we to elevate it to a felony, which we believe the grand jury has indicted on,you need to have an intent to commit or conceal another crime i think that's a little bit confusing to people because they're trying to get their heads arndsound what is the firt crime. the first crime would be the falsification of saying that the reimbursement payments to michael cohen, trump's former lawyer, were legal expenses when, in fact, they were not legal expenses it was hush money, and it was just disguised as legal defenses that's the falsification to up that to a felony there needs to be something else, and the something else is what we just don't know, and that's the number one thing i will be looking for as soon as this indictment is unsealed. >> let's look at a few maybe clues that we have, glenn. all along we've been focused largely on stormy daniels, but nbc news has learned that the grand jury was also taking questions about hush money paid to another woman, karen

mcdougal how would that fit in? what other pieces of the puzzle do we not know about that might lead us somewhere different. >> i have a feeling we're going to be surprised about the breadth and the scope of the indictment once it's unsealed. we know that david pecker, head of the national inquirer seemed to be in the habit of running these catch and kill operateions it seems like at least infer rentally they were designed to help donald trump retain plausibility as a presidential candidate. we also know allen weisselberg was mentioned on the covert reporting made by michael cohen when he was discussing the hush money payments with donald trump. so i have a feeling, you know, we may even seen a conspiracy charge because we know there was a conspiracy between donald trump and michael cohen. we may learn that there may be other co-conspirators. perhaps david pecker, perhaps a allen weisselberg.

as i say, i think we should know some of the answers to these questions come tuesday. >> so in legal terms, conspiracy would up the ante, glenn >> the beauty of conspiracy fwr a prosecutor's perspective, anytime people enter into a conspiracy, which is just an agreement between two or more people to commit a crime and then one overt act, one thing that one co-conspirator does in furtherance of committing the crime, all of the co-conspirators are criminally responsible for all of the crimes of all of their fellow conspirators, whether they participate in the crime or not, so it really does broaden the scope of criminal liability. >> so that's one possibility for the question i'm about to ask you, laura they used to i'm told in legal circles call this a zombie case, right? all but dead and suddenly it gets resurrected. >> many times over. >> which would suggest to you alvin bragg has something more, not just more than he had before when he said huh-uh, but also

let's fill in the real world, he is doing this historic thing, indicting a former president and current presidential candidate. >> part of the reason it kept resurrecting back from the dead, at least according to the book of mark pomerantz who was the former special prosecutor who worked on this case. the reason it kept coming back, they thought it had jury appeal, they thought the facts were simple they thought they could tell a simple story and get a conviction the problem was that legal hook. they couldn't figure out how to get it to a felony they commissioned outside law firms to research it, to try to figure it out, and the previous district attorney cy vance couldn't get there because they passed on it, that's why you hear the president say no one ever wanted to prosecute this. it's a dead case it doesn't mean bragg didn't find something else. he opened a new grand jury they heard different testimony they heard from witnesses. they collected documents, they subpoenaed things. we just don't know what else he

has. at this point without seeing the actual document, it's really too early to prejudge. >> let's take it to mar-a-lago, and dasha, do we have any clues about what's going on behind closed doors there >> reporter: well, look, chris, despite the media blitz that some of trump's representatives are doing right now, they've been somewhat quiet on the actual strategy here, and that might be because there's still a lot that they don't know, and there's a lot still that we don't know but here is what we can tell you. we know that trump right now is at mar-a-lago. he's likely huddled with his media and legal team talking about -- including the logistics for the arraignment next week. that's one thing they have to get figured out, but one thing that we heard from his attorney joe tacopina on the "today" show this morning in his interview with our colleague savannah guthrie, he's saying he doesn't know if this will actually make it to trial. he said they still have several

legal challenges that they are going to front not providing details on what those legal challenges might be. one thing he did say pretty adamantly, though, is that there is zero chance that the former president takes a plea deal in this case to prevent it from going to trial but again, not giving any strategy about how they're going to prevent that. one of his attorneys, though, jim trusty, who's actually representing trump in another case in the classified documents case said on cnn today that he believes that trump's legal team will try to dismiss the charges against the former president saying that i would think in very short order you'll see a motion to dismiss saying we'll likely see pretrial motions to dismiss in, quote, days. but again, all the lawyers including those on trump's team have acknowledged that it's impossible to predict anything right now as there is still so much we don't know until that indictment gets unsealed, chris. >> i think a motion to dismiss

at least, laura tells you something about it, right? it's very unusual, isn't it? for something like this to be dismissed. >> not necessarily judges can throw it out if they think there isn't an actual legal hook to the case it remains to be seen again what actual evidence the district attorney offers to support this idea but one of the things i'm going to be looking for during the actual arraignment is to see what the judge says about any conditions placed on trump and what he can say about this case. he has been posting up a storm about not only the district attorney, but any number of other characters associated with and given the security risk, i'm going to be really interested to see if the judge issues a gag order. defendants have a right to vigorously defend themselves and claim their innocence all they want they don't get a right to threaten prosecutors and threaten the administration of justice. >> who could a gag order cover >> trump >> just trump? >> it can cover anyone the judge thinks to have a defendant also be running for office at the same time just presents a whole set of interesting legal issues

we've never seen before. so that's why from a first amendment perspective, it'd be interesting to see whether the judge wants to go that far orbit. >> laura jarrett, dasha burns, glenn kirschner, thank you so much how does this affect 2024 and trump's campaign how law enforcement is planning for the unprecedented surrender of a former u.s. president throughout the next two hours, we'll also bring you major developments in the other big stories of the day including what's happening right now down in mississippi president biden is there visiting a town decimated by a deadly tornado as millions across the south and midwest brace for even more severe weather. we'll keep our eye on the president's movements and bring you updates on that and the tens of millions of americans who are expecting harsh weather this weekend. you're watching "chris jansing reports" only on msnbc behold... all that talent! ♪ this is how we work now ♪

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so we just got the first comments from ivanka trump, the president's daughter who was a senior aide to the president when he was in the white house, and here's what she says it's very interesting. i love my father and i love my country. today i am pained for both i appreciate the voices across the political spectrum expressing support and concern as you may know that when the former president decided to run again, it was clear that she and her husband jared kushner were not going to be part of this

campaign they were parts of the previous campaign and the administration. she simply says now i am pained for my father and my country the charges against donald trump may indeed complicate his run for president, but they don't stop him, of course, from running. that we know, but critically what we don't know is how the indictment will impact trump's campaign and the race overall. brendan buck is the former communications adviser to house speakers john boehner and paul ryan also with me former prosecutor and msnbc legal analyst charles coleman. i guess if we're going to talk about 2024, one important question is how deep could this go into that campaign? how long, typically, might a case like this take? >> chris, a case like this is usually going to take a year, a year and a half from start to finish. >> wow, so it's going right up into cthe campaign >> absolutely. it's important to understand, i said a case like this. this particular case may take longer because i'm anticipating

a number of different legal maneuvers by donald trump's defense team i do see motions to dismiss at a number of different turns, more likely than not to the point that the judge probably will ultimately end up admonishing them and telling them stop filing motions to dismiss. i think that that's going to happen i've said before and i'll say again, i do believe that we are going to see an attempt to try to change the venue in this case outside of somewhere in the five boroughs all of that is going to extend the time deeper and deeper into election season. >> so brendan, if this does go deep into 2024, does it help or hurt trump >> you know, it sounds crazy, but i have to say it helps him at least in the nomination look, the republican party in my experience has been completely fine self-sabotaging itself in pursuit of a good fight, and donald trump now has himself a good fight that, as you discussed, could last the next part of a year as long as he is seen as fighting against people who he is portraying as out to get him,

i got to think that that's actually going to help him look, the republican party right now, the base of the party loves to see fighters. they care about who your enemies are, but perhaps the biggest thing that's going to help donald trump here is we're just going to keep our eyeballs on him for the next year. i think he's going to be able to starve his opponents of attention, which is really the most important thing if you're trying to knock off donald trump, who's got a commanding lead. you've got to find some way to grab ahold of this narrative, and i think he's going to keep our eyes on him for a long time, and that's ultimately probably going to help him. >> the fascinating thing when i combine what charles just said with what you just said, you have a situation where he could be using legal strategy, which is to file, file, file, file, delay, delay, delay, as a political strategy >> look, if he finds himself in jail in january or february, that is very bad, you know, around the time of the first states that are voting in the primary, absolutely. but if this is drawn out and

he's able to just be playing victim, which is of course his favorite thing to do i really do think this helps we can't just look at this in the context of this one indictment there could potentially be other indictments and it's very possible that there becomes such an accumulation of trouble that people just think he is unelectable, ask that might be the thing that could hurt him the most. >> does the constitution say anything about a presidential candidate running while under indictment or somebody becoming president while under indictment or running with a conviction >> this is safe to say that this is not a scenario that the founding fathers basically saw or forecasted. no, it does not, and the thing that you have to point out or that i have to point out is you use the word candidate basically you're talking about citizen trump. you're not talking about president trump, you're not even talking about former president trump because as far as the constitution is concerned, none of that matters. you're talking about an everyday citizen. now, as far as him being elected

in that sense, there's a question of him being able to fulfill his duties, which would invoke some constitutional provisions however, with respect to him just being a candidate, no, that does not necessarily affect him, which is why the indictment or potential prosecution from jack smith becomes paramount because as of right now, he is the only one that has the potential to put something forward that could completely barge him from holding office again >> oh, boy, charles, brendan, fascinating conversation thank you, guys, so much. and today the manhattan d.a.'s office is again slamming house republicans for what it calls unlawful political interference in the ongoing criminal prosecution of former president trump. nbc's ryan nobles is on capitol hill ryan, tell us more about how the d.a.'s office is responding to the request by republicans for information that is tied to the trump case >> yeah, you know, chris, for some time the three house committees led by republicans

here in washington, the administration committee, the oversight committee and the judiciary committee have been lobbing back and forth letters to the district attorney's office requesting information. they've gone as far as to suggest that alvin bragg the district attorney should come before these committees for a transcribed interview. the d.a.'s office making it clear today after the news of the indictment broke that they are not under any circumstances going to just wholesale comply with what the house republicans are asking for, and they are also making it clear that they are not going to allow these requests from congress to interfere with their investigation and accused jim jordan, the chairman of judiciary, the other chairman to try and use politics to get in the way of their investigation and they even took it a step further by suggesting that these republicans are actually looking to undermine an attack people

involved in this process it says, quote, you and many of your colleagues have chosen to collaborate with mr. trump's efforts to vilify and denigrate the integrity of elected state prosecutors and trial judges and made unfounded allegations that the offices' investigation conducted via an independent grand jury of average citizens serving new york state is politically motivated, and it's important to point out here, chris, that there is very little that the house -- these house committees can do to enforce their requests to the district attorney they could take the dramatic step of offering a subpoena of the district attorney alvin bragg, but he could even fight that subpoena in court if he felt necessary so a lot of this is just political theater and it's not going to amount to much because this is a state prosecution of which the federal government has very little, if any, jurisdiction chris. law enforcement and the secret service are are preparing for a historic stress test next week as the former president is

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for you in front of the manhattan d.a.'s office where former president trump is likely to appear on tuesday afternoon for his arraignment. his surrender being coordinated between the secret service and trump's team now, we also just got this video in it is the new york district attorney, alvin bragg flanked by increased security inside the courthouse nbc's peter alexander is at the white house for us and also with me former nypd commissioner and law enforcement analyst dermot shay let me start there i suppose it's not a huge surprise that they're giving alvin bragg extra security given the death threats among other threats against him, but generally with him and beyond him, what are the pressure points right now for nypd? >> that's not at all surprising. the district attorney ordinarily has a protective detail that's manned by the nypd certainly in this time that is

going to be -- i would expect it to be stepped up, and unfortunately, i would expect the rhetoric -- as the rhetoric steps up and we approach finality, whatever that looks like, that the threats will unfortunately increase and that security will only go higher and higher >> the mayor's office said this morning that there are no credible threats to the city at this time, but you also know that there are also always concerns about what they don't know, right? where do you see the main concerns obviously there's a lot of talk about these protests, both around trump tower and certainly downtown by where the dea is what other places, what other things are nypd and other law enforcement looking at right now? >> well, as weigh the facts that are coming out, you know, that area of lower manhattan, as we all know, is no stranger to protests you have police headquarters you have the federal courthouse,

the manhattan d.a.'s office all within fairly close proximity to each other it's not at all out of the ordinary for large protests to start there and then wind through different locations in manhattan. this i think will be different, obviously trump tower will be a focus, but this will be ground zero i can't see it playing out any other way, and it will certainly put a stress on both federal authorities and the nypd that i will say upfront i am absolutely certain that they can handle that in terms of making sure that whatever has to take place in the criminal justice system does so without incident, but there's no other way to describe this, i think, than the potential to turn into a circus the longer this goes with protests, counter protests, threats of that nature, of any nature that are coming in whether it's both sides on the former president, on

prosecutors, so it is going to be -- make no mistake, a test that only grows going forward. i think that the initial appearance, however that is decided upon to take place will be the tip of the iceberg, and as you watch something that will play out at least at a minimum months, if not much, much longer, there's going to be a potential for this to really take over that section of lower manhattan. >> so peter, we know it's not just nypd. what's the secret service saying about their role in this >> yeah, so chris, as you noted the secret service has been responsible for coordinating with new york authorities about these unique seacircumstances. now that mr. trump's legal team has been notified of the indictment, officials say more specific conversations are taking place they're continuing today on the transportation, the security needs for former president trump to comply with the pending legal charges. our kelly o'donnell speaking to the secret service earlier, and

the service describes its role here as facilitating the transportation and personal protection of mr. trump, not taking part in the arrest or the surrender itself, they're going to coordinate with the new york authorities and mr. trump's lawyers for his appearance and movements to make sure he's able to surrender safely which we're all going to see play out together on tuesday, chris. >> i also want to ask you about an apparent contradiction. the former president's lawyer says this mornina.anted trump to secret service does. what's going on with this disconnect >> you got mr. trump's lawyer, joe tacopina, he confirms that the manhattan d.a.'s office wanted mr. trump to surrender today. tacopina along with other aides rebuffed that request saying the secret service needed more time to prepare the secret service is denying that to nbc.

two secret service officials telling nbc news that mr. trump's detail could be ready to transport him to new york at a moment's notice, that they are simply taking orders based on the date the manhattan d.a. and mr. trump's defense team agreed to, that agreed to date we are told is now tuesday. >> peter alexander, dermot shay, thanks, guys. in other news, extreme storms are expected to slam over a dozen states today, severe thunderstorms, strong winds, and tornados that could put more than 50 million people at risk in the midwest and mid south heavy rain and flash flooding expected to hit the mississippi valley, then quickly move through the midwest and tennessee valley through the night. the risk area also includes parts of mississippi that were already so badly devastated by tornados last week that killed 26 people. a major test for the nation as the u.s. enters uncharted terrority. what's really at stake for the world's oldest democracy

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so many unthinkable firsts have occurred since donald j. trump was elected to the white house in 2016. peter baker writes in the "new york times," so many lines have been cross so many unimaginable events have shocked the world that it is easy to lose sight of just how astonishing this particular moment really is history is full of people who have had trouble with the law, particularly politicians from ulysses grant, to richard nixon so gary hart, but never truly a moment like this msnbc political analyst and princeton professor eddie glaude joins us now you know, there are so many things that donald trump has done that sunk other politicians in the past that he shrugged off, norms that he's broken that people have gotten used to, but to peter baker's point, how

astonishing is this particular moment, eddie? >> oh, it's historic it's unprecedented in the history of the most stable democracy in the world, in the history of the world, we have never had an occasion where we've had to hold accountable by our criminal justice system a former head of state or a head of state and so we've always carried ourselves as, in fact, the most stable democracy the world has ever seen, and typically in these sorts of moments it reveals the fractures, the fault lines at the heart of the politics so this is unprecedented it is a reflection of a crisis point. and we can't understate that even as we try to understand the rule of law, you know, try to down play, we don't want to fall into the trap of melodramatic, but we have to understand it for what it is, it's an historic

moment. >> some will see this indictment as proof that no one is above the law. other people are looking at this as a sign of a weakened democracy. they think it's a dangerous new precedent or a case of judicial overreach. so you know, if there is something it tells us about the state of our democracy, what is it, we certainly have heard the argument that it's under threat. is it weakened is the separation from left to right so big that already it's weakened where is our democracy right now, and what does this indictment say about its strength >> wow, we are in a cold civil war. there's no doubt about it, and that cold civil war falls along the lines of republican and democrat and that of course has racial and class undertones and overtones, but we're in a cold civil war. we can't deny that, and trump is an avatar. he represents all of these sorts of grievances, these fears, this sense of marginalization, the

skepticism about government, about the other and the like, and so all of this is out in the open and this trial -- and i think there will be cascading indictments, this is just a first of others to come, i believe, it wears the weight of those divisions. and you know, you said something at the beginning of the question, chris, that's really important. there are those who already don't trust the government, and if the government doesn't hold this man accountable through a fair and just process, criminal justice process, they will lose faith and trust in the government so we are, shall we say between the rock and the hard place as it were. we have to do what we have to do either we believe in the rule of law or we don't, and that seems to be at the heart of the matter. >> you make me think, eddie, about the video we just saw which was alvin bragg surrounded by even more security than he

normally would be and the pressure on that man, which, yes, he is getting death threats, we're not in any way understating how he and his family have been under attack, but when you look at this through the lens of what it might say about our democracy, what it might say about the rule of law, it almost takes your breath away that so much of that is about what he has decided here and how he's going to perform in the days and weeks and months ahead, eddie. >> it's one of the ironies of this moment, you know. you know, the serpent wrapped around the e legs of the table upon which the declaration of independence was signed was the serpent of slavery here you have a descendant of slaves holding one of the most powerful men in the world accountable. as reverend sharpton said this morning on "morning joe," it's an indication of the power of american democracy, but it's also an indication of the tensions here.

ask and let's be clear, we have an ugliness on the underbelly of this country we have done some ugly things and so we need to hold d.a. bragg in prayer. we need to hold -- we need to protect him because we know what we're capable of, and we don't need to be naive about that. >> eddie glaude, it's also so enlightening to have you on the program. i thank you for this conversation, have a good weekend if you can given everything that's going on appreciate it. >> you too. we've got new reaction to trump's indictment here and abroad how might the former president's legal troubles impact the perception of america around the world. and to what extent does the indictment energize trump supporters his former presidential primary rival former ohio governor john kasich will join me ahead.

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matter that former president donald trump will be returning to new york city a week after his arraignment, which is scheduled for tuesday in order to sit down for a deposition in a separate case. this one will be for the new york attorney general's civil fraud case against donald trump. he is expected back in new york the week of april 10th this deposition was scheduled for earlier this week, but then was postponed. we haven't gotten a comment yet from the attorney general's office people here in the u.s. and of course around the world have been weighing in on the news of donald trump's indictment, headlines about the first prosecution of a former american president are topping newspapers and websites all around the globe. for more, i'm joined by nbc news correspondent yamiche alcindor in washington, josh lederman is in lon don. i wonder what voters are saying now that the long waiting game is over, would he or wouldn't he, alvin bragg has indicted the former president.

>> reporter: well, a key question, chris. when you think about this historic indictment of former president trump, it is not only historic, it is also deeply polarizing for americans across the country. we've been hearing from people all day about their thoughts, which really in a lot of ways is really in some ways it shows their political affiliations and really is tied to how they see this from a political lens take a listen to what we've been hearing. >> i think it's been a long time coming i'm hopeful that it actually works because i feel there could be a lot of negative repercussions if it doesn't go through or falls apart i worry that some of his followers are going to resort to violence. >> there must be something there or they wouldn't bring it forward, i mean, i have no idea what the outcome's going to be i'm not hopeful from wha i have no idea what the outcome is going to be i'm not hopeful from what i read. >> alvin bragg is my d.a., and i'm very upset with him. i think he needs to resign. >> reporter: a lot of opinions

there. the thing we are seeing both in what people we were talking to and also in public opinion polls, a new quinnipiac poll shows 66% of republicans see this as politically motivated while something like 66% of democrats, around 60% of democrats they see this as being motivated by the law there is a split there when you think of republicans versus democrats and how they're viewing this, chris. >> josh, we haven't heard anything, at least i didn't see anything as i was looking for comments from world leaders. what are you hearing from your post in london >>. >> reporter: you can understand why foreign leaders are loathe to weigh in on this. they don't want to touch this with a 10 foot pole. there's no up side especially many of these foreign leaders don't know if donald trump could well be president again some day certainly, the media across the world is following this closely with newspapers here in europe running headlines fairly gleefully, such as germany's newspaper, historic decision in

the usa, donald trump must go to court. in france, the newspaper, the headline, stormy daniels, the porn actress who has become donald trump's little big problem. and here in the uk, the tabloid "the mirror," donald trump sends fundraising e-mail minutes after the indictment drops in the u.s., this issue isn't as polarized, democrat as it is republican as it is in the united states. several londoners say if he did what he's accused of, he should be held accountable. take a listen. >> i think he should be as liable as anyone else. >> i totally agree >> it sounds wrong, so, yes, he should face a lot, yeah. >> and, chris, even though the indictment of a former president is unprecedented in the united states, we should point out it's not quite as uncommon as in

other parts of the world, including in places like israel where prime minister benjamin netanyahu is currently facing corruption charges and in pakistan where former president imran khan faces dozens of charges including terrorism and incitement to violence chris. >> josh lederman, yamiche alcindor, thank you so much. we have a major up date from rome pope francis is expected to be discharged from the hospital tomorrow that means he can be at palm sunday mass at st. peter's square on sunday last night, we were told that the 86-year-old ate pizza for dinner with hospital staff, and this morning he read newspapers while having breakfast before getting back to work francis was hospitalized on wednesday with bronchitis, and he has been receiving iv antibiotics. this is the firsint dictment against donald trump, but will it be the last the other investigation still pending and the potential consequences next.

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your brother has landed in the dark lands. they're under bowser's control. [ screaming ] hang on, luigi. [ ominous music playing ] [ screaming ] yes! fire! [ chuckling ] the new york indictment of donald trump one in a web of legal challenges surrounding the former president, of course, and the other investigations could pose even more severe legal consequences here's nbc news chief white house correspondent kristen welker. >> reporter: the bomb shell indictment against former president trump is just one of several investigations still swirling around him. mr. trump has dismissed all of the probes as politically

motivated witch hunts, aimed at preventing him from retaking the white house. >> the new weapon used by out of control nhinged democrats to cheat on an election is criminally investigating a candidate, bad publicity and all. >> reporter: the largest threat to mr. trump might be the investigations being led by special counsel jack smith he's looking into the former president's handling of classified documents after the fbi last summer seized thousands of documents from mr. trump's mar-a-lago home, including more than 100 marked classified after he refused multiple requests for authorities to turn them over. this week, the former president was asked by fox news whether he took boxes with him from the white house. >> this is the presidential records act. i have the right to take stuff. >> reporter: the special counsel is also investigating mr. trump's actions surrounding january 6th. the former president has dismissed the entire

investigation as a horrendous abuse of power >> the special counsel investigations into mar-a-lago and january 6th pose a greater threat to donald trump because they're broader in scope and generally speaking, federal crimes carry stiffer penalties. >> reporter: a fulton county grand jury has recommended indictments for multiple unnamed people into potential interference in georgia's 2020 election where mr. trump narrowly lost. one key element, this phone call between mr. trump and georgia's secretary of state >> i just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have. >> all of it an unprecedented legal web for a former president of the united states kristen welker, nbc news we'll dig deeper into trump's other legal battles in a moment, but first, we've got a lot to cover in our second hour

of "chris jansing reports," let's get right to it. ♪ at this hour, it may be days before we see the full indictment against donald trump, but we are getting some new details. roughly 30 counts against the former president for document related fraud. his own attorney says trump was shocked by the indictment, but they're already planning legal challenges to stop this case before it gets to court. we'll go live to mar-a-lago with the latest president biden not answering any questions about his predecessor while touring tornado damage in mississippi. can the white house stay above the fray the latest on trump's efforts to channel republican outrage in to cash one republican senator specifically calling on supporters to donate to trump's cause. our nbc news reporters are following all the latest deve