unreported information tha cohen handed over to manhattan prosecutors and what his forme fixer might do at the trial. plus, how many handier alvin bragg made his case for do senior official, andre weissmann will join me to talk about that he says charging trump was required by the rule of law. after the break, the other major story this week, tha wisconsin's state supreme cour race, -- we'll explain why this electio should matter to every america and a whole lot more i may be in mohyeldin. let's get started. oh >> tonight, we have a muc deeper sense of -- and the reason it has taken so long to get to this moment thanks to a pair of stunning new revelations. breaking earlier today, lann

davis, michael cohen's attorney, we will speak to in just a few moments, confirmed to axio that his client provided manhattan prosecutors with documentation about a trum hush money payments made to second woman who claims to hav had a affair with them that suggests the case b district attorney alvin brag could actually be broader than the stormy daniels payment also breaking -- pressed about why trump was in not charged earlier, he told msnbc today that he was aske to stand down by his the bosses >> we are looking at these so-called hush money payment and then we learned from the southern district of new yor that they asked us to stan down and i stand down i mean they were communicating that they had this ongoing investigation in the west that we put ou efforts on hold while they completed their investigation. and i felt that it was

appropriate for me to press th pause button so for the course of more than a year and a half now, that is what we did. i was surprised, after michael cohen pleaded guilty, that the investigation from the souther district on that issue did not go forward >> so, this request, thi request to stand down, cam under the trump justic department to be clear here, we don't kno exactly how or why - to not taking action we have no direct governance that there was any political interference in the case here's what we do know we know from the public record that donald trump has penchant for tending t interfering investigations tha pose a threat to him we also know that trump has penchant for putting pressur on the southern district of ne york after all, trump's - jeff sessions fired then u.s drone attorney general piepe are from his role. overseeing the souther district after he refused

request to resign. in months later, he said h believed that if he had stayed donald trump would have aske him quote, to do something inappropriate. years later, the trump appointee to oversee the southern district of new york, jeffrey berman, released a book in that book, he alleged tha trump sought to use the u.s. attorney's office to support trump's politically, and pursu his critics, even pushing th office to opening a criminal investigation of forme secretary of state john kerry. so, while we can't reall connect the dots, maybe you, the audience, can. a short time ago i spoke about these developments and a whole lot more with michael cohen' attorney, lanny davis. watch. >> lanny davis, thank you so much for joining us. this morning, former manhattan da cy vance revealed to nb news that he was told to quote stand down on the trump hush money investigation. by the u.s. attorney's offic in the southern district vance went on to say that afte

michael cohen pleaded guilty he was somewhat surprised that the federal government did not proceed on the areas in whic it had asked him to stand down what is your reaction to tha revelation what do you make of the. >> first of all, the souther district could not prosecute a sitting president under th justice department's policy. but they did some very strange things that i believe an inspector general of the justice department shoul consider-y looking into. for instance, -- of the united states, i thin the simpson would be that mr trump directed him to do this, or know he was doing it, calle jeffrey berman and asked for a reversal of the michael cohen guilty plea. there were other things i coul mention that are quite problematical us to the conduc of the southern district including abusing mr. cohen on a friday afternoon, telling hi lawyer that if he doesn't plea guilty to all of these counts, including not even having chance to look at the ta issues, by monday morning, fro

friday afternoon when things are shut down, monday morning, if you don't plead guilty, now we are going to indict you o monday morning, including your wife this is something abusive. and i at least raise a question, that should be looked into b the inspector general after th justice department >> you've also revealed that your client, michael cohen, ha provided manhattan prosecutors with documents related to hush money payments made to a secon woman who claims to have had a affair with donald trump can you tell us who is tha woman, and one of the potentia implications for alvin bragg's case if there are two women, and multiple hush mone payments into its center >> well again, trying to b very careful about what i ca and can't comment on, it is matter of public record that the southern distric prosecutors under donald trump stated in writing that trump directed michael cohen to pa the hush money payments an then they called that a seriou crime impairing our democrac

in, so many words. what i can tell you is tha michael was forced to plead to a second crime involving karen mcdougal even though he did not pay any money in that situation, tha money exchange occurred betwee the national enquirer and kare mcdougal to keep her quiet before the election. mr. trump was involved in th understanding that he would be paid the national enquirer 150,000. michael did get accused of papering that transaction, but he pled guilty to that transaction. so that is the best answer i could say. the transaction involving kare mcdougal is the second crime there are witnesses to their crime that are not just michae cohen. and corroborating, detaile documentation, to him as well. >> as i mentioned, in others have described michael cohen i the star witness of this case, you certainly know the ins and outs better than anyone. how would you respond to som

of the criticism that this is potentially weak indictment, that involves a quote, unquote untested legal theory that might be politically motivated >> first of all, let me deal with the weakness facts. that is completely speculate by people who don't know i think. i am in the room all the time, for many meanings, at leas seven, with this particula group of prosecutors i've talked to michael countless hours. i know what the facts are in the case and it is substantiated by o documents, emails, tex messages, telephone calls. it is a very strong factua case - to the jury. what is donald trump motivated by politics when he directed michael cohen to pay the hundred $30, 000, not connecte to him, rip for the election with the promise to be repaid? and he didn't repay him. while he was president of th united states -- that is the question for the jury to decide they will have to decide

whether michael cohen -- political ramifications an right before the electio within one or two weeks, mr. trump directed according t federal prosecutors, and according to michael cohen directed michael cohen to pa the money. it is a pretty strong case actually on the law, i can only say there are different statutes i new york that seem to be applicable and i can assure you that th da and the prosecutors hav studied this question and do not believe that the judge wil dismiss the case without allowing the jury to decide th basic facts missed on the law. >> you said that michael cohen would be a key witness in th trump trial. how do you plan to balance the obvious knowledge that he ha with the notion that cohen has lied before and that the trump team, and certainly trump' lawyers, will aim to paint him as a lawyer? >> i haven't heard a singl prosecutor, including cyru vance, former district attorney, say that that makes any sense.

organized crime cases are wo by prosecutors and they put on as witnesses, people of lied and committed crimes michael cohen did live for ten years. but he owned those lies an went public in front of chairman cummings and national television he said i am ashamed of my lies, i'm telling the truth for my country and my children. and this is something that a jury will have to decide t weigh michael's credibility. i also already said if it is a problem with michael's credibility, it can be sur that he is backed up multipl times with documents, phon calls, emails. he is not his word for anything it is corroborating everything he says. >> are you at all concerne about threats of violenc directed towards michael cohen or perhaps even yourself a this case gets underway? >> so owed rather not answer that question. i'm told that people who are professionals, that yo encourage crazy people if yo

they think you are concerned -- has already shown that he is willing to call him up to th capitol and to try to have a insurrection while he is watching tv and not doing thing to protect even his ow vice president we know that it is indisputable no republican worries abou that yet they say it is politicized action of this particular case by the da in manhattan, even though the same facts, the federal prosecutors found that michael -- cohen had to go to jail for th same facts so i am a little bit concerned about mr. trump's willingnes to, at least let's say, -- protest, protest, protest, but he didn't see with no violence i'm worried about mr. trum encouraging people to do violence the way he did on january 6th. >> mr. lanny davis, we appreciate your time thank you so much for insights festival >> thank you

i appreciate the invitation. thank you. >> next, my sunday night panel will break down what we just heard from lanny davis but first, my friend lecture louis is here with the headlines. -- >> president joe biden sayin he has contacted officials fro states impacted by severe stor systems that ripped through th south midwest and th mid-atlantic, the storm killed at least 30 people and also -- for arkansas where the storm struck a couple of countie there. in tennessee, 13 people have died after you have two tornad swept through multiple countie friday night, none of th deaths were in buildings wer -- according to local law enforcement. then in indiana, five people are reported dead after at least three tornadoes were confirmed to have hit th states we will continue to watch th story that is happeng inrigh now. more ayman with me and mohyeldin right after this break. they customize your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. with the money we saved, we thought we'd try electric unicycles.

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in a panel for reactions to my conversation with lanny davi and everything else about th trump indictment in hi upcoming arraignment joining me now are katie better, new york times reporter an msnbc contributor, give it cag austin, professor -- york university college of law and joe walsh, forme congressman of illinois. he was also 2020 presidentia candidate. it is great to have you with us david, let me start with you i will play for you what lanny davis said in response to tsai vance's claim that he was told

to stand down by the souther district of new york on th hush money - >> there are other things like mention that are quite problematical as to the conduc of the southern district including abusing mr. cohen on a friday afternoon and telling his lawyer that if he doesn' plead guilty to all thes counts, including not even having a chance to look at the tax issues, by monday morning. so from friday afternoon, when things are shut down, to monda morning, if you don't plea guilty now, we are going to di on monday morning, including your wife. >> you know, lanny davis and very well respected lawyer he chooses his words well. -- doing a river -- when you look back, certainl what we have been seeing fro republicans talking about th indictment against trump a weak or potentially should b dismissed because it was located in 2016 in the sdn were looked into this, and h davis is throwing cold water o

that he's making serious revelation there. >> lanny, who is a very seriou and well practiced old hand in washington, i've dealt with him, he makes a very important poin here first of all, the trump, under trump, the justice departmen wasn't the u.s. justic department it was the trump justice department we saw - all sorts of behaviors and having subordinates throug them that are just not appropriate for the justic department it is very valid point that he is made here about how his client, michael cohen, was treated. i thought a lot about th segment. you pointed it out very well prosecutors used people wh have committed multiple murders, commercial murders, in order t make cases this case, i have said repeatedly, will not be single string. it will be a fabric of interconnected crimes that the will reef together for the jury >> katie, lanny davis also

talked about how in his words, michael cohen was forced t plead guilty to a second crime involving karen mcdougal, th former playboy model who als claimed to have had a affair with trump even though he didn't pay an of his own money in that situation, what you make of the? >> i think what lenny is doing is trying to show, he is tryin to distinguish between michael cohen the man who pellet guilty, who went to jail, versus michael cohen the witness. as he just pointed out, th government has used witnesse in the past, if we pull it bac from the specifics, because don't want to dispute disput -- plead guilty they don't do it because the want to. whether his client was force into doing a, what he is distinguishing between is th idea that someone can be a convicted criminal and someone can still be a valid witness he also brought up the goo point that there has been a lo of evidence to support michael cohen's testimony. that is something we would expect he would never want anybody to bring a case based on a single person's testimony

he would never won a cas brought without documentation. i think what he does he se brings that up again and again to say, we matter what you think of my client, this is no only is testimony, it will b supported. is not the only person thi case relies on i think he's just trying t remind viewers that there is the michael cohen who they might have an impression of, versus what michael, cohen actually brings to the table i this prosecution >> yeah. it's really good point republicans and critics of thi have tried to claim -- lanny davis responded to tha specific criticism he says that factually it is a very strong case ultimately, he bolted down t -- whether trump was motivate anyway by politics kne director michael cohen to -- my can understand why lann

davis is making that point this is an affair -- decided to run for office. the payment must meet when h was running for office >> amen, what lenny said tonight is another stark reminder one of the most outrageous aspects of the watch for day is that every republican going after this indictment, calling it a political witch hunt, and they don't even know what th indictment is. they have no idea what these charges are. -- robert they haven't seen it yet. -- but plenty tonight was fascinating because -- and michael cohen. this will, i think, exhibit pattern of behavior, o business fraud behavior, fro donald trump, for a long time.

>> let me switch gears t another important intervie that happened today. i'm sure you all saw it. david, i will start with you o this -- cy vance exploding with my colleague jen psaki earlier, this is what - served time in prison. >> conceivable, yes. but i wouldn't necessarily think that is the likely outcome. simply because it is the lowes level felony it has a maximum priso sentence of four years and minimum prison sentence of n time of literally just probation an some non - carson tory restrictions some one without a crimina record would not be sentenced, typically, to incarceration if you are convicted of any level funnel >> what do you make of that? could we see trump in barr's

for this indictment? >> i think on this case, sid vance junior has it right. first of all, we don't ver often imprisoned men my age wh are first time offenders secondly, it is a low leve family if what we believe it's the internet that -- there could be something muc more serious, that cy vance an nobody else, none of us know about. but the more likely thing woul be a house arrest, if that wer the case, trump tower rather than a place where he can go and play call. but probation is a distinc possibility in this case that is not the same with th matters that jack smith is investigating from the justice department they are very serious. >> yeah. some of noticed, potential pollen oldie if in fact they ultimately get to that level katie, david, joe's, quick stick around we will squeeze in a quick break. we will talk to next in the.

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ok hon, we know you're clean. we all go, why not enjoy the go with charmin. just because the alleged perpetrator's next president doesn't mean that he is abov the law. manhattan da alvin bragg has apparently presented north o dance for a grand jury to vote to indict donald trump but i appears that new york stat prosecutors have never filed a election law case involving federal campaign before an legal experts say this might make it a risky case but it doesn't necessarily mea it easy week one, as trump's allies have suggested over the past couple of days. fact, as my next guest pointed out, he says charging trump is required by the rule of law. andrew weissmann, nbc lega analyst and senior member of

special counsel robert mueller's took to -- why trump should face the same penalty for the crime that michael cohen was prosecuted for. writing in part, quote, it would be anathema to the rul of law not to prosecute th principle for the crime when a lower level conspirator ha been prosecuted. andrew weissmann joins me now. andrew, great to see you again thank you for making time fo us this evening. with what you wrote in tha guest essay in mind, i want to get your reaction to what we have heard today from cy vance he revealed to my colleagu chuck todd that the southern district of new york asked him to stand out in the hush money payment case, even thoug michael cohen had alread pleaded guilty what are the implications of this, do you think >> sure. it is great to be here i think one thing that peopl need to understand is it is no that unusual for state prosecutors with other state prosecutors, or federa

prosecutors with state prosecutors, or federa prosecutors with federal prosecutors, to have what ar known as turf disputes that is, that you really don't want to competing sets a prosecutors trying t investigate the exact same thing. does not fair to the people wh are being investigated it is not really good li enforcement. there is enough crime to g around and so you really want to make those decisions. so, i wasn't shocked in any wa by the southern district makin the request to the da's office a course, the da did not hav to agree i found it was more interestin that the southern district was that apparently told by th then attorney general to sto after taking a plea from one participant in the conspiracy, because the other conspirato was donald trump the reports are that you had

the attorney general of th united states saying, do not continue any investigation which is permissible under the doj rules. i worked on the muelle investigation, that was very much an investigation into the conduct of the president of th united states. the only thing you couldn't do under dj policy is actuall charge the president you could investigate. so i thought that was the very interesting part that there was a stand dow from the attorney general to the southern district of new york, and then apparently th southern district then boote it back to the da's office which is why we are in the position where we are in now this is a state case, not federal case >> yeah. i don't know if you had chance, andrew, to watch the interview i did with lanny davis, at the top of the hour. he called with the souther district of new york, this i his word, not mine abusive. do you see that possibly i being abusive? >> yeah. i did watch it

and it was fascinating kudos to you for having that interview. you know, i was going to reserve on exactly wha happened, because of course we only have lanny davis, his sid of it. and just, when i was listening to him, one thing i could thin of is that it is not unusual for a prosecutor, afte negotiating back and forth wit someone, to say i have to give you a deadline this can go on forever most defense councils don' want to ever have a deadline that they don't want to have we want to keep putting things off so you don't totally kno how it happened. one thing i can say is just th new year allegation by lanny davis is going to play int donald trump's hands the state level, because donald trump is claiming that michael cohe pleaded to something that is not a crime. that is one of his defenses. that this campaign finance

crime is not really a crime, that this was a stretch. and if you have michael cohen' lawyer saying well, this i really sort of shoved down m clients throat, that i something that is going to b used by the former president but i don't really understan from lanny davis's point, he i a lawyer, he is a defens lawyer, if he didn't think i was a crime, if he thought thi was abusive, there are thing you can do you can appeal this. you can go to higher ups, it i not like the southern district doesn't have supervisors - so either you wouldn't ethically have your client plead to something you thought was not a crime, so i do think this is to be continued, but i do think that the mere allegation by lanny davis is not a good thing for the manhattan district attorney' office >> interesting i really appreciate your tak on that. it will be interesting to se how that plays out we are several years later obviously, it stands now tha alvin bragg thinks he ha

clearly been able to make case against donald trump. otherwise, we wouldn't be in this point take us through how you thin he was able to do that how do you think he was able to, i guess, bring back to lif this case, so to speak do you believe that there must have been some new information that has come to light or that he has become aware of that has brought this back t the top of his priority list >> i do. that is what i would call an educated guess we are going to know a lot mor on tuesday, when the indictments and seal it will likely be the speaking indictment it will be references to som of, not all, but some of the evidence and we may learn more than we know now about tha evidence i guess i suspect that there i a reason that alvin brag initially, when he took office he had real background any too a political hit by saying this case is not ready, and one o

the prosecutors resigned quite publicly, has now admitted tha he gave his resignation letter to the new york times. and there are a lot of reall disparaging things in that letter alvin bragg withstood all of that and stuck to his guns as career prosecutor and kept his head down and investigated and i really just think that i he is willing to do that, ther has to be something new. there has to be new evidence there is to be teams that du into the facts more to develop evidence that would satisfy hi as to why this was now a righteous case when it wasn' before so i strongly think that we ar going to see evidence that was developed in that year when he was in office. >> andrew, you and i hav spoken many times on thi network. but this is the first time w have you on my show. thank you so much for coming on hopefully it will not be the last we will the talking to man

times in the days ahead. >> my pleasure >> thank you, andrew best of luck next, republicans are up i arms about biden suppose weaponized - we will look at that and w will take a trip down memory lane to all the times trump di precisely that >> >> >> (screaming) defeat allergy headaches fast with new flonase headache and allergy relief! two pills relieve allergy headache pain? and the congestion that causes it! flonase headache and allergy relief. psst! psst! all good!

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paradontax blood when you brush could lead to worse over time. help stop the clock on gum disease now. parodontax toothpaste... ...is 3x more effective at removing plaque bacteria, one of the main causes of bleeding gums. parodontax. the gum experts. >> for all the gop uproar about the weaponization of - supposed political motivatio behind alvin bragg's investigation, republicans see to have a very short memor when it comes to some of the fearless leaders and his own track ticks. president donald trump calle for the prosecution of hillary clinton, he also called fo former fbi director james come to be investigated he blocked then speaker nanc pelosi from using a military plane in 2019 to visit troop in afghanistan andrew mccabe, the former fb director was fired by th justice department deprived of his pension after trum

criticized him for his role in the russia investigation as we mentioned earlier, trump while in office, repeatedl pressed senior doj officials behind closed doors to targe former secretary of state john kerry. and now, here we are 2023 according to nbc news, trump has been reaching out to republican allies on the hil to consult about their publi defense of him against da alvi bragg, including their efforts to investigate brag. this is only a snapshot of how trump has used his power to go after people he perceives as enemies. so here's my question. who is the real victim here? my panel is back with me t talk about that and more david, i'll start with you two and three house chairs hav been pointed by speake mccarthy to investigate alvi bragg's investigation and th grand jury indictment. their house judiciary -- chairman brian steele. they were on fox this mornin talking about doubling down on

investigating bragg post indictment watch. >> everything is on the table, maria. we will talk with the othe chairman and look at the response, we just got hi letter back, we are reviewin that we think that this is, here is the thing, maybe the mos important thing. we think this is bigger. this involves all of us. >> we look at federa government taxpayer dollar going to district tierney' across the united states, in particular progressive da' that are not imposing the rule of law and our streets, do w need to rewrite how thes grants are being written >> david, reaction well, i can remember whe republicans -- put it back to the states an if they are fair creatures, th local governments. alvin bragg was and elected by the people in manhattan, new york county. he is presumably carrying ou the wishes of the voters here. we have a federal system the states are co-evolved to

the federal government, in - congress has no role whatsoeve here there are lots of issues the could be looking into. there is no shorts or problems in this country. but they are not interested in those. they are playing games here an trying to strip people up. i don't think this will last a long time. donald has got a big bunk righ now. is not the kind of thing tha they need to endorse >> joe, given everything that outlined in this set up, all that is the times that he ha weaponized his power in hi government to go after perceived enemies, do you thin republicans like jim jordan, kevin mccarthy or ryan steel even recognize the hypocrisy o what they are seeing in doin right now? >> yes and no, a man look, my former political part is a cult. i served with jim jordan i served with kevin mccarthy we screamed about the debt whe

-- didn't say boo-boo about the debt when trump was president. bill barr was the politica attorney general i've seen i my lifetime. jim jordan went after eric holder, didn't say boo about bill barr. david is right we real against big oppressive federal government, republican do, and now they are going after a local da look, they are beholden to trump. my former political party is a cult they cannot ever publicl oppose their cult leader and that is trump, just one poin of disagreement with my friend david, this is going t strengthen trump politically so what, no one is above the law. but he is going to be th republican party nominee and heaven help us >> katie, what kind of precedent that thi investigation by republicans into allen bragg - could open the door to - buy progressive prosecutor even one trump isn't involved?

the point i want to make her is that, you are talking about a manhattan da who has jurisdiction over the plac where the electric crime happened this is not some democrat low, democrat da and some rando state that has no jurisdiction over the investigation where this case. >> so, i think this is going t open the door to republicans continuing to talk about the things that they want to do to progressive da's this is not a new conversation this is a very liv conversation under the administration of donald trump keep in mind, even when he was president republicans -- local police departments, loca law enforcement. they talked about it but the couldn't get the votes i congress to do it. there was real opposition from policing groups, policing -- there was real opposition from a broader array of law enforcement organizations. it is the sort of thing that i a better talking point than it is something that could ever get done to get the votes in congress to get this passed, it i really hard for me to see that happening. there's so much good - many of those grants are filtered through the justice

department you can only imagine how muc opposition there would be from the justice department, whic me saw even when donald trum was president, even when bil barr was attorney general, eve when jeff sessions was attorne general. there was opposition to this and for good reason, because there was worried that even if there were progressive da' that the attorney generals and the donald trump disliked, there could be greater damag done in terms of ripping awa grants plus, there was in the court some of these efforts that failed as well there were efforts made to tak money away from sanctuaries, because they were defying th trump administration's policies, -- so it is much harder to do thi and i think the members of congress do this so what the are looking for is a great talking point, they are lookin at a great political talking point in the air looking a something they're hoping to us -- donald trump so as long as the wind i blowing -- there it will use this talking to disappoint him. the minute that goes away if i does, obviously the othe

panelists no politics while we better than i do, they wil grow choir i think it is as simple as that this is not something that can actually happen in the rea world. but it is a great thing to say on television. >> listen, really quickly, and we're almost out of time, wh did somebody like jeb bush fee inclined to come to the defens and do the bidding of donald trump at this point? he's not a politician anymore. he's not running for office, he's not a lindsey graham or ted cruz why is he doing what he's doing, do you think >> amen, if you need any evidence that my forme political party is irreparably broken, cannot be saved, you nailed it. jeb bush, he comes to donald trump's defense. enough said. the party is gone. >> thank you all, the three of you for your time tonight, and for your time this, nigh greatly appreciated, as always great to see you next, we're less than 48 hours away from what's possibly th most consequential election of the year we're going to set that up, an

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janet -- would flip the court to th left, and would make it much more likely that abortio rights and voting rights wil be protected in this state what's more, the court could end up voting on a hugel consequential motion, as t whether to overturn the result of the 2024 presidential election according to nbc new conservative candidate danie kelly, who was involved in a plan cooked up by trump allies to reverse the state's 202 election results with, quote fake electors. back, then the court cam within one vote of a blockin joe biden's win. that's how close it was. if another challenges brough in 2024, the outcome might not be so favorable if the conservative candidate winds o tuesday. joining us now is wisconsi former lieutenant governor mandela barnes great to see you again, thanks for coming back on the show. we've been previewing this election on our show for sometime now, following it closely for weeks, because w

believe it's so consequential. let's get some personal news here this is your state, you serv the people of wisconsin, wha specifically are you mos concerned about here >> thanks for having me. , the fact is that the will of the people as the opportunit to be challenged by a rogue, extreme supreme court justic in dan kelly i've had a chance to know he for the last ten years, now an she has always prioritized fairness, she's always prioritized respect for th rule of law, which is exactl the opposite of what dan kelly has done he advised to overturn the 202 election the will of the people shoul always be the law of the land. it's a supreme court justice that actually understands that on top of that, we have th 1849 criminal abortion ban, we have the issues of clean drinking water, and also issue like universal backgroun

checks these are things that people i the state of wisconsin support but even been able to se realized because of partisan gerrymandering that has rule the day. things can change in wisconsin we can return to full potential. >> one of the bigges differences between the two is obviously on the issue o abortion we know the abortion rights ar on the ballot. dan kelly is an advocate how much is at stake here fo reproductive rights? you just alluded to it wit that law >> i'll tell you, it's been al three antiabortion groups. but they believe that they would make their own choice, making their own health care decisions. it seems simple, but for peopl like dan kelly, it's ver complicated, but it shouldn' be complicated people should have reproductiv rights, and should be able t make those choices on their ow without interference by extrem politicians. again, we've got the 184 criminal abortion ban, women's in wisconsin cannot get an

abortion tim kelly thinks that wome should be criminalized, thinks that abortion provider shoul also be jailed for providing medical care it's absurd. >> wisconsin has been called the most gerrymandered state i the country, it's somethin that we've also put th spotlight on at this show, favoring, republicans given th majority of where they live an democrats live how would the election affec that and how potentially the 2024 election cycle >> i'll tell you in ron hours, the fact the republicans hav 64 out of 99 seats in the stat assembly, and yet did not ge more than 51% in any statewide vote last year, or las november, that shows you jus how wildly gerrymandered w are. we have had a number o challenges to our -- and in the u.s. supreme court, it got kicked back down. ultimately, we were dealt severe blow by the state supreme court. again, this goes back to her

valuing of fairness, valuing justice, valuing a mor representative democracy we're not seeing actua represented democracy, because we don't have that right now i wisconsin, given the unfai district lines that thes legislators are elected to these unfair districts tha they are elected to. elected officials are choosing their voters, when voter should be choosing the elected officials. another issue that we should b simple and plain another issue area where dan kelly just doesn't seem to b understanding of this law. >> one of the things tha happens as we see a lot with republicans, trying to distanc themselves from donald trump and in the run up to the election with the voters to tr and win some of those moderate voters in fact, he told msnbc news, david -- daniel kelly said that he is not looking for any endorsemen from trump the intercept has reportin that one of the major funder behind the group that helped organize the january 6th rally

is pouring millions of dollars into this race how concerned are you on the influence the election deniers like these kinds o organizations, have on thi race >> dan kelly is the chosen candidate of election deniers, that's how we got out of the primary in the first place extending by republica billionaires who are already going to great lengths t overturn the election. he said he's not looking for donald trump supporters, but the fact is that he did work t try and decertify the election results in the state o wisconsin. he already did, that and i can tell you, whether he say publicly that he wants the endorsement or not, the realit is that donald trump wants him on the supreme court >> what's your message t voters going into tuesday, mr. barnes >> my message to everybody out there on tuesday is that the future of the state of wisconsin depends on the democracy, depends on it quite literally. their lives depend on, it thei

lives to get impacted, regardless of where you realiz it or not with this election it's about fairness, it's abou respect for the rule of law, it's about reproductive freedom, it's about safe drinking water and it's about making sure tha people in the state of wisconsin actually have thei voices heard, and that the wil of the people will truly be th law of the land. >> former wisconsin lieutenant governor, mandela barnes, we will certainly be watching tha race very closely, and the outcome come wednesday thanks very, much always a pleasure stick around, a lot more eamon in just a moment connect your business, you can make it even smarter. now ports can know where every piece of cargo is. and where it's going. (dock worker) right on time. (vo) robots can predict breakdowns and order their own replacement parts. (foreman) nice work. (vo) and retailers can get ahead of the fashion trend of the day with a new line tomorrow. with a verizon private 5g network, you can get more agility and security. giving you more control of your business. we call this enterprise intelligence. from the network america relies on.

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right now is msnbc's katie fang, leading an honest an thought-provoking conversation with pioneering asian american pacific islander women she is joined by political strategist, business mogul, an oscar nominated screenwriter julia cho, and more. plus, an intimate conversation with a comedian and lgbt activist, margaret show. watch that next on msnbc also streaming on peacock. thanks for making time for us. make sure to catch us on msnbc saturdays at a, sundays at nine, and follow us on twitter tiktok, and instagram at eamon msnbc. until we meet again, have good nhtig