down to three large pine trees forcing the gulf turned it t suspend action there were no reported injuries, thankfully around 50 people had to scatte to safety, in the course had already been cleared earlier i the day for 21 minutes, with storms passed through the area as well. pretty astounding there, thankfully, again, everybody was safe, nobody was injured that wraps up for me everybody. i'm yasmin vossoughian, i'll b back in the chair tomorrow at pm eastern symone starts right now. >> greetings, everyone you're watching symone we are kicking things off with one of the most blatant an agree just threats to ou democracy have ever seen three state representatives in tennessee put up four expulsio with two democratic electe black representatives losing their seats. all over peaceful protes against gun violence my exclusive interview with th tennessee three, it's coming u next and two contradictory decision on the abortion pill

mifepristone, first, federal judge in texas invalidates the drugs fda approval, hours later, a judge's ruling in anothe case, saying the opposite. that abortion rights advocat leans in on what the dueling rulings mean, for women' access to potentiall lifesaving care. plus, the case against donal trump. we'll dig into the facts behin those 34 felony counts acros falsifying business records, i new york and where the histori prosecution goes from here i am symone sanders-townsend and i have something to say. ♪ ♪ ♪ 136,378 people in tennessee ar now without representation i their own state house, all thanks to the action of th republican majority. yeah, this week republican

lawmakers in tennessee, treate the second memo with mor reverence than the very bedroc of the republic they claim t love i'm talking about democrac itself as parents students and legion of other everyday tennessean's demonstrated against gun violence, passionately but peacefully, at the state capital last week, in the wake of that deadly school shooting in nashville, three democratic state representatives who ha the chance to interview, justi jones, justin pearson an gloria johnson, they stood i solidarity with protesters marching to the well of th house, to demand their colleagues support gun safet reform three days later, the trio now known as the tennessee three are fighting for their jobs. not by addressing the voters who elected them, a republican supermajority vowing to punish them republican house speaker cameron sexton, even link thei peaceful protest t insurrection with no investigation, n consideration of a censure o some other legislative penalty tennessee republicans wielde their power to call for th expulsion of the duly electe

tennessee three. well johnson narrowly survived the expulsion vote representatives justin jones and justin pearson, the tw youngest black male legislator in the body, did not moments later, on the capito steps, their resolve was stronger than ever >> they thought they won today they don't realize, they don't realize what they've started they started a movement they can't stop, they thought tha we were creating good troubl there, we're on the outsid now. >> sometimes to get from the periphery in the back of the house, you have to go to the will of democracy. and demand that democracy be true for everybody and not just with rich white men in suits >> if the republicans goal was to silence these goo troublemakers, it was far from a success. the tennessee threes expulsion sparked even greater protest and skyrocketed the tennesse legislature to the top of th

national news cycle. the trio had a virtual discussion with president biden, where he thanked them for thei example, and vice presiden kamala harris made a sudde trip to enlist even more tennesseeans in the fight fo democracy. >> a democracy session does no silence the people, you do not stifle the people, you don't turn off their microphones whe they are speaking about th importance of life and liberty >> well, well, well. let's remember how we got here folks. after yet another school shooting that killed three children, and three adults republican lawmakers continued their bulwark against common sense reform, banning thei colleagues from the people house, but refusing to ban weapons of war in the streets. i traveled to nashvill yesterday, to sit down with th tennessee three. it was their first joint interview since thos unprecedented expulsions, and began by asking, now forme representative justin pearson, about the devastating real lif

impact of unfettered access to firearms here's our conversation. >> yeah, the proliferation o guns in our communities ha real ramifications legislation being passed at th tennessee state house that makes it easier to access a gun, has real ramifications so, i say the names of larry thorn and dr. nelson, who were murdered due to gun violence and it's really important that we understand this moment as a catalyst about what happened but they're being laws tha have led to this happening, an there's also been inaction >> so, let's talk about th expulsion. representative johnson, by one vote, you are still a sittin member of the tennessee stat legislature. why do you believe you are not expelled >> because of the color of m skin >> so, would you say that th members, the republican member of the tennessee state legislature are racists? >> well, i would say that i wa sitting in criminal justic

committee, discussing a bill where we were -- they would like to add the firing squad and the electri chair to the methods for capital punishment and one of the members said, i think we need to add hanging b a tree so, he called for a hate crime this is just a few weeks ago and we hear comments like this from the time i've been up there, i have heard comments like that. on multiple occasions. and we gotta, man, kind of apology. you sat in a committee and called for a hate crime, h still on that committee. we were stripped of ou committees >> i will say, as i wa preparing to come down t nashville today, i got message from folks that said, well, hope that representative jones and representatives pearso continue to keep their cool. continue to stay calm. and i don't know about you,

felt unsettled by that why did it unsettle you? >> because what happened yesterday, was an act of violence it was a public lynching, it was an attempt to humiliate, a attempt to beat down, and to really make an example out o us what was outrageous, the thing you heard during that fake trial. and which, a centrally, they were saying to represent a person and i, we are up 80 - they might have called us boy. they did not treat us like college, they do not treat u like equals, and they neve have >> why do you think it was thi particular moment that moved this body to take these extrem measures why was this moment different? >> an institution is ver

difficult to change. and even in a moment o persecution, it will do what i is intended to do, and a institution that has its pillars built by white supremacy and by patriarchy, will still produce a similar result, even in the persecutio of the minority. the two youngest black lawmakers, the one of only two democratic women in the stat house. so, in this moment in time when we were all up fo expulsion, race, which wer told not to talk about, -- race >> we're told race doesn' matter >> raised as a matter. if you just act like us, rac doesn't matter, if you just do what we tell you to do, then you'll be okay so, that race, again, became the defining factor, between the separation of what happene to representative jones and i, and representative johnson >> i just have to say, we're talking about the patterns o an institution, we are talking about what is embedded at th

heart of an institution. there are many members tha came before you that sat in th seats that you all set in. i think that there's som intergenerational friction going on is that accurate >> yes epresentative jones will say though, i'll say this abou some of the ancestors, docto cooper, who's served distric 86 for 86 years. there have been some extraordinary folks who have resisted in the ways that they thought best at that moment in time who have allowed us th opportunity to be here the truth is, we canno continue to operate in a ver old way of thinking. and a very new moment. in tennessee, in america history. it's very similar to what we tell people who are republicans, who talk about the immutabilit of the second amendment. we do not live in 1776 where w need a militia, you have t have a reality check on what these rules, what these laws mean in this present moment.

and to our colleagues in the state house, we do not live in the era of the 1950's or 1960s or 19 hundreds, we have to liv in this moment we have to operate in this moment, and act in this moment >> what would you like the current members of the democratic caucus in the state house to do? >> we have to be honest abou how the culture on capitol hil claude - but it's much more comfortable to conform it's so interesting to me, i said, you are disruptive in th well that day. >> who was the day >> the charges were. the resolution and the reality is, when w first walked in those rooms, that was the disruption. the movements, the communities the people we represent, tha embodiment, that was the

disruption to a body that is s defined by white supremacy patriarchy, implantation capitalism that was the disruption. >> well, members on th national state council, as w speak, as we have this conversation, 24 of them hav gone on the record saying, they're going to support invoked to send you back to th state house. and they're gonna vote o monday are you confident that you wil be back in the state legislature next week? >> i appreciate the act of solidarity from our loca leaders, so, i think the question that's gonna be wit cameron sexton, he said lawyer will tell us in the capital, w can't come back until the next general assembly, which is i 2025 >> i don't want to make sure i get this right, the speaker of the tennessee state house -- >> his attorneys >> his attorneys, they reached out to you all via your -- >> they stated at the end of the resolution, you ar expelled from the 113th genera assembly

so, the ethics attorney stated you won't be able to return. but then we looked - we talk to constitutiona attorneys, so, it seemed lik that can't uphold. nothing about this was constitutional, number one now, they're gonna say again we're gonna go around and make up our own rules as they're so used to doing and say, we ma try and room refused to state. you >> representative pearson, you represent memphis. and memphis is not the memphis city council, it is the shelby county commissioners who would have to vote to send you back to the state house. now, and pc news has not com from this, i told you i was in the nashville streets today, and i heard chatter, amongst members of the state legislature, amongst folks locally, here. people who i know in memphis who said that, there is concern that if the shelby county commissioners do move i support of you, that memphis i

350 million dollar ask that is currently before the state legislature to fund a projec in the city the convention center, -- >> stadium >> that they are concerned tha ask will be pulled, it would not be met have you heard that? >> i've definitely heard tha rumor. i further some lobbying by people in positions of power t make that happen i am not sure if it's 100 an true, no one has to come and told me, what they're about to do the question for our count commissioners, what price ca we be bought for i don't think there's a pric for our democracy, i don't think there's a price for ou citizens who want to make sure their voices are heard, on a issue as important as gu violence right? i really believe that ther will be members of the count commission, and a majority o them, seven of them, who would vote to ensure district 86 continues to hav representation, with a threa that that is coming from som folks, to take away funding, this deals with the way that the state government operates. the budgets passed by the stat

legislature. and to be able to control young, black representative, i is to wield money. as a stick against a majorit black county for making sure that they have someone who is representing th voice of the will of the people >> you know, we know that we have a retaliatory administration we are seeing it in legislatio against our major cities it's constant. it's kind of remarkable, it' almost like a mob, literally they came into my office, hr came into my office wednesday, i guess it was, the day before our expulsion hearings it was the woman - the head of hr and our ethic lawyer, our ethics lawyer. and the head of hr said, well, we just want to come and have talk with you, i wanted you to know, if you are expelled, you will lose your healt insurance.

and then the ethics lawyer say to me, well, you know, you remember so and so, he was potentially up for expulsion and he decided to resign, an that way, if you resign, you don't lose your health insurance. >> did you feel intimidated in that moment? >> i didn't feel intimidated, knew what they were doing. >> i am going to have more o my conversation with the tennessee three, the only time they've been interviewed together since the expulsion votes after the break. i want to talk about the support they're getting from the president and vice president, concerns for thei safety, and what happens whe the state house is back in session on monday. and later, as last night rulings on the abortion pill sink in, we're gonna break dow what they mean for women, what they mean for america, and why they're not the last word on women's access to this healt care first, all are besties here, m colleague richard lui with today's top stories today. >> the ten is a three. some stories we're following for you this hour, pope franci

presided over an easter vigi at st. basilicas today he had to skip a good friday event yesterday, the vatican said it was due to cold weather, 86-year-old pope francis was hospitalized for three day last week, received treatmen for bronchitis the biden administration has a new call to release wall stree journal reporter, evan - russia formally charged hi with espionage friday, saying, so says russia nugent sees also saying that he also entered his denial the white house knew statement restated that he was not, an has never been, a spy. nor has he ever worked for the u.s. government. and the justice department confirmed to undersea news and investigation was opened int the potential leak o classified pentagon documents. documents were found on tw major social media platforms just this week, they appear to show details about ukraine's military strength, and other sensitive war information. it's unclear when they wer first posted, if they were altered, and who might b responsible for this the defense department is also investigating this matter.

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legislature, the tennessee threes calls for gun safet reform and their warning against threats to democracy have captured the attention of the entire country i continued my exclusive conversation with them, by asking about the bigge picture. including potential lega remedies and whether after meetings with the president an vice president, they would cal on the justice department to investigate the situation. here's how forme representative justin pierso responded. >> so, we're really fortunat that the number of attorneys firms, organizations hav reached out, if there are ways we can should pursue legal remedies to our expulsions and we're hopeful that the wil of the people continue just go forward with potential reappointment, and potential elections, special elections coming forward as well >> but i don't have to press o this issue, because it would

seem to me, there's a lega challenge here at the end of the day, is ther not a liberal for th department of justice to play? >> absolutely. >> yes, that is something we can ask for, i mean, i'm willing to >> this whole process has been a force of our due process it's been a force of our constitutional system, o government everything about this, even th trial that they had, the verdict was decided before w even started talking the jury, the quote unquote ou colleagues, we're announcing t the media saying, we wer creating this myth o insurrection, creating thi myth that we were violence there was no due process i this, there was nothing abou this that was followed, we talked about, we were out of order. this whole process of expulsio was out of order this whole process of expulsio was an affront to any decoru or any decency or any system o ballots that were supposed t have in our government

and it was one man's decision, speaker cameron sexton, the on on the news, after that firs protest, lied on these childre and mothers, and then had to g from there to cover up his tracks and justify him calling a morning community, childre who came to the capitol, mothers and grandparents and community members, clergy, calling them insurrectionists. >> i know we have to go shortly, what did you ask the president or the vice president for today? >> i think one of the main things is support in thi moment we knew, and we said from th start, we're not gonna qui fighting and that's the reality we cannot quit fighting. we've we asked the president and the vice president for their support in this effort here in tennessee, and the south. were too many people, or t easily give up on what i possible here. >> what does support look like >> i think one action of solitary that we saw that wa so important, the united state

-- to make an emergencies stop in tennessee because a crim happened yesterday we're in a state of emergenc in tennessee with this undoing of the wil of the voters. that was an important action o solidarity, we know that it' not get in there, because so often, people look over states like tennessee for so long, we felt alone the nation has seen with this, just another day in th tennessee general assembly >> lastly, you talked abou monday, what is happening this upcoming week? do you all feel safe >> personally, i had several phone conversations abou getting security, that's something we are gonna mov forward with it's just in this moment, wher you have no longer extremism because this is just the way they operate monday well i might not be i the house, on the house floor, i will definitely be in th peoples house, chanting, singing, speaking.

in order that we can get legislation passed on this >> i hope the nation sees th moral insanity that, a wee after a mass shooting terroriz nashville, a representativ part of nashville, the legislature's response to that grief is not to pass commo sense gun laws it's to expel their colleagues for calling for action we were calling for an assault weapons ban. they responded by assaulting democracy. the nation needs to see what's going on in tennessee. >> the nation needs to see what's going on in tennessee representative johnson representative pierson representative jones i thank you all for your tim and just your voice. >> well i was in nashville, also sat down with several other democratic state lawmakers, including the minority leaders of th tennessee house and senate, an you'll need to know, america's policies are made in the

battles for democracy ar happening in the state legislatures right now tomorrow, on simone, i'm gonna have with the stat legislatures had to say abou their expelled colleagues, the politics of racism in tennessee, how this is affecting blac state legislatures across th south, and how this affect their efforts to govern. that is sunday, 4 pm eastern right here on msnbc. more today, angry reaction i pouring into that abortion pil ruling by a trump appointe judge in texas including one senator who says the biden administration ought to just ignore it. can they do that well, i'll ask a former justic department spokesperson, sta with us. st roster ever assembled. the monster, the outlaw... and you can't forget about the boss. sometimes- you just want to eat your heroes. the subway series. the greatest menu of all time.

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able to make decisions about our own bodies suffered ye another setback in the last 24 hours. access to medication abortio is now in jeopardy, fo millions of women, after a ruling from a trump appointe judge in texas the judge in texas, hi decision suspends the food and drug administration's longtime approval of the abortion pill, mifepristone it's the first pill in the two-step medication abortion the judge stayed his own ruling, giving the fda seven days to appeal, which means the pill i still available for now. in a plot twist, not long afte the texas decision, anothe federal judge, in washington state, issued his own separate opinion in a case, directl

contradicting the federal judg in texas judge thomas bryce, ordered th fda to keep mifepristone on th market ruling that the restrictions were quote, burdensome and unnecessary, because the fda had deemed the drug safe and effective. that decision only applies t 17 states in washington d.c. that suited to keep the drug available. the justice department acted quickly, saying, it woul appeal the texas ruling, so, where does that leave th abortion pill right now? well, joining me now are - the president and ceo of the national law center, and anthony coley, the former chie spokesperson for the justice department and i would argue a very adept legal in political analysts. fatima, a minister with you. you know, the fda approved mifepristone over 20 years ago on the market. it's been on the market, the plaintiffs in the case say 2 years ago, the fda rushed to make that approval so, what does medication abortion look like now, th

access, look like now in america? >> i'm glad you started with that i judge techs merrick's opinio was a vehicle fo misinformation it was approved in the yea 2000 he and i were still in law school at that time, i jus want it's been a while, an it's been used by millions and it is safe and effective it ha been a steady repeatedly ove the couple of decades that it' been a noose and more than hal of abortions in this country are medication abortion that context i think is important if you actually read his opinion, it is rife with right-wing talking points. >> can we talk about the opinion, i'm gonna put on th screen for folks the plaintiffs in texas, the actually sought out this judge and the opinion, the judge kacsmaryk commonly used word by abortion activist, unborn human abortionists instead o doctors. most judges would use the term fetus.

what conversations are you involved with right now in order to protect women, an their rights what is happening? >> the first thing i think people should know, abortion access is still available in this country and medication abortion is still available in thi country. i think part of what you'r seeing right now is an effor to confuse people on thi front. so, we're trying to get that information out. but i also think people have t be very, very clear about what has just happened. if he was -- to get his way, in a week, w might be in a different place. there is the second opinio that you named from th washington judge, now the fd is in a place where it has two giant lead conflicting opinion about what to do but if judge kacsmaryk and the right-wing groups that surroun him were to have this their way, abortion access in this countr would be highly restricted, an that is their goal >> it's just really knocking m

back we've got these two competin opinions, anthony, and the you've got democratic lawmaker weighing in, ron wyden, senator, democratic senato from morgan, he released a statement, in that statement he said, quote, i believe th food and drug administration has the authority to ignor this ruling, which is why i' again calling on president biden and the fda to do just that now, it's one thing to disagre with the rule, he's calling fo ignoring the ruling. democratic congressman ocasio-cortez -- went on television on th network and said the sam thing. can -- is it's gonna happen can they do that can they do that as over that before? >> i don't know for at tha point. >> why not >> even if, well, right now, what we know for sure, acces is still available and that's important, we now said it three times. it's important to reiterat that what i know for sure, i've worked at the justic department for two years including the last six month after the dobbs decision

i know for a fact that thi justice department is committe to protecting women' reproductive rights an freedoms i've seen it firsthand what i hope they do an continue to do is to, not just defend this lawsuit, but t aggressively bring forth affirmative litigation, as w saw in idaho, about three or four months ago. that's what the justic department needs to do, we als have a responsibility ourselves, simone, what we are seeing right now is just not an attac on reproductive freedoms, we are seeing forces on the far-right, we saw it i tennessee, trying to shut down legitimate debate. >> it's all connected. >> it's all connected. voting rights trying to limi access to the ballot box education in florida even trying to restrict th telling of history as painfu and as glorious as it is so, around the country, we nee

to pay attention to what's happening. >> fatima, you won - >> that democracy point is so, so important his opinion ignores science, i disregards the fda it ignores all president so, in a country that is a democracy, where things like the rule of law or tha important, we can't just ignor that and they brought this case i amarillo, texas, where he is - >> they pick this judge. >> they didn't just pick thi judge, they created an entir entity located in amarillo texas, so that they would be guaranteed to get this judge that's not just for shopping you're going to this judge because you have a hope that h will disregard science, that h will disregard law, that h will disregard the foundations that this country is built on. and tear a bunch of things dow in the process we all should be terrified

about that >> only about 20 seconds left, justice department appeal is gonna go to the fifth circuit, it's one of the most conservative in the country. what are the prospects there >> so, i suspect a new lawyer, i suspect they'll lose in th fifth circuit. and then it will go to the supreme court. >> dang, anthony, i don't trus the supreme court on this one. >> don't forget, there is competing ruling out o washington, the supreme cour is going to have to resolv this ultimately. that is where it will go >> well, i don't think get tha gives people lots of hope in america, we will be watching for team - thank you very much for coming in today, with a good easter jacket, anthony, you are staying with me. we have more illegal things to discuss. when we come back, i hav something to say about these dangerous developments involving women's rights t make decisions about their own bodies, and then, later we'r gonna get into march - about the 34 felony counts against donald trump in ne york and why da of an brig says h brought them don't go anywhere.

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a woman's right to make decision about her own body' butt back on the - and now in limbo, even i places where it's legal, following dueling opinions from-ing to judges this move is a product o overturning roe v. wade, our supreme court, which is unlike any other court that we have dealt with in our history, has made lower court judges, and frankly, lawmakers, feel empowered to make decision about women's bodies that take us back. this all stems from th playbook, i think i've discussed many times right her in this program, the culture wars their distraction. but they are the playbook of the republican party apparatus now, how long will people have to wait for rights to be restored decades? before other justices could be appointed? how many women will have to di for our current supreme cour justices to care whether it's an issue of a woman's right to make decision about our own bodies, or voting rights, or lgbtq

rights, take a look at what is happening in this country. take a look at what is happening in state legislatures when will it be time for the across the board, when will it be time for a justices to step up and shut down lawmakers wh infringe upon basic american rights i, frankly, think the answer cannot be for the people t wait and trust the system. because it is very clear, th system is, in fact, failing us the powers that be should be focused on the constan trampling of our rights, the powers that be, as i said, are not only supreme court justices, but the federal government the department of justice. or where is the attorney general when it comes to the lgbtq+ community why hasn't he stepped in for those state legislators wh were expelled in tennessee i think the silence is quite loud here, folks there still time let's decide what kind o america we want to be, let's get started, let's do the work let's make it a reality. this is serious. i'm gonna continue the

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lived out of under a lock -- donald trump was in cour earlier this week, makin history as the first president current or former, ever, to be criminally indicted. he was placed under arrest i new york, and pleaded no guilty to 34 felony charges of falsifying business records. trump called it a witch hunt but after the hearing, manhattan district attorney, alvin bragg, came with the facts about this a case, and said this about trump in the charges. >> these are felony crimes i new york state, no matter wh you are. we cannot and will not

normalize serious criminal conduct. for nine straight months, th defendant repeatedly made fals statements, he was payin michael cohen for lega services, he also caused other to make false statements we have a history in mid manhattan da's office, vigorously enforcing white collar crime >> this alleged cover-up included 11 falsified invoices we 12 ossify general ledge entries, and 11 checks falsely presented hush money payment as retainer fees, for trump' former lawyer, michael cohen about into the 34 felony charges of falsifying business records. meanwhile, despite the judge calls for trump to sto engaging in rhetoric that could, quote, incite violence, hi supporters aren't backing down according to officials, th judge presiding over trump's case has received multiple threats, since trump's day i court. and donald trump himself did not stop the attacks next week, prosecutors are expected to turn over the firs

set of discovery materials t trump's defense team, includin grand jury minutes, exhibits and notes of witness statements joining me now to discuss, kathryn christian, she's a former manhattan distric assistant district attorney, she's also an nbc news and msnbc legal analyst. anthony coley is back with us, he's a former chie spokesperson for the justice department catherine, i'm gonna start wit the 34 felony counts the falsification of busines records, it's a felony in ne york, when it's done to concea another crime. does the ea brag have to prove what those are the crimes are? >> well, he has to, if you'r saying that he actually afte name what they are, no he has to show that there wa an intent to commit or conceal he actually did, during hi press conference, if you rea the statement of facts, hint a if not explicitly that he' envisioning in new york stat

election violation, that's a misdemeanor under new york state law, where you conspir to promote a campaign by unlawful means he hinted that there is a ta related crime, that these fals statements, by either mr. cohe or the national inquirer, am i was done to mischaracterize fo tax purposes he's clearly stated that he' talking about the federa election law, and also, fals statements by ami. the law does not require him t specify, techs fraud, insuranc fraud. but he did say that he is thinking of for different crimes that mr. trum allegedly committed. >> so -- >> so, he attended to commit during this arraignment hearin on tuesday, last tuesday, th prosecutors in the case noted, they are requesting protective order, and workin on a protective order with the trump team, because they are concerned, frankly, that

evidence is posted on social media, or used for political purposes one of the things that the requested, we don't know i it's gonna make it into th final protective order, donald trump only be allowed to revie materials in his lawyer' office how unusual of a request i this type of protective order? how do you even enforce it >> it's unusual for a case lik this usually, we request that, in cases, violent cases o organized crime cases, we have a fear of witness safety to do it in a case like this you're basically saying to the court and to the defense attorneys, we don't trust th former president of the united states i'm actually surprised when heard, during the arraignments the prosecutor in defense were agreeing to it i can't imagine any defens attorney agreeing to that. you are entitled to challeng it, and have a hearing, which expect the defense attorneys will do. and if they lose that hearing, under new york law, they could then go to the appellate division

>> okay, so, anthony, afte this, we saw the arraignment house republicans they jum back in, they had something to say. and we saw that they sent subpoena to the former new yor specialist, as a detective attorney, marc pomerantz mark pomerantz, he was investigating donald trump, he resigned, and then he wrote book so, what do you think hous republicans are up to here do you think mark pomerantz is gonna show up? >> a couple things, i'll b adjusted to hear catherine's thought on the mark pomerant pete as well, monk pomerantz should not have written a book he should not have engaged i public conversations about the work of the district attorney' office he, quite frankly, should be held accountable by th appropriate ortiz. having said that, simone, i' from the south, so tell me there's -- >> strong words. two colloquial, two wrongs don't make a right on the other side of the coin, you have jim jordan, who

is actually doing what he is accusing democrats of doing, which is weaponizing the government the key thing to remember here about this case, alvin bragg has one charge that is to uphold the rule o law, what i mean by that it means, at its core, treatin like cases alike this is important, there is deep and abiding sense i america that there are two systems of justice, one for th rich and the powerful and th privileged, and another fo everyone else. and i want to live in a worl in a justice system wher everyone is held accountable and if you break the law, yo are held accountable lik everyone else, and this is m last point if i could make it, it's that alvin bragg has been in office for 15 months. during that period of time, hi office has brought 29 case against individuals, and organizations, for what? for falsifying busines

records. >> you're saying you've got record to stand out. >> they have a record to stand on >> alvin record -- alvin bragg has a record >> are there any consequence for these pressure campaigns which frankly, i view them a intimidation tactics, to intimidate the da brig in doin his work are there any consequences for republican, government officials, participating i that >> not that i know of. here's what i suspect will happen, and we saw this little in the aftermath of the hearing on tuesday that the judge made clear, he' not going to put a gag order o donald trump right now but he made clear, he' watching and some of the rhetoric tha we have seen, certainly, leading into this hearing, i think donald trump is on watch >> all right, well, he is on watch. catherine, i think one of th things that i'll be watching for, going forward, whethe

donald trump's legal team will request a change of venue fo the trial. do you think we have a shot at moving this trial somewher else >> well, they'll request it. they're not going to have a win, that's my prediction in new york, the request is motion that's made before an appellate court. the appellate court in manhattan, we'll be hearin that motion. and we'll decide it. and in my opinion, it won' win. it has to be, there is a tidal wave of negative publicity, an this is not someone who is unknown. he is, and quite frankly, th publicity, he's generating himself. i don't envision that they'l win it, they will certainl make the motion, which wil cause a little bit more delay, i don't think they'll be successful >> all right, catherine, anthony told me when we sa down on set, you are actuall on deadline white house this week reading some of the agree just tweets that you hav gotten and we just wanted to take time to give you your flowers on the air here, we ar

grateful for your insights and your comments. >> and i have never met you, sister, i just want to say, yo are brilliant and beautiful, and any people who are commenting on your appearance, i think you should ignore them we like you as you are, and am excited that the world is now getting a chance to hear your voice, so, god bless you. >> bless you, and happy easter everyone and happy passover >> oh, this is a great way t end. thank you all for being here and thank you at home fo watching symone on thi saturday they, i am symone sanders-townsend, you can catc me at msnbc weekends at 4 pm eastern, and anytime over on the peacock wary of ne episodes of msnbc hub, every monday and for more of the show including some behind th scenes videos you will see anywhere else, find us o instagram, twitter and the tiktok, remember, i've got mor from tennessee, politics natio with the great reverend al sharpton, we'll start righ after this break

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