and political tour, and he is losing endorsements, as well what's the plan there in tallahassee for him to regain his footing? >> that's what they're trying to figure out right now the timeline for his entrance into the presidential contest officially has not been forecasted and seems to be a bit more flexible, given the slip in popularity that he seems to be having from those on his side. they're trying to figure out, what is the best way to regain momentum and praise from conservatives who were looking for alternatives from trump. so far, the thought is that he hasn't made a case, a strong enough case at least, to convince voters he has what it takes to beat him. >> he's fallen in the polls in recent weeks so far, the desantis team being outmaneuvered by team trump. senior politics reporter for "axios," eugene scott, thank you so much. thanks to all after you for getting up "way too early" on this friday and all week long. have a great weekend "morning joe" starts right now

welcome to "morning joe" at 6:00 a.m. in the morning willie geist not with us today, trying to relive some of the more exciting mornings of the '70s yes, that's him on chopper 5 going across -- >> it is not. >> see the little -- chopper 4, i'm sorry. >> get it right. >> in the '70s, we didn't really -- numbers didn't count channels didn't counfreelancersi and i were. >> you were just there. >> beautiful look at new york city over the morning. it's friday. >> yes thursday was a very rough day for elon musk. >> oh, i don't know about that $3 billion rocket exploded. >> i'm going to question that framing. they get a lot of great data out of that. >> it exploded. >> but it was a planned explosion. >> no. >> it was -- they got what they wanted they got massive data.

it was a step forward. >> it was an unscheduled disas disassembly, as they call it. >> i have had many of those. >> exploded. >> i've had many of those. >> then he planned to make people pay for twitter verification his plan to do that blew up on the social media site. on top of that -- >> that was not good. >> no, twitter is messed up now. >> it's a mess it's a shame. >> on top of all that, tesla's value dropped by $50 billion as its stock price fell by 10%. we're going to have much more on those stories straight ahead. >> not to be a nag here, but -- >> well, kind of -- >> -- there are a million different market forces that are pushing and pulling. a lot more competition there. >> it was a rough day. >> great for america. plus, what the lead attorney for smartmatic had to say about forcing fox news to apologize for airing misinformation about the 2020 election. that's the next lawsuit down the pike we'll have the latest on that.

>> mr. pillow learns the hard way. >> oh, no. >> absurd claims of election fraud can have consequences. >> oh, took them this long. >> 5 million consequences. >> took a long time. also ahead, the fight for endorsements in florida not going well for ron desantis. >> no, it's not. >> we'll have new reporting on that and we'll explain why prosecutors dropped charges against alec baldwin in the deadly shooting on the set of his movie "rust. that is a big development in the case against alec baldwin. we'll have the latest. it's friday, guys. friday, april 21st with us, we have the host of "way too early," white house bureau chief at "politico," jonathan lemire. also with us this friday morning, pulitzer prize winning columnist and editor of "the washington post," eugene robinson good to have you both with us this morning. >> yeah. we'll get to the latest on fox in a moment. major news there

but the president is about to formally announce he is run ning for re-election next week. the team will announce as early as tuesday according to three sources familiar with the plans. tuesday is the anniversary of biden's 2020 campaign announcement >> what do you think of that, m mika >> well, i thought all along he would do it, and i think he has to do it i think that's how he feels. >> yeah, gene robinson, i've given up on guessing. >> yeah. >> of course, taking the president at his word that he was thinking about moving forward. at the same time, i got good friends who have been very close to him for a very long seem who have been telling me all along they don't think he is going to do it. yesterday, i got a call. it's so funny how this works i got a call in the early afternoon from somebody really close going, "i just don't think he is going to do it." a couple minutes later, we get this news from nbc, three sources saying he is going to

launch next week he loves to delay things loves to wait until the last possible second to do things always has politically but this looks -- this looks like a pretty solid sourcing right now. >> yeah, assuming the sourcing is good, as we think it is, he's in i'm not surprised. i mean, i took him at his word that this was his intention. i also took him at his word that he believes in fate. he wanted to see how things were going to work out and whether it was -- he was going to run again. i think he believes he's fated to run again he looks at the republican field. he sees donald trump ahead of that field he sees ron desantis sort of -- it's too early to say he is flaming out, but he is not doing very well right now. if it looks pretty likely that trump could be the nominee on the other side, i always thought

that biden would run if it looked like he was going to go up against trump because his whole reason for running the last time was to keep donald trump out of the office because he was such a danger to the country and the world. >> right. >> he'll do it again he'll do it again. he knows -- >> and -- >> -- he can beat him because he beat him. >> yeah. i think it is okay to say flaming out. what'd they say about the rocket, the what >> oh, unscheduled disassembly >>yeah, so ron desantis' campaign right now is experiencing an unscheduled disassembly. >> i don't know. >> it is looking more and more likely that donald trump will be the nominee with who knows, two, three, four indictments. what's two or three indictments between republican primary voters jonathan lemire, you've been on this story very closely. we've been talking i got a chance to spend some time with the president on and off camera in ireland, and i got

the sense that he was actually leaning into it. a little more excited about it after ireland. again, questions still abound. what can you tell us >> you're right, there's been speculation from the beginning the president, we should note, is 80 years old. he would be 82 taking the oath of office again, were he to win. and, you know, he has said publicly, it's all along been his intention to run privately, people close to him have, as you said, joe, expressed some doubt you know, the white house team, the campaign apparatus, was forming. they were ready, putting pieces in place for him to say the word "go. he still hasn't yet. i think that's what the word is here we're reporting the same people close to him say this announcement could come as soon as next week they are eyeing the tuesday, which would be the four-year anniversary of his successful presidential campaign launch nothing is official until the president says it is having said that, if we do anticipate that he is going to run, as you note, the looming

danger that is donald trump on the republican side of the field is what has been animating biden all along. there's also a sense, if not me, who, in terms of other democrats who could take on trump. right now, they're preparing to launch now, we're waiting for the final go from the president. >> all right we'll be following that. now to the other big headline of the morning. we are hearing from the lead attorney in smartmatic's $2.7 billion defamation suit against fox news the voting software company says it was grievously harmed by the network talking about vote flipping from the 2020 election. the lawyer representing the company said evidence in the recently settled dominion lawsuit could be used in its case >> in addition to that, what i think is really unique about the smartmatic situation is the recklessness that was involved

here smartmatic was in l.a. county, l.a. county only, and you can confirm that we are in l.a. county only by doing about a one-minute google search notwithstanding that, what the other defendants were doing is saying we somehow masterminded an ability to rig a national election, when we were only in one county that level of recklessness is something you don't normally see. >> don't you think it is important to make sure those millions of americans get the truth? >> i -- i'll say, long haul. i want everybody to think of the long haul here smartmatic is in this case for the long haul. they are looking to take this case through trial they are looking to the vindication of a jury verdict in their favor. they are in this for the long haul in order for them to get back to where they were before this all started, where they can win the contracts that they're now losing, they need to get an

apology. they need to get a full retraction they're in that business for the long haul. they're not looking to get out of that business >> on wednesday, fox put out this statement on the smartmatic lawsuit, claiming it will defend its case surrounding, quote, extremely newsworthy events. the network goes on to call smartmatic's damages claims implausible and disconnected from reality but, joe, this is exactly what you pointed to when the settlement with dominion came out. that could be evidence that came o out, that the damaging, humiliating evidence, that what was happening on the air was not what they were saying off the air, and that they were misleading their viewers they ended up paying for that. that all now rolls over and gets used as evidence for smartmatic? that's not good news for fox. >> you have two things first of all, you have the public relations of it yeah, the texts are really bad pr wise because you're basically letting viewers know that you're lying to 'em when you say that

donald trump is this and that. he's horrible. he's a liar. he's a destructor. also, that the election claims are just purely ly bogus then you go onto the air, and you lie to your viewers and tell them the election was rigged so that's a pr problem it does have legal consequences. what attaches to that, and what we learned from the last trial, at least the last settlement, all of that discovery is, the intent the intent to do it with malice because they were losing viewer s viewership to newsmax. that's what is so devastating about the discovery. it basically proves the pry prima facie case

the lawyer is saying, "we're taking it to the end." something perhaps more troubling for fox news, if you have a company like smartmatic that is saying, "we're not going to just get a billion or two dollars and get out of this business, we're in this business to stay we have to stay in this business, so we need an apology. just for you all at home to know how badly these people's business has been challenged, and some destroyed, i have friends who are election officials, who run elections, who say they get yelled at and accused of having smartmatic machines they say, "they're only in los angeles right now. or dominion, they have dominion machines they're like, "no, they do four counties over but we don't." they're getting screamed at. every election official has been taken to task because they were

in this conspiracy with dominion there is no way any elected official in america can have dominion voting machines or smartmatic voting machines unless this is adequately cleaned up when he says, "we have to take it all the way to trial. we have to get an apology," that makes complete sense if they want to stay in this business for the long run that's bad news, of course, for fox news let's bring in -- >> and -- >> sorry, go ahead. >> and if you see this sort of tension between reporters asking lawyers questions like, "why didn't you ask for ang apology," you know, look, there is frustration within the journalistic community about the way fox handled itself, but the bigger question is the service to the viewers i'll, you know, put all competition aside. fox is a powerhouse. millions of people watch fox every day. millions of people potentially

watch only fox. >> right. >> so the importance of that apology is so that viewers get the correct information, that they're not being lied to. >> okay. >> they're not promulgating the lies. >> right well, you're concerned about that, and i understand that. a lot of people in the media -- >> that would be the reason i'd ask that question. >> -- concerned about that however, the lawyers, they're interested in -- i'm just explaining why there wasn't an apology -- representing their dl clients. clients are probably -- their primary concern is making their investors whole. if it would cost their investors $200 million to get an apology, that's not why they were in the business that's why people write editorials or talk on shows like this let's bring in nbc news legal analyst andrew wiseman andrew, i've been stunned the past couple days, the way fox -- and i'm not going to blame the lawyers because they do what the

clients tell them to do -- but the way fox stumbled they pay $787 million, and they still have another suit out. all the things that they paid for, almost $800 million to make certain things go away, didn't go away. not going to go away in fact, rupert murdoch, the hosts, the discovery, all of that is still going to be out there if they don't now settle for probably even more money to smartmatic and they've got more so i just have no idea the logic of it all, to drag it all the way to the end after all the embarrassing discoveries out, then go ahead and pay almost $800 million none of this makes any sense legally or business wise can you give us some insight into why it happened that way? >> so i think you're putting your finger on a real problem here, which is that, logically,

you don't understand, and i don't understand, and i don't think we've gotten answers to why fox, if it was going to settle, didn't pony up the money before these damaging emails and texts that showed what people were thinking. all i can think is, sometimes, denial is a big factor, and people are thinking, it won't be so bad we have legal arguments. maybe the judge will rule in ways that are favorable. that may be part of it, and people really were thinking they were going to go to trial and they could drag this out maybe take it to the supreme court. i think maybe one of the key things is when the district judge said at trial, "you, dominion, can call rupert murdoch to the stand, as well as all of the key hosts." i think that may have been a bridge too far rupert murdoch said, "i am not going to be disgraced like that

and forced to make these statements under oath live, and we're going to settle. to be cynical about the big picture, the big picture may be they pay a lot of money to dominion, maybe to smartmatic, but, one, it seems to be tax deductible so it's not quite as large as everyone thinks, and their business model still goes on as mika said, they have a huge vi viewership the next time they promulgate the big lie but know not to denigrate a company. they can do the same thing but not be subject to a lawsuit. >> andrew, in your latest piece for "the atlantic," titled, "when the media bow to trump." you write, two of the top news stories in recent weeks, the manhattan district attorney's criminal indictment in the people of the state of new york versus donald trump, and the three-quarter-billion dollar

settlement in dominion voting systems versus fox news network, may seem like independent affairs, but they are parts of one bigger story that story is how former president trump has been able to control what information is available to the public as he has repeatedly done in an effort to aggrandize and cling to his own power. his willing helpers were media companies, but they were not acting as news organizations when national media companies pollute the information environment in collusion with the political campaign, the question becomes whether american institutions and the legal system can adequately res respond. the courts may hinder trump or, for that matter, any politician with autocratic leanings, from colluding with media companies but the worrying messages to such politicians may be to avoid mischaracterizing or paying hush money all together to avoid

defaming a company with deep pockets when promulgating the next big lie bragg and dominion may win their battles, but the electorate may lose the war >> gene robinson >> well, that's a frightening pro prospect, andrew so how do we break this cycle? i mean, i know a lot of people in media who were appalled at what fox did in defaming dominion and who were rooting for fox to lose. at the same time, who worried that an adverse ruling to fox, if they'd gone to trial, might have an impact on the governing supreme court decision, sullivan v "new york times," that gives wide latitude to reputable news organizations. that is kind of potentially a

threat how do we break this cycle, and how should the media be thinking about this >> great question. so i think the key word that you used, eugene, is the word "reputable." so if i were at a reputable news organizations, i don't know i'd be particularly worried about what i saw at the national inquirer, which was colluding president trump campaignor wha we saw at fox news you know, if you talk to any reputable journalist, whether it's in television or whether it's in print media, this is so far beyond the pale in terms of what news is supposed to be. you're just not colluding with one political campaign so i don't think that there's a real sort of, you know, slippery slope here, where to receive

liability here, you have to worry about what's going to happen next. this really goes back to a point that joe made, which is, these are private parties that are suing. they're not -- their interest is not to get a public apology, to defend american democracy or to protect the information flow they're trying to get the damages to their client. that's where you really think the fec, which did impose a small fine on "the national inquirer," needs to step in. it can't be a small fine you need to be thinking about, okay, what is the business model for "the national inquirer," for fox news the next media company that's going to pretend to be giving news but is actually going to be promulgating lies, is there going to be some regulatory damage that's going to deter that so we don't have the repetition it's really easy to simply avoid

denigrating a company so you won't get sued but still promulgate a big lie you need to have the government step in to have some kind of regulation of that kind of conduct. >> so one of the loudest promoters of the big lie, my pillow ceo mike lindell, has been ordered to pay $5 million to a man who successinglyfully debunked his claims of the stolen election. a panel unanimously ruled against lindell, who issued what he called the "prove mike wrong challenge. >> that wasn't hard. >> at a cyber symposium he hosted in 2021 lindell promised to give millions to anyone who could prove his cyber data about the 2020 election was not valid. he was taken up on his offer by a software developer and trump voter who says he was initially excited to see what evidence lindell had found. according to the man's attorney,

quote, much to his chagrin, he found it wasn't 2020 election data in a statement to nbc news, lindell called the ruling a horrible, wrong decision. >> that was unanimous and will be unanimous in any arbitration panel. jonathan lemire, again, the factsare not there rudy giuliani, donald trump, the kraken lady, they have -- >> oh, my lord. >> -- all been lying through their teeth since november 2020. they keep promising facts. they never provide facts, none all they can do is just push the big lie. you know, again, 63 federal judges, a lot appointed by donald trump, a lot of them f federalist society judges, all said there were no examples of widespread voter fraud even in concurring opinion in

the supreme court case during that time, you had the two most conservative justices on the court, thomas and alito, saying, "you know what we ought to look into this one part of the pennsylvania election, but, of course, there wouldn't be enough votes to change the outcome of the election at all. basically saying, it's already set. biden won. yet, despite all that, these people keep lying, keep making fools of themselves, and, in the case of fox, keep having to pay out hundreds of millions of dollars in damages. >> as we've discussed on this show and i covered in my book, whether it was rudy giuliani or sidney powell, they say one thing on the courthouse steps and something very different inside the courthouse itself they knew they didn't have the evidence to back it up we know mike lindell, he had free reign of the oval office in the weeks after the 2020 election would bring conspiracy theories to donald trump's desk i guess we know now why my pillow was expanding into the slippers and so on they have to raise money to pay out this $5 million.

he's lucky that others didn't take him up on the same offer. andrew, lindell also is one of the individuals in which dominion is suing. rudy giuliani on that list, as well we just saw what dominion was able to get from fox news. in your estimation, how worried shouldly lindell and others be when attention is turned to them >> i think the individuals are even in worse shape than fox because they can't say they're just in the news organization or they were claiming a reporter's privilege. i think there's a reason that, since dominion has brought its suit, that you have not heard from sidney powell, rudy giuliani, mike lindell there has been -- you know, they've been quite muted that's because their public statements have gotten them in, deservedly, a lot of hot water because if you defame a company and put out these -- the big lie

about a private company with deep pockets, they can sue you, which is exactly what's going on i think that by all accounts, that is something that they really have to worry about they don't have a lot of defenses the real issue is just how much money they can pay because some of them have more than others. this is the kind of thing that can really bankrupt all of the individual defendants. you can be sure that dominion is going to be, you know, pressing ahead hard with respect to each of them. >> nbc news -- >> they're going to be bankrupt. i mean, look at rudy giuliani. you look at these other people i see absolutely no way for them to avoid bankruptcy. they just got caught in lie after lie after lie. >> i just don't know why they would continue to participate when it was obvious, but there you go that's why we're where we are. nbc news legal analyst andrew weissmann, thank you very much for coming on the show on this

friday morning we appreciate it still ahead on "morning joe," donald trump remains the focus of criminal probes in new york, fulton county, georgia, washington, d.c. jackie alemany joins us with new reporting from "the washington post" on the status of all of the investigations into donald trump. plus, the legal trouble does not appear to be slowing down. the former president's new bid for the white house as he picks up new endorsements in florida while the state's governor focuses on his fight with mickey mouse. >> oh, don't do that don't do that. you know what bob iger is saying >> yeah. hold my beer. >> hold my beer while i take this guy's political soul to the ground okay also, a january 6th -- >> kind of tough. >> -- defendant is facing a firearm charge after allegedly shooting at police days before he was expected to surrender for charges related to the attack on the capitol. >> that should help him in his

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♪ youuu did it! ♪ with centrum silver. 32 past the hour >> tj was asking me -- i mean, i know we've been working together a long time. >> who, you and me or tj >> tj. he was asking what was in my book. >> those are your private musings. >> inspirational >> i write down a lot of quotes in here. >> brene brown. >> no. here's a good one. >> what? >> write it on your heart that today is the best day of the year >> i love that >> isn't that nice >> i love that.

>> it's a good challenge in the morning. >> yes, it is. >> good reminder in the morning. >> thank you. >> a lot of terrible things going on, a lot of things we can't make a difference on we certainly can, going through our day, we certainly can adjust our attitude and try to be as positive as possible it's here and all over the world because we're bombarded with really bad news at home and abl ab abroad we have to make it better. >> make it through. >> i'll tell you right now, the united states has to do something, for instance, in sudan. >> yes. >> gene robinson, sudan right now, the situation is just absolutely more horrific out of northeast africa, this power struggle keeps going nearly a week after the nation's military and a paramilitary group clashed in the capital they're trying to get control of the presidential palace. this has gone well beyond urban

convict. this is a city in meltdown, a cry for sudan. it's been a scene of constant civil war for 20, 30 years i remember when i was in congress human rights groups talking about the million plus christians who had been killed by the then muslim majority. there's been one move after another to try to bring peace. nothing is happening nothing is working positively. it is getting worse. >> sudan has always had these deep schisms, you know, between arabs and christians, between the sort of northern sudanese in south sudan which split off to become a separate country. there's still -- you know, i mean, this is horrific, what is going on now i'm sure that one of the things

the white house and pentagon is thinking about is evacuating americans. make sure the people at the embassy are safe and, if necessary, are out of there. we have to get some sort of international coalition together, probably with the uk and others, to try to negotiate a cease-fire in some sort of peace there. it is going to be difficult, i think. prosecutors in new mexico will drop involuntary manslaughter charges against alec baldwin in the fatal shooting of cinematographer halyna hutchins on the set of film "rust" in 2021. prosecutors say in a statement that new facts were revealed as authorities were preparing next month's preliminary hearing. however, the prosecutors noted the decision does not, quote, absolve mr. baldwin of criminal

culpability and noted that charges may be re-filed. baldwin has maintained the gun went off accidentally, and that he did not pull the trigger. the charges against the film's ar ar armo ar armorer remain unchanged. >> i don't understand that. >> there might be reaction to him playing out the case in the public arena. >> i'm just saying, if you're going to press charges, press charges. if they had it, press charges. they dropped it and said, "we may come back and charge again." doesn't make any sense at all. >> yeah. a texas man facing multiple charges in the january 6th insurrection allegedly shot at sheriff's deputies who went to his home last week for a welfare check. that's according to a new court filing from the fbi agent. the agent called nathan donald

pellum last wednesday and asked him to surrender his father called the sheriff's office and asked them to check on his son when deputies arrived, pellum fired shots in his home and then at them. a deputy said a bullet came close enough to him, he could hear a whistling sound as it hit a metal object near to him pellum is facing an additional felony charge of being a felon in possession of a firearm let's bring in investigations reporter for "the washington post," jackie alemany, who is taking a look at the status of all the investigations into the cases against donald trump. >> jackie, a friday check-up we can go top to bottom. >> starting with january 6th. >> before we start, it is interesting, i'm sure you saw the poll just released this week actually, voters scaled them on what they consider to be illegal activity

manhattan was at at the bottom, and at the top, georgia. voters, for some reason, they get -- maybe it was the tape recording, but most voters, a majority think that was illegal activity they're far more concerned about that than, say, what happened in manhattan or even with the documents. >> yeah, and it is exactly for the reason you noted, joe. the evidence is very clear cut everyone heard it. there's apparently other recordings that the d.a.'s office has obtained as evidence. we obviously had a little bit of a frackus when the lead grand jurist diseased interviews and e was concern she tainted the public opinion the court of public opinion does, at the end of the day, ultimately matter in all of these cases. >> jackie, let's turn to -- >> definitely.

>> -- special counsel jack smith. he has gone quiet in recent weeks, but we know that there is still work done at main justice. talk to us about the latest on the two cases. january 6th, yes, but also the mar-a-lago documents case, which we've talked about before. there are many in trump orbit who are the most anxious about that one and potential obstruction charges. >> yeah, we started the week with some news actually, it was over the weekend, where trump's legal attorney, we reported, recused himself from the mar-a-lago documents case this is evan corcoran who appeared before the grand jury after a judge forced him to testimony and said he couldn't use the crime fraud exemption to shield himself from -- he couldn't use attorney-client privilege because of the crime fraud exception and needed to provide answers to questions to prosecutors about conversations we had had with his client, former president trump, about

some of the statements he made to the department of justice, responses to the subpoenas, and conversations with trump about where these classified documents lied throughout mar-a-lago then, in the middle of the week, we saw some action in the manhattan d.a.'s office. alvin bragg ultimately lost a case against house chairman jim jordan mark pommpomerance, will have t testify. then another top trump attorney which, i think, should make me remind you all about the infamous saying, "make attorneys get attorneys," he appeared before the special counsel yesterday for an interview it raised eye bbrows with defene attorneys who noted that it's not often that targets in cases

appear before grand juries, but, rather, try to negotiate these behind closed doors interviews they oftentimes take the fifth when they appear before the grand jury in these interviews, maybe sometimes try to obtain some proffer or avoid getting charged. boris has been intimately involved with all trump activities for years now specifically, the fulton d.a.'s case, the mar-a-lago documents case, and january 6th. it's unclear what he told prosecutors yesterday in this closed door interview, but that's something we're going to be looking for today >> obviously, we've covered the indictment by the manhattan d.a. and manhattanites in a grand jury indictment ultimately, but there's two others the investigation into the business practices of the trump organization, and also the rape allegations that are going to

trial, even though team trump was trying very hard to delay that, making issues about the jury, the location anything they could to push that off. >> yeah. i think that actually, mika, could be the dark horse of all these cases, at least in my conversations with some of trump's lawyers who are specifically involved in the e.j. carroll case. this is a concern for them trump has a lot of different concerns right now i think the d.a.'s case is at the bottom of that list, sort of mirroring voters' concerns, but we do know that, right now, trump was supposed to appear in the carroll case that'd been postponed temporarily. but this is someone with a myrrh r myriad of legal exposure on his plate right now. >> jackie alemany of "the washington post," thank you for coming on the show great to see you. coming up, a leading

anti-abortion group blasted donald trump after his campaign says he believes state should decide abortion laws we'll explain what's going on there. plus, one of our next guests says some republican-led states are flirting with authoritarianism we will dig into that just ahead on "morning joe. heading on a family trip? nah, sorry son, prices are crazy, [son deflates] awh, use priceline. they have package deals no one else has. [son inflates] we can do it! ♪go to your happy price♪ ♪priceline♪

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♪ oh, my goodness, look at that beautiful sunrise if that doesn't inspire you to get up and get some exercise, i don't know what does >> i'm going to stay in. >> welcome back to "morning joe. >> eggs, bacon. >> 46 past the hour. good day for a walk in washington, d.c. >> chicken. >> live look at reagan national airport.

a leading anti-abortion group blasted donald trump after his campaign said he believes states should decide abortion laws on thursday, a trump spokesman provided this statement to "the washington post. when asked whether the former president supported the six-week abortion ban that florida governor ron desantis signed into law, quote, president donald j. trump believes that the supreme court, led by the three justices which he supported, got it right when they ruled this is annish shah that should be decided at the state level. in response, a prominent anti-abortion group, susan b. anthony pro-life america, issued a scathing statement that reads, in part, president trump's assertion that the supreme court returned the issue of abortion solely to th completely inaccurate reading of the dobbs decision and is a morally indefensible position for a self-proclaimed pro life presidential candidate to hold it continues, we will oppose any presidential candidate who

refuses to embrace, at a minimum, a 15-week national standard to stop painful, late-term abortions while allowing states to enact further protections. when asked for comment, a trump spokesperson reiterated the former president's position and said, our focus here should be on saving lives and avoiding the radical left's traps, not dividing the pro life community. interesting. >> well, it is you know, jonathan lemire, you have donald trump who is pro choice most of his life. >> mm-hmm. >> that natural inclination of his, despite who he appointed, that natural inclination really started to show itself when there started to get -- we started to get word from the supreme court that they were going to overturn roe. the dobbs decision fretting about that privately, saying it'd be horrible didn't he even go so far as to

blame pro lifers for losing the 2022 midterm elections >> he most certainly did he expressed real private worry in the aftermath of the supreme court leak to "politico" that this could be bad for republicans in november. he then, after the republicans were disappointing in their november outcomes, in part because of candidates trump hand-picked for the senate, we should note, but trump did blame a lot of pro life republicans for that and it's interesting going forward, because we know that he's had a pretty firm grip opt evangelical, pro life republican base throughout his time in office now, there seems to be some unhappiness there. there hasn't, at least for now, been an alternative to coalesce around certainly, mike pence, for instance, his would-be campaign has not gained much in the way of traction yet. it is also interesting how trump, as he is sometimes hard to pin down, and we don't like to refer to him as a

conservative here, but on this, he warned abortion would be a political loser for republicans. he also warned social security and medicaid could be an issue for republicans. dom some in the gop are going the other way. >> from "usa today," susan page. susan, seems to be split not just pro life groups going after donald trump donald trump has been going after pro life groups and pro life voters for, well, a year now. >> well, and he's right when he says the abortion issue was a big problem for republicans in the midterm elections. it looms as a big problem for them going forward because, the fact is, they are at odds with the force of u.s. public opinion when they talk about things lake a national abortion ban or a ban at 15 or 16 weeks of pregnancy and the actions some states are taking, including actions to restrict access to the abortion

drug the way most abortions are now performed in the united states so the republicans, i think, are struggling to figure out how they can continue to get the support of pro life voters without putting them at odds with other voters they need to get if they want to win elections. >> susan, governor ron desantis in florida, an unannounced candidate, signed a six-week abortion ban for his state, but he signed it at, like, 11:00 at night with no fanfare. so he can't have that both ways. how do politicians like desantis navigate this? you look at the polling. you know a six-week ban is not going to play well nationally. at the same time, he wants those evangelical, pro life voters how do you walk this thin edge >> well, he did tweet a picture of him signing it, so i guess he did go on the record in that way

with the six-week ban. the problem a lot of americans have to be six-week ban is that's before many people realize they are pregnant. so it is a pretty severe measure to take. he is now on the record. there are other republicans who are being very cautious about talking about a national abortion ban at all. you see republican senators, for instance, doing the same thing trump has done, which is to say, let's leave it up to the states. >> all right susan stays with us. still ahead, chris christie says donald trump has already disqualified himself as a potential presidential candidate, with the reminder for voters about trump's call to suspend the constitution "morning joe" will be right back

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time for a look at the morning papers

just a few minutes before the top of the hour. we're going to begin in tennessee, where "the jackson sun" has a front page feature on the governor's proposed flag red, unlikely to pass. >> unbelievable. >> governor bill lee askedpprovo keep guns out of the hands of those who are a threat to themselves or others legislature says it doesn't have the support to advance. >> outrageous. >> lawmakers sent a bill to the governor's desk this week that further protects gun dealers and manufacturers from lawsuits. >> gene, gene, it's just absolutely staggering. you know, i had seen some people talk about this yesterday. let me try to find this poll for you. >> in the midst of tragedy, in the midst of seeing firsthand a situation in which certain laws

may, may, just may have been helpful. >> unbelievable. >> gene, let me give you these numbers. this is from a poll taken last year it was the last national poll i could find that was on red flag laws first of all, universal background checks. this is a poll taken of gun owners npr published it by gun owners, 84% of gun own eowners support universal background checks, including guns at shows and private sales. 84%. raising the minimum age to buy an ar-15 semiautomatic rival from 18 to 21, 72% of gun owners support that then red flag laws that law enforcement officers can use to temporarily remove guns from people that courts say are dangerous, 65% of all gun owners support this

>> yeah. >> 65% of all gun owners support this legislation in tennessee -- or support this legislation that a republican governor in tennessee are trying to pass after little children were slaughtered in a christian school there. >> it is absolutely unbelievable it is unbelievable that this has become -- you know, this goes beyond the nra's money, i think, and influence, and it gets -- it's way in the realm of the irrational every single poll shows overwhelming public support for these measures, and every single example of where measures like this have been put in place have shown that they're really effective. there is a red flag law in florida that has been used thousands and thousands of times. you can only imagine how many deaths it has -- shootings, it

has prevented deaths in that state. these are no-brainer things that, for some almost cultish reason, the republican party has decided to oppose. anything that makes americans safer. the only solution is to get these people out of office we just have to do it. >> well, you know -- >> you think about -- i'm so sorry. you think about the shooting of the young 14-year-old boy who came to the door do you think that man, from what has been reseal ed about him, should have a gun? there are definitely many situations in which there are people who probably shouldn't have a firearm, let alone an assault weapon, from these mass shootings. these laws can really help. >> the laws, of course, as bill lee, the governor of tennessee said, they have to have due process. >> yeah. >> make sure --

>> it has to be fair. >> -- people's constitutional rights are protected. >> absolutely. >> if you have a situation, where we see time and again, that somebody is mentally distressed, not in a position to own a gun, they should go in you know, what do we do? susan page, i had a talk with bill clinton this past weekend, interviewed him on the 25th anniversary of the irish peace accords. he said, and i, of course, think it's brilliant, just politically, this guy knows his ways around on political issues, he talked about in 1980, george w. bush easily won the state of colorado the state of colorado, on that same day, had a statewide ballot initiative, i believe on universal background checks, that passed overwhelmingly on an otherwise conservative day he said, what we really need to do is just start taking it to

the voters it won't be, okah, the libs are trying to take away your guns. oh, this group is trying to take away your guns put it to the voters if you look at all these polls, a universal background check would pass in 50 states with 50 ballot initiatives red flag laws would pass in 50 states with 50 ballot initiatives. raising the age for buying long rifles would pass -- to 21, would pass in 50 states. chances are good, the banning of military style weapons would pass in at least half, maybe 30, 35 states if you had ballot initiatives where it was put up to the people. >> yeah, interesting you know, the thing that's so flumexing to me, on tough issues, we've gotten to pivot points for america, where

something that seemed impossible is suddenly possible yet, on the issue of gun violence, not even the murder of little children at sandy hook was enough to do that. i just wonder, does president clinton or you have a theory on what would be catastrophic enough, powerful enough to be that sort of pivot point in how america handles gun violence moving on to other news, iowa's legislature approved a bill that bans sexually explicit books in schools the measure passed both the house and the senate this week it bans books that have descriptions of sexual acts and prohibits any classroom instruction on gender identity or sexual orientation in kindergarten, where i'm sure that happens, through sixth grade. republican governor kim reynolds is expected to sign the bill into law it's just -- i can't. >> gene robinson, you go down the list we've been talking about how

badly republicans are dioing politically. it's a self-own.suddenly, kansas looks like a north star for pro choice politics, right >> exactly. >> so they are lining up this is the -- this is, without a doubt t i'm saying this down the middle, just saying this as a political observer, they are lining up the most toxic platform to run against in the history of my life, of american politics, since i just don't know when. you've got book bannings you've got some states pulling books, librarians in fear pulling books of hank aaron and roberto clemente off the shelves to keep away from kids because they're afraid they're going to be fired you've got schools getting shot

up one day after another day after another day. you've got 10-year-old girls having to flee the state of ohio, and other legislators saying that little girls that get raped by their uncles are the best reason why states should use the power, the police power of that state, to force these little girls to have, these rape victims to have forced pregnancies i could go down the list seriously, we could talk all morning about all of the crazy things they're doing the authoritarianism against businesses, by republicans telling businesses how they can think and how they can communicate. >> yeah. >> this is straight -- and i know of what i speak because i just came back from the region i talked to a lot of people about this -- this is straight out of orban's playbook.

you don't send troops in, you just regulate them or tax them out of existence you act as an authoritarian. >> well, yeah. no, this hasn't been ronald reagan's republican party for a long time. it's more like viktor orban's republican party, which is shocking. >> sure is. >> look, republicans, they know what's going to happen, or they should know what is going to happen look at what happened in the midterms they were saddled with bad positions, especially on abortion, which shocked a lot of people and, you know, they got creamed in, basically, an election where there should have been a red wave and there wasn't even a red ripple because, largely, of abortion and other things. so they are making it much, much worse going into the 2024 election by taking these extreme positions on books, on

everything, and as mika pointed out, on, you know, terrible things happening in classrooms that are not happening, that have never been happening. >> exactly >> so they build up these st strawmen and performatively knock them down. maybe there's a segment of the republican base that just loves it and it makes them really enthusiastic, and the rest of the country shrugs and then votes the other way. >> well, more morning papers straight ahead this conversation brings us to our next guest. professor of history at rice university and presidential historian doug brinkley. associate processor in global politics at university college london, brian kloss. brian, your latest piece for the "atlantic" is entitled, "the red states experimenting with authoritarianism." you write, in part, quote, beyond attacking elections or trying to interfere with their results, republicans are testing out different ways to wield

power against democracy. in florida, governor december n ron desantis is using his power to punish a private company that dared to criticize him in idaho, republican lawmakers made it illegal to help minors cross state lines to obtain an abortion in texas, republican governor greg abbott has said he looks forward to pardoning a man convicted of murdering a black lives matter protester on the political right, many have suggested that concerns about american democracy are alarmist previous attempts to capture the erosion of american democracy at the state level have been criticized for hyperbole one effort to measure the quality of state level elections resulted in several u.s. states scoring below rwanda in autocracy, in which the dictate or was re-elected in 2017 with

98.8% of the vote. >> pretty impressive >> absurd. >> my dad would ask, who were the 1.2% who voted against you, joe? >> again, that's absurd. north carolina is certainly not north korea, but millions living in red states have become guinea pigs the subjects of republicans experimenting with autocracy. jonathan lemire, you take the first question. >> brian, this is a disturbing and accurate analogy you're making sure. others suggested that with the red state governors, we are setting up conflict with the judges who are trying to follow the law. what are you seeing in the red states >> yeah, it's interesting because there's been a widespread study that looked at this over the last sort of 20 years. they found that states that had democratic governorships or

democratic governance and also mixed governance between democrats and republicans, didn't see an erosion of democracy, but deep red states did. since then, it's intensified in the trump era. you see this with judges for example, in mississippi, jackson, white republicans at the state level established a parallel court system to serve white neighborhoods, to overrule the black majority elected judges in a place that's 80% black. so you have these sort of parallel institutions being set up to usurp those elected by democrats. in georgia, you also have a measure that's been put in place to withdraw elected judges also, this has happened in florida, where governor ron desantis has removed a democratic prosecutor on a very flimsy pretext they're going against these sort of rule of law institutions with aggressive, new tactics, and they've become laboratories of authori authoritarianism, instead of as was said in 1932, the state's role as a laboratory of

democracy. >> douglas brinbrinkley, it is fascinating, is it not, how the last few years have unfolded you have had some republicans on the state level, of course, donald trump on the national level, moving more towards an authoritarian poise yet, they've been rejected in election after reelection. most recently, shockingly, in wisconsin by 11 points, which was supposed to be a swing state. what's your view overall about how we are fairing through this great trial for democracy over the past six years >> well, to me, it's mccarthyism on steroids. i mean, if we look at the book banning issue, in the 1950s, you had had eisenhower, a moderate, even conservative president during the mccarthy era, people just -- not just the pitch hun -- witch hunts on hollywood, but attempts to ban books.

alan ginsburg's "howell. "naked lunch." the list is long it became an attack on the arts, on american culture. seeing what iowa is doing, w willy-nilly picking out books for political points, being known as the state that's out of the midwest that's censorings is a horrific event kirk vonnegut, who died a few years back, there is a museum. every year, there is a banned book festival, an event to talk about the books that are under attack there's so many books now that are being pulled out of shelves, out of red states, that there's no way to even put your finger in the dam and keep them on the library of shelves i find that's a real sign, when authoritarianism, neofascism kicks hold, is when they go after the libraries, trying to get rid of book. a lot of this was jiggered

the anger on the right came out of the 1619 project. >> gene robinson, you actually are writing on how, in many way, ron desantis makes donald trump look reasonable. explain. >> well, i was really writing specifically about this insane crusade he has against disney. disney world disney is florida's biggest employer, its biggest corporate taxpayer, and, you know, 75,000 people work there. he is -- he went insane when disney had the tamerity to criticize the don't say gay law that he ran through the legislature. he won't let it go he got even more incensed when his attempt to assert, basically, dictatorial control

over disney was thwarted by a clever maneuver by the company that really sent him into a rage now, he's talking about damaging disney's business by building rival theme park or a state prison outside the gates of disney world it's just nuts you know, aside from whatever personal issues desantis has that we're learning about, the guy did win in a landslide in the last election. i guess i have a question for brian, which is, when and where do we see the pushback on this i can't imagine that disney is seen as a villain by the people of florida, but will we pay a price for this >> i think this is the biggest paradox of modern american politics, is why is it that people who are doing extremely

unpopular, authoritarian things, keep on getting put into positions of power or maintaining their grip on the republican party i think the big framework mistake a lot of people who analyze u.s. politics make is they continue to think we live in the land of normal politics, where the rules apply like they do in other democracies. the trumpification of the gop put us into the land of authoritarian politics, which is the realm i study around the world. people cling to personalities, not to policy. they don't care about transgressions they just want to ratchet it forward, to make the right people angry i think a will of what's happening, you know, when you see trump flags and trump hats, you don't see biden flags and biden hats in authoritarian regimes, you have that memmemorabilia when the devotion to the personality trumps the policy, you go down these loyalty tests. the big loyalty test we're about to get, you know, front row seats to, unfortunately, the

desantis versus trump. it'll separate the true believers from the half-hearted disciples. i think that's where, you know, trump is going to do very well because it has -- he has transformed the party into much more of an atuthoritarian movement rather than the republican party of the past. >> that is for sure. >> susan page, several years ago, we told the story i think we read perhaps in "the washington post," a funny story about how stephen miller went to a sushi restaurant, spent a lot of money he heard somebody at the restaurant insult him, and he decided to own the libs by throwing away the really expensive sushi that they made and he'd already brought he flew athrew away the sushi, "take that," and didn't realize he gave them the money and didn't have dinner it is a perfect metaphor for this whole owning the libs thing that brian was just referencing.

i mean, owning the libs has cost republicans in 2017, '18, '19, '20, '21, '22, and, yes, again in '23, especially in wisconsin. this focus on owning the libs has cost a certain news network almost $800 million. owning the libs is going to bankrupt a man who used to be called america's mayor owning the libs has had a horrific consequence for the republican party, for the conservative movement, for many people who worked for donald trump or went on january 6th and are now in jail. this owning the libs, if somebody says, "i want to own the libs," i think, politically, we should see that as a cry for help and a declaration that self-harm is about to take place politically. >> yeah, we're definitely back into the culture wars. it's been a reflex for some

republicans to go to culturish shoo yous. these days, treatment of transgender people may be number one on the culture wars list sometimes you lose the culture wars, right? brian talked about the loss of no normalcy in american politics. it'd take a reassertion of american politics to be repercussions to the positions some of the candidates and power figures are taking. >> yeah. hey, you know, jonathan lemire, speaking of losing, brian, a minnesota twins fan. >> oh, gosh. >> yeah. >> brian, we have very bad news for you. it's one thing to lose it's another thing to lose to the 2023 red sox >> not good. >> you just do it 200two out of three times. >> just not nice. >> this is why you're on the show today. >> we lost our pitcher in the second inning, so we have an

excuse there. >> excuse, okay. excuses in baseball? okay. >> there are exceptions. >> if you sleep better, all right. >> yeah. >> susan page and brian kloss -- >> we all need something to help us sleep better after the red sox game. >> thank you. >> brian, thank you so much for your continued, important work susan, your great reporting. we're grateful that you all are here with us today. success and disappointment for the largest and most powerful rocket ever launched. spacex starship did not make it far. it blew up minutes after lifting off. >> again, i doentdn't want to ba pain i think most people would consider this to be a success. they got a lot of data that they needed, and they were not expecting this thing to do much more, i believe, than it did. >> all right let's find out more from nbc news correspondent stephanie gosk she has the details. >> three, two. >> reporter: spacex's starship,

the brain child of elon musk, had lift-off. >> what a sight from the ground. >> reporter: then the uncrewed flight had some problems. >> it does appear to be spinning. >> reporter: it was supposed to be the moment the spacecraft separated from the super heavy booster. >> just experienced what we call a rapid unscheduled disassembly. >> reporter: what is an unscheduled disassembly? it kind of looked like an explosion. >> rapid unscheduled disassembly is the spacex code for very large explosion. >> reporter: even so, this was not a failure for spacex >> even getting a few minutes of flight like they did is incredible progress for them purely on the basis of the data they're going to receive from that flight. >> reporter: musk's company has its eyes on eventually sending people to the moon and mars. spacex is working with a $3 billion nasa contract. there have been some dramatic explosions, but a nasa administrator congratulated the

company. >> every great achievement throughout history has demanded some level of calculated risk, he wrote with great risk comes great reward musk spoke about risk with nbc news in 2021. >> this is -- space is risky more than anything else, i want to make sure we do everything possible to maximize the safety of the crew. >> reporter: musk says valuable lessons will be learned. another test launch is scheduled in a few months. >> nbc's stephanie gosk with that report. i love what he said, rapid unscheduled disassembly. looked a lot like an explosion. >> cute. >> a big explosion doug brinkley, you've obviously followed the space program for some time. by the way, people are going, oh, joe is trying to defend elon musk actually, i was taking my cues as stephanie just did there from bill nelson, who, of course, runs nasa. he said, it was a successful flight they got a lot of what they were

looking for. what was your take on yesterday and the program overall? >> yeah, it is largely successful i mean, you want failure, 1967, three astronauts, white, grissom and chafee blew up in a fireball before lift-off on a test exercise at cape canaveral that's failure this was moving the ball forward. there was the great excitement when the rocket took off we're all pulling together to get to the moon. soon, we'll have our first women astronauts on the moon in artemis-3. we have to look at the data, as you said, joe, that's collected. in science, thomas eds ison sai, a hundred ways to try something. you have a couple mistakes you constantly are boiling it down until you get the right formula. i would be happy if i were spacex about this result but not ectatic. >> well, you know, doug, also, yesterday was just such a stark reminder of elon musk and the

brilliance of elon musk, but also some of the bad things he does that seems to distract him. this is like if thomas edison spent his afternoons making mud pies out in the street until of inventing in his laboratory. elon musk, steve rattner, in fact, told me this a couple days ago. the guy is absolutely brilliant. so many of the project jts that does is lightyear years ahead everybody else you sit and wonder, while he is doing extraordinary things, an extraordinary mind, extraordinary inventor, why he would waste so much time and capital at twitter >> very much what henry ford did with the automobile. he did the moving assembly line, the model-t. he was a mechanical genius, henry ford you got him into the political field, and it got weird. his attacks on wall street,

anti-semitism and the like we sometimes have to watch these genius inventors, we don't think they have answers for all our social problems here on earth. >> it's funny you bring that up. again, this should just -- there is an incredible parallel. i'm so glad you came on to tell our viewers the parallel henry ford, of course, was, as he famously said to his, i think, one of his sons or daughters, said, "you don't understand the modern age. he said, "son, i invented the modern age." in fact, he was viewed as the man who invented the modern age. in part, he did. but i remember reading about how shocked and horrified members of congress were when he went to testify to see how completely ignorant he was. as you said, anti-semitic. when he got outside of his areas of expertise, he just humiliated himself on the hill. >> that's right. you know, henry ford's

revolution was amazing everything we do today, born out of henry ford when we drive. mani meaning the birth of the patterns of the red, yellow, green light. the first motel, the first shopping mall to drive in and park, eventually the birth of the interstate highway system. ford was the genius of his time. we've had people like bill gates, and now musk is giving it his best at space. i wish him well. doesn't mean i wish him well on twitter. >> exactly historian doug brinkley, thank you very much. speaking of that, elon musk is finally finding success at twitter in his effort to remove blue verified check marks from prominent profiles whose owners will not pay for authentication. the social media giant began to make good on its promise to remove the check marks from users last night, but the move

caused widespread confusion over which accounts are authentic various fake accountings sprang up, including this one claiming to be hillary clinton and proclaiming her entry into the 2024 race. that tweet received over 60,00 . the verification process also raises concerns abouta mber of false g accounts, including some posing as the irs amid tax filing season, emerged yesterday. other accounts such as this one from the city of new york attempted to proclaim their authenticity, only to be met by fraudulent accounts that created further chaos. users seeking verification can pay $8 a month for a subscription program in which any account can obtain a blue checkmark. >> well, that's the thing, gene robinson. >> what? >> it is chaotic i looked at so many of these

examples yesterday, where it's just absolute chaos. especially with these government agencies, these health agencies, these safety agencies, this is going -- and the possibility of fraud, i mean, this is going to cause aheartache and hardship, you know, americans. >> how about for democracy >> trying to sort through this there are real safety and public health issues here >> exactly >> i don't really understand it, to be honest with you. >> i don't understand it either. and you're right, there are real public safety issues there are government agencies that need to, you know, tweet, like, "you're in danger. there is a tornado coming," that sort of thing. >> right. >> you don't know who is who on twitter. now, it's always been a place where you had to tread

carefully. you had to, you know, really pay attention to figure out, yes, this is the legitimate person i think it is. now, that becomes all but impo impossible you know, i don't know i looked at twitter just now i still have my blue checkmark i have no idea why i assume it'll go -- >> you paid for it, gene come on! >> he did not. >> he's got enough money so, no, but, again, it's -- now, somebody could pretend they're me and pay them $8, and they would have a blue checkmark. >> that's right. >> how do you tell >> yeah, i lost my blue checkmark, i will just say i think there is a real danger here the old twitter, pre-musk, had plenty of flaws, but it had become, over time, a place where you could go for official government information

it became where government agencies and news outlets would go first to put out vital stuff, flood is coming, hurricanes, whatever it might be people knew to turn to twitter for realtime information it'd often be faster than sewing it anywhere else, in any other form of media. that's gone now. this is dangerous. why? and why? because it goes back to our previous conversation, this is elon musk's effort to own the libs he has, in many ways, tipped his hand to his own political ideology, at least on twitter. setting aside his brilliance in terms of inventions, and by doing so, you know, that sort of pe petculant act could endanger lives. >> friends close to him say it's all a game he's not liberal or a conservative, he just likes poking at people but i must say, this is a dangerous -- this is a dangerous

game as far as, again, if you're talking about new york city government, talking about hospitals, if you're talking about governmental institutions. on a personal level, you know what, i didn't ask for a blue checkmark. i'm really good without a blue checkmark. we have to say, people always ask, how long does it take you to get ready for a show? i remember, you know, watching tim russert or chris matthews. they used to get stacks of paper and would read through printed out stories. i'm sure, just like you guys, just like mika, what i do or what i have been doing is, i'll be working i'll take five minutes off in the middle of the day. i'll grab my phone, and i'll just go down the news feed what i used to be able to do, to your point, jonathan, what i used to be able to do is know what was going on in the world, for the most part, in five

minutes. i'd hit the links, read the stories, then i'd put it down and work come back an hour later, i'd scroll down. it would tell you, especially yesterday, because the non-verified, i don't have time to check and see what's real and what's not real. >> i can't see -- yeah >> ads are cluttering up the timeline i would guess my use of twitter has probably dropped by, i don't know, 30 k%, 40%, 50%. >> mine had dropped by 80%, 90%. i just don't find it to be -- i can't get the news anymore it's cluttered by other stuff. i cannot figure out the verified and unverified, mentions it doesn't come up it's not as fast it's strange it's not a tool for me for news gathering anymore. >> yeah. but, jonathan, it just is so much more clunky now you know, people have been whining for a very long time, oh, democracy. it's social media. get over it, right i just sort of kept sort of

going through it because i really -- we live without twitter, we can live without twitter again. >> yes, we can. >> but in this case, i will say, it is a shame that that great news feed has been taken away. >> yeah. >> at times, i just, you know -- >> it is good opportunity. >> -- i go through it two minutes and -- >> forget it. >> -- i'll read the papers. >> i never use twitter as a place to argue in the public forum like a lot of people did for some, that was even part of the appeal in terms of a news feed, it just pick the accounts you wanted to follow you could get the realtime updates who what was going on. it was useful for people in our industry and also people who want to be informed. that was twitter's service it was very good at that even that has started to slip. they've got the two columns, where they have one where it's people you're following, others where they're suggesting for you. sometimes it's hard to tell which is which. >> what is that? >> often, you're getting stuff you don't want there also, the ads have really changed. they've become, in some ways,

much more sensational than they used to be it speaks to musk losing money at twitter a lot of big advertisers have fled, and now he is trying to get people to pay for the checkmarks if yesterday was evidence, not many people are. >> mika may have lost a news feed in twitter, gene, but she did gain a $12.95 tank top from twitter. >> i don't know what the consequence of buying something like that on twitter is. >> so many ads on twitter, she's like, i'll get that. >> yeah. >> gene, you can't do it. >> the ads, there are so many ads now. you can click and say, you know, not interested in this ad or block this ad or whatever. you get the same ad, you know, the next day >> i know. >> it's just -- you just can't get rid of 'em for some reason >> it's just not as good. still ahead on "morning joe," senate majority leader

chuck schumer calls mccarthy's proposal a wish list mas ka rairaid i masquerading as legislation. also, jp brits k pp pritzke guest. we'll ask about preparations for the 2024 democratic national convention you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. when it comes to reducing sugar in your family's diet, the more choices, the better. that's why america's beverage companies are working together to deliver more great tasting options with less sugar or no sugar at all. in fact, today, nearly 60% of beverages sold contain zero sugar. different sizes? check. clear calorie labels? just check. with so many options, it's easier than ever to find the balance that's right for you. more choices. less sugar. balanceus.org

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bill. >> speaker mccarthy yesterday capitulated to the maga right and rolled out a partisan wish list masquerading as legislation. this maga wish list has no chance of moving forward in the senate, and it doesn't move us any closer than we were yesterday to avoiding default. speaker mccarthy's wish list is an extreme step in the wrong direction. it heads us in the direction of default. and time is running out. >> however, despite near complete democratic opposition of the bill, there is a lone senator who appears accepting of parts of it. >> i think what i saw in the response by kevin mccarthy was 1% that's very reasonable to me right now, especially with the spiraling debt that we have. i've always said i'll vote for clean debt, i'll have that, but i think it is a perfect, an

opportune time to do the right thing, which is to sit down and look at the long-term financial situation. what kevin mccarthy put on the table is a tremendous opportunity for us to have a good negotiation >> even with manchin's comments about the bill, even swing republicans didn't say they'd vote for the legislation it may struggle in the house where mccarthy can only lose four republican votes to pass a bill without any democratic support. joining us now, democratic senator tammy baldwin of wisconsin. it's great to have you on the show do joe manchin's comments open the window for some negotiation on this at all >> so, look, the bottom line is, we cannot afford to default. we cannot afford to default because of the cataclysmic results for the people we represent. and we have been clear from the very, very beginning, we will pay our debts, then we have the

budget process and the appropriation process, which are most appropriate for us to tackle these big issues. we have said that since the very beginning of the year, since january 19th when the debt ceiling was surpassed, and now, at a time when the treasury secretary is taking extraordinary measures to pay our bills on time, we have to make the commitment to not default. those negotiations that joe manchin and others are talking about have an appropriate place in the congress of the united states, and that is during the budget and appropriations process. >> senator, you announced in the last week or so you will be running for re-election. >> yes. >> to represent, perhaps, the pinnacle battleground state in the country. it's even, plus 1, almost every cycle it seems democrats secured a significant win with the supreme court vacancy there. tell us about the momentum you're feeling in your state.

>> it's tremendous right now januet won her race for the supreme court with nearly an 11-point margin in a state that's usually, as you say, decided within a point or two. this was voters saying, we want our rights and freedoms back chief among those, of course, has to do with abortion rights but there are others we have an immensely gerrymandered state, and people feel like their voices aren't heard, their votes aren't counted when they don't have appropriate representation in our state legislature and in our congress there's a whole host of issues that this supreme court in wisconsin will hear that are about regaining rights and freedoms lost. again, chief among them, abortion rights. >> you mentioned abortion rights we're waiting, in the next few hours we believe, the supreme court is going to make a decision about the access to the abortion pill. what do you expect, and what are

your concerns? >> first of all, the texas case was devoid of science. they were looking at an approval by the food and drug administration that took place 23 years ago trying to upend it the implications for other medications and medical devices are very clear and very scary. but because it was devoid of science, really says to me that judge was part and parcel was part of the attempt to abolish abortion nationwide. we're seeing it in florida with the six-week ban, in idaho with the travel ban wisconsin, by the way, has the oldest abortion law in the country, passed in 1849. i'm not, you know, misstating that 1849, a year after statehood it's a criminal abortion ban in

every circumstance except for life of the mother we are seeing the tragic results when we have a system in the united states where it depends on where you live, your zip code, what your rights and freedoms are. >> the white house, of course, is also strongly voicing their opinion on this. speaking of, the occupant of the white house, president biden may announce as soon as next week that he will be running for re-election, perhaps an announcement coming tuesday. give us your reaction. do you want to see another -- is he the right man for the job to continue this for another four years? >> look, yes joe biden is one of the most accomplished presidents in his first two years of his four-year term the legislation that we worked with the administration to pass is reshaping our infrastructure and reshoring industry that we lost decades ago the inflation that we all worry about is now being tempered, as long as the republicans don't

default on our debt. we have to pay our bills but president biden's record is historic yes, we want a leader like that going into the next term >> democratic senator tammy baldwin of wisconsin, thank you very much for coming on the show this morning we appreciate it have a great weekend. >> thank you. coming up, we'll take a look at the severe weather impacting millions today across the south and midwest, and we'll explain why an irs agent is asking for whistleblower status "morning joe" is coming right back ♪ limu emu & doug ♪ hey, man. nice pace! clearly, you're a safe driver. you could save hundreds for safe driving with liberty mutual. they customize your car insurance so you only pay for what you need!

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ten minutes before the top of the hour. live look at the white house a beautiful friday morning in

washington, d.c. an irs special agent is seeking whistle-blower protections to share information with congress the agent alleged to have about political interference in the continuing political probe into hunter biden hallie jackson has the details >> reporter: new reaction to the allegation that the president's son is getting preferential treatment with a letter to congress asking for protection for his work in a high profile case his attorney won't confirm which one but a source familiar with the matter said it is the hunter biden investigation. >> he is somebody who would really regret if he just stayed silent and did nothing and so he's not living with his life that way in terms of credibility he's

willing to be cross-examined, tested he has documents that support some of the assertions he wants the make. >> reporter: the agent allegedly seen clear conflicts of interest and preferential treatment infecting decisions. nbc news learned federal prosecutors considered potential criminal charges throw tax crimes and a charge related to a gun purchase. hunter biden said a review would show he handled the affairs legally and appropriately. last month the attorney general making this pledge about the case overseen by a trump appointed u.s. attorney in delaware. >> he is not restricted in the investigation in any way. >> we surely are curious to see if this is being slow walked. >> reporter: no comment from the justice department or the irs but the white house says the president is keeping an appropriate distance.

>> he believes in the rule of law and independence of the justice department. >> reporter: hunter biden raising the public profile recently in ireland with his father this month. >> i'm proud of you. >> reporter: the attorney telling nbc news it appears this irs agent has committed a crime by sharing private tax information. >> hallie jackson with that report meantime federal prosecutors have considered charging hunter biden with four separate crimes. the sources say those possible charges include three tax crimes, one related to a gun purchase two misdemeanor counts for failure to file taxes. a single felony count on tax evasion related to a business expense for one year taxes and

the gun charge which is also a potential felony additionally two senior law enforcement sources told nbc news about the quote growing frustration in the fbi because investigators finished the bulk of the work on the case about a year ago last october "the washington post" reported that two federal prosecutors believed they had gathered enough evidence to charge hunter biden. the decision to file charges if any will be made by attorney david weiss appointed by former president trump and retained by the biden administration to continue the hunter biden investigation. the two sources familiar with the matter said there are no indications a final decision has been made. the irs criminal investigation, the justice department and the office of attorney for the

district of delaware and for hunter biden declined to comment. jonathan, your thoughts? >> yeah. a few points to make the white house is not goingfiat you heard there of press secretary jean-pierre saying they are out of it the president is worried about his son. there's an expectation in washington the frustration from the fbi is well-known and a possibility that hunter biden might be charged with a crime of course, there will be a political dynamic to that with president biden expected to announce a run for re-election ainge doing so potentially with his son under indictment it is donald trump himself

indicted once and a possibility of future charges and clear that people said to me hunter biden is his son not involved with the accusations. we saw hunter front and center on the trip to ireland. >> absolutely. quote fashion with marjorie taylor greene? it's all inside the new volume of maga-zine there's a vision from airmail. "morning joe" will be right back just like i stole kelly carter in high school. you got no game dude, that's a foul! and now you're ready to settle the score. game over. and if you don't have the right home insurance coverage, well, you could end up paying for all this yourself.

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who go there and are willing to take him on. i've known him for 22 years. i'm not afraid. >> chris christie seems to be dropping hints about a potential presidential campaign possibly as the anti-trump candidate. it comes as desantis is losing steam and speaking of the 2024 election illinois governor jb pritzker is standing by hosting the 2024 democratic national convention this hour, the next defamation case for fox news after settling the dominion lawsuit for $787 million. the big question you have is why they didn't do a grand settlement with a big one looming now with just all the

dirty laundry out there. >> they paid $800 million. on the dirty laundry out there and to make matters worse, paying that money didn't make it go away. >> no. >> you still have this lawsuit, smartmatic, lawsuit going up they say they did demand an apology. you have it on the backside with horses saying why did you humiliate us and why not settle before we were humiliated and now exposed again in the future. i don't understand the advice, the strategy here why it is so muddled. >> legal experts and ceos agree. who is running the place jonathan and eugene are with us. >> if you notice, jonathan, chris christie was very helpful

because defend and suspend why they rhyme he said donald trump when he did the oath to defend the constitution maybe there's a bird chirping at the time. he thought suspend the constitution which donald trump promised to do. >> defend does not rhyme with terminate and he used to describe the constitution. >> good point. >> less helpful from govern christie trying to give him the benefit of the doubt but seeking a lane to attack trump. there it is. termination of all rules, regulations and termination. even the constitution. christie is expected to jump in the race and maybe he and governor hutchinson doing this,

taking on trump when so many others are not basically single handedly obliterated marco rubio in 2016 and could do work for and support donald trump in office and has baggage to contend with. >> yeah. some helpful rhyming from the control room from alex who said germinate rhymes with terminate. perhaps -- no. he has the germany thing there i don't know. >> doesn't really work. >> let's workshop it. >> republican lawmakers in florida endorse donald trump over their governor ron desantis yesterday congressman mike waltz became the latest lawmaker to

snub desantis. part of what sources say is a deliberate effort to embarrass ron desantis the florida governor not doing any favors according to "the new york times" trump is making efforts to connect with the state's gop congressional delegation in a way that desantis never has. freshman congresswoman who endorsed trump says that after her father died in a car crash last year she got two condolence letters, one signed and one from desantis' wife, not the governor himself. >> this goes to what we hear another congressman who had a horrible fall. >> yeah. >> 20, 25-foot fall. in the hospital. just absolutely terrible condition.

he recovered but said the first call he got in the icu from donald trump desantis never bothered doing it and again, people go -- it does matter it is politics this is what politics is if you don't want to that you can to people, pick another profession in this case the congressman gets back and there's a hurricane in the district. his district is touched it greatly. and ron desantis holds a press conference and won't let him be in the press conference. my press conference. i have been around a lot of herschel walkers i remember louton childs dragging me into a room where the president's people didn't want me in there childs said this is joe's district

if joe is not in here then i'm not in here. that's from a politician with little use for me. shows you how bad ron desantis is with his owner allies. >> yeah. i think that's congressman stubie. >> yeah! >> absolutely ron desantis has -- what's the opposite of the personal touch worse than the impersonal touch. repels people and that's really a bad trait to have if you want to get -- to do politics it just really is. as you say you have to like to talk to people you have to -- because that's what you are going to do and what politics is about it sounds as if desantis really doesn't. doesn't like that sort of retail aspect of politics at all.

so these are the -- the members of congress from the home state won landslide as governor and would think he has juice for endorsements he has one from republican member of congress from florida and i think trump has something like nine or ten or maybe 11 at this point there are only 20. so trump will soon have a majority of the florida congressional delegation supporting him instead of the governor who won this huge victory just a little while ago. so that really tells you about this man and what we are learning is he is a pretty weird guy. >> yeah. desantis continues to face attacks from some in his own party for the campaign against disney this is what former trump

adviser conway had to say yesterday. >> i think we'll look back at six months saying what in the world happened desantis and trump flipped places in the polls. he spends too much time on the culture wars woke is important but you can't have that as a replacement for a bold economic plan. >> illinois democratic governor jb pritzker said when the candidates focused on woke culture illinois voters saw through the hidden extremists running for school board and governor pritzker joins us now. we'll start there but we have a lot to talk to you about but if you could talk about what

happened locally and the trea extremes. >> we had organizations putting up candidates that were against parents, students, teachers wanting to ban books those candidates put up for elections and it was important to shine a light on them and make sure that the voters knew sometimes people don't know who they vote for. there is not enough information. we want people to know and when they found out they rejected the candidates these are extreme candidates and it is happening all over the country. we saw it here in illinois and we defeated them. >> interesting. >> fascinating that -- we are seeing it in places like kansas, wisconsin. what's so fascinated is republicans so effectively use culture wars over 20 years but i

think we are coming a point where law of diminishing returns is coming in and working against them abortion working against them. the obsession on transathletes and on drag queen shows or something like that. i don't want to break it to them they act like this is new and culture is going -- i kind of remember like the "rocky horror picture show." i remember this in 1970s culture. 50 years ago this idea that this started somewhere last month is again just people looking and say get serious here. >> you have got it exactly right. at the heart of it is this

fundamental cruelty focusing on attacking children who are lgbtq or teachers are. or taking on people who are not white. banning black history from the schools. making sure that certain texts aren't available to people there's a cruelty to it all. i think that voters see that and showing up and rejecting it. >> good morning. reporting this morning that president biden could announce as soon as next week running for re-election. and you have been talking to him because he is part of the process of giving chicago the democratic national convention want your response and what you hope to showcase in chicago with the eyes of the world on it.

>> let me start by saying we have a great global nation it was the right thing to pick chicago. we have a blue wall that we have to protect in the midwest. gretchen whitmer getting re-elected this blue wall here in the midwest is something that the democrats rely on to elect and re-elect joe biden and anybody to the presidency. so the recognition of that was very important anybody who spent a summer in chicago knows how beautiful it is we are proud to be able to host it the biden-harris ticket is -- so important for the future of the nation remember that just in two years president biden has gotten so much done and hard to do in a 50-50 world where you need to get votes maybe on the other

side of the aisle. he can do that think about the c.h.i.p.s act and the ira and the infrastructure bill helping to rebuild our nation bringing manufacturing back to the midwest and the united states building new roads and bridges and water ports and airports th thanks to the work of joe biden. i mentioned about the cruelty of people on the right that joe biden exudes empathy he is somebody that more than anybody i think of in my lifetime that held the office cares about people and i think that matters to the american people. >> you have a new mayor to work with in chicago in brandon johnson. i'm wondering who his biggest challenges are going to be and how maybe the two of you can

work together. >> we are already working together he has come to springfield to talk to the legislation which you shall and me about the things that are necessary. he is focused on something that i am focused on which is lifting up people who are left out and left behind. he won because in my opinion he addressed that i want to say that this is a world where people recognize genuineness, authenticity mat everies and he is who he is. you can see it and feel him. he is the son of a preacher. he has a family. he lives in austin not the easiest neighborhood to live in. he represents the challenges and the opportunities for chicago. >> democratic governor pritzker

of illinois, thank you so much for coming on the show this friday morning we appreciate it. >> thank you. >> all right another eventful week in washington some much needed levity to politics with the second volume of the vision for what donald trump magazine would look like called "maga zine "and the editor joins us now. i like it. all maga this entire magazine >> all maga all the time. >> it is a section but all put together by old spy magazine hands. second volume. the fact that trump never thought about magazine surprised me. >> what will - >> very positive way that

even -- i'm sorry. it is written in a way that even trump supporters can find no fault in it. >> own the libs with style >> this is by marjorie taylor greene. >> just go through her outfits my favorite is -- who is the former editor of "mad magazine" and about the trump memorial plans and the ways to monetize the death and memorial. >> there's also a segment called "dying to get in" with the memorial mike lindell with the pillow crying what about the last dance? the former vice president. tell us about what you are trying to get there. >> i won't make comments but it is just mike pence, you feel -- i don't understand republicans how they dance around trump and

not address him directly but this is his attempt to dance around the subject of trump. >> understood. the weekly issue of aairmail comes out tomorrow you write amid this era of grifr and corruption some glimmers of hope came this month in the cases of two organizations that have histories of grubbing in the gutter for nickels and which along the way created vast divisions in the country fox news was in the dock for the inaccurate attacks against dominion voting machines following the 2020 presidential election the trump organization is still in the dock according to new york attorney general james for accused of staggering fraud, inflating assets by billions of dollars when applying for bank loans. lies were at the heart of the

fox dominion case as they were throughout the trump administration and the current re-run for the president is i. while this is going on succession winds the way to the season four conclusion for the trumps it must seem unfair that the murdoches get the hbo treatment for the dramas surrounding their family succession, for all it indictment, it is classy the trammic domestic opera is trikely to get the reality show treatment which is less classy. >> looking at the settlement this week and another massive settlement is headed fox's way to pay out on, do you sense that there's a bit of gravity returning, that words do matter?

that people do actually in the end get held accountable for the actions whether it is in court, about these voting machines or whether it is january 6th defendants >> i'm with you. i listen to you guys every morning and feel the same frustrations you do that there seems to be no accountability for misdeeds in the country right now. and i think other than dominion, while i think it won financially, they should have exacted an apology many apologies that would be on air from fox i think the first amendment took a hit because the same lawyers defending dominion trying to diminish the first amendment which is a problem and i think that the fox viewers know nothing about this i don't think it's a victory there's reporters disappointed because they had book contracts and in the courtroom that day

and realized the books are going to be far less dramatic than expected so it was -- i'm looking forward to the smartmatic thing but maybe the fox people think this is a cost of doing business. the payouts is the cost of doing business. >> gosh. that's cynical thank you very much. you can read more from "morning joe's" partnership with airmail. >> she was saying that fox was cynical. not you. >> yeah. >> no one ever accused - >> okay. thank you. bless you. >> thank you. the lead attorney for the smartmatic about forcing fox to

apologize. plus, from january 6 to mar-a-lago, an update on the other key investigations into donald trump later this hour, actors jake gyllenhaal and dar salim join us to talk about "the covenant" and interpreters left behind from the evacuation of afghanistan. you are watching "morning joe. we'll be right back. ♪ honestly'♪ find the perfect vacation rental for you booking.com, booking. yeah. trelegy for copd. ♪birds flyin' high, you know how i feel.♪ ♪breeze driftin' on by...♪ ♪...you know how i feel.♪ you don't have to take... [coughing] ...copd sitting down. ♪it's a new dawn,...♪ ♪...it's a new day,♪ it's time to make a stand. ♪and i'm feelin' good.♪ start a new day with trelegy.

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welcome back wear hearing from the lead attorney in smartmatic's d defamation suit against fox news saying it was grievously harmed by the comments. yesterday the lawyer representing the company said ed in the settled dominion lawsuit could be used in it case.

>> in addition to that, what i think is yunique about the situation is recklessness involved smartmatic in l.a. county only and you can confirm that with a one-minute google search but the facts and the defendants doing is that we masterminded an ability to rig a national election in one county that level of recklessness is something you don't normally see. >> don't you think it's important to make sure that the millions of americans get the truth? >> no. i'll say long haul i want everybody to think of the long haul here smartmatic is in this case for the long haul looking to take this case to trial and the

vindication of a jury verdict in their favor. to get back to where they were to win the contracts they are now losing they need an apology, a full retraction because they're in that business for a long haul. >> on wednesday fox put out this statement on the smartmatic lawsuit claiming it will defend the case the network calls the damages claims implausible and disconnected from reality. but, joe, this is exactly what you pointed to when the settlement with dominion came out that evidence came out that the humiliating evidence of what was happening on the air is not what they were saying off the air and ended up paying for that that rolls over and gets used as

evidence for smartmatic. >> you have the public relations. you are letting versions know that you are lying to them he is horrible a liar the election claims are purely bogus. then you go on the air and you lie to your viewers. that is a pr problem with legal consequences but what attaches to that and learned from the last trial or the last settlement in all of that discovery is the intent. the intent to do it with malice because they were losing viewership to news max and aon that's devastating about the

discovery. it basically proves the case i'm not surprised that the lawyer is saying we are taking this all the way to the end. also something else that's interesting that may be more troubling for fox news if you have a company like smartmatic saying we are not going to get a billion or two dollars and get out of the business we are in this business to stay. we have to stay in so we need an apology. for you to know how badly the people's business has been challenged and some destroyed, i have friends who are election officials who run elections who say they get yelled at and 'to used of having smartmatic machines and they say, they are only in los angeles right now or dominion that they have dominion

machines no they do four counties over but we don't they are screamed at every election official taken to task because they were in this conspiracy with dominion there is no way any elected official in america can have the dominion or smartmatic machines unless this is cleaned up. taking it to trial, we have to get an apology that makes complete sense if they want to stay in this business for the long run and bad news for fox news let's bring -- >> if you see this sort of tension between reporters asking questions like why didn't you ask for apology, look, there is frustration within the journalistic community about the way fox handled itself but the service to the viewers

i'll put all competition aside fox is a powerhouse. millions of people watch every day. millions of people potentially watch only fox so the importance of that apology so the viewers get the correct information, not being lied to. not promulgating the lies. >> you are concerned about that. >> that's the reason i would ask that question. >> however, the lawyers are -- i'm explaining why there wasn't an apology representing the clients the clients are probably -- their primary concern are making the investors whole. if it was going to cost $200 million for an apology that's not what they were in the business for that's why people write editorials or talk on shows like this

let's bring in andrew weissman i've been absolutely stunned over the past couple days and the way fox has stumbled they pay $787 million and they have another suit out. so all the things that they paid for, almost $800 million to make certain things go away did not and murdoch, the hosts, the discovery is still going to be out there. if they don't now settle for probably even more money to smartmatic i have no idea -- the logic of it all to drag it all the way to the end. then go ahead and pay almost $800 million none of it makes sense legally

or business wise why did it happen that way >> i think you are putting the finger on a real problem here which is logically you don't understand and i don't understand and i don't think we have answers to why fox if there was going to be a settlement didn't pony up the money before the incredibly damaging emails and texts that showed what people were thinking privately sometimes denial is a big factor and people think it won't be so bad. we have legal arguments. maybe the judge will rule in ways that are favorable. that may be part of it people at fox thinking they could go to trial. maybe take it to the supreme court. but i think maybe one of the key things is when the district judge said at trial you dominion can call rupert murdoch to the

stand as well as all of this key hosts. i think that may have been a bridge too far saying i am not going to be like disgraced like that and forced to make the statements under oath and settle to be cynical the big picture may be they pay to dominion, maybe to smartmatic but seems to be tax deductible. not as large as anybody thinks and the business models goes on. they have a huge viewer ip the next time they know not to denigrate a company. coming up, the power of national politics. the u.s. economy just keeps rolling along. david brooks has the receipts

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his father called and asked them to check on his son. when deputies arrived they say he fired several shots at the home and at them

a deputy said he heard the whistling sound as it hit a metal object near to him he is now facing charges of being a felon in possession of a firearm. let's bring in reporter for "the washington post" jackie alamaner looking at the investigations -- >> this is the friday check-up we can go top to bottom. >> starting with january 6. >> it is interesting i'm sure you saw the poll this week just released voters scaled them on what they consider to be illegal activity. manhattan was at the bottom but at the top was georgia voters for some reason, they get the -- maybe that tape recording. but most voters, a majority think that's illegal activity

and more concerned about that than what happened in manhattan or the documents. >> yeah. i think it's exactly for the reason that you just noted, joe. the evidence is very clear cut everyone heard it. apparently other recordings that the d.a.'s office has obtained as evidence. we had an frackus when the lead juror did interviews but the court of public opinion matters with all of these cases. >> let's turn to special counsel jack smith when's been quiet but we know that there is still work done by main justice talk about the two cases january 6 and the mar-a-lago documents case

many in trump orbit most anxious. >> evan corcoran appeared saying that he could not be shielded from provide -- could not use privilege because of the crime fraud exception and needed to provide answers to questions to prosecutors about conversations he had had with the client former president trump about the statements he made to the department of justice, responses to the subpoenas and conversations with trump about where the classified documents lied throughout mar-a-lago then middle of the week we saw some action going on in the

manhattan d.a.'s office. bragg ultimately lost a case against house judiciary chairman jordan mark pomeranz has had to testify. and another top trump attorney which bears -- which i think should make -- remind you all about the infamous saying make attorneys get attorneys. he appeared yesterday for an interview raising eyebrows with defense attorneys who noted that it is not often that targets in cases appear before grand juries but try to negotiate interviews because they often take the fifth and maybe sometimes in the

interviews try to avoid getting charges. boris is involved with all trump activities for years now but now the mar-a-lago documents case and january 6. it is unclear what he told prosecutors yesterday in this closed door interview but something to be looking for today coming up, guests join "morning joe" with the gripping new movie "the covenant. how they tackle the u.s. withdrawal from afghanistan when "morning joe" comes right back

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how long you been here >> five years. >> you like it >> it is a job, sir. >> well, this unit specializes in explosive sites basically we get into trouble.

sadly, we've lost our last interpreter. >> understood. >> it is ahkmed, sir. >> oh, yeah. it is sergeant, not sir. >> that was a scene from the few film "the covenant." the film follows u.s. arm sergeant john kinley played by jake gyllenhaal and afghan interpreter ahkmed played by dar salim. ahkmed goes to great lengths to save kinley's life but then kinley is compelled to return to the war war zone to find them be the taliban does joining us now the film's stars, jake gyllenhaal and dar salim. gentlemen, thank you so much for joining us today the film is terrific, action packed

i had to remind myself to exhale a few different times. >> thanks, jonathan. >> thanks for having us. >> it's a tense ride, that's for sure. >> no question there jake, you've acted in a few other war related films such as jarhead and brothers tell us what drew you to this part >> first and foremost, guy richie, our director who's made classic films and always entertaining i've always wanted to work with him. also, the idea of doing good and not having it sentimentalized. it's a story of two very unlikely people coming together and having what i wouldn't call a friendship, but a reluctant, begrudging friendship. doing good comes out of action, not necessarily out of thinking

of ones self as good we like to call it an action parable because that's what it is it's a very simple story about doing the right thing. >> dar, your character has a key line in the film where he suggests that he's not a translator but rather an interpreter. explain what that means and how it informs this unlikely bond between the two men. >> as jake said, because this is a relationship which is based off necessity more than a natural relationship between, say, two americans or two afghans. they're kind of stuck together what ahmed is saying to john kinley is, listen, i'm not a google translator, i'm here to interpret the situation for you, interpret the culture and how things work in my country. even though you're in charge, my life is at stake too this is kind of the get-go, the

starting point of their relationship. >> jake, you mentioned guy richie at the helm was part of the appeal here. he is known for an, shall we say, unorthodox approach to filming, sort of relaxed and improvisation. tell us what you thought of that. >> i loved it. i think i can speak for dar when i say the creative experience at its best is when you have someone making a movie that's a leader, you are in the mind of guy richie and in service of that, but also collaborative when he works, he starts with a 60-page script, partial sort of treatment, some scenes written out with dialogue, and you find it together. he writes throughout the process, but you really discover the characters together. i loved it i love doing different things and different versions of things i don't think there's one fixed

way of being creative. to find different worlds and explore them is inspiring. working with him is great fun. there's no reason we're making a very serious movie that can't be great fun too. >> dar, how did you prepare for your role, relatively new to the u.s. film business how did you incorporate things from the real world into your character? >> a lot of my friends are veterans from the iraq and afghanistan war. denmark was part of the coalition where i'm from i spoke to interpreters and focused mostly on the conversations with guy and jake on the set, because that's where the movie really happened. you had someone who knew where he wanted to go, but he created an atmosphere where we could find it together i just love the fact that we ended up making a wonderful action film that will keep you

engaged and at the edge of your seat, but at the heart of it is true emotions. it's not a story about two actual interpreters and soldiers, it's the story of all the soldiers and all the interpreters it's a story you can make larger than life. it's still emotionally true, because it's a fact that all interpreters did put their lives at stake every day working alongside the u.s. soldiers and all u.s. soldiers did put their lives at stake every day trying to do the right thing. once we found that heart of the story and the relationship, it was a wonderful ride to be on. >> jake just mentioned this film is not based on one specific soldier, one specific interpreter, but we know that there were hundreds of interpreters left behind in afghanistan after the u.s. military withdrawal in august 2021 the film makes that clear. when audiences are watching this

movie about the bond, the promise between the soldiers and the interpreters, what should they take home about those who are still there after risking their lives to help their american soldiers? >> first and foremost, we hope they entertain and they love the movie that was action packed and a great venture. hopefully we are a country whose ethos is about no one left behind i think america is made of heros and oftentimes reluctant ones, but it's the fabric of who we are not just as americans, but as humans in this world that has become so global i hope we take away the idea that we leave no one behind and there's good inside of us no matter what and to look out for

each other that, to me, would be a success. that's what i'm so proud of that the film communicates. >> it certainly communicates that as well as a lot of action that will leave you gripped to the screen "the covenant" is in theaters now. jake gyllenhaal, dar salim, thank you both. >> thanks for having us. >> we will brie ght back with more "morning joe. allergies don't have to be scary. (screaming) defeat allergy headaches fast with new flonase headache and allergy relief! two pills relieve allergy headache pain? and the congestion that causes it! flonase headache and allergy relief. psst! psst! all good! there's always a fresh deal on the subway app. like this one! 50% off?! that deal's so good we don't even need an

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beautiful shot >> let me tell you something, you know, this is unusual day because i know the country i've been all around this great big world. >> yeah? >> very rarely do you see clouds and rain in seattle. it's called america's sunshine city. >> not really. beautiful. good morning, seattle. it's 6:00 a.m. on the west coast. >> four more hours before you have to wake up and get into work. >> we have a lot to get to this hour, including the latest reporting on a new frontier in the field of campaign finance. a pro-desantis super pac is making major moves. also we're looking at a major headline involving the u.s. economy home prices just had the biggest drop in more than a decade. plus, the pentagon releases

video of an unidentified flying object flying over a war zone. we'll have more about that extremely concerning story. we begin with president joe biden preparing to formally announce he is running for reelection next week, planning to launch his campaign as early as tuesday, according to three sources familiar with the plans. tuesday is the anniversary of biden's 2020 campaign announcement that news comes as nearly half of democrats think president joe biden should run again in 2024 the latest a.p. poll out this morning shows 47% of democrats want him to run again, up from 37% in january 81% of democrats say they'd at least probably support the president in the general election if he was the party's nominee, with 41% saying they definitely would and 40% saying

they probably would. the poll also found biden's job approval rating at 42%, up four points from last month. >> let's bring in ashley parker from the "washington post" and reverend al sharpton look at these numbers. joe biden always sort of underperforms in the polls we've seen that time and time again. we certainly saw it before the 2022 midterms. but these numbers remind me of what people were saying about harry truman before his big 1948 win, we're just mild about harry. that's kind of how democrats have always felt about biden, but he always seems to be underestimated do you think that's the same case here? are you pretty sure he's going to run and announce that next

week >> i'm pretty sure he's going to announce and i'm pretty sure he's being underestimated. i'm also sure that's part of what energizes him to be underestimated is some of the motivation he has to go out and do what he does. if you look at his travel schedule for the last several weeks, i don't know many presidents who have gone many places in that short span of time, including this overseas trip where you did this interview with him that we're waiting to see, by the way i digress. i think he has really shown a kind of energy that you get when you want to fight a night you think you're behind or at least you're being projected as behind, but you know deep inside that you are far better than that i think it's motivation for him and good for his candidacy

>> this is one of the most underestimated people in politics in a very long time by the way, not by republicans of course, they're going to criticize him. but democrats say, oh joe biden, he's too old to run for president in 2020. and joe biden, oh, he got embarrassed in iowa and new hampshire. the old man should just go home. then he wins south carolina, then he beats the 16 people that were running against him, then he's too old to be president he gets elected. i keep hearing this from democrats. oh, you know, his best days are behind him then he shocks people with a historic achievement in the midterms then you start hearing it a couple weeks later then he delivers a state of the union address. oh my god, biden,he's back

then two weeks later democrats start up ashley, i know you hear it this has been going on, i guess, since he's been in politics. he's always underestimated. >> you're absolutely right i'm still hearing that from some democrats, especially those concerns about age people who are close to biden have said and apply this to politics and also his life that he is simultaneously the luckiest and unluckiest man alive, a lot of personal tragedies, a lot of political losses in presidential primaries before he came back and won it if you look at biden himself, he has a lot of adages and quips, but he always says don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative if you look at that context that elections are always about binary choices, despite private gripes and grumbles and whispers and concerns, he has no

meaningful democratic primary challenge, nor is he expected to get that he sort of put that away with the successful midterms. then it will be a binary choice again between him and a republican nominee, who could be someone like donald trump, where joe biden believes with some historical evidence and that he beat donald trump in 2020, that he will be the preferred alternative there as well. >> his numbers always seem to lag behind what people support, whether you look at issues or character traits you go down the list again, there always seems to be sort of this false positive against joe biden and he ends up proving again and again proving his critics wrong. >> joining us now, jonathan che. you ask, if ron desantis is just

not dumb enough for republicans. >> ouch. >> you write, unlike trump, who oozed his way into politics through fox news, desantis came to the conservative movement from the brand his first term as governor achieved political success because in part the pandemic allowed him to craft a populist identity based on the intuitive principle of letting people do what they want now he has become upobsessed wi uprooting life from the schools to the beer they drink to the cartoons their children watch. he is pursuing an historically necessary struggle i wonder, however, if republican voters are even able to follow the plot >> jonathan, this is certainly a counterintuitive argument at a time when ron desantis keeps

st stumbling with allies with bob iger and the mouse waiting to ab abuse him politically. isn't desantis the one that's looking kind of dumb right now >> i'm arguing he's sort of overthinking it. he went to south carolina this week and he was ranting to the republican audience there about cultural marxism and using these abstract concepts and terms. it's not clear to me his audience is really clued in. i think he's genuinely become so committed to this idealogical project, i think he's kind of lost touch with how his voters really think about the world i do think he's an intelligent guy. i don't think you can really call him dumb. he's making some bad mistakes, but i don't think he lacks brain

power. i think he's gone too far the other way. >> i never understood this i remember when you had madison cawthorn in north carolina saying the craziest thing on the planet i just sat there thinking, if that dude would just say less taxes, less spending, fewer regulations, stronger america, he would have been reelected with 85% of the vote for the rest of his life in that district it's just like desantis. if desantis did a main street less taxes, less spending, less regulations, more freedom and a stronger military, it's just like trump trump would have won in 2020 if he had gone that route why do they all keep overthinking this and getting engaged in these culture wars that they're losing time after time after time? >> well, look, i don't want to

defend desantis, but in his defense, he's got something trickier than just winning in a republican district like madison cawthorn he's trying to knock off donald trump, who's abeloved figure t the republicans. he's trying to do this complicated dance where he says i'll be everything that donald trump was but without the stuff you don't like, but without also saying what the stuff you don't like is. he's really trying to maneuver through this complex terrain, but he's kind of over intellectualized it and genuinely come to believe this theory they've got to use government power to take on this woke conspiracy that's oozed its way into all these aspects of american life. i think he's become kind of fanatical about it and lost sight of what he's trying to do here, which is win the nomination.

>> i don't understand the republicans again. maybe you can help me out here they have to know their positions, which are radical on these social issues, they're radical on guns, they're radical on abortion, they're radical on banning books, they're radical on even teaching history they've got teachers across america worried, like, can i teach about institutional racism republicans are now suggesting that teaching that black people have been victims of institutional racism in the united states of america is a radical theory i don't know how they do that and keep a straight face, but they do. they are wildly out of step with most americans so, again, why do they keep doing this i really want to understand. what do you hear >> you're right that these by

and large especially something like abortion are not popular general election positions the challenge for republicans, which is what it's always been, especially with gerrymandering in house districts, but even on a national level, is the biggest threat in many house races and the first hurdle in a presidential campaign is to win a republican primary there you have a base of voters, many of them who would consider themselves maga heads, trump loyalists who do believe these positions are important. when you talk to republican strategists there's a lot of concerns that say, look, you have desantis mentioning woke every other clause, you have all these fights over wokism and critical race theory and environmental sustainable investing and abortion and guns. this may be great for trying to win a republican primary, but

it's a real albatross when it comes to the general election. some are true believers, but for a lot of them that's why you're seeing these positions that don't make a lot of sense if you're trying to win over a majority of the country. >> jonathan, in looking at your piece, it reminds me of people that are running for office around the country and they'll come to some event or rally, civil rights rally, and start talking what they think is the talk that black folks talk i mean, i've seen it many times. it made me think about that when i was looking at your piece. is it that ron desantis is trying to play to a crowd that he's really not part of the crowd, so he's overplaying it and arguing things that are in his head, the whole idea of wokism and all, which is not really they are, but he thinks that's the way he's relating

like a politician going to harlem and all of a sudden he gets slang in his dialogue that we've never heard before >> yeah. i don't really believe that. i know that's a widespread theory of desantis i actually think he's a true believer i think he's become pretty fanatically attach ed to this wy of looking at the world. instead of just finding ways to maybe attack areas where he thinks the democrats have gone too far and left an opening for him in the middle, he goes all the way to the right wing extreme. i think it's because he's convinced he's the struggle for the future of american politics. >> thank you so much for coming on this morning. despite a perilous political

landscape, new data is giving cause for optimism about america's future an economist looked at the united states' economic performance over the past three decades to see what has changed. while the gdp and some of our closest competitors ebbed and flowed since 1990, like japan, for example, america has stayed at the top of the pack despite all of the challenges over the years. let's bring in "new york times" opinion columnist david brooks, who is writing about this report in his latest column entitled the power of american capitalism you write, the mighty mississippi rolls on if you don't live near it, you might never think of that wide powerful river you may associate it with mark twain stories, but every day, 24/7 it rolls on american capitalism is kind of like that. you can invent fables about how

america is in economic decline you can rail against neo liberalism, but the american economy doesn't care it just keeps rolling on my point is not that american capitalism is perfect. my point is there is a tension between economic dynamism and economic security. for reasons deeply rooted in our culture, the american brand of capitalism has always been tilted toward dynamism with freer markets and smaller welfare states we've lived through a wretched political era. the social fabric is fraying in a thousand different ways, but american capitalism rolls on. >> a couple of years ago i started obsessing over countries' gdp i remember the first time i started digging into the charts,

i noticed that most countries are up, down, up, down then i looked at the united states since about 1990. i noticed there's a little blip here and there, but through all the political chaos, through all the government shutdowns, through all the impeachments, through all the political crises, our gdp line went like this it just kept going straight up just like you, i looked at it and i thought, well, big wheels keep on rolling. it is a remarkable thing if you listen to democrats when republicans are in office or republicans when democrats are in office, they'll all tell you, oh, the country is fading, it's collapsing no comparatively from 1990 to now, you point out our economy is actually stronger. it's become a bigger, even more

powerful machine across the globe. >> if you listen to donald trump, we're in american carnage, the country is in a crisis, we're on the verge of a civil war. then you look at the data and that's just not an accurate picture of where we are. gdp growth is pretty steadily up you see productivity and american workers are not only more productive than workers around the world, but getting more productive. you look at education. we are pretty good at the number of people we send to college you look at the number of skilled immigrants in this country. we think of millennials and gen z as a generation that's really had it rough, low wages, high housing. that was true after the financial crisis in the last five years gen zs

and millennials are having the highest wage group the dynamism of the american economy is picking up people who were suffering, which is the young. because of that dynamism, we could afford to have a more generous welfare state and we're increasing the amount of money for social support and cushioning the people on the bottom. >> you also compare us to european countries if you look at earnings, gdp per capita and again comparatively to where we were in 1990 when the economy was supposedly so much stronger and demagogues on both sides talked about how capitalism was dying the fact is, comparatively we're doing much better now against the g7 countries even than we

did 30 years ago. >> we have a slightly different model. i live in europe they have a lot of positives to their models, a lot of social support, more health care system that we do they don't have as much dynamism and growth we're trying to find the right balance, to have the dynamism and growth but also to have the right kind of social support if you look at what biden's passed, he's trying to increase the support without crushing the dynamism my worry is that we have people on the extremes who have lost faith in capitalism all together if you go to tucker carlson, he's attacking capitalism as part of a great betrayal so the republican party, which used to be for free enterprise, is not so much anymore so these declinists are proposing policies that will produce what they pretend to be

trying to avoid. >> these declinists, donald trump has led these declinists for the past six or seven years. it's pretty remarkable how things have changed. the declinists are now all on the trump right. they yoused to be on the far let now you have the trump right talking about american carnage, talking about donald trump's book "the american dream is dead," talking about how horrible things are going. the united states is the biggest threat to western civilization you've talked about american capitalism let's talk about the state of our country overall. you have people on the trump right attacking our military, our armed forces i've been traveling across europe, across the world let me tell you something. they understand the u.s. military is stronger now than at any time since 1945, again, comparatively. >> i couldn't be more grateful

for their presence in key areas around the world. >> you talk about the economy and how strong the economy is. the dollar has been generational highs over the past year you look at childhood poverty at 50 or 60-year lows you look at teen pregnancy at 50-year lows you look at our educational system you're exactly right monarchs, sheiks, you name it, they send their kids to america to educate their children. if this is what declinism looks like, give me more of it we're doing pretty damn well. >> the three of us spend a lot of our time focusing on problems and we should. but sometimes we ignore how strong things are. i've decided to spend three

hours a day thinking about artificial intelligence, because it's a gigantic thing. that's all happening here. innovation is happening here the vaccines happened here what puzzles me if you've got all these underlying things going well, why are we in such a bad mood why do so many people think the coming generations won't have the advantages that people in my generation had some of it is, frankly, our fault in the media we're a little too negative probably some of it is a wall of cynicism built up i was talking to an administration official about this yesterday a lot of good things have been happening and credit is not being given to those who have passed major pieces of legislation the last couple of years. it's just this wall that, oh, things are terrible, nobody's helping us out somehow something has to be done to reverse or puncture the wave of cynicism and disillusionment

and distrust that i think is actually not reflective of reality. >> "new york times" opinion columnist david brooks, thank you so much for bringing us this important message. >> ashley parker, you as well. >> ashley, you listen to david, you know the stats too things are never as bleak as our politicians suggest they are what do you think is contributing to the negativity is it the cynicism of washington is it the media? >> david's column was fascinating as was hearing him talk about it just now i think when i go out in the country and talk to voters and i'm often looking for a certain type of voter, whether on the democratic side, the republican side, the republican base, whoever. a lot of the complaints and stuff you hear is stuff

emanating from a media echo chamber. if you talk to republicans, it's often from fox news and even more far-right, fringe websites, things they've picked up not twitter. washington is increasingly less obsessed with twitter with momove by musk. but by facebook, someone forwarded it to them, it may not be true. but you do understand when these people say, i heard that immigrants come over here and they get a free flight to martha's vineyard. i'd love to go to martha's vineyard for free. that's wildly inaccurate and bungling the details but for someone who's not having the time to track down what is true, what is not true, hearing from politics who have their own agendas, you can see how david

makes a strong case for a macro increase, but on a daily level you can still see that grimness, quite understandably. >> i think when you look at this, you also have to couple in that they're feeling that more things are going to people that need it. david talked about dealing more with social needs. when i talk to people traveling and they think that blacks and other communities of color are getting so much, which is why they're in this so-called rut. one, they're not in a rut. secondly, blacks and people of color are sill percentage wise where they were. they just have more. we have the lowest black unemployment than we've ever had, but they're still 2.5% more

unemployed than whites i think a lot of the blame game also adds to this cynicism. >> we need to have a segment about this black unemployment now, i think at about 5%, the lowest it has ever been in american history. this statistic is one that will be really surprising for a lot of people. the black unemployment rate is lower right now among black males than white males again, we ought to dig into those numbers and have a discussion about it. >> for another day for sure, because it needs some time. coming up on "morning joe," los angeles mayor karen bass is poised to release her first budget proposal since taking office in december it's expected to include a major investment to rebuild the city's

police force we'll speak with l.a.'s chief of police straight ahead. plus, the latest on the war in eastern europe as ukraine gets some much-needed support for its defense againsrut ssian air strikes. "morning joe" will be right back ♪ ♪ it was time for a nunormal with nucala. nucala is a once-monthly add-on treatment for severe eosinophilic asthma that can mean less oral steroids. not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. infections that can cause shingles have occurred. don't stop steroids unless told by your doctor. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. may cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. ask your asthma specialist about a nunormal with nucala. whoa. okay. easy does it. we switched to liberty mutual and saved $652. they customize your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. with the money we saved, we thought we'd try electric unicycles. whoa! careful, babe! saving was definitely easier. hey babe, i think i got it! it's actually... whooooa!

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♪ los angeles mayor karen bass is pushing to rebuild her city's police force as we look at live pictures from los angeles. the lapd lost nearly 1,000 officers since 2019. there are now just over 9,000 sworn officers mayor bass is adding the push to increase hiring in her recent city budget proposal, hoping to get department staff up to 9500 officers los angeles police chief michael moore is backing the mayor's plan he joins us now. thank you so much for being on this morning first, can you talk about the

drop in sworn officers out on the streets? what caused all of that? >> it was a combination of things good morning thank you for the opportunity to be here. it's a combination of the hiring freeze during the pandemic, anti-police sentiment that slowed any momentum or desire to add to our ranks at the same time in concert with a 25% increase in the number of personnel leaving the profession and the department in eras where we would have a normal ebb and flow of retirements, the last three years we've seen hundreds of additional officers leave the department many go to other departments, but others are simply leaving the profession we stopped hiring and stopped inflows and at the same time seeing increased outflows. i'm encouraged by mayor bass's budget to restore this

organization and start the rebuilding process and to do so with a plan that i think will show success. >> i know, chief, the mayor has big plans also to tackle homelessness can you describe the homeless situation in terms of the population of homeless, how it's increased, the problems that have resulted from that increase in numbers and other data, other areas where los angeles is really struggling to keep up with the demand that you would need if you had the correct amount of police officers or enough officers to cope with the demand of problems. >> i believe l.a. is on the rebuild. mayor bass and her initiative has proven results she's placed more than 1,000 persons who are houseless in housing that has allowed them to transition into permanent housing. we're seeing improved conditions in venice beach or hollywood

boulevard or other areas and neighborhoods that previously had encampments that had lasted there for months or years. so the homeless situation is improving. i believe her plan to house more than 17,000 individuals who are presently without shelter is going to show the results that she desires. in concert with that, the interim steps we've done to deal with this despite this reduction in staffing, whether it be redesigning, realigning work flows, assigning in other resources. it's also been a matter of augmenting our personnel with added overtime hours l.a. is on the rebuild i've got great optimism. the recruitment efforts she's identified, we're in a scarcity across this nation of qualified applicants every chief i speak to is expressing what we are here. our plan is to work through this by three phases.

a, better marketing. we're an iconic brand, an agency that offers tremendous opportunities for any young person to join what i think is a very noble profession. secondly, we need to match the incentives we have agencies across america offering bonuses while lapd offers housing incentive, we need to add bonuses. the city council is acting on the mayor's directive initiative to adjust that i think that will bring us to parity with other agencies finally, we've got to improve the process. people who want to join this profession, we want them to apply and be in the academy in less than three months i believe that needs to improve further for what americans expect when they want to join a profession, that it shouldn't take months and years to do so

i believe the budget addresses exactly what we need to do to restore our organization, which will improve the safety of los angeles. >> los angeles police chief michael moore, thank you so much for being on this morning. >> reverend al, we've seen this in los angeles and philadelphia, terrible situation of leaders in philadelphia trying to get as many police officers back in as they can we've seen it across the country. you've been talking with mayor adams and so many other mayors about the need to balance, that police officers need to be supported. they need to know when they go out there that the politicians got their back, but we also need to make sure at the same time that those same police officers are professional, respectful of the people whom they're working for, whom they've serving and protecting i'm just wondering as we get

here to 2023, it's been a rocky three or four years, how is that balance going right now? >> i think there have been some steps forward incremental in some cases, but steps forward. not only do they need to know the politicians have their back, they need to know the community has their back i think people like me that have for years dealt with the question and fought for the question of police accountability must also say one of the ways to deal with this is to have some of you young guys and ladies join the police force and correct it from the inside, which is exactly what eric adams did. he was a policeman when i first met him 35 years ago i think they must know the community will work with them. community policing works as long as the community can trust the police the police must also feel that trust and feel that common bond, because bringing down crime is

something in the interest of both sides it is not something that i think that we ought to make it where people are uncomfortable to try to fight crime in our community. that's exactly what we need, is them to fight crime. we just don't want them to become criminal themselves in their behavior. some of the other stories we are following this morning, two more people have been arrested in connection to the mass shooting saturday at a sweet 16 birthday party in alabama, bringing the total of five people charged now the shooting killed four and wounded 32 others. two men, 19 and 20 years old, were arrested yesterday. authorities say they have been charged with four counts of reckless murder. two other teens and a 20-year-old were also arrested and charged earlier this week. britain's deputy prime minister dominick robb has

resigned following an inquiry into bullying allegations. he writes he decided to resign after an official inquiry found that most of the claims made against him were justified he added the investigation had dismissed all but two of the claims leveled at him which he said were, quote, flawed and set a dangerous precedent for the conduct of good government the findings of the report have not yet been released. home prices, as we reported, fell across the country last month, their biggest annual decline in 11 years. u.s. existing home sales decreased 2.4% in march, down 22% from a year earlier. the drop was the steepest in the western part of the country, where sales were down more than

30%. it also marked the 13th time in the previous 14 months that home sales have slowed. prices have now fallen on an annual basis for two consecutive months for the first time in over a decade. and the first ever declassified video of a ufo over an active combat zone is sparking concern about potential cross fire the video released by the pentagon on wednesday shows a spherical object jetting across the sky in iraq. defense officials don't believe the ufo presents a threat to other aircraft nft region or is of extraterrestrial origin in an interview with fox news, one expert said the incident could have, quote, devastating potential from countries who may believe the object was sent by an enemy government. we'll keep an eye on that. coming up, we'll get an

update on the war in ukraine we'll be joined by a ukrainian actress and activist, who is trying to bring more attention to the current situation in her country and how everyday americans can help "morning joe" is back in a moment trelegy for copd. ♪ birds flyin' high, you know how i feel. ♪ ♪ breeze driftin' on... ♪ [coughing] ♪ ...by, you know how i feel. ♪ if you're tired of staring down your copd,... ♪ it's a new dawn, ♪ ♪ it's a new day... ♪ ...stop settling. ♪ ...and i'm feelin' good. ♪

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. this week marked the 80th anniversary of the warsaw ghetto uprising that was the largest jewish evolt against the nazis during the holocaust it was led by an underground armed jewish resistance group. it stands out in history as yet another example of the jewish people's courage in the face of the unimaginable horrors committed against them throughout world war ii. on tuesday, which was holocaust remembrance day, i visited the museum of the history of the polish jews and spoke with a polish historian and a survivor of the auschwitz deathcamp he talked about whether an atrocity on the scale of the holocaust could ever happen again in america. >> you talked about a conversation you had with martin

luther king, jr. could you share that with our audience >> when i got to selma, the famous sheriff clark asked me, are you sure that you want to be there? i told him yes but if you get there, you are not permitted to get out okay and among others, i was asked because they knew i was in auschwitz. i was a survivor of auschwitz. they asked me could it happen elsewhere? and i also said, yes, it could happen even in your country. so how to prevent it i told him, this is only in your fence. if you defend, protect your constitution, your laws, right your rights, civil rights, your

citizens' rights, you will win if not, you will fail. it could happen to you >> and then you talked about january 6th. >> and now i tell you after january 6th, i'm happy that you americans, you were able to protect your rights, your civil rights your constitution, your right to live in democracy. and this is thebest test what does it mean democracy? still, it is in danger there is no such thing done forever. but what you did, it helped us and i hope that our struggle for freedom, for civil rights will

help you >> oh my gosh, so powerful >> so powerful. >> what an incredible conversation, what an incredible opportunity to be able to speak with him, especially there what do you hope people who are watching this will take away from his message >> i tell you, what i took away, the night before we were actually at an event with marion, with your brother, with an event that david zaslavpoliso america, and they had made contributions as well, and so there was this understanding bob kraft was there. he of course has such -- has such an extraordinarily

important organization i've already said ari manual, steve ratner were there. we sat there and we listened to speaker after speaker there to commemorate the 80th anniversary of the warsaw uprising, but also the holocaust. and we had, again, an extraordinary man, a holocaust survivor, and what struck me was marion coming up and what he said and what your brother, the u.s. ambassador of poland said, kashi kelly who you know very well when she and david zaslov were afraid tbn was going to be shut down in poland, one after another they talked about the values of freedom in the west. they talked about fighting, protecting constitutional rights, civil rights, freedom of speech.

>> yeah! and it's amazing that all of these speakers acrosbackgroundsf these generations, with radically different experiences, they were all bonded together by this belief that we have in the west that we've had in the west for some time, belief in freedom. >> yeah. >> and that that -- and let me bring in reverend al real quick. that is the through line, reverend, from a survivor of auschwitz to an executive running a tv network that's being threatened to be shut down because they don't like the message that's being sent out to a u.s. ambassador who was working with allies to help push back a russian invasion. of course, the most extreme example of all of this is an

auschwitz survivor fighting, but as you saw, he drew lessons not only from auschwitz but from selma and are frofrom january th to say this is the through line through it all, and this is how you avoid a future auschwitz in your country. >> absolutely. and i think that real leaders, real responsible leaders or influences have to keep drawing that line. a gentleman name bill waktel was in my office the other day his father was one of the closest people to dr. martin luther king along with stanley levenson and others because they saw that through line with the civil rights movement. and i think we don't talk about that enough. we get in our silos, and it was just moving to hear him talk about -- >> yes. >> -- his own survival, but then to link it to selma, this is what we must do. it was very moving >> hanging on every word, and

really, when you look at what's happening here in america, it's not to underestimate the fox news situation, not to underestimate the division in our politics, the extremes, the disinformation january 6th, it all matters, and another place where it matters -- >> you're just pushing back, yeah, against disinformation just pushing back against narratives that are false. again, big or small, i mean, big or small, we're not equating one thing to another to another. it's a fight to defend the truth. it's a fight to defend civil rights. >> the constitution. >> it's a fight in the end to defend rigorously the constitution of the united states you'll notice, that's what marion, the auschwitz survivor said that's where it starts you defend the constitution. you defend the rule of law you don't let people come in to

talk about terminating the constitution or terminating elections because they didn't win. >> incredible conversation we're going to turn now to very related, the war in ukraine. two american-made patriot missile systems have arrived in ukraine according to the country's defense minister long topping kyiv's wish list. the missile defense system will help ukraine protect itself from russian attack aircraft cruise missiles and shorter range ballistic missiles one of the systems was donated by the u.s. while another was jointly gifted by germany and the netherlands, as the war in ukraine rages on, actress ivana sachno is using her platform to spread the word on how america can help she was born in ukraine and witnessed firsthand the orange revolution in 2004 and the revolution of dignity in 2014, and now her father is still in ukraine helping to relocate children and their mothers from kyiv to safer parts of the

country. sakhno also has extended family who are living in the ukrainian capital and the actor and activist joins us now. thank you so much for being on the show with us i'd love to hear more about what you would like people to do to help the people in ukraine who are trying to stay lalive, stay safe, but also defend themselves against russian aggression. >> hi, thank you so much for having me. it's a very meaningful way to begin the day by your side the main thing that we need help with, which the states have been continuously helping creating people to fight the enemy, and we're very grateful for it there is main three aspects of it it's the weapons that ukrainian soldiers need in order to defend the enemy, accountability, hold russia accountable for the war crimes, and security that we need so when this war ends, russia will just invade again.

>> i know you are very concerned about the forced deportation of children talk about that. >> yeah. one of the main crimes happening during this war is forced kidnapping and deportation of ukrainian children the ukrainian government has verified over 19,000 cases of ukrainian children believed to have been kidnapped and transferred to russia. it's very difficult to tell the exact number of how many kids have been victims, but the yale humanitarian research lab has verified at least 43 facilities across russia and occupied where those children have been sent for reeducation. >> ivanna, it's amazing looking at the pictures that we showed at the beginning of you in the orange revolution. we remember that, and then 2014, and now here we are in 2023. it looks like your story, marching through your story is a story of ukraine's life in this

extraordinary time tell me through it all, i remember how hopeful i was during the orange revolution through it all, do you have hope do you believe this ends with a free and independent democratic ukraine? >> of course i do have hope, and that hope lives within every ukrainian. i think that's why we keep fighting, and that's what we lead with. believe in ukraine, believe in the bright future and democracy in our country i'm incredibly inspired by the people, and i think the entire world has been witnessing the unshakable courage of my people. it's true as you're saying we've lived through generations and generations of ukrainians sent to gulags and exile. my great grandmother was telling her stories of living through auschwitz, living through the starvation mode in ukraine, and

every generation has been wishing the other to have a safe sky above our heads. it's painful to know that children in ukraine really know in their skin what it's like to wish for that safe sky, and i think it's morally imperative to help ukraine end this war for the u.s. and coming back to the deportation of ukrainian children, you know, the -- that violates directly the united nations genocide convention and constitutes a genocide, so i want to encourage people to contact their lawmakers, contact their representatives, and it demand action. so we're doing everything we can. there's -- there is a resolution in the u.s. senate currently, congress resolution 158. so people can contact their lawmakers and demand that they pay attention to it. >> all right >> actress and activist,

ivanna sakhno, thank you very much for coming on the show and everything you're doing. be well. >> and rev, this weekend tell us what you have on "politics nation". >> well, we're going to have the mother and attorney for the young man that was shot twice, almost killed in kansas city we're going to have also the mayor in california that had the fbi came out with text messages where some of the law enforcement there was saying i'll take you to dinner if you kill this black mayor, and they were calling names like monkey we're going to have the mayor of chicago brandon johnson. it's going to be a very active wee weekend. i'm going to challenge people not only are we standing with this black young man i