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and russia i'm serious. why do i care. >> isle tell you why -- >> it might be worth asking yourself what is this about? why do i hate putin so much? has putin called me a racist has he threatened to get me fired for disagreeing with him no, american tv host spouted russian talking points the way tucker did and russia is saying it is sad to see him go. well, tonight, there's new information on what led to his firing also tonight, transgender montana state representative zoey zepher joins me plus, dramatic testimony from e. jean carroll as the civil rape trial of donald trump got under way today in manhattan. but we begin tonight with the one man conspiracy promoter, also known as tucker carlson up until monday, tucker hosted

one of, if not the most watched cable news shows in the country. but his ouster from fox wasn't just any old firing. tucker presented a unique danger that was unlike anything else we have seen in american cable news history. almost exclusively using his one-hour slot to peddle the worst of the worst conspiracies and authoritarian propaganda to millions of americans. to the point where one of the most prominent people who came to tucker's defense after his firing was -- i kid you not, russian foreign minister sergey lavrov >> translator: perhaps it would be useful to consider how things are with freedom of speech in the united states. i heard that tucker carlson has left fox news. it's curious news. what is this related to, one can only guess, but clearly the wealth of views the american

information space has suffered as a result. >> now if it was anyone else, the idea that a senior kremlin official would be defending a united states tv anchor at the united nations no less would be unbelievable it would be unheard of but because it's tuck 'ems it's not surprising it is no secret that his show was the kremlin's favorite russian state tv its favorite russian state tv would frequently air clips of tucker defending him, defending putin specially after the invasion of ukraine. and almostucker was even receiving job offers from russian state tv but it wasn't just russia. tucker also wielded tremendous influence over the republican party. it was often tucker who took some of the most fringe and most dangerous conspiracies that you would find in the darkest corners of the interwebs and inject them into mainstream republican politics. he was essentially the capitol

hill pipeline. the great replacement theory railing how immigrants are making our country dirtier while claiming there is no such thing as white supremacy, tucker would ramble on at 20 minutes at a time promoting the conspiracy theory that immigrants are being brought in by the jews, of course, to replace native born white americans. prior to his show was only popular on white supremacist internet forrums and tiki torch marches where nazis chant jews will not replace us. but not long after tucker brought the tiki torch march indoors to the fox air waves, you had the entire republican party embracing that theory. including florida congressman matt gaetz who tweeted tucker carlson is correct about replacement theory as he explains what is happening to america. during his campaign for senate, peter, jd vance told fox that democrats, quote, have decided that they can't win re-election

unless they bring a large number of new voters to replace the voters that are already here that is the kind of talk that would get a lawmaker expelled just ten years ago but thanks to tucker, it's now standard republican talking points and then there's january 6th tucker took the lead when it came to writing a revisionist history of the insurrection with the help of kevin mccarthy, who handed him and no one else, 40,000 hours of footage from that day which tucker select i ively edad to frame the angry mob as meek sight seers. carlson's former producer abby grossberg told the great nicole wallace yesterday what else he tried to do with that footage. >> when the january 6th tapes were coming out, tucker was very set finding an fbi person who was implanted in the crowd and spinning this conspiracy that they were ultimately the ones responsible for the capitol attack i went back to them and said,

look, there's no conspiracy theory here. i called this attorney that's representing one of the proud boys and he flat out told me on two occasions there is no conspiracy get away from this stuff this is dangerous. tell tucker to stop. i'll come on your show and represent my client, but i absolutely will walk off if he asks me this and the response was, find somebody else. tucker is really intent on this. >> so let that sink in the host of the most-watched cable news show was intent on framing the insurrection as an fbi conspiracy think about how dangerous it is when right wingers have already previously threatened attacked fbi offices. but none of that seemed to matter to the fox executive suite. nope, none of it what actually pushed them over the edge, according to new reporting from "the wall street journal," was his, quote, vulgar and offensive messages about them and about his colleagues that were in the redacted portions of the dominion filings, including the time he

called a senior executive at fox the c word, according to people familiar with the matter talk about only caring when it happens to you and not to your fellow citizens o r to your country. now fox has a decision to make since whoever they put in the anchor chair at 8:00 p.m. will be watched by millions of americans, regardless of who they are, so will fox stick with the brand of vulgar white supremacist and kremlin talking points that tucker brought them, or will they take it in a different direction? joining me now is dean of the columbia school of journalism, staff writer for the new yorker and msnbc political contribute and professor at vanderbilt university professor hemmer, i want to start with you this is your field of expertise and study. my colleagues written a piece that i just want to read a little bit of. there's a right wing fringe righter tucker is only person on fox. other people nobody would dare

to let them or any other fox show let them on any other fox show tucker would have them on to say any wouldn't hear anywhere else on american tv and that his relationship with these fringe voices was like mutual far right people could get on. another little bit of this i think i'm reading the wrong thing up on the air. once the story reached tucker carlson, it was at the apex of conservative media fox news is the voice of authority in conservative media. if it led other people know it is okay to talk about these kinds of things in the language they use it's not just on the air, it's ambient on so many public spaces that means anything they platform has a wider reach talk a little bit about this that seems to be what tucker really did is he took wild stuff off of four chant and mainstreamed it. >> right this was the power of tucker carlson's show was that it was a pipeline from these various parts of the far right into a more mainstream right wing

platform one that was necessarily so strongly associated with racist conspiracy theories, although fox is not -- it's not new that there is racist content on fox news but he had writers like blake neff ultimately fired for posting pretty incendiary and racist content on a far right and openly racist website. and n ex ff bragged about the fact that he was able to use carlson's show in order to get this material out there. so, this was a powerful platform not just for tucker carlson but for this far right racist white right. >> let me read one more part this was the part that was on your screen. sorry about that, y'all. i read extra this is another part of that same piece i just read white supremacist message boards frequently watched along live with carlson's show were overloaded with posts lamenting his firing tucker is one of the last our guys wrote one user. referring about a meme among white travelers. bad times coming

been obvious for a while but it seems to be reaching its apogee another 4chan user wrote another moment, professor hemmer, the white right has been trying to get inside of the mainstream republican party for a long time. they picked at the tea party because they knew there was a lot of anti-obama white resentment there they picked at the trump sort of maga movement. it does seem that tucker was an accelerator for mainstreaming white supremacy and white nationalism particularly when it comes to the replacement theory. >> he absolutely was i mean, fox news was seen as a more respectable platform. remember in the obama years that other journalistic outlets would stand up for fox news when the obama administration criticized it because they saw those journalists as -- they saw the people at fox news as fellow journalists. i think that's not really the case anymore and tucker carlson actually had a big role to play in that as well because exactly because he was so overt about his white nationalism and about his

racism >> you know, i'm glad you're here as the head of the journalism department. you were nodding when professor hemmer was saying journalists used to defend fox news colleagues defend them and say you can't go by what's on primetime. but this taints all of what fox news was supposed to be because there was no editor, no executive willing to stop him from doing that. the only time they stopped him and fired him is when he insulted them. >> sure. so one thing to keep in mind is that the reason that journalists defended fox news in the obama era was that they were defending a portion of fox news that they could identify with. which was the news gathering organization, which was fairly normal, fairly standard organization now it had a right -- ranging from right to far right opinion section. and that was the programming that people were most familiar with in primetime. that's not entirely unusual. but in most of these setups, including the setup that we're

on now, the opinion element is follows the news gathering that people will interpret the information that the news gathering, you know, side develops but on fox, this is what the dominion case really brought out, it seems to have been inverted that people knew information, they knew what was true, but they also were in the business of catering to what their audiences wanted to hear, so was the opinion not the news side that actually led. and so, on the heels of that -- with that being exposed, they were vulnerable in a way they weren't otherwise. i think these text messages to come out in some other context, i don't think that we would be seeing the demise of tucker carlson as a fox news host in the way we're seeing it right now. >> i agree there's no sign that rupert murdoch would have stopped him had he not talked trash about the executive and got them pseudoby one of the reporters -- one of the executives there.

sorry. one of the producers there one of his senior producers. let me just play -- a guy named ray epps the real world consequences of the kind of stuff tucker did he was on "60 minutes" this past week >> he's obsessed with me he's going to any means possible to destroy my life and our lives. >> why >> to shift blame on somebody else if you look at it, fox news, marjorie taylor greene, ted cruz, gaetz, they're all telling us before this thing that it was stolen so, you tell me. who has more impact on people them or me >> i mean, that is life ruining. look, i'm an opinion journalist. but we have a standards and practices department here. you can't come on and say anything you want. standards and practices goes through and makes sure the things we're saying are actual factual. you can give your informed opinion as a host, but you can't say anything you want.

in this case, this supposed, quote unquote, news show was painting that guy who is an anonymous person as an fbi agent and plant who was the real person behind january 6th. that guy was a trump supporter ends up getting death threats and life ruined. that's the opposite of journalism's purpose. >> the problem with that is that people who don't -- we're not intimately familiar with how news and opinion journalism work, and i can include myself in this as a person whose opinion journalism at the new yorker for the past ten years, but if you don't know the distinctions between what standards and practice will let you get away with, what fact checking will get you get away, the ways opinion has to be within certain parameters that are governed by facts. if you don't know that, you hear something that is so outlandish as you frequently did on carlson's show, you're believing this is vetted information it's the information of the same

caliber, the same degree of accuracy that you might get elsewhere. or even more accurate than you might get elsewhere. and that's what makes this i think so dangerous one other thing i do want to add really quickly is that some of this is about tucker carlson a good bit of this is about the ecosystem he operated in because when we look at this, he replaced megyn kelly and before that, you know, there's bill o'reilly. before there was glen beck it's not like he was this unique figure may have been the most extreme example of it. glen beck may have given him a run of his money. >> megyn kelly championed black face she was in the running with the rest >> there it is it's not like these people are going to run out and get a nobel prize winner, epic humanitarian to fill that slot and whatever happens next >> well, and that is the thing

one might call it grooming, professor hemmer essentially you're taking millions of people, you're showing them something that looks like the news. and you're saying, black people are dangerous. black people are dangerous you should get a lot of guns then we're surprised that somebody who watches a lot of fox news shoots a black person who is a teenager and rings his doorbell immigrants are making our country dirty and foul and racism against non-white immigrants this man was grooming millions of people into far right one might say white nationalist beliefs. who would have otherwise thought of themselves as ordinary republicans. talk about where fox goes from here because they've shown no ipg inkling. they didn't care they weren't making money off of it they wanted that message on their air. >> remember, we spent time talking about what tucker carlson was fired for. but what might be more important is what he wasn't fired for. >> correct. >> he wasn't fired for racism.

he wasn't fired for mainstreaming white nationalism. he wasn't fired for conspiracy theories about the election. he wasn't fired for conspiracy theories about january 6th and so when it comes to replacing tucker carlson, maybe they want someone who doesn't use the c word in the office, but it's unlikely they're going to look for somebody who doesn't offer conspiracy theories because the thing is, yes, you can talk about it as grooming. but it's also what the audience wanted it's what the audience tuned in for. and fox is going to want to continue to serve that audience. >> and there are other people who will do it if they don't they know that they're going to try to find a way to do it again that's the sad and frightening thing. up next on "the reidout" -- it's another tennessee three in the making montana republicans are punishing the state's first and only transgender lawmaker for speaking out unapologetically against anti-translegislation. we'll talk to her next [ kimberly ] before clearchoice, my dental health

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lately, maga republicans love the word decorum. mind you, this is the same republican party that publicly declared that january 6th attack on the capitol and the events that led to it legitimate, political discourse. that party is now clutching their collective pearls and fake outrage over citizens of their own states and even legislatures, daring to object to their extreme politics it happened in georgia when a

democratic house member objected to the governor signing in secret in front of a plantation painting onerous anti-voter legislation. it happened in arkansas where a republican house member silenced ten students who came to object to a disastrous education bill and most recently happened in tennessee where house republicans expelled two black democratic members for breach of decor rum on the house floor because they demanded action on guns only to be accused of inciting riots or violence. most americans would consider those attempts to silence dissent to be undemocratic and political disaster except in montana where house republicans just punished missoula democrat zooey zephyr >> this conduct cannot be allowed to stand our constituents in our state deserve better they deserve our full attention and this institution and body

deserve the respect of all its members. however, it has not been respected. and we must regain the decorum of this body, not only now but also to set precedent for the future >> ah, decorum the house supermajority voted to banish, banish her from the house floor for the rest of the 2023 season, which by the way is only eight days. she will still be allowed to vote remotely. she is montana's first transwoman elected to the legislature and was the target of her republican colleagues after she told fellow republicans they should be ashamed of their support of legislation banning trans-youth care she also told her republican colleagues, quote, i hope the next time there's an invocation when you bow your heads in prayer you see the blood on your hands. that comment triggered the maga montana republicans who insisted that she be forbidden from speaking republicans would only allow her to speak if she apologized for her comments allies came to show their

support on monday, demand sing that the republicans let her speak. she raised her hand and a microphone in solidarity montana law enforcement di sended on the small group of supporters and began arresting them in a ludicrous show of force, they deployed officers in riot gear on tuesday, montana's house speaker cancelled the house floor session without explanation after accusing zephyr of encouraging, you guessed it an insurrection joining me now is zooey zephyr thank you for being here let's talk about this censure of you. what you were censured for was saying that your colleagues would have blood on their hands. what is in the legislation that in your view places that blood on their hands >> we've seen a slew of attacks against lgbtq community, banning our art forms, our books, our histories and our healthcare

and when legislatures bring legislation like that forward, they create an environment that makes it very difficult to thrive as a queer person in this state. >> and it can't seem to be too easy to thrive as a queer person in the state, as you said. how are you generally treated by your colleagues? even before this dust-up over what you said. >> that's part of the struggle is behind the scenes, republicans are expressing they wish their far right contingent of their party didn't push this. but they're afraid of being primaried and afraid the direction their party is going, but ultimately those words ring hallow when they vote to take away the rights of queer people in the state. >> behind the scenes, they seem to not want to do it, but they do it performatively >> exactly >> let's talk about the son of the governor, of your governor governor forte has his own interesting history in terms of punching a journalist back in the day.

but one of the gianforte's son identifies as he and they pronouns and nonbinary and lobbied their father tovote against these bills in a meeting that he scheduled -- this son scheduled with their dad, they told him, i would like to make the argument that these bills are immoral, unjust and frankly a violation of human rights. have you had a chance to chat with governor gianforte's child who apparently is on your side >> i haven't yet but i think that highlights the fact that when they target lgbtq people, they think they're targeting a boogieman. we're everywhere whether you're an administrator at your job or the governor of montana. you're never far from a queer person and our votes need to show we're welcome. >> let me ask you this because i think for a lot of people, even for me, we were on our call this morning. i said to my team when i use the phrase on television gender-affirming care, i don't fully know what that means in these bills i highly doubt

your colleagues on the other side do either when it comes to adults and when it comes to children. >> when it comes to adults a trans-woman like me takes a hormone therapy. as a child that begins by just calling them by the name they would like to be called. auz puberty comes on puberty blockers and as they decide to go on with transition that can look like hormone replacement therapy. >> because i think that's important for you to say because i think that what republicans are doing is they're playing on people's lack of knowledge, even people like me in the media lack of knowledge about trans-folks making it sound like people are giving 10-year-old children surgery, which is not true, right? >> that is not the case. these surgeries, when they happen, are happening mostly in adulthood and extremely rare circumstances, in late teens again, following the advice of all medical practitioners, best practices of every medical community in the country

>> i mean, that's important part in your own journey, there are not only parents and family givers and loved ones involved but doctors. we're talking about a medical profession and people who are professionals that are involved, right? >> exactly these are decisions made by patients in conjunction with their parents and psychologists and therapists, following best practices with their doctors >> what would be the -- what do you think will be -- if governor gianforte signs these multiple bills, what do you think the impact will be we know there's a very high rate of suicide among particularly trans-youth. and lgbt youth more than the average population what do you think the results will be? >> our community will continue to be afraid about tim pacts we'll continue to see a rise in violence, but you cannot stifle the queer community. we will come together, ban together and be joyous in one

another. >> i am told that even in going after you, in doing these pieces of legislation, you were misgendered by your colleagues you were disrespected. have you been able to get that corrected and get that respect of you as a fellow legislature from your republican colleagues? >> unfortunately i have not. i'm not surprised at the hypocrisy on that front given this is a group of people who advocate for limited government yet are using government to take away the healthcare of trans people across this country. >> yeah. it's not exactly a big boost for democracy eefrtd when you don't allow someone to speak who is an elected legislature. very quickly, last comment, have you heard from your constituents not have representation for nearly two weeks >> my constituents are upset they want their democratically elected representative speak on their behalf they're letting us know. >> well, they should want that because they voted for you and they should be represented

thank you so much for sharing some of your time. please keep us posted on what happens. we need to pay attention to what's going on montana. thank you, montana state representative zooey zephyr. thank you very much. be well. up next on "the reidout," i am here because donald trump raped me those are the words of e. jean carroll, who took the stand today in trump's civil rape trial. that is next mmm, popcorn. (alternate voice) denture disaster, darling! we need poligrip before crispy popcorn. (regular voice) let's fix this. (alternate voice) poligrip power hold + seal gives our strongest hold and 5x food seal. if your mouth could talk, it would ask for... poligrip.

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♪ it was an emotional day today in a manhattan courtroom as writer e. jean carroll took the stand in her civil case against donald trump telling jurors, quote, i'm here because trump raped me carroll broke down in tears as she described in detail the alleged incident inside a new york department store in the 1990s. and then how after she went public with it in 2019, trump lied when he denied her claims and, quote, shattered her reputation by calling it a hoax to boost sales of her book she did not have the chance to look her alleged attacker in the eyes trump's lawyer claimed logistical reasons were keeping him from appear in the courtroom. he jets off next week to his golf courses in scotland and ireland, according to sky news despite his absence, trump was able to cause problems in the courtroom today. just after the day's proceedings began, he reiterated his claims

on his twitter knockoff. that his case is, quote, a made up scam and ranted about various aspects of it. it led to the judge warning trump's lawyer who was present in the courtroom that his client's posts seem entirely inappropriate and may cross the line into tampering with the jury joining me now is kristen gibbons, former prosecutor and msnbc legal analyst and msnb reporter producer adam reese in the courtroom today. adam, give us a little bit of sense of what went on in that courtroom today. >> joy, the fireworks began as you said before the jury was in the courtroom. the judge, judge caplan is furious with mr. trump and his legal team because mr. trump posted on truth social today that the case is a hoax. that the attorney for e. jean carroll is a political operative. and that the dress that she was allegedly wearing on that night should be put into evidence. and the judge said, what's going on here? we gave you an opportunity to give your dna for over a year

and you haven't done that. and these statements, not only by mr. trump, by his son eric, who tweeted this afternoon absolutely inappropriate joe tacopina, mr. trump's attorney said he would speak to his client we'll see if there are any more tweets the first witness of today, the first witness of the case was a woman who is the manager of burgdorf at the time, 1996, she described the layout of the store, the floor plan. they actually showed blueprints where the lingerie department was, where her office was, where the escalators were where they allegedly came up. she said that lingerie wasn't a focus of burgdorf goodman. maybe there was one sales associate on the floor or maybe they were off working with a customer and someone screamed in the dressing room, they would have to scream loud if anyone were able to hear it finally, she said sometimes unfortunately dressing room doors were left open

next, the star witness, e. jean carroll took the stand very harrowing, vivid, graphic testimony, talked about how she went to the store to buy herself a gift as she was leaving, going out through the revolving doors she sees mr. trump he says, hey, you're the advice woman. she says, hey, you're the real estate guy he says, help me find a gift for a woman. they go inside they look at some hats they look at some other items. they go up to the sixth floor where the lingerie department is he picks up a piece of lingerie, hey, try it on all the while she says, she's laughing there's banter she's really enjoying herself. and she says, this will be material that i can use for my column he pulls her into the dressing room, shoves her against the wall this is all, according to her. he completely denies any of this happened pins her against the wall. pulls down her tights and forces himself on her she panics she shoves him away. she slams his foot with her four inch heels and runs out of the

store. she tells two people, one person she told lisa bernback a friend and writer, carol martin at wcbs anchor woman at the time one of them told her to call the police the other said don't say a word. he's got 200 attorneys he will bury you >> wow. >> she's back on the stand tomorrow 45 minutes of direct and then cross joy, that will be brutal cross-examination. >> yeah. joe tacopina doesn't seem like someone a woman who has gone through that trauma will enjoy being in front of. kristen, what you just heard, let me go to you what is the significance of hearing from e. jean carroll right away, the first day. then hearing from her at the end, at the end of the day, not a cross-examination of her but just hearing her story and then being able to hear her again first when the trial resumes tomorrow >> well, it allows the jury to go home and think about what they heard in this particular case they'll think about the graphic and the

detail, very vivid account of what she remembers, substantially remembers about the attack she suffered in there. and the rape, specifically by donald trump it allows the jury to then come back in the morning and hear more details about it. what it does, joy, i've direct examined countless witnesses and countless survivors. what it does is invites the jury to truly empathize with the witness and really empathize with their experience so they can kind of feel the suffering along with her as she testifies. >> we know that there are going to be other folks that are going to testify who have gone through similar things and that sort of trump's prior bad acts will come in let me play very quickly a smattering of what trump tends to sound like when' he's talking about his own behavior >> they say -- is everybody okay you see these incredible looking women. and so i sort of get away with things like that when you're a star, they let you do it. you can do anything. >> whatever you want. >> grab them by the [ bleep ]. do anything.

>> he went after me on the plane. yeah, i'm going to go after. believe me, she would not be my first choice that i can tell you. man. you don't know that would not be my first choice take a look. you take a look. look at her. look at her words. you tell me what you think i don't think so i don't think so >> kristen, the woman who was, quote, he went after on the plane, is going to testify jessica leads trump grabbed her breasts and tried to reach up her skirt on a flight to new york more than three decades ago. a woman named natasha who alleged that trump pushed her against a wall and forced his tongue down her throat while she was on a reporting trip to mar-a-lago in 2005 the "access hollywood" tape is coming in. what's the significance of that? this is a civil trial and not a criminal trial i assume that's why these things can come in. >> yeah. if you remember, this also -- this prior act evidence also came in the criminal trials of crosby which i prosecuted as well as in weinstein

these are evidentiary rulings. but they're significant. it establishes that intent, motive of predatory misconduct that was seen by trump both in carroll's case but also in leads and the other young lady but also in that video those are trump's words. and that is extremely important in this case, joy, where there is a high likelihood where trump will not only not testify but won't make an appearance at the trial. and so the jury will be able to hear trump's words without hearing him on the stand >> that is interesting, adam tomorrow, how is it expected to roll out right. trump is apparently not going to testify. he'll be in scotland what are we thinking we'll be in tomorrow >> 45 minutes more of direct and then cross like i said, it's going to be a brutal cross-examination they say it's impossible this could have ever happened you have no witnesses. you never called the police. there will be those outcry witnesses that i mentioned and the ones you mentioned, at least two other women who claim prior bad acts and, of course, that

"access hollywood" tape. >> it's going to be something else and there are no cameras in the courtroom. and as we can see, that's why we're very thankful we have you adam reese in the courtroom today. kristen gibbons, thank you thank you both very much coming up next on "the reidout," after neglects jackson lawmaker concerns- mississippi tate reed grant the state more control over jackson's law enforcement. now the naacp is suing to block it stay right there trelegy for copd. ♪birds flyin' high, you know how i feel.♪ ♪breeze driftin' on by...♪ ♪...you know how i feel.♪ you don't have to take... [coughing] ...copd sitting down. ♪it's a new dawn,...♪

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on friday, mississippi governor tate reeves signed two bills infridging on the autonomy on the capital city of jackson creating a new justice system within the 83% black city as well as an expanded capital police force saying that, quote, jackson has to do better the naacp and local residents sued the state, calling the new laws a separate but equal system msnbc correspondent tre main lee has been reporting extensively from mississippi and joins me now. what have you learned? what have you seen >> joy, i'll tell you what, the already deep abyss between the majority black city jackson and its leaders and the white majority in the legislature have been driven deeper people in jackson they fear this could have very violent and deadly consequences. let's take a look. >> the bullets came in on this side. >> this is my daughter's window

right here. >> right here, these are bullet holes. >> reporter: last december, 49-year-old smith says she was shot in the forearm when bullets fired from outside of her apartment crashed into her jackson, mississippi home. >> caught me right here. >> reporter: they were fired by a mississippi capital police officer who was chasing people after they fled a suspected stolen car this summer, mississippi will expand the jurisdiction of its state-run police force from the downtown capital complex to all of jackson under two new controversial laws passed by the republican-led majority white legislature. house bill 1020 and senate bill 2343 will essentially create a new justice system within jackson with its own unelected so police force. the city has no control more than 80% black say, the move diverts power away from the voting citizens of jackson amounting to a state led takeover of criminal justice i the city

>> this is about vote dilution >> naacp president, dere johnson, is a longtime jackson resident >> it is not a solution for th state to step in without any true coordination, conversation, and use of authority of th city of jackson. >> the civil rights group is suing the state to block the laws, claiming jackson's residents have been targeted for a separate and unequal policing and criminal justic system >> law and order is critical >> governor tate reeves denies any attempt to take power away from jackson, adding the law are meant to improve safety an prosperity >> i've lived in jackson for almost a third of my life. and i want what is best fo jackson. >> the battle over publi safety and criminal justic comes as the city is experiencing a sharp rise in violence last year, 138 people were killed in jackson, the highest per capita homicide rate in th nation, according to jackson police and fbi records

bishop dwayne picket agrees, there is a need for more police just not like this >> they are not answerable t the mayor, who looks like us they are not answerable to the structure inside of ou community. >> mississippi department of public safety commissioner sean tyndall, who oversees the capitol police, told us th agency is working to build trust in the community >> i want to be engaged with the public, i want our officer to be engaged with the public, and i want them to trust, a, that they are going to do thei job, going to do it with goo training >> in many states, a separat agency is called to investigat police shootings, but here, th same public safety officials who oversee the police are investigating the police and the several officer involved shootings that have occurred since they began expanding las summer among them is the fata shooting of 25-year-old jale lewis during a traffic stop in september. also under investigation, th shooting that injured latosh smith.

>> it's a black community an all of these apartments were filled with people what gave them the right t come into this community and shoot? >> responding to concerns, w told them to hurt from jackson residents, commissioner tyndal said their apartment is workin on being more transparent. >> once those investigations are complete, not only are the videos going to be made public but the investigative files of the mississippi bureau o investigations will be mad public >> smith says, she has mor questions, but she will not be in jackson while she waits for answers. >> i went today outwork lookin for a house to move in and get out of jackson, mississippi, because i refuse to sa anywhere capitol police will b involved >> well, trymaine, when listened to that package, all can think of is apartheid. that's what this sounds like this sounds like apartheid air at south africa, in which th vast majority black population is not going to be policed b an all white police force that does not seem to be answerable to their local government at all. is there going to be any actio here are the feds looking at this the justice department and wha

is the status of this lawsuit? >> those are really importan questions, joy first, a number of - the naacp, as you mentioned, their lawsuit, claiming that the system basically created separate but unequal systems o governance in that city. you also have the aclu representing a handful o activists organizations, who filed on behalf of three jackson residents, who say the rights were violated because o the idea that unelected judges be in control of these court which, again, is actuall against the state constitution but lastly, natasha smith is also suing the capitol polic department, claiming that th department and the commander acted recklessly and use unusual force against them the doj has not waited yet they're -- supposed to talk to, sayin they need to get down there no because as you mentioned, th clear divide in this community is being widened every singl day. >> yeah, calling kristen clark the -- tyndall said that they want to build trust in the community i'm sorry, i laugh when i hear

him say that build trust with who who is he talking to in th community? >> you know, again, it's one o these tricky positions where - not being really honest bu folks say they not only have the capitol police not bee transparent, the folks who got shot, like natasha smith, wh was -- say they haven't even gotten any phone calls. they haven't received an information at all so when he said, listen, one thing we will not do is no criminals around the city, continue to be aggressive, but they're coordinating to buil that trust that trust has to sink down to the community, at least not to the folks we spoke to. >> it's kind of hard to trus an entity that makes laws that your local elected leadershi had no say in and can't do anything about, where you will have no control, and your 83 of the population. wild times in jackson. we will say with this story. trymaine, great story, thank you so, much keep updating o his. we will be right back. we will be right back. a "let's dig in" day... mm. ...a "chow down" day... a "take a big bite" day...

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everyone that is tonight's reidout, but don't go anywhere. all in with chris hayes's next his guest tonight includ vermont senator, berni sanders. that show starts right now >> tonight on all in >> tucker carlson has left fox news it's curious news, what is thi related to one can only guess >> new questions and new reporting on why tucker carlso was fired from fox news. >> there