from the white house coming down who have their own relationships and own constituencies but republicans are not eager to help democrats do anything that they want on their own. >> i think that is certainly an understatement. alexi mccammond, great to see you this morning. and thanks to all of you for getting up "way too early" with us on this wednesday morning. "morning joe" starts right now. hopefully we're in good shape on the debt ceiling. i can't imagine anybody thinking of using the debt ceiling as a negotiating wedge. i said to senator schumer and nancy pelosi, would anybody ever use that to negotiate with, they said absolutely not, that's a sacred element of our country. they can't use the debt ceiling to negotiate. >> that's president trump in 2019. maybe kevin mccarthy did not hear that moment. president donald trump making the case, you cannot use the debt ceiling as a negotiating wedge, but that's exactly what the house speaker is doing right now of course. we'll have the latest in the

fight over the debt ceiling and a possible plan b for house democrats. meanwhile, the biden administration has plans to send active duty troops to the southern border as soon as next week. we will explain what the military personnel will be doing down there. also ahead, new testimony in the civil trial against donald trump. it comes as the former president decides not to take the stand in his own defense. new reporting this morning on text messages that ultimately led to tucker carlson's firing. we also will have a look at the latest aid package headed to ukraine as its forces prepare for a spring offensive against russia's army. and writers expected back on the picket lines today as the wga strike is already impacting several shows, late night going dark for starters. good morning, welcome to "morning joe," it is wednesday, may 3rd, with us we have the host of "way too early," white

house, jen palmieri, cohost of the circus and former chairman o. of the republican committee, michael steele. we remain one game behind you in the al east. >> we're moving on up. we may be in the cellar, last place, but watch out. you look at the orioles, they're an exciting team, 20-9. i'm so happy for their fans. it's going to be exciting. it's a long season, as we always say, willie, and judge is hurt again. he had a great year last year. avoided injuries, but those have started back. but jonathan lemire, our red sox, bake. barnacle, the cynicism of

barnicle. jack and i love watching every night. they are so exciting. they're the little engine that could. >> there was a sign where the home run would put a twinkle in barnicle's eye. no longer. this team has been pretty resilient. they have a number of games where they have fallen behind and come back to win. guys are stepping up. it's a testament to the manager. a nice win for the sox. to your point about the orioles, a lot of high draft pictures. they have come up through the system. that's a great baseball town with a great park. it's fun to see. >> it is fun to see, and it's so amazing being able to watch all

of these games on your phone, and they're moving so quickly, it's so fun. you know, times, jonathan, haven't always been so easy for willie and me. >> uh-oh. >> and i think about this especially on his birthday. >> oh, man. >> i'm going to -- we were in turkey in 1971. >> had my birthday locked up that year. >> that's tough. >> there's an old turkish saying that i scrawled on the wall for him before he woke up when something like, i don't know, we shall wear golden robes and eat the fatted lam like ottoman kings. it's all i could give him that year, but look at where we've come. look at where we've come, willie. >> okay. >> this is my way. >> i'm saying happy birthday,

you know, happy birthday, willie. >> thanks, joe, i would love to say we were wrongfully detained but we deserved to be in that cell in turkey for that stretch there. not proud of what we did, but we've come out the other side, and i think we've done okay for ourselves. >> we're not allowed to go back. >> we tried. >> can't go back for a couple of decades at least. you know, jen, some people give hallmark cards. >> do you want part of this? >> this is what i do. >> like jen said, after she was kind enough to pick me up from the turkish prison, she put her arms around, me, even though she was 4 years old, we're stronger in the broken places. god makes us stronger in the broken places, and i said thank you very much, jen palmieri. >> sitting next to willie, he's overcome with the warmth of your

birthday wishes, it's heartfelt. inspiring. >> hey, joe, this is the most fascinating part -- >> oh, i'm sorry, go ahead. >> i was going to say, the most fascinating part was when willie made a little birthday cake out of a bar of soap. >> gift to myself. >> a moving moment. >> it is. erin copeland wrote about, it is simple gifts like that. so but anyway, willie, i got to tell you, i was flying back from atlanta. i interviewed tyler perry yesterday. >> love him. >> just an extraordinary man. >> yes, he is. >> an extraordinary story. here's a guy who was homeless. he was living in a car and there were times that things got so bad he was thinking about taking his own life, and he said it was

his faith and his mom that pulled him through, and took a tour around his atlanta studios yesterday. just an extraordinary man. so we're going to be playing some of that over the next few days. but as i was coming back from the airport, i was really taken by how many people were coming up to me saying wish mika a happy birthday, and make sure to remember willie's birthday tomorrow. i'm sitting there going, everybody knows, your birthday is may the 3rd. >> we celebrated mika's very nicely, a beautiful event for her daughter carlie last night. we have that may 2nd, may 3rd connection that we have had together for the last 16 years we've been together. we compare the two and the three together, people can remember it pretty easily, so thank you, joe, for your sincere turkish birthday wishes. we appreciate it. and this will all be taken out

in post. this is great. let's turn to the headline this morning. we begin with the multiday man hunt for the suspect accused of killing five of his neighbors, including a child. authorities say they caught the man about 15 miles from the scene of the crime after someone called in a tip to the fbi. nbc news correspondent sam brock is live outside the jail in cold spring, texas. sam, good morning. how did they track him down? >> reporter: yeah, willie, this was really a remarkable turn of events given the fact that when we spoke 24 hours ago, authorities had no idea where francisco oropesa was. now he'll be brought to the jail in san jacinto county. a man accused of murdering five people brutally, including a 9-year-old child who was only trying to protect his mother. there was a tip that came in from the fbi tip line at 5:15

yesterday. by 6:30, whatever that information was, it prompted an immediate swarming and oropesa was already behind handcuffs. we have video that appears to show him being arrested at a private residence. not clear whose residence it is. we pressed whether or not there was a connection. they did not provide that information. there were three agencies involved in taking him in without incident and without injury. texas dps, u.s. marshals, and the elite unit of border control, all three getting on scene and bringing oropesa in handcuffs back into a police car where he was brought to montgomery county. this is in the city of cut and shoot, texas, 15 miles away from the brutal massacre, where it occurred. shocking to some as it wasn't clear whether he was in southeast texas, another part of the state, mexico, and it turns out he was in the backyard of his living space the entire

time. the chronology and the specifics a bt -- about how he got that, that remains unclear. the sheriff in san jacinto county talking about how this came to pass and where he was found. >> he was caught hiding in a closet underneath some laundry. they effectively made the arrest. he is uninjured, and he is currently being taken to my facility in cold springs. >> reporter: now, it is not apparent at this point, willie, whether or not he's actually been transferred or not. the expectation is if it hasn't happened already it's going to later today, and this news comes in light of information that was broken by nbc news yesterday regarding the violent past of francisco oropesa, specifically that in 2022, his wife had filed for a protective order because

she claims in sworn testimony that he beat her, that he physically closed his fists, punched her, kicked her on the ground, in the backside, in the face, in the mouth. this narrative painted by neighbors of someone who at least to the best of their knowledge was someone who wasn't violent, never aggressive, never raised his voice. there's documented evidence she filed a protective order against him. i asked the sheriff that, knowing that he was deported four times and there were repeated calls to his residence because of gunfire. did that prompt further investigation, did you look into this, yes, and we tried to arrest him in 2022, a constable went around to another county trying to track down oropesa and wasn't successful, and ultimately his wife decided not to prosecute him, and that was just the end of it. that prompts quite a few questions about how there wasn't more scrutiny and search for this man. of course, to fatal consequences a year later. >> five people killed, including a 9-year-old child a couple of days ago, and a lot of people in

texas feeling a little bit better that he's now in police custody. nbc news correspondent sam brock in texas for us this morning. sam, thank you so much. jon, we were watching "way too early" this morning, had story about tucker carlson, new text messages coming to light. perhaps some of the motivation about why fox may have let him go. >> a racially charged text message reportedly sent by tucker carlson to a fox news producer is providing more insight into why the cable news station fired the former host last week. just one day before the company was set to take the stand for a billion dollar defamation trial last month, the times is reporting that this previously redacted message came to the attention of fox executives. the times reports it was sent to one of his producers in the hours after the january 6th insurrection that reads in part this way. a couple of weeks ago i was

watching video of people fighting on the street in washington. a group of trump guys surrounded an antifa kid and started pounding the living crap out of him. it was three against one at least. jumping a guy like that is dishonorable, obviously. it's not how white men fight, yet suddenly, i found myself rooting for the mob against the man, hoping they would hit him harder, kill him. i really wanted them to hurt the kid. i could taste it. carlson later goes on to write that he quote shouldn't gloat over the man's suffering but according to the times, the earlier portion of the message was concerning enough that it contributed to fox's decision to settle with dominion voting systems for more than $787 million and ultimately fire the host. other messages including ones where carlson disparaged fox executives and used sexist language also reportedly led to

his firing. the contents of this latest message are part of redacted court filings and were disclosed to the times in interviews with several people close to the dominion lawsuit but have not yet been independently confirmed by nbc news. nbc has reached out to carlson's attorneys and fox news for response but has not heard back. a representative for carlson did tell the "times" that he had no comment on the story. so michael steele, i just want to get your reaction to the latest revelation, a text message that seems to be part of a larger puzzle as to why tucker carlson was shown the door. >> yeah, it doesn't surprise me. i think that a lot of what, you know, we now know from the dominion case really filled in some of the back story about exactly how these hosts like tucker operated within the fox

ecosystem. i mean, the fact that something like that could be sent to a colleague and it sort of sits there, and nothing happens or comes from it, and it's not until you get into this sort of adversarial, prosecutorial setting in which it becomes public or potentially becomes public that they see some reaction. it really speaks to the culture inside the building in many respects that that type of communication doesn't rise to a point where, you know, he's brought in by the leadership of the company saying what the hell are you talking about, how white men fight. you want to see somebody get killed on the streets of d.c.? and so i think they're probably going to be more of this, quite honestly. even though this case is settled in that regard, you still have the smartmatic case coming

forward. don't know, you know, all the access to e-mails and the documents they have there, but it really speaks to a culture, i think, that had grown up inside of fox that you could communicate that way with a producer, with someone of authority inside the building and everyone's okay with it. >> and the culture was, just a culture of no accountability specifically for their biggest star. and, you know, those lines had to horrify them knowing that that was going to be out publicly, especially when you looked at all the other things that were going to be going out, him repeatedly using the c word to describe women, to describe one of trump's lawyers when he was pushing back against the very election rigging lie, the big lie that trump pushed, and

here you actually have a fox news host saying you wanted a group of trumpers to kill a kid. his words. i wanted them to kill the kid. you mix that up with again, the c word used to describe women that he worked with or that came across him. the anti-semitism that we hear is going to be coming out in the producer's lawsuit. it's just hard to imagine why they wouldn't at the end feel like it was their best legal move, political move, pr move to send him on his way. and his son put together a compilation a few days ago when people started engaging in this really bizarre anti-tucker babbling, sure he's this, sure he's that, but he did some

really good things. the trains ran on time. sure, we've heard it from bari weiss, we heard it from andrew sullivan, people that i read regularly, and they did this anti anti-tuckerism, and said he had the receipts and wanted to show all of these people that weren -- were engaging anti anti-tuckerism, saying whatever bad things tucker carlson did, at least he was anti-woke. this is what they're defending whenever they go to the mat for tucker. >> white supremacy that's the problem. this is a hoax. there's no evidence that white supremacists were responsible for what happened on january 6th, that's a lie. even if it makes our own country

poorer, and dirtier and more divided. demographics, demographics, remember the great replacement theory, was a conspiracy theory. it's more like a statistical flat. the way we practice immigration has become dangerous to this country. congresswoman ilhan omar, a symbol of american's failed immigration system. dating montel williams is something within her range of experience. is she good at it, we can't say. she's done it. for masochistic reasons, one more time. it might be time for joe biden to let us know what ketanji brown jackson's s.a.t. score was. you should be elevated on the choices you make, not your dna, because that's rwanda. we're not precisely sure how george floyd died.

very few unarmed black men are killed by white men these days. the only administration is getting black people to sell more weed in the cities. you never see politicians transition into malcolm x, why is that, maybe because malcolm x didn't talk like a sharecropper. xenophobia, seems almost an technique. this show has taken a stand against color blind equality, and against racism. >> and there are, jen, there are people, again, people who i've read who think make some very important points on different issues who are actually going out defending him saying, well, andrew sullivan, tucker represents something nonetheless real, a deepening suspicion of

corporate and government authority, and bari weiss says, you can't deny how important tucker was and is. nelly and i watched his monologues and not quite nightly but the next day on you tube. let's see. what else did she say. just said he was one of the only people on tv who made viewers aware of the new military industrial complex. the alliance between big tech and the government. i mean, you know what, i could name about five other people. i want you guys to play that clip again, and i want you to play the clip because i want these people who are defending tucker carlson, i want them to see once again what they're defending. play the clip. >> white supremacy, that's the problem. this is a hoax. there's no evidence that white supremacists were what happened on january 6th, that's a lie. we have a moral obligation to admit the world's poor even if it makes our own country poorer

and dirty and more divided. >> demographics, demographics. remember the great replacement theory was a conspiracy theory? it sounds more like a statistical fact. ilhan omar is living proof that the way we practice immigration has become dangerous to this country. congresswoman ilhan omar a symbol of america's failed immigration system. can a single human being be as loathsome as ilhan omar. dating montel williams is within her range of experience. is she good at it, we can't say. she's done it. for masochistic reasons, one more time. might be time for joe biden to let us now what ketanji jackson's l.s.a.t. score was. you should be based on the choices you make, not your dna, because that's rwanda. we're not precisely sure how

george floyd died. very few unarmed black men are killed by white cops. where's george floyd when you need him. the only job training program is getting black people to sell more weed in the cities. you never see politicians transition into malcolm x, why is that. maybe because malcolm x didn't talk like a sharecropper. xenophobia, seems antique. this show has taken an aggressive position in favor of color blind equality, and against racism. >> yeah, so i have no words, not only for what we saw there, but also by people who are going out there going, yeah, but at least he wasn't woke. so we're going to be okay with the most racist rants that think we've heard on national news in our lifetimes. >> when i saw the headline about

what the text message that supposedly got him fired said, i had a gasp and then an oh, right, of course this is what was happening behind the scenes, and sometimes even i can make the mistake of not appreciating just how dark things can get in some corners of the right. and what really struck me about that text message, joe, is just the casual aside about it's not how white men fight. he could have easily not included that in the text message. it's dishonorable, of course, tells you how established it was within the culture that white people were supreme. so it's not you see the misogyny, the racism that he's airing and find behind the scenes, it's actually a little darker than even what you've saw aired in that two-minute clip.

>> joe, can i jump in on it real quick. that's an important point that it it is darker than what we see on the clip, and what you see from all of this is a feeding into the system. tucker's reflecting an attitude that, you know, those clips really touch on, that entices and incites that particular audience who believe that's not how white men fight, who believe that congresswoman omar is an anathema to everything america, and so it feeds into this. it's this sort of representation that you see on air every night. and it is darker off camera. but it's no less relevant because it does partly feed that

narrative that they want to put out there about this country. and about people like myself who don't look like or should not be considered. you know, the job market for selling weed for black people selling weed on the streets of d.c. what the hell is that supposed to be? i grew up in that city. you know, there were more white folks selling weed at times than black folks, but, again, that's not the point. and the point is to continue the caricature of black people, this idea that, you know, this antifa, this individual was, you know, worthy of killing because they weren't white. it's just a whole culture thing that we've got to deal with

because tucker's a symbol of that, a symptom of that, and the problem, the real problem is that fox allowed it and promoted it every single night. elevated it up. mainstreamed it. gave it commercials. gave it, you know, lead ins. gave it, you know, advertising. all of this stuff that made it seem okay. and you've made the point a little bit earlier. the first time in your lifetime you could see just outward racism spewed on national television every night, and everybody's like yay. and i think this is an interesting moment, and it's going to be more of the second set to come. this is just one of, i'm sure, a lot of stuff that tucker and others at fox have been saying behind the scenes that will get some light, and now the question is, now that the light is exposing it, what do we do with it, how do we process it, and

what does the journalistic community do about it when they see one of their own pushing this kind of narrative out to the country. >> and, again, what do those who are defending him, sort of the anti anti-tucker crowd. we saw it for years, the anti anti-trump crowd, where it doesn't matter how important trump was, they never defended trump, they just attacked the people who were being critical of donald trump, and of course you find out a lot of people at fox were being far more critical about donald trump than even we were on air, calling him the most evil person and a destroyer, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, so it is very interesting, but we are now with donald trump. we're coming into a very interesting place where you're going to have media outlets trying to mainstream a guy who tried to overthrow the united

states government. good luck with that. you know? good luck with that. for your democracy, for your network, good luck with that for people who work with you. it's kind of hard to mainstream that. >> yeah, it will be interesting to see how everyone handles donald trump. this is not 2016. there's novel about his potential as president. he has a record as president, which includes leading an attempted coup against the united states government. there can be no reset. let's start over, he's a candidate. he has a long record as president, and it's not pretty. still ahead on "morning joe," with a historic default looming, house democrats have a back up plan to force a debt ceiling increase. is it realistic? we'll have the latest from capitol hill. what florida voters are saying about governor ron desantis and the ongoing fight with disney. he's still at it. we'll get a live report from orlando. plus, thousands of film and tv writers are planning to picket again today after

contract negotiations failed this week. we're following the latest on where those talks stand this morning. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. - the will states that mr. marbles will receive everything he needs in perpetuity.

thanks to autoship from chewy. - i always love that old man. - and he gets the summer house. - what? - [narrator] save more on what they love and never run out with autoship from chewy. - this is our premium platinum coverage map and this is consumer cellular's map. see the difference? - no... i don't see the difference, do you? - well, that one's purple. - exactly! that's our premium. - what does that mean? - i think it means it costs more. - for the same coverage? - that's what makes it premium! - that doesn't make sense, does it? - no... but it is premium!

- i'd just go with consumer cellular. - thank you! - (whispering) they're the same. - [announcer] get the exact same coverage as the nation's leading carrier. starting at $20. consumer cellular. the first time you made a sale online with godaddy was also the first time you heard of a town named dinosaur, colorado. we just got an order from dinosaur, colorado. start an easy to build, powerful website for free with a partner that always puts you first. start for free at godaddy.com your shipping manager left to “find themself.” leaving you lost.

you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire for copd, ask your doctor about breztri. breztri gives you better breathing, symptom improvement, and helps prevent flare-ups. breztri won't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. it is not for asthma. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. don't take breztri more than prescribed. breztri may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vison changes, or eye pain occur. if you have copd ask your doctor about breztri. the maga republicans in congress are threatening vison changes, or eye pain occur. to throw america into default, crashing our economy. their latest radical demand? they want to repeal investments in affordable clean energy and manufacturing that are already creating hundreds of thousands of jobs across america. their reckless demands will kill countless american jobs

even jobs in their own hometowns. because for maga extremists, it's never about your jobs or our economy. it's always about pushing their extreme agenda. leaves it up top for lebron. >> lebron finishing the alley-oop there to pad the lakers lead over the warriors at the beginning of the 4th quarter. anthony davis last night leading l.a. with a game high 30 points and 23 rebounds in this highly anticipated opener of the second round. the lakers nearly let it slip

away. golden state, with less than two minutes to play, the lakers did hold on to win on the road. 117-112. the teams will stay in san francisco for game two tomorrow night. huge win for lebron and the lakers last night. over in the eastern conference in new york, the knicks rebounded from sunday's loss to even their second round series against the heat at a game apiece. julius randall returning from injury and combining with jalen brunson for 59 points. series shifts to miami, tied 1-1. game three is on saturday. 76ers center joel embiid is the nba's most valuable player. embiid finally claiming the honor after finishing the last two regular seasons as runner up. it comes as embiid is battling a right knee injury that has sidelined him for philadelphia's last two playoff games. it's unclear if he'll be back on the court for game two against the celtics but very unlikely. >> how are you feeling as a

celtics fan? embiid is not going to play tonight. they stole game one. they have to win tonight. >> we'll see embiid in game three. celtics fell apart down the stretch. they were really sloppy. i feel like there was hangover from the bruins collapse the night before in the same building. must win tonight. as far as the lakers go, that's a huge win on the roads. the warriors seemed a little gassed. they finished a seven game series against the kings. lebron didn't have to do that much. i feel about the lakers like i do about the yankees, so i'm not happy about this. the knicks had to have that one. >> the ability of these guys to sort of turn it on in the playoffs, lebron, lakers, not much going on in the regular season. 7th or 8th in the west, something like that, and now, i mean, they're on the fast track to the conference finals. lebron never count him out. he's like brady. never bet against him. >> as you know, i'm much more of

an nfl fan than nba fan, go giants, but this time of year, sometimes during the regular season, the games are just, you know, doesn't feel like people are operating at like the full potential. >> stars take advantage. >> low energy. >> excellent nfl draft coverage, by the way. >> thank you. >> you were great in k.c., you really broke it down. >> one of the better capers i have pulled off, being the "morning joe" nfl draft analyst for a day. >> the night before, alex, our executive producer, i saw jen on our guest list from kansas city, is there a political event, no, she's covering the draft for us. that's fantastic. and she was great. she delivered. crushed it. >> is it not astounding. i know the nfl has always been huge. for christmas i would get nfl sheets with all the names of the teams arranged and i had nfl bulletin board, and everything. so it's always been big, but i

guess, you know, about five, six years ago, you started hearing people say, oh, i'm not going to follow the nfl after the george floyd protests and the colin kaepernick stuff, and here we are several years later, ratings bigger than ever. i mean, it's so funny. i've been out of it so much. as far as the nfl, i'll watch playoff games, but, you know, i'm a college football, you know, being from the south, i'm college football, college basketball fan, but jack is, you know, he loves two things, he loves sunday mornings with willie geist and he loves the nfl. we watch red zone every week, and he's so into it, and i've gotten so into it, i mean, we're huge lions fans. i know i'm a falcon fan but the lions last year were absolutely crazy. but usually you and i and we all remember whenever you'd see the nfl draft, and i thought, you know, i thought they were going to be like, you know, they

usually would rent out a warehouse in new york. there would be a couple of drunk guys in t-shirts holding signs. >> jets. >> always jets fans. >> that's what i thought it would be like, and they do this sweeping shot in kansas city, and they had half the number -- they had half the population of kansas city, like, size-wise, there along with jen watching the draft, and there's just never been a sport more popular than the united states. it's extraordinary how big the nfl has gotten. >> it is, jen, and to see it up close, we were talking about nashville a few years ago. >> nashville was first time they took it out of new york. >> hundreds of thousands of people in the drone shots. like wood stock, to stand there and wait and watch who your team is going to draft. some 20-year-old kid from kansas state. it's amazing.

>> and it's like people are -- it's the whole weekend is filled with possibility. everybody, all the fans walk away happy, everybody got a prize, maybe it wasn't the prize you wanted. it's not anybody that actually uses. joe, speaking of the lions, it's in detroit next year. i mean, i don't know. >> road show. >> road show. michigan. election year. >> it's so exciting. >> swing state. >> good call. >> can we get the iso of jen up for a second. can you just swing the camera left so we can get barnicle. >> he just keeps lurking, and we see his head. >> there he is. >> step back out. >> there he is. okay. there we go, mike. yeah, by the way, red sox won again last night. sorry grandpa, they may be pretty good this year. okay. so who on the panel knows about the lions this past year, anybody like following the

lions? >> i can talk some lions. >> they drafted alabama running back, joe. gibbs. >> they did. they got knocked for that. they then drafted a great defensive back from alabama. but that team was -- i mean, they were the most, for us, they were the most exciting team in the nfl last year. they started like one in six. and jack and i kept saying this is the best one in six team we have ever seen in our life. explosive offense. like, and the lions fans, they're like us falcons fans, you got to take the scraps they throw you. motor city madness. do they play in the pontiac dome, the silver dome? >> no, they play at ford field. >> they play at the new building downtown. the lions were. great offense. they finished strong. credit to them, the last game o.

-- game of the reason season. they beat the packers. a statement win building toward next year. rogers gone out of the division, the lions are the favorite, the question around draft day was whether or not they were going to take a quarterback. they didn't. they have a lot of weapons, but still some questions remain about jared goff. >> build a good team around him, and apologies to jim vandehei, willie geist, the detroit lions did not beat the green bay packers, they punched them in the mouth. they ran over them at lambeau field when they wanted to get to the playoffs. it's a team with a lot of spirit, a lot of fight. the "new york post" is the official "morning joe" newspaper, i think we may need to make the lions, what do they have, any -- >> oh, the met gala was woke or

something, and then, yeah, the met gala was woke. there you go. i don't know. >> this is why they are who they are. the official paper of record of "morning joe." >> that's amazing. >> we may have to have a vote. i know everybody loves the giants. that's awesome. maybe we make for a season the detroit lions the official team of "morning joe." >> honorary. >> i like it. i have been smiling throughout this conversation because people always say like how do you prepare for "morning joe" every day, it's four hours and you cover so much ground. some days you can't, you wake up and you're ready for the news of the day, and you talk about the lions off season for ten minutes. >> in may. >> and, willie, wearing golden robes in turkish prisons on your birthday in 1971. >> that's right. >> and 4-year-old jen palmieri coming over and walking me home

and quoting henry saying we're stronger in the broken places. >> the world breaks all of us, joe. >> yes, exactly. >> how do you prepare for that, willie? >> we still have three hours and 16 minutes of this, buckle up, everybody. >> barnicle is lurking. let's get back to the news. coming up, we'll have the latest out of sudan where opposing military groups have reportedly agreed to a seven-day cease fire in the conflict there. a new round of aid for ukraine as the united states looks to shore up the country's military ahead of an expected counter offensive against russia. also ahead, the u.s. breaks the ice a bit with beijing calling for high level talks amid heightened tensions between the two world powers. retired navy admiral james stavridis will weigh in on all of that, plus the guy on the right who arrives at 4:00 a.m. for his 7:00 a.m. appearance. we'll be right back. we'll be right back. the real secret to success? better sleep. purple is different.

soft and firm, in all your right places. the gelflex grid keeps you cool, while sleep does it's scientifically proven thing. rise sharper, happier, an overnight success. avoiding triggers, but still get migraine attacks? qulipta™ can help prevent migraine attacks. qulipta gets right to work. keeps attacks away over time. qulipta is a preventive treatment for episodic migraine. most common side effects are nausea, constipation, and tiredness. ask your doctor about qulipta. first, there's an idea and you do something about it for the first time with godaddy.

then before you know it, (it is a life changer...) you make your first sale. small business first. never stopped coming. (we did it!) and you have a partner that always puts you first way. (no way!) start today at godaddy.com. if you're on medicare, you should know president biden has capped the cost of insulin at 35 dollars a month. 35 bucks. see how joe biden is helping more americans afford the medicine they need. ♪ the all-new chevy colorado is made for more.

bring more. ♪ do more. ♪ see more. ♪ and be more. ♪ the all-new chevy colorado. made for more. ♪ your brain is an amazing thing. but as you get older, it naturally begins to change, causing a lack of sharpness, or even trouble with recall. thankfully, the breakthrough in prevagen helps your brain and actually improves memory. the secret is an ingredient originally discovered... in jellyfish. in clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve short-term memory. prevagen. at stores everywhere without a prescription.

beautiful live picture of the white house. it's 6:48 in the morning. u.s. officials have told the associated press another $300 million in additional military aid is being sent to ukraine. the package reportedly will include an enormous amount of artillery rounds, howitzers, air-to-ground rockets and ammunition. this latest shipment comes as ukrainian officials say they are readying a counter offensive against russia. joining us now, former supreme allied commander of nato, retired four stair navy admiral james staph -- stavridis. when we say that ukraine is readying a counter offensive, what do you suspect that's going to look like? >> i think the ukrainians will take the armor, the tanks, the armored personnel carriers that we have provided them, and they'll use them to drive at the

russian forces, trying to split russian forces who are arranged kind of north and south along the black sea. if the ukrainians can successfully do that, willie, they will find themselves, and you can see the there -- think of them driving through the black sea through the red area. divide the russian forces and allow the ukrainians to flank the russians, splitting going north and south. it could be a very good spring for the ukrainians. >> so, given that that would be the strategy, admiral, what about the underlying aspect of lack of manpower on the ukrainian side? it's a small country. it's not russia. they don't have the prisoners that they're sending into the meat grinder. but the manpower issue. >> yeah. i think you put your finger on one of the key things that would make me cautious how ukraine is going to do. one is manpower. number two is the lack of air

power. so the russians have 1,000 combat aircraft. they could overwhelm the ukrainians in the sky in combat. thirdly, we're flipping the table here. it's been the russians on offense for a while. now the russians go on defense. and we say in the military, defense is to offense as three is to one. because you can dig in, get behind barricades. so, yes, i think the ukrainians will do well this spring, but the russians still have cards to play. >> and the russians have literally, literally dug in. >> they have. especially in crimea, which to them is sacred ground. they will fight hard for crimea. >> ukrainian officials have suggested the counteroffensive might still be a few weeks away after the conclusion of the country's muddy season which makes it hard to move. talk about the challenges the russians have faced. their offensive over the winter didn't get them very far. now there's some reporting that even what mike mentioned the

wagner prisoner group, they're having trouble with their supply lines and the guy who runs it, the putin ally, might sufficient they may have to abandon bakhmut. >> indeed. this is prigozhin, used to be putin's chef and now he is running the wagner group. talk about a job change. his point is he's not only beating up the standard russian forces verbally for lack of ammunition, lack of support, he's actually fighting. in other words, we see reports of wagner group and russian troops exchanging gunfire. so, this is another, shall we say, significant disadvantage the russians are going to face is divided forces. >> admiral, where do you see this leading? of course, we get to the summer. are we looking at more discussion of talks on resolving this? where do you think this is headed in the next few months? >> yeah, let's hope so. you and i did a nice segment on

"the circus" a few months ago and we talked about. there's two clocks running. one is all the things we just discussed. the challenges russia faces. the logistics. the cratering, the manpower, all those challenges, equipment losses. on the other hand, the clock is running on support for the ukrainians here in the west. i think both of those things, jennifer, will over time induce the parties to come to the table. will that be three months from now, three years from now? we don't know. but probably toward the end of this year i think the pressure is on both sides because of those clocks running will bring us to some kind of negotiation. >> joe? >> so admiral, there's a daily beast article how vladimir putin is preparing russia for possible defeat in a crisis manual that was leaked. and in it, it says new manual preparedfy russia's presidential administration and distributed to kremlin's army of

propagandist contains surprising instructions about not underestimating ukraine's impending counteroffensive and do not underestimate and do not spread the idea that kyiv is somehow not ready for it. and they go on and on, saying that it's vladimir putin preparing people around him for the worst case scenario this spring. i'm curious your thoughts on those leaked documents and also what's plan b for vladimir putin? we've always feared that -- always feared that he could use tactical nuclear weapons, but we've also said at the same time, he can control the information that gets out to russians and try to turn a loss into a win. >> i think he is doing what any politician would do, which is to try to lower expectations at this point.

and probably his setup, joe, is that he'll ultimately say to the russian people, look, we held on to crimea. that's really the crown jewel. they'll probably get pushed out of that strip of land between russia and crimea. that's what he's preparing his people to deal with when the negotiation, jennifer and i were just discussing, comes. i don't see him reaching for a tactical nuclear weapon, joe. he knows if he did that, the global south, india, brazil, nigeria, south africa, pakistan, that herd would move away from russia if he used a nuclear weapon. so i think that's unlikely. i think his plan b is tough it out. tell the russians, look, we won. and short of actually being driven out of ukraine by the ukrainian armed forces, which would be a big task, not impossible, but a big task, short of that i think putin will

stay in power and ride this out. >> and willie, the argument that they're starting to make in russia right now seems to be, listen, if we just hold on, if we hold on to any of our gains that we've made, that's a great success because it is our country against the entire west. and it shows just how tough our fighters are. that starts -- that sounds like the message that is starting to be delivered to the propagandists in russia. >> what a moving of the goal post that represents, 15 months ago when vladimir putin thought he was going to roll into kyiv and take over the country. a long way from that. admiral, stay with us. we want to talk about china, sudan, probably the detroit lions offensive line. a lot to hit you with when we come right back on "morning joe." ♪♪

this week is your chance to try any subway footlong for free. like the subway series menu. just buy any footlong in the app, and get one free. everyone loves free stuff chuck. can we get peyton a footlong? get it before it's gone. on the subway app. so, you found the no7 then... it's amazing! hydrates better than the expensive stuff i don't live here, so i'm taking this and whatever's in the back. it's already sold in the us. but i'm not taking any chances. the uk's #1 skincare has crossed the pond. ♪ the uk's #1 skincare with wet amd, sometimes i worry my world is getting smaller because of my sight. but now, i can open up my world with vabysmo. vabysmo is the first fda-approved treatment for people with wet amd that improves vision and delivers a chance for up to 4 months between treatments.

which means doing more of what i love. ♪ vabysmo is the only treatment designed to block 2 causes of wet amd. vabysmo is an eye injection. don't take it if you have an infection or active swelling in or around your eye, or are allergic to it or any of its ingredients. treatments like vabysmo can cause eye infection or retinal detachment. vabysmo may cause a temporary increase in eye pressure after receiving the injection. although uncommon, there is a potential risk of heart attack or stroke associated with blood clots. open up your world! a chance for up to 4 months between treatments with vabysmo. ask your doctor. your heart is the beat of life. if you have heart failure, entrust your heart to entresto. entresto helps improve your heart's ability

to pump blood to the body. don't take entresto if pregnant; it can cause harm or death to an unborn baby. don't take entresto with an ace inhibitor or aliskiren, or if you've had angioedema with an ace or arb. the most serious side effects are angioedema, low blood pressure, kidney problems, or high blood potassium. ask your doctor if entresto is right for you. staaaaacccceeeyyy! i'm the sizzle in this promposal. and tonight, sparks are gonna fly. kyle? and while romeo over here is trying to look cool, things are about to heat up. uh-oh. darn it, kyle! and if you don't have the right home insurance coverage, you could end up paying for this yourself. sorry mr. sanchez! get allstate, and be better protected from mayhem, like me. that's a hard no. when that car hit my motorcycle, insurance wasn't fair. so i called the barnes firm, it was the best call i could've made. call the barnes firm now, and find out what your case could be worth.

♪ call one eight hundred, eight million and fini was hit by a carse could band needed help. ♪ call one eight hundred, i called the barnes firm.n that was the best call i could've made. i'm rich barnes. it's hard for people to know how much their accident case is let our injury attorneys know he how much their accident cget the best result possible. they can rest easy now

because he is behind bars. and he will live out his life behind bars for killing those five. >> a massive manhunt that spanned four days ends now with the ars of the man accused of killing five of his neighbors, including a young boy. we will have the latest from texas. also ahead, more testimony in the civil trial against donald trump, including from a woman who says she spoke to his accuser moments after the alleged assault. plus, new reporting on the former president's plans when it comes to the 2024 campaign and whether he will participate in republican primary debates. jonathan lemire, mike barnicle, michael steele all still with us. we continue our conversation with retired admiral james stavridis, the united states is now ready to hold high-level talks with beijing, speaking at an event yesterday, ambassador nicholas burns said the u.s. wants to develop, quote, better channels between the two governments. nbc news reports he also said

while the relationship is complicated, the united states does not seek conflict with china and that dialogue would be more constructive. can't argue with that, admiral. it would be more constructive, but why do you suspect this message is being sent right now at this moment from the united states? >> yeah. i think first of all, nick burns, somebody i've known for a long time, he was our ambassador to nato, so he understands how complicated this international scene is. the reason we, the united states, are making these overtures right now, willie, is pretty simple. it's because the relations have really cratered over the last six months. everything from spy balloons to worsening trade, to cyber conflict to arguments about the south china sea. so none of that is good for the global environment. and here we also get to ukraine. we want russia to -- we want russia not to get support from china. the best way to do that is to have good relations, reasonably

good, between china and the united states. there's a big game of risk for it here. >> admiral, it's so interesting. i was at a global citizen event last week and interviewed president macron, and here we're talking about the things he thinks need to be done to help on the issue of climate change. and top of his list, the united states and china getting together and starting to talk again. he said it's one of the reasons he went there on a trip that was seen as controversial. he said we have to break the ice. and it is true, is it not f we're worried about global security, if we're worried about ukraine not escalating into world war iii, if we're worried about climate change, if we're worried about the economy, if we're worried about trade, if we're worried -- again, again, let's underline it again, global security, the united states has to talk to china regardless of

what trump republicans are saying and regardless of what some people on the far left are saying. we have to talk to them. >> indeed we do. and here is how i would categorize it, joe. what we need to do is confront china where we must. where they're flying spy balloons over the united states. south china sea, body half the size of the united states is territorial waters. it's preposterous claim. we need to confront china where we must, but we should cooperate wherever we can. you just ticked off the shopping list. it's the environment. it's cooperation and global security, trying to resolve this situation in ukraine. i'll add one to your list, prepare for the next pandemic. part of why our global response was so disastrous because it disaggregated the united states from china and others who were involved in it. so, we should have a tragedy

that says confront where we must, cooperate wherever we can. that's the best policy. that's why nicholas burns is putting those feelers out. the next thing you'll see and watch for it, will be cabinet level officials going to beijing. look for janet yellen to go, our secretary of the treasury. look for ginny-ranundo. we'll continue to front where we must. >> let's put this relationship in perspective. i hear for people who loathe joe biden, who are overly ideological and it's all partisanship. they'll talk about how weak we are and china is pushing us around. it skews the debate. it goes against the reality of everything i've heard from leaders in europe, leaders the middle east, leaders in asia. they're all saying the united

states is flexing their muscles more than ever before. i'm not being jingo-istic here. i'm saying american leaders, especially in washington, need to -- this is what dr. brzezinski used to say, through the eyes of our allies. our allies and our adversaries are saying, we're not leading from behind anymore. our pivot to asia started and we boxed china in. you look at what we have done in guam, the increased force there. you look at the increased force in the philippines, the agreement there. the sub agreement with australia. china, i'm not being critical of the biden administration. america is doing what america has been promising they're going to do for 20 years and never did it. we have pivoted to china. and we have a stronger presence in asia now than we've had.

at the same time, and forgive me for this long buildup, but our policymakers that watch this show, need to understand it, at the same time, china has a reason for feeling, you know, a little tight around the collar. they have a reason for saying, my god, the americans are starting to surround us. and if at least we can understand why they're thinking that way, that helps us get to the table and start talking about some of our disagreements instead of this reflexive anti-china movement on the hill. >> indeed. and i'll add one to your list of how it looks from beijing, which you didn't mention, which is recently announced u.s. nuclear submarines will be doing port calls in korea. and, oh by the way, we have ships in and out of singapore constantly. so, yes, we need to put ourselves in the shoes of the other. and therefore, understand their

arguments. for example, why they think they own the south china sea. not that we're going to agree with it, but because then we can reverse engineer those arguments, negotiate, and resolve some of these conflicts. all of that is crucial to diplomacy. final thought, joe, i hear a lot, you probably do, too, oh my god, we're in a new cold war with china. no, we're not. and you know, mike barnicle and i are old enough to actually remember the cold war. that was the soviet union, the united states and nato, millions of troops nose to nose in europe, huge battle fleets around the world playing hunt for red october, thousands of nuclear weapons on a hair trigger alert. we're not remotely there. we are still engaged. we need to continue that. >> we are still engaged. and mike, you talk to any diplomat, you talk to any business person that has been to china over the past several

months, and the chinese will actually express concern. and the chinese will actually ask, wait, wait, why does everybody in america hate us? and you bring up the spy balloon and they'll laugh, they'll go, oh my god, your spy technology is light years ahead of ours. we have no idea how much you're raking out of china everyday. and so they understand the differences. again, i'm not carrying china's water here. they understand the differences. they don't understand when the united states turned the china/american relationship into the new cold war. and quite frankly, the admiral is right. a lot of policymakers on the hill don't understand just how dangerous that is for the world, for global security, for ukraine, for our economy, for our trade, for our climate

change. you name it, whether we like it or not, china and the united states are the two superpowers, along with the eu, that are going to shape the next 50 years on this planet. >> yeah. there's no doubt about that, joe. on a commercial level, i mean, it's a different playing field in china between american business interests and chinese business interests. but chinese business interests are increasingly being overseen by the chinese government. and admiral, my question to you is, all of the talk about, you know, america has to get more involved with china, what about within the past five years china's growing global appetite? how do we confront that? >> china has a plan and it's a smart plan. it's called one belt, one road. it is manufacture, produce goods and services, export those, bring lots and lots of raw materials in along the old marco

polo routes, across central asia. you create geopolitical, gio economic influence. how we face that, mike, is with our greatest capability. it's two things, our alliance systems, which can be placed inside like fire brakes in this one belt/one road. and number two, it's our private sector, the ability to go, engage, to confront, to show what american business can do. all that is very powerful. >> but it gets you in, admiral on a domestic crisis. the bide an administration says it plans to send 15000 active duty troops to the southern border as the white house is expecting a surge in migration when the covid-era title 42 restrictions expire next week. the measure allows the u.s. to quickly expel migrants at the border, inkwluding asylum seekers in order to limit the spread of covid-19. but that's going away now. the additional military personnel will be at the southern border for 90 days to

assist the current 2,500 troops currently there. they will not be armed. they will not use force or make arrests in accordance of the law that prevents the military for enforcing law within the borders of the united states. the department of homeland security says it will serve -- the troops will -- in a supplemental role, helping with dasks like ground monitoring and data entry. troops are going to the border, uh-oh. what does it mean to send 1,500 more troops down there? >> yeah. before i was supreme ally commander in nato and really focussed on europe and afghanistan, i spent three years as commander u.s. southern command in charge of military activity south of the united states. so i know this zone reasonably well. this is a smart move on the part of the biden administration. these troops will be going there to free up border agents who will go forward and do the work of law enforcement. it is a reasonable -- let's face it, a tiny deployment of troops in big context of things.

i think it's absolutely the right move. >> so there is a political reality to this as well, michael steele. white house aides acknowledge it's been a problem and lot of their policies to this point haven't totally worked. the images from the border making their way around the media. this is a white house that really distanced itself from the immigration policies of the trump white house and to be clear, these are not the same, but trump white house also sent troops to the border. how do you see this playing politically right here for this administration as title 42 ends, troops head in and we expect influx of migrants across the southern border? >> yeah. i think the administration is behind the eight ball here. i think they've been slow to the roll on immigration question for the last two and a half years. i think they've narratively allowed the republicans to maintain the narrative that began under the trump administration.

and while people may scoff and moan and groan about the idea of a wall, for a lot of americans, not just republicans, it was a sign of at least something. there was some strategy there. kids in cages, a lot of bat crazy stuff, but at the end of the day, you know, like anything with motion, you're going to pay attention to that thing, right? you may find the speed to be dangerous and reckless, but you at least acknowledge it's moving and going in a certain direction and may be coming at you. that was a lot of the trump immigration policy. the biden administration comes in and basically says, okay. we'll get to that. meanwhile, you're having these hiccups of crises that occur at the border. and now with the pressure of going back to precovid normal with respect to the role of the government in terms of the

dollars, the covid restrictions and things like that, the requirements of checking immigrants and migrants coming into the country, those now relaxing and going away. the administration finds itself playing catchup. and politically, that is not a good position for the administration to be in as the president is now launching his re-election bid, you've just given some narratives to your political opponents regardless of whether donald trump is at the top of the ticket or not. that will be used over the next few weeks to sort of reset the table narrative around immigration, if the administration can't show it has a plan. >> like ronald reagan, i support more immigration to the united states. i support more legal immigration to the united states. i believe legal immigration keeps us young, keeps us vibrant, just as reagan said in

his farewell speech. and if we stop allowing immigrants to come into the united states, we become an older, weaker, less dynamic country. ronald reagan said that in his final speech from the white house. i say that as background to this next question. why has it been so hard for the biden white house to get their arms around this crisis? after all, illegal border crossings across the southern border were at a 50-year low when barack obama and joe biden left the white house and turned it over to donald trump. and then we had the explosion, we had the crisis. it's gotten worse. but why is it that the biden administration has allowed this humanitarian crisis to continue and also allowed a good bit of chaos to continue at the southern border? >> i think, from when i talk to people on the inside, this has been -- it's not as if they don't understand what the problem is.

it's been a particularly the beginning of the administration, just a massive, massive, logistical problem in terms of how many people are coming. it's not just the spring always has an influx of more immigrants coming. you also have migrants from climates -- people that are coming to the country because of -- because they lost their way of life because of climate as well as violence as well as economic concerns. so it's just a much bigger problem. i think what you see -- michael said the administration needs to show they have a plan. this is the plan. that is what they are showing us. last week secretary of state blinken said they were doing processing centers in country, in central america, to try to encourage people to not leave your country. apply for asylum in your own country, don't go to border. we see they're doing the diplomatic work, logistical work around that. we see they are sending troops to the border to aid what they

know is going to be a bigger influx after title 42 restrictions end. and so that can be more orderly. when we do see may 11th when they go back to the pre-covid policies for the border, we know that they have taken steps to try to mitigate this and make it more -- a more orderly process. but, it's -- you know, at some point it really is a massive, logistical problem. >> title 42 expires a week from tomorrow. there are long lines in el paso of migrants waiting if r that day to get in. retired admiral james stavridis covering a ton of ground for us, as only he can. thank you so much, admiral. always good to see you. >> happy birthday. >> thank you. appreciate that. the man accused of killing five of his neighbors in texas last week was arrested last night. francisco oropesa was captured in the city of cut & shoot, the name of the town, about 13 miles from the scene of the murders. it ends a four-day manhunt

involving more than 200 local, state and federal officers. this is video recorded shortly after he was arrested. the fbi says someone called in a tip just after 5:00 p.m. yesterday evening. oropesa was found hiding in a home about an hour later. >> bottom line is, we now have this man in custody. he was caught hiding in a closet, underneath some laundry. >> the tip for the suspect's location came in through the fbi's tip line. and we just want to thank the person who had the courage and bravery to call in the suspect's location. >> it's not clear yet exactly how oropesa avoided authorities for all these days. neither the sheriff nor the fbi gave detail about the home where he was found. they also would not say if he had any help while he was on the run, but the good news for now in this horrific tragedy is that he is now in police custody. still ahead on "morning joe," former president trump

potentially could skip out on some of the upcoming republican debates. what that means for the primary field ahead of 2024. plus, some new reporting about a text message sent by tucker carlson that sent off a panic within fox news and may have played a role in his firing there. also ahead, jurors deliberating in the seditious conspiracy trial of five proud boys appear to be struggling with some of the charges. we'll go over how things played out in court yesterday. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪♪ ." we'll be right back. ♪ we'll be here. ♪ so you can be there. everything from vitamin a to vitamin zs delivered in 1 hour. (man) what if my type 2 diabetes takes over? (woman)thing from vitamin a what if all i do isn't enough? or what if i can do diabetes differently? (avo) now you can with once-weekly mounjaro.

mounjaro helps your body regulate blood sugar, and mounjaro can help decrease how much food you eat. 3 out of 4 people reached an a1c of less than 7%. plus people taking mounjaro lost up to 25 pounds. mounjaro is not for people with type 1 diabetes or children. don't take mounjaro, if you're allergic to it, you or your family have medullary thyroid cancer, or multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. stop mounjaro, and call your doctor right away, if you have an allergic reaction, a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, vision changes, or diabetic retinopathy. serious side effects may include pancreatitis and gallbladder problems. taking mounjaro with sulfonylurea or insulin raises low blood sugar risk. tell your doctor if you're nursing, pregnant, or plan to be. side effects include nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea which can cause dehydration and may worsen kidney problems. (woman) i can do diabetes differently with mounjaro. (avo) ask your doctor about once-weekly mounjaro.

(vo) in two seconds, eric will realize (man) [laughs] (vo) they're gonna need more space... gotta sell the house. (vo) oh..open houses or, skip the hassles and sell with confidence to opendoor. wow. (vo) request a cash offer at opendoor dot com identical twins bethany and stephanie both struggled

with cpap for their sleep apnea. but stephanie got inspire, an implanted device that works inside the body. there's no reason to keep struggling. inspire. learn more and view important safety information at inspiresleep.com. ♪

the all-new chevy colorado is made for more. bring more. ♪ do more. ♪ see more. ♪ and be more. ♪ the all-new chevy colorado. made for more. ♪ lawyers for the woman suing donald trump for battery and defamation are calling for more witnesses to bolster her case. e. jean carroll says donald trump raped her in a department store in the '90s and lied about it. yesterday carroll's long-time friend told jurors carroll called her within minutes after the alleged attack. he was breathless,

hyperventilating and emotional. jessica leads also took the stand yesterday and she testified that trump assaulted her on an airplane in the late 1970s. leads told jurors that the two spoke briefly and then, quote, out of the blue he decided to kiss me and grope me like he had 70 zillion hands. leads went public with her allegations in 2016, trump died it telling a crowd at a rally, quote, he would not be my first choice. trial is set to resume today. we will not -- we now know that donald trump will not take the stand. his lawyers notified the judge of that decision yesterday. carroll's lawyers, however, are expected to play some of trump's taped deposition for the jury later this week. let's bring in right now member of the "new york times" editorial board, mora gay. so mora, we learned over the past couple days that donald trump is not going to be attending -- possibly attending republican presidential debates. now we are hearing that he's not

even going to attend a civil trial where he is being accused of rape. >> you know, it really takes me back to 2016 when we started to hear some of these allegations in earnest. and just as a woman and a voter, it was really infuriating at the time to see so many women come forward, just disturbing allegations to begin with, but then the fact that he was elected president any way. and i think that trauma for american women is still very real. and yet, it's progress to see the former president being held accountable in some way. this time through the courts. and women being able to have their day in court rather than having their own personal lives and integrity picked apart in the midst of a presidential campaign. so, i have mixed feelings about it. i'm sure a lot of voters will. but as we get more details, and

the details are really hard to hear, i think it's going to remind us that this is not a normal presidential candidate. this is not a normal campaign. and i think we don't want to lose sight of that. we don't want to normalize his candidacy. and we have all seen that this is not a normal presidential candidate. we don't want to go back to that. i think that's clear. and hope any these women can see some justice. >> and trump's lawyers, the defenses they're using are straight out of, i'm sorry, the bad old days, the 1970s. i saw some skit a while back where you had women interviewing a man. it was a british comedy skit. the man came in and he was complaining about being assaulted and them taking the wallet. and so the women started asking the men questions that often

rape victims are asked. and they start by going, well, why are you -- you're dressed like you're really rich. weren't you asking for it? and then they said, did you yell? did you scream? and the guy said, no, i didn't scream. well, why didn't you scream? and then the next one was, when did this happen? why did it take you so long to report this to the police? well, that was a comedy sketch making fun of these old, tired dated arguments and turning it on men, asking, how would you like -- well, what have we heard here? we heard trump's lawyers saying, well, why didn't you scream? why didn't you report it? i'm sorry, mara, i'm not getting personal with you, but you could ask any woman your age, how many friends do you know who were

assaulted, sexually, or close to it, who didn't report it to the police because they were afraid they would be raked over the coals and blamed just like trump's lawyers are now blaming this alleged victim. >> well, you're exactly right, joe. and i've written and been public about my own sexual assault. and i actually dated that person afterwards. there are a lot of complicated reactions to trauma, such as sexual assault. and we know that. doctors know that. psychologists know that. detectives know that. juries understand that because, of course, they live in the real world as well. and i think the fact that you see donald trump's lawyers engaging in this kind of retro-sexist argument on his behalf is disturbing because, you know, we don't want to go back to a time when we are still trafficking in this nonsense. we know a lot more now about sexual assault.

and its impact on women and anybody else who may have been a victim of sexual assault. and to pretend that we don't is a disservice to women everywhere and to any victim of sexual assault again. and it's also just an insult frankly. it's insulting. and we also just want to remind people, of course, that sexual assault, rape, it's not actually about sex. it's about power. and so when donald trump says things like, oh, she wasn't my type. it's not about attraction. sexual assault, rape, is not about attraction. it's about power. and it's about violating another person's right to their autonomy over their own body and their human dignity. >> when you're powerful, they let you do whatever you want, right? >> that's what it comes back to every time, isn't it? >> you talked about -- earlier about how this brings you back to 2016, in a big way for me,

too, in october of 2016. i think that is what was such a gut punch for women was -- and what caused women's march and just all the women that ran in 2018 and kamala harris as vice president. that america would elect that man president after everything that he had been accused of and said about women. >> just feel that in your gut. >> yes. yes, you do. >> so we told our stories and either people didn't believe us or didn't care. it didn't matter. >> but do you think that, you know, this is bringing focus back on trump, which is good. do you have a sense that it's impacting the trial is bring -- that other women are stepping forward? i know that these -- that states after metoo started to pass laws that extended the period of time in which you can bring these charges, at least in civil courts. do you see it happening elsewhere? >> we haven't seen that yet. i actually politically the most

interesting thing to me here is that this is happening against the backdrop of women's rights and abortion rights under assault. and the connection, i think, for the republican party politically is going to be quite devastating, i predict, in the coming months. and really impossible for women to ignore. >> this is not directly about donald trump this next case, but a lot of these defendants say they were driven to their actions by the former president. jurors deliberating the fate of five proud boys members charged with seditious conspiracy in the connection with the january 6th insurrection appear to be struggling with the charges against some of the defendants. the jury sent a note yesterday to the judge asking for additional instructions on what to do if they cannot unanimously agree on all of the charges. the judge sent a note back to the jury stating you can deliver a partial verdict requesting they send him another note if they end up deadlocked on a charge. the jury will resume its

deliberations today. and michael steele, seditious conspiracy, this is just putting it out there that you were attempting to overthrow the united states government with that specific charge. and some of these, as i mentioned, members of the proud boys, saying the defense, donald trump made me do it effectively. >> yeah. it is very compelling narrative when the folks who were there, who you've been their champion and they love you and they're coming out for you say, yeah, i'm here doing what i did because he asked me to be here. and so you're seeing in cases like this -- it's really one of the clarifying elements of the january 6th hearings was irrelevantive of how these trials played themselves out or will play themselves out, the american people had an appreciation of what happened on that day. what it really meant. what they saw unfold in front of

them was insurrection, realtime. and it was one of those things that you couldn't put your head around when you were watching it, but now with the trials and with the narratives out of january 6th, you really begin to see the pattern and that one thread, that one single thread that ties it all together has been trump, has been his rhetoric. as been his exhortations. let's go to the hill, you know. his condemnation of mike pence that fed this fever to hang him. and even now in the midst of all of that, you still have these story lines playing out with characters like pence, who you know, finally get in front of committee to tell the story. we don't know fully or all of what that was just yet. but it just gives you a sense of the weight of that moment.

really put in perspective by january 6th. yes, the jurors are trying to work through some of the specifics of the case in front of them, but the fact is this case is not deadlocked. this is not people sitting there going, well i just don't know if that really happened that way. people got it. and i think that's important for the country that we can get this in front of peep who have been tainted in some way by the hot rhetoric of trumpism and all of that and still get in to a jury box and look at this case, look at these cases dispassionately as they should, apply the law to the facts and come to a reason conclusion that, yeah, what we saw happened really happened. >> and mike, the prosecution just keep coming. our colleague at nbc ryan riley posted a story late last night that a florida man who federal authorities say set off an

explosive device in a capitol tunnel during a fierce battle between trump supporters and law enforcement on january 6th was arrested and charged with 12 counts. so justice may be coming slowly because there are so many defendants or potential defendants, but it continues to march along here. >> so, we're sitting here, and we're listening to these horrible tales in a rape trial, and about january 6th, for the past six or seven minutes. i find it unbelievably depressing to realize that in our life times, you're younger than i am, all of you, in our life times we are unlikely to be able to measure the damage one man, donald trump, did to this country, to our institutions, to the way we live, to what we think. this one man today after all of this, after all of what the nation has seen on their television screens, all of this

which the nation has listened to about him on trial for rape, after all of the things he's done and said in public, boldly in public, he is the leading contender, the odds on choice to be the republican nominee for president of the united states. i don't know how i fight this depression, but it is deeply, deeply depressing to realize it. >> ahead in every republican poll given a town hall on cable television next week. to your point about the january 6th prosecution, we also got word late yesterday a former fbi agent was arrested in oregon for the role he played at the capitol that day inciting rioters to go after police officers calling the officers there nazis and urging on other rioters to go get him. and we know the fbi, of course, has denounced his behavior, but the fbi director said they know that some of his agents sympathetic to the rioter's

cause that day. this one now in custody. >> even after efg we know, after everything kwef seen a large swath of americans want to vote for donald trump again. more than 30 years ago, donald trump called for the execution of our next guest and a group of his friends after the man's wrongful arrest in the case of the so-called central park five. they now are the exonerated five. now youssef salam is running for new york city council. he joins us in our studio next on "morning joe." ♪♪ tudio next on "morning joe. ♪ this week is your chance to try any subway footlong for free. like the subway series menu. just buy any footlong in the app, and get one free. everyone loves free stuff chuck. can we get peyton a footlong? get it before it's gone. on the subway app.

as the sun rises, we raise the flag. a symbol of all that we hold most dear as americans. courage. opportunity. democracy. freedom. they■re the values and beliefs that built this country and still beat in our hearts. but they are under attack by an extreme movement that seeks to overturn elections, ban books, and eliminate a woman■s right to choose. joe biden has made defending our basic freedoms the cause of his presidency. the freedom for women to make their own healthcare decisions. the freedom for our children to be safe from gun violence. the freedom to vote and have your vote counted. for seniors to live with dignity. and to give every american the freedom that comes with a fair shot

at building a good life. in small towns and big cities, we raise our heads, our eyes. our hearts. for america. for the idea of this great country. joe biden is running for reelection to make certain that the sun will not set on this flag. the promise of american democracy will not break. democracy must not be a partisan issue. it■s an american issue. as your president i will defend our democracy with every fiber of my being and i■m asking every american to join me. for freedom. for democracy. for america. joe biden. i■m joe biden, and i approve this message. so, you found the no7 then... it's amazing! hydrates better than the expensive stuff i don't live here, so i'm taking this and whatever's in the back. it's already sold in the us. but i'm not taking any chances. the uk's #1 skincare has crossed the pond.

♪ ...i'm over 45. ♪ the uk's #1 skincare ♪ i realize i'm no spring chicken. ♪ ♪ i know what's right for me. ♪ ♪ i've got a plan to which i'm sticking. ♪ ♪ my doc wrote me the script. ♪ ♪ box came by mail. ♪ ♪ showed up on friday. ♪ ♪ i screened with cologuard and did it my way! ♪ cologuard is a one-of-a kind way to screen for colon cancer that's effective and non-invasive. it's for people 45 plus at average risk, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your provider for cologuard. ♪ (group) i did it my way! ♪ after my car accident, wondnder whahatmy c cas. so i called the barnes firm. i'm rich barnes. youour cidedentase e woh than insurance offered? call the barnes firm now to find out. yoyou ght t beurprpris

i d d so my y quesononsw eouout hicacase.y y son, yoyou ght t beurprpris cacalledhehe bars s fi i d d soit was the best call eouout hii could've made. call the barnes firm and find out what your case all could be worth.uld've made. ♪ call one eight hundred, eight million ♪ will you apologize to the central park five? they have been exonerated. there have been videos and movies shown about the case and you came out with a full-page ad saying they should die. >> why do you bring that question up now? it's an interesting time to bring it up. you have people on both sides of that. they admitted their guilt. if you look at linda and look at some of the prosecutors, they think that the city should never

have settled that case. so, we'll leave it at that. >> no, they were exonerated. people on both sides. there he goes again. former president donald trump in 2019 refusing to write a 30-year-old wrong when he took out this full page ad "the new york times" calling for the reinstatement of the death penalty in new york in the wake of the central park five case. one of the men exonerated in that case responded with an ad of his own on the day trump was arraigned in new york last month. and we are joined by youssef, a candidate for new york city council. thank you for being with us today. >> my pleasure. my pleasure. >> you're jumping into the arena of politics. what drove you there? >> all of this. you know, those who have been closest to the pain should have a seat at the table. you know, i've always said that. and you know, many times you see people marching for justice out in the streets. it occurred to me that you need to have someone in the halls of power to carry your voice.

and most times we don't have that. we need that kind of leadership that says, i know what it's like to have been there. of course i've been run over by the spike wheels of justice, 34 years ago. i was 15 years old. and that case is a case that is a stain still on america because if the former president can say, well, they had to be guilty of something. they looked at the color of our skin and judged us by it, not the contents of our character. we need voices like mine, who can articulate all of the pain points in a way that is meaningful to the average person in harlem, you know, the average person in the margins of life. >> i don't mean to walk you through the painful time in your life, but i think it's instructive to where you're coming from as you run for office. can you just speak to what it was like to be sitting in prison for something you absolutely knew you did not do and to know

that so much of the world had made up its mind that you had done that and you knew you didn't. how did you get through those moments? and how does it motivate you still today? >> the biggest challenge of being in prison for a crime you didn't commit is that you constantly have thoughts, well, maybe i should just become this. you know, maybe i should turn into the monster that they're talking about. and of course, the challenge is you're the ingredient that they're trying to get to accept a definition of yourself that you weren't born with. you were born on purpose with a purpose. you have to constantly remind yourself every single day, the greats have said things like if you can't see it, you can't be it. in your mind's eye, you have to hold the most positive of thoughts so that wherever your mind goes, your body follows. and of course, while i was in prison, i had to pray often and meditate even more because praying is talking to god and meditation is listening for the answer. that was the way i got through it. keep in mind, my eyes on the

light at the end of the tunnel. as it got brighter and brighter and brighter, being so thankful i was able to get through it. so rather than just going through something, i was able to grow through something. >> mara, you have been out on the campaign trail with yusef, watched him. you say he's a pretty good retail politician out there on the trail. >> yeah. it's pretty amazing. people do know who he is. and you know, i did have a question, though, for you. when we spent time on the trail together in harlem last month, you talked to me a little bit about how donald trump played an enormous role back in the day, during this case, in the early '90s, late '80s in really turning you into what you described as a national pariah. i think it's so easy for us to kind of paper over some of donald trump's behavior, both in office and years before.

but i just -- i was hoping you could expand on that a little bit and tell us what you mean when you say, you know, he played an enormous role in kind of nationalizing the case at the time. i think people forget that. and i just -- this is full circle for you, but i wanted to see if you could expand on that. >> absolutely. you know, in this country, according to the law, you're supposed to be innocent until proven guilty. and the worst thing about america is that when it comes to black and brown bodies, at the very inception of this country's creation, it says we the people. black and brown people were considered 3/5ths of a human being. that has never been revisited, never been reformed. we're still seen as that. and so for donald trump to have been contemplating and thinking about how do we solve this case, he rushed to judge us.

and in rushing to judge us, two weeks after we were accused, he had already contemplated, created and green lit an article that was placed in new york city's newspapers really to cause a damaging domino effect. that effect i think was to almost be a whisper into the darkest enclaves of society that someone should do to us what they had done to emmitt till. and so for two weeks to go by and we had not been placed on trial yet, we were accused, he really was the fire starter for everything that happened to us. they were hoping that we died in prison. and if we didn't die, they were hoping that we were given a social death afterwards. and here we are now able to use the platform that we were given in a really powerful way, not to shrink from society, but rather to say, look, i went through some of the most awful

experiences. rather than becoming a monster, turning into a person that was a recluse, i said you know what, i need to stand and be counted. i can't tell you how many people come up to me and say, thank you for standing. thank you for showing me that there's a way forward. so me running for politics, it's about making sure that we understand as a people that it is not impossible but that i'm possible. you're possible. we are the heroes of our story. we're fighting for that dash in between our birth and our death. and we have a great, great, great legacy to leave as we do the work. i'm so thankful to do this work. >> so yusef, you were in every way wronged by the system. as you said, you're now trying to change the system from within. you're taking part in the process. walk us through your thought process. how did you get there? how did you make a decision that this is how you were going to try to make a difference? >> far too often, you know, so

many people as you see, you know, all kinds of atrocities, oppressions happening around the country, everyone goes out and marches. and it seems like we still get the same results. nothing. we need people to be able to say, to be able to say, well, what is the next step? we live in a country where everything happens through a political process, and some people don't want to participate, and i can guarantee you that nonparticipation is participation. i probably was that person when i first came home from prison that i dependant want to have anything to do with the system. the more i realized if i didn't do anything i would get the same results, i needed to do something. as i began to think about how can i effect the greatest

change? it's through the political process. but you have to remain true to who you are. >> yousef, i am sure you realize more than most of us that we all live in a country where we take so many things for granted that are not available to so many others around the world, and i am sure you know because of the life you lived, the prison is a mental aspect, bars go up around your mind and some stay there for a long time. could you talk for a minute how long it took you to adjust yourself to the fact that you could make a phone call whenever you wanted to, that you could walk to the corner store for a newspaper whenever you wanted to, that you could go to the bathroom wherever you wanted

to -- >> wow, you just brought it into perspective. "shaw sank redemption" is a good example of where the man needed to go to a bathroom and asked as a free person. when you are awakened to a nightmare like that, it consumes you. i was 15 years old. i am 49 now. i had no idea that that would be my plight in life. my thought was, man, am i going to get a bmx bike and climbing trees, and all of the things that young people do as part of their childhood, and to have that interrupted, to have that development arrested, i have never been able to restore that

kind of hope until now, because the controlling of your own self in trying to direct yourself in a way that is meaningful is to ensure that all of the narratives out there, these narratives are coming after the fact. right, they say every action is a equal and opposite reaction, and then the cameras turn the cameras on her, and they would take pictures of her after they pushed her and it was as she was responding, and to be on the other side of that, and to realize you don't have to ask permission to live life, and

your live was gifted to you by the creator, oh, man, it's so beautiful. then you realize there's more work to do, because then you have to teach through your example, your children, your family, your people, that they can also be free. oh, man, it's a good thing. >> well said. really well said. next month is the primary, here in the ninth district and you are running for that seat up in harlem. was walk the streets and talk to voters, what is on their mind? you are talking about opportunity and housing and public safety, and reduction in crime. what do you hear the most from the people of harlem when you go around shaking hands? >> the biggest thing is street safety, and all the ill effects happening in the margin of life we experience in harlem, and the greatest thing that i have

experienced from the people themselves are people coming up and saying, i have never voted before but i will vote for you. you give me hope. i am, like, wow, how amazing is that to realize that your vote is your power? to not use your power is to allow for your tax dollars to not represent you. we need wrap around services, and more importantly we need to believe again in our own humanity, and that to me is the biggest and best thing about this particular race and a lot of the voices -- yes, we need affordable housing, we need safe streets. we need education, holistic education that allows for our children to assume the roles of the future caretakers of tomorrow, and not become second-class citizens. a lot of that, i think, is about

us believing in ourselves again. you know. i tell people all the time, look, a lot of folks i meet, they say i am not able to vote and i am not from here, and i said don't worry, use yousef @harlem.com and talk about it. donald trump deserves a fair trial. it kills me, you know, when i think, you know, we are a country of law and order, and when i think about donald trump, everybody asked me that, and they say what do you think? i say, he deserves a fair trial,

whether you are black, white, orange, and you have the worst combover, you deserve a fair trial. >> you are right about that, and it shows incredible grace given by you. we appreciate you being here. >> thank you. a seventh grade student open fire in the school killing eight children and a school guard before being arrested in the school yard. six more people and a teacher were hospitalized and it happened in central belgrade. most students were able to flee through a backdoor as the gunman opened fire. the shooter used his father's happened gun. a seventh grader, and these are very, very rare in europe, school shootings, but we are seeing the contagion here in the united states beginning to spread from time to time around

the world. we will have that story coming up. the man accused of killing five of his neighbors in texas is in custody and we will bring you that story next on "morning joe." from prom dresses to workouts and new adventures you hope the more you give the less they'll miss. but even if your teen was vaccinated against meningitis in the past they may be missing vaccination for meningitis b. although uncommon, up to 1 in 5 survivors of meningitis will have long term consequences. now as you're thinking about all the vaccines your teen might need make sure you ask your doctor if your teen is missing meningitis b vaccination. need relief for tired, achy feet? or the energy to keep working? there's a dr. scholl's for that. dr. scholl's massaging gel insoles

have patented gel waves that absorb shock to hard-working muscles and joints, for all-day energy. we moved out of the city so our little sophie could appreciate nature. and joints, but then he got us t-mobile home internet. i was just trying to improve our signal, so some of the trees had to go. i might've taken it a step too far. (chainsaw revs) (tree crashes) (chainsaw continues) (daughter screams) let's pretend for a second that you didn't let down your entire family. what would that reality look like? well i guess i would've gotten us xfinity... and we'd have a better view. do you need mulch? what, we have a ton of mulch. as a business owner, your bottom line is always top of mind. ton. so start saving by switching to the mobile service designed for small business: comcast business mobile. flexible data plans mean you can get unlimited data or pay by the gig. all on the most reliable 5g network, with no line activation fees or term contracts... saving you up to 75% a year.

and it's only available to comcast business internet customers. so boost your bottom line by switching today. comcast business. powering possibilities™. welcome back to "morning joe." it's known globally as international willie day. why? because our willie sz turns 39 today. >> 39. i appreciate that. also, james brown's birthday. >> no way. >> yes! >> we need to get the rev. rev, call in sometime. i want to hear some of the best james brown stories.

he told me one or two that we can't talk about publicly. you need one of those shag carpet rakes that i gave you for your birthday present last year, willie. >> yeah. >> any big birthday plans? >> we got -- george guise has a baseball game, and then no fanfare, just my favorite people. >> mike barnicle, i want to ask you a question. first of all, this is a question that people are going to have to be answering over the next year and a half because it looks like donald trump will be the nominee of the republican party. it's way too early to tell but certainly doesn't look like he has any comers right now that

will be strong enough. i will stay up front, i have known chris for a long time and helped us start the show, and i'm friends with jazz. a lot of people are talking about whether cnn should set up a town hall meeting with the likely gop nominee because -- the question, you know, the guy is a insurrectionist and he tried to overthrow the united states government, and he's not just any other presidential candidate. there are people saying you don't provide that sort of normalcy, and others are saying he's going to be the nominee.

the town hall is a good pass of what we do. where do you draw the line with a insurrectionists, and a guy that promotes violence, openly promotes violence. what does the media do? >> you have him on and you press him on all the points you just raised. you don't give him any wiggle room. you don't let him do his bend the facts routine, and you point out the fact that he did try and overthrow the american government, actively tried to overthrow it. you point out that he's a liar. you point out all the flaws and keep pointing them out. i don't know if you can do that in the context of a town meeting. we will find out if we can do that next week, jonathan.

>> yeah, kaitlan collins is a terrific interview and she's hosting this. this does raise all sorts of questions. some have said if we treat him like any other politician, that's a sign that our democracy is failing. to mike's point, certainly, you have to hold him accountable and have content and facts that is harder in a setting where it's not a one-on-one interview, and we know donald trump has the ability to filibuster and steam role over questions. >> in 2016, the media in some ways, we kind of just felt even personally steamrolled. if he's a serious candidate

again and it's something the voters decide, you can't ignore a serious presidential candidate. it puts the media in a difficult position. you do have to ask him the tough questions. i agree, i mean, one solution, just as a small example is if you have a town hall situation, you can provide fact checking, for example, and that will be very important. having an aggressive and competent moderator. that's really important. those are the things that are important, and not providing a free platform. he was not held to account, it was endless covering of donald trump rallies, for example. that's not something that we want or need to see again.

that's not adding value to the american people. this is an ongoing conversation that we are going to have to have. i don't know how to get it right, exactly. we should all be thinking about how to get it right. we have breaking news. disturbing breaking news right now that the "wall street journal" and ap are reporting, the kremlin's statement says two unmanned vehicles were aimed at the kremlin and the devices were put out of action. "the wall street journal" report says that white smoke can be seen billowing from the kremlin itself. obviously, jonathan, we just got this breaking news seconds ago. there are going to be repercussions and we don't know

whether the drone -- attempted drone strikes came from ukraine or not. it seems far more likely, far more likely, given all the warnings the white house has given to the ukrainian government about strikes inside russia that this is just russian disinformation, that the drones likely were, again, part of a hoax to make it looks like it was from ukraine. we are just minutes in now and we don't know. we will be searching for the answers over the next several weeks. >> yeah, we are just basing this -- it would not be unusual if it was russian disinformation, and we have had false flags over the years and it's right out of their playbook. the white house has warned ukraine to not do something like

this. we don't know that they did, but there has been a lot of warnings from the white house saying to kyiv this is about defending your country and regaining your territory and you should not be striking back within russia's borders. that's some of the reason why they were reluctant to give them some of the missiles and weapons that would have that range, and ukraine has not always listened from that, whether it's ordered from the ukrainian government or forces within that country, the explosion in moscow that killed a daughter of a official, and we don't know, mike barnicle, this is what happened today, but it's something the white house will be scrambling to respond to. >> we do know a couple things,

even though this is preliminary information we are getting, and we know it's a horrifically long drone flight from ukraine to moscow. and we know a little bit about the dissension within the russian government, and there's more that we don't know about what happened and what has been reported than what we do know. >> exactly right. the russian government reading from "the wall street journal" breaking news, it says kremlin hit by ukraine drones. ukraine drones struck the kremlin in the early morning hours and they are saying it was an attempted assassination on vladimir putin. that seems awfully unlikely and we will get military experts on and others to speak on this in the coming hours.

two unmanned ukraine drones crashed into the kremlin. all of this information coming straight from the kremlin. videos circulating on social media showed white smoke billowing out of the kremlin complex, and nobody was injured and no damage. willie, call me skeptical only because i have had in depth conversations with not only people inside the white house but other western leaders who made it abundantly clear to ukraine that they support ukraine's efforts to defend themselves, but that support ends when it has anything to do with going into russia itself. >> yeah, you got good reason to

be skeptical because this is coming from the russian government and because it's difficult, a mission like this, and the recklessness of it if it were ukraine. no evidence presented it's from ukraine, but the accusations saying two drones from ukraine hit the kremlin, and we will see if we can dig deeper, but this is only information from russia and its state media. we will go live to texas where the manhunt now is over. the man accused of killing five people, including a young child there a few days ago has been arrested and is in jail this morning. we're coming right back on "morning joe." hydrates better than the expensive stuff i don't live here, so i'm taking this and whatever's in the back. it's already sold in the us. but i'm not taking any chances. the uk's #1 skincare has crossed the pond. if you care about clean air,

you should know president biden's the uk's #1 skincare infrastructure laws are reducing pollution and creating clean energy jobs. more solar. more wind. made in america. tell joe biden to keep working for more jobs and less pollution. the first time you made a sale online with godaddy was also the first time you heard of a town named dinosaur, colorado. we just got an order from dinosaur, colorado. start an easy to build, powerful website for free with a partner that always puts you first. start for free at godaddy.com (music throughout) with a partner that always puts you first. get the royal treatment. join the millions playing royal match today. download now.

♪ limu emu & doug ♪ hey, man. nice pace! clearly, you're a safe driver. you could save hundreds for safe driving with liberty mutual. they customize your car insurance so you only pay for what you need! [sfx: limu squawks] whoo! we gotta go again. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ ♪ i have type 2 diabetes, ♪ ♪ but i manage it well. ♪ ♪ it's a little pill with a big story to tell. ♪ ♪ i take once-daily jardiance, ♪ ♪ at each day's staaart. ♪ ♪ as time went on it was easy to seee ♪ ♪ i'm lowering my a1c. ♪

jardiance works 24/7 in your body to flush out some sugar! and for adults with type 2 diabetes and known heart disease, jardiance can lower the risk of cardiovascular death, too. jardiance may cause serious side effects including ketoacidosis that may be fatal, dehydration, that can lead to sudden worsening of kidney function, and genital yeast or urinary tract infections. a rare, life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking jardiance and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this infection, ketoacidosis, or an allergic reaction, and don't take it if you're on dialysis. taking jardiance with a sulfonylurea or insulin may cause low blood sugar. ♪ jardiance is really swell, ♪ ♪ the little pill with a big story to tell. ♪

this morning. we begin with the multi-day manhunt for the suspect accused of killing five of his

neighbors, including a child. it ended last night. authorities say they caught the man about 15 miles from the scene of the crime after somebody called in a tip to the fbi. sam brock is live outside the jail in coldspring, texas. how did they track him down? >> reporter: willie, this was really a remarkable turn of events given the fact when we spoke 24 hours ago, authorities by their own admission had no idea where francisco oropesa was. how did we get to that point, right? this was a man accused of murdering five people brutally, including a 9-year-old child who was only trying to protect his mother. a tip came in at 5:30 yesterday, and by 6:30, whatever the information it prompted a

immediate swarming, and it's not clear whose residence this is, and there was no other information except that there were three different agencies that brought him in, texas dps and the marshals and border patrol, and he got oropesa and shocking to some, it was not clear if he was in another part of the state, but he was in the backyard of this living space the entire time, the chronology and the specifics of how he got there remains unclear despite repeated questions. the fbi did not want to get into

it. here they are talking about how this all came to pass, and remarkably where he was found. >> he was caught hiding in a closet underneath some laundry. they effectively made the arrest. he's uninjured. he is currently being taken to my facility in cold springs. >> it's not apparent at this point, willie, if he has been transported here or not, and if not it will happen later today, and in light that was broken by nbc yesterday, regarding the violent past of oropesa, his wife claims in sworn testimony that he physically closed his fist and kicked her on the

ground, in the backside and in the face, and there's documented evidence she filed a protective order against him. i asked the sheriff knowing he was deported four times and there was repeated calls to his residence because of gunfire, and did you look into this? he said, yeah, a constable came from another counting trying to track him down and then his wife decided not to prosecute him, and it was forgotten. >> five people killed, including a 9-year-old child a couple days ago, and a lot of people in texas feeling better that he's now in police custody. sam brock in texas for us this morning. sam, thanks so much.

we were watching "way too early" this morning about tucker carlson, new text messages coming to light and maybe perhaps motivation of why fox let him go. a text message sent by carlson to a fox producer, providing more insight into why the cable news station fired him. he was set to take the stand for a billion-dollar defamation trial, and the times reporting this redacted message came to the attention of fox directors, and it reads in part this way. a couple weeks ago i was watching video of people fighting on the street in washington. a group of trump guys surrounded an antifa kid and started pounding the living crap out of

him. it was three against one, at least. jumping a guy like that is dishonorable, obviously. it's not how white men fight. yet suddenly i found myself rooting for the mob against the mob hoping they would hit him harder, kill him. i really wanted them to hurt the kid, i could taste it. carlson later goes on to write that he, quote, shouldn't gloat over the man's suffering, but according to the times the earlier portion was enough to settle. other messages including ones where carlson dispairaged fox executives and used sexist language also reported led to his firing. the contents of the latest message are part of redacted court filings and were disclosed

at times in the interviews with several people close to the lawsuit but have not been independently confirmed by nbc news. nbc reached out to both carlson's attorneys and fox news for response but has not heard back. a representative for carlson did tell the times that he had no comment on the story. michael steele, i want to get your reaction to the latest revelation. the text message seems to be part of a larger puzzle as to why tucker carlson was shown the door. >> it doesn't surprise me. i think a lot of, you know, what we know from the dominion case really filled in some of the backstory about exactly how these hosts like tucker operated within the fox ecosystem. i mean, the fact that something like that could be sent to a colleague and it sort of sits

there and nothing happens or comes from it, and it's not until you get into this sort of adversarial prosecutory setting where it potentially comes public where you see reaction. so it speaks to the culture inside the building in many respect, that that type of communication doesn't rise to a point where, you know, he's brought in by the leadership of the company and saying, what are you talking about? how white men fight? you want to see somebody get killed on the streets of d.c.? so i think there's probably going to be more of this, quite honestly, even as this case is settled in that regard, you still have the smartmatic case coming forward. don't know all the access to emails and the documents they have there, but it really speaks to a culture, i think, that had grown up inside of fox that you

could communicate that way with a producer, with someone of authority inside the building and everybody is okay with it. >> the culture was just a culture of no accountability, specifically, for their biggest star. you know, those lines had to horrify them knowing that that was going to be out publicly, especially when you looked at all the other things that were going to be going out, him repeatedly using the "c" word to describe women. election rigging lie, the big lie that trump pushed. here you have a fox news host saying they wanted a group of trumpers to kill a kid. his words.

i wanted them to kill the kid. you mix that up with, again, the "c" word to describe women that worked with him, and the lawsuit coming up and it's hard to imagine why they wouldn't at the end feel like it was their best legal move, political move, pr move, to send him on his way. and there was a compilation put together a few days ago, when people started to engage in this bizarre anti- anti-tucker babbling. sure he's bad. sure, he's that, but he did really good things. the trains ran on time. we heard it from barry weiss, and andrew sullivan, people i

read regularly, and they did this anti- anti-tuckerism. people used to have the anti-anti-trumpism. and mehdi hassan said he had the receipts and wanted to show all the people that were engaging in anti-anti-tuckerism, exactly what they were defending, and they are defending this by saying whatever bad things tucker carlson did, well, at least he was anti-woke. this is what they are defending whenever they go to the ma for tucker. >> white supremacy, this is a hoax. there's no evidence white supremacy did this, that's a lie. even if it makes our own country poorer and dirtier. demographics, demographics. remember the great replacement theory was a great conspiracy

theory? seems like a statistical fact. congresswoman ilhan omar herself, dated montel williams, it's something in her range of experience. just for masochistic reasons, one more time. it might be time for joe biden to let us know what ketanji brown jackson's score was, and they think they should be elevated in ame on your choices. rwanda. very few unarmed black men are killed by cops these days. where is george floyd when you need him.

you never see politicians transition to say malcolm x. why is that? maybe because malcolm x didn't talk like a sharecropper. this show has taken a position in favor of color-blind equality, and against racism. >> there are -- jen, there are people, again, people that i have read who, i think, make very important points on different issues who are actually going out defending him, saying, well, andrew sullivan, tucker represented a deepening suspicion of corporate and government authority. barry weiss says you can't deny how important tucker was and is.

nelly and i watched his monologues and not quite nightly but the next day on youtube. what else did she say? he was one of the only people on tv that made viewers aware of the new military industrial complex, the alliance between big tech and the government. you know what? i can name about five other people -- i want you to play that clip again and play the clip, because i want these people defending tucker carlson, i want them to see once again what they are defending. play the clip. >> white supremacy, that's the problem. this is a hoax. there's no evidence that white supremacists were responsibility for what happened on january 6th. that's a lie. we have a moral obligation to --

demographics. remember the great replacement theory was a conspiracy theory, and it seems like a statistical fact. congresswoman, can a single human being -- she dated montel williams. just for masochistic reasons, can you do it one more time? it might be time for joe biden to let us know what ketanji brown jackson's lact score was. they think you should be elevated in america based on the choices, because that's row wanda. very few unarmed black men are killed by white cops these days. where is george floyd when you need him. the only job training this administration is gotten behind

in 2 1/2 years is getting black people to sell more weed in the cities. you never see politicians transition to see malcolm x. why is that? this show, more than any other show on television has taken an aggressive position in favor of color-blind equality and against racism. i have no words, not only for what we saw there, but also by people who are going out there and going, yeah, but at least he wasn't woke. we're going -- we're going to be okay with the most racist rants that i think we have heard on national news in our life times. >> when i saw the headline last night about the text message that supposedly got him fired said, i had a gasp and then an, oh, like, right, of course this

is what was happening behind the scenes. sometimes i can make the mistake of not appreciating how dark things can get in some corners of the right, and what really struck me about that text message, joe, is the casual aside about it's not how white men fight, right? he very easily could have included that in the text message, and it's dishonorable and it's not how white men fight, and that tells you how established it was within the culture that white people were supreme. so it's not -- you see the misogyny and racism that he is airing, and then find behind the scenes it's actually a little darker than even what you saw aired in that two-minute clip. still ahead on "morning joe," with a historic default looming, there's a backup plan,

but is it realistic. also this morning, what florida is saying about ron desantis and that ongoing fight with disney. he's still at it. thousands of film and tv writers planning to picket again today after contract negotiations failed this week. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. k. . (other money manager) different how? aren't we all just looking for the hottest stocks? (fisher investments) nope. we use diversified strategies to position our client's portfolios for their long-term goals. (other money manager) but you still sell investments that generate high commissions for you, right? (fisher investments) no, we don't sell commission products. we're a fiduciary, obligated to act in our client's best interest. (other money manager) so when do you make more money, only when your clients make more money? (fisher investments) yep. we do better when our clients do better. at fisher investments, we're clearly different. - i'm fernando, i live outside of boston. i've been with consumer cellular for five years. consumer cellular gives you all the same features

that these big companies give you. what you get for the cost is remarkable. why would you pay more money?! - [announcer] why would you pay more when you can get unlimited talk & text with a flexible data plan starting at just $20 a month. - i think they should raise their prices! (laughs) - [announcer] sorry fernando! our prices are staying low. so switch today and save! call or go online.

there's a different way to treat hiv. it's every-other-month, injectable cabenuva. for adults who are undetectable, cabenuva is the only complete, long-acting hiv treatment you can get every other month. cabenuva helps keep me undetectable. it's two injections, given by my healthcare provider, every other month. it's one less thing to think about while traveling. hiv pills aren't on my mind. a quick change in my plans is no big deal. don't receive cabenuva if you're allergic to its ingredients or taking certain medicines, which may interact with cabenuva. serious side effects include allergic reactions post-injection reactions, liver problems, and depression. if you have a rash and other allergic reaction symptoms, stop cabenuva and get medical help right away. tell your doctor if you have liver problems or mental health concerns, and if you are pregnant, breastfeeding, or considering pregnancy. some of the most common side effects include injection-site reactions, fever, and tiredness. if you switch to cabenuva,

attend all treatment appointments. every other month, and i'm good to go. ask your doctor about every-other-month cabenuva. i'm the sizzle in this promposal. and while romeo over here is trying to look cool, things are about to heat up. darn it, kyle! and if you don't have the right home insurance coverage, you could end up paying for this yourself. so get allstate. millions have made the switch from the big three you could end up paying for this yourself. to the best kept secret in wireless: xfinity mobile. that means millions are saving hundreds a year with the fastest mobile service. and now, get the best price for two lines of unlimited. just $30 per line. there are millions of happy campers out there. and this is the perfect time to join them... save hundreds a year over t-mobile, at&t and verizon. and get the best price for 2 lines of unlimted. visit xfinitymobile.com today. and this is ready any questions? -yeah, i got one. how about the best network imaginable? let's invent that.

that's what we do here. quick survey. who wants the internet to work, pretty much everywhere. and it needs to smooth, like super, super, super, super smooth. hey, should you be drinking that? -it's decaf. because we're busy women. we don't have time for lag or buffering. who doesn't want internet that helps a.i. do your homework even faster. come again. -sorry, what was that? introducing the next generation 10g network only from xfinity. the future starts now. >> lebron finishing the alley-oop there to pad the lead over the warriors. in the beginning of the fourth quarter, anthony davis leading l.a. with a game high of 30 points and 23 rebounds in the highly anticipated opener of the second round. golden state used a 14-0 run to tie the game with less than two minutes to play but the warriors

held on to win on the road, 117-112. the teams will stay in san francisco for game two tomorrow night. huge win for lebron and the lakers last night. and then the knicks rebounded from sunday's loss and had to have this one at home. 111-105 win. game three is on saturday. meanwhile, 76ers center joel embiid is the nba's most valuable player. embiid finally claiming the honor after finishing the last two seasons as runner up. it comes as embiid is battled a right knee injury. it's unclear if he will be back on the court for game two against the celtics tonight, but very unlikely. how are you feeling as a celtics fan? embiid will probably not play

because they got what they needed and stole game one. >> yeah, the celtics fell apart down the stretch and were sloppy in game one, and i feel like there was a hangover from the bruins collapse the night before in that same building. as far as the lakers go, that's a huge win on the road. the warriors had a little gas, and lebron didn't even have to do that much. i feel about the lakers as i feel about the yankees, so not happy about it at all. >> the ability of these guys to turn it on the in the playoffs, and not much going on in the regular season, and seventh or eighth in the west, and now on the fast track in the finals. >> yeah, i am more of an nfl fan than a nba fan, and -- yeah, go

giants. sometimes in the regular season, the game doesn't feel like they are operating at their full potential. low energy. >> yeah. excellent nfl coverage, by the way. >> thanks. >> way to break it down. >> yeah, one of the better capers i have pulled off, the "morning joe" nfl draft analyst. >> yeah, i saw jen on our guest list from kansas city, and i thought is there a political event? no, she's covering the draft for us. you crushed it. >> is it not astounding, and the nfl has always been huge, always been huge in my life, and for christmas i would get nfl sheets with all the teams and an nfl bulletin board, everything. it has always been big. i guess, you know, about five or six years ago you started

hearing people saying i will not follow the nfl anymore after the george floyd protests and the kaepernick stuff, and now years later the ratings are bigger than ever. i have been out of it so much as far as the nfl, i will watch playoff games. you know, being from the south i am a college football and basketball fan, and willie, he loves the nfl. we watch the red zone, and we are huge lions fans, and the lions last year were absolutely crazy. there are others that say, usually, you and i, we all remember whenever you would see the nfl draft, and i thought, you know, i thought they were going to be, like, they would usually run out of warehouse in new york, and there would be a

couple drunk guys in t-shirts holding signs. that's what i thought it was going to be like, and they do this sweeping shot in kansas city, and they had half the -- they had half the population of kansas city, like, size wise, there along with jen watching the draft. there just never has been a sport more popular in the united states. it's extraordinary how big the nfl has gotten. >> it is, jen. to see it up close, and we were talking about nashville a view years ago -- >> yeah, nashville was the first time they took it outside of new york. >> yeah, there were thousands of people with the drone shots, like woodstock, and some 20-year-old kid from city, and it's, like, yeah. >> people are -- it's the whole

weekend filled with possibility, right? all the fans walk away happy, and everybody got a prize, and maybe it was not the prize you wanted but everybody gets a prize and nobody loses. speaking of the lions, it's in detroit next year, joe. >> road show. road show. >> i'm's just sayin'. >> yeah, election year. swing state. >> good call. >> could we get the iso of jen up for a second. could you swing the camera left, so we could get barnicle -- >> he just keeps lurking. you can see his head. >> there he is. >> step back out? >> there he is. there we go, mike. yeah, by the way, red sox won again last night, sorry, grandpa. they may be pretty good this year. who on the panel knows about the lions this past year? anybody following the lions? >> we could talk lions. >> they drafted a alabama

running back, joe. >> they get knocked for that and then drafted a great defensive back from alabama. that team -- they were -- for us, they were the most exciting team in the nfl last year. they started at 1-6. jack and i kept saying this is the best 1-6 team we have ever seen in our life. explosive offense. like, and the lions fans, they are like us falcon fans, right? you have to take the scraps they throw you, right? but last year, this team was exciting. motor city madness, baby. do they still play in the pontiac dome? >> no, they play at ford field. >> the lions, joe, they were -- great offense and finished strong. they had been knocked out of the

playoffs already and still beat the packers to keep the packers from the playoffs and that was a statement win building for next year, and with aaron rodgers gone, the lions are the favorites. the question on draft day was if they would take a quarterback, and they dependant. who was good last year, and questions remain about goff. >> he was good. he was solid. he's that build a good team around him, and with the apologies to jim, willie geist, the detroit lions did not beat the green bay packers last season, they punched them in the mouth and ran over them at lambeau field when they wanted to get in the playoffs. it's a team with a lot of spirit and a lot of fight. the "new york post" is the official "morning joe" newspaper. i think we may need to make the lions -- what do they have? any -- >> oh, the met gala was woke or

something. yeah, the met gala was woke. i don't know. >> this is why they are who they are. the official paper of record of "morning joe." >> that's amazing. >> we may have to have a vote, and everybody loves the giants, but maybe we make the lions of official honorary team of morning joe. >> i am smiling because people ask how do you prepare for "morning joe," it's four hours, and some days you can't and you are ready with the news, and then you talk about the offseason moves of the detroit lions -- >> in may. in may. >> willie, and wearing golden robes in turkish prisons on your birthday, and jen coming and walking me home and quoting

hemingway saying we are stronger in the broken places. how do you prepare for that, willie? >> coming up, my red sox friends are excited about this segment. the inside story of the greatest baseball team ever. jack curry joins us with his new book on the 1998 yankees and to talk about this season as well. "morning joe" is coming right back. what are folks 60 and older up to these days? getting inspired! volunteering! playing pickleba...! first, there's an idea and you do something about it

for the first time with godaddy. then before you know it, (it is a life changer...) you make your first sale. small business first. never stopped coming. (we did it!) and you have a partner that always puts you first way. (no way!) start today at godaddy.com. for copd, ask your doctor about breztri. breztri gives you better breathing, symptom improvement, and helps prevent flare-ups. breztri won't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. it is not for asthma. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. don't take breztri more than prescribed. breztri may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vison changes, or eye pain occur. if you have copd ask your doctor about breztri. - booked our trip to vegas! vison changes, or eye pain occur. - in this economy? what, are we rich?! ♪ ♪ are we rich? we could get a personal chef! i heard about this guy on the news that, that serves a very rare species of fish. highly illegal.

he's wanted by interpol. we could have his scary fish whenever we want! - we're not rich... i used kayak to compare hundreds of travel sites to get a great deal on our flight, car, and hotel. - oh. - kayak. search one and done. somedays, i cover up because of my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now i feel free to bare my skin, thanks to skyrizi. ♪(uplifting music)♪ ♪nothing is everything♪ i'm celebrating my clearer skin... my way. with skyrizi, 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. in another study, most people had 90% clearer skin, even at 5 years. and skyrizi is just 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine, or plan to. thanks to clearer skin with skyrizi - this is my moment.

there's nothing on my skin and that means everything! ♪nothing is everything♪ now's the time. ask your doctor about skyrizi, the #1 dermatologist-prescribed biologic in psoriasis. learn how abbvie could help you save. ♪ ♪ ♪ cargurus. shop.buy.sell.online.

>> how can i help you, young man? >> i got a hundred dollar check from my grandma, my dad said i need to put it into the bank so it can grow over the years. >> that's fantastic. a smart decision, young man. we can put that cheek into a money market mutual fund, and

reinvest it into foreign currency with compounding interest and it's gone. >> oh, what? >> it's gone. it's all gone. >> what's all gone? >> the money in your account. it didn't do too well. it's gone. >> what do you mean? i have $100. >> not anymore, you don't. poof. >> that's a "south park" clip that's gone viral. it's their tank on the banking industry. we'll talk about this week's failure, something not funny, first republic and the latest on the debt ceiling when andrew ross sorkin joins us with business before the bell telling us who his favorite "south park" character is. "morning joe" back in a moment. t

(man) what if my type 2 diabetes takes over? (woman) what if all i do isn't enough? or what if i can do diabetes differently? (avo) now you can with once-weekly mounjaro. mounjaro helps your body regulate blood sugar, and mounjaro can help decrease how much food you eat.

3 out of 4 people reached an a1c of less than 7%. plus people taking mounjaro lost up to 25 pounds. mounjaro is not for people with type 1 diabetes or children. don't take mounjaro, if you're allergic to it, you or your family have medullary thyroid cancer, or multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. stop mounjaro, and call your doctor right away, if you have an allergic reaction, a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, vision changes, or diabetic retinopathy. serious side effects may include pancreatitis and gallbladder problems. taking mounjaro with sulfonylurea or insulin raises low blood sugar risk. tell your doctor if you're nursing, pregnant, or plan to be. side effects include nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea which can cause dehydration and may worsen kidney problems. (woman) i can do diabetes differently with mounjaro. (avo) ask your doctor about once-weekly mounjaro.

whoa. okay. easy does it. we switched to liberty mutual and saved $652. they customize your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need.

with the money we saved, we thought we'd try electric unicycles. whoa! careful, babe! saving was definitely easier. hey babe, i think i got it! it's actually... whooooa! ok, show-off! help! oh! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

. look at that. the sun is up in los angeles just before 6:00 in the morning, just before 9:00 in new york city. more than 11,000 writers officially walked off the job yesterday when talks with the organization that represents major studios failed and the impact is already being felt. >> reporter: outside warner brothers, paramount, sony, netflix and the other hollywood studios, and on the streets of manhattan, striking writers united behind a single message. >> fair pay. fair compensation for our creative work. >> reporter: stars like rob lowe, whose son is a writer, standing up in solidarity. >> we're only as good as the writing we get. >> reporter: overnight the late-night talk shows went into reruns. hosts like steven colbert standing behind the writers. "snl" canceling pete davidson's

hosting debut. soap operas will likely follow. and if the strike carries on, there could be an impact on fall shows. writers like mazie saying they're striking so young writers can make a living doing what they love. >> i believe this is a fight for the future viability of writing even being a career. >> the way streaming companies pay their talent is very much different than the way the old school television companies paid. the writers have sort of been left behind in their words on the streaming revolution. >> they want to turn us into gig workers. they want to remove all of the gains that our union has fought for decades. >> reporter: the alliance of motion picture and television producers representing studios including comcast, which owns nbcuniversal, says its proposal includes generous increases in compensation writing the primary sticking points are mandatory staffing and duration of

employment for writers. what would hollywood be without writers like you. ? >> you're about to find out because we're not working. we've withdrawn our labor and we will not be working until we get a fair deal that we deserve. >> a lot of our favorite shows are dark. "snl" was supposed to have pete davidson this week, but that's put on hold. musician ed sheeran took the stand this week to defend one of his hit songs in a copyright lawsuit. ♪♪ >> reporter: english singer/songwriter ed sheeran finding himself in a rare and unwanted spotlight. a potentially damaging copyright lawsuit involving his song

"thinking out loud." >> what do you want to say to fans supporting you right now? >> thank you. >> reporter: he is accused of copying part of the melody from marvin gaye's song "let's get it on" something he denies. the family is represented by benjamin crump who says the two songs have striking similarities. the suit alleging sheeran stole this part of the 1973 hit. ♪♪ ♪ i've been really trying baby ♪ the jury will be asked to compare that to the melody of sheeran's chart topper. ♪ darling i will be loving you until we're 17 ♪ >> reporter: no cameras allowed at the trial but testimony at times has been heated. the singer saying his music career slow down if he's found libel, selling the court if that

happens, i'm done. to have someone come in and say we don't believe you, you must have stole it, i find insulting. sheeran took his guitar on the stand saying the inspiration for the song was van morrison, not marvin gaye. ♪♪ sheeran responding if he had actually stolen that melody he would be an idiot to perform it in front of a crowd of 20,000 people. >> this is something when he moved from his song into the marvin gaye song, he does that a lot with a lot of songs. ed sheeran does that at his concerts. you're a musician, what's your

read on all this? just listening to it, it's close, is there enough there for the lawsuit to hold here? >> not even close. this is one of the most outrageous things i've heard. i can't believe the judge has even allowed this to get to a jury. anybody that -- anybody that writes songs -- let me tell you something, i've written 400 songs, willie, none of them good, but i know chord structure, i've been studying chord structure since i was in front of a piano at 5 years old. without getting two in-depth, 1, 4, 5 chord structure is the basis of every rock song, every pop song we know. everything is built around that. that's, in effect, what this is. it's 1, 1 going up to the third with the bass note, 4, 5. it's -- this is the most basic

thing. it would be like a guy building a ranch house and then suing everybody else for stealing his idsch houses were built across america in the 1950s and 1960s. there's some songs that are obvious. like "my sweet lord." we all love george harrison. he didn't mean to, but he ripped off "he's so fine." john lennon ripped off a chuck berry song with "come together." sometimes you're playing it, you accidentally do it and it filters over. this is so basic. let's forget about ed sheeran for a second. this would completely -- this would completely open up a flood of lawsuits on people that have the most chord structures getting dragged into court by

families of the '50s, '60s, '70s. i don't know if people know this, pop music, rock 'n roll, r&b, it's not tchaikovsky, it's not beethoven. part of the greatness of it is the commonalty, the 1, 4, 5 chord. i don't -- i don't mean to go on and on about this, but this is outrageous. i could find -- i could find a hundred songs with this chord structure. i've got to say also, willie, you got -- you go on to instagram or you go on to tiktok, what do you see? you see people doing exactly what ed sheeran does, right? they'll take a song and it may be "sweet home alabama" that has the same chord structure as a hip-hop song and you merge the two together. you go i never thought those two songs could go together.

when we played live, we would always do, like -- our college band would do, you know, "louis louis" to "the joker" then an '80s song with the three chord structure to a '90s song. it was always seamless. yeah, it's called rock 'n roll. three chords and a prayer. this is a really, really dangerous lawsuit. again, i'm shocked that the judge even let this get past summary judgment. >> joe, to your point, there's an op-ed in the "washington post" posted yesterday by a musician, the headline is the ed sheeran lawsuit is a threat to western civilization. no, really. she makes the point you make saying it would be like telling a painter she could no longer use red. just something foundational, something fundamental to the

process. we'll see how this plays out. it does appear that ed sheeran that the argument and history of music on his side here. we'll see. weroop of the hour with breaking news. russian authorities are accusing ukraine of attempting to attack the kremlin overnight with a pair of drones. russian officials labeled the alleged attempt as a "terrorist act" saying the russian military and security forces disabled the drones before they could strike. the kremlin added president vladimir putin is safe and continuing to work with his schedule unchanged. we should note there is no verified evidence that the attack provided to us or anyone else by russian officials. according to reuters, a senior ukrainian presidential official says kyiv has nothing to do with the purported incident. let's bring in richard engel. good morning. what more do we know about this? >> so, we don't know very much about the video, the origin of

this video. the course is still somewhat mysterious. according to the kremlin, this incident took place last night. it is now 4:00 in the afternoon in moscow. so, this video has been circulating for several hours on russian social media. but just in the last few hours, just the last few minutes, the kremlin is starting to take this seriously putting out more videos, putting out statements, and, as you said, calling this as an assassination attempt effectively against russian president vladimir putin. i have a statement here from the presidential press service in moscow, it says last night the kyiv regime attempted to strike the kremlin residence of the president of the russian federation with unmanned aerial vehicles. two unmanned aerial vehicles were aimed at the kremlin. as a result of timely actions taken by the military and special services with the use of radar warfare systems, the devices were disabled.

it goes on to say we guard these actions as a planned terrorist action and an attempt on the president. it concludes by saying the russian side reserves the right to take retaliatory measures where and when it sees fit. that is perhaps the most troubling part of this statement. will russia use this incident, this alleged attack by kyiv, which kyiv denies, to take some sort of attack of its own, perhaps even another attack on a presidential site or on zelenskyy himself? zelenskyy is not in kyiv right now. he's in finland. as you said, kyiv not only denied this alleged attack, it said it had nothing to do with it and went further by saying that it would be counterproductive. that attacking the kremlin achieves nothing and that it could provoke a radical response from russia. so, this video is out there. the russians are making a big deal of it. they're putting out these statements.

kyiv is denying it. we'll see where it goes from here. >> you just said and we've been saying since this news broke, all of this information is coming from the russian government, from russian state media. take that for what it's worth. we know they like their propaganda. supposed it were ukraine trying to do this, how difficult would it be to get two drones to the kremlin and potentially how unwise it might be given the warnings from russia and also from allies, the united states warning ukraine not to attack within the boundaries of russia. >> it would be impossible to fly a drone of this size all the way from ukraine to the kremlin. if you look at the video, again, unverified video, and in these days of ai and other -- you can create video. you have to be cautious. what appears to be a drone in that video is quite small, more of a hobbyist style drone that

is flying towards the dome of the kremlin and then explodes for some reason. apparently, according to sources on russian social media, it was taken by people in the area, but it is not common. i've spent time around the kremlin to have their cameras trained on the dome of the kremlin at the exact same moment that a suspicious aircraft is flying towards it. it's not easy to fly drones in the area. the entire area around the kremlin is geo blocked. if you try to use google maps or order an uber, it doesn't work. if you walk a few blocks away, your phone will work. i remember last time i was near the kremlin, i tried to pull up a map, it showed me somewhere in the middle of the black sea. there is a strong electronic presence there and systems to prevent this exact kind of

thing. now, drones -- geolocation services can be disabled, but you would need to be fairly skilled to be able to do that. you couldn't fly a small drone like that from kyiv or anywhere in ukraine. >> richard, joe here, this does -- none of this adds up, especially if you look at it from the ukrainian side. can you talk about how the ukrainians have known from the start that so much of their success depends on support from the west, support from europe, support from the united states and those allies have made it clear that they will fight to defend ukraine but they draw the line at ukraine escalating this into a third world war. could you explain how this would be counterproductive and just plain foolish because they would

risk cutting off the supplies of war material that are helping them exist right now. >> would be beyond foolish. it would be counterproductive and it would infur yat the white house and allies of kyiv who have been spending a lot of political capital and real capital to help ukrainians fight this war and keep the russians from taking over the country. the united states made it clear it would not support an attack like this, an attack that would frankly have no chance of success. a small drone like that fired against the roof of the kremlin, how that is possibly an assassination attempt, unless vladimir putin happened to be standing on the roof at the time with a tiny drone, there's no way that this would ever have any chance of success. so, if kyiv were to have done this, an attack that would be

provocative and alienate allies and have no chance of success, it seems that they would have no benefit of even carrying it out. that's if it were carried out by kyiv. if it is real -- and we don't know the authenticity of this video, if it is authentic, it could have been done by the russians or kyiv supporters in russia. hard to know. until we know more about the authenticity of the video. >> appropriate skepticism this morning. nbc's richard engel, we'll be back to you as more information comes to us. thank you. jonathan lemire, anything from the white house? >> not yet. they're formulating a response. it's not clear if the president will weigh in. russia has a history of false flag operations, including some in this war. it could be an excuse to try to escalate. the ukrainians have struck

within russia's borders before. ammunition dumps have been exploded, and whether or not the government takes responsibility is the difficult thing or if it's a rogue group on its own. the fear here, whether it's real -- whether the ukrainians did this or a false flag, does putin either way use it as an excuse to escalate the conflict? >> it would be hard to escalate the conflict right now given the fact they have gone out of their way to destroy most of the country of ukraine. >> richard, great reporting there. it would be impossible to launch this drone attack from ukraine. that's the first thing. secondly, it would be impossible for somebody to be flying drones

around the kremlin as he said just because of all the signals that are scrambled, all the blocking and also all the protection there. third, we're left to believe that somebody was sitting there thinking i'll just get my camera out and take video of the kremlin and it's fixed there when this little drone, again, a local drone hits the top of the kremlin. again, it makes -- the more we get into it, the more details we get, the more reporting we get, the more unlikely it is that ukraine had anything to do with this. >> let's bring into the conversation chief white house correspondent for the "new york times," peter baker, former u.s. senator and nbc news political analyst, claire mccaskill as well. good morning to you both. claire, let me start with you. put on your hat as a united states senator and what you hear

in the reporting we've seen out of this. it seems, according to a lot of people, a lot of experts are saying if they were going to make a run at vladimir putin, if the ukrainians were, and that would be a dramatic escalation, which would completely change this war, this is not the way they would do it with a small backyard drone at the kremlin. >> well, if i was still a united states senator i would be anxious to get the readout from the pentagon today. the pentagon will have much more solid information than we have at this point. this is so ham-handed of putin. he's so desperate to try to make russia believe that somehow he has some validity in this despotic, thuggish attack that he did on a nation. on its face, it looks silly. it just looked stupid. there's no way that zelenskyy and ukraine would ever do

something like this because it is dumb. i think we can all agree on one thing, one thing ukraine has shown since the beginning of this conflict is they're not dumb. they have fought in a way that was unexpected. they have been tenacious. they have been strong. the idea that anyone would believe at this point in time that they would figure out a way to fly a baby drone near the roof of the kremlin so that some of it -- so putin would have this bs to say to the people of the world, it's creel really beyond credulity. >> ukraine would lose support from the west if they did do it, they are not going to do it, and this assassination attempt by whomever launched this would have only worked if putin were

standing on top of the kremlin roof at the time this little baby drone hit the kremlin roof. again, it all looks very -- there is interesting timing, though, peter baker. interesting timing because first of all, reports of leaked documents show putin and the kremlin are preparing their propagandists to start downplaying russia's ability to start pushing back on the ukrainian counter offensive, lowering expectations, and a day or so after speaker kevin mccarthy, his republican house was seen as the last hope for russia to push back against u.s. aid against ukrainians, gave about as strong and forceful condemnation of russia as any public leader we've seen. this is vladimir putin increasingly cornered by, you know -- they're left actually

having sergey lavrov condemn fox news for firing tucker carlson and then posting hoaxes about baby drones hitting the kremlin. >> yeah. let's remember, i was a moscow correspondent back in the early days of putin. he has an iron-fist control over this country but that doesn't mean he doesn't have domestic politics. the domestic politics for him is to keep outrage at the ukrainians and to keep justifying the war. they have not had battlefield successes that they can point to. they like to look for reasons to claim the ukrainians are doing something outrageous in order to justify sending people into the meat grinder there. remember a couple things, in terms of the targeting of this building, anybody who spends any time in moscow knows that putin doesn't spend much time in the kremlin. this would not have been a

serious assassination attempt if that's the idea. that's not where he is. at most it could have been a symbolic strike. the idea of hitting symbolic center of russian power, that would be one thing. but putin -- not never, but very often is not in the kremlin himself. remember, too, that the whole idea of targeting foreign leaders during a war, it's fraught, but it's not unusual. the russians were targeting zelenskyy from the beginning of this war. they wanted to take him out. their plan was to decapitate the ukrainian government, take out zelenskyy either by force or kidnapping or what have you in order to install their own leadership in kyiv. the united states did the same thing at the beginning of the iraq war in 2003, the very first strike in that invasion was at a building that they thought that saddam hussein was at. the idea of targeting a leader during war time is not unheard of. it's not the kind of thing that the u.s. wants ukrainians to do. leaked documents show there's a

desire on the part of kyiv to strike moscow on the anniversary of the invasion. in february, the americans talked them out of it. >> we'll stay on top of this story over the next hour or so, and get our own confirmation of just what is russian state information being presented here. breaking news out of serbia. police say a seventh grade student opened fire today in the capital of belgrade killing eight children and a security guard before being arrested in the schoolyard. most students were able to three through a back door as the gunman opened fire. police say the shooter used his father's handgun in a shooting that is extremely rare in europe but did visit serbia today. in the u.s., the multi-day manhunt for the suspect accused of killing five neighbors including a child is finally over.

authorities say they caught him about 15 miles from the crime scene after someone called in a tip to the fbi. sam brock has the latest. >> reporter: a man described as a monster is behind bars this morning, captured in cut and shoot, texas. >> he was caught hiding in a closet underneath some laundry. >> reporter: this video appears to show the moment francisco oropesa was taken into custody. >> we want to thank the person who had the courage and bravery to call in the suspect's location. >> reporter: oropesa is accused of the execution-style killing of five of his neighbors, victims ranging in age from 31 to just 9 years old. authorities say oropesa became enraged and opened fire after the neighbors asked him to stop firing his assault rifle in the front yard. the arrest comes as new details emerge about a man deported from

the u.s. four times. the sheriff in san jacinto said oropesa beat his wife last june, but she ultimately did not press charges. >> there were multiple calls of police being called to that home because of a firearm being used. >> we filed charges on him in 2022, and to the best of my knowledge, they -- we got a warrant for him. the constable went to serve him in another county because he left here and never could make contact with the subject. >> reporter: the victim's families overwhelmed by grief. jesse castilla remembering her sister, diana.

saying her sister was just starting to live her life. >> that is nbc's sam brock. just devastating report. after the deadly mass shooting in nashville in march, front man for old crow medicine show wrote an op-ed saying country music can lead america out of its obsession with guns. it reads in part, they say we love our guns down south, and it's true. they're part of the pageantry of our beloved southland. country music plays a central role in forming the south's gun mythology. when shots rang out inside nashville's covenant school and three adults and three children were murdered, the tragedy exposed the deep hypocrisy of musical genre at one so beholden to christian principles. what the south needs now is an anti-assault weapons movement

driven by forces from the center. by interfaith denomination leaders, by students and by country singers who are tired of bending to the whims of fear mongerers and who are ready to speak from their platforms to an impressionable audience. it's time for country music makers to use their platforms to speak candidly to their conservative audience. let's bring in kurt bardella, political adviser and creator and publisher of the country music media platform, the music hangover. kurt, we had sheryl crow on who lives in nashville and tied into the community. she was willing to talk about the gun violence, the madness of a gun culture that is now embraced by only -- if you look at the poll numbers, embraced by a small segment of americans. 90% of americans want universal

background checks. 75% of americans want red flag laws. majority of americans want the bans of military-style weapons. yet, there is -- i know, it's kind of like republicans will say one thing about trump off camera and another thing on camera. same thing with a lot of people in country music. they hate the violence. they hate the extremism but they're scared to speak out. >> yeah. you know, it's interesting, joe, because we've had now really two major gun incidents that have hit the core of the country music community. the route 91 shooting, the largest mass shooting in united states history at the concert in vegas while jason aldean was on stage and this most recent terrible school shooting at the covenant christian school. i think this really has started to change how some artists are

looking at it. we saw kelsa ballerini speaking out saying something needs to happen here, dedicating part of her appearance to the victims of the covenant school. a letter was just sent recently to governor bill lee that was signed by a number of country music artists, marin morris, kelsea ballerini, jason musgrave and others calling for legislating some form of gun control. it was important because in that letter they talk about how a lot of these people are gun owners, they believe in the second amendment, the right to bear arms and they believe in commonsense reforms to keep our children safe. when we think of christianity, it would be immoral not to do

something about gun reform at a christian school. what more do people need to see before they realize this is a problem that needs to be legislated. thoughts and prayers are not enough. you actually have to state action. as this debate goes forward, we'll see more country music artists speak out, i think. >> we've reached out to ketch, we want to get him on tomorrow to talk about this. kurt, maybe you can come back and talk and continue this conversation. claire, there's a real need for people not just in country music but across the south to speak out. this is not happening in marxist halls. you know, it's like young marxist meetings of greater manhattan. this is happening at country music festivals in nashville where people are just shot like fish in a barrel from some guy

up 20, 30 stories high. you have people in christian churches in texas getting gunned down and still living with the horrors of that massacre. you have, of course, this christian school in nashville. so, it's not just the others, which a lot of times republicans, if they can just say this is a problem that's impacting the others, we don't have to worry about it. it's not the others. it's a christian school in nashville. it's a country music festival in vegas. it's a christian church in texas. day in and day out these crises happen to everybody. so, shouldn't -- shouldn't they get engaged? >> well, to state the obvious here, i think the most influential people around gun culture in the south are not politicians. they are, in fact, evangelical

ministers and country western stars. that would be the most important place for people to begin to speak truth to this fetish we have with military-style weapons in america. all the evangelical ministers have the opportunity and country music stars have the opportunity. what's holding them back? money. they're afraid they won't get the support from their congregations and the support of their fans if they speak out. kurt, i'm curious, can you speak to that? can you speak to what happened to the dixie chicks when they just had the nerve to criticize george bush on stage and why is it that the country western genre is so afraid of stating the obvious right now about these weapons that are slaughtering children? >> it's interesting that you bring up what happened with the artists now known as the chicks. i think that plays a lot into

the fear that artists feel now. everyone saw what happened when the chicks spoke out about the war in iraq, even though they were right, by the way, they were ostracized by the entire community. country radio stopped playing them. it's one of the things that people associate with country music and political activism. one thing that encourages me is the times have changed. a lot more artists, especially younger artists like the kacey musgraves, marin morris', taylor hubbards are speaking out. eric church, one of the largest successful country artists in this format spoke out about the nra. while he may have caught some flack on social media, he's still selling tickets, putting butts in seats and is successful. so we've seen tangible examples of artists speaking their conscience and not suffering commercial consequences.

we need to see more of that. >> kurt, again, look at the numbers. background checks. 90% of americans support it. overwhelming majority of republicans support it. overwhelming majority of gun owners support it. same thing with red flag laws. who will freak out? you know, gun manufacturers and their lobbyists. outside of that, i mean, peter -- peter baker, you look at the numbers, the numbers are on the side of reform but such a wide gap between what 90% of americans want to do and what the people in that building behind you are willing to do. >> the political system is deadlocked, stalemated on this. the president can call for an assault rifle ban all he likes, but nothing will move on capitol hill and he's not taking any action to do anything about it because he knows that won't happen. you wonder can it be different if there's movement from the grassroots, from the community, from people like the country music stars or from the churches

that -- churches that are in communities that have been affected, targeted and victimized by the plague of gun violence. i think the only thing that will change things in the building behind me is if things change out in the country. if the constituencies do something to change the dynamics that make it politically palatable to oppose things that do have the support of 80% or 90% of the public. >> peter baker, kurt bardella, great conversation. still ahead, the federal reserve poised to race interest rates for the tenth time since march of last year. andrew ross sorkin joins us ahead of today's expected announcement. and we'll go live to orlando to hear what florida voters are saying about the fight between governor ron desantis and the walt disney company. you're watching "morning joe." r"

reaching for the bar, just to reach for pads. waiting for the sunset, just to wait for the stall. discover gemtesa. a once-a-day pill proven to reduce all 3 key symptoms of oab: leakage episodes, urgency and frequency in adults. do not take if you have a known allergic reaction to gemtesa or its ingredients. tell your doctor right away if you're unable to empty your bladder or if you have a weak urine stream. tell your doctor if you're taking medicines that contain digoxin or if you have liver or kidney problems. side effects may include headache, common cold symptoms, diarrhea, nausea, urinary tract and upper respiratory tract infection. ask your doctor about gemtesa. more time here, less time there.

from prom dresses mo to workouts, and new adventures you hope the more you give the less they'll miss. but even if your teen was vaccinated against meningitis in the past they may be missing vaccination for meningitis b. although uncommon, up to 1 in 5 survivors of meningitis will have long term consequences. now as you're thinking about all the vaccines your teen might need make sure you ask your doctor if your teen is missing meningitis b vaccination. when the davises booked their vrbo vacation home, they didn't know about this view. or the 200-year-old tree in the backyard.

or their neighbors down the hill. but one thing they did know is exactly how much they'd pay. because vrbo is different. you see the total price up front. of course, it's good to leave room for some surprises. boo! ♪

6:37 in the morning in seattle. as you wake up out west. 9:37 in new york. dramatic dash cam footage out fairfax county, virginia shows a car colliding into a stopped car and a police officer. gosh. this is a 17-year-old driver. you can see the officer hops up, he's okay, thank goodness. out of control, traveling well over 120 miles per hour was that teenage driver. both the driver of the stopped car and the officer suffered only minor injuries. thank goodness for that. as well as the teenager. he's okay, too. he's been charged with reckless driving. the federal reserve expected to raise interest rates again. jay powell likely going to make that announcement today. this comes two days after first republic balance collapsed

causing jpmorgan chase to buy most of its assets. let's bring in the co-anchor of cnbc's "squawk box," andrew ross sorkin. so a quarter debate point here? >> we got the adp employment payrolls which is reflective of how strong the employment picture is in the united states ahead of what we'll hear on friday from the federal government, but the expectation was that we had gained 142,000 jobs. guess what? we gained 296,000 jobs, which is both fabulous news and always so weird when i try to explain it this way, willie. it's great news in so many ways that we're getting 296,000 new jobs. you would think that's a great thing. but if you're the federal reserve and thinking about inflation, you say to yourself, well, in a strange and perverse

way, that's a problem because it means that inflation is going to continue to persist. it means the economy is so strong and what they're trying to do is slow it down with this super blunt instrument. the real question is does the federal reserve's ability to raise interest rates, is that having any effect on all of these things? i think there's a reasonable debate to be had about that. in terms of today, 25 basis points. if some people thought it might not be on the table, i think it's on the table. the other piece of it is what he says. what does jay powell say? 25 basis points and we'll halt and pause? 25 basis points and we'll go more? it's all in the nuance and wording. >> we'll see that in a little while here. add to this conversation, john, the debt ceiling fight which seems to be nowhere now. the meeting at the white house six days from now with president biden and congressional leadership to get something done but the clock is ticking. >> clock is ticking and both sides seem dug in right now. neither side giving any

indication that they're willing to give an inch in the talks. clock is ticking. we know there's only about a week left of congress being in session. the president will be traveling overseas. the deadline rapidly approaching. are we seeing jitters there in the markets about what could be coming or do we think that might still be a few weeks away when the deadline gets that much closer? >> it's still a ways away. you don't have people on wall street and in the investment community talking about it, you don't see it in the marketplace in part because so many times we've seen this movie before and i think there's a sense of, you know, this is the boy who cried wolf, invariably it will be 11:59 and 5 seconds and a deal gets done. i think that's still the expectation. whether that should be the expectation is the better question around. this time could be different. >> andrew ross sorkin, thank you very much as always. great to have you here. claire, i want to ask you about where we stand now in the

debt ceiling negotiations. republicans have presented a bill and a tough look at spending cuts over the next decade or so. democrats are still saying, you know what? we'll do nothing. just going to come to the table with nothing but a clean debt ceiling increase that doesn't seem like -- just doesn't seem like that's a winning hand. it seems like they'll be blamed for that. why couldn't they come forward saying, i'll tell you what we'll do, we'll save these programs for the poor, for children, for the truly disadvantaged and we'll do it by finishing -- ending the trump tax cuts? >> well, i think it is -- believe it or not, it's still kind of early in this dance. the big five, that is the republican leader, democratic leader in both houses and the president, they will eventually

hammer this out. mcconnell it trying to say hands off, he doesn't want his candidates next year where he is -- he's licking his lips thinking they can take the senate next year. he doesn't want them in the middle of this. i think it's important to remind people, joe, that we do this differently than i think every other country in the world. there is a decision made in congress to spend money. and then there's a decision in congress whether we will pay for what we have decided to spend. and it is only the republican party under democratic presidents that really plays with fire here. the democrats under trump, they pass the debt ceiling early after trump even admitted it's stupid to try to negotiate around whether or not the country is going to pay its bills. so, ultimately i think that democrats will succeed in isolating the republicans on being willing to do this. here's the question -- unlike any other team when we've always fixed this, mccarthy is leading

the most extreme elements of his party have power. will those extreme elements drive this car off the cliff? i don't know. if they do, that would probably not be good for their party in the elections next year. it will cause a huge commission meltdown. >> the white house is saying we're not playing this game, right, joe? >> yeah. sorry, willie. i think if we get to that point, you have an awful lot of republicans in biden districts, districts that biden won, they'll start hearing from their supporters, financial backers, they'll start hearing from wall street, they'll start hearing from constituents if we really do get to the 11th hour and nothing has happened here. i don't think mccarthy will have a problem getting the 218 that he needs. he won't have to go to the most extreme members on his side because there's quite to be a few republicans that don't want to see the economy crash.

there's still some options, even without the most extreme -- the qanon caucus. >> we'll see if any movement comes out of that meeting. florida lawmakers passed a bill that would shield travel records for top-elected officials including for governor ron desantis. the bill would block the release of records pertaining to trips desantis has already taken. this comes amid questions about who is paying for the governor's recent national and international trips as he readies a run for the presidency. what do floor do governors think about governor desantis' fight with disney? dasha burns is live in orlando. what did they tell you? >> good morning. well, you see mickey mouse over my shoulder here. we're in orlando outside of disney world right now. yesterday we spent the whole day in a county nextdoor, lake county, florida, which is a conservative county. it went for desantis by about

66% in '22. went to trump by 60% in 2020. it also encompasses part of the villages, which, of course, is one of the world's largest retirement communities that famously was very, very trumpian in 2016 and 2020. as we watch folks whiz around on their golf carts trying to make their tee times, we stopped a few people to talk to them about this battle, desantis versus disney. look, we found overwhelming support for desantis in this fight. the vast majority of people feeling like disney stepped out of line when they waded into the political fray that they are getting too "woke" was the word used in a lot of our conversations. one woman we spoke to said she had annual passes to disney world. she did not renew those annual passes because of this political situation. we talked to a father of two young kids who says he doesn't take his kids to disney world.

instead he takes them to other area parks in part because of what he sees as, again, disney stepping out of line here. there were a couple of dissenters who feel like desantis is being petty in this fight. again, we talked to dozens of people, willie, the vast majority were on the governor's side in this battle. take a listen to some of what we heard. >> i'm definitely on desantis' side. go woke, go broke. it's absolutely ridiculous, you know, what they're doing and trying to infiltrate the children. you think about disney, you think about kids. >> i agree with what he's saying. i think he's doing the right thing. >> you think he's doing the right thing? >> i do. i think it needs not to be political from disney's perspective. >> it shows the pettiness of ron desantis and it also shows

hypocrisy. because what he's running on and going around the country and world saying is florida is free. he's made us more free. he hasn't made us more free. i think nothing is more obvious to that than the fact that this is simply because disney, which has the right of freedom of speech said that they supported -- they did not support this so-called don't say gay bill and they were doing it to support their employees and -- we have lots of family members and friends that happen to be gay. >> those first two voters you heard from are conservative voters who voted for trump who support both trump and desantis right now. the last voter you heard from, more independent, not happy with any of her choices at the moment. the other thing we heard from just about everybody who was in support of desantis in this fight is they felt like generally disney had too much power. they were getting special

treatment compared to other businesses in florida. when i asked is there some contradiction here in terms of pro-business governor, a governor trying to make florida a place that's business friendly targeting a business like this, people said, look, disney is just different. disney is a different kind of entity here. so, this fight is a different kind of fight that desantis is picking here. >> as you know, that special district that he objects to, that the governor objects to in the case of disney also enjoyed by the villages where you spoke to some of those voters there. dasha burns, thank you very much. coming up next, he calls it the greatest baseball team ever. i tend to agree. jack curry of the yes network joins us with the inside story of the 1998 new york yankees and to talk about the current state of the a.l. east and much more. jack curry next on "morning joe."

bakery-inspired flavor. learn more at boost.com/tv (music throughout) get the royal treatment. join the millions playing royal match today. download now. (man) what if my type 2 diabetes takes over? (woman) what if all i do isn't enough? or what if i can do diabetes differently? (avo) now you can with once-weekly mounjaro. mounjaro helps your body regulate blood sugar, and mounjaro can help decrease how much food you eat. 3 out of 4 people reached an a1c of less than 7%.

plus people taking mounjaro lost up to 25 pounds. mounjaro is not for people with type 1 diabetes or children. don't take mounjaro, if you're allergic to it, you or your family have medullary thyroid cancer, or multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. stop mounjaro, and call your doctor right away, if you have an allergic reaction, a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, vision changes, or diabetic retinopathy. serious side effects may include pancreatitis and gallbladder problems. taking mounjaro with sulfonylurea or insulin raises low blood sugar risk. tell your doctor if you're nursing, pregnant, or plan to be. side effects include nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea which can cause dehydration and may worsen kidney problems. (woman) i can do diabetes differently with mounjaro. (a y unjaro.

5%, that probability by brennan, 35%. >> fly ball deep right, going back, brennan on the track at the wall, see ya, a home run the other way and the yankees are on the board. >> the indians won. >> that one's driven to right field, did he get enough? he got enough. see ya, a home run for calhoun, and the yankees lead 3-2. >> boy, do we need that. the new york yankees snapped a four-game losing streak last night with a 4-2 win over the cleveland guardians. even with the win, the yanks

still find themselves in unfamiliar territory alone at the bottom of the al east. if history's any indication, there is cause for some hope in the bronx. 25 years ago the yankees started the year with three straight losses. what came next was one of the best seasons in the history of baseball, and the subject of our next guest's new book, joining us now, "new york times" best selling author and yes network analyst jack curry. his new book is titled "the 1998 yankees: the inside story of the greatest team ever" did you hear that, guys? the greatest baseball team ever. >> i thought it was about the '67 red sox. >> i knew it was going to be like this. >> i knew it was coming, but yeah, '98 yankees, 125 wins, led the major league in runs scored. fewest runs american league. best defensive efficiency. when they led after eight innings they were 120-1. i just thought that they rampaged through that season.

when they finally had a blip in the post season game four in the alcs, el due cay steps up, they win their next seven post season games. incredible series. >> the stat that that you just said, they lost one game leading after the eighth inning. what else made this team in '98 so special? >> i think when you just look around the diamond, everyone knew his role. i interviewed virtually every player on this team and i'm going to steal something that david cohen said to me. if you go one through 25, i think it was the best roster constructed ever. their lineup was vicious. i interviewed jason varitek for this book. he was a rookie in 1998. i could sense his frustration as i said to him give me a scouting report on this lineup. he was going back trying to say how do i get these guys out and 25 years later he still didn't have the answer. and also their bench,

strawberry, chili davis, joe girardi, those were some of the guys on the bench. >> we had a perfect game from david wells this season, and kony won 20 games that year. >> i remember that team vivid lit. they crushed everything in front of them, but to me that year, that team, in my mind it's symbolized by guys like scott broshus, just below the headlines, down in the batting order. if you check him out, you know, consistency and character was all there in that club. >> acquired in essentially a salary dump. they traded kenny rogers. he had been a 200 hittersish for oakland. hits eighth and ninth, drives in almost 100 runs, and wins the world series mvp. >> we're focusing on the '98 yankees. i know you want to focus on the 2023 yankees who sit in last place at this moment anyway. >> i'm sitting here going wait a

second, we're listening from jack, from yes like on the greatest team ever? this is like listening to like russian propaganda on the cause of that drone strike, come on, man. >> i was with the "new york times" when this year occurred, i was writing for "the new york times." i have carried over those principles to the yes network and i would advise you to read the book. i bring up a lot of other teams who i think are in the conversation. >> that's what i wanted to ask you about seriously. so this is provocative even for yankees' fans who always go back to the '27 yankees or the 1961 yankees. of course we have claire mccaskill here who would have a good argument to make about the 1967 cardinals when you look at bob gibson, steve carlton, lou brock, orlando se pay da, tim carver, curt flood. that's a hell of a lineup. the big red machine 1975, don't ever go to sleep on them.

i bring up all of those great teams to ask you what separated the 1998 yankees from the '67 cardinals, the '61 yanks, the '27 yankees, the reds. >> when i set out to write this book, the distinction is dominance. you had to dominate your opponent. a lot of those teams you referenced, they did dominate their opponents. i think this team dominated more and i brought up some of the stats and the facts and the reason why. i also think this, they won three rounds of playoffs. it's very difficult to be a champion these days. you've got to get through three rounds of playoffs. let's just look at the modern game. the los angeles dodgers have been the best team in major league baseball across the last decade. they've got one world series, and it came in the shortened 2020 season. why? because you've got to get through the gauntlet. as great as some of those other teams were, they finished the regular season, they had to win one series.

>> the 2023 yankees currently in last place, very early in the season. give us your quick assessment. >> the injuries have been a factor. once you say that you push that to the side because everyone has injuries. they haven't been able to score. their offense has struggled, across the last 19 games, they've scored three runs or fewer in 14 of those games. you can't score, you're not going to win. i think they need to tread water, not let the division get too far away from them. get some of these players back, but also the guys who are here now, they've got to produce offensively. >> so claire mccaskill, we leave the last question to you, greatest team of all time, the gas house gang of 1934, or those 1967 cardinals? >> i think my question is -- listen, i'm going to argue for the '42 cardinals with ino and stan visual. i just think that was the best team because i love the cardinals, but i'm really curious how you differentiated the yankee team from the '39

yankees because i quickly looked up, they had a run differential of 411. that was amazing. that's something. >> you're right, they had the greatest run differential i would say '98 yankees followed by the '27 yankees, followed by the '39 yankees. that's how i ranked them. >> we've reached the end of the four hours. the new book is "the 1998 yankee." thanks so much. say hi to my buddy bob lorenz. >> ana cabrera picks up the coverage right now. ♪♪ it is 10:00 eastern. i'm ana cabrera reporting from new york, and we have two big breaking news stories we are following right now. russia claiming ukraine attempted to target vladimir putin in a drone attack on the