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we have secured the convictions of leaders of both the proud boys and the oath keepers for seditious conspiracy. specifically conspiring to oppose by force the lawful transfer of presidential power. >> guilty, guilty, guilty, guilty. four members of trump's maga army, the proud boys, including leader enrique tarrio, are convicted of seditious conspiracy in the january 6th attack. also tonight, yet another allegedly undisclosed big money gift to justice clarence thomas from the same big money republican ben affecter. what is going on and will there ever be any recourse for this supreme court corruption. plus, my conversation with soon to be 109-year-old viola fletcher, and her 102-year-old brother, hughes van ellis, two of the last remaining survivors of the 1921 tulsa massacre, who

are in town to meet with the justice department. we begin tonight with the breaking news of a partial verdict in the trial of five members of the far right group, the proud boys. for their involvement in the january 6th attack on the u.s. capitol. the jury found four of the defendants, including its former leader and former florida director of latinos for trump enrique tarrio, guilty of the most serious charge, seditious conspiracy. as well as conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding, sorry, to obstruct an official proceeding. reading is fundamental. the seditious conspiracy charge alone comes with a maximum sentence of 20 years in prison. the jury found the fifth member not guilty on the seditious conspiracy charge and was unable to reach a verdict on the conspiracy to obstruct. he is best known for using a police shield to smash in a capitol window, allowing some of the first january 6th rioters to enter the building.

all five were found guilty of the additional charges including obstruction of an official proceeding, conspiracy to prevent an officer from discharging any duties, obstruction of law enforcement, and destruction of government property. u.s. district judge timothy kelly declared a mistrial on several other counts on which the jury could not come to a conclusion. these members of the proud boys are the latest of many insurrectionists found guilty of the high crime of seditious conspiracy. six members of another far right group, the oath keepers, including their founder elmer stewart rhodes were convicted of the same crime across two trials in november and january. in their clousing arguments, attorneys for the proud boys tried to lay the blame for the attack on donald trump, saying it was trump's words, motivation, and anger that causes the insurrection, and that they were being used as a scapegoat for trump and those in power. they reminded the jury it was donald trump who famously told the proud boys to stand back and stand by during the 2020

campaign. and it was donald trump who pushed his supporters to descend on the nation's capitol for what trump claimed was going to be a wild day. it can't be lost that among the more than 1,000 people who the doj has charged in connection with the insurrection so far, that's been a common refrain from witness after witness, coming forward saying they were acting on donald trump's words. and while trump has not yet faced any charges in relation to the attack, and attempts to overturn the 2020 election, even as he's actively running for president again, the special counsel's investigation has been moving aggressively, as we learned last week the granld jury in that investigation heard testimony from former vice president mike pence, a sign too many that the probe could be nearing a conclusion. joining me is michael steele, former rnc chair, msnbc political analyst and host of the michael steele podcast. glenn kirschner, former federal prosecutor, msnbc legal analyst, and host of the justice matters podcast. and cynthia miller idris,

professor at american university and author of hate in the homeland, the new global far right. thank you all for being here. this is a big day, glenn. you have been watching this trial, you have been in the courtroom. hot were the reactions from those as they were convicted? >> i wasn't there when the verdicts were announced. i was there for some of the closing arguments. i actually think the best thing i heard from any attorney during closer argument came surprisingly from one of the defense attorneys. not from the prosecutors. he said, ladies and gentlemen, you heard statements about donald trump saying we're going to go to the capitol and i'm going to be there with you. of course, he didn't go, but we're going to go, and you're going to fight like hell or you won't have a country anymore, and you're going to stop the steal. now march on the capitol, and the defense attorney said, ladies and gentlemen, i expect those statements to be government exhibit number one in the criminal case of united states v. donald trump. that is y hope, prophetic. >> what's interesting, i note that in "the washington post"

piece about what enrique tarrio has been saying himself, he is actually not saying that it was donald trump. he's actually refuting his own attorneys. his attorneys are saying this was trump. what tarrio is saying, they were using us as scapegoats. they wanted to get donald trump and get us to flip on donald trump. that's the claim he's making. it sounds like he's trying to sort of hedge against the potential of another donald trump presidency. >> who's they? that's what i want to know. who is they? >> what do you make of that? the fact is this guy doesn't seem to be turning on donald trump. >> of course not. he's too invested. too invested. >> what do republicans do now? fox news covered it very late. they jumped into it quite late in the coverage. they have been very sort of positive toward the insurrection, saying this was a normal day. >> just political discourse. the answer for what republicans do, i think in large measure, they're going to cue off trump, who will rail against this. they will basically sort of

obfuscate and deny the findings, and again, remember, you have members of the house who went to the jail here in d.c. to support the insurrectionists and said they were political prisoners. what do you think that gop is going to do on the heels of this decision? they will stand firm where they are. they're not going to peel off. we'll see if any of the other presidential candidates create a heisman move between them and trump, doubtful, because again, that base is still hugging him and leaning in to him. hugging these very same people. >> cynthia, let me read this. one of the members, so donald trump has been doing this musical tribute at the beginning of his rallies. and this j-6 choir, people who have been indicted for their roles in the insurrection. one member, he's accused of leading a kansas area group of proud boys and telling a capitol police officer, you shoot, i'll

take your f'ing a out, as well as using an ax handle to keep police from building gates. this is an extremely violent group who are in a choir because they're a violent group. what do you make of the fact all of them are accused of seditious conspiracy? when people are that mote vadeivated, does it deter people from getting involved? >> it doesn't, and it hasn't deterred additional violence. this is a group that some of our closest allies, canada, new zealand have declared a terrorist group. it's a terrorist organization in other countries. they're continuing to violently plot an attack and show up at drag readings, drag shows and anti-trans violence. we're seeing other kinds of plots and attacks which is showing there's been no deterrence here. there's no slowing down their mobilization. >> does it slow down the risk of them, though? you have the leadership now all

convicted. both in the oath keepers and in the proud boys. does that send a message to others that the risk is too high? donald trump, there's no guarantee he's going to be president again and he would even pardon them if he was president again. he doesn't know who these people are and doesn't care. >> it could. it's like a whack-a-mole, we end up in a situation where they start using more coded language, more mean driven mobilization, communicating in text emojis that are really difficult to prove in court what they meant. i think we're going to see more secretive, more back channel communication, more old school off line communication x i think that they are going to continue to be persuaded by the ideology and find a better way to do it. it's not the best way to kind of come and arrest them all and focus our strategies on that strategy all the time. we also have to work on prevention. >> let's talk about donald trump for a moment. now you had the two main violent

groups, also the three percenters, the third violent group involved in january 6th, but now you had the leadership of both the proud boys and the oath keepers. this seditious conspiracy goes back to the civil war. this was about trying to prevent the seditious southern rebels from being able to attack the capitol. we're now using that law to convict people in the modern era. what risk does that, as the defense attorney stated, pose to donald trump? >> so, here is the most important takeaway from my perspective about the series of verdicts just handed down. enrique tarrio was convicted not only of seditious conspiracy but a whole other bunch of crimes at the capitol, and he didn't even set foot on capitol property. he was outside the district. what does that prove? i would call that atmospheric precedent. you can be convicted for crimes at the capitol even though you weren't at the capitol. joy, who else wasn't at the capitol on january 6th? let's see. steve bannon, mike flynn, rudy giuliani, roger stone, john

eastman, mark meadows, donald trump, we have a little bit of atmospheric precedent that all of those people i just named better buckle up because their ride is going to get bumpier now. >> it seems that the accounts that were about violence that day were the ones that the jury hung on, that they couldn't or they only convicted pizola on. enrique tarrio had other issues. he had ripped down the black lives matter flag off a church, he had a gun cartridge he wasn't supposed to have, but the conspiracy charges are the ones that seem to be sticking. what does that tell you, you mentioned a lot of people, it was a conspiracy? >> the conspiracy charges are often the toughest to prove. it's an agreement between two or more people to commit a crime, and then one act, what we call an overt act toward the commission of the crime. here's the thing, you don't enter into a conspiracy by filling out documents and getting them notarized. it's a secret agreement between bad folks. once you can prove a conspiracy, the reach of co-conspirator

liability is so far, right, and that's why they were able to pull enrique tarrio into it even though he wasn't at the capitol. >> we'll show that video again, these are the leaders either now indicted or headed to jail. there they are in the basement plotting, they must have felt so cool in the moment, but that's when keeping it real goes wrong, one might say. i'm a little fascinated by enrique tarrio. a black man, black cuban. a member of a group that has been called anything from western chauvinists to white nationalists. he also in the past has been accused of turning state's evidence, being a government snitch, one might say. he's now headed to prison. which gang does he hang out with? i don't see him with the skinheads. i don't see him with the black folk. where does he hang out in prison? >> he's going to have 20 years to figure that out. maybe he creates his own new gang at this point. this is what we're seeing, that these guys, you know, there's a lot of plausibility deniability

in their labeling of themselves as western chauvinists but really they're mail supremacists, biggest, they attract a ton of people to them who express all kinds of virulent racism online. so you know, i think we're going to have to see what happens over the next couple decades. >> i'm going to come back to you to ask about the politics of this. here's a cbs poll. likely republican voters, do you prefer to support a candidate who criticizes insurrectionists 15%, supports insurrectionists, 24%, and 60%, don't comment. 9/11, let's let it go. but where does this party go if they are the party of these guys? >> they're already there. i mean, where do they go? it's kind of the internal struggle that you see playing out for republicans like myself, and others who are trying to figure out what threads are

sal salvageable to knit together something different. and those who completely capitulated and said we're all in. those of us holding on to a thread -- >> you say those, like it's more than one of you. you and david jolly. >> david jolly is gone. there's an us. trust me, there's an us. but it is, it's a difficult us. it's a difficult spot for us. >> is there someone -- >> larry hogan. larry? >> let's get larry on the phone. that's the thing, it seems to me even as a law enforcement manner and you as an expert, what you need is someone with stature to go to the base of the party and say here's this alternative thing. >> nowio know why i have been screaming at the leadership for the last number of years. more than anything else, that's what they should do. in the past, we have relied on the leadership of the party to stand up and pull us back from the precipice. now the leadership are the first

ones over it. and that's the problem. >> and so glenn, if i'm watching this trial as a person who was a part of that broad conspiracy, who should be the most worried right now? mark meadows? or is it trump? >> look, at some point, the department of justice has to move on from the boots of the insurrection, the foot soldiers of the insurrection, up the hierarchy. up the criminal food chain. let's start holding accountable some of the political folk who were responsible for organizing funding, inciting, and directing the attack on the capitol. i don't know, i appreciate merrick garland coming out and saying we got more boots of the insurrection. how about now you do the suits? >> it would be nice. you would like to see not just the grunts go to prison and the people who directed them sit back and eat bonbons while they're at home. cynthia, thank you. come back more often. you know michael steele, my brother, glenn kirschner. this is a lot of fun. now we added cynthia. thank you for being here.

up next on "the reidout," what started off as a whiff of corruption on the supreme court has grown into an outright stank as we learn more about clarence thomas' ties to billionaire harlan crow. "the reidout" continues after this. so please don't bring it up. - bring what up? kayak? - excuse me? do the research, todd. - listen to me. kayak searches hundreds of travel sites to find you great deals on flights, cars and hotels. - they're lying to you. - who's they? kayak? - arr! - open your eyes! - compare hundreds of travel sites at once. kayak. search one and done.

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propublica reports crow paid the tuition for thomas' grand nephew who thomas considers his son. and who he had legal custody of, to not one but two boarding schools. and we don't know how much crow paid, but propublica estimates it could be in excess of $150,000. in a statement, crow said that justice thomas didn't ask for the money. additionally, he told propublica he has long been passionate about the importance of quality education and giving back to those less fortunate, especially at-risk youth. at-risk youth? according to a thomas friend, crow paid the schools directly on behalf of the justice and thomas was not required to disclose the tuition payments to schools because his great nephew did not fit the definition of a dependent child under the ethics in government act. interestingly, the thomases did not reject the payment for their grand nephew, just to recap, mr. crow has reportedly paid for clarence thomas' private jet rides, his yacht cruises and

bought thomas' mother's house where she still lives rent free. at this point, crow has allegedly dished out hundreds of thousands of dollars, nearing millions, for thomas' personal benefit, and to fund ginni thomas' political organizations. thomas has repeatedly failed to report these payments. joining me is richard painter, chief ethics lawyer in the george w. bush administration and professor of law, and jason johnson, msnbc political contributor and host of a word with jason johnson podcast. richard, i want to start with you. at this point, the amount of money that harlan crow has dished out to this justice, you know, he's dishing it out like another salary. supreme court justices get paid a little north i think of $200,000 a year. he's getting that from harlan crow as gifts. how is that not a crime? >> well, i don't know whether it's a crime, but we reached the point in the united states where

it would be a real visible player in washington, d.c., you need at least one supreme court justice in your portfolio. hot we have going on here is clearly an attempt to ingratiate himself through a friendship with a justice over many, many years. and whether it's buying his mother's house or paying the tuition bill, which was justice thomas' obligation if he chose to enroll the boy in a school that was justice thomas' obligation if he was the custodial parent or he was the guardian, and he had the opportunity to make those decisions, and then if he doesn't want to send his nephew to a public school, because for whatever reason he doesn't like the public schools, that's okay. but he needs to pay the bill, and if he doesn't pay the bill and mr. crow pays it for him, that's just a gift that goes on the disclosure form. and i dealt with this in the

white house under president bush. i told people very clearly, if somebody pays your kid's tuition at a school, that's a gift to you. just put it on the disclosure form. if they're lobbyists, we're going to get you fired. if you don't put it on the disclosure form, you could commit a crime because if you file a false disclosure form, that's a false statement, a false statement, intentional false statements to the government can be prosecuted under united states code 1,0001, the false statement statute, the same robert mueller went after quite a few people on. this needed to be disclosed. it's a slam dunk, this was an obligation of the justice. he made the decision to put his nephew in this private school. he had the legal guardianship, the authority to make that decision. and the responsibility to pay the cost that came along with it. >> you know, jason, i'm struck by the term at-risk youth, because i find it hard to imagine that someone being raised by a supreme court

justice who is flying all over the world and going on expensive yachts and dining with people like harlan crow maybe in his garden of evil is an at-risk youth, right? that doesn't sound like an at-risk youth. once again, i ask you to imagine what would happen if instead of clarence thomas this were happening with sonia sotomayor and the billionaire wasn't harlan crow, it was george soros. dream with me, jason. what would that be like? >> well, everybody from jim jordan to mitch mcconnell would be screaming for her head. people would be protesting outside their house. but that's the thing, joy. this is what makes this particularly disgusting. we already know he's corrupt, he's bought, and the same thing is happening with john roberts and his wife. we know there's money in the pockets of all these people. we talked about this before when harlan crow was first revealed to be the bad guy behind the camera, the bond villain, whatever. it's one thing to take clarence thomas on expensive trips,

because from an ethical standpoint, thomas could have said, hey, i don't want to take trips anymore. but once you're paying for my mama's house and paying for my son to go to school, you can't tell this man no anymore. harlan crow is literally has his hands up clarence thomas like a puppet. and the idea that anyone could even remotely pretend that clarence thomas was his own man on the court when this is happening is absolutely impossible. every single democrat besides ocasio-cortez, every democrat should be screaming to get clarence thomas to get off the bench, to talk about the inherent corruption we have on the supreme court right now, because this is not going to be the last reveal, because as we saw in the propublica article, his grand nephew said, by the way, we took a trip to the baltics. there's other trips coming that we probably haven't heard about yet. i'm waiting to find out he paid for colonoscopy surgery, something like that, because harlan crow runs the entire

family. >> this is what ron wyden tweeted, he's pushing for answers. he wants crow to answer questions. if he doesn't comply, i will explore other tools at the finance committee's disposal to shed more light on what appears to be blatant corruption. i think to that point, richard, it almost doesn't matter if crow specifically had cases before the court. he's a big donor to republicans like greg abbott, who banned abortion in his state. he's a big co -- a cofounder of club for growth which has gotten all of its asks from citizens united on, on this court. in the past three decades they publicly donated $14.7 million to candidates and committees, at least there 13 million went to republicans. they're getting republican outcomes. it doesn't need to be specific cases. and let's go back to scalia. justice scalia when he died, he literally was staying for free at a west texas hunting lodge owned by a business person whose

company had recently had a matter before the supreme court. is this not just simple corruption that thomas learned from scalia and is now practicing it for himself and his family. >> it's been going on in this court for quite some time. at least we have the ethics in government act which requires disclosure of these gifts and it's a law, and they need to comply with the law. if one of the liberal justices do this y can guarantee you that jim jordan would have had them impeached in the house this morning and walking the articles of impeachment over to the senate right now as we speak. the same standard should apply to everybody. this is unacceptable. we have never had something this serious on the supreme court with a single justice receiving that many gifts, undisclosed gifts from the same person. this dwarfs by far the incident with justice ford, 1969, where he was persuaded to resign from the court because of a single

payment from a businessman that he actually returned as soon as the businessman was indicted. and yet, he was still forced off the court, and the democrats wouldn't support him in the u.s. congress even though they knew that would give nixon an extra seat, nomination on the u.s. supreme court. we have come a long way since the more bipartisan attitudes of the late '60s and early '70s, and everyone is going to dig their heels on and focus on does he agree with me on abortion or not instead of focusing on ethics. when it comes to ethics. this supreme court is like an out of control fraternity. it's an animal house of ethics. without the college dean who is there to throw them all out. and congress has that ability under the impeachment clause of the constitution, but they're not going to use it. they wouldn't throw out a president, an impeached and convicted president who inspired an insurrection. what are they going to do about this? nothing.

>> last word to you, jason. why should any of us respect any decision out of this court knowing how corrupt they are? last word. >> because we shouldn't, and this is the way that republicans have been trying to take over our country. as you have mentioned on tiktok, joy, as i have said on the air, this is all part of the overall corruption of the government that republicans have been working through for the last 20 years. nothing, nothing that comes out of this court that has the stench of clarence thomas or kavanaugh or gorsuch or amy coney barrett has legitimacy, and we should function that way from now on. >> or roberts at this point. thank you. still ahead, the choke hold death of a homeless man on the new york city subway is now ruled a homicide, but it's also raising serious questions about the homeless crisis. we'll be right back. ♪♪

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. jordan nealy was a 30-year-old man who some new yorkers may remember, here are videos showing nealy as quite the michael jackson impersonator who performed around new york city subways, transit hubs and streets. he was also homeless and struggled with mental illness. factors that many believe contributed to why nealy is no longer alive. on monday, he was allegedly yelling and pacing back and forth on a subway train in manhattan. until a stranger, a former marine, who has not yet been named, put him in a choke hold on the subway train floor.

we're about to show the video and a warning, it is disturbing. the incident that you see here was shot by juan alberto vazquez, who was on the subway train at the time. as you can see, jordan is being held down by another rider, locked on the ground while two other passengers restrain him. vasquez said the choke hold lasted for about 15 minutes. nealy was unconscious on the car floor when officers arrived and died at the scene. the cause of death has been deemed compression of the neck and ruled a homicide, according to the medical examiner, the man who put nealy in the choke hold was taken into custody and later released. no charges have yet been filed against him or anyone else in the car for that matter. new york mayor eric adams a former police officer, responded to the incident as well as the backlash. >> i was a former transit police officer. and i responded to many jobs where you had a passenger assisting someone, and so we cannot just blatantly say what a passenger should or should not do in a situation like that.

>> assisting someone. joining me is reverend al sharpton, host of "politics nation" and president of the national action network, and a homeless rights and housing activist. thank you both for being here. i want to start with you first. welcome to the show. tell me what you make of the way that this young michael jackson impersonator was killed. >> well, and my brother sharpton, that's my family right there. we go way, way back. and you all have to forgive me if i get too emotional. this brother was someone who was failed by the foster care system, was failed by so many layers of government. this is a brother who, i know

what it's like to be a foster child, to be in the streets, and to try and find a way to survive. this is a brother who was trying his best to survive and did it through entertainment, through performing. i knew him from that aspect. didn't even know he was homeless. but i have seen so many people have to resort to becoming street performers like brother jordan was, and when you're that young and you don't have help, because there's so many -- >> i hear you, brother. i do. and you know, rev, it's giving bernie getz, this whole incident, the fact this man was not arrested, the fact we're not getting his name. it's giving eric garner, it's giving a lot of things that we

really should not have to remember. i want to play for you two pieces of sound. this is governor kathy hochul's first reaction and her updated reaction to this killing. >> people who are in -- who are homeless in our subways, many in the th throes of mental health episodes and that's what i believe is involved here, there's consequences for behave. . >> i'm really pleased that the district attorney is looking into this matter. as i said, there has to be consequences. we'll see how this unfolds but his family deserves justice. it became very clear he was not going to cause harm to these other people, and the video of three individuals holding him down until the last breath was snuffed out of him, i would say was a very extreme response. >> somebody must have told her her first reaction was inadequate. reverend sharpton, your reaction to all of this. >> it cleary is something that

is above being disturbed. this was, in my judgment from the film, showing the lack of any kind of civility and a legal reaction. whether this young man, brother jordan, was troubled or not, he should not be sentenced with death. you are talking about a life was taken. and it struck me, which is why i immediately put out a statement, he's on the subway impersonating michael jackson, who was close to me. as you know, michael used to come up to the national action network. i preached michael's funeral. you combine that with eric garner, where we have a state law against choke holds, so what is bothering me is the press is looking into the jordan family, what happened to jordan, what happened to his family? what happened to the guy that would choke him for 15 minutes? we don't even know his name. what is the background of this

guy that was clearly behind jordan? he can't say self defense, he was not at risk. so to let this go forward in any way is to sanction vigilanteism in this city, and therefore would have national ramifications. we cannot let this go. we will support whatever the homeless advocates are doing because this is really giving legitimacy to those who can say i can get up on a subway, if somebody is making noise, and do what i want to do, including causing their death. this cannot happen. this cannot be allowed. and i have talked to the d.a.'s office. they must investigate and prosecute to the full extent of the law or we're back to bernard getz and more recent, to eric garner. this is a fusion of both offenses. >> -- >> go ahead. i was going to say, the getz

case was '84, and that's vigilanteism. in the case of eric garner, supposedly in 2022, the supreme court upheld the fact police can't get a choke hold. how does this guy get away with doing a choke hold that police can't do, and what about the other people standing there watching him die. there was no one else at the train, no one at risk? >> not only didn't help him, you have three guys holding him down. what about the guys holding him down that aided and abetted a choke hold that resulted in a murder? >> exactly. exactly. >> let me say this. >> police. >> there is something to be said about media who knows this individual's name and has yet to release it. there's something to be said about media who is depicting this person as an ex-marine, as if to say that he served the country, so it's all right. we're going to protect his identity because somehow he's a victim, when in reality, what he

has done is illegal. so and i also want to center this, he's an ex-marine, but he's an ex-marine who is trained to kill. >> does it make it more dangerous, sir, for people who are homeless? you're an advocate for the homeless. this seems to me to be an open door. people get nervous on the subway. they see homeless people panhandling. this seems like an open door against people who are already vulnerable? >> we have seen already people who have been killed while homeless. killed, murdered. we just dealt with that last year in several states. so yes, of course. this sends a message. it could send a message that it's okay. and that's why we have to, as

the reverend says, we have to hold this individual accountable, because with the medical examiner declaring this as a homicide, a homicide is a crime. >> yeah. >> so we can't let him not go through due process and be held accountable for what he has done to this individual who posed no imminent danger -- >> to anyone. to anyone. to anyone on that train. people were standing there quite casually. thank you both very much. we'll keep an eye on this case. coming up, i recently spoke with two survivors of the 1921 tulsa race massacre, and the founder of justice for greenwood program, about their ongoing search for accountability and justice. that interview is straight ahead. with cpap every night. but now that i got the inspire implant, it's making me think of doing other things i've been putting off.

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that scene in the hbo series watchman, brought renewed teengz one of the worst atrocities in american history, the tulsa race massacre. it was this month in 1921 when a white mob descended on the

all-black neighborhood of greenwood in tulsa, oklahoma, known as black wall street, destroying one of the country's most prosperous black communities and killing hundreds. today, more than 100 years later, the last three known survivors are still fighting for justice, including brother and sister hughes van ellis and viola fletcher who were 1 and 7 when their hometown was massacred. they came to washington this week to meet with the department of justice as part of their ongoing fight for reparations. this week, i got to sit down with the two of them along with the founder of justice for greenwood, demario simmons. it's such an honor to talk to you and to meet you in person. i want to start with you, mother fletcher. before and you remember that day. tell me a little bit about that. >> well, it was a very scary time to be doing all of this and seeing so many things

happening, like people running, getting shot and killed, and we had to be gathered up with the family and leave town, so it's something that hasn't left me. i can still think of it, sometimes i can't sleep at night for that reason. >> and uncle read, you are the baby brother. you are at 102, so you grew up, you don't remember the massacre. you grew up outside. tell us what your childhood was like after the massacre. >> in my childhood, i it was rough. i raised a family and i had to go from town to town and look for work because i didn't have no skills, for skill work. so, a lot of people ask me, why are you moving, red? i said they said, we move here, move, there -- -- ,,. >>,,?

>>. -- just to make a living. i didn't have no skills, that's all i had. >> let's flutters going to have in the 109th birthday. happy birthday in advance. next week will be her 109th birthday. >> yes. >> demario, on that same day, you all are going to be still fighting for reparations and repair. >> absolutely and joy, thank you so much for caring so much about our love elite survivors in this issue. unfortunately, on 109th birthday, we will be back in tulsa county district court once again as the city, the chamber, the state, the perpetrating the massacres are going to be trying to get our case dismissed. they are going to look at these beautiful survivors, who are telling you what they experienced, and mother randall is not here for three of them. they will say they don't deserve anything, the community doesn't deserve anything, and this case should be kicked out. as you know, a year ago, we

thought we are going to move forward with this case. we are right back here another year later and we know that the defendants. their strategy was i have these beautiful individuals, they want them to die, point blank. they were hoping that during this delay, they wouldn't be here any longer. but they both told me they will be here for the long haul. -- 28 more years left. >> oh, yes. >> 28? you see will continue to fight. and uncle read, you told me earlier before this interview began, you will fight until you get justice. >> see, i'm going to have to -- mourn in 1921, in the united states army, mom and dad, i survived. i'm pretty fortunate to be here to tell that. some said you should have been gone. i know some guys not as old as i am, i'm here. i'm still here. >> a man. >> i'm here today. >> and mother fletcher, at 108, you are still fighting. what does justice look like to you? >> well, everything is

beautiful and rebuilt and restored, you know, we think it's just time now that we have justice on all of that where we can live our lives, that type of life over again as a grown-up. >> yeah, have you ever received an apology from the city of tulsa? have either of you? >> no. >> no apology? that is stunning to me. that you would have survivors, you know, one of the arguments that people who oppose reparations make is they say, well, who would be make the reparation to? these survivors are gone. they say that with regard to enslavement. but in this case, you have three survivors, two of whom are sitting right here. they could make repair to and they are still saying no. >> still saying no and they utilize the survivors and other descendants of stories of names and likeness is to raise $30 million to build their own historical center that they can use for cultural tourism. this is their words. and they wouldn't give one penny of that money to the survivors of other descendants.

they won't share any of the revenue. we've asked the many, many times. so, the city, the county, the chamber, and the other powerful elite in tulsa still utilize, they are still burning greenwood down. they've gentrified all the land, it went from 40 blocks, now it's one half a block, and everything that's built up, all the high-rises and the hotels, and the banks, the offices, they are all owned by non greenwood residents or non black people. >> and, you know, mother fletcher, what would you like to see happen in greenwood? because if you could get something back for the people of greenwood, the people you grew up with, what do you want? >> the people who are entitled to it, i think they should get something back. then -- it could be something better, you know? there is always room for improvement. >> always. >> you know, uncle read, you all of that some incredible experiences. you went to ghana and became citizens of donna, so i know you are dual citizens with african names and all of that

wonderful grandeur. >> that was wonderful, yes. >> -- on that flight right now. we have young people -- >> absolutely, you all have been able to meet the president. >> yes, met the chief, they made me the chief first than i was surprised to know that they were giving me citizenship, so that was a surprise. >> well, i'm excited. this is one of my proudest moments, to be able to meet the two of you. i've watched your hearings, i've watched you from afar, and have really prayed that i would get the opportunity to finally meet you in person. so, this is wonderful day for me. thank you, keep fighting. you said if it takes 28 years, uncle red. >> i will be here. >> hopefully on may 10th, we can move forward with this case. >> absolutely, well we believe in you. thank you very, very much. >> we will be right back. u very, very muc >> we will be right back

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