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expel george santos from congress. republicans cheat to a room of accountability. and three democratic state attorneys general from colorado, california, and michigan join me to discuss reproductive rights, gun reform and combatting hate crimes. i'm charles blow infirmity has some. let's get started. >> as we start the second hour, we want to flip the script on how president biden's reelection campaign is perceived. the common within much of the news media says that biden is struggling in parts of the electorate in 2024 because of how voters view his age. in a recent piece of the new york times, i argue that there is a chicken and egg expect to this coverage. let me say up front, candidates age and competency are always

fair game in politics. even biden conceded earlier this month that he took a hard look at his age as he contemplated whether to seek reelection. >> one of the things people are going to find out, they're going to see a race and going to judge whether or not i have it or don't have it. i expect them to take a hard look at it, i take a hard look at it as well. i took a hard look at it before i decided to run. i feel good, i feel excited about the prospects. >> but there are other truths that must be considered. as i wrote in the times, headlines and polls don't just measure and reflect public sentiments. they also influenced public sentiment. the persistence of a theme elevates and validates that theme. it's true that if he is reelected biden would be the oldest president we've ever had. but he is already the oldest president we've already had the first time he was elected. so what has changed?

i would argue that the biggest change was not the simple passage of time but the decision of some republican leaders to focus like a laser on biden's age as the factor weighing against him and then how the media responded to that heightened focus. editorial decisions can be influenced by campaigns and coverage can influence voters as much as inform those voters. from my piece in the times, the idea that voters are worried about biden's age and capacity has been repeated so often that it no longer requires any proof beyond polling that reflects what respondents have consumed. reports that they are worried about biden's age and capacity. breathless headlines have created a sense that worry about the presidents age is common and common sense, when in fact at least in part it is

fueled by political manipulation and by media complicity. as it 2024 election cycle begins in earnest or maybe we in the news media should let the voters decide what's most important to them and stop deciding for the voters. let's bring in but paula ramos, msnbc contributor and the author of finding latinx-, in search of the voices in and brad jenkins, ceo and president of aapi victory fund. paula, first you. your thoughts on the media narrative around president biden's age. how should we be covering it in 2024 election cycle? >> so let me start with this, charles. i actually was working for hillary clinton in 2016 so i

very much saw the way that the media completely sort of told the story of who hillary clinton was before she even got a chance to tell everybody who she is. before she even got a chance to introduce herself. i saw that very vividly so i understand the power that we have as journalist right now. i think our role right now is to really believe the picture and lay the story of the accidental threats this democracy is facing and i think that will be the biggest challenge that president biden is up against. what is the country that we live in right now? and then let voters decide. this is a country where one out of three american women have lost access to abortion. it is a country where over 45 states in this country have passed anti trans legislation, a country where at least 1000 books have been banned. there are over 200 mass shootings just this year. these are the consequences of the country we are living in right now so to me that the important thing, focus on the ground, focus on the states that people are living every single day and then let them decide.

>> brad how do you think biden is doing in responding to people being critical of his age? >> i mean he's doing his best job. i wish you wrote that piece for years ago because here's the thing, this is like groundhog day. there is the same rhetoric about joe biden during that democratic primary four years ago and it is happening again. the idea that joe biden is too old, can't be the reader of the democratic party, and they happen to your point, we let the voters decide. and what happened? joe biden won resoundingly. joe biden beat donald trump, by the way, who is also very old. the other crazy thing is, my favorite thing working in the white house, joe biden would say this all the time. do not compare me to the almighty, compare me to who i'm running against. and joe biden is going to be running against someone who is also very old. another being hurt thing here, the stakes are so high. the stakes are so high for millions of women, for millions

of americans right now who are worried about whether they are going to be able to put food on the table. they are not worried about joe biden's age, they are worried about who is the person who's going to be able to actually paint division and this is the thing that i do think that perhaps your piece missed. the one thing we do have to take into account is he will be the oldest president reelected in american politics, and a heartbeat away, the vice president is very important. and i do think that this white house and this campaign needs to elevate the vice president in a way where she can seem presidential. she will be a heartbeat away, it's a huge moment. particularly what we just mentioned about the assault on reproductive justice and women across this country. this is a huge moment for the vice president to step up and seem like, because we know that she's presidential, we haven't

quite seen that yet. so that the challenge i think this white house and this campaign is going to need to really focus in on but as it relates to age, look. the one thing that does not keep me up at night is whether voters vote for old people. if you look at the senate, if you look at members of congress, american voters are used to voting for old people. what they're going to vote for in this election is who does that person who's going to actually deliver for my family. >> paula, i argued this month that age did not define vitality as much as passion, specifically some voters did not believe that bottom went down fighting on the initiatives that younger democratic voters cared most about. what are your thoughts on that? >> i think the reality is there's been a lot of accomplishments. unemployment is low jobs are up he delivered on things like student loan forgiveness he delivered on climate change. but i think it always comes out to this. there's always a discrepancy

between the achievements between what's going on in the white house and the story that we are relying outside. and that's the gap i'm paying attention to. how do they tell that story? i think that's what people need to hear beyond just a list of the achievements going back to what i said at the beginning. what is the story that the president is going to do? to not just tell american voters that young voters, when you pointed out. but he will protect them, but also to allow them to reimagine a badge and a better future. if you are a transgender person in this country right now you are not just thinking about that future, rethinking about how to survive. if you are a woman in the rio grande valley that needs access to abortion, yes you want to be thinking about the future but you are literally thinking about how you survive in this moment. if you are a teacher in florida right now who wants to tell the truth in this country, you are thinking of surviving. it's that very difficult

balance of striking a realistic tone, but also one that allows us to imagine. and that's really hard. >> brad, the new york times reports that the census group no labels is considering recruiting a third party candidate for 2024, even discussing names like joe manchin. the report says the democrats are especially alarmed by the development. what do you think of a third party candidate in 2024, when they do something like to someone like charles stein did in 2016 and siphon votes from the democratic candidate? >> no. go for it, god bless no labels, they want to try for it, go for it. i think that, again, we know what's at stake, we know that trump and desantis and all these guys they are inflaming and using wedge issues to ginni up their base. they're not even trying to persuade independent voters. the reason why joe biden won is because he is the best candidate. it's the reason why he is our candidate to actually reach voters across the aisle. trump, desantis, all these guys are at 37%. that's gonna be their number.

the question is whether joe biden, the largest electorate in every election cycle is not republicans, it's not democrats, it's people that don't vote. and that is the percentage of the electorate that i'm the most worried about. in the obama white house the lead up to the midterms and reelection, we did something special, we created something called the american jobs act. what do we do the? because we had a vision in the second term, obama's second term, the bear is loose. second term obama, we had to start painting a vision of, here are the things we are going to do in the second term. that is what joe biden white house and the joe biden campaign is going to need to start to do. but he is the best messenger. it's not even a question. you look at polling right now, it's very early but there is not a single person in america right now. he's our sitting president,

that has a chance to beat -- there's no the way to put it. this is a fascist takeover of the republican party. this is not your mom and dad's or your grandparents republican party. this is of a fight for the very soul, not to sound like joe biden, but for the very soul of our democracy and the only person that is going to win is someone who has won, in office as we speak, and can also reach communities as paula said, in every single state. it's not just white suburban exurban moms. we are talking about asian american voters in nevada. we are talking about latina voters in florida and in texas and in georgia. joe biden, during that primary, who was a candidate that could galvanize communities of color and young people? it was joe biden. it wasn't cory booker, it wasn't kamala harris, there was a mayor pete. it was our guy joe biden. so look, i will say this, for the people that are saying he is too old, he's this, he's that, he's the other -- i will point to things.

i will point to bernie sanders and how he ignited young people, and i will point to dark brandon two point oh. because young people don't care about your age, young people care about the issues that you are fighting for. that's where we are going to win. >> pella ramos and brad jennings thank you for your time tonight. congressman robert garcia is heading, leading the charge to expel george santos from congress. he joins me later after the break. but first, richard louis is here with the headlines. hello richard. >> charles good evening some breaking news first off this hour president biden and how speaker kevin mccarthy will meet in person on monday. to discuss the debt ceiling negotiations, both sides have not been able to reach an agreement in part due to republican demands for stricter work requirements to receive federal aid. ukraine's president volodymyr zelenskyy speaking at the g7 summit in hiroshima on sunday. he denied russia's claims that they had control over the city of bakhmut in eastern ukraine.

zelenskyy also stood with biden as he announced over $3 million in additional aid to ukraine. and the party of greece's conservative prime minister just short of the majority. that sets the stage for another ballot. this is greece's's first election since the country stopped being under strict supervision by international lenders. that provided a bailout. the mehdi hasan show, right after this break. after this break getting inspired! volunteering! playing pickleba...! i'm kareem abdul-jabbar. i was diagnosed with afib.

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led by my next guest, congressman robert garcia, introduced a resolution to expel scandals congressman george santos from congress after he was indicted on 13 federal criminal charges by the justice department. but the republican-led -- party lines -- -- sending it to the house ethics

committee and, which has been investigating santos since early march. congressman dan goldman, -- called the move a stalling tactic that allows republicans to avoid accountability. democratic congressman robert garcia of california joins me now. congressman, why did you introduce this resolution? >> i mean, look, george santos is obviously a fraud and a liar and he should not be in congress. as a fellow freshman, particularly a president of our freshman democratic class, it's just a shame to see someone who is lied and lied about everything in their life be here in congress. it is time for change, he should have resigned a long time ago and i'm glad we brought this resolution up three months ago. we he should do the right thing. he has now been indicted, 13 different counts. he needs to go. >> let's talk about the host president here. there have been two house explosion since the civil war. congressman michael myers in

1980 and jen -- in 2002. those came after they were convicted of federal crimes and refused to resign. but santos has been indicted but not convicted yet. why are you moving forward with the explosion of him before the conviction on those cases? >> two things, first, george santos is the biggest -- so he should be there. he also came forward, the resolution, even three months ago, even prior to the 13 federal count indictment, he is already openly admitting to actual fraud, to lying, he is admitted to criminal charges and brazil. even prior to just what happened over the last few weeks, he is already and admitted fraud and liar. so he should be out of congress. the people of new york elected >> two things, first, george santos is the biggest -- so he should be there. he also came forward, the resolution, even three months ago, even prior to the 13 federal count indictment, he is already openly admitting to actual fraud, to lying, he is admitted to criminal charges and brazil. even prior to just what happened over the last few weeks, he is already and admitted fraud and liar. so he should be out of congress. the people of new york elected a complete fabrication of a person, the george santos that was elected does not exist.

it is very clear that his constituents want him out as a democracy we should be proud, and try to have the best -- truth in justice and george santos is the opposite of that. >> you published a letter to speaker mccarthy thursday demanding he provide the timeline of quote, every single day of the ethics committee's probe into santos. have you heard back from the the speaker? >> this >> i have not heard back. but that is not a surprise. he kevin mccarthy has led his still leaders comments with incredible cowardice and he has given away the keys to leadership to folks like marjorie taylor greene or george santos, to folks like lauren boebert. and the truth is he's needs george santos. it is very clear, if george santos had anytime gritty he would've resigned and mccarthy and he was a -- he would've called for his resignation. so speaker mccarthy is not doing anything to actually move this forward. he actually got his entire caucus to vote against removing

santos. that is not leadership. that is not what this country needs. we demanded to speak to mccarthy, give us a public updated timeline around the other committee. -- it has gotten nowhere, -- we expect him to do more and we will push every day and push on mccarthy and keep all of those republicans accountable, especially his colleagues in new york who quote on quote say they want him gone. they are just showing that they have no spine. >> listen, as you just mentioned, no republicans voted against the gop, that included, as you said, all 12 republicans who voted for him to resign, including six new york republicans. if they think that he should be held accountable, why don't you think that they would vote to expel him and otherwise send it to the ethics panel, instead of expel him? >> i mean, that's a good question. i have asked that question as well. clearly they are completely

committed and loyal to whoever mccarthy threatened. do -- they basically they're asked them to resign, have said that they have voted to expel him from congress, they want him out, yet they don't have the bravery to actually take this vote. it's very clear what is going on, -- this is now the save santa's caucus here in the house. those republicans, most of which are democratic, leading biden districts, are going to be held accountable for this vote. we are going to remind our constituents every single day that those new york freshman believe that george santos should remain in congress. so that is not going to go over very well with the voters. congressman robert garcia, thank you so much for your time. after the break, democratic state attorney general from colorado, california and michigan join me to discuss their efforts to fight the conservative assault on your rights. asthma isn't pretty. it's the moment when you realize that a good day... is about to become a bad one.

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surpassed the opioid crisis as the top public health concern for americans. according to a new axios poll 26% of respondents said access to firearms is the number one threat from 17% just three months ago. the gun violence archive reports there has been 232 mass shootings this year, that's higher than the number of days we've had in 2023. and more than 1000 incidents involving firearms have occurred in american schools since 2018, but the biggest rise since at least 1970 according to the k-12 gun shooting database. i'm joined now by three democratic state attorneys generals to discuss this issue and more. but the ags of colorado, but california, and michigan. i want to start with you, your twin sons are students at

michigan state university were gunman shot and killed three students and injured five others back in february. first of all, i want to know how this is impacted you and your family. but also how that kind of life experience informs your work on gun violence? >> well, you know, i ran for office on the promise to do everything i could as the attorney general of the state of michigan to try to ensure that we had protections against senseless gun violence in our state to the extent that i could around the country. of course i was worried like every other parent when i sent my kids off to college that they would be subject to gun violence. i don't know if i could have seen a mass shooting at their school in their sophomore year but michigan was already well on its way to passing some new gun violence protection

measures. and not only have we already passed a couple since the shooting but we have another that's being signed into law tomorrow. extreme risk protection or the red flag laws are going to be signed by governor whitmer tomorrow. we are making progress, just not fast enough. but >> your state of colorado has experience a number of mass shootings most recently in march at a denver high school. what is your office doing to combat gun violence and what are you hearing from your constituents on the ground about how they feel about gun violence? >> when i talk to young people this is the top concern on their minds. and that was true when i first ran in 2018, it's more true now. i ran on a commitment to a red flag law that we got passed in 2019 after years of the gun lobby opposing that low. we are working to implement that law. we know it saves lives. if someone's at an extreme risk in terms of themselves or others, removing firearms can save lives.

that's true and so many contacts including domestic violence. i'm working hard to implement that law, training the public, outreach, engaging with law enforcement. this is a critical gun violence prevention tool we have to keep looking for more tools, more ways to save lives like limiting people buying weapons right away. and raising the age to 21 before someone can buy a firearm. >> last september you watched california's first office of gun violence prevention. what have you been able to accomplish with that office and how do you keep that momentum building? >> we wanted to build it to our department of justice with resources and support and a formal institutional presence. the important work that we've been doing for years on gun violence prevention as well as a commitment to doing more in the future. it will be a place where we are housing the scaling statewide of successful gun violence

restraining order acts. places in certain corners of our state like san diego county do it very well where red flag laws are used to take guns out of the hands of individuals who are making specific threats to harm others that gun. but others can benefit as well. it will be a place where that same effective approach, that policy solution can be used in more places. it will also be a place where we are going to be doing more work when it comes to cease-fire type of interventions where deep interventions with a few individuals who are very involved in gun violence can be used to disrupt the gun violence going forward. it's one of the first if not the first of its kind in the nation where we are taking common sense gun laws that we have in california, scaling them and bringing them to every corner of the state. we've become a place where we have among the strongest gun laws in the nation as well as

one of the lowest viral mortality rates in the nation. those things go hand in hand me believe we need to continue to lead and push for things that are common sense, constitutional, effective. >> i want to turn to another issue threatening american lives and that abortion bans. michigan is an outlier state in this protecting of abortion. but your state is still planning on dealing with that and how is it planning on dealing with the possibility that mifepristone will be restricted by the supreme court or even by the circuit court? >> when roe v. wade fell due to the dobbs decision last year here in michigan the voters acted very quickly passed a constitutional provision that encapsulated roe v. wade into our michigan constitution so that we have the constitutional right to all kinds of

reproductive freedom in the state of michigan. i don't think it surprises any of us on your panel today that many who wanted to overturn roe v. wade, they weren't fervent believers in states rights they just wanted abortion to be completely legal and inaccessible. in our state we are going to continue to fight and do everything we can to make sure that abortion is safe and legal and accessible to all who need one. and we have a variety of tools and our tool belt to do that. keep fighting for reproductive rights. state.'ve also been funding for how do you maintain that fight and maintain that access?

>> in every way we can. we need to make clear that abortion care is health care. if you look at what's happening in texas right now with their restrictive ban on abortion it's requiring women to come close to death before they can get access to health care. for both physical health and mental health these abortion bans are going to lead people to die. this is something eugene said before, many of our colleagues said, this is about saving lives and we believe that argument can and will carry the day. it's worth noting that this ban on mifepristone is actually taking away the ability of states to make decisions for themselves. we in colorado will fight for our rights and we will fight for this basic principle that when the fda says a drug is safe it can't just be overturned willy-nilly by a court 20 years later after it is shown to be safe again and again. >> you joined a coalition of --

the uvalda to maintain access to the abortion medication. this is the same court with a panel of judges that seemed skeptical of maintaining access to the drug during this week's hearing. what is your read of that case and how you think it will kind of pan out? >> in california we have some of the strongest protections for reproductive freedom, bodily autonomy, choice and access to health care. we enshrined in our constitutions this past november that right in california state constitutions. we go to wherever the fight is on reproductive freedom, whatever is under attack, whenever it's being denied. individuals shoot who should have access to it, communities

of color, vulnerable communities women are being hurt unharmed we want to be there in that fight. the fight was where it was. it was in texas, and then in the fifth circuit, and then up to the supreme court. we believe that the u.s. supreme court was always going to make a final ruling on this issue. it will continue procedurally towards that potential ultimate solution. but we gotta stay at the u.s. supreme court level which makes mifepristone accessible throughout the nation for now. -- we believe that we are stronger together, i'm proud to work with nestle and wiser and all attorney generals across the nation who have similar commitments to reproductive freedom. when we do, we get results as we did hear. >> attorneys general wiser, bond, that and that's where police take around. after the break is aapi month and jewish american heritage month. we will discuss the state efforts to combat hate crimes during this important moment. trying to control my asthma felt anything but normal. ♪ ♪

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for both asian american pacific islander communities and jewish american communities. but it comes as the nation grapples with an increase of hate crimes against both groups. more than 11,000 acts of hate against the aapi community have been reported by stop aapi hate since march to those in 20. and the report released last year by the anti-defamation league found nearly 4000

incidents of harassment, vandalism, and assault heart targeting the jewish community throughout today's in 22. the highest number ever recorded in a single year. attorneys general wiser, breonna, and nestle are back with me. mr. bonta you are california's first filipino attorney general therefore i understand the struggles of facing the aapi community. how has that inform the way you spearhead laws and initiatives in your state? >> we all bring our lived experiences to our roles and mine is growing up in america and california as a filipino american. and when you arrive at a place where someone has never been before from your community it's important to leave with your values, bring your lived

experiences and bring your community with you. i became attorney general at a time of great pain in the asian american community. there were attacks and targeting on aapi community members and i said to the community and i say it now, i see you, i value, i am you. and i will fight for you and be by your side and defend you against hate crimes and right now we have a situation in california throughout the nation where people are being attacked because of who they are and where they're from and how they look at how they pray. and as well as who they love. it's wrong, we are better than that, it's gotta stop. we went out on a limb on addressing hate crimes from day one we created a racial justice bureau to stand up against the forces of hate, we created an outreach team to work with victims and impacted communities. we provided guidance to prosecutors so they can better identify hate crimes. we provided guidance on victims services the trauma informed and culturally competent. we ruled out a plethora of supports and defenses, accountability components for

the api community at the very beginning and that was because this is personal to me. in the middle of this epidemic of hate my mom reached out to me and she said i'm thinking about taking public transportation into the city, do you think i should? i could tell from her voice she was worried, she was concerned. i said mom, you might be safe but right now there are too many hate incidents happening and i want to make sure you are safe, so i will take you. that story between sons and daughters and mothers and fathers and grandparents and family members and loved ones has happened 1 million times all over this country. we should have to have that conversation. as attorney general i'm committed to getting to the root causes in addressing hate crimes. >> in march you were targeted

by a heavily armed man who threatened death to jewish members of the michigan state government. first off i want to know how you're coping and what happened to you, but also to talk about the legislation that you introduced last month to expand a definition of hate crimes? >> >> obviously it was an incredibly disturbing experience, all the enough i spent much of my career as a gay woman fighting on behalf of lgbtq rights for people in this state and around the country so it was interesting and sort of alarming to me with that the reason i've been targeted more than any others is because i'm jewish not because i'm gay. for a long time i sort of regarded antisemitism is something out of a 1950s movie. but unfortunately it has come roaring back more gradually than ever in michigan. we formed a hate crimes and domestic terrorism unit where we focused specifically on complaints about bias oriented

crimes and also against various domestic terrorism groups many which are white supremacy groups. in the new legislation that i am standing firmly behind it would actually expand the classes of groups of people that are involved to be protected by these laws and also increase the penalties. we are working as hard as we can but unfortunately there are more threats now than ever against people based on their religion or their ethnicity or sexual orientation or race than i have ever seen in my career. >> mr. wiser, let's stay on and antisemitism for a while. you have a personal connection to a holocaust as the son of a survivor. what is your reaction to seeing so many fellow elected officials and constituents being targeted by antisemitic crimes? we >> are living in a very scary time.

antisemitism is a leading indicator of toxicity and have real challenges in our democratic republic. if you go to the holocaust museum in israel or in washington d. c. you will see the lead up to the holocaust involved demonization, attacks on legitimacy of people to practice their faith. that is antithetical to what this country is about. my grandparents and my mom survived the holocaust and the u.s. army liberated my mom, when we go along with my grandmother. they came to this country because of what we stand for. we need to stand united against hate and recognize that hitting against any group, whether jews, lgbtq, asian americans, african americans. it is an affront to all of us. that is something that we work hard here in colorado, we've hate free coalition but is led by our anti-defamation league. we work to improve our hate crimes law here in colorado with other agencies. we pushed for the no hey act on

the federal level and have taken action in law enforcement responses on hate crimes and other acts that target individuals based on who they are. for example, operation daylight burglaries was in northern colorado targeting asian american business owners. we need to stand up for this basic principle that nobody should be demonized or subject to crimes based upon who they are. this nation is about e pluribus unum, for many we are one. when >> it's been nearly one year since the mass shooting at laguna woods church. authorities say the gunman was politically motivated by hatred towards taiwanese people. what steps have you taken to combat this violence in your city since then. we? >> the anniversary of the shooting with something that we

solemnly recognize last week and a hate crimes roundtable that i was hosting in anaheim it was one of the 13 big city in california roundtables that we've been hosting with mayors and community leaders to do just what you are referring to, to take action, to identify solutions that work that move the needle that save lives that prevent hate crimes from happening. we've listened through our outreach throughout the state we've identified the need to get involved at many levels from early intervention including education, i think studies, cross cultural awareness which will help better inform and prepare when

our community members to live peacefully in our diverse community. to realizing that many hate crimes actually majority of hate crimes in california were never identified or investigated as such. they were not worked up as hate crimes and hate crimes of course are hate crimes, they are comes against an individual but they are also crimes against the community. it is very painful when a hate crime the community knows is a hate crime is not investigated as a hate crime and not identified as a hate crime. we work with district attorneys offices, prosecutors offices across the state to be better prepared pant performed about how to prepare those hate crimes cases. and then victims services are

so important and community investments. i helped support multi millions of dollars, tens of millions of dollars to be invested into trusted community organizations that provide services to communities impacted by hate including victim services, preventative services. we see community based organizations that have earned the trust of communities and have served communities faithfully and well over long periods of time as critical partners in addressing hate. when there is no panacea we, we need to move the needle in anyway and everywhere we can all times. and harold. wayfair's got just what you need... performance fabrics, stains don't stand a chance. no chance! -woo! dog friendly and wallet friendly... pug-proved. get nice things with nice prices at wayfair. ♪ wayfair, you've got just what i need ♪

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charles blow mehdi hasan we'll be back next sunday at ap am eastern. >> i'm craig melvin. >> and i'm natalie morales. >> and this is dateline. >> it's gut-wrenching. we this young woman shot three times. this was a murder >> a young le