before we go, the congratulations are in order for some of my friends here at nbc after nearly a decade, announcing that they'll be transitioning to a new role in nbc news with more from the moderator and meet the press. there are simply no bigger job in this business and chuck has done it with tenacity and class. and infectious love of politics. so to chuck, thank you for every election you have walked is all through and we're excited for the next years msnbc. we also learned today that truck will pass the baton to kristen walker this fall. firm firsthand on a day's top incidents of the briefing room, she is the best of the best what he does from 6 am focused 11 pm wants to get the story right. in short, she is a complete and total bad. ask to chuck and kristen it is not honor to share these halls with both of you. that's does it for me today, but stay right where you are because there is much more coming up on msnbc. coming up on msnbc and breaking news this hour,

and nbc news exclusive, a new record that the federal grand journey and the classified documents case is expected to meet this week. it is part of the justice department and special counsel jack smith investigation into the former president. they're meeting after a brief hiatus. a very good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters in new york. welcome, everyone, to alex witt reports. this new report could signal a decision soon on whether to indict the former president. for more, i'm joined now by one of the authors up the exclusive report, msnbc's julia ainsley. julia, welcome. tell me what you found out. >> well, what we know is that they are, what we expect is that the grand jury in the mar-a-lago case, remember jacques met the special counsel is looking at the former president trump's involvement in this mar-a-lago documents, as well as january six. we understand the grand jury is looking at his possible obstruction and classified documents in mar-a-lago will be

meeting this week. that's after a long hiatus, and we know that they were already calling and some very high-profile witnesses earlier, which may signal that they were at the end. it could be after a long hiatus. it could, be were not reporting, this that prosecutors are able to present their case and before word with a vote for a possible indictment. we should point out that an indictment means that there are charging, they would be charging trump. that doesn't mean that they are finding him guilty. this is the grand jury process. it's a very secretive process. this is a term we hear a lot that says it's impossible, a grand jury could indict a ham sandwich. needing that an indictment is a pretty low bar. it could be that if they are at the stage where they were going to present this evidence to the grand jury to try to get indictment of him for an indictment, that could happen this week, or within the next coming weeks. this is something we're watching as we have this news now that they should be meeting in the coming weeks. as i could be that they want to

recall some witnesses. we're not sure about that. >> in terms of the details here on the question of whether or not the doj may be close to a charging decision an investigation, i do want to play with tim parlatore, one of donald trump's former lawyers today, on meet the press. let's take a watch. >> when the grand jury went quiet several weeks back, you know, i kind of looked at it and said, okay, this indicates that either they're coming to a charging decision, or maybe they are moving to the stage where investigations -- and now jack smith is going to start writing a full report. now that he's competing that, in your mind, is going to be more of a potential charging decision? >> not necessarily. i mean, certainly, it could be that they are continuing investigation of other things. it could be that the reason for the break is that the last grand jury simply expired. then they couldn't be a new one. i'm not sure, specifically, and i certainly haven't heard of anything new that would, you know, require this testimony. i can't imagine there's anyone

else in mar-a-lago to testify. >> frankly, he is covering all the basis with that answer there. do all of these possible direction sound plausible to you? have you, anyone on your reporting team, julia, have you've been able to get any clarification on which way the hearing is likely to go this week? any indication? >> no, in fact, that's why i want to be very clear in careful and thus, that we are not say in which way the grand jury will go. that is part of the reason why the grand jury brought such -- it was deliberately secretive. what we do know is that there are two central questions prosecutors want the grand jury to look at. it is whether or not the president, former president trump, should have taken those documents to mar-a-lago. did he break the law in doing that? and by claiming that he had signed over all the relevant documents to the archives? and, did he then for the wrapped up the investigation when his, when people came, and we know that fbi search about a

year ago now last august, as their obstruction apply. it's an underlying crime as well as obstruction. that's when we know that all this evidence is building to. put that in the report. is this simply new grandeur? we they're new witnesses they needed to call, and then took them longer to bring those forward? or, could they be moving towards a possible indictment? we don't know. that's what makes it newsworthy. the fact that they would've taken this long is there now a move. as we learn more, we will certainly report out. >> absolutely we will. in a few minutes, we will talk with legal analyst about this new development in terms of what it means, and former official olivia troye on the most alarm main aspects of the new audiotape of donald trump presents talking about classified documents. let's go to our developing news this. hour brand-new reaction after president biden signed the debt ceiling bill into law, off --

a catastrophic default word before tomorrow's deadline. officials on both side of the aisle give their opinions on the deal. >> both sides had to come together. i think if kevin mccarthy and his team, i give him a tremendous amount of credit for doing what he thought he couldn't do. president biden, and what he wants to, do what he does, he can do best, it's bring people together. >> the group feels that this was not what we would have done if we were all in charge. >> a lot of people voted for this because they have other interests, and kevin mccarthy has assured them that this doesn't mean that they are satisfied with his leadership. it doesn't mean that they are happy about the fact that they had -- >> tensions growing today after chinese warship comes within 150 yards of an american destroyer and the taiwan straight. this happened saturday join a joint canada u.s. mission. now, a new warning from china. we'll have a full report later on this hour for you. the growing republican field for president kicking off a summer of campaigning in iowa.

several hopefuls make their pitches to the voters in the first state with gop front runner donald trump notably absent. >> don't complain what you get in this caucus because it matters. >> we have a number of reports on this in the next hour, from capitol hill, to the white house, iowa. we'll go first to julie tsirkin, joining us from capitol hill. julie, welcome. what are you hearing from lawmakers today now that the president has signed the step deal into law? >> he, i will now that crisis has been averted, now we talk about what was in this ultimate compromise between the presidents, and speaker mccarthy. you heard from a variety of lawmakers on the left, on the, right in the center, what this bill meant to them. much of which, most americans will not feel the practical in packs of. there are some details in this, bill both that speaker mccarthy had to answer for today on fox news, and also, details that were publicans, like ken bakr you just heard from, also had to explain why he voted

against. one of these items, of, course as the irs funding. that amount, 80 billion dollars was actually passed by democrats in their inflation reduction act last year. it was one of those items that republicans campaigned on doing, so it was very important for speaker mccarthy to be able to negotiate something here, and they were able to reset some of those funds, though not nearly as much as they would've hoped, especially in that house had passed the plan. take a listen to what mccarthy had to say about this, and what congressman had to say on the flip. and watch. >> we just stop them from hiring any irs agents. it we also took another 20 billion going into the future. so i think, i think that would be good enough. instead, what would be the option, maria? to have a clean debt ceiling, and let them higher irs agents? and not get the 2.1 trillion dollar cut? or the work requirements? or the reform? our people to strengthen the military, but cut the

non-defense lawyer then 2022? >> i don't know where he gets these numbers now. 80 billion, as we had planned several months ago, we will spend 60 billion increase. that is what he is posted about, so i don't think his numbers are quite correct. >> look, some of these numbers are so tight it's a little bit of meant the magical gymnastics to get to some of these numbers. all in all, mccarthy spent all morning defending this bill, that he was able to negotiate. all while conservative republicans seem to slam him for this agreement on the other and. for example, can bucked it raised the fact that they will be looking into a motion today -- that is that concession that mccarthy made to some of the hard right members that could ultimately cast in his gavel. we'll be watching, that for sure. >> we thank you for doing so, julia, we appreciate that. okay, julie, sorry, julia was before you. we heard this morning from a former trump attorney who just resigned. he gave his take on what this new nbc news exclusive story

means for a federal indictment of president trump. what he says might surprise you. we're back in 60 seconds. seconds with align probiotic. you see... your gut has good and bad bacteria. and when you get off balance, you may feel it. the bloating, the gas - but align helps me trust my gut again. plus, its recommended by doctors nearly 2x more than any other probiotic brand. just one a day naturally helps promote a balanced gut. and soothe occasional bloating gas and discomfort. align probiotic. welcome to an align gut. (vo) this is sadie. she's on verizon, and she has the new myplan where she gets exactly what she wants align probiotic. and only pays for what she needs. she picks only the perks she wants and saves on every one! all with an incredible new iphone. get iphone 14 pro on us when you switch. it's your verizon. news on the trump classified

investigation. nbc news exclusive report with a federal grand jury is expected to meet this week after a hiatus. new reaction to report that jack smith has an audio recording of trump discussing a pacified document after he left office. here is one assessment of the significance of the audio. >> for a while, at, least there was a halfhearted effort to claim, by donald trump, that he could just magically declassify, you know, telepathically, or mentally, and this seems to reflect his clear understanding that he had not declassified this document. >> joining me now, olivia troye, former homeland security and counterterrorism adviser for

vice president, mike pence. and former presidents -- legal analyst. great to have you here. olivia, i would like to ask you about the audio in just a minute, because you've expressed some pretty interesting thoughts on twitter about. up first, what do you think about the nbc exclusive on the grand jury meeting this week? it doesn't mean that a charging decision might be here? >> well, honestly, i feel like the clock is to kane, and we know that trump and his legal team, and his inner circle have a habit of delaying things, elaine. things they will stall the process and any of these investigations, as long as they can. you know, we're looking at 2020 they're coming up, soon and it's important to move these investigations forward and get to the bottom of it. in the court of public opinion, the close of this election gets while trump is certainly, right now, the front runner on the gop, i think we really need to get these investigations wrapped up. the public is what, shane and i

think it politicizes up to a certain extent. if you broke the law, he should be held accountable. >> cynthia, let's take a listen again to what a former trump lawyer said about this on with the press today. here it is. >> now that he is convening that, in your mind, is more likely to be a -- potential charging decision? >> not necessarily. certainly it could be that they're continuing investigation into other things. it could be that the reason for the break is that the law jury simply expired, and they couldn't have a new one. i'm not sure, specifically, i mean, i certainly haven't heard of anything new that would require new testament. i can't imagine that there is anybody else in mar-a-lago. do you testify? >> when you listen to this, cynthia, all these reasons that he's given, are they all plausible to you? does anyone stand out is being most likely to you, given the big picture? >> well, there are all, like a teeny bit plausible. like 1% plausible, or 2%.

what is clear to me is that donald trump will be indicted, whether or not this is the, week or next week, but given all the information we have, i'm not convinced he'll be indicted. what has to happen, what makes sense to those of us who are in this businesses that you will take a break after you got all the witnesses in, especially if you finish with some of the more important witnesses, and then you got this big prosecution memo, which has to do with the facts, the law, and applying it. you look at the defenses, and then you counter whatever the defenses are. that memo starts at the deputy level, probably, and it gets approved. then jack smith, it'll get approved, didn't go through 17 other levels in the justice department where ultimately needs garland signature. that takes a while, and especially takes a while to get garland, because he's a nervous person. it wouldn't surprise me if this three weeks for a month is the time it took to do that but either way that is coming soon, is coming down the pike, and

any cooley drinking trump lawyer he thinks he's not going to get indicted needs to put the glass down. >> as promised,, olivia we mentioned the two viewers about the tweet that you put out there about the audio recording. first, of all you write that trump was obsessed with striking iran. we came close. you were there, olivia. what was that like, constantly worrying about trump's obsession of are going to war with iran? who was there holding them back, was a general milley? >> i think trump is seriously a very unstable, and unfit leader. he was very trivial when it came to matters of national security, and he did not have the grasp to understand the gravity of certain situations. noble strategic understanding of -- where some of these decisions were being discussed, and potentially being made. this goes back to 2019. i'm talking about late 20, 19 and early 2020 when the relationship between the u.s.

and iran was strange, and it was tough. they were people, certainly generals like general milley, who will say this. my own direct boss, pence's national security advisor, general kellogg, played a significant role at times when talking trump out of things when it comes to iran. said to myself, colleagues of mine have been talking to my self about this when this classified top situation can do a surface. we said, what do you think it is? this is what i meant. it was related to possibly iran, because of his fixation with this whole scenario. >> did he, did it spillover after he lost the november 2020 election? did the national security concern for you become greater that the iran strike might be used as some kind of a diversion to help them stay in power? >> absolutely. i worry about this every day. i worried about it every single day that he would do something

that would be on a grand, massive scale. and, look, the reporting says general milley did as well, and their leaders, there were discussions on with moving trump from office. these concerns are real, because the people who have worked on trump's candidate, who have served, and those have seen trump firsthand know what he's capable of. we know how he makes decisions, and how he makes decisions in his ear. and the greatest concern is that we're seeing these reports when it comes to intelligence communications, we're seeing these documents. they should not be out there. it's a disregard to the people surveyed in these communities, oppose our national security in danger. it doesn't matter because we can use this -- for the comments they've made about. it meets politics, and politics, all the time, this individual

at the rest to whatever else, it may actually impact. i hope that people keep that in their mind because this guy, he's potentially, you know, going to be the front runner for the gop again. i've said that. this is someone that, you know, we're seeing this play out, and he remains a danger to the country. i think it's hard for us to reiterate this. we cannot overstate. >> i will tell you, i'm glad you're doing, at tampa's it may be. that being said, what about the leak of the audio recording. could that speed up the doj investigation? >> no. i don't think it speeds it up. for me, i think we all know about the leak now, but let me suggest that we focus on this. there is the lead of the tape, where he's talking about mentally, because obviously getting more press than him, and saying that he was a danger to the jury. we have that part of what we

know about that lap top from margot martin, but she did a lot of interviews with him. there will be all kinds of other things on that laptop that have to be investigated. i don't think that that tape necessarily delays everything, but recognize that that is a treasure trove of information that may have linked and lee than the mastication. >> okay, olivia troye, cynthia 's fate, thank you. >> they, came they saw, they mostly try to avoid one topic, but not everyone escape that big gop iowa band without commenting on the front runner. here what was side, and whether or be qualified escaping. e qualified escaping and longer when you need it most. its non-habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil. (vo) sail through the heart of historic cities and unforgettable scenery with viking.

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republican candidates will expand even further. this is kicking off a busy summer campaign season this weekend, but donald trump escaping a big event in iowa.

at least one person took on the former presidents. nbc's -- is in des moines with the latest details for us. >> look, over the last eight years, republican party events around the country have been nominated by former president trump, and his supporters. that is what made this weekend here in iowa so notably different. >> a growing republican field to take on joe biden for president, kicking off the summer of campaigning yesterday in iowa. >> when i tell you i'm going to do something, i'll do. it >> notably absent, the former presidents. >> do you see that donald trump is not here -- >> i'm just happy to be. here i love the people, here i think this is a great event. >> senator joni -- leading the rothstein riots. former president, mike pence, not yet a candidate, but riding yesterday, expected to announce his challenge of trump this week. >> you can expect we'll be back in iowa and say. >> and a few more times after that? >> it's entirely possible. >> eight months in the iowa caucus, candid is just

introducing themselves. >> mingle lane, including with family members, among the crowds. >> is desantis your guy? >> i'm totally listening right now. i have not made up my mind at all. >> you've got two candidates. >> i'm not entirely with trump this time. >> nikki haley taking a shot of trump, posting on social media account, congratulations to kim john after the world health organization added north korea to its executive board. >> what did you make of donald trump? >> kim john is a tyrants. he threatened us, there's nothing to congratulate him about. >> a major announcement by the republican party this weekend, requiring every candidate to sign a loyalty pledge that they will support the eventual nominee, a pledge the party is required to make for the debate this august. >> are you preparing to sign that loyalty function? >> i will do what we need to do

to get on there. >> this week is expected to be a big one for this republican 2024 field as well. not only as former vice president mike pence expected to jump into the race right here in iowa on wednesday, but also, former new jersey general, -- and dakota general, are also expected to announce their own campaigns. we are eight months away now from the iowa caucus. >> we are indeed. thank you for that report. well, these are all the democrats who voted against the debt ceiling bill in the senate, as well as the house, and one of them joins me next to tell me the reasons why. he reasons why needs. she picks only the perks she wants and saves on every one! all with an incredible new iphone. get iphone 14 pro on us when you switch. it's your verizon. when you really need to sleep. you reach for the really good stuff. zzzquil ultra helps you sleep better and longer when you need it most. its non-habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil.

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we have just learned of a labor disruption at a major west coast port outside of los angeles. let's go to cbc's -- who's joining me with these breaking details. welcome, tell us about your exclusive reporting. what are you finding out? >> good afternoon, alice. what we just learned, the largest terminal and long beach has already notified truckers that they are going to be close tomorrow. they're going to be closed for protests. that is significant because they are the largest port terminal for a long beach, but they also have terminal operations and seattle. truckers are telling me they're also receiving word from other terminals that they're going to wave their penalties, if you. well it's called free. time they're going to be at an additional free time for their containers, and other terminals,

which they are telling me they fear the other terminals at long beach, at los angeles, in oakland, as well as seattle, will be closed tomorrow. that is the very latest. >> wow. has there been any response from the biden administration on this? >> we did reach out to the labor department to see, you know, what's going on. they told us they're monitoring the situation, and they hope that they can pick up where they left off a couple weeks ago, where they did make some concessions, and some agreements. >> florien, i fly a lot in and out of los angeles. ipoint when there were literally dozens of ships off of the ports there, because they were closed. i mean it was days and days. is there a concern that this could lead to some kind of supply chain issue as that incident did? >> it definitely can because of what happened says, picture the

box says, if you, well the containers. they are put out every day at a certain day you. got your loads. it increases congestion. we talk to the harvard trucking organization, who represents the ports. what happens is they can't pick up on what they're supposed to pick up on on friday. what happens, to put some perspective into this, oakland, which as you know, has not had operations since thursday, when they were shut down for five days back over the summer for the abc 5 trucker protest, it took two months for those containers to get cleared out. yes. it takes so much longer. i mean think about, it just the pile, it keeps getting staffed. and so the truckers are now telling the shepherds, you know, you may need whatever product it may be for back to school or whatever, it's going to be delayed. >> oh boy. this is unwelcome news, thanks

for bringing it to us. anyways now let's go to more defiance in a new warning from china. hours after a chinese warship buzz u.s. and canadian warships. the chinese defense minister in his first international speech telling the u.s. today, was the point i'm going to the south china sea? what does it have to do directly with your interest? he then called in the u.s. to, quote, mind around business. we are joined now with virginia congressman, gerry colony. a democratic member of the, house oversight and foreign affairs committee, and a good friend as well. welcome to the broadcast, sir. how are you interpreting the recent provocations from china, and how concerned are you overall about the relatively strait relations and communications we have with beijing right now? >> there is a very provocative action from the people's republic of china. it's not only in the high seas, it's in the air, it's in that straight, it's and creston on

the waters of the philippines, malaysia, korea, japan. they are claiming that the south china sea is their private lake. what the united states is doing is insisting on, and ascertain, the, you know, millennia long principle of freedom of navigation in the high seas. we are going to resist, obviously, chinese attempts to prevent that, or to encroach, or interfere with. am i worried about the growing strain between the united states and china, and india, u.s. allies and china? yes. it allows for absent communications allows for a lot of risk of miscalculation. the chinese don't understand us that wall, and i don't know that we understand them that well. the fact that they refused -- and defense to defense talks is a worrisome sign.

>> there's a lot of worries. we were just talking showing the video there that chinese fighter plane that flew very close and front of the nose that the u.s. reconnaissance plane. you see, even the backwash from the jets of that chinese plane. i mean, the turbulence that immediately comes, right there, i mean, that is nothing to mess with. that's dangerous, dangerous situation. let me ask you as we switch gears, sarah, the fact the your among the democratic lawmakers who voted against the debt ceiling bill that -- what kept you from supporting net? >> well obviously i would've voted for it because default is not an option. when i saw that i voted over 300 men in congress that voted for it. i had a look at the substance of the bell. does this bill reflect our values, my values, and is it a deal for america? the substance of the bill was not -- approving the pipeline, and

taking away judicial review so citizens affected negatively have no recourse, throwing at least a half 1 million people off of food benefits, not something that -- snow cutting 21 billion from the irs, ironic i thought we're talking about debts, nearly way to reduce debt is to raise revenue. you can't cut your way out of this. the irs's agency that collects this revenue, and they have -- on the table. >> do you think that democrats can recoup what you lost in the deal? >> obviously, this is going to be the fight as we proceed. i believe the white house was skilled at minimizing the damage, but it's hardly a motivation to say, well, it could've been worse. that's hardly a motivating factor. i, after people voted for, it i feel duty bound unconscious bound not to support --

>> understudy. wouldn't of cast a vote that way had you been a deciding factor, so that's understood as well. let's go to nbc news this exclusive reporting that the federal grand jury, in the class of five documents case is expected to meet this week. this comes days after a source told nbc that the special counsel's office has obtained a recording of donald trump discussing a classified documents about iran. this is after leaving office. how serious do you think this could be for donald trump? >> i think it's very serious. the special counsel that has been appointed by the attorney general is a very serious, diligent, fearless prosecutor. he is not going to be deterred by politics. he's going to look at the merits of the case. i think of donald trump's own mouth, he has incriminated himself. i think he has deepened his legal peril. i think that there, this week, they are really worth watching in terms of what might happen

to donald trump following this point of view. >> speaking of this, week i want to alert viewers about what you and i briefly discussed during the commercial break after the horrific attack on both of your staffers. both of whom are hospitalized after a man with a baseball bat came into your office looking for you. i know one of them is coming back this week. it is a brief update on how they're doing. >> i think that everyone is struggling, but is on the road to recovery. the brave intern who was experiencing her first day on the job is going to be returning this week. my staffers stafford a blows of that bat, including, unfortunately, a concussion. she is going to, obviously, dealing with some physical therapy and physical recovery issues for the foreseeable future. she is in good humor. i talked to her frequently during the week. i believe that we're going to

recover. it is a reminder that all of us in public life are subject to this kind of random compresses violence in today's political climate, and i hope that some lesson that everyone can learn about tons of the aisle. >> i hope. so i'm glad to hear that both recovering. and that interim, good grief, or stay on the job. anyways, blessings about them. i hope they're going to be okay. thank you so much. good to see you. it is another day of defiance of sorts for disney world against florida governor ron desantis, and for very specific reason, we're going to tell you what's playing out, right now in fact, in mickey's backyard. ey's backyard. y gum & enamel relieves sensitivity, helps restore gum health, and rehardens enamel. i'm a big advocate of recommending things that i know work. (vo) this is sadie. she's on verizon, and she has the new myplan where she gets exactly what she wants i'm a big advocate of and only pays for what she needs. she picks only the perks she wants and saves on every one! all with an incredible new iphone. get iphone 14 pro on us when you switch.

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try the subway series menu. their tastiest refresh yet. tens of thousands of -- lgbtq community are flooding to -- for the annual gay days gathering. it's one of the nation's largest pride month events. and even larger crowd than usual's expected today and defiance of governor ron desantis's feud with disney, and attacks on lgbtq rights. joining me now is nbc's priscilla thompson, joining me from orlando. priscilla, welcome to you. talk about the festivities, what's happening there, especially in light of the states push to restrict rights. >> yeah, alex, there are pool parties, there are, there is this expo happening here. of course, the big days of people heading to disney and their red shirts. i spoke to organizers who say that people can flocking their, wherein shirts that say, don't say desantis, or say get, i say

trans, all of those things to really stand in solidarity with disney during this moment as they are pushing back against governor ron desantis and the so-called don't say gay bill. organizers tell me that in the initial days, there was some hesitation as people got on the ground here in orlando, that they heard from some people who said that they were canceling their reservations, and weren't coming in over fear that they wouldn't be able to be out and proud here. as you mentioned, tens of thousands have still turned out. they are really making their voices heard in this moment. i asked the ceo, joseph clark, what the message is having this event here, bringing all these folks here to florida. i want to play a bit of what he had to say about that. >> people that are here are standing up against desantis. they want the music at the pool parties to be heard in tallahassee like i do. they want to shout out to say, no, we're here. what garage. look at the people who are at this event.

they're having fun. it's a community together. we're not doing anything that's hurting anybody. why are you coming after us? and when does that stop? >> the point that mr. clark really emphasized to me is that this is also about supporting the lgbtq community that is here in florida, and supporting those businesses, and letting folks know that there are people around this country in solidarity with them as they started to get out with the governor here over these laws that many people view as discriminatory. alex. >> absolutely they are. thank you so, much appreciate that, priscilla thompson there in orlando for us. in just this last hour, former fbi director, james comey, said something that will more than leave you shaking your head. it's about 2024 in donald trump. it is really that hard even imagine,. gonna want to hear next. to hear next.

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and the reaction today is nbc news exclusively reports the federal grand jury is expected to meet this week. former fbi director, james comey, wayne and on donald trump under indictment and more. here's what he said it short time ago. >> this is a crazy world that donald trump has dragged this country into, but he could be wearing an ankle bracelet while accepting a nomination at the republican convention. >> he could be wearing an ankle bracelet and be elected in november. >> yeah. it would be rejected if you put it on a script for rachel, but you could have a president who is potentially incarcerated when he is elected. we sounds crazy to be coming out of my mouth, that's the situation we face. >> crazy to be coming out of his, mouth crazy in the hearing. just pointing out, everybody, we're going to do that right now. joining me as my panel at nbc's political analyst, brittani pat

cunningham. most of the under started podcast. susan del percio, republican strategist, and david jolly, former republican congressman from florida. as i welcome all of you, brittani, was she euro action to what james comey just said? >> i mean, i couldn't agree with him more. you could not write, on more wild script if you tried, and we just finished the final season of succession. these are on television, yet, real life is still blowing all of our minds. look, i think we really have to consider what this means about the state of our democracy. this is a country in which far too many states incarcerate people, incarcerated people, can't even vote, let alone consider running for president while they're incarcerated. when we look at our standing across the world, when we look at the state of this country, when we look at the state of our democratic institutions, all of us should be worried. we should be making sure that this is handled right away, and,

that we prevent these kinds of atrocities from happening in the future. time will only tell how ready and willing this country areas to stand up for the ideals that it has espouses. >> it's extraordinary. people say when we discuss these kinds of things, and the prospect of what james comey said actually becoming true, like, how could this happen? because the founding fathers have not, in their wildest dreams, any envisioning of a convicted felon, potentially. right? running for office, or getting into the white house. it's a different era, that is for sure. but susan, too, you is there an indictment, or any new revelation that you think pushes donald trump out of the race, even disqualifies them, even to some of his most ardent supporters? >> to his most ardent supporters, probably not, what it comes to an indictment. the question is, what will donald trump's opponents say? will they be as locksley days a,

colors who, all about his indictment in new york. or, will they start punching him a little harder. that is the big question i have. really, the number to look at is his head to head against joe biden. those start to tank. when it comes to his base, the real maga base, they're not going anywhere as long as he's on the ballot. >> david, that's a good question that susan's going to pose to you. what do you think is trump's breaking point? when the voters will say, no. and now if. and what point is he done? >> prison, maybe. i agree with james goni, i asked myself every, day can we possibly alexa and buddy who is under indictment. that answer appears to be yes. what about a criminal conviction? maybe. what about somebody who has already lost their freedom been incarcerated, or has an ankle bracelet? we don't know that yet. alex, and susan knows as well, there is a theory of political

science. the myth of the rational vote. are at one point, when republican voters say, that the baggage is too great for donald trump, and he can't beat joe biden, and therefore, i'm going to move iran desantis, nikki haley, or someone else? we have not seen that breaking point. his numbers suggest we may not. and a head to head, razor-thin general election voters say, i don't want to guy under indictment. >> you, know we were in iowa yesterday, vaughn hillyard was out there at the joni ernst event. was there anyone that you all cleaned that starts taking a bit of a lead from their? anything that you heard? donald trump wasn't there, let's make that point. is there anyone you think came out front, running are feeling like the wind may be behind his or her back, brittani? you first. >> i mean, that is the question, right? i think the question that you just posed about when this base is finally going to abandon ship is a good one. especially when we realize that there are far too much of the

republican party has allowed, and will allow, in order to get that agenda done. i think the person who emerges as the person who is willing to stick to that agenda, irrespective of what might come and their way. and sadly, that person can still beat donald, trump but if it's not going to be, it's going to be the person who chose the party line. >> interesting. susan, david, and name from either of you, real quick? >> no, to me, ron desantis is still in second place. he'll stay in second place. one day, he'll realize that he can't appeal to trump voters as long as trump's in the race, so he has to shake it up. >> david, a name? >> yeah, i agree, ron desantis is the juggernaut, but i think everybody else is -- not because of donald trump's weakness, but because around desantis says. is the ceiling at 25%, as it appears to be, we will find out. >> okay. let me move to president biden haven't signed that debt deal until law before tomorrow's deadline. the president is praising the bipartisanship.

the agreement in his first oval office on friday from the -- on friday. how big of a win is this for the president, brittani? >> i think it's critically important. look, he said that we need to make sure that things keep moving forward. i'm hoping that now that this is been signed into law, that everything has been passed, that the promises that he's been making in the american people can continue to gain focus, and gain momentum. we need him to stay strong on student debt relief, especially as those challenges are coming from the gop to the courts. we need it to strengthen that social safety net, especially as those work requirements are added into that that sailing top by the republican party. he's gotta make sure, especially between now and election day, that he doesn't let mccarthy run the game, and the far-right doesn't lund mccarthy. >> how about you, susan? you've heard house speaker kevin mccarthy who is also calling the debt deal a big deal for republicans. who really won the debt ceiling deal? does it have to be, should it

be allowing the government to pay its bills? does that have to be defined by a party when? >> well, you can argue that the american people won because it happened, we met the need immediately, however this is the kind of thing the people won't remember come next tuesday, especially the four of us -- this is not something you get a win, from mccarthy, kevin mccarthy did a good job within his conference, and who certainly said that he have the strength to negotiate. again, i think kudos to joe biden for not giving up on the idea of negotiation bipartisanship. that being said, i just think it all washes away until the next crisis. >> what about david's, steve bannon? as you, know he's taking aim at a couple of noticeable house republicans like marjorie taylor greene, and jim jordan.

will he face primary challenges by, quote, real maga. he made these comments in response to a political article that detailed happen to lawmakers had mccarthy get the debt deal through. what kind of dynamic do you think could of march from this vote? do you think it up more far right republicans turn on mtg? >> sure. and kevin mccarthy. your true hard line conservatives know that kevin mccarthy's lines are a bunch of hot garbage, and this was a republican victory. i find it amazing that donald trump used to call -- i think we can start -- a democratic led coalition in the house and the senate deliver the votes to a democratic president to say the u.s. economy, and only kevin mccarthy was the one taking the victory lap. he is so out of touch with what happened in this past weekend, the brilliance of joe biden leaning into kevin mccarthy's arrogance, and to sit back and

wait, and then declare the moment of sobriety once the economy was saved by democrats. that is a beautiful contrast for joe biden, and a presidential cycle to show confidence, versus chaos. this is a good week for joe biden. well good before joe biden, and again, kevin mccarthy claiming a good. we will see how it all plays out as we always do. good to see you all. thank you so much. brittani, susan, david. good to see you. that's gonna do it for me on this edition of alex but reports, also you again next saturday at noon eastern. my friend -- continues our coverage. just mark it on the calendar. k it on the calendar >> hey, everybody, good to see, a six seconds earlier. good afternoon, i'm yasmin vossoughian, nbc news exclusive, information on a grand jury meeting this week in the special counsel's investigation of donald trump, raising speculation, a charging