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we expect trump to enter a not guilty plea as he has repeatedly maintained his innocence. he will be electronically processed like any other defendant. >> coming up, we will talk with somebody with plenty of experience investigating trump, and miami is bracing for any security concerns, and law enforcement out in force as trump supporter protesters make their voices heard. we are learning what comes after trump's court appearance. we are told trump will head back to new jersey to deliver remarks to supporters tonight. >> let's get right to it with our reporters on the ground joining us now, darsha burns, outside a golf club, and also a reporter outside the federal

courthouse. >> yasmin, let's start with you. we understand there's a greater presence picking up there. what are you seeing and what security preps are there right now? >> reporter: as i mentioned earlier, as we get closer and closer to the 3:00 p.m. deadline, where the president will likely show up behind me at the courthouse, and they are -- we don't have confirmation on the way, but there's only one way in. i was in a different location when i spoke to you in the last hour and that's because there's a bomb threat in the area in which we were, so they asked all of the individuals in that area, all of the crews and all the press to make their way this way as they are able to sweep the area. certainly there was a lot of nervousness and anxiety in

anticipation of what was going on and with that all of that there is certainly an increased police presence in the area and increasing supporters and protesters. i think that news was breaking that there will not be a mugshot just processed through the system, and as what happened in manhattan, there are t-shirts being printed with the mugshot on it despite the fact that the public will not be seeing that mugshot. again, they are expecting anywhere from 5 to 50,000, and they are getting louder and security presence is becoming more and more. let me just reiterate who is on the ground here for them, miami-dade police department, and miami has taken this very seriously as the major said yesterday at his press conference, as well. we will watch what happens with the sweep and hopefully make our way back to the area once they

are able to make sure everybody is safe and sound and that it was just a threat. for now, of course, we will remain over here to be as safe as possible. >> darsha, what can we expect out of the trump circle today as he comes out country club of his? >> any legal expert will tell you perhaps this is the most serious significant legal problem the former president has ever faced, but for former president trump this is about the court of public opinion, not what will happen to him in an actual courtroom today but about the politics of this. we have already received his team's first fundraising email of the day. we are likely to see more of that as he hosts a fundraiser later tonight. look, we have seen this from him time and time again, and he's playing this indictment the way he played the new york indictment, the way he has played all of the legal troubles that he has faced where he's using this to propel him in the

primaries, and he's using this to rally support and he's using this to build momentum in this presidential race, and you are going to likely see him double down on this later tonight. what will be interesting to see is if there's any sort of limiting factors from the court, from the judge in this case about what he can and cannot say, although we have seen in the past that that is very difficult to control when it comes to the former president. his gift in the messaging around these kinds of issues is he is able to say and convince his supporters that this is not about the system coming for him, this is about the system coming for all of those who support him, and that is why it becomes so difficult for his opponents to break from him and to go after him in this primary even though they are technically his rivals because they don't want to, you know, upset and turn off

so much of the republican base that is convinced by the former president that this is an attack on their movement, and that's been the messaging in the fundraising emails and i expect that will be the messaging tonight. we have already seen several truth social posts this morning, and i suspect we won't see or hear from the former president until we hear from him in bedminster tonight. we will likely keep an eye on social media where he will make his voice heard. >> thank you so very much. i want to bring in some of the top legal voices. senior legal correspondent, laura jarrett, and former u.s. attorney chuck rosenberg, and he's also a msnbc contributor, and also we have a former u.s. attorney. >> you have new reporting about the booking process and what will play out in that courthouse behind you in just about four hours from now. what are you learning?

>> yeah, there have been questions about a mugshot or a photograph of the former president. all along we have been told he will be treated as any other federal defendant when he enters that courtroom house. of course he is not a federal defendant but he is the former president of the united states, and handcuffs will not be used, and i was asking specifically about a photo, and instead officials plan to upload a stock photo and that's what they will use as their booking photo. that internal photo would not be made public, except in emergencies, and instead what will happen is he will go through the process in terms of having his hand electronically scanned and he will have to provide personal data, even though his personal information,

all that stuff will go through the normal booking process. as for the photo itself, despite there are fundraising efforts about his photo, and his likeness is something we are all familiar with, there will not be a formal mugshot here today, i am told, guys. >> and the justice department is talking about a speedy trial, and what kind of a timeline are we talking about here? >> well, josé the three greatest defenses in any criminal trial are delay, delay and delay. we can expect trump's attorneys to file motions, substantive motions, motions that will be of great weight and impact, and a motion to suppress the search warrant. that will take time. judge cannon may appropriately

delay the case based on motions put before her and appeals that follow those motions, either from the prosecution or defense. in addition to that, one has to acknowledge there are legitimate reasons for president trump to want to delay this case. he's running for president of the united states, and that takes time. if he has to dedicate himself for running for president and a judge could listen to that and say i will allow some reasonable amount of time for continuances. one other factor here, josé and ana, is that president trump faces other criminal trials currently in manhattan and may face criminal charges in a different jurisdiction as well, and if all that occurs judge cannon would be right to listen to and pay attention to these requests for continuances, and the trump team will undoubtedly be hoping that as a result they will arrive at a time after the presidential election, put this off as long as possible and benefit their client, former

president trump. >> what if this does run into the presidential election? what could we expect to happen? i know that there is a policy, right, about not taking any kind of moves that would potentially influence the election, as far as what the justice department does. chuck, how do you see that playing out? should we get close to the 2024 election? >> you are quite right, ana. there's a department of justice policy long-standing, reiterated by attorneys general of both parties, and many administrations that the department of justice is precluded from taking overt investigative steps for the purpose of, and that's an important part of the language, for the purpose of interfering in an election. obviously this case was indicted long before the election and none of the steps were taken for the purpose of interfering in an election, but you run into all sorts of other problems.

paul is quite right, we always will do well to listen to paul charlton. this case could be pushed many months if not years, and it could extend beyond the next presidential election, and if mr. trump is returned to office there's a whole host of different policy considerations including the long standing policy of the department of justice that you can't indictment or try a sitting president, so there's a lot of chapters left to be written. there's a long path ahead of mr. trump and the prosecutors, today, is really the first step. >> you know, laura, in this world of first steps, unusual being almost usual now, the former president continues to be consistent in his attacks on the justice department and jack smith specifically. could he face any legal consequences for these attacks? >> well, that's a good question.

i think at some point this is going to be an issue for the justice department. obviously they are very concerned about their team member's safety as all prosecution teams that we have seen that have gone up against the former president are worried about, and on the other hand he has a first amendment right and like any other criminal defendant to provide a vigorous defense. he's allowed to talk about how he thinks it's being prosecuted unjustly like any other defendant. he's not allowed, however, to make threats and he's not allowed to do anything that would be a direct threat against anyone on the prosecution team. i think it's something to keep an eye on. i think it's something clearly judges are atuned to. we have seen at least one federal court judge keep a jury anonymous because of what he has said on social media, and it's clearly something they are worried about. >> paul, i am curious as to the

role of walt nauta, trump's coconspirator in the indictment, and he traveled to bedminster with president trump just now, but if he were to flip, what do you think that would mean for prosecutors? do you think it would be worth frying to flip him? >> undoubtedly. you bring charges against multiple defendants and you invite one or more of the defendants to cooperate against their coconspirators. what you have to be careful of is you are rolling the small fish, if you can use that phrase, up against the big fish. prosecutors will be talking to mr.nauta's lawyers, if they have not already done so. in my experience as a prosecutor, what often happens is when defendants are forced to

look at in a realistic fashion, trial, possible conviction and time in prison, and he faces possible prison, and it's then in that point in time that discussions with defense attorneys become much more important and realistic and defendants and defense attorneys will say it's time to consider cooperation, so ana i think we can expect prosecutors are talking to his lawyers and are undoubtedly saying no at this point in time, but let's see what happens as this trial moves forward. that attitude may change. >> there are so many more questions i would like to ask each and every one of you, and we are just scratching the surface in all of these discussions. thank you very much for all of that. coming up, how would the race for president play out with the leading republican candidate facing trial? we are going to break down the political fallout. first, jack smith is also

investigating trump in his january 6th attack on the capitol. you are watching special breaking news coverage live of trump's arraignment, only on msnbc. but now that i got the inspire implant, it's making me think of doing other things i've been putting off. like removing that tattoo of your first wife's name. inspire. learn more and view important safety information at inspiresleep.com.

donald trump's handling of classified information is just one part of special counsel jack smith's mandate. the special counsel also looking into trump's role on the january 6th attack on the capitol and his efforts to overturn the 2020 election. >> let's discuss this and more now with california congresswoman, zoe lofgren. she has taken part in all four modern impeachments dating back

to nixon. she was a member of the house of the january 6th committee, so you have so much perspective you can offer to this conversation, congresswoman. let's begin with the indictment in happened against donald trump in the classified documents case. what do you feel is the most concerning when it comes to national security based on the evidence laid out in the allegations in this indictment? >> well, that he mishandled these documents so severely. it's not cited in the indictment, but there were documents so secret that some of the fbi agents couldn't look at them because they didn't have a high enough clearance and that they were left unguarded in public spaces. we know that spies have infiltrated mar-a-lago and so you know, that's a concern. it's very reckless. it's just terrible. he conspired to really obstruct

the fbi from completing their search warrant and, you know, the whole thing is a mess. you know, we will have it all sorted out in a courtroom. but it really was very disappointing to read the indictment. >> congresswoman, i was struck by your comment that spies have infiltrated mar-a-lago? >> sure. we know of one woman that paid her way in. we would be naive to think that our adversaries are not penetrating this place. anybody can go. i mean, there's no security clearance to go to a wedding in the ballroom where those boxes were stored. there's no security clearance on the bus boys. there's no security clearance, frankly, on people that want to join the club. it's just about paying money. it makes me very concerned that these highly, highly sensitive documents were basically available to the public. >> congresswoman, this is such a

unique time we are going through as a nation, and ana was mentioning that you have worked in three presidential impeachment proceedings, and you were a staff member during richard nixon. what is your perspective as what we as a nation are going through right now? >> it's wrenching. certainly the ex-president has his supporters and understandably they are stricken by this turn of events. but i remember, you know, when nixon got in trouble, you know, at the beginning, people were defending him, but as the facts emerged, that defense had to fallaway because there really wasn't any defense. by the time he resigned, his approval rating was in the 20s because people had to face reality. now in the modern world, is there a reality anymore? we have these various sources of

information that purport to define what is real as what is unreal, so that is very different. but in the end, the truth will come out in this courtroom and a jury of his peers will reach a judgment, and that is definitive. >> one of the big differences here, versus nixon, of course, is there are many, many different investigations into this former president and this indictment, the federal indictment regarding the classified documents is one of two indictments he's currently facing, including the manhattan d.a.'s hush-money probe, and there's still another jack smith special investigation, the january 6th part of his duties. because of your january 6th committee role, i am curious as to what you think is happening in that case, where that one goes from here? >> well, both cases, the georgia

case and mr. smith's investigation, have to do with the president's attempt to effectuate a coup. i hope they are pursuing that vigorously, because it was a big threat to our constitution and our democracy, and that threat continues. i mean the ex-president already indicated publicly that if he is re-elected he intends to suspend parts of the constitution, a shocking declaration. i hope it's under way. we, in our investigation, did a very thorough job. obviously we couldn't get all the information, for example, mark meadows, his chief of staff refused to come in and talk to us. it's my understanding he has gone in and testified to the grand jury. we can't know what he said. he has substantial criminal exposure. did he assert his fifth amendment right? i don't know. but if he actually testified

fully, he knows everything and it would be, i think, extremely damaging to the ex-president. >> i keep thinking, congresswoman, what happened with nixon, he had just been re-elected and watergate happened because of that, and the impeachment of former president trump was once when he was in office and once when he was out. this is the beginning of a presidential campaign. what are your concerns about having a trial in this case in the middle of an election? >> every effort should be made to have the trial promptly. i mean justice delayed is justice denied. i think having mr. smith saying we should have this trial promptly, and i have heard other former u.s. attorneys say the rule generally is you start the trial within 70 days of the indictment, so i would hope that is the model. i do think, though, mr. smith

didn't file this indictment for political reasons. he filed it because there was evidence that severe conduct endangers the nation, and that's why he did what he had to do. nixon resigned because when people found out -- republicans found out what he had been saying was a lie, they went to the white house and told them, you know, it's time to go. that was an era when shame existed, and people were ashamed of what he did. now the ex-president sort of revels in shameful activities and supporters enjoy it, so it's a different environment we find ourselves in. honestly, i struggle to understand how shame disappeared from american society. >> we are in uncharted territory in so many ways right now in which the society in which we

live. congresswoman, thank you for taking the time to share your insights. appreciate it. and then today could significantly impact the race for the white house. some of trump's republican rivals are starting to shift their tone on his indictment, but will it be enough to knock him back from leading the pack? >> you are watching special news coverage of donald trump's arraignment live here from miami only on msnbc. with downy infusions, let the scent set the mood. feel the difference with downy. we know patients are more than their disease. that's why, at novo nordisk, we've spent a hundred years developing treatments to help unlock humanity's full potential. these are the greats: people living with, thriving with — not held back by — disease. they motivate us to fight diabetes and obesity,

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former president trump's appearance in court marks a historic day that could shape the 2024 run for the white house, as we know. >> senator tim scott calling the case serious, but still slammed the doj as targeting republicans. nikki haley said if the allegations are true, that would

mean trump was, quote, reckless. that's a harsher line coming from her than she took initially after the indictment was revealed. joining us for more is vaughn hilliard, and also with us, former republican congressman, and also an msnbc political analyst. let's start with some of the rhetoric we are hearing in the campaign trail in the last 24 hours, chris christie going further than many of the other rivals taking on trump here. >> i am convinced if he goes back to the white house the next four years will be about him settling scores. he has shown himself, and particularly in his post presidency to be completely self centered and self consumed and doesn't give a damn about the american people in my view. >> it's interesting, because trump is still the leading

republican candidate by far according to the most recent polling, so a lot of voters must not agree with christie. is that your sense out talking to voters? >> that is, over the last week and over the last months and years, i have yet to run into many republican voters that suggested to me that the investigations are a concern to them. i have met republicans that said they are open minded looking beyond donald trump but not because of the investigations. when you look at the new poll that came out in the last 48 hours, among the likely republican voters, 76% of them believe the political indictment is politically motivated, and chris christie, this republican field, it's a music festival. over the last two months, since trump was indicted in manhattan,

his lead over desantis doubled. he has only seen benefits from the indictments and prosecution, and he called it political prosecution and what has been laid out has been defended by republicans, and it took a little more of a concerned tone, because largely they only needled donald trump and his political endeavors moving forward instead of taking them head on and this could suggest that there may be a new direction for the candidates as he's set to appear in court here in miami. >> congressman, according to new polling 3 out of 4 likely republican voters call trump's indictment politically motivated, and how do they run against trump that many in the party believe it's a politically motivated attack? >> it's a tough situation for them, but what a lot of the candidates are figuring out you

can't beat donald trump by following him and you can't beat trump by praising him and you will have to distinguish yourself at some point. you see nikki haley and tim scott trying to do that now. if you just go out there and praise donald trump every day, all of these republican primary voters are just going to continue supporting him. these candidates have to decide, do they want to survive in the primary and keep the small percentage of the vote they kurptly have, or do they want to thrive? the only way to do that is going at donald trump and explaining to republican voters why what he did was wrong and why they need a different candidate to represent them against joe biden in 2024. >> trump has been putting his spin on the narrative and the messaging regarding what these charges mean, but a plurality of republican voters according to the same polling is they would prefer trump not talk about the

investigations into him and would rather he focus on his vision in the country? any chance these voters could get fatigue from the trump legal drama and it could hurt him politically? >> that's a good question. trump in many ways is a celebrity and a tv show, and a lot of people, the reality tv shows, people get tired of them. these candidates are going to have to take this argument to the voters and explain to the voters that donald trump isn't that ideal candidate. there's evidence to back this up. in 2022, all of the swing states lost their elections. it's difficult but republicans are going to have to make this argument. they are not going to beat donald trump by following him, by praising him and attacking the justice department. >> meanwhile, the former president is set to return to new jersey tonight. he will be delivering remarks

this evening and what can we expect? >> i asked an aide what we should expect and his response was, quote, a defiant president trump. that's all we have seen in the past few months. this is a man that promised retribution if he is to get back in the white house. he flew back down to mar-a-lago and addressed a crowd for about 30 minutes after he was arraigned in new york city. he already posted multiple social media post in the last hours continuing to suggest that the fbi planted documents at mar-a-lago. of course, there's no evidence, and his legal defense team never presented evidence that was the case, but for donald trump this is so much about winning this republican primary electorate. there's an echo chamber in which the republican primary electorate has existed from fox to news max to oan and truth

social. they only heard donald trump's side of the story and those allies around him. if folks were to open the indictment you would see the justice department present a different case than the one donald trump purported to the millions of americans looking to him. when you are looking at his polling support it continues to be firm here and we are only 7 1/2 months away, and donald trump will use this as not only a legal defense but his own political defense. >> thank you both very much for being with us this morning. the city of miami organized a massive security operation around this unprecedented event here at 3:00 p.m. local time. >> let's get to one of those officials. joining us right now is mayor of miami, francis suarez. thank you so much for taking the time. let's start with the security. how is your city managing this historic and widely-watched arraignment that will happen now in just a few hours?

>> well, you know, we are accustomed to having large-scale protests, large-scale events throughout our history, and we had a meeting with the chief of police detailing our collaboration with the county and our federal partners to ensure the people that come to protest can do it peacefully, respecting their constitutional rights, but that law and order is maintained. that's what is essential. we want to make sure that president, the former president is able to get in and out safely and we want to make sure that any of the rallies that happen pertinent to this event will happen in a peaceful manner without any unnecessary confrontations between the police and protesters or protesters that may have a different perspective. >> mayor, i know the city in south florida has historically dealt with this, and i am thinking back when noriega was

tried in the federal building, and there's reporting there's no barriers around the courthouse. i know this is a federal issue, and should there be better defense mechanisms for the federal courthouse? >> it's their building, as you said, josé, and they have indicated to us what they want and were trying to follow what they are asking us to do. right now the latest report that i got is about 100 people, and it may be a little bigger since the last report that i received. i am actually going to go on site after this interview and see myself. we feel confidence the forces we have and the ones that are at our disposal should be able to manage anything that happens throughout the day. >> we're looking at live images overhead where we see perhaps protesters gathering, and could

be looky-loos, and there's a lot of media on site as well. you are talking about a lot of police lights, and there's heavy law enforcement presence around the courthouse right now. what is your message to protesters or people that may be heading down to the courthouse today? >> my message is, we respect the constitution and respect your right to protest and to have a perspective on this matter but we want you to do it peacefully. we are a city that abides by law and order and we are not going to tolerate anybody that hurts somebody else or damages peoples' property, and particularly a lot of small businesses are in that downtown location, so we feel confident people will listen to that message and that today will pass uneventfully. that's our hope. >> mayor, how has the communication between before all the different security forces that are in and around that area? >> you know, josé, so far so good. have not heard any complaining on our side. it has been seamless.

there's constant communication, and i have been constantly communicating with my chief and city manager. so far there have been no incidents and we follow leads here and there on things that could be a concern at any given moment, but nothing has risen to anything, and there seems to be order and control, which is what we are hoping for. >> before we let you go we continue to see new comments on social media from former president trump that are rather aggressive, and attacking the prosecution in this case, the doj, the special counsel, jack smith, this morning calling him a thug. those comments obviously are not helpful when it comes to fueling potential violence, like we saw on january 6th. so i throw that out there. what is your thought on those comments? are they helpful? ? >> my thought is, like i said,

my message is for everybody that wants to protest, do it peacefully. we don't want to do anything that is going to exacerbate the situation. you know, the former president, you know, can say whatever he wants to say, that's up to him. far be it for me to give him any sort of political advice, but my perspective as the mayor of the city and as the person in charge with making sure this all happens peacefully is i am going to project calm, and i am going to project confidence and i am also going to ensure the people they can protest and follow their first amendment rights and be able to exercise their first amendment rights in a way that doesn't create conflict and in a way that allows them to express their opinions whether they are in favor or against what is happening today in a manner that will not risk their safety. >> mayor francis suarez from the city of miami, thank you for being with us this morning. appreciate it. >> thank you, josé. joining us again, and let's head back out to the courthouse,

and yasmin is there, and also a national security journalist and author of "becoming bullet proof." back with us, rob demeco, a former member of the fbi's hostage team. as we are discussing the security situation, i understand you have new information about law enforcement investigating an object near the courthouse. what can you tell us? >> yeah, so i want to be clear here. things are super fluid, right, and we were moved from one camera position to another because we were told there was some sort of threat, something happening in the area in which we were standing. we are getting this information, and it's trickling in to us minute by minute, and so things may change, again, minute my minute. here's what we know. i saw a picture of the

suspicious device that we have seen, and they have called in the bomb squad to investigate this suspicious device. we are being told this by police officers along with our own security officials on the ground. again, a suspicious device found near the area in which we were in front of the courthouse. the bomb squad is being called in to sweep the area and investigate the suspicious device, and as soon as that area is cleared we can resume activities back in that area. from there we can also talk about the increased security presence overall that we have seen seeing since i arrived here a couple hours ago until now, and it's about almost 12 noon, and we are about three hours away from when the former president will voluntarily surrender himself to the court. we have seen miami pd showing up, and we are hearing choppers above as well, and as i

mentioned a little earlier, the street behind me where we were expecting the former president and his motorcade to show up is completely barricaded awaiting his arrival, whether or not he's going to come through the center of the building and give a wave like he did in manhattan, or go the underground way is still in question. we have the buildings in front of me, and behind this federal courthouse are public buildings, civilian buildings so it's harder to maintain security if the former president wanted to make a public appearance or give a wave even to his supporters. protesters are showing up, more and more. it's somewhat of a circus, maybe looking at 50 to 75 people, and a lot of costumed folks as well, and doesn't seem to be any sort of credible threat at this moment. as the mayor just said, there's a major security presence here on the ground.

i will mention this, ana and josé, there are no barricades put in place and we thought maybe they would put barricades up after this device that was discovered, and so far nothing like that was erected. in manhattan, there were barricades in place where we could not physically cross, and there's yellow tape we cannot cross. >> i have seen these pictures here of downtown miami, and it's an area where we grew up -- >> you are familiar with it. >> sure, it's close to the police department and close to miami-dade college, and it's an area -- i just want to bring you back to the issue of the hardening of it. nbc news learned some federal officials expressed concerned

there are no hardened barriers outside the courthouse. what do you make of those concerns? >> it's interesting, because during your previous interview it was mentioned why were there not barriers, and you were told it was because of the marshals, and this is where you see the jurisdiction of each agency saying this is the way we want to do it. i think it's odd to not have some type of physical barriers and i think it would be in the best interest to put those up, and yellow tape is not going to do much, even if you have security bodies, and do they help deter people from doing something? absolutely. but always having that hardened barrier there gives you a little bit of a buffer. the other thing we were discussing before was the arrival departure. historically, the arrival and

departures, that's the most vulnerable point. it will be interesting to see if we see him come through the front and wave, or in the secure area where nobody sees him arriving or departing. if you get that wave and public view, not a wise division, and you make him vulnerable, and there are civilian buildings around and you can't secure all of it, and you have high-level views, people from apartment windows and buildings, and ground views, and we are seeing a little investigation occurring with a device somebody left behind, and that's another concern, any baggage or devices anybody left behind, and how close are they in proximity to the courthouse and the protesters and the public. >> would the defendant have a choice in which way he comes in and arrives, for example, if the

former president said take me outside because i want to wave to my supporters, would that be something where they would listen to what he says, or is that out of his -- totally out of his control and out of his hands? >> i love that question, because that's one of the dualities that happen. i would think secret security would say no, and i can see the protecty in this case, trump saying i want to go out front. if we are talking purely security, they would say, sir, we strongly recommend this, this makes you susceptible. we are going to see in the end who wins that debate when we see the arrival. >> let's talk about that debate. you know the courthouse so well. is it a soft or hard target?

>> a courthouse is a hard target. when you start looking at things, there's gaps and vulnerabilities there. i heard it was agreed that he could go into the underground parking lot, and you can always change your mind. that was the initial agreement that they would come in that way, and maybe at the end, though, if he comes out and does a walk and talk, that could really rile things up. that's where mayor schwartz talked about going out on the ground and that's great, because he will get a feel of the crowd you can't get from cameras, and the intensity and you start to hear things, and the fact that he is willing to go and take a look at it and bring in some of the racks and things, but that didn't work on january 6th, and those were there and they were used against the police. the marshals office can ask, do

we have an upswing and where people don't feel like they are getting boxed in. >> got to leave it there. thank you so much. thank you for helping us discuss this security situation. today is such a historic day. up next we will ask a presidential historian what the following hours mean for this country? >> you are watching special breaking news coverage from miami on donald trump's arraignment only on msnbc. hat lets her pick exactly what she wants and save on every perk. sadie's getting her plan ready for a big trip. travel pass, on. nice iphone 14 pro! cute couple. trips don't last forever. neither does summer love. so, sadie's moving on. apple music? check. introducing myplan. the first and only unlimited plan to give you exactly what you want, so you only pay for what you need. act now and get iphone 14 pro on us when you switch.

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♪♪ ♪♪ welcome back to our special coverage of the indictment of donald trump. we have new comments this morning from first lady jill biden about the indictment, while president biden remains silent on the matter. the associated press is reporting that jill biden told

donors that she finds it shocking how many republicans, quote, don't care about the indictment and still plan to vote for trump. >> mike memoli is with us. what are you hearing, mike? >> reporter: we keep hearing a white house strategy of doing everything they can to not comment on trump's legal woes. the white house is well aware of how republicans are accusing without any evidence president biden of weaponizing his justice department to target political opponents. president biden as a candidate in 2020 was clear in promising he would not treat the justice department as his own legal defense. that's a promise president biden has reiterated himself of late. telling peter alexander at a press conference that he's given no direction to the justice department on any prosecutorial decisions whatsoever. that's what makes it so

interesting, given how much white house officials have avoided commenting on even the smallest developments on this case why it was interesting to hear it from the first lady. she was referring to a poll that showed that republican voters aren't factoring in this indictment into their decision. she called it shocking. she talked about the maga extremists and a steady commander in chief like her husband. she said, we can't go through the dark days of the past. we've lived through this. in these intimate settings, they're being a little more candid. president biden is just continuing on with his job. he's going to be meeting with

the nato secretary general, an important conversation as he is preparing to attend a key nato summit next month. >> mike memoli at the white house. trump's indictment marks the first time a former president has been charged with federal crimes. joining us now is doug brinkley. >> professor of history at rice university. doug, great seeing you. how do you see the stakes of this trial? >> first off, i'm nervous about bomb threats and the fact that there might be violence. with january 6th still fresh in our minds, as a historian on february 15, 1933, fdr gave a speech in miami and there ended up being a nut there who not only shot at roosevelt and

killed the mayor of chicago. security is the most important thing. my other main thought is john adams said no democracy is ever lived. they all commit suicide. our democracy has lived. we will commit suicide if we didn't prosecute donald trump because he has flaunted the law. he had many chances to give back these classified documents. he's jerking the american public around and he really truly is an ex president that still thinks he's president. so we have a big problem in our country and today's just another moment of trump throwing america off the real issues at hand, whether it's homelessness, climate change or the economy. >> douglas, you've to studied so

many past administrations and leaders. what struck you most when you read the indictment? >> first of all, how well it was written. it was carefully done, how judicious it was, but mainly how damning it was. anybody who reads this can feel that donald trump is guilty as charged. he admits it himself. the problem is he doesn't think -- he never thinks he's done anything wrong. his hero was roy cohen. during watergate roy cohen had -- four times he was being charged just like donald trump for all sorts of perjury and conspiracy. the lesson trump learns is don't be nixon, don't quit, don't leave. roy cohen taught trump to boot it further down the line. alas, it's not about justice prevailing on this tuesday. this is a long-range story that

has many manifestations yet to come, particularly because it's playing in the backdrop of the 2024 presidential campaign. >> 13th of june, 17th of june of '72 when that burglary happened in washington, d.c., in the watergate. someone said we're living in an era where there's no shame. do you think there's a change in our country? >> i do. i think we've stopped having a sense of public service. that idea of john f. kennedy had in his famous inaugural that we all have to do something to help our government, help our country. we've become largely spoiled in the united states. we've taken for granted how lucky we are to live in a society where your vote matters. there's been good news. we have did run free and fair

elections and joe biden won by 10 million votes. donald trump threw sand on that, convincing a lot of conspiracy-minded people that he was the elected president, that led to january 6th. we have all the presidents in the american history and they're in a club of their own and there's donald trump, an outlier. he's getting his comeuppance in miami today. >> doug, so great to have you with us. thank you for joining us. that wraps up our special coverage. stay with msnbc. andrea mitchell is coming up right now. good day, everyone. i'm andrea mitchell in new york, joined by chris jansing and katy tur. it's the first time a former president will be