could change your life. (bright music) >> this is sky news at 11:00. here are the headlines. >> russian mercenary leader,

yevgeny prigozhin called off his rebellion after 24 hours of mayhem. roadblocks to stop his wagner forces are filled in, as the crisis is diffused. after a direct threat to his leadership, the questions over vladimir putin's future. well forces in ukraine assess how the turmoil will affect the progress of the war. also this morning, the public toll, they can now call 999 after earlier technical fault. plus, labor calls for mandatory help for homeowners struggling to meet rising mortgage payments. and the princess of wales takes on roger federer as she praises the work of ball girls and boys ahead of wimbledon. good morning. now, the rebellion by the

russian mercenary leader yevgeny prigozhin appears for now, to be over. the russian president vladimir putin called it a knife in the back of our people, and said that his forces were traitors. but a deal has now been negotiated by belarus and the kremlin, said the rebel leader will be allowed to leave the country and his fighters will not be prosecuted. our moscow correspondent diana magnay reports. >> yevgeny prigozhin cheered by supporters after bringing his country to crisis point. it was a rebellion that ended as quickly as it began, armed wagner mercenaries leaving rostov-on-don less than one day after they took it over. a deal swiftly struck, to call off his troops. >> translator: the time has come when blood might be shed. therefore, conscious that russian blood might be shed by one of the parties, we are turning our columns around and moving back to the field camps. >> in return, prigozhin was

sent into exile in belarus, they are no charges against him, they are dropped. other volume rebels will not be prosecuted either, despite president putin's tv addressed 12 hours earlier, threatening punishment for criminals lunching armed meeting. >> we are fighting for the life and security of our citizens and our territorial integrity. it is an attempt to subvert us from the inside. this is treason in the face of those who are fighting on the front. this is a stab in the back of our troops and the people of russia. >> wagner forces have seized the city of rostov-on-don, a crucial launchpad for russia's offensive in ukraine. then, followed chaos and confrontation. prigozhin declared himself on the hunt for justice, accusing russia's military chiefs of killing his men. an explosion shook a second city, voronezh. and a miss out narrowly missed a military hala talk to their,

but oil decker was also set ablaze, with a convoy of wagner fighters heading for moscow. authorities scrambled to build roadblocks to slow their advance, but as yevgeny prigozhin's mercenaries junior, there was an unexpected u-turn. a deal brokered by russia's key ally, alexander lukashenko of deliveries, has led to the man once called putin's people step back. he is now leaving russia, his future, and that others wagner mercenary group uncertain. putin may have faced on the greatest threat in his 23 year grip on power, but images of troops preparing defenses in moscow, and the threat of armed insurrection could do lasting damage to the kremlin and the authority of the president. diana magnay, sky news, moscow. >> now as the wagner military leader heads to belittle's, things are slowly returning to some kind of normality in

russia. wagner forces have been continuing to withdraw from the voronezh region. local people have been posting videos which show military vehicles and buses with flags, driving on the highway in a southern direction. russian authorities started to dismantle those roadblocks overnight, in the pep screen, midway between rostov-on-don and moscow, excavators were seen filling in an improvised moat which they had hoped would make the road impassable for wagner troops. let's remind ourselves how events unfolded. this all happened very quickly yesterday, it began early on saturday morning, ian rostov-on-don. that is when wagner group forces occupied the headquarters for russia's military operations in ukraine. they then seized control of military facilities in that on the edge, but 100 kilometers south of moscow. a mercenary convoy than events north on voronezh, along the

m-4 motorway towards the capital. russian forces then erected it defensive positions and blockaded main roads and bridges along the route, that is before the order was given for the mercenaries to then stand down. we can now get more from diana magnay, who is in moscow. >> you do it wonder what it was that that mercenary column would or could have done once they got to moscow. would they have taken the defense ministry and key military installations here? what they have needed considerable support from security forces within moscow to do that? perhaps, yevgeny prigozhin failed to realize that would not come through, is one possible theory. i think it will be interesting as well to see when and if we hear or see seguin show you the defense minister or valery gerasimov, because the kremlin said last night that their future it was not discussed as part of this deal. but seeing as apparently they

were the targets of prigozhin's wrath, it will be good to see them and you do wonder why vladimir putin could not just you know, listen to prigozhin, get everyone in one room together. he is the commander in chief and negotiate some kind of arbitration between all of these warring factions. but that is not the way that he plays his people, or his politicians or his military forces. so we have the situation that we have. it is an extraordinary situation. i think people are in russia, as we are in the west are wondering what on earth happened in the last 24 hours. i think also it seems a little suspicious. you think about what the outcome is actually are now, of course we don't know what kind of power prigozhin will have when he goes to belarus, whether putin will let him have any at all, but if he does, then you have a powerful, violent man with many troops at its posable in belarus, or

president lukashenko is essentially at the back and call of vladimir putin, and any case, and his health is in question. i would imagine the kremlin has been looking around for alternatives. so forgive ghani prigozhin, that would suit him find to have a powerful position in belarus. it does not bode well for the ukraine offensive going forward. so i think lost we talk about the damage that this may have done, to vladimir putin, in terms of his authority, the fact that you know, he could have, he was facing off an apparent threat from the inside, which essentially is his worst nightmare. we must also consider the fact that if he is still palace with prigozhin, a powerful prigozhin in belarus is not a good thing for you can either. and it is a good thing for vladimir putin, if he does not feel cushion, if privilege and's wrath is only ever directed towards chicago and gerasimov, which he always says it, was but knows he must stay that way in this system. >> that was diana magnay for us in moscow we can get more on

where this leaves vladimir putin and the effect on the progress of the war in ukraine. with me in the studio again, christopher steele, former british intelligence officer with mi6 and the former british army intelligence and security officer, philip ingraham, lots of intelligence in this room. gentlemen, you can enlighten us. christopher, to you first, this did not succeed but june the 24th, that might be seen as the date which really put a big, fundamental change in the armor of president putin. what would've come next if they have succeeded, do you think? >> i think this is the fundamental problem with russia, as it exists now, and putin's offensively hollowed out, there are no state architectures which can kind of constrain an order of the political process in russia. russia is very much to come in sort of medieval court, and autumn in court, where there's assaulted on top, and fighting factions underneath. and there's nothing that really formally regulates any of that, and the need policy making to

boot. i think the problem is that if and when putin goes, you have this vacuum underneath, we will be able to tell what will happen and sort of a conflict will break out. >> certainly, those who might be eyeing up succession will be thinking that this is a pivotal moment? >> yes i think he has lost authority, as a result of this, he has appeared weak and of course the two things that he has brought to russia, supposedly which are well funds to biloxi are both disappearing for the moment because of his catastrophic war in ukraine. >> philip, regimes like this stay in power if they can come and really a triumvirate of elites, armed forces and the people. how do you see what happened yesterday affecting putin's control over the three of those? >> what it is done is it and brought a lot of the controversy going on around his special military operation, ukraine, more to the attention

to the people. because i can't hide it digging of the roads up outside of moscow and everything else. >> he's now filling them in. >> he's feeling the pain as quickly as we possibly can. the elements are keeping him, these military elements. but goshen's whole piece was about attacking the ministry of defense shoigu and his overall commander, gerasimov. >> now we don't know what's has happened to them, so prigozhin may have succeeded in his operation, if they are both moved out of post. and then you got the security, federal security organization, the fsb, under patrushev, and his positions in there. he should've been on top of this from a security perspective, it is one of those individuals, the architect of everything going on inside of ukraine from 2014. it's illuminated a number of weaknesses in that power base, keeping putin in position. >> prigozhin, gone off into

exile in belarus. that is not the end of the story there, is it, as far as the wagner mercenaries? we are told they are absorbed into russian military. do you think effectively they are neutralized as a threats to putin's authority? >> yes, but to make a point, buddha courts head of the fsb, patrushev is a security, former head of the fsb, defense in charge of internal security in russia. in terms of the threat, i think it's very hard to say. it's very difficult to know, very dangerous in a sense to have a group of mercenaries, people who have been released from prison, and people who have been paid significant amounts of money to fight, to see where they would go, and how they are integrated. and if you have them on the frontline, i think one of the things you must remember over here is is a whole business franchise, effectively, underpinning wagner. that is what is uncertain, now. what happens to all of the resources, the gold, diamonds, money laundering, the crypto

that wagner controls in the world, which is amounting to billions of dollars. how is that managed going forward? >> what do you think prigozhin will be doing? he will be going to play bingo in minsk, is he? >> difficult to tell. i still think fundamentally, he is a businessman. i suspect there's a strong, business element to whatever deal was cooked up yesterday. >> and philip, where does this lead, what is happening in ukraine? how do ukrainian forces try and make the most of the situation where putin's eye is off the board? >> from a tactical perspective today, yesterday and tomorrow, it makes no difference whatsoever. the russian defenses have changed, the monuments, anti tank traps are still there, troops are still in the trenches. >> they have not heard about, it do you think? >> even if they have, their primary focus is on surviving, to survive they have to fight and stop the ukrainian counterattacks. ukrainian counterattacks are continuing to go in and, we see

them going in just north of bakhmut, it's been reassessed by uk defense intelligence put out today. free access north of bakhmut, one going down south of the donetsk, moving into the boundary between donetsk and zaporizhzhia oblasts. then the other one is going down to zaporizhzhia down towards talkback, and what's with that if they were successful, splitting the land bridge that so important for russia, from crimea helping to russia. that's the tactical level. on the operational level, ukraine has an opportunity over here to disrupt the command and control that has been destructive at the highest levels but what has been going on with prigozhin, by attacking further command centers, logistics centers, all of the rest of it in russia's rear areas. that's where i would hope ukraine would focus on that. >> okay, all right. again, i am being told we are out of time. but really good to have both of you and your analysis here in

the studio. thank you very much indeed, christopher steele, philippe ingraham. now, the government could block pay rises for public sector workers, rejecting the recommendations of independent pay review bodies. the chief secretary to the treasury, john glenn told trevor phillips earlier that ministers must take account of the effects on inflation when deciding on pay rises. >> now what happens is we have the report pay-per-view bodies, most of those have come in. then we look at those and make an assessment. now obviously, in some of the disputes we have had in recent months, they are near to resolution, we are very pleased that several of the nhs unions have agreed to 5% and then 4%, and have seen different changes across working practices. we will look at those paid if you bought reports, that will be the prime minister, given that the chance for together, with input from what the right way of resolving this is.

>> meanwhile, labor is calling for more support for struggling homeowners because of the effect that interest rates are having on mortgages. last week, the chancellor, jeremy hunt agreed with measures with lenders like extending the term of mortgages or converting to interest only payments. but the leveling up told -- helped should be mandatory. >> we estimate significant numbers of people will not be able to access any support at all unless the measures become mandatory, so all mortgage players, not just some have access, to give them more accessibility to extend more key trims, to be able to shift from one type of mortgage to the other. >> you are watching sky news, do stay with us. coming, up discarded investigation reveals a rise in hospital admissions due to child the ping. child thpie ng

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the ambulance crew answered her phone and said we are with your daughter, working on her now. >> rosie had had a heart attack, caused by the sudden collapse of both lungs, a bilateral pneumothorax. her brain was charge of oxygen, and two days later, it was made clear that she would not survive. rosie was 18. >> her lungs were just massive holes, blisters called blips, and they bilateral pneumothorax,

the re-scratching their heads. >> there was no postmortem, no official link made, but rachel is convinced it's because she started vaping heavily six months before. since then, vaping has been increasingly scented as a cause for serious illness in younger people. figures obtained by sky news revealed that in the ear april 2020 to 2021, there were 11 cases were children and young adults aged 19 or under were admitted to hospital, either directly due to vaping, or with the practice cited as a factor. two of those were no older than nine. but the following year, that figure almost tripled to 32, with 12 boys and girls in the younger age bracket. and in the past year, the numbers rose again, with a total of 40 cases. 15 aged just nine or younger. for many smokers, vaping has been the key to quitting what is the biggest preventable cause of death.

but children's chest physician, professor andy bush says too much is still unknown about the effects. >> if it teenager starts to smoke cigarettes, probably the worst which will happen to them is they will be sick and throw up behind the back shed and not look very clever. the use of e-cigarettes could put them in hospital, put them in intensive care. things like lung bleeding, lung collapse, air bleeding, lungs filling up with that. >> it was he started vaping at 17. rachel watched as she became more and more addicted. >> now, it is pretty clear on here these are not for under 18. in fact, it is illegal to sell vapes to children. but when you open the box is, what hits you first off is a real fruit he smell. then you can see the bright colors. this one even looks like lip gloss. so you can understand why these appeal to young people. and they cost about five pounds each. >> the government is clamping down on rogue firms unlawfully

targeting teens. it set up vape enforcement squads to track down traders selling to young people. the uk vaping industry association welcomes the move, but wants 10,000 pound fines given to those selling them. it also points out that 76,000 people die from smoking each year, whereas not a single confirmed report of a death from the evening. rachel has made it her mission to tell her daughters story to any child that she sees with a vape. >> it is a strange thing, the world, she is not in it. i forget sometimes she is not in it. >> so much is unknown about the impacts on young lungs, but what is clear is too much is at stake to ignore the risks. emma birchley, sky news. >> joining me now is caroline johnson, conservative mp for sleep with and north high come, and in a jeff pediatrics doctor. it is very good morning to you,

caroline. your reaction to that report and the age of children that are suffering severe health problems because of vaping? >> well, i think it is hugely concerning to everybody, the number of children who are now taking up the being as essentially a habit. the locals call it in sleaford, it should turn their admitted to hospital in the last few months due to complications following vaping. >> so what do you propose? i mean it is illegal to sell vapes to anybody under 18, but obviously they are getting into the hands of children pretty regularly? >> what i brought this forward a bill brought forth by one mp in february of this year to ban disposable vapes, because these are the brightly colored candy flavored, cheap and easy to get rid of vapes that are so attractive to children. the government also brought

forward a consultation looking at banning, even for the sort of refillable they, the colors, the flavors and the consultations for the process which is complete now. >> and how easy do you think that will be to get the industry to change the packaging? is that sufficient? >> while the industry maintains the vine that this is a stop smoking product, not an alternative addiction or lifestyle product, which i'm not sure that is how it is advertised in my view, but that is what they say. and if that is the case, they would not have a problem with stopping the colors and flavors because that is what is attracting children. and i don't think anyone wants to children or anyone else to be addicted to these products. >> to be clear, we are talking about the products which are sold on the normal market, these are not black market products. kids are still getting sick from them? >> yes. and black market products or potentially even worse. the local police said a symbol of those to be professionally

tested. we found products like antifreeze, trichloroethylene, varnish, all sorts of different substances in these they pass, which is potentially extremely dangerous to these children. >> and you are mentioning some of the health problems, hospitalizations of kids in your constituency. what kind of problems were you seeing? >> so, what is been reported to me, reports of children collapsing, children having experiences where they feel like, they physically collapsed, they feel like we are watching their collapse from above, beside where they are. really quite scary report of one young man, who was in the back of his mother's car, being brought to the hospital, he had lost the side of his face, droop on one side. so really quite frightening symptoms. >> are there perhaps -- are their unexplored, almost neurological side effects from this, particularly in children?

>> with a simple fact is we just don't know what the long term effects will be on the deal on children or adults. that is why it is one thing to make them available to adults, smokers who wish to quit, and change known harmful substance for a substance which is not currently known to have harmful, long term effects which we do not know, it is sort of this change of known harm to potential harm. but for children who were not nonsmokers, it's important they don't start vaping. we need to stop that. >> yes. the not prohibitively expensive as part of the problem. would you go as far as to call for an additional tax on them? >> oh, i have. so i met with the minister, spoken to the chancellor about this. because actually, the industry would agree that something a vape delivers around 40 or 50 cigarettes worth of nicotine,

in a single disposable unit. so a single dispose what you would cost four pounds, worth amount of secrets we cost 32 pounds. so this massive potential to tax them. they would be cheaper for smokers witching to quit, the outside of the pocket money range for children. >> right, karen johnson, good to talk to you. thank you for your time. >> thank you. >> let's have a look at the weekend whether. >> warm memories -- >> warm memories - >> warm memories - s plastic makers are investing billions of dollars in new technologies and creating plastic products that are more recyclable. durable. and dependable. our goal is a cleaner, healthier planet for generations to come. for a better tomorrow, we're focused on making plastics better today.

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you sophy ridge on sunday. hello, i'm trevor phillips, sitting in for sophy ridge, who is away. well, you mark them to the top of the hill, and then again, this morning, yevgeny prigozhin is off to belarus, probably with pockets stuffed with moscow gold. having humiliated the russian president. yesterday, very putin called his former ally a criminal trader and promised to crush the rebellion. this morning, the mercenary leader received a pardon, even before there has been a trial maybe mr. putin should have paid more attention to hillary clinton, who once rather wisely said, you can't keep sneaks in your backyard and expect them only to buy your neighbors. back home, who is up, and who is down? well, there is no sign of the labour party's political and advanced, they think they are up. the conservative government seems helpless in the face of stubborn inflation. so most people reckon they are

down. north of the border, there is chaos in the ranks of the scottish party or their finances, but the nation is still split over independents. so maybe the snp is neither up nor down? well, the next 60 minutes we will try to work out who is right and who is wrong. plenty of important domestic matters to talk about today, not the least the economy and inflation. which we will get to shortly. but let's start this morning with some immediate live action to the events in russia from the government. i am now joined by the chief secretary of the treasury, that is john glenn. good morning, mr. glen. >> in morning, trevor. >> now the government emergency response cobra, met yesterday. what is the government's understanding of the situation in russia this morning? >> you are, right cobra was

convened, chaired by the foreign secretary. this is fundamentally an internal matter for russia. obviously, observing it, it is obviously a very unstable situation in russia, but it is fundamentally an internal matter we were alongside our allies, the conversations being had over the last 24 hours, but obviously civilian interests are considered, they seem to have done that. but this is not a matter which we would be intervening in, we would observe and monitor the situation on an ongoing basis very carefully. >> i know the diplomatic line which is that it is an internal matter, not for us to comment on and all the rest of it, but doesn't this alter the equation in ukraine, where we have invested billions, and where we have an interest? >> we as a government have been committed from the start on supporting ukraine, and their battle against what putin has done. we will continue to remain focused on that. we continue to train troops,

support with military support, and we are united with our allies in leading in that effort. that will continue, that is a separate matter to what is happening in russia over the last couple of days. >> did i hear you say that we sent troops to the uk? >> we have been training troops. i visited them in salisbury plane later -- earlier this week. >> this involves no interruption, no escalation of our effort? there are some people who would now say that actually, this might mean an escalation by the russians in their assault on ukraine, the wagner mercenaries now, we understand they are being integrated with russian troops. so might this be the moment for a bit more support, for mr. zelenskyy and his team? >> we will work very closely with ukraine as this situation evolves, as has evolved over the last few months.

that is our primary focus, supporting ukraine to deal with putin, in whatever form that attack takes and it has evolved over recent months. so nothing's changed with respect to the british government's position in supporting ukraine. obviously, i recognize these concerning events, and what has happened in russia, but as i said we will remain closed to our allies. cobra has evaluated, alongside our allies what has been happening. they have urged concerns of citizens to be taken into account. we believe this to be an internal matter for russia. >> well let's talk about the things that are internal to us. >> the economy. >> your control, the economy. let's start with that. inflation in this country is running much higher than incomparable countries. for example, we will compare with the eurozone, and the

americans. the americans are down there at 4%. it's not actually just level, the fact that the americans inflation is down a bit, the eurozone is down a bit, and ours is stuck at 8.7% now we know the bank of england has got its one club interest rates, they put on 50 basis points this week. let's talk about what the government can do. give me one thing that you in the treasury are doing to tackle this inflation? >> as chief secretary to the treasury, my responsibility, fundamentally, primarily used to control public spending. that is an incredibly challenging job at this time. because we have a three-year comprehensive spending of two years back, obviously these inflationary pressures barrel down across all of our public expenditure, our cap spending, on day today expenditure.

keeping a grip on public spending, making tough decisions are re-prioritization, putting efficiency in savings reviews into the preparations for the last fiscal event, the last budget. and obviously, you will know that the chancellor asked me to lead a productivity review, which i am now undergoing that will happen over the next few months, looking at how we can control public spending in a difficult time, we still deal with many legacies from covid. >> all very sensible. explain to me how any of that has any bearing on that 8.7% figure, in the next few months, which is when it is hurting? >> well i can understand, i really do understand, because i have a constituency, you know me, they have concerns about higher interest rates for their household budgets. there's no single quick lever, i could give you a stand by -- >> i am just asking you for one contribution. >> well i think there are three

elements to the government's response. the independent monetary policy interest rates which you have described, controlling public expenditure, and then helping with those additional costs. so we have helped with those energy bills, they extended that in the spring budget. but -- >> thank you for coming down, anyway. the big thing here is mortgages, isn't it? >> can i just point out that i think by putting one screenshot on your screen, you failed to show the fact the interest rate pressures across europe and across many of our allies, australia, canada, the u.s., interest rates have gone up, the fastest rates since the 19 80s. this is a common experience. obviously, you are right asking what is happening in the uk, i am telling you that. what i am saying it's not one single thing i can do, which will resolve this in one month. >> okay, fair enough. you make a good point, actually. the problem for us is that ours is stuck, what others are going down. let's, let's interrogate some

of those things. >> please. >> let's start with the bank of england, by the way. you don't have control over what the bank of england does, but you do have control over who is running the bank of england. and where transport secretary colleague, grant shops told my colleague sophy ridge, mark hopper, i beg your pardon, told my colleague sophy ridge earlier on this week, that he thought the bank was too slow? >> well we remain, in the treasury, completely aligned to the bank. they, as you say, have a responsibility for interest rate policies. they have had them for over 25 years. if you look at it over those 25 years, they have been pretty effective in keeping it to the 2% inflation target. these are incredibly difficult times. they have made their decisions, the npc committee made the decision last week, we worked closely with them, in lockstep

with them. they are independent of us, so they make those judgments. you would not expect me to comment on that. >> there have been a few, from what you are said, andrew bailey, safe? >> he has an eight-year term, he was appointed at the end of 2019. i work very closely with andrew in a previous job, when he was head of the fcm, and we support him and taking the decisions necessary. >> so 45 inside for mr. bailey. can we deal with one other thing, can we stop talking about tax cuts now? that's not going to happen, is? it >> well, you know that we never talk about measures before fiscal events. obviously, the headroom that we have had previous fiscal events in the spring, it is now in a different state because of the interest rate payments we have to pay. basically, we shut down the economy, spent a lot of money. when we come out of covid, we have a lot of debt interests to pay, that has gone up because interest rates have gone up and

that makes our public finances very challenging, to significant, once in 100, years once in several generational events in europe. ithe government is here to deal with whatever circumstances are happening, and we are taking the right decisions at a difficult time, as the imf indeed endorsed in a recent assessment of the uk economy. >> i'm taking that as an answer that tax cuts are not on your agenda. >> i think the prime minister made it clear, the chancellor made it clear that our priorities not inflation, but the dominant threat to the uk economy, and that is what we are was focused on at this time. >> glenn, thank you for your time this morning. wonderful. wonderful. a kid... and harold. wayfair's got just what you need... performance fabrics, stains don't stand a chance. no chance! -woo!

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and the political situation and scotland. yes, prime minister had to stop a speech after allowed intervention by a heckler at a special conference lead to set up how the -- would respond to defenders. heckling is the worst of its worries, it was still mired in chaos following financial -- and arrest. the polls are looking pretty

grim for the party that have dominated scottish politics for so long. i'm joined now by the first minister, hamza youssef. good morning, mr. youssef. >> prior to your intervention, it's unfortunate that every poll that has come out, we continue to be a party that leads every other party and scotland. so that's a very kind intervention. >> kind of you to say that. we'll come back to that in a second. you said yesterday that you would make the next general election of referendum on independence. does that mean that is your predecessor that if you got 50% of the vote, you would consider that a mandate for independence? would it also mean that you didn't get 50%, you just drop it? >> first of all, that's not what i said. it's what's reminding people

the preferred option, the option for which we have multiple mandates for. the option for the majority of the scottish parliament backs that is that legally binding referendum. that has been denied time and time again by the uk government. my message is pretty simple. we will use the next general election to test the composition, the simple proposition that puts the people in scotland on page one, line, one of the manifesto. this is a vote for us college become an independent country. if we win that general election, we will negotiate with the government how we can -- to that proposition. of course, as i continue to reiterate, the uk government and westminster parties continue to deny us the right to a referendum. >> forgive me. when you say, if we win that election, what does that constitute? does that mean mostly for scotland? 50% of the vote? what does winning the general

election -- >> i'm happy to clarify, i suspect that you have covered more general elections and i have been involved in campaigning. every general election, i think the rules of the general election, the party that wins the most seats was the general election. if you want to test our proposition for popular support, which is a fair enough as to do, in fact that's what we want to do. if you want to test this by popular vote, you do that via referendum. that's more than any -- for the means of a general election are thus, the party that wins the most seats once that general election. >> okay, so if you win more seats than anybody else, you are not going to take that as a mandate to push for a further referendum. both were to sumac and -- have said that it doesn't matter what comes up, you're not getting one. what are you doing to force their hands? by the way, it is illegal for them to say that. >> first and foremost, --

i'd put it to sumac ferry simply. you continue to tell scotland, a voluntary union, then prove it. if you're saying you can't have your independents via referendum, and any mandate given to you by general election, this is a voluntary union, have a way for school to become independent. the question you ask is a fair one. the second part of my speech, one of my main arguments is that it's so important for us to be sure that we have a consistent majority supporting independents. while, of course, will be campaigning in that general election, what we're doing right now is campaigning to make sure that we have that consistent majority in scotland that supports independents. it's the power of the people that i don't doubt will beat -- >> them be get clear something here. we're talking about democracy.

it's, the general election, either rishi sumac, and kurson are in downing street. they will have gone to a country with a manifesto that says that we're not going to have another referendum. they will have one. and what way is it not democratic for them to fulfill their mandate given to them by a general election of the united kingdom? scotland is not independent yet. >> while the two points -- belabor in scotland, so if we win the general election in scotland. if you are seeing that scotland is continually denied a referendum because they are outvoted by the fact that the uk has more seats, then that is the democratic bases that we are continuing to wheel again, some afraid. there is a deficit in that regard. you are essentially saying the

rest of the uk allows you to become independent, allows you to have a referendum. that's the only way you can become independent. that doesn't sound like a voluntary union at all. >> okay, all right, we could talk about, that but let's go to the circumstances in which you govern. perhaps the best way of dissuaded everyone that's collin should be independent is to have a brilliant performance by the government in scotland. let's address a couple of issues to petito westminster -- 's for example, the nhs. you are responsible for it in scotland between may 21st, may 21, and marched 1923. the number of patients and scotland's up 780,000. over 18,000 people died waiting for treatment. that's a 39% compared to 2019.

it's not a settled record is that? >> you are suggesting that somehow that's unique to scotland -- >> i'm not suggesting it's unique, i'm just does not good for scotland. >> it's the proposition that it's the promise that undermines your question. that would be third, of course. the global pandemic, buys definition, it changed services around the world. the pandemic is the biggest shock -- in a 75 year existence in terms of the nhs in scotland. -- the best performing for well over seven years. there's only one nation in the uk that didn't lose a single data strip in the nhs. that's scotland. when it comes to those longest weeks in the nhs, if you look at those people who have been -- there have been dramatic -- for impatience, outpatients, in those waiting for diagnostic tests. there are challenges.

i won't pretend otherwise, but that's part of that global pandemic. we're absolutely focused on re--- you know it's not connected to anything in westminster. that was pretty normal. the copy of nhs, without recovering or social gear. there are challenges you have, of, course including brexit. ask anyone in social care they will tell you how much of the workforce we lost -- >> were wandering a bit away from your governments performance. it's still not better. >> if you want to talk, if you want to talk about scotland's record, it will show that because of our actions, an estimated 90,000 children were lifted out of poverty. if you want to look at our record, just last week a report shows scotland outpaces the

rest of the uk in terms of direct investment. if you want to talk about our record, we have the best performing department in the entire uk. if you want to talk about our record, we have more young people lifted out the deprived area as them ever before. i can go on and on if you'd like. ultimately -- >> nobody would say that you are responsible for some of the, let's call them, shenanigans that have taken place in the party. you have inherited a situation that has damaged the f mp. let's clear up one thing. are there any circumstances in which you would move from the msp and former first minister, nicola sturgeon? >> i'm not going to answer hypothetical about what might happen in terms of investigation. you should know better than that, of course. it's been appropriate for ministers of any elected politicians who of course

commented on what is a live police investigation. >> i'm just as again, -- >> i can't imagine circumstances in which she would lose the web. >> i'm not going to make a -- they have not had the party membership suspended to repeat that situation under review. this investigation is one of knocking to comment on. >> you do except that this has been pretty catastrophic for your party the chief executive of the party was arrested in april, missing 30,000 members of a luxury motor home worth 110 pounds. did you know any of that when you stood for the leadership? >> no. i made that clear at the time. i'm not going to argue with

essential proposition. it's been a difficult few months for the parties resistant -- i have to make sure i do everything to ensure that there are stability in the party, that we are open and transparent. that's why i instruct governance and financial oversight, financial review. the party is conducting that at the moment. i'm trying to galvanize our party, that's why we had such a great convention here in the city of dundy just yesterday. so despite all those challenges, the opening that the interview, we are still the most popular country and scotland. we have the most members than any political party here at scotland. that's a pretty good base to build upon. >> i want to give you the opportunity to respond to what i think some people say. you've been a very senior member of the government for a long time. that's almost a decade. it's hard to understand, but

you would not have any consciousness if any of these issues until after you became elected as the parties leader. you can understand why that seems bizarre to an outsider. >> not really. no one's as that question before because people genuinely understand that you could be a member of the government, that doesn't mean that your senior member of the party. i've never had a position of the party in almost 20 years. i've had a number of pretty tricky jobs that have kept me busy a government, whether it's transport minister, secretary, or health secretary, as you just mentioned a couple minutes ago. i'll be upfront, u.s. ministry question. do i know about the latest issues that you raised before the remains of public media? no, the answer to that is basically no. >> prime minister, thank you for your time this morning. great to talk to you.

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