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it got a prigozhin, the leader of the wacker group, abruptly called off his armed rebellion. mid march to moscow. after agreeing to a mysterious deal reportedly brokered by the president of belarus, alexander lukashenko. prigozhin may have a problem back down for now, but he has exposed some very real cracks in putin's power. it's hard to imagine things going back to where they were. over the next, hour we're going to continue digging into a number of the big questions around the events in russia over the last 48 hours. what is going on in moscow, what does it all mean for putin, ukraine? we're going to start on the ground, joining us live from moscow's kier simmons. i know you've only been there for a short period of time, here, but what is happening on the ground right now? what are you seeing on the ground around you? >> i just arrived in moscow, jen, you can see for yourself. behind me.

one of the main thoroughfares in moscow, and it looks like ordinary life. you might even say mundane. and that, in itself, is sunday when you think about the events of the past 48 hours, when you think that i could've been standing here talking about russians fighting russians on the streets. when you think that president putin who, on a number of occasions throughout his history, has reached out and supported other leaders, had to have another leader, from belarus, support him in the past 48 hours. that's the first time that has happened. i think another way to describe it is that russians, and people here in moscow, frankly are in disbelief. and listen, there are national guard on the streets, a little bit today, but it's just nothing like the scenes that may have played out. another important point. rust dove, the city about 100

miles from here, that the wagner group took over, essentially. stunning pictures there of people cheering and taking selfies and pictures as they left. and as you get a prigozhin left. those, i think, those pictures will be studied very closely by the kremlin. >> now, president putin has been pretty quiet over the last several hours. is there anything you're hearing from russian officials today? do you expect to hear anything from them? >> we heard from dimitri peskov announcing the deal yesterday, today we've been hearing from the ministry of foreign affairs, not commenting, jan on what happened. and i suspect what you will see from the russian government is an attempt to just move on and make this business as usual. interestingly, some of the russian media also talking about it, once but in the idea that russia has passed the

majority test. in other words, that they got to the brink -- foreign interference that caused this mutiny. those kinds of arguments, i think, you'll hear impassioned by the russian media. interesting to see if they come and pick that up, tries to spin, it or whether they just try and say, nothing to see here. >> now, you mentioned it's business as usual on the ground. you're starting to see a little bit of pushing different narratives. you interviewed putin, you spent a lot of time in russia, is there anything else that has really struck you about the events of the last 48 hours? >> well, i think what's really striking about the last 48 hours is that you can't predict, sometimes, what happens in russia. i don't think anyone can honestly say where this goes from here. i think it's important to

underscore that russia got to the clip edge of chaos, a country with around half the world's nuclear warheads, with a warlord attempting to take over from the men who are in charge of nuclear warheads. that, i think, is sobering. but most of all, churchill described russia as a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma, and that continues to be the case. >> still applicable, that churchill quote. keir in moscow for us, thank you so much for taking the time to be with us today. i want to turn now to former deputy national security adviser, msnbc political contributor, my friend, ben rhodes. so ben, at the start of russia's invasion, the white

house was declassifying information in order to call out russia's actions. that was a strategic move. notably, that was on the move that was made about the intelligence that prigozhin was planning something. now, reports have suggested that it's because they didn't want putin to blame them for a coup. which makes sense to me. but what did you make of that decision about the intelligence, and not sharing it? >> i think that's right. jen, you saw in the last 24 to 36 hours, president biden refrained from commenting much on this. and i do think that's in part because they didn't want to be seen to be playing into a russia narrative that is clearly going to emerge. this is somehow western interference. i do think that's going to be a much harder narrative to sell in russia than the normal color revolution, that the u.s. is behind uprisings for instance, in ukraine, popular uprisings. i don't think anybody can credibly claim, even in russia, even to the russian public, that is saturated in state media, that prigozhin is some kind of western asset.

this is a bad guy who has been fighting against american interests in places like syria, and all around the world, including in ukraine, for several years now. i just don't think that's going to be a narrative that can catch in the same way. i think it's also the case that, you know, the u.s. intelligence community, like all of, us probably didn't know exactly where this was going to lead. and it wasn't as simple as coming out and saying we see russia is preparing to invade ukraine as they did before the full scale invasion. in this, one i don't think anybody, including putin, including prigozhin, knew exactly what was going to unfold, or even where it's going to go from here. >> yesterday felt, and we talked with us yesterday to, it felt very abrupt. this deal struck by lukashenko, prigozhin just moving to belarus. what did you make of this? and do you think this is the last we hear from prigozhin? i mean, is he just disappearing into the night? or what's going to happen here? >> well first of all, this was a massive crack in the edifice of the putin regime. he has never been challenged like this. and make no mistake, taking

over that city of rostov, that is a logistics hub for a city of ukraine. that is 1 million people. getting than 145 miles of moscow, that's not a small thing. i do think prigozhin may have wanted to test whether or not there was a collapse of the russian structure, whether or not other leaders, other fiefdoms within the russian kleptocracy that putin set out, people often came with him. that didn't happen. most people say behind putin. i don't necessarily think that the side of putin strength, i think it's a sign that people didn't necessarily want to put -- jump on the train with prigozhin. therefore, he de-escalated, and took a deal. he took a deal, by the way, that was very different from what putin said on television, we thought this was a mutiny, that production should be detained, he was going to be prosecuted. putting out a climb down as part of this deal, and started prigozhin. i don't think we have the last of him. and i certainly don't think we've heard the last of potential internal challenges to when putin. we are in a new russia, where vladimir putin is weaker than

-- >> the fight in ukraine -- what is your expectation there, and what will you be watching? >> i will be watching a number of things. first of, all what happened to the wagner fighters, this is 25,000 people, heavily armed, some of them quite well trained, others just convex. russia clearly appears that they want to absorb that into their normal command structure. not clear to me that everybody has been a wagner fighter will take that deal, does that diminish russia's capacity? how does ukraine try to take advantage of this pretty massive political distraction for putin? they are in the midst of a counteroffensive. to the tragic press that advantage in the coming days and weeks? are they able to get somewhere? but i think the main thing we took away from this last couple days, jen, is russia's internal stability is now a part of the war. it's not just what's happening on the battlefield in ukraine, it's what's happening inside of russian politics. we are 16 months into a war in which vladimir putin that he was going to roll into kyiv,

and he had to supply tanks in moscow in preparation for a potential coup. that's a new dynamic. and i think russian political stability is as much a part of this war as the battlefield picture in ukraine. >> we know putin is a bit sensitive, he can be a bit paranoid, he's also a chess thumper in terms of throwing out rhetoric. if you are sitting in the situation room, like you over many years, what are you worst worried about here? in terms of his overreaction or what he might do to assert his power publicly? >> we've seen this go a couple different ways, jen, and what i've been looking for in the situation room is does this turn his attention inward, and make him want to stamp out internal dissent, pullback military resources extended into ukraine for his own internal security? or does it make you want to lash out? does it make him do certain things around escalation inside of ukraine that he hasn't done before. everyone's been most concerned about nuclear weapons, but there's a nuclear power plant

under russian control in ukraine. does he do something there? we saw them explode a dam that caused massive humanitarian suffering in ukraine. are there different ways that putin tries to lash out? because in the past, you and i have a lot of experience with this, jen, and sometimes you yourself with the target of this lashing out. sometimes, when he feels cornered, his play is to lash out at the west and europe and the u.s.. we are entering a pretty unpredictable time here. a weaker and cornered vladimir putin might need to consolidate and folks at home, but he also might want to lash out. i think the white house is going to be watching very carefully for signs of which way he's going to go in the weeks and months to come. >> ben rhodes, thank you for still answering my text when i have questions about what's happening in the world, even though we don't work together anymore. thanks for joining me today. next, i'll ask the great granddaughter of the former leader of the soviet union, nikita khrushchev, if history is repeating itself. and later, former u.s.

ambassador to nato on what the weeks and months ahead might hold for vladimir putin. plus, more my conversation with nancy pelosi. you'll hear her reactions to trump's federal indictment, that's all coming up in the special hour of breaking news coverage. we're back after a quick break. fter a quick break the subway series? it's the perfect menu lineup. just give us a number, we got the rest. number three? the monster. six? the boss. fifteen? titan turkey. number one? the philly. oh, yeah, you probably don't want that one. look, i'm not in charge of naming the subs.

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into saturday, the kremlin was on high alert. bracing for a possible confrontation in moscow, with forces from the wagner group. troops were rushed to the city, and checkpoints were set up along the border. the regional governor quoted as saying a counterterrorism operation was underway. residents were urged not to go out, and to reform refrain from going to work on monday. but despite the obvious risk to the city, our next guest noted to the u new york times that she noticed a wedding party

gathered outside a historic hotel. when asked about celebrating during a national emergency, one guest responded, we aren't canceling for no reason. i'm joined now by -- professor of international affairs at the new school, and the great granddaughter of former soviet leader nikki to chris jeff. i wanted to start just what you're seeing on the ground, we did see russian troops taking up security positions outside the city, but people were out and about, as you said. what did you see on the streets, and how attuned were residents to what was happening? >> well, in the morning, actually, there were some military vehicles. but it wasn't heavy as well. there were police are different kinds, but they were staying not out of sight but certainly not in the middle peoples lives. in fact, when i was walking toward the kremlin, which was

about a 50 minute walk, i was stunned to see -- we know what's going on, essentially a coup happening, and they were laying the -- wait a minute, do we really care? so then i saw the wedding party, people were piling up to get into a museum with a tremendous patriotic display, we are russians, god is with us, something like that. so there was an eerie feeling that people are preparing for something, and pretending that nothing is going to happen to them. people i talked to in conversations, they were saying, whatever we think of putin, prigozhin's men are rapists and murderers. this is a very russian attitude. you are waiting for things to work out, even if you are afraid it may not. >> you said that while this was all happening, that if putin

was able to withstand promotions advances, this would strengthen him. do you still believe that, after the last 40 hours? because a lot of people are saying it weakened putin. what's your thought? >> what weekend putin is essentially a military coup happening. you have shootouts happening on the road to moscow. and actually, when i was walking around in the morning, that's was quoted in the new york times, by the afternoon, people got much more apprehensive and subdued in thinking, in my courtyard about 70 cars parked usually. five cars were left. everybody else cleared out, basically as far away from moscow as possible. so what i was saying, he was able to resolve it. lukashenko, the belarusian president, was the one doing his bidding. it was clearly he was doing his bidding. the problem with putin is that he thinks, now, he's so out of touch with anything potentially

real, he announced that it's a mutiny. if you announce a mutiny, and how are you going to explain that the shoot outs, that essentially took over military command in rostov is being excused? and he's going to belarus? i think what i meant, and i still think, i mean, he got away with that. he got out. he's still in charge, he showed. if he only went out yesterday at 10:00 instead of lukashenko, develop russian president, and said, people, these are the reasons why we are forgiving this. we don't want bloodshed, we want to continue with our great country, we are patriots. he would have been loved and victorious. the problem with putin, he has too much hubris now, after 23 years, he doesn't care about his people, even if he says he supports them, and he doesn't know how to talk to them. and that was his giant mistake. otherwise, he would've been

much more victorious than he was because by now, it is resolved. prigozhin is not going to go into the sunset, and belarus, africa, in syria, or anywhere else. >> i was going to ask about prigozhin, and what we expect, it sounds like you think so. to hear from him more. that he's not just disappearing into the sunset. what will that look like? >> well, i think in some ways, both putin and prigozhin won, but also our weekend. because prigozhin wanted to take -- because putin was, according to prigozhin, not nationalistic enough. it wasn't the bloodshed that prigozhin was offering. and putin didn't go that direction. but putin also blinked. he allowed prigozhin to go. so both of them didn't know -- therefore, they decided to go their separate ways. i don't think putin will forgive, because we know he doesn't forgive personal disloyalty. so is not going to forget.

that he's the one who made prigozhin. he's the one who allowed prigozhin to become what he is globally known as, a mercenary of war. and prigozhin is not going to go into his quiet corner and get old and live in belarus, because he basically feels, and i'm sure there's a lot of wagner writes that may -- deal with the russian state, but they are loyal to prigozhin. this is a gangster loyalty. it's not going anywhere. so in some ways, it could be one of these mujahideen scenarios in russia, when the continued to be loyal to prigozhin and something else much grander than yesterday's events will be brewing for putin and the kremlin, threatening its existence. >> nina khrushcheva, thank you so much for joining us from moscow, i really appreciate your perspective. up next, i ask a former u.s. ambassador to nato, how leaders around the world are looking at

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clinically proven to remove skin tags safely in as little as one treatment. nato allies are now trying to decipher what this weekend's are brief armed rebellions means for the war in ukraine. the president of lithuania, which will host a gathering of nato leaders next month, tweeted, quote, the kremlin regime rips what it says. all the violence directed at ukraine has backfired. on saturday, as their williams underway, president biden called the leaders of the uk, france, and germany. the white house had a short right out of the calls, saying the u.s. and its nato allies, quote, affirmed their unwavering support for ukraine. that leaves the question of whether the events of the last 48 hours change the kind of military support and assistance that nato partners are willing to provide. i have to wonder whether the chef's mutiny might have an

impact on the thinking around that. joining me now is ivo daalder, he served as the u.s. ambassador to nato from 2009 to 2013. thank you so much for joining me this afternoon, i wanted to start with something you tweeted out that in 1991, gorbachev survived a coup attempt, only to be out a few months later. as you're looking at the events of the last 48 hours, even with the deals struck, the mysterious deal. what is your sense, at this point, of putin's long term grasp on power? >> well no one knows, of course, but clearly the last 48 hours have really weakened him, in a way that we haven't seen, really, in this entire presidency, which is now in its 24th year. or indeed, in any time since the end of the soviet union. we have a leader who has been directly challenged in the same way that gorbachev was directly challenged, which is a sign of weakness. and although it is true that no

one else has come out to support prigozhin around vladimir putin, at the same time, these forces were able to move about 800 kilometers, without any resistance, and what resistance there was was quickly shot up the sky. and it was only an outsider, lukashenko, who was able to find a way out of this. right now, everyone in the kremlin, starting with putin, is looking around, figuring out, who can they trust? who's about to knife them in the back? who's going to defend them? and that's going to be there for quite a while. it tends to be that revolutions each their own children. we may see that in this case, that happens as well. and so it is a really dangerous period, because on the one hand, ukraine is now launching full force its counteroffensive, but on the other hand, we don't know what's happening inside the kremlin. putin hasn't been seen or heard from. we don't know what the military leadership of russia's. it's a deeply uncertain time, and then that's what the nato

leaders were talking about. how to make sure that we don't make it any worse than it already is. and at the same time, make sure that ukraine finds a way to benefit. because that, ultimately, is what this is about. >> you mentioned uncertainty about the leadership of the ministry of defense of russia. of course, we don't know the answer to that this point. but what are you going to be watching for in terms of what -- whether or not putin's calculus changes in ukraine -- >> i think we want to look at two things. one is to see whether, in fact, the current leadership will remain in power, that is defense minister -- and the chief of the general staff -- they are the targets of extraordinary criticism, not only coming from prigozhin, but also from military bloggers and everyone else. it is really hard to see how these guys have really messed up this war in a remarkable way

can stay in power. that's one thing to look at. the second is, russia doesn't have many military options. but what they do have is escalation options. and i do worry, and i think people in the white house are being very close attention to the possibility of, perhaps, preparations to blow up the nuclear power station in zaporizhzhia. they've just blown up in an incredible way, the hydroelectric dam in the north which has caused extraordinary catastrophic damage. and we have to worry about the possibility of putin using nuclear weapons. so i hope that the white house and the defense department are not only looking at this closely, but making it very clear to the russians that any form of escalation, a deliberate nuclear incident, would lead to catastrophic consequences edge jake sullivan, the national security adviser, had said last october. and that those catastrophic

consequences are that we would intervene to end this war, and make sure that ukraine wins. >> now, you've been in these rooms, you've been on these calls in these moments where there's tension around the world. there is a nato meeting coming up in a couple weeks, but lots of calls in between, and conversations. how do you anticipate key nato powers are watching this? will this change anything about that meeting. what are the other things they are calculating as a coalition? >> i think there's going to be an attempt led by the united states to say, let's keep cool heads here. let's not look at this as the -- we can finally find a way for russia to be doug under, to get rid of putin. that's not for today. for today, we need to make sure that we do everything that we can, we continue to do, to help ukraine win this war. and secondly, to make very clear to everyone in russia, vladimir putin, and everybody around them, that escalation

would have dire consequences. but that also means that cool heads need to prevail. we don't do things that provoke, that lead to the very escalation we are trying to prevent. so it's a balancing act, and it means that the white house and others will have to talk to some of our allies who may see this as an opportunity to finally go after vladimir putin and say, you know, that's really not where we want to be? we want to help ukraine, but we also don't want to make this the beginning of something much much worse. >> the time for cooler heads. ambassador ivo daalder, thank you for your time this afternoon. up next, very few american journalists know the russian playbook better than david remnick, the editor of the new yorker joins me to talk about all the dynamics at play, when we come back. when we come back s, you can make it even smarter. now ports can know where every piece of cargo is.

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what's fact, and what's fiction in the news out of russia. and that was especially true this weekend. given putin's tight grip over the media and the sheer volume of disinformation, it can take a bit of time. there are a number of experts with context into what's actually happening. one of them is -- who wrote an op-ed in the new york times titling the man

challenging putin for power, profiling prigozhin as a dangerous competitor. zika wrote, according to many sources in -- clashed with the military general staff. however, the effect could be the opposite, with more people seeing mr. promotion as the most probable favorite to succeed mr. putin. pretty precious. he wrote that several months ago. david -- tracked him down to discuss the events of the past few days. joining me now is david remnick. before joining the new yorker, he served as the moscow correspondent for the washington post, and has certainly been following moscow and russia and putin for many, many years. so, you gave us some inside looks at the depth of knowledge between putin and prigozhin. tell me more about the moment you write about, when he says prigozhin was no longer putin's puppet.

>> i think we have a tendency to view these figures as if they are great geniuses of strategy. it wasn't so long ago that putin was on the cover of magazines as the master strategist of a three level chess game of world strategy. you know, he's such a master strategist that now, with a stroke, he's at war with ukraine, he's at war with the west, and he's at war, it now seems, with a great deal of his own power structures. and he's put himself in jeopardy, his country, in jeopardy, and there are times when i think that we should be listening knowing to great historians of a soviet past like steve hot truck in, but we should also be rewatching dr. strange love and the death of stalin, because there is a great deal of absurd-ism in the confidence at work here. prigozhin is a guy who spent

nine years in jail for breaking into apartments. putin was a mid level kgb officer. this is not -- >> you're telling me they aren't playing three dimensional chess here, possibly, david? [laughter] i read your article that was very excellent, one of the parts that stuck out to me was when you asked zygar about the most striking aspect of the uprising. he said he wasn't certain putin was running the country saying, quote, he is still there in his bunker. but there is the growing feeling that he is a lame duck, and they have to prepare for russia after putin. at first -- first of all, you've been covering putin and russia for a long time, what did you think of that? and what does it look like to prepare for a russia prosecution? >> there is no institutional succession mechanism. there are no legitimate elections, of course, he's locked up in jail -- to volley, his would be

opponent. there are all kinds of clans, as the term goes in moscow. glands, subdivisions of power, rivalries within the fsb, within military intelligence, the mayor of moscow and the prime minister on one side, and all kinds of factions -- but the mechanisms for coming to power, for succession, are no more orderly than in the television show, succession. the violence could be a great deal worse. he has created a catastrophically disorganized, personalist method of rule, so that he is at the center, ideally, and everyone is playing off each other. he's the referee. but now, his weaknesses are exposed. and people smell it in moscow. prigozhin is somebody who ripped away the veil, and now we all see it. he still may gain power, he may

be there for a while. but the game has completely changed, as of yesterday. >> i want to ask you about prigozhin, because as you mentioned, he's -- i mean, he's a former convict, he's a former all, gaar corner be current. the notion that he is going to disappear into the sunset and we will never hear from him again in, bellerose terrace me as a true, but what is your sense of this? what are you going to be watching -- i mean, he's a master propagandist. >> i wouldn't take any great insurance policies out on the life of yevgeny prigozhin. this is a regime that is perfectly capable of murdering its enemies abroad and at home. we know that over and over again. but the trouble is that, well, putin may be secure in locking up people like a wall street journal reporter or vladimir --

, but he knows that production has real followers in the military. this is a guy who essentially crossed over into the country from ukraine into russian land, it would be like taking over miami without a shot, heading toward washington, with the stop in north carolina. he went unopposed. and putin is humiliated and embarrassed by this spectacle, and i should also say, the spectacle is known to the russian people. this reached the russian press. you have a war of propaganda on the line, it's not just state television. so he is exposed as weak, and that is very hard to put back in the bottle, psychologically or politically. >> david remnick, thank you, really excellent piece. i encourage people to read it. from your interview with mchale zygar. coming up, more of my conversation with nancy pelosi.

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been a historic week in russia. but it's not exactly been quite a here at home. we saw our political discourse deteriorate in stunning new ways. take what played out in the republican house of representatives this week. republicans voted wednesday to censure congressman adam schiff for investigating donald trump. they also tried to recast the russia probe as the so-called hoax that trump has long claimed. but they're carrying with the special counsel john durham felt woefully flat. then we saw lauren boebert baselessly try to impeach biden, which led to a verbal conflict with marjorie taylor greene. green then teamed up with --

to sponsor a bill to expunge trump's to impeachment. i shouldn't have to say this, but congress can't expunge impeachment proceedings after they've happened. the gop would rather use their majority to wage a campaign of retribution that than actually governing. they have a laundry list of grievances in an effort to vindicate donald trump. as nancy pelosi puts, that it's a puppet show. i asked her about it during our conversation earlier this week. >> we are sitting right here in the capital building, and over the last week, we've seen the hearing with john durham, republicans trying to force a vote to impeach biden, a vote to censure congressman adam schiff, should we anticipate -- you anticipate that trump is going to keep driving the agenda of the republican-led house? >> it appears so. because the fact is, when we had this vote, more than a week ago, it lost. the vote to censure adam

schiff. the word -- but the word is trump weighed in, and the vote changed. because they are protecting the unpatriotic, unscrupulous behavior of donald trump. >> you are known for many things, one of them is being an excellent vote counter. do you think mccarthy will be speaker at the end of the year? >> let me just say this. one thing i am is strategic. and when you are tragic you have to know what you're talking about. i have no idea what goes on their caucus. but i do know one thing. hakeem jeffries will be speaker in 2025. >> trump was just indicted and pleaded not guilty to 37 counts involving the image of classified documents,

obstruction of justice, and making false statements. what was your reaction with that indictment? >> i have 30 years of experience in intelligence longest serving. and the only later that anyone can remember in recent or near history that came to leadership with a national security credential. came from -- or agriculture or transportation, i came from an intelligence standpoint. -- so i had 38 years, and i know how important it is to protect these documents. if i were in the scif, that's the room you go into to get briefed, and i wrote down a few names or dates, i couldn't take my own piece of paper out of the room. >> with the names and dates on it? >> i'd have to submit it to the staff to be placed in a vault. i would have access to my

information but i couldn't have taken it with me. this is about protecting our national security. it's not putting our sources and methods. and as allies, what is an ally? a person who who helps you. instead we are jeopardizing not only our own security, but the security of other countries, and their sources and methods. how do they trust us as an ally, if we do that? so what the former president is alleged to have done, and seems to have confessed to it, but nonetheless is innocent until proven guilty, is to say he did it and have some arrogance about it. that is the case, he seriously jeopardized our national security. if he did that. and secondly, he is dishonorably our court system in the manner in which he is treating it. so our security, and one of the pillars of our democracy. very casual about it all, sad

to say. >> as you just alluded to, i mean, reading the itemized list of 31 documents, and the clearance levels, as a former ranking member on the intel community, there were five eyes classifications there, some of the highest level classifications. and knowing what you know about former president donald trump, we know he has an affection for dictators. do you have concern, without us knowing at this point, of what he may have wanted to do with those documents? >> what i do know is that he seriously jeopardize our national security. and the other piece of that, in terms of him is he himself, when he was a candidate talked about how important it was to protect our documents. our security documents. our intelligence community is -- takes risks for us all the time. and to jeopardize their lives, their families, the sources

they may have interacted with, is a very dangerous thing. very irresponsible, and by his own public statements, before he was president, and as president, he knew that. >> you have been incredibly outspoken on january 6th, you played a leading role there, he's been a strong defender, of course, supporter of the work of the january 6th committee. and this, weekly washington post is that with a report detailing how senior leadership at doj resisted investigating trump's role in january 6th for more than a year, according to the post, quote, a weariness about appearing partisan and clashes over how much evidence was sufficient to investigate, all contributed to the slow pace. do you think that the justice department waited too long? in order to move forward with investigating trump? >> i can't really speak to that, because i know about it it's what you just said. that was a public account. i do think that right now, my

first question when i saw that article was, but right now, they are proceeding. and i understand the sensitivity to a president who has incited an insurrection, they were going to put a bullet in my head, hang the vice president of the united states. they made an assault on our democracy, on our constitution, and the rest. and that has to be investigated. because you just can't do that. and you can't arrest people for doing it while ignoring the big fish, who instigated it. if, in fact, they have the intent to take the case to that point. >> you frequently quote benjamin franklin's a republic if you can keep it. if trump wins reelection, do you think we can keep it? >> i never thought he could win the first time, so i had to say there's no way you could win

again. but here's a president who has been twice impeached, multi times indicted, we don't know how many will be, defeated once. i think he's very seriously damaged goods. we have to do everything to make sure that a person so frivolous with our democracy, so jeopardizing of our national security, so disrespectful of our rule of law, whatever the president of the united states once again. >> a special thanks to speaker emerita nancy pelosi for spending some time with me earlier this week. that does it for me today, but make sure and follow us on twitter, on instagram, on tiktok. the show is also available as a podcast starting tomorrow. you can search for inside with jen psaki wherever you get your podcasts. and follow the show. listen to the show every monday morning. we'll be back here next sunday at noon eastern. but stay right where you are, because we're coming back after a quick break with more on russia. e on

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>> hi, everybody. good to see you. good afternoon. i am yasmin vossoughian, thank you for joining us on this busy sunday afternoon. we are continuing our coverage of the crisis in russia. it is nine pm in moscow right now. things there are much calm