we will speak with congressman joaquin castro of texas about the treatment of migrants at our border. congressman eric swallow on the doj's election interference case against president trump. and what now is a critical moment for democracy. but for now, i handed over to my colleague and friend eamonn -- hello? >> hey, i was going to say, i've been off for the last two weekends. and i feel like it was a period when we were wondering whether donald trump invited. now i feel like every time i leave and come back he is inventories about to get indicted on subpoena charge. >> there is new today headed to the calendar and to our msnbc graphics every time to return. >> good to see you, great show as always. enjoy the rest of your evening. good evening to you, welcome to ayman tonight. ng eminent indictment, donald trump could be charged at any moment in the election interference case. this as more officials and aides speak to the special counsel's team. then, making history. michigan charges six republicans and the fake little

scheme. the first state to do so. we are going to discuss all of it with michigan secretary of state jocelyn benson and more. and report card, oversight chairman james comer wants to us to review the mecca controlled houses first six months on the job. and the results, they are not good. i'm ayman, let's get started. the justice department investigation into donald trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election appears to be approaching a fever pitch. nbc news has not learned the federal grand jury charge of the -- deciding whether or not to indict the expression in her testimony from a key witness this week. former white house staffer and current member of the trump campaign william russell. his testimony could actually prove crucial to the federal government's case, since he was with the former president for

at least part of the day on january the 6th, including at the -- where trump deliberately -- deliver his speech shortly before his supporters stormed the capitol. nbc news has learned, direct disappearance, prosecutors questioned william russell about trump's state of mind during and after the 2020 election. in fact, his disseminate can't just 48 hours of the trump himself revealed that he had received a target letter from special counsel jack smith in the election interference case. according to nbc news, that letter outlines three federal statutes the ex president is accused of violating. deprivation of rights, conspiracy to defraud the u.s., and tampering with a witness. receiving this type of letter is typically the final step before a person gets indicted. you might remember that trump actually received a similar target later just days before he was charged with mishandling classified documents and prior to his indictment in new york

over alleged hush money payments in the run up to the 2016 election. so if that same timeline holds here, trump could actually see a third indictments at any moment. the former director of condolence at the fbi makes clear we shouldn't take news of this target letter lightly. as a veteran of the justice department, jack smith is certainly well aware of the senate it takes for the feds to break successful case against anyone, let alone a former president, certainly one that was running for office. it is a standard that has worked out pretty well for him, considering the u.s. government remarkable truck corporate. it was analysis by pew research of available data from the 2022 fiscal year shown 0.4% of federal defendants who chose to go to trial or acquitted. that year, almost 72,000 people

were criminally charged by the feds and only 290 of those went to trial and one. another almost 1400 defendants who decided to give a trial a shot, well, they were convicted. that means almost everyone else, essentially gave up and pleaded guilty. but we do know that is most likely not an option for trump. as recently as this morning, he was on his failed social media site railing yet again against the investigations into him. but as much as trump secret wants you to believe his case is somehow different, that heat will emerge victorious after all of this, we'll, pete numbers are not on his side. because despite how trump may view himself, as frank writes, he is no different from those other stuff in the 2000 defendants charged by doj last year. that is some really donald trump might have to confront

sooner rather than later. let's bring in matt sutherland not panel to break this down. -- special correspondent for so that it fear. charles coleman, and frank saluzzi, former assistant director for crittenden's at the fbi and an msnbc national security analyst. great to have you all here. frank, let me start with you. in this excellent piece you wrote, explain to us how the government and its track record is a testament to the way the fbi approaches the way they got their evidence. talk to us about what goes on behind the scenes to ensure only the strongest cases, only the most powerful arguments are brought by prosecutors? >> sure, in 25 years with the fbi, i knew that the truck was strong. i knew from personal experience that federal prosecutors tends to play to win and not even to

think about bringing cases that they might lose. i experience that personally. i have to tell you, what i look at the latest data that you cited, it was even staggering to me because the track record is so good. as you said, the vast majority of criminal defendants in the federal system take one look at the evidence and decide you've got me, let's work a deal. i'm not here to suggest at all that donald trump is going to do that, nor should he. he should defend himself, if he chooses to. but rather as a check against those who keep zion, right, hey this is week, this is novel, we have never seen this before, object smith is biased. i'm here to tell you, federal prosecutors don't bring charges to lose. so what is it that is so different in the federal system that caused these numbers to pop like this? you have got the full weight of the u.s. federal government, all of the tools in the tool kit for the fbi, and federal

cases, you've got the dea, atf, on and on and on. all with a tremendous amount of resources. what do those results look like? electronics or violence, physical surveillance. informants, undercover agents, cooperating witnesses. and time is on their hands. and they will charge and indict and sent target letters, hoping to flip people on to the higher ups in the investigation. it is overwhelming and that is what the column is about. trump needs to take this seriously and the american people who can become -- i would understand, if we all become numb to the litany of charges and indictments the trump is already facing and just kind of tune us out. i'm telling you, don't tune this out. this is serious, serious business. yes, as a former president, but he's just going to be like the 72,000 defendants last year in the federal system. >> charles, to pick up on that point, prosecutors don't want to lose cases, when they bring

a case they want to win, they're going to bring the most compelling charges that are supported by the facts and the evidence in accordance with the law. walk me through these charges that have been reportedly laid out in the target letter of the trump received? did any of these come as a shock or are any missing? when you look at these charges, what is it that first come to your mind about the case that could be potentially brought against donald trump? >> first of all, ayman, looking back. always good to talk with you. for me, as a former prosecutor and a civil rights attorney, it is the deprivation of law. that really stuck out to me because it is not just something you typically see charged but it is something that strikes at the very core of the narrative about donald trump and what he did. the uniqueness about the charge is focused on the notion that in your official capacity as a government employee, as someone representing the usa, you intended to deprive other individuals, in this case the

american people, have the right. specifically, what it is referring to here, is the right to vote and the rights to have your vote counted and mean something. so from a narrative place, that is going to be very, very big. jack smith making very clear to a jury what it was that donald trump set out to do with his participation and generous sex and also the fake electors scheme. that for me is something that really stands out. it also tells the story for jack smith as a prosecutor in terms of what was all about. prosecutors have to go where the actual facts take them. once you have those facts, when she had to indictment, your trial, your story is all about selling a narrative. that is going to be a key statue that helps them to sell a very cohesive, very complex narrative to end and higher jury. >> molly, speaking of narratives, trump loves the narrative of being a victim. but the numbers here don't actually lie. trump's legal battles against the federal government aren't likely cases he's faced before. perhaps not even like the ones

he may face on a state level. but when he loses out on social media, it is because he wants to shape a narrative that he is being targeted, that he is somehow the victim in all of this. is this a guy who's just simply and denial, or is this part of his grift to raise money off of everything he sees as a grievance? >> he needs to raise a lot of money because these lawyers are expensive. we've seen reporting, especially those in florida lawyers with the security clearance are really holding him up for money. i would also say, remember, trump's thing as he is trying to kick the can't as much as possible with all of these cases. this will be his second set of federal indictments. that may not be in florida, so he may not be able to kick the can of the way that he would with judge cannon. so i think that is something to think about. but i do think he is ultimately quite scared. you are seeing him tweet out a lot of really violent and scary stuff. he is a truth --

haze not tweezing. he's trying to scare, distract, get his supporters engaged. and he again needs to raise a lot of money. >> frank, in your piece note for the federal case involving the 2020 election is different since it involves a former presidents who tried to interfere with the peaceful transition of power. tell us what this case is so important, what we shouldn't become numb to trump's legal peril. that we say, oh no, here's another trump charge or another trump indictments, whether on a potential state liberal or a potential federal one? >> of all the cases and charges the trump is facing so far, and i in no way mean to denigrate them. infect, the documents case, i dealt with classified information for the bulk of my career. that is serious. but this one, this one is different because it goes to the heart of our democratic process. free and fair elections and

heaven our vote counts. as charles said, this is a civil rights charge, it is going to be uniquely applied in the set of circumstances. this charge was enacted way back when to enable agency prosecutors to go into the deep south, worked against the ku klux klan, who was preventing minorities from voting. so, in its origins, this charge is right and it goes to the heart of whether we are going to continue as a democracy to have our votes count. this one's difference. it counts, it means everything moving forward as a democracy. >> charles, what do you make of the fact that the grand jury is still hearing from witnesses in this case, even after the doj sent this target letter? this targ>> you know, people hy been talking about the length of time that has been taken, but one of the things that are continue when -- we've had a level of insight into this investigation, and

you can in some respects, we've never got this and most cases. most people are able to have the prosecution take place pretty much under the cover of secrecy and such a what you don't have investigative reporters constantly seeing who is going in and out and getting secrets forced thought of what's happening. the significance fear is that this is not necessarily an unusual circumstance or and ignored minute i'm a time for a typical investigation. really, what i think is going on is object smith already has more than enough to move forward. the prosecution memo is done. all the ayes have been done it and the teams have been crossed. these witnesses are just providing statements, shoring up -- tying up loose ends. the icing on the cake. we are a really strong case is only going to get stronger. as frank said, to make it clear that the high conviction write that the doj enjoys stays intact. >> molly, one statute that was

not mentioned in the target letter was inciting or assisting an insurrection. would it be a mistake if smith failed to charge trump as an insurrectionist, specifically because of what happened on january 6th? >> he got some of the similar charges to the lower down conspirators, and i think he's being really careful because he knows jacks mitt is under maximum scrutiny and you don't want to make a mistake. and you also really want to make the charges stick so. i don't think it is wrong to be careful. i think the civil rights statute is really important. the fact that it was used against kkk members in the deep south, and it's really about people having their rights taken away, which was the goal there, i think that it's really meaningful and important. again, the whole thing here is we don't want this to happen again. and i think that is the larger issue and hopefully that will prevent its. >> as we mentioned, the case would be tried --

the point would be to win the case as opposed to simply scoring political points or legal points. panel, placed around. we've got a lot more to discuss. after the break, we can do this competition as jack smith broadens the scope of his election interference investigation to georgia and arizona. stay with us. stay with us for what you need. you could save $700 dollars just by switching. ooooh, let me put a reminder on my phone. on the top of the pile! oh. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ ♪ tourists tourists that turn into scientists. tourists taking photos that are analyzed by ai. so researchers can help life underwater flourish. ♪ (mom) the moment i loved our subaru outback most...

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investigation has been growing in recent months with an increased focus on the swing

states where trump tried to reverse the election results. just last night nbc learned that georgia governor has been in contact -- or has been contacted by smith's office, and that comes on the heels of the news that georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger complied with a subpoena from smith's team, seeking surveillance footage from a polling site that was the subject of baseless election fraud claims by trump and his allies. and that's just in one state, the state of georgia. over in arizona, doug doocy has also been contacted by the special counsel and this week was -- we confirmed that she was interviewed earlier this year by fbi officials as part of the investigation. let's bring back my panel. charles, i'll start with you on this. what do you make of these moves from smith's team in getting the state officials to cooperate with him, and the fact that he is speaking to them?

>> amen, like i said, prosecutors go where the facts take. you and what we are learning as this investigation continues to go forward is that this was a very large scale planned by donald trump and many of his allies to just dropped, if not we >> it is not a crime to believe that you did not lose an election that you lost, it's not a crime to believe that you may have been cheated out of that election, it is however a crime for you to try to overturn the results of an election. especially if you have reason to believe or should have known that you actually lost the election. so what i glean from everything that's going on from jack smith and his current pursuit is that he is trying to get as much evidence as possible that will firmly established that donald trump in fact knew that he lost, or should have known that he lost, and should've known that there was not the widespread fraud that he continue to pedal in terms of -- and yet he is still doing everything that he did anyway.

and that's where the crime occurred, and that's what jack smith is going to be pulling out. which is why you see him taking steps and going out to these other jurisdictions to try to firmly make that point clear, with what i suspect will be another indictment against the former president. >> all of these states that trump tried to pressure into overturning the election in, like georgia or arizona apparently, are now in the big picture and there is no doubt that this obviously adds more legal trouble for him in this investigation, or perhaps even again on state investigations down the road. how does trump spin this? are we going to even seemingly lose any republican support in these states as a result? >> well, we saw so far with these indictments, what we've seen is that he's done better because of them. you remember the alvin bragg indictment in new york, that was actually the worst politically for on desantis. that actually helped trump in the polls, and it gave him a bounce. and the federal indictment. so i would not be surprised if

more indictments don't necessarily move the needle with republican primary voters, but again, trump really has the republican primary unless something humongous happens. it's very likely that donald trump has the republican primary locked up. the question is, can you grow the electorate with indictments, and i'm not convinced that you can. >> frank, what's the most potentially a damaging lead of development here for trump? is it arizona? is it georgia? could it be wisconsin, even possibly michigan? >> so, i've always zeroed in on georgia, because there's nothing like having the defendants voice on a tape. there's nothing like it, it's how you make every corruption case. it's recordings, recordings. and it's this one that's really going to get to a jury. but the broader issue here is accountability for me, because when you hear about these swing states, when you hear wisconsin,

michigan, arizona, georgia all being in the mix for jack smith, it's about holding people accountable. sending a message that look, we're going after the big guy, yeah. but you are part of this and you may be facing these charges as well. and the jury appealed to that. imagine the guy in the graphics department for special counsel smith who has approached trial here if this goes the way we think. there are going to instruct the creation of graphics for the jury. there is going to be spoken wheel with trump at the top and you're going to have with johnson and michigan and georgia, and the jury is going to look at that and see that this was a vast conspiracy. this was a man operating in a vacuum, a diluted guy who just thought he had one. this was a strategy, i think that's part of what jack smith is doing. >> charles, let me switch gears for a moment and get your thoughts on the classified documents case. judge aileen cannon, who's overseeing the case has announced the criminal trial against trump will begin on may

20th 2024. this is obviously later than the december date that jack smith's team was aiming for, but also puts the caution on the indefinite postponement that trump had actually sought not too long ago. is there a middle ground here on who this date benefits? >> i think overwhelmingly it's -- well and it's one of those things that people have said will neither side go what they want. neither side expected to get what they wanted. trump's attorneys understood that a speedy trial would actually need setting a date, but they had no other legal recourse and the idea of a may 20th trial dates actually provides them hope that they can now develop a strategy around, and here's why. may 20th, by that point the primary will be over. so donald trump will presumptively be the republican candidates as the nominee for that party, and what that's going to do is it's going to reopen their previous arguments around a trial taking place at that point being in line with

election interference. that is something that judge cannon may actually take seriously. it's also not going to happen on may 20th 2024, mainly because as i can tell you as a former prosecutor, they've got a motions. there will be a lot of legal -- that will take place that will reasonably push that date forward. and the farther it goes, the more that that first argument has credence. so issuing this ruling, aileen cannon basically gave the defendant an opportunity to have a strategy or develop a plan where currently there was none. that's something that's going to benefit them, and then in addition to everything that i've said, trust and believe, donald trump's defense team is going to try to use this state as a benchmark for every other case that they're fighting in every jurisdiction. this is the first federal indictment, so you can't get higher than the federal cases that he's facing. so anything that comes after that, they're going to basically say should track this march -- or sorry may 20th date. and that's going to be something else that again allows them to delay, delay,

delay, or try to where previously they had no actual outlet to do so. >> really quickly charles, can jack smith have to open cases against trump, two concurrent trials against the former president? can they be running at the same time? >> as many crimes as he commits he could have cases against him. so absolutely, yes. >> i really appreciate that. charles coleman, molly jong-fast we, frank figliuzzi, thank you to the three of you for joining us this evening. up next, michigan -- first state to file criminal charges against 2020s fake trump electors. we'll tell you about that story and more. and more our heritage is ingrained in our skin. and even when we metamorphosize into our new evolved form, we carry that spirit with us. because you can take alfa romeo out of italy. but you best believe,

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election. this is the first time anyone has been charged in the so-called fake electors scheme, which republicans from six other swing states also participated in. but to fully understand how we finally came to this moment of accountability in michigan, we actually have to go back a few years. before any votes were even cast to understand. donald trump begins sowing doubts about the presidential election months before it is actually called. notably, in august of 2020. he proclaims the only way he would lose is if the election is rigged. one day after election day on november 4th, the state of michigan is called for joe biden. and a few days later on november 7th, joe biden is declared the winner of the 2020 election, becoming president elect joe biden. one month later, on december 14th, michigan's legitimate state electors, they meet at the state capital to affirm their votes for joe biden.

but on that very same day, 16 other officials, republicans who would eventually be known as the fake steak electors, allegedly meet in the basement of the gop headquarters and signed their names to multiple certificates declaring trump the winner of michigan's electoral votes. now those documents are then sent to the u.s. senate, and the national archives. of course, trump and his allies continue to spew lies about election fraud in the following weeks, which helped fuel the january 6th insurrection. and one day before the insurrection on january the 5th, the national archives rejects the fake certificates they received from michigan. and in the aftermath of the capitol riot, attention is on the fake electors and the plot seems to die down. but in fact we later learned that attorney general david nestle has been investigating the electors, and their scheme

since early 2021. almost a year later, in january of 2022, she refers them to the justice department. now at the same time, nestle says there are grounds for criminal charges, but because there was a coordinated effort between republican parties in other states, she is compelled to send the investigation to the feds. in between june of 2021, a michigan senate panel led by republicans and -- announces there's no evidence of voter fraud in the 2020 election results. then in june of 2022, the former state republican party chair delivers bombshell testimony to the january 6th select committee, detailing how the fake electors discussed hiding in the michigan state capitol building on the eve of the official electoral college vote, so these officials could cast their fraudulent votes in the chamber the very next day. an idea that cox escribano's

quote, insane and inappropriate. fast forward to december of last year, when the select committee released its final reporting, that report actually included a very interesting detail. the days following the 2020 election, donald trump apparently personally asked a representative in michigan to reach out to other state lawmakers and gauge there is support for questioning the integrity of the election results. and at the beginning of this year, she announced that she is reopening the state investigation into the fake electors scheme, citing a lack of movement from the doj. and that brings us to what happened this week. on tuesday, nestle formally announced charges against the 16 fake electors with each defendant facing a felony count, including forgery, related charges. each punishable up to 14 years in prison. nestles office as the investigation is ongoing, and hasn't really ruled up

potential charges against additional defendants. trial dates have not even been such, so this timeline isn't finished. joining me now is michigan secretary of state joscelyn benson, madam secretary, it's great to have you back on the show. thank you so much for making time for us. let's start with this significant news. your office has been working in part with the attorney general and her office over the years, in 2021 you partnered with her office on investigating claims of election fraud and for someone who has worked closely with her, what is your reaction to the charges that have been filed this week? >> first, thanks for having me back. i was gratified to learn of the felony charges against these 16 individuals, who action oblique tried to interfere with the results of a legitimate presidential election in michigan, and may be planning to do so again in the future. we don't know. if they don't like future results. and so the attorney general and

i work together closely on matters like this, and when we refer to these certificates to these office for investigation in 2020, i had full confidence that she would only pursue charges if the evidence overwhelmingly suggested a violation of the law. and indeed that's what it appears to be here. this was not a symbolic attempt to -- we wish this person had one and we're going to fight these letters for fun. these were actual attempts to try to lie to the federal government about who won michigan's electors. simply because one political party and it's almost ardent supporters disagreed with the results. >> some of these people that have been charged our prominent figures within, or were prominent figures, within the states republican party. you have the former leader of the michigan gop, former republican national committee woman, and among that list -- a town clerk who will now be barred from running any elections in the future. i know these are just charges

at this point, but being barred from running elections is a pretty significant consequence. what are the ramifications do you think we could see for these 16 fake electors? >> well, as the attorney general has said, both the investigation is ongoing and i think the ramifications are still ongoing. i've been saying repeatedly, we need to see not just legal consequences for the actions that were taken to try to overturn a legitimate presidential election in 2020, the political consequences as well. we have to make sure that current republican parties in michigan are run by someone who is also actively part of the effort in 2020. so we need voters on both sides of the aisle to reject these efforts to overturn election results, simply because someone doesn't agree with them. instead of at least in the case of one political party, supporting and amplifying those who spread lies about our elections in order to achieve political gain. >> are you at all surprised at the doj has not moved on this

particular case? i mean, as i understood it, the attorney general at one point thought that the feds or the doj would move in and deal with this fake electors plot, but it seems now that she is pursuing this case, she doesn't -- she may not necessarily be believing that as much anymore. >> well, certainly i think both state and federal investigations can proceed simultaneously. because you have both election laws and michigan that were violated, and then potentially election laws at the federal level violated not just in michigan, but in several other states. so we need to see both investigations proceed and i'm grateful that the attorney general did the right thing here in michigan and filed charges when she knew there was abundance of evidence that the law had been violated. and we need to see accountability. i know very much and believe very much in the integrity of the officials in the justice department, i believe as the facts and evidence and loss plays out, if charges are warranted in any case related to the 2020 election cycle,

we'll see the. and that's really what we need at this time. we need investigators at the state and federal level to take their time, take these efforts seriously, pursue based on facts and evidence alone, not politics, and then file charges when the law warrants them. and that certainly what has played out here in michigan. >> let's talk about voting rights for a moment. on tuesday governor gretchen signed a slate of bills which you and your office had actually worked on and were the result of a constitutional amendment approved by voters back in november. clerks will now be able to begin in-person voting 29 days out from an election. walk us through how these bills will impact the safety and fairness of elections in michigan going forward. >> yeah. the story of democracy in michigan is kind of two sides of the same coin, or one coin, one that we've had to overcome these great challenges to our democracy. we've also expanded our voting rights and our democracy along these same years. in particular, because voters

on both sides of the aisle have voted to amend our state constitution to implement no reason absentee voting. early voting. election day regulation, automatic voter registration, and now we have a legislature that is helping us act on those voter mandates to expand these rights even further. so in 2024, you're going to see voters in michigan continuing to have more options to vote, continuing to participate, and we hope on both sides of the aisle all across the state, continuing to have faith in the results of our elections. and as we see consequences for those who try to block the role of the people from coming to fruition, we hope that as well will instill peoples faith in our democracy and that the people who are charged with protecting at. >> josh allen vincent, michigan secretary of state, thank you so much for your time in her insights this evening. greatly appreciated as always. >> yes, thank you. always a pleasure to be here. thanks for having me. >> ahead, conspiracies, lies, and nothing that actually helps the american people.

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neuriva: think bigger. before the midterms, republicans made a promise and if they took control of the house of representatives, they wouldn't tackle the real impacting issues that voters wanted to. like rising inflation, high gas prices, unemployment, and six months into the gop control of the house, james comer wants to show off all of the hard work his party has done for the american people. >> i would welcome you to compare our first six months to the first six months of my predecessors. >> all right. let's look at the record, shall we? there have been scant hearings on inflation and gas prices, but republicans have had dozens and dozens of hearings on our important issues to fox viewers,

like guess what? hunter biden laptop, alleged twitter censorship, the priorities of manhattan d.a. alvin bragg, and of course the so-called weaponization of the federal government. it's been six months of sham probes, conspiracies, and debunked lies. and that's never been as evident as it was this week. comer's oversight city -- heard from to iowa - the investigation into hunter biden, it claimed that trump -appointed u.s. attorney who actually oversaw the case has repeatedly disputed what we did get in the hearing, hyperbolic theatrics from republicans. what we didn't get, evidence. any of it, of actual wrongdoing from the administration or the president. even republican chuck edwards admitted as much. >> i've heard over and over that president biden has not

been implicated or proven for any wrongdoing here. and i acknowledge that, for now. >> for now. the next day the weaponization 's select subcommittee held a hearing on unfounded accusations that the biden administration is working with big tech companies to censor conservatives favorite subjects like, again, hunter biden laptop and covid-19 misinformation. sensing a pattern here? the star witness was a presidential candidate conspiracy theorist and anti-vaxxer rfk junior. the same man who just last week was caught on tape saying covid may have been quote, ethnically targeted to spare jews. despite this antisemitic nonsense, chairman jim jordan, he insisted on a platform-ing it. and here's what ranking members had to say about that. >> they intentionally chose to elevate this rhetoric to give these harmful, dangerous views a platform in the halls of the

united states congress. they have cosigned on idiotic, bigoted messaging. it's a conscious choice. >> joining me now is democratic congresswoman melanie stansbury of new mexico, she's a member of the house oversight committee. congresswoman, it's great to have you back on the show. thanks for making time for us. so let's talk about what we saw there, and to get your reaction to combers a comment suggesting that they have a better record in the first six months controlling the house that the democrats did with their first six months back in 2019. what grade would you give republicans, congresswoman? >> well, i think it's pretty obvious that they get enough. probably even worse than an f if there is such a thing. it's been stranger than fiction, you can't even write a melodrama like we've had at the committee over the last six months. as you said, they've platform conspiracy theorists, they've put all kinds of hearings on over and over again, and i

think that one of the things that folks don't realize is that they've held literally the same hearing time and time again, because they'll call a witness, interrogate them, and when they don't get the answers that they want, they carry it over again and then the hold it in another committee. and just this week we had this virus supposed whistleblower hearing, and we had to vet the witnesses because the republicans have been calling as their star witnesses folks who are known fugitives from the law. folks who are literally out to grind their political acts against joe biden, against democrats, and literally have no evidence of wrongdoing or other criminal activity, while their own political candidates, their own front runner, is literally engaging in criminal behavior. a president of course that incited an insurrection, who is currently indicted under 37 criminal counts for documents that threatened our national security, that has been held liable and accountable for sexual harassment and caught on

tape for it. and yet they refused to actually investigate real criminal activity. it's a sham, it's embarrassing, and it's a disgrace to our democracy and our democratic institutions. >> let me play for you, speaking of wednesdays hearing, i want to play for you and your viewers the sound of you debunking and calling out your gop colleagues. watch. >> i want to remind everyone that the person who appointed u.s. attorney general david wheeze to handle the matter that we're here to discuss today was donald trump. this is yet another attempt by the majority to turn this committee into another in kind donation to the trump campaign. >> did you see anything from your colleagues that disproved your point? >> no. of course not. and they're not even trained to hide their use of the committee's resource to donald -- it's clear that for example,

just a couple of weeks ago, the very day that donald trump was indicted on 37 counts, comer planned to hold a markup, a controversial markup, that would have literally undermined the fbi. now, this can't be an accident, right? so it's very clear that there's some sort of coordination happening but tying the scenes between comer, between the leadership of the house, between donald trump and the political folks who are working on that campaign, to provide in kind donations using committee resources to help prop up former president trump. and it's not only frightening for or democracy, it's a total misuse of federal resources and it's an abuse of power. >> i know you saw the disgusting a moment in the hearing when marjorie taylor greene displayed those nude photos of hunter biden. obviously we're not going to show them here on this program, but her republican colleagues have not condemned her for it. and we know that she has been

name-calling, she uses profanities, what do you make of this new standard of decorum in the gop-controlled house? this is the party that claims to be the party of family values and decency. >> yeah. i mean, for anyone who had the misfortune of actually seeing that portion of the hearing, it was disgusting. you know, marjorie taylor greene puts up images during the hearing of sexual acts, actively happening, and this is supposed to be the party that is trying to shield children from supposed you know, sexual activity and other things like that. and here they are coming to committees and actually putting pornographic images on a live hearing. and what i found particularly shocking during the hearing, if you watch the c-span coverage, is that at the moment that dan goldman and a ranking member raskin tried to engage the chairman about taking these images down, he actually smiled. he smirked.

so not only are they not sanctioning marjorie taylor greene, they're enabling her, and they clearly are finding it entertaining, and it's part of their larger effort to use artificial committee and congressional resources to help support donald trump and prop up their party, as we're heading into the midterms. and is into the presidential year. >> and sadly, the whole world is watching as she continues to do that in the peoples house. congress woman, it's always a pleasure. thank you so much for making time for us. ahead, an important update on the e. jean carroll legal victory against donald trump. stay with us. with us (mom) the moment i loved our subaru outback most... was the moment they walked away from it. (daughter) mom! (mom) oh, thank goodness. and that's why our family will only drive a subaru. (vo) subaru. more iihs top safety pick plus awards than any other brand. love. it's what makes subaru, subaru.

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♪ wayfair, you've got just what i need ♪ this week, a federal judge in new york tossed out donald trump's attempt for a new trial in the e. jean carroll's sexual abuse and defamation case, and essentially declared it the ex president had raped her by the common understanding of the term. trump's team had argued that the $5 million in damages he was ordered to pay carroll should be reduced, and a new trial granted because the civil jury had found him liable for sexual assault, not rape. the crime of which carroll had originally accused him. but u.s. district judge luis kaplan wrote that trump had digitally and not consensually penetrated carol in the 19 90s. trump's legal argument caplan said, mistakenly focuses on the new york penal law definition of rape, to the exclusion of the meaning of that word as it often is used in every day life. and the evidence of what

actually occurred between miss carroll and mr. trump. judge caplan also denied trump's request to reduce the $5 million in damages the jury awarded carroll. of course, this isn't the end for trump and carol, trump is still appealing the outcome of the trial in federal court, and carroll has sued him a second time for defamation with a trial expected in january of 2024. stick around, the second hour of ayman begins right after a quick break. quick break. our heritage is ingrained in our skin. and even when we metamorphosize into our new evolved form, we carry that spirit with us. because you can take alfa romeo out of italy. but you best believe, you can't take the italy out of an alfa romeo. more shopping?

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