>> on the second hour of ayman,

breaking developments and donald trump's throat and document. judge tanya chutkan requests -- rejects the request from trump's team to delay the court proceedings. and televised the trial. democrats are demanding cameras in the courtroom, are to win the fate of democracy depends on it. and it is a bust. house republicans wanted to expose bottom criminality and goggles the opposite. no evidence, no crime. i'm ayman mohyeldin, let's get started. tonight, we begin this hour with that breaking news. u.s. district court judge tanya chutkan just ordered donald trump's legal team responds to the government's motion for a protective order but monday, at five pm eastern. that order would prohibit trump and his lawyers from sharing discovery materials with unauthorized people. the special counsel argues this social post from trump suggest

he might intimidate witnesses. in part by improperly disclosing confidential evidence received from the government. just moments ago, judge chutkan requested -- rejected a request from trump attempt to delay this proceedings, as the latest developments in this legal and political chaos -- three presidents have been impeached and history. just to have been arrested. serres only one has been both impeached and arrested, and only one has the greatest honor of being and dot three times on scores of criminal charges. donald trump. the most indicted president in the history of america. he currently faces 78 different criminal charges, with more likely in the coming weeks. this will permanently change how donald trump will be remembered. the first president on the

brink of not just one but multiple criminal trials. the most recent for charges, of course, come from the election interference case brought by special counsel jack smith, which include conspiracy to defraud the united states. trump faces 40 counts in the classified documents case. the original indictment contained 37 counts, the superseding and i've added another three. trump has pleaded not guilty in all three cases. he denies any wrongdoing. let's be clear. fulton county district attorney fani willis will likely be added more criminal charges to that total in the coming weeks, for trump's efforts to overturn the election result in her state. that's not even including the true civil trials trump is facing. the scope and scale is historic. it is quite unparalleled.

one has to wonder, does the morality of a president still matter to the american people, or does it just matter or that your side winds? joining me now is nbc presidential historian michael -- it's great to see you again, thanks for coming back on the show. let's start with your reaction to trump's social media post and the special counsel's request for protective order. what do you make of this rapid development over the past 24 hours? >> any other president, any other kicks president would have been presented with an order like the one judge chutkan issued. even if he disagreed because every other president, moralis, with a few exceptions, has believed the rule of law. what donald trump has demonstrated, before he was president, through his presidency, right up to this not, this is someone who has contempt for the rule of law. contempt for the institutions of our democracy, like the way

we elect our president and transfer of power. the amazing thing is that he gets away with calling himself a conservative. a conservative believes and preserving his institutions of democracy. conservative beliefs, above, all preserving the rule of law. instead, what we see today, and tonight, is donald trump, despite this order by judge chutkan, threatening potential jurors and witnesses by saying, you go after me, i can after you. that's a threat. that's not a godfather movie, that's not american history. we are in a totally new different period. the other thing tonight. the judge specifically said, do not attack potential witnesses and what does he do? he's twice attacked mike pence tonight. that's basically thumbing his nose at the judge. we are now about to see what she's going to do about it. this almost looks to make historically like the weekend nonscientifically three,

october, that richard nixon fire or his special prosecutor and all hell broke loose. >> you point out an interesting point in history. when you look at the big picture. clinton and johnson were impeached. grant was arrested for speeding in his horse carriage. but we have never seen anything like trump. i'm curious to get your thoughts on whether or not at how our small d democratic institutions or system or prepared a built for somebody like donald trump. somebody who his kind of like a bull in a china shop. not just challenging our legal norms, but also breaking all of our political norms as well. >> donald trump's who our founders dread. they always worry that someone could get -- and they talk about -- someone getting himself elected to the president for his reckless and lawless and a democratic. out for his own power.

and maybe ally, secretly, with foreign hostile governments. all of this finally came to pass, at least same, in the case of donald trump. look at the guardrails, protections against. that you mentioned and patients. well there have been all these impeachments. when was the president ever removed from office? if i happened. not likely to ever happen in the future. what other constraints or they are against the president? donald trump is president, he was presented with all sort of demand by congress. he ignored them. he appointed one third of the supreme court. he believes he's got a majority with five or six. and not in 74, july, frigid nixon lost a supreme court ruling on whether he would have to release types that nixon knew, privately, would be meaning he'd have to quit or be removed from office. even nixon, who was formidably

-- obeyed the supreme court ruling. what would donald trump to in the same circumstances? >> i think we all know the answer to that. and we see what he has done, not only to the and solutions but even to the republican party and the way he continues to based him day after day. michael beschloss, it's always a pressure. >> thank you, ayman, you're doing great. picked up in history. >> joining me now is carlos curbelo and david henderson, and jennifer horn, a former new hampshire looking party chair and host of the is it just me or have we all lost our minds podcast, which i would argue is one of the best titled podcast out there right now. jennifer, i'll start with you. i want to get your thoughts on the developments of the past 24 hours but specifically trump's post. if you go after me, i'm coming after you. is there any world in which

this is not intimidation? >> not by my definition of intimidation, certainly not. but you know, i think we're missing part of the point here, as we were discussing this and the past 24 hours or 12 hours, however long that week has been up. everyone's worried about him trying to intimidate witnesses. is he talking about, going after jack smith? who's he going to go after? we have to be clear, this is a second audience for the. tweet it is the donald trump jenner six posse. it is sending word out. letting all those folks who have already showed they are willing to take up arms and defense of this man, no longer president, to kind of put them on alert. and when he says, it's time to go after all these people who are going after me, they're going to be ready to go. when i saw that tweet, i have to tell you. very quickly my thoughts went to the potential for violence. this wasn't just about him

trying to intimidate witnesses, it's sending a be ready signal to those folks, as i just said, who have proven already that they are willing to take up arms for donald trump. >> david, you know, that was on the air tuesday went news 4 of the indictment. i quickly learned from speaking to some of the great legal minds rely on on the show about the importance of the judge in which are just two and a case. i think with age clips of that today. what did you make of judge tanya chutkan already denying the trump legal team's request for more time to respond to the special counsel's protective order motion? what does that tell us about her mindset and the way she will perhaps conduct this trial? >> in frank terms, ayman, he is trump's worst nightmare. she is his legal team's worst nightmare. i'm going to be real when i say it, a black woman with a lower degree is a virtual unstoppable story when it comes to the justice system. here is. what you are taking someone

who's been subjected to two different forms of discrimination. gender and. rice and instructing them on the low of how things are supposed to work. then you put them in an environment where people get mistreated based on who they are, if recycled of their career. not you've got somebody walking into her courtroom saying, hang on a stick, and i deserve to be treated differently because i used to be is a powerful person and expected to become a super powerful person again. that is not going to work on her. also, the techniques he typically uses that work on people, and telling them, i've been in positions more of headed pressure put on me. it's difficult to articulate how much pressure put on a person. but someone like judge chutkan has been called every name you can imagine. she's been put under every form of pressure you can imagine. it's not going to work on her. i was on her legal team, i would tell them, this time you are playing on fire. i think the odds of him serving time, which are still knicks to

zero, but judge chutkan is still the type of judge who would sentence him to serve time, because she's going to be equitable in terms of how she treats everybody in her courtroom. she's already showing that with these current rulings. >> great answer, david. carlos, the magistrate judge warned trump of witness intimidation at his arraignment. is a protective order the only way to keep him at line? is he even go on tuesday and line? >> he's probably not going to stay in line. i really do think that's the only instrument available. i think it is probably applied. you think about what donald trump is doing, you have to zoom out here. i think you did a great job of going through that with michael beschloss a few minutes ago. donald trump is doing things that are the reason why, and this community, or olive in south florida, so many people have fled here. people do not want to see this in this country. people from countries like cuba,

venezuela, nicaragua, worth the rule of law broke down and where dictators started intimidating people and and president people, punishing people for their beliefs and opposition. donald trump is not hinting at the stuff, ayman, has been pretty transparent about it. the judicial system, the courts, i think have to use every instrument at their disposal to make sure that these processes can continue, can't go on the way they're supposed to. and that people feel safe coming forward and telling the truth. >> places like iran, with a lot more to discuss. after the break, we discuss the six unnamed coconspirators and the trump indictment and why they weren't charged yet. but first, my friend richard is here are the headlines. >> good evening, more breaking news. a d.c. judge deny a motion for former president donald trump's legal team.

they requested a time extension to respond to a protective order request from the special counsel's office. prosecutors following the request for the protective order last night. they asked for trumpy borrowed from disclosing any evidence in the investigation. more on ayman on this for a subject. kremlin officials say russian tanker was hit by a ukrainian drone near crimea. was carrying fuel near a bridge that links rushed to the annex peninsula. it is the second struck my russian ship in two days. and as a 15-year-old male was arrested in connection with the fatal stabbing of a gay man at a new york gestation. officials say he was charged with murder as a hate crime. o'shea sibley, a professional dancer and choreographer was stabbed to death last week. more ayman with ayman mohyeldin after the break. after the break. game today? (hero fan) uh, yea. i have to watch my neighbors' nfl sunday ticket. (josh allen) it's not your best plan. but you know what is? myplan from verizon. switch now and they'll give you nfl sunday ticket from youtubetv, on them.

(hero fan) this plan is amazing! (josh allen) another amazing plan, backing away from here very slowly. (fan #1) that was josh allen. (fan #2) mmhm. (vo) for a limited time get nfl sunday ticket from youtubetv on us. a $449 value. plus, get a free samsung galaxy s23. only on verizon. ♪ chevy silverado has what it takes to do it all. with up to 13 camera views.

and the z71 off-road package. ♪ you ok? yeah. any truck can help you make a living. this one helps you build a life. chevy silverado.

sleepovers just aren't what they used to be. this one helps you a house full of screens? basically no hiccups? you guys have no idea how good you've got it. how old are you? like, 80? back in my day, it was scary stories and flashlights. we don't get scared. oh, really? mom can see your search history. that's what i thought. introducing the next generation 10g network. only from xfinity. >> in criminally charging

goli, taste your goals. former president, donald trump, for his efforts to reverse the

2020 election loss, federal prosecutors allege that trump actually enlisted six coconspirators to assist him in his criminal efforts to overturn the legitimate results of the 2020 presidential election. and to retain power. at least five of them are lawyers, according to this indictment. let's go through some of them. coconspirator one, who nbc news believes to be rudy giuliani. the indictment described him as an attorney who was willing to spread knowingly false claims, and pursue strategies that trump's 2020 reelection campaign would not pursue. giuliani was essential to efforts by the trump team to overturn joe biden's -- nbc news has confirmed that coconspirator to is not other than john eastman, coconspirator to was an attorney who devised and attempted to implement a strategy to leverage the vice president ceremonial role overseeing the certification proceeding to obstruct the certification of the presidential election. according to the indictment. nbc news believes coconspirator

three to be city powell, they died meant described her as an attorney who's baseless accusations trump embraced and publicly amplified, even though he privately acknowledged to others that the unfounded claims of election fraud is sounded crazy. coconspirator for appears to be jeffrey clark. coconspirator for is described in the indictment as a justice department official who focused on civil matters, and worked with trump to use the justice department to open sham election crime investigations, and influence state legislatures with knowingly false claims of election fraud. and coconspirator five appears to be kenneth chesebro, the indictment states that coconspirator five with an who assisted in devising and attempting to implement a plan to submit fraudulent states of presidential electors to obstruct the certification proceeding. the identity of coconspirators six is unknown. so far. but let's bring back my panel to discuss this. congressman, i'll start with you. it's worth noting that five of these coconspirators are lawyers. at least two of them were

former attorneys for donald trump. what does it say about the conservative legal movement that so many republican lawyers were willing to submerge the laurel of law, also help one man stay in power. ? >> it is remarkable, a man. these are the people that bill barr used to call the crazies, or whatever it is, these are people who have sullied to the legal profession. and the legal system in the united states. people go to a three attorneys for good advice, for an understanding of how the law works. for how the constitution works. sure, to figure out how to gain advantage within those parameters, it's pretty clear that these individuals were giving advice that was way beyond the bounds and the parameters of the constitution, and of the law. they were not acting as attorneys, they were acting as chief political hacks who are basically willing to do anything to keep donald trump in power. so, it is a good sign that people like that will be held

accountable. because typically, i think a lot of deference is shown to lawyers. but these are lawyers who do not deserve that kind of deference. >> david, i have a two part question for you. the first one is the indictment lays out what these coconspirators were doing, but why doesn't charge them? and to, could donald trump say, look, these are lawyers, they were the ones that were telling me and giving me this advice, whether it's a john eastman type of memo, to put forth fake electors. or rudy giuliani saying there's the way and here's what we can do. >> to answer your first question, ayman, there's no justification for them not being charged. i expect we may see charges again in the future. here's the reason why we say that. down in florida, you've got two guys being charged along with former president trump for moving around boxes and for deleting security footage of moving around boxes. in the d.c. case, you've got a conspiracy to jack a presidential election, and seven people are in on it. if you're going to charge the guise for moving around the boxes, how do you not charge the coconspirators who tried to

hijack an election? especially when they knew what they were doing. president trump is sitting behind the wheel of the car, but the lawyers are providing the fuel to these wrongful legal theories. that answer is question number one. with regard to the second question, and bear with me, ayman, i forgot exactly what you asked me, the second question. can you remind me? >> the second question was could donald trump use the fact that these are five lawyers as his legal defense. say, look, i was given advice from john eastman about a possible electoral slate, or alternative slates, to put forth. i was given advice by rudy giuliani to put pressure on mike pence to not certify the election. and really, hide behind the fact, or use as the defense strategy, that these coconspirators are lawyers giving him bad advice. >> absolutely. he's going to try to do that, 100%. here's what we have in our advantage, we're trying to analyze this. some of the theories have already been tested. let's look at giuliani. he's looking to be barred in d.c. and in new york, typically what they do is they'll say, hey, we'll have a hearing to

determine whether or not we should disbar you. in your case, it's so blatant, we're going to go ahead and -- because the lies were so egregious. we saw this with the january 6th proceedings, in terms of the evidence that was offered. he was told multiple times that this was wrong. i don't think any jury is going to feel any differently than in new york and d.c. barr did for giuliani. also, some of these other lawyers are facing disbarment in other states. eastman in california, powell in texas. they haven't been successful. but they let you know how people are responding to these illegal theories, and trump is receiving them in multiple directions. and when he goes to pence, and he tells pence, hey, we can just do it, the lawyers say we can. pence didn't just say no. he said let me have my people check it out. and his people came back and said yeah, they're telling us we can't do it. so i don't think we should do it. and he still kept moving forward. i don't think it's gonna be a good defense. >> jennifer or jack smith's team demonstrates that his coconspirators knew they were spreading election lies. according to witness accounts,

trump privately said that sydney powell's election fraud claims were, quote, crazy. what do you make of this private, public dichotomy, and how this special counsel's offer might use it between what trump was saying publicly and what he was saying privately? >> well, we know that there are other voices in this case. other witnesses who talked about the fact that the president absolutely knew what was true, what was honest. that he had lost the election. that many people had discussed it with him. and he knew that that was the truth. so, the fact that he then publicly came out and continued with the conspiracies, and the lies about the stolen election, i would just suggest -- it makes it very clear that trump, you know, the state of mind is a guilty one. he absolutely knows what he was doing. but i also think it's really important to add to this conversation that it wasn't just trump and his close circle of attorneys that were

advancing these lies, and these conspiracies. there are a whole long list of republican politicians sitting in the house, sitting in the senate, who advance them as well, and they knew better. they knew that these were lies that they were repeating to the american people. and i think that that, as much as we are focused on this arraignment, this indictment right now, we have to recognize how really dangerous and damaging it is to have elected officials who are willing to engage in this manner as well. >> jennifer horn, the david henderson, carlos curbelo, thank you so much for joining us tonight. i greatly appreciate your insights as always. the coming up, the case for televising the trump trials, congressman steve cohen joins me after a quick break. break who needs that much more tide? (crashing sounds) everyone's gonna need more tide. it's a mess out there. that's why there's 85% more tide in every power pod. -see? -baby: ah.

think hairspray's stuck in one dimension? think again. flex any style... with hairspray that flexes with you. new tresemmé hairspray. (dad) we got our subaru forester wilderness to discover all of the places that make us feel something more. (vo) subaru is the national park foundation's largest corporate donor, helping expand access for all. ♪♪ when you have chronic kidney disease...

there are places you'd like to be. like here. and here. not so much here. if you have chronic kidney disease, farxiga can help you keep living life. ♪ farxiga ♪ and farxiga reduces the risk of kidney failure, which can lead to dialysis. farxiga can cause serious side effects including dehydration, urinary tract or genital yeast infections in women and men, and low blood sugar. ketoacidosis is a serious side effect that may lead to death. a rare life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking farxiga and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this bacterial infection, an allergic reaction, or ketoacidosis. farxiga can help you keep living life. ask your doctor for farxiga for chronic kidney disease. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. ♪ farxiga ♪ -we're done. -what about these?

looks right. nooo... nooo... quick, the quicker picker upper! bounty absorbs spills like a sponge. and is 2x more absorbent so you can use less. bounty, the quicker picker upper.

i'm your overly competitive brother. check. psych! and i'm about to steal this game from you just like i stole kelly carter in high school. you got no game dude, that's a foul! and now you're ready to settle the score. game over. and if you don't have the right home insurance coverage, well, you could end up paying for all this yourself. so get allstate, and be better protected from mayhem, yeah, like me. thanks, bro. take a lap, rookie. real mature. >> nearly 40 house democrats are demanding donald trump's criminal trials be televised, in a letter to the judicial

conference, members argued for the, quote, extraordinary national importance to our democratic institutions. adding, if the public has to fully accept the outcome, it will be vitally important for to witness, as directly as possible, how the trials are conducted. the strength of the evidence a deuced and the credibility of the witnesses. unlike in state and local courtrooms, broadcasting proceedings in federal court is not the norm. but there have been some exceptions in recent decades. joining me now is one of the signatories of that letter, democratic congressman, steve cohen, of tennessee. congressman, it's great to see you again. thank you for making time for us. let me get your thoughts by just quickly on the breaking news that we had this evening, the protective order that prosecutors requested against trump last night, after he posted what seemed to be a threat online. today you have the u.s. district judge, tanya chutkan, reject trump's request for an extension. what's your reaction, sir? >> well, he said if you come

after me, i'm gonna go after you. this is the actions of a bully, of a tyrant, and that's what he is. judge basically cautioned him about taking illegal steps, and he doesn't know what illegal is. because everything that emanates from him is perfect, all right, and legal. but this is dangerous to witnesses, dangerous to piece pull that testified. dangerous to people to prosecute. basically telling people, don't get involved, don't support this position. and if you do, i get to be president. he'll get even. he will get even, because bill barr said there will be no checks on him. we will lose our country. >> let's talk about the letter you and your colleagues sent to the judicial conference in which you make the case for this trial to be televised because of the powerful circumstances we find ourselves in. why do you believe, sir, it is important the american public could bear witness to this trial in realtime? >> we have seen our nation

become more divided than any time, i guess since the civil war. this it's totally divided. but it's divided now not on whether your favorite -- it's whether or not to see facts and admit they are the truth or not. we have a problem just as seeing reality, and the facts and working off the same -- we are cell owed by cable television, if you watch msnbc and cnn, you see a certain version of the news. which i think is the truth. and if you watch fox, or newsmax, or some of those stations, you see fiction. and that's why they had multi hundreds of millions of dollars judgments against them for lying about dominion voting and other things on fox, and they're going to have others they're going to be filed liable. we need to make sure that the people can watch this, and see it on their own, and not to have to watch it through the eyes and ears of fox and newsmax, who would take trump's

position, and switch the perspectives to be what trump wants, and not the truth. the truth needs to be seen, because otherwise, if they don't accept the judgment, and i'm just assuming that the judge -- he's presumed innocent. but i think he's guilty as el capitan, as anybody can be. and if they don't see the trial, it may not accept it. because i'm sure on fox, they will show this be something like for -- >> how concerned are you about what the reaction will be if donald trump is found guilty in this trial, and it is not televised? how concerned are you that him and his followers, or him and his allies, may incite his followers to violence, like what we saw on january the 6th? >> i definitely can see that. donald trump does not want to go to jail. then his followers believe him. here's a man who's probably the

-- he's pinocchio look like a tower of truth. he's been found indicted now three times. each -- impeached twice. he's been found guilty and is liable in civil cases for rape, for lying -- a civil case he cheated charities. cheating charities? you raped women at bergdorf goodman? and you lie about everything in the world. and these people believe him as if he is a truth stopper. he's not. they don't see it with their own eyes, even then, i don't know if they'll accept it. but you've got to hope they will accept the verdict, and to do, that they need to see with their own eyes, i hope the chief justice roberts will understand. that our country is at risk of danger of a civil war. we are danger of insurrection, danger of this horrific things. whether he's found guilty or not. the only way i think i can see

to make less of this would be to televise it, so people can say for themselves. >> since you mentioned chief justice john roberts, it's ultimately him and the judicial conference who will make that decision. but do you believe, given the way that the supreme court has behaved and the way the chief justice has behaved it, in the lack of transparency when it comes to the supreme court, that he'd be willing to grant that transparency to the american public in this trial? >> i certainly hope he would. i don't think he wants the court to have a good reputation. some of the things the court has done has lost its support for the public, with the no ethics laws, and all the benefits that have been heaped upon clarence thomas and justice alito, getting similar benefits. and acting like it's improper even to question the ethics of the supreme court. they should not be a medium for ethics laws like every other political group is. so yeah, i hope justice roberts will protect the courts

integrity, and the court is at a low point, i think it's acceptance by the public would be abnormal for him to do this, to say the public has a right to see this at different times. -- if we didn't even have television, there's news reels, i guess, but he didn't have a president like trump. we didn't have a division of this country the way it is, where people, you can't see the truth, and listen to what they are told by folks that think democrats are all running pizza restaurants with fronts to have human trafficking and child trafficking going on. they believe this qanon mess. this is a dangerous time in our nation. i think justice roberts need to recognize, the court needs to take extraordinary action to protect the democracy and protect the foundations on which the court rests. >> yeah, in his previous scholars and others who have study this have noted, televising the trials has not impacted either the jurors or the right of a defendant to have a fair and speedy process.

so, really, there is no reason not to televise these trials anymore. congressman, steve cohen of tennessee, it's always a pleasure, sir thanks very much for your time. >> you're welcome, thank you very much. >> ahead, testimonies from hunter biden's former business associate backfires on republicans, we are going to tell you why. you why that's me before dawn powerwash. soaking, scrubbing...that's life. was life. now, powerwash gives me the power of an overnight soak in minutes. i'm sorry, minutes? with 3 cleaning boosters... not found in traditional dish soaps that help break down, loosen and lift away food and grease... so much faster! tougher mess? let the suds sit a few minutes before wiping. even cleans... the grill! thank you!

the chase ink business premier card is made for people like sam, who make- everyday products, designed smarter. like a smart coffee grinder, that orders fresh beans for you. oh, genius! for more breakthroughs like that- i need a breakthrough card. like ours! with 2.5% cash back on purchases of $5,000 or more. plus unlimited 2% cash back on all other purchases. and with greater spending potential, sam can keep making smart ideas- a brilliant reality! the ink business premier card from chase for business. make more of what's yours.

businesses need 5g solutions today. that's why they choose t-mobile for business. mlb partners with t-mobile to not only enhance the fan experience, but to advance how the game is played. aaa relies on t-mobile's network to stay connected nationwide, so they can help get their members back on the road. and we're helping pano ai innovate, to stop the spread of wildfires. now's the time to see what america's largest 5g network can do for your business.

what do we always say, son? liberty mutual customizes your car insurance... so you only pay for what you need. that's my boy. ♪ stay off the freeways! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ >> all right, a brutal blow for house oversight chairman, james comer, this week, and the witness republicans had hoped would prove their theory that joe biden wants accepted bribes, instead testified to the panel, and i quote here, i have no basis to know if joe biden altered policy to benefit his son. in fact, that witness hunter biden's close friend and business associate, devon archer, said he was not aware of any wrongdoing by the president, period. as put in the washington put, james comer has repeatedly seen that james comer should be

taken with a grain of salt. we should be clear, regardless of this, hunter biden clearly overstated his influence with his father, and manipulated their relationship to help himself. but, as democrats point out, that's not criminal, and it doesn't tarnish president biden. >> so then the question becomes how much longer are we going to go on this fishing expedition? there is no evidence connecting president biden to anything related to hunter biden. we have been told by the republicans repeatedly that this is an investigation to joe biden. there is no evidence that connects joe biden to any of this. and we've now had witness after witness come in, and they have testified to the same thing. >> all right, joining me now is michael singleton, political consultant and host of the shermichael show on sirius xm -- and former congresswoman, don edwards, now washington post columnist and nbc said msnbc -- shermichael, what was your take

away from devin archers testimony this week? >> look, i had an opportunity to greet it. at best, ayman, i guess you could say maybe there's some unethical behavior on behalf of hunter biden, of putting his father in a very precarious predicament. but there's no surprise, i mean, i don't think hunter biden is the poster child for being a perfect child. but is there direct evidence that connects the president to some type of fraudulent activity or illegal activity? we haven't seen it yet. and republicans are arguing that this is a part of the investigation, trying to see if such activity did indeed occur. but as we know, we don't see it. >> congresswoman, exactly how many more times can james comer cry wolf before he loses any credibility in the eyes of the american public. do you think republicans are as frustrated with him behind closed doors as democrats are in front of the cameras, that he's unable to deliver on what he keeps saying will be evidence? >> well, your starting with the wrong premise. he really doesn't have any

credibility. this hearing that came forward, and you can look through the transcript, i don't know how many times a witness in devon archer could say i have no knowledge, i don't know, i never heard of that, joe biden didn't have any connection. dozens and dozens of times throughout the transcript. and so, i think you have a nothing burger of investigation. and i think for all the promise of tying joe biden to all of this, it simply has not worked. and so i don't know whether republicans are frustrated, but it's not like any of their oversight is going well at all either. so, i think, you know, you look at this time since january, republicans have been in control. they've gotten nothing done in congress. and as well, they really haven't done anything with respect to these investigations. so, ultimately shermichael, is this going to work for republicans going into 2024?

this attempt to try and juxtapose hunter biden's legal woes with donald trump's legal woes, as some type of political strategy? >> i certainly wouldn't put them on the same playing -- plane, ayman. >> i'm not saying them on the same plane at all, republicans love to create this fake narrative worth a say, we were just about to break hunter biden. we were just about to have this. we were haven't devin archer bright that big bombshell and then they indicted on trump. so i guess anybody who lives on earth one doesn't believe that, but i'm saying they're going to use that narrative. i'm asking, do you think it will work? >> i think it certainly has the ability, if they continue to persist to raise some level of doubt or question among a certain percent of the voting populace. whether or not, payment, it's effective enough to increase or change the odds potentially if it's joe biden first donald

trump, i'm not particularly certain of, that to be honest with you. i don't think the average person really carries. in terms of the former presidents legal issues, i think that is certain to be front and center in the midst of the election next year. but this devin our thing -- most americans don't know where the heck ukraine's. they don't care about this. it doesn't have an impact on them. so i'm less certain this is going to be an effective political strategy. i think there are something republicans could focus on that might tend to be more effective for them in the general election. >> congresswoman, let me ask you about something more sinister here. democratic congressman jamie raskin has pointed this out. he sent a letter to comer, re-up in a claim that he withheld a key transcript from the american public, relating to the triple committee hearing with irs agents who say the department of justice mishandled the hunter biden case. comer pushed this idea of fees

claims, that's not true. we haven't been able to this transcript. do you expect the public will ever get to see the full transcript, if it does in fact go against what republicans want us to believe in the narrative they pushing out there? >> i don't think so. i think that republicans have been very crafty, particularly the committee, very crafty at holding the -- they think will not be in their favor is. withholding those public view. the fact is that there is no connection with joe biden. there is no -- with the irs. some sort of manipulation of the irs. hunter biden is going through his own legal process. and that will happen. that is completely separate and apart from the president of the united states. it's not going to stop republicans. those that want to go down this rabbit hole are going to do that. but i think for the majority of

american people, shermichael is right. the stuff just doesn't factor in. >> so how do democrats counter it and what should they be doing right now, congresswoman? >> i think the thing they can do is, i mean, i think the law is on the oversight committee have been really, really good. dan goldman, jamie raskin, really pushing back on the republican narrative. and they've torn a power of these witnesses. these witnesses have come forward. and of all those fallen completely flat. the reason is because democrats are on their a game as challenging the so-called oversight. james comer is doing a horrible job leading this committee. >> shermichael singleton and from a congresswoman donna edwards, thank you to both of you. greatly appreciate your insights tonight. >> thank. you >> coming up, victory for the tennessee three. we tell you about that. you about that as the breakthrough you've been waiting for. the first fda-cleared at-home skin tag remover

clinically proven to remove skin tags safely in as little as one treatment. when i was diagnosed with h-i-v, i didn't know who i would be. but here i am... being me. keep being you... and ask your healthcare provider about the number one prescribed h-i-v treatment, biktarvy. biktarvy is a complete, one-pill, once-a-day treatment used for h-i-v in many people whether you're 18 or 80. with one small pill, biktarvy fights h-i-v to help you get to undetectable—and stay there whether you're just starting or replacing your current treatment. research shows that taking h-i-v treatment as prescribed and getting to and staying undetectable prevents transmitting h-i-v through sex. serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems and kidney failure. rare, life-threatening side effects include a buildup of lactic acid and liver problems. do not take biktarvy if you take dofetilide or rifampin. tell your healthcare provider about all the medicines and supplements you take, if you are pregnant or breastfeeding, or if you have kidney or liver problems, including hepatitis. if you have hepatitis b do not stop taking biktarvy without talking to your healthcare provider. common side effects were diarrhea, nausea,

and headache. no matter where life takes you, biktarvy can go with you. talk to your healthcare provider today. my most important kitchen tool? my brain. so i choose neuriva plus. unlike some others, neuriva plus is a multitasker supporting 6 key indicators of brain health. to help keep me sharp. neuriva: think bigger. sweet pillows of softness! this is soft! holy charmin! oh! excuse me! roll it back, everybody!! charmin ultra soft is so cushiony soft, you'll want more! but it's so absorbent, you can use less. enjoy the go with charmin. are you a new at&t customer looking to upgrade your phone? you're trapped! locked into your contract for three years... introducing the easy unlock. bring your at&t locked phone and t-mobile will pay it off and give you one of the latest 5g smart phones free! free your phone now at t-mobile! at bombas, we make the comfiest socks, underwear, and t-shirts that feel good, and most of all, do good. because when you purchase one,

we donate one to those in need. visit bombas.com and get 20% off your first purchase. bombas. my husband and i have never been more active. and get 20% off shingles doesn't care. i go to spin classes with my coworkers. good for you, shingles doesn't care. because no matter how healthy you feel, your risk of shingles sharply increases after age 50. but shingrix protects. proven over 90% effective, shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. shingrix does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. an increased risk of guillain-barré syndrome was observed after getting shingrix. fainting can also happen.

the most common side effects are pain, redness, and swelling at the injection site, muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. shingles doesn't care but, shingrix protects. shingrix is now zero dollars for almost everyone. ask your doctor about shingrix today. >> and update on a story we've

been covering for you. both expelled members of the tennessee three have won reelection to their old seats. justin jones won his election for his state house state and nashville. and justin j. pearson won his state race in memphis, according to projections. this comes months after republicans expelled them for disorderly behavior while protesting against gun violence on the house floor. jones and pearson we're fighting for stricter gun measures, after a mass shooting at a nashville school left six people dead, including three on year olds. their expulsions lid to claims of a racial double extended. well jones and pearson up both black, the three protesting member of the tennessee three, democrat laura johnson, who is white, she was not removed from office. johnson said the difference in treatment, quote, might have to do with the color of her skin. jones and pearson marie into the ballot officials, but only on an interim basis. they still had to run for the old seat. first in the gym primaries, and

then in this week's general election. their winds come at a critical time for democrats. republican governor bill lee has called a special session for later this month to address potentially changing the states gun control laws. justin jones says he is ready for it. he tweeted this announcement at the republican house vita who let the votes last spring. the find out era of politics is just beginning. see you august 21st for special session. we'll be right back. right back. now is the time to partner with our experts. get started today with verizon business. it's your business. it's your verizon. my father didn't know his dad. she knew that i always want to know more about my family history. with ancestry i dug and dug until i found some information. i was able to find out more than just a name. and then you add it to the tree. i found ship manifests. birth certificate.

wow. look at your dad. i love it so much to know where my father work, where he grew up. it's like you discover a new family member. discover even more at ancestry.com imagine you're doing something you love. rsv could cut it short. ♪ rsv is a contagious virus that usually causes mild symptoms but can cause more severe infections that may lead to hospitalizations... ...in adults 60 and older... ...and adults with certain underlying conditions, like copd, asthma, or congestive heart failure. talk to your doctor and visit cutshortrsv.com. (dad) we got our subaru forester wilderness like copd, asthma, or congestive heart failure. to discover all of the places that make us feel something more.

(vo) subaru is the national park foundation's largest corporate donor, helping expand access for all. when my doctor gave me breztri for my copd things changed for me. breztri gave me better breathing, symptom improvement, and reduced flare-ups. breztri won't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. it is not for asthma. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. don't take breztri more than prescribed. breztri may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. ask your doctor about breztri. (vo) verizon small business days are coming. vision changes, or eye pain occur. from august 7th to the 13th. now is the time to partner with our experts. get started today with verizon business. it's your business. it's your verizon. >> as we discussed earlier,

goli, taste your goals.

rudy giuliani appears to be a coconspirator one in check smith's indictment, which accuses his former client donald trump of plotting to overturn the 2020 election. coconspirator one is part of a free conspiracy. the possibility is that rudy giuliani could be charged himself. they next chapter in his long public life will be written by jack smith, who could pressure giuliani into cooperating or leave him dangling to be indicted, potentially, by the district attorney investigating election interference in georgia. so with giuliani back in the news for his election subversion efforts, msnbc's

hearing and encore presentation of four seasons total documentary, next. this revisits juliette's famous press conference at four seasons total landscaping, delivered just as the presidential election was called for joe biden and how giuliani's efforts to turn the election into doubt not a i carpeting center somehow. stick around after for a competition i hosted with the director of the documentary, and the family behind the philadelphia landscaping business. don't go anywhere. four seasons total documentary is beginning right now and streaming on peacock. thank you for making time with us. metric to come back tomorrow night at nine, usually, on msnbc. i'll be joined by its him -- the lead investigator of the general sixth committee to discuss how this late to trump indictment vindicates his work. and going broke. wisconsin democrat party you're bandwidth or on the dire straits state republican party finds themselves and. until then, i'm ayman mohyeldin.

four seasons total documentary begins right now. have a good nights. ve a good nights >> well, this is it! this is where it all happened. imagine that. my garage door made history. this is where the big press conference took place.