against president trump here, they don't. >> we will see, this is an interesting place with regards to that. we will see if other georgia politicians get on board with this idea. it is not clear yet which way it will go. williams and christine, thank you both. that is all in on this wednesday, interesting place. thank you both. that is "all in" on this wednesday night. alex wagner tonight starts right now with ali velshi in for alex. >> the expression everything but the kitchen sink or throw spaghetti on the wall, when you listen to chesebro and sydney powell you're wondering is this a legal strategy or about anything i can prosably attempt and trying. >> the lawyers say, yeah, i'd do that if i'm defending them. i want to interview the jurors. >> thank tuesday you at home for joining us tonight. we've got new developments in

that georgia case involving donald trump's alleged efforts to overturn the election. sydney powell, this woman, asked the court to separate her case from the other 19 defendants in the trial. their lawyers claimed sydney powell, quote, has no substantive connection to any other defendant regarding the incharges in the indictment, end quote, and therefore should be tried alone. that is to put it mildly a difficult case to make. powell seen here standing alongside rudy giuliani in front of a campaign sign for the codefendant for donald trump, at that meeting they considered making sydney powell a special counsel so that she could investigate the election. but now her lawyers say she doesn't really know any of those folks. another codefendant in the georgia case, this man kenneth chesebro has also filed a motion

to sever his file from the others. mr. chesebro would like the court to release the names of 30 coconspirators in the indictment. there are 30 of them not named. fani willis told the court she wants all 19 defendants in this case filed together, no exceptions. chesebro and powell have all invoked georgia's speedy trial act to try to get their cases to court before all the other defendants in the case. another codefendant, trump lawyer, john eastman, says he intends to do the same. we don't know who the courts will side with on that particular question, but if those defendants think they're going to have an easier time on their own, they'll have to rethink their strategy. john eastman gave an interview to fox news where he issued this challenge. >> on the rico side of the fulton county case, that would require findings of bad faith. that would have to be you all

basically agreeing implicitly, explicitly you all knew it was phony, and to that you say. >> well, they've got all the evidence, they've got all my e-mails. my phone was seized over a year ago so they've got all that stuff as well, and i challenge them to find a single e-mail or communication that supports that implausible theory. >> challenge accepted. john eastman wants to see an e-mail where he admits this isn't all above board. okay, what about this one? it's in the january 6th indictment sent by john eastman to then vice president mike pence's chief counsel in which he says i implore you to consider one more relatively minor violation of the electoral count act and adjourn for ten days to delay -- to allow the ledge s rachers to finish their investigations as well as to allow a full forensic audit of the massive amount of illegal

activity that has occurred here. how about this one where he tells rudy giuliani i've decided that i should be put on the pardon list if that's still in the works, end quote. okay. joining us now are people who know more about this than i do. jim was seen as a former campaign manager for barack obama's 2012 re-election campaign and a former white house deputy chief of staff and the ceo of the group. also with us is anthony michael christ, a professor afflaw and political science at georgia state university. good evening to both of you. anthony, let's start with you because some of the legal stuff makes some sense and some of it makes no sense at all. donald trump tried this the other day, the day he turned himself in. he came out and spoke briefly to reporters and said i don't even know most of these people i'm charged with. he may not know a couple of them based on the breadth of this set of charges.

sidney powell was on the ground. she was doing things there, hanging around election offices, trying to become special counsel, behind a lot of these plans. tell me on the face of it theimators of their arguments. >> well, i think this is exactly why fani willis has used the rico statute rather than a traditional conspiracy crime or conspiracy to commit election fraud because under a traditional conspiracy to commit election fraud charge, you'd have to have a situation where two people essentially get together, agree to do something unlawful and then one person in that group does something concrete in furtherance of that crime or that conspiracy. here what we have is a much more difficult scenario where you have a number of different moving parts and everybody knows they're part of some kind of machine that is up to no good. right, they have an unlawful enterprise or unlawful goal, but

they don't really know how they're all working together. so this idea they can say, well, i don't all these defendants and i didn't really have any concrete agreements with them really doesn't fly because that's exactly why fani willis is charging these crimes in the way that she is. >> jim, how do you think this is all playing out? it's less coordinated than the whole case fani willis is making. they all seem to be doing their own thing right now which leads me to believe at some point they're not all lined up behind trump. >> you're right. at some point they're going to make deals and say things like eastman said last night on fox. i loved how you nailed him on it. this is the kind of thing they're all going to start to do, and this is the problem when you have 30 shall we say unsavory characters trying to cut deals and trying to all defend themselves, and now they all want to go to individual trials, which if you're the

trump campaign is just an absolute nightmare and would be very, very bad for them as this plays out on national tv every single night. >> anthony, there's some speculation and i don't understand this very well, but the reason that these attorneys for a few of these characters want their cases to go first and separately is that they can then invoke attorney-client p privile to not say things about their discussions with donald trump, and donald trump can later use that information. what do you know about this? >> well, i think what we're seeing from the individuals who have invoked their speedy trial rights is two things. the first being the counsel issue or the attorney-client privilege issue. and i'll get to that in a second. some of them particularly kenneth chesebro has the opportunity or wants to make the opportunity of standing alone to say i was just engaging in legal

theory and i wasn't engaged in the actual criminal conduct other people were potentially or allegedly doing in georgia, just leave me alone. i was just the guy thinking legal theories like law professors do. so i think that's part of the strategy. the other thing of course is that attorney-client privilege is not completely absolute, right? so if a judge finds that there is a crime that was involved in a conversation between an attorney and their client there's the crime fraud exception, which would allow some of that evidence to potentially come in. we already have an example of that from federal court where a federal judge found there was some criminal activity at least more likely than not to have occurred between john eastman and donald trump and some of the individuals that john eastman was working with in some of the litigation they had here in georgia. so that can be pierced. and so, you know, i think that some of the defendants may have thought that maybe fani willis

wasn't going to be quite prepared to have trials this fall, but i think really a number of the folks are gaming out the system to essentially say i really wasn't engaged in this really deeply criminal stuff, i kind of have the fewest fingerprints on georgia than anybody. i think that's unpersuasive. i think that would be a hard thing for them to create a defense around, but i suspect that's largely their strategy. >> so, jim, of the four indictments two of them georgia and jack smith's january 6th, have to do with fraud or donald trump's claims of fraud in the election. they are detailed. they are going to play out some time over the course of the next several months or a year. but take a look at a poll conducted by the atlanta journal constitution in which the question was asked do you believe there's widespread fraud during the 2020 presidential elections or not? now, just to be clear with everybody these are republican primary voters. 61% say yes, 30% say no.

8.5% are undecided. i'm puzzled as to how you're undecided 2 1/2 years into this thing. jim, this is what's going on. donald trump looks at those numbers and if you believe there was fraud in the 2020 election, you're more likely than not to be a trump supporter in the next election. his base isn't dwindling on that front. >> no, it's not. and the sis the lasting damage he's doing to american democracy. he's out there telling an entire wing of one of the two major parties that up is down and that black and white, and now they're not going to believe the next thing they hear. and it's really a huge problem, and it's a huge problem for people running against him in the primary. because the moment you say, hey, the election wasn't stolen or even this guy is going to be prosecuted on 91 felony counts and should be our nominee, you're going up against 60% of the party who believes that's not true and believes donald trump was right. i saw an interesting

statistic as well among religious voters more people believe donald trump is honest than religious leaders. it is part of the problem that all these folks running against donald trump in the primary are going to have to deal with because right now he is the arbiter of truth as horrifying as it seems to you and me. >> speaking about the truth, anthony, mark meadows trying to get his case taken to federal court, probably thinks he's got a chance of a better jury pool there. but his principle point, and he's not fully making it, but there's been a trial before a trial, but you can see what he'd do if he got to federal court. his argument was i was the chief of staff to the president. in fact the words he used i was trying to land the plane. but there's a phone call in which he's unrecorded, that the court has heard where he's talking to brad raffensperger the secretary of state.

and while he's not using trumpian language in terms of being threatening and mob bossy, he's implying is there something we can do together to work this all out because there's votes we need. >> so i actually had the opportunity to go to federal court on monday and watch that hearing, and mark meadows did his very best to i think be an affable witness and to present to just do his job and really the activities he was engaged here in georgia were run of the mill activities for chief of staff. but it was somewhat unpersuasive and i would say largely unpersuasive because while there might have been some incidents wh conduct might have been fairly benign, the d.a.'s office proffered evidence to show that he was coordinating with campaign staff and doing things that were not furthering the federal interest. in particular there was an effort by trump allies to get a

signature audit on mail ballots here in fulton county, and mark meadows asked a member of the secretary of state's office if he could somehow coordinate campaign funds to come to georgia to assist that. he made a lot of efforts to coordinate with campaign workers and with state officials to get the phone call connected between donald trump and brad raffensperger. there was a lot he was doing. throughout the entirety of everything mark meadows did here in georgia, one thing stuck out in that hearing which was he had no good answer for why when he was chief of staff he didn't read in anyone from the white house counsel's office, anyone from the department of justice or anyone from the department of homeland security because he was really doing campaign work, and that's not permitted under federal law, and really cuts against his removal motion. >> and he was the chief of staff not someone's assistant.

he could have tapped anyone one of those people, the white house counsel or tapped anyone and said you've got a view on this, or should i be going to this meeting. lot to unpack and we appreciate your expertise. we appreciate your time tonight. all right, we're going to take a quick break. we will be right back in just a moment. ke a quick break we will be right back in just a moment

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kids in texas are back to school this week, however, for the almost 200,000 public school students in heisten, the largest school district by far in texas, this year is on track to be very different. that's because this past june the state of texas took over the houston public schools following what they called inadequate test scores. the state started by removing elected school board members and ushering in a new superintendent who in turn announced a, quote, new education system. in that system discipline is prioritized over libraries and books. over the summer librarian jobs were eliminated in 28 schools across houston. some of the libraries have been repurposed, turned into so-called team centers meant for disciplining students who misbehave in clas. this sparked outcry against the largely democratic city where 80% of the kids in school are black or hispanic.

>> reporter: lately houston mom lauren simmons struggles to recognize her own city. she came up through the very same school system that her third and 11th grader now attend, but this year her daughter's school won't have a full library. >> it's been a real struggle for me because i should just be able to wake up drive my kids five minutes down the street and they be at schools that are filled with great educators, that have all of the fancy, you know, programs and after school programs, and that's just not our reality. >> reporter: what did the library mean to you when you were a kid coming up in the same system? >> the library was everything. i'm the kid that's checking out ten books and i'm checking out ten more books and i'm at hominid the cover reading books. >> reporter: over the summer dozens of houston schools replaced their libraries with

team centers where students will do work or go where they misbehave. many librarians were laid off or reassigned to new jobs. the changes overwhelmingly impacted black and latino neighborhoods. so the moms spent their summers going to meetings and protests demanding to be heard. >> i want you to look at my face and remember me because i'm your new best friend. >> reporter: republicans have made parental rights a center of the gop platform arguing that parents have a right to demand books be removed from schools, that lessons on race and gender be restricted. but this spring when the state of tex took over the houston independent school district of almost 200,000 kids in a blue city, in a red state there was little outcry from those same parental rights activists. the state replaced their elected school board members. they pushed out the superintendent and brought in a former dallas superintendent and charter school founder mike

miles. turner thinks the move is anti-democratic. >> i'm not going to try to sugar coat it. it's a hostile takeover where the people are not accountable to the parents or the teachers or the local community or the students. they're appointed by the people at the state. >> reporter: is houston in conflict with its own state government? >> houston has been in conflict with its own state government for years. what's happening here cannot be viewed separate and apart from the greater picture, okay. so let's not be fooled. >> reporter: for years a number of houston schools were failing. parents pleaded for more resources as large numbers of students fell far behind on reading and math. former district leaders tried to implement new programs, and the state gave them a "b" rating in 2022. the texas education agency took over hisd anyone. the superintendent knew the model would emphasize instruction time in the classroom and use team centers

like these for the kids who are excelling and the kids who need a time out. he understands families are anxious about change. he believes it was necessary. what message do you think is sent to kids, though, who see classmates in other parts of the city who still have functioning staffed libraries? >> so i think kids like to learn. i think kids focus on their schools, and so i think -- i think the kids are going to be fine. i think they're very flexible, adaptable. you've seen them already -- >> reporter: i've spoken to some of the kids in your district. one third grader told me it made her feel angry. one fifth grader said it made her feel like she's a bad kid who doesn't deserve a library. >> so when they come to school what i've heard and what my staff has heard is nothing but, oh, this is okay. i think the kids will adapt and they will love school like you see kids learning here. >> reporter: do you believe

librarians are important? >> so every -- every single position has value, and it has, you know, a role to play in different places. we can't be all things to all people and we can't have everything we want. so there's a productization hat has to happen. science and reading versus this position. >> so does that mean you're robbing peter to pay paul? >> i wouldn't phrase it that way. what i would say is we're putting in a bold, different model that works. >> reporter: but parents like lauren say their wishes are being ignored by the school system. do parents here feel heard? >> i'm having to literally fight and yell from the rooftops that my children deserve a library. even prisons have libraries. >> reporter: cheryl hensley worked for hisd for 39 years. she was lauren's second grade teacher before she became a

librarian. she was laid off as part of the takeover. >> if we just focus on the classroom it's just part of the kid, it's just part of your community. i'm building a lifelong learner. i'm building beyond the teacher. i'm giving them a choice. they're going to the classroom and they're told they have to pass this test, they have to read this passage, they have do to these strategies. when they come to me they're given a book they choose. they get a book they want to read. >> reporter: was it hard to leave your school? >> extremely hard. i still go by. these kids are important to me, and i felt like i loved every single one of them. >> reporter: lauren says the library that was a lifeline for her as a kid is worth fighting for. >> what are my rights as a parent? are my children not entitled to a quality education in their neighborhood? like where does that fit into my

american dream, you know, the pursuit of happiness and life and liberty? i don't feel very happy right now. i don't feel very liberated. i don't feel very free. i feel very frustrated. i feel very unheard, and i feel like my children, the children in this district are being treated like political football. >> reporter: lauren's son james can already read well, but her daughter sidney struggles with dyslexia. >> i think people forget sometimes there are real people impacted by this. seriously, what am i supposed to do with my baby girl who is doing her best -- >> they lived in a house in the woods. i don't know why people need to take a library away for no reason. it doesn't make sense because it's really hard to see a thing

that you love to just be, poof, gone. >> reporter: the library was one of sidney's favorite spaces at school. you're going into third grade. that's an important year for reading. what do you heap to still learn? what kind of help do you need? >> i need like help with words and i need to read a lot. >> reporter: what message do you think it sends to you to go to a school that doesn't have a library? >> that kids just shouldn't read, or kids like us just shouldn't read. >> kids shouldn't read or kids like us shouldn't read. that is some incredible reporting from nbc news correspondent antonia hilton who's covered many stories of american schools struggling as politics and education policy collide. we're going to talk to her all about that when we come back. stay with us. back stay with us

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the city of houston is run by a democratic mayor sylvester turner who you saw in the previous story. harass county went blue as it has in every presidential election since 2008. joe biden won the county by more than 13 percentage points. harris county is one of the most diverse counties in the state of texas. the school district is no different. more than 30% of the 200,000

students enrolled are black or latino and the republican led state of texas is focused on improving the district's test scores by taking away state libraries. they'll transform the library and many of the schools into centers of discipline, literally replacing books with isolation. mayor turner says the library plan is creating a prison-like atmosphere in places typically associated with learning. antonia hilton spent a few days in houston talking with parents and students about the changes and what it means for their communities. literally no one tells these important stories than you do, but the last thing you said in your story, that boy saying kids shouldn't read or kids like us shouldn't read, i don't know if he recognized that in american history particularly in the south, particularly in texas, that was a thing that his ancestors may have faced, a deliberate effort to make sure that certain people did not read. they could not attain

self-sufficiency. they could not in those days get away from their owners and captors, but in this day it keeps them in their place. that was a remarkable piece of a very remarkably resonant story. >> reporter: thank you, ali. you know, that boy is actually a ferocious reader so he may well know all the history you spelled outright there, and that's really the weight a lot of the families of color here in houston are feeling right now. nobody thinks the school didn't need any kind of reform or change. in fact, in all the areas in which the state was criticizing houston isd, the parents were, too. they wanted more for their kids. they wanted more resources. they were asking the state for more money. they wanted new programs. they wanted interventionests to help their kids catch up to reading and math. nobody here was saying nothing needed to change and the status quo was fine. so they agree with the superintendent on that. but i think for these families

who are seeing some of their kids struggle to read and struggle to find points in the day at school where they can also just relax, be themselves, have fun, curl up with a book, the library meant something to them. it meant a lot for those kids to go into that space, to make a decision, a choice about what they wanted to explore that day and really have essentially in that room. and so that's the question that parents tell me they're asking this administration, you know, where is our agency now thought we've lost our elected representatives where do we get a seat at the table? and if we're going to make all these changes, okay, some changes are good but what say do we have? and will you partner with us before you move ahead with that? that's sort of what's at stake here. and they see this history and what could happen to kids who look like them. >> you spoke to the new nonelected superintendent, and i thought something he said was very interesting. when you asked him specifically about libraries it was stark. i can't imagine such a thing. i've known of the story for several weeks but i've not seen

the imagery there are literally libraries without books in them. and he said we can't be all things to all people, we can't have everything we want. there are virtually no students in this country who will tell you that the library whether it's school or otherwise was not central to the being of a child who enjoyed education. so, yeah, can't be all things to all people, but why the libraries? of all the things to cut why the libraries? >> reporter: well, he sees himself as a reformer. he has a large network of charter schools in which he's implemented this new education system and says he's seen a track record of success. and here's the logic behind it, that if they're able to take resources, focus more time on instruction in the classroom and use some of the way in which they've reorganized and remove some positions to increase some teachers pay, that then those teachers will succeed, they will go above and beyond, they'll do more for kids in the classroom

and kids will get more of that reading instruction and all other kinds of instruction to really catch up with the rest of the state. so it's not that he thinks kids shouldn't read but the library is not the space for that. there'll be points in the day where there'll be able to read through english, read as part of science. but librarians said to me they did a whole lot more than check out books or stand there as kids read. they found kids who maybe weren't that into reading and they helped them find subjects they were inspired by, that they would give kids the next book in a series so they would keep falling in love with reading and in love with authors. they would also teach classes to help kids figure out the difference between fact and fiction. how do you evaluate resources and cite them in papers. librarians were playing all these roles. their concern is this is so much

bigger than how did the shelves look in a room. it's about the culture, all the pieces and joy and love of learning that go with it. we had a chance to go inside the team center, and you can see some of it in the story there where there are rows and rows of desks in what used to be a library and along the wall there are a lot of these shelves where the kids are either going to be able to at the beginning of the day or end of the day grab books, sort of an honor system. we didn't actually get to see kids do that today. but the other people librarians are concerned about is if they're just there in the corners and along the walls, kids are going to forget about the library and it won't be a focal part of school culture anymore. >> crow spoke to the parent of a child in the school system that has disabilities and they worry about how this transformation of libraries is going to affect their children especially their children and their ability to learn english. let's listen to that together. .

>> tell me a bit more about that. >> reporter: you just met a mom there named celina. she has children heading into one of these schools where the library has been transformed. she has a son with autism, one son with adhd. and her concern is her kids with special needs may be misinterpreted in the classroom and they may then be sent to spend some time in one of these team centers for discipline. she said she hasn't received enough information in spanish. and this is a district in some schools the majority of kids are latino, the majority of kids have parents who do not speak english at home. many of them are going home and they can't practice reading and

have an adult to help them with their assignment that day. so getting that instruction in school, that support in school is really all those kids have. and so these parents are doing their best right now. i actually got to spend time with one mom named jessica campos who speaks both english and spanish and she's been translating. she sends out text messages and e-mails to all the spanish speaking parents around her neighborhood to try to give them an update on the questions she asked the administration, the information she received from their teachers so she can try to give them, you know, that sense of feeling they still have a say in their school. at that elementary pew, the principal no longer speaks spanish who has been put in place now after this takeover. so there's a lot of anxiety there, and i think it's going to take a couple weeks of how this new system really works. i've spoken to meme who are working through it and excited and say the pay increases are going to help. but right now the parents,

they're describing chaos, and that's for parents both who speak english as a first language and for parents who are still learning, ali. >> i'm going to follow it closely with you, antonia. the attacks on books and education in texas and across the country is exactly what i've been exploring for the last year and a half, but now i've got a brand new podcast for it. the first two episodes are outright now. you can scan the qr code on your screen to listen wherever you get your podcasts. still ahead an outpouring of bipartisan support for senator mitch mcconnell after an incident at a press conference in his home state of kentucky today. we'll have more details on that when we come back. e details on when we come back. are you good? no, i think i'm late on my car insurance. good thing the general gives you a break when you need it. yeah, with flexible payment options to keep you covered. just tag us in. ouaaaahhhh! [bell dings] for a great low rate, go with the general. attention... are you suffering from hearing loss? the fda has finally approved hearing aids to be sold over the counter. ouaaaahhhh! [bell dings]

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before the senate reconvenes next week, senators are attending a few events in their home states. today reporters caught up with mitch mcconnell after he spoke at an event in kentucky. this is what happened when one of those reporters asked senator mcconnell about running for re-election. >> what are your thoughts about running for re-election in 2026? >> what are my thoughts about what? >> running for re-election in 2026? >> that's a -- >> did you hear the question, senator? running for re-election in 2026?

>> yes. >> i'm sorry, y'all. we're going to need a minute. senator. >> somebody else have a question. please speak up. >> senator mcconnell, by the way, misspoke. he's a minority leader as you know. he went onto answer questions with the help of his aide. in late july senator mcconnell went silent for several seconds during a news conference in the capitol before his colleagues escorted him away. at the time mcconnell's office said he felt light-headed. nbc news reached out to his office for comment on the senator appearing to freeze-up today. a spokesperson said, quote, leader mcconnell felt light-headed and paused during his press conference today. while he feels fine wheres a

measure he'll be consulting his physician. this afternoon when asked about senator mcconnell president joe biden wished him well. >> we had disagreements politically but he's a good friend, so i'm going to try to get in touch with him later this afternoon. >> after the episode in kentucky, senator mitch mcconnell began calling his fellow republican leaders in the senate, senator john thune's spokesman said his sounded like himself. the cost of a hurricane's destructive path through the southeast. much more on that after the break. southeast. much more on that after the break. blendjet 2 gives you ice-crushing, big blender power on-the-go. so you can blend up a mouthwatering smoothie, protein shake, or latte wherever you are! recharge quickly with any usb port. best of all, it even cleans itself! just blend water with a drop of soap.

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it's been a little over 12 hours since hurricane idalia made landfall in florida's big bend region as a cootgory 3 hurricane downing trees and power lines and flooding streets and homes. the sparsely populated island city of cedar key saw 8 to 9 feet of damaging storm surge. in tampa while structural damage is minimal which is more typical of a built-up area like that tampa bay saw up to 5 feet of storm surge. so we're dealing with a couple problems here, water, storm

surge, flooding. just tonight a sea wall has been breached in charleston, south carolina. a town that literally floods any time a hurricane glances in its direction. but there's another issue with the water. it's really hot. you've probably seen references to ocean temperatures off the coast of florida feeling like you're getting in a hot bath. it's the harbinger of really damaging super powerful storms. joining us now is the former under-deputy at noaa and assistant secretary at science in the state department. she's both the president and ceo of the wildlife conservation society. monica, thank you for being here. you for so long has been a sort of counselor to me in terms of understanding climate. you have a specialty in ocean and ocean water. and that is what we see here. when a hurricane in the atlantic gets close to the mainland the temperature of the water influenced by the climate influences the power of that

hurricane. >> it sure does, ali. thank you so much for having me on tonight and for talking about this really important topic. it super charges the storm. and i want to say hats off to the folks who flew through the storm to feel its impacts and actually the forecast was incredibly accurate as to where it would make landfall, so it gave people plenty of time to prepare. what they had to prepare was a super storm full of heat and energy, and that huge storm surge different than what we've seen decades ago, that super charged water just acts like a vacuum, and it sucks up more and more energy into the storm, and then it all comes ashore. >> so let's look at this. hurricane idalia went from a category 1 to a category 4 essentially overnight. warm waters in the gulf of mexico helped fuel hurricane idalia's rapid intensification hours before it made landfall as

idalia moved through the gulf on tuesday, its winds rose by 55 miles per hour in just 24 hours strengthening from a category 1 hurricane to a category 4 by early wednesday. i want to put up a tweet by a former noaa scientist jeff masters who you may know, and he was saying idalia is one of ten historical storms since 1950 that have intensified by at least 40 miles per hour in 24 hours before landfall. this is -- you and i follow storms very closely. a storm can arrive close to land and the termture of the water might not be warm enough and the storm can fizzle and save lives. when it hits water and it's that hot, it intensifies into again could have pin a category 1 or 2 a couple days ago, ended up category 4. >> it intensifies so quickly, and it is such a huge, powerful thing to contend with, and most of the building codes really weren't made for storms of this

intensity, and we certainly had time to prepare for a storm, but not the one of this intensity if we had, i think, a little more climate information, if we continue to perfectthies models, maybe we can better predict the intensity of this storm a few days out. we're getting better and better at it, but we need to keep going. >> there is damage. there were -- we believe i think there were two lives lost in connection with this, but there is a lot of property damage. in years past you'd say hopefully you had insurance for it. wind insurance is really hard to get. flood insurance is really hard to get, and it's getting harder to get particularly in flood prone areas like florida. i had a produce kurt on this show tell me here in new york state they couldn't renew their flood insurance. insurance companies are sitting here thinking i don't want to get involved in this. >> it's a real problem, and some people may think climate change is a hoax, but it's not and

insurance companies know it. that's why it's harder and harder to get insured in the state of florida. in fact, the state of florida itself now has to write insurance policies because big companies won't come in and do it any longer. thousands of floridians are turning to the state to insure them, and the system is already at a very critical point where it's hard for it to take on much more damage and have to pay out more claims. they can't keep up. the same thing has happened in california. and i'll tell you, you know, a decade ago in new york city the very institution that i run lost its aquarium -- we lost the aquarium in coney island to super storm sandy that wasn't even a hurricane. it's taken us more than a decade and millions and millions of dollars to repair. so we know that climate change is a real force that we have to contend with now, and we are i think fooling ourselves if we think the hits won't keep on

coming. the ocean is absorbing 90% of those extra greenhouse gases. that heat is just trapped in the ocean, and it's going to continue to charge things up. and of course on top of that we've had horrific heat waves this summer and fires like the ones in maui, so i think insurers are going to be holding -- are going to be increasing prices everywhere, all over the country because climate change is here. it's hitting everyone in the u.s. one way or another it's been -- it's been quite a summer and hurricane season hasn't even ended yet. we have a big month ahead of us, ali. we have to hope things don't get worse. >> and you're right in california if you want insurance for a fire you're having problems getting that, too. some insurers won't insure you for anything in florida. all right, one quick reminder before we go tonight as we continue to follow all of the developments in donald trump's multiple trials, all four

indictments will be available complete and unabridged in a brand new book and introduced by me. "the trump indictments" comes out september 25th. you can preorder it now. and while you wait for the book you can hear me read all the indictments on our podcast by scanning the qr code on your screen and a lot more content in that podcast as well. that's it for our show tonight. "way too early" with jonathan lemire is up next. why did you decide to evacuate? >> this surge right here, man. if we had been in our property we would have got flooded, we wouldn't have been able to leave. >> didn't know what i was going to do until these guys showed up. i was going to actually stay and swim in my house. >> high heart just dropped out of my chest when they called the house was on fire because we prepared for a flood not a fire. >> some of the survivors of hurricane idalia, the first major hurricane to hit florida's big bend region in more than a century. we'll have the very latest on the storm's path and on t