go cornhuskers, go ladies, that does it for this edition of "andrea mitchell reports." "chris jansing reports" starts right now. good day, i'm chris jansing live at msnbc headquarters in new york city. donald trump is skipping a chance to appear before tv cameras, telling the court he'll waive his right to show up in person for an arraignment before a judge in georgia as part of a not guilty plea he entered just this morning. another judge absolutely shredding the arguments of trump's former lawyer rudy giuliani for defaming two georgia election workers. next up, punitive damages for the admitted lies he told, even as he insists he's too poor to pay. plus, hurricane idalia is just the latest in a string of multibillion dollar disasters hitting the u.s. at a rate of

one every couple of weeks, and fema's primary disaster fund is nearly out of money. and a nightmare in south africa, a fire ripping through a building full of homeless men, women, and children, some literally throwing babies out of windows in a desperate attempt to save their lives. the death toll 74 with potentially more to come. but we start with the former president, opting out of his first chance to respond to the charges against him in open court in georgia. trump's decision to plead not guilty and waive his arraignment means no televised court appearance, yet another example of an event that would have been the first of its kind. at least four of the 19 defendants have now waived their right to appear, trump joining ray smith, sidney powell, and trevian coo tee, that includes rudy giuliani the subject of a blistering decision from a d.c. judge finding him liable for

defaming two georgia election workers and accusing him of intentionally ignoring basic rules of evidence in order to avoid a trial. i want to bring in nbc's blayne alexander following this case in georgia, barbara mcquade is a former u.s. attorney, law professor at the u.s. university of michigan. great to have all of you here. blayne, what more can you tell us about trump's decision, and do we know yesterday if others will follow suit? >> chris, we expect that they likely will. in fact, as you mentioned, this is not the first person we've seen waive their appearance, we do expect that before next wednesday we will see some of those other co-defendants do the same thing, enter a waiver and a not guilty plea so they don't have to come down here to downtown atlanta and appear before a judge. this filing from the former president through his attorneys was very short. it wasn't even two full pages, but basically saying he's

waiving his appearance. he's entering a not guilty plea. that kind of takes a lot of question off the table as to whether or not we would see a repeat of what we saw last week, which is that extraordinary scene of the former president coming down to georgia, the enormous amount of security around the jail for him to turn himself in. there was a plan locally for what would happen with courthouse security if that needed to take place, but of course that doesn't need to actually come to fruition. and the bigger thing you mentioned in all of this, this is different from his previous legal troubles, so this would have been televised. we will not see that opportunity of the former president actually saying the words not guilty before a judge, chris. >> blayne, thank you so much for that, we have seen throughout this, david, for every one of these court appearance, that he's turned a lot of heads. he's gotten a lot of publicity, but as blayne pointed out, this is different. this would have been cameras in court. are you surprised at all that he made this decision? >> yeah, mildly surprised.

i mean, he's used all of these indictments and the activities that go along with them to raise money for his campaign, to boost his status in the republican primary contest, to strengthen his connection to republican voters at least those committed voters part of his base and the broader part of the republican base, and here you would have had him on television, not much different than a mug shot that he splashed all over the place. there could have been logistical issues. could have been he's following legal advice, but just given the politics of the primary -- if we want to talk about this in a general election context, i think there's more peril for the president politically related to his legal issues. in the primary it's been nothing but gold for him politically. kind of surprised he's bowing out of a chance to monopolize the media for a full day because we would have had cameras once again following him all over the place all day and all night until he was done. >> all right, barbara, let's talk about rudy giuliani.

i mean, i haven't read a fraction of the orders that you have read. i thought that this was kind of extraordinary. she basically said giuliani was so intentionally inept it wasn't even possible to have a trial. what's your takeaway from what you saw here? >>. >> the judge here found there was no genuine issue of any material fact, that the facts were clear that donald trump had defamed both ruby freeman and shaye moss with his statements, and you know, the really indefensivable when you think about the things they said singling them out based on completely innocent and very responsible behavior serving as poll workers. so probably not a surprise that the judge did find the way she did, but she did come down very hard on him. the only thing left now is how much money he is going to have to pay them, not only in damages but possibly punitive damages, which is damage above and beyond your out-of-pocket expenses.

so for things like i lost my job and i had pain and suffering and other kinds of things. that's compensatory damages, and that would be the baseline. in addition when conduct is extremely egregious, a judge can also add what's called punitive damages, and that's extra money for punishment because what they did was so egregiously bad. >> let's break down, david, that financial component because giuliani has said pretty much throughout this process, right, that he's running out of money. his lawyer has said he's out of money. he said he can't even reimburse ruby freeman and shaye moss for the cost of litigation, let alone anything else he might be responsible for, but according to fortune magazine -- and i'm quoting them here -- the judge said claims that giuliani couldn't reimburse the attorneys' fees were dubious given that giuliani was able to pay more than $320,000 to the vendor holding his electronic data, which former president donald trump's super pac reportedly paid, that he recently listed his new york city apartment for $6.5 million, and reportedly flew on a private

plane to georgia to surrender to authorities after being indicted there. this is just one example of rudy giuliani being accused of playing fast and loose with the truth. how do you see this playing out for him, david? you followed him for a long time. >> look, i mean, i'm still constantly perplexed at the sort of makeover of the national figure that we knew as rudy giuliani and that we know today as rudy giuliani. but the one constant, i think, is that he likes the limelight. he likes the spotlight, and even with all of this legal peril, the fact that there are cameras interested in talking to him, that we are interested in talking to him, that he remains a key figure in trump's legal drama, i think it's something that he's sort of quietly or not so quietly enjoys and almost wouldn't know what to do without.

you know, i think, you know, for him as we have seen for other people associated with trump, there are things that trump has been able to navigate legally, in part because he's a candidate, in part because he's a major political figure, that the people around him, even closely around him, like his former chief of staff mark meadows and others are not able to handle as successfully, and i think, you know, what he is finding out is that there's a difference between being donald trump, at least for now, and being somebody who has helped donald trump or advised him over these years. >> you know, barbara, i think if you go back to the january 6th hearing, there are few people more relatable than ruby freeman and shaye moss, and i just want to remind people and play a little bit of that testimony. take a listen. >> it's turned my life upside down. i no longer give out my business

card. i don't transfer calls. i don't want anyone knowing my name. i don't want to go anywhere with my mom because she might yell my name out over the grocery aisle or something. i don't go to the grocery store at all. i haven't been anywhere at all. >> when you listen to that, and again, that's just one small portion of what the two of them have talked about. talk about the punitive damages, what's looked at in making a decision like that, and, frankly, how much does emotion and relatability play into it? >> i think very much. you know, a jury would be asked this question or a judge to find what is the appropriate amount of money, and in some ways, it's very difficult to put a dollar figure on all of that, but testimony will be important to understand all of the different ways that they have suffered. and as you just heard, they are, you know, basically prisoners in

their own homes. i know there was other testimony about people coming to her grandmother's home saying words like you're lucky it's 2022 and not 1922, you know, suggesting that more dire consequences could occur to her if it were in a different time, and so i think a lawyer will propose what is an appropriate number for that. the defense will counter that a different number is appropriate, and ultimately, it is what is appropriate punishment that doesn't just compensate the person for their loss. that's going to be compensatory damages, but then this bit that's above and beyond for deliberately inflicting harm on another person, that is sheerly for punishment, and that number is often well into the millions of dollars. >> david drucker, we're going to get back to you in just a moment, but barbara, stand by fors. we have some breaking news. president biden is now proposing a major plan for gun reform that could close the gun show loophole.

nbc's ken dilanian is following this for us. barbara mcquade is staying with us. this literally was just unveiled by the white house. ken, walk us through the president's plan and how it would work. >> chris, this is one of the biggest attempts at gun regulation by a president in years, and what the justice department and the atf is doing today is they are announcing a proposed new regulation that would dramatically expand the licensing of people who are selling guns in the united states of america by eliminating the so-called gun show loophole, which an atf official said in a conference call never actually existed according to the law and the atf. in point of fact, there are tens of thousands of transactions a year where guns are bought and sold outside of the background check system, not by licensed firearm dealers and brick and mortar stores, but at gun shows, flea markets and increasingly on the internet through giant online marketplaces. this is an attempt to rein that in and regulate it.

right now they're not, and so as one official put it, it's like there were two lines at the airport security, one for people who get screened, and one for people who are not, and that line of unscreened people has been growing. so this is a new rule, it's going to have to go through the federal rule making process. it's almost sure to be challenged by second amendment activists in court, but the biden administration believes they can defend it because it's based on new language and the law that congress passed in response to that horrific mass shooting in uvalde, texas, last year called the bipartisan safer communities act. in that law was i would say a little notice provision that tightened the definition of what a gun dealer is. it used to be that you had to derive most of your income and make a livelihood at dealing guns to be covered by it, now it's sort of anybody who engages in the selling of guns for profit will be covered, and that should result in a huge expansion of regulation, and therefore of background checks. >> barbara, we're just i'm sure just throwing this at you now.

when you look at something like this, anything that involves guns, you automatically think it's going to be long. it's going to be nasty and may end up in the supreme court. what's your initial thought on the fight that could ensue over this. >> i don't think so, chris. what it's doing is simply extending a law that already exists in most of the country and ending this loophole. when i served as a prosecutor, it was no secret that people who had problems getting guns, people with felony convictions or mental health adjudications went to the gun shows to buy their guns. they're not going to be able to get one at the sporting good store or some other retailer and they knew that, and they knew the place they could always get a gun was at one of these gun shows because the sellers there were acting as individuals and didn't have to submit to the background check. so this is a huge loophole. this is a way that people buy guns legally but still without going through the background checks that we require. now, it may be that all background checks come under

scrutiny by the supreme court, but this one just brings gun shows up on par with what retailers are already doing. >> what would you see as the pushback? because obviously as ken just pointed out, the white house believes that they can defend this. what are we going to hear likely from the other side? >> i think the only argument would be, you know, after the bruin ace, the court really changed the standard for what is a permissible restriction on gun possession, and it said that it had to be recognized traditionally in the history of the united states, and that is a big exception, i think, that you could say, well, they didn't have background checks in the 1780s, and therefore it's not lawful today. one hopes that some other language that came up in another seminole case called heller in what justice scalia wrote the second amendment does not protect the right to possess any gun in any place under any circumstances whatsoever. this background check seems like

something that fits under the court's precedence under the heller case and see if it continues o'eat away at that standard. >> did you get a sense on this background call what the white house thinks? >> the rule making process involves soliciting public comments. it can take as long as a year, chris. but obviously it will take longer if this thing gets caught up in extensive litigation. >> thank you both so much. up next, hurricane idalia, could mark the united states 19th billion dollar disaster this year alone. the scenes of destruction and the very long road ahead and what's next in this summer of disasters. we're back in 60 seconds. f disasters. we'rbae ck in 60 seconds

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storm idalia, with winds so powerful at one point, it reversed the course of a river. right now the storm is churning off the coast of north carolina after tearing through the southeast leaving 200,000 people without power in florida, georgia, and the carolinas. in florida, major flooding left almost an entire town under water, while 70 miles south of that in cedar key, debris is piling up after roofs and walls were ripped out of homes. one woman told "the new york times" she regrets not leaving, that the whole ocean came through her house. in south carolina, president biden has now approved an emergency declaration after idalia caused the fifth highest tide ever recorded in charleston, and just 20 minutes outside charleston, severe winds picked up this car and simply sent it flying. in north carolina, the national hurricane center is warning of heavy rainfall and life-threatening flash floods

today. nbc's guad venegas is on the ground in cedar key, florida. guad, what's it like there today? i can see the piles of debris behind you. >> reporter: chris, you said one of the residents mentioned it looked like the whole ocean came up inside of cedar creek. cedar key. this is what the destruction looks like today. this is the fairway inn, it's a hotel right off the water that receives a lot of tourists. the owner told me that she had been getting booked every weekend, and of course not only are they dealing with the cleanup, but they aren't receiving those tourists, so there's going to be an economic loss here. look at these walls, chris, this is a cinder block wall. this isn't a wooden structure. it's made out of cinder blocks, and it was torn out completely by this storm. so we had both the winds but also the surge that came in and destroyed a lot of these structures. now, here's what's interesting. when you look at the damage caused by these hurricanes. you look at a structure like this one, these other cottages

here in the hotel who look like they survive. that one made it out okay, but the surge also affected these in the interior is completely destroyed. here's part of a conversation i had with the owner where she was talking about what it's like inside of these rooms. >> i had a bed, a tv. the tv's gone too. coffee, little coffee station here. microwave, refrigerator, bathroom. that's all gone. nothing saveable in this room, in all three of these rooms. >> reporter: of course all of that now destroyed, and then you can see cottages, she said this was the most popular one because it had a beautiful ocean view. that's the reason why so many people live in these communities along the west coast and florida. this is a beautiful part of the country with a lot of ocean views, and the owner was mentioning how there used to be a tv in the room. i think it's that tv that's sit right there.

she also talked about a microwave. we saw a microwave somewhere down there in the water. and that's what the residents came back to after many of them evacuated and returned after the storm, they returned to properties like this one and now it's just going to be the job to do all the cleanup. we can see some of the workers down about 100 feet from me. i'm not sure that we can see it on the camera. those workers beginning with that cleanup process. meanwhile, other residents here are working together to help each other with food, with water, and anything they might need. it's going to take time. while the power company is also working hard to restore power to all of the communities affected, and chris, i also had a conversation with someone from the phone company who said that a lot of the towers affected that aren't operating right now need power, so they have to wait for the power to return to those cell phone towers in order for that service to be restored to a lot of the affected areas here, chris. >> guad venegas, thank you so much for that. the first estimate of idalia's costs is a staggering

$9 billion in damage, and that's only the latest example of what has become an all too familiar story. climate fueled disasters with astronomical price tags. >> we are seeing an increase in the number of severe weather events, and what we saw with this storm as we have seen with several other hurricanes over the last few years is that they are intensifying more rapidly due to the elevated heat of the water temperature. >> well, the data backs it up. through all of 2022, the united states experienced a total of $18 billion plus weather events, that's floods, hurricanes, wildfires. in just eight months of 2023, we've already seen 17 that cost at least a billion dollars. and with no expectation of the disasters letting up anytime soon, fema's emergency coffers are way down and counting on a cooperative congress to fill them. something the president acknowledges is not a sure

thing. nbc's ali vitali is live on capitol hill for us. i'm also joined by michael man, presidential distinguished professor of earth and environmental science at the university of pennsylvania and author of the new book "our fragile moment," which will be available next month. michael, is the fema director right? there's no doubt at all, climate change is intensifying storms. we're just going to continue to see more of them, and that means billions upon billions of dollars of costs even beyond the widespread disruption to lives. >> that's right. the science backs that up. in fact, for a degree celsius, tree and a half or so fahrenheit of warming, which is what we've seen over much of the world oceans, you can expect a roughly 7% increase in the average wind speed that translates -- actually, no, a 14% increase in the average wind speed, which corresponds to a roughly 50% increase in the destructive potential of those storms.

and so we're seeing that, right? we're seeing storms that are leading to losses of tens of billions of dollars now. and too often we hear about the supposed costs of taking action, of decarbonizing our economy. what we really should be talking about is the huge cost of inaction, and we're seeing that play out in the form of these devastating expensive and deadly storms. >> let's talk, ali, about what we're looking at right now because on one hand, it would look terrible, right, not to fund fema, if it needs the money after the summer after the year that we've seen, but as we keep seeing storm after storm after storm, could it get caught up in a political fight? >> yes, because when have we ever talked about a cooperative congress to use the phrase you used here. that's certainly something the white house is well awir of. they're sort of in this moment here where on the one hand, democrats in the first two years of the administration were able to pass the largest singular

climate investment through the inflation reduction act that does what your other guest is talking about here, which is take some preventative action, although many experts -- and i'm sure your guests might agree -- think that that preventative action is coming far too late to help anything on the climate change front. then of course you have the entire concept of climate change too still sort of up for debate on one side of the aisle here, specifically talking about republicans. so you've got president biden saying something like this, and then republicans debating it on stage at their debate last week. watch what the president said. >> i don't think anybody can deny the impact of the climate crisis anymore. just look around. historic floods. i mean, historic floods. more intense droughts, extreme heat, significant wildfires have caused significant damage. how can we not respond? my god. how can we not respond to these needs? and so i'm confident, even though there's a lot of talk from some of our friends up on

the hill about the costs, we got to do it. >> reporter: and so look, there's a few dynamics to watch for here, chris, as we head back into september with lawmakers finally coming back to town after august recess. we are watching republicans who are vying for the presidency basically questioning or trying to dodge on questions of is climate change real. we saw that on the debate stage in milwaukee. then you pitch forward to what might be happening in congress here. the biden administration is requesting more funding for things like fema and disaster preparedness and relief, but they're pairing it at this point with a request for ukraine aid. that's something that has been quite political in nature, many republicans here coming back to town ready to talk about cost and spending because the other thing that's looming in this conversation is the september 30th deadline to fund the government. i have to tell you, in my conversations with some more far right conservative house republicans, they are very willing to shut the government down over demands that they want

to see met by leadership to curb spending. they feel like in the last debt ceiling negotiation, they didn't get what they wanted. now they're going to use this as the next standoff. there is a comfortability there in shutting down the government. so all of this is put in the same swirling pot of spending talk and that does not necessarily bode well for what the president says should be a no-brainer, but actually might not be here on the hill. >> so michael, one of the things that you and i have talked about in the past is that economic argument to make that you just laid out so well, but even beyond that, beyond the insurance and the replacement costs, in your new book -- and you were kind of enough to send me an advanced copy -- you where something that just absolutely boggled my mind. you write about the number of deaths even beyond just the storms, quote, recent studies suggest that we are now experiencing as many as 5 million deaths a year from heat stress and other dangerous weather extremes. add in the additional 4 million deaths a year from air pollution, and that's 9 million,

and then you give the context. you say yearly that's nearly twice the total number of people who were killed by covid. you also stress there's still time to act. it's just a matter of how bad we're willing to let it get. if frequent death and destruction isn't doing it so far, michael, what's it going to take? >> well, you know, this is a question we're all asking, right? and as ali mentioned, you know, one of our two major parties appears to be in denial that the problem even exists, and i'll tell you, they are going to find themselves increasingly out of step with younger voters, including young republicans who overwhelmingly rank climate -- the climate crisis as one of the key issues because they know that they are going to inherit the legacy of the decisions we make today, whether or not we, you know, address this growing threat. and so any party that continues to deny what is now plainly

evident to anybody who's watching the television news, reading their headlines, scrolling through their social media, any party that continues to deny the obvious is going to lose a larger and larger portion of the public. and that may ultimately be the only thing that changes this dynamic. people showing up at the voting booth and voting on climate and voting out those, you know, politicians so beholden to the fossil fuel industry that they are acting on behalf of those special interests rather than the people they're supposed to represent. voting them out and voting in climate champions and climate advocates. so in the end, it comes down to the individual, individuals turning out and voting on climate. that's the only way we will see the sorts of policy changes that are necessary to avert this growing catastrophe. >> dr. michael mann, ali vitali, thank you both so much. up next, the reaction after

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today on capitol hill, growing concerns over the health of one of the most powerful political figures in the country, after senate minority leader mitch mcconnell froze and

was unable to speak for the second time this summer. >> what are your thoughts on running for re-election in 2026? >> thoughts about what? >> running for re-election in 2026. >> did you hear the question, senator, running for re-election in 2026? all right, i'm sorry, y'all, we're going to need a minute. >> it's difficult to watch, and it's raising serious questions about whether the 81-year-old kentucky republican can continue to meet the demands of his job at a critically important time. it's also setting up the possibility of a high stakes succession battle. nbc news reporting that mcconnell had phone conversations shortly after the incident with three senators who are most often named as his possible successors. david drucker is back with us. an aide later said, david, that senator mcconnell, quote, felt

fine but would be consulting a physician before his next event as a prudent measure. but what are you hearing? >> well, look, mcconnell keeps everything very close to the vest. it's not just personal issues. it's how he conducts himself politically in dealing with his conference. he prefers to be very quiet about things and let his members do the talking. he knows his members well, it's another reason he's lasted so long. i think the fact that he immediately mode phone calls to some of his closest lieutenants tells you everything you need to know about the seriousness of the health issues he has been dealing with and some of the concern that is bubbling up in the conference right now because of this. you know, i think it's important to understand that there really isn't any widespread unhappiness with his leadership. he was challenged earlier this year. he won easily, even though it was his first challenge in quite some time, there was really never any doubt he would be

reelected as the republican leader, and so he's always been in a good position there, but given his age and given his health issues and given that they appear to continue and not have subsided, i think it's probably -- i think what we are going to see is an increased discussion about this because one thing politicians don't like, they don't like even more than leaders they don't like is instability and the unknown, and so i think this is something mcconnell is going to have to address. >> let's remind people about his health problems. back in march, mcconnell fell at a fund-raising event, it sent him to the hospital with a concussion. "the new york times" reports since then he has had at least two more falls, which his office did not disclose. i mean, we're heading into budget talks. we were just talking about that with ali vitali. there are questions about whether house republicans will try to force a government shutdown. so what does happen if he's

struggling? when you talk about increased discussions, do those discussions include if they feel he's not in the health to be able to lead at this critical time? >> look, i think we'll know more after the senate returns from the august recess, and we're going to have to talk to senators and their top advisers and kind of get a sense about where everybody is. i think it's -- on the one hand, i think republicans would like to see mcconnell leave on his own terms. one, because he is a strong political leader and has been a bulwark of the conference over the years and especially for traditional republicans resisting the populist poll throughout the trump era, mcconnell is a traditional conservative, and he's very good at deal making and taking heat and shielding his members from blowback they would otherwise get. there's a lot that republicans will do that mcconnell will do

that republicans will grumble about publicly, but that privately they're very glad he did it, right? so once he moves on from the scene, you don't know that the next republican leader, whether it's senator john thune, senator john cornyn or somebody else is going to just simply be as good at this as he has been. i think they have a lot of respect for the man given how long he's been at the top and how successful he's been, but clearly when these things happen over and over again, you start to eventually hear from voters that are concerned and that usually will jump start a broader discussion. i think part of this is going to depend on what these senators are hearing at home. if this is the sort of issue you and i are talking about, not to say it doesn't matter because it clearly does. if it's something you and i are talking about but voters at home are preoccupied with other things, less pressures. when senators start to hear about this, it's going to be a

bigger deal. >> they certainly hear it about joe biden, i think they heard it about dianne feinstein. democratic congressman dean phillips wrote about this on x formerly known as twitter. for goodness sake, the family, friends, and staff of senators feinstein and mcconnell are doing them and our country a tremendous disservice. it's time for term limits for congress and the supreme court and some basic human decency. realistically, though, when you talk about, you know, these conversations, i'm assuming they're only about what to do about certain things on a case by case basis. have you heard of any conversations of term limits? >> term limits would require amending the constitution. that's not going to happen. i just don't think there's the political will in the structure of amending the constitution that would be required. don't forget too, it sounds good. i'm always on the losing end of this argument whether i'm talking to democrats or republicans, but the minute you put term limits on members serving in the house or senate, there are some people that

aren't term limited. staff and lobbyists, nobody's going to be happy with that. we've seen term limits in certain states and you end up with more -- who don't have the political will to stand up to a president or governor, i don't think we're going to have anything more than some complaining around the edges on this. >> david drucker, good to have you on the program, nice to see you. coming up, tropical storm idalia still churning in the carolinas, the ongoing threats of heavy rain, river surges and flash flooding. we'll have a live report. you're watching "chris jansing reports" only on msnbc. watching reports" only on msnbc but with prilosec otc just one pill a day blocks heartburn for a full 24 hours. for one and done heartburn relief, prilosec otc. one pill a day, 24 hours, zero heartburn. have fun, sis! ♪♪

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. we have some breaking news in the fulton county case, literally just handed to me, that after signaling in previous filings that this is something that could happen, president trump's lawyers have officially filed to sever his case from the 18 other defendants. their argument, what we've heard from the few others who have also said that they want to do this, they don't have enough time to properly prepare a defense by october 23rd. this sets up an interesting situation because you have people who want a fast trial, they're entitled to that, and the group who want to wait. so we're going to continue to follow that. again, expected, but it's important for us to say that it has now been filed officially.

meantime, the death toll is increasing from tropical storm i idalia, up to three, two in florida, one in georgia. north carolina is feeling the brunt of the storm. we're already seeing damage there. this animal hospital just outside wilmington lost its roof overnight. nbc's julia ainsley is in morehead city, north carolina, which is two hours up the coast from wilmington. what's it like on the ground there? >> reporter: it's windy, chris, a lot of rain still moving through here as we say good-bye to tropical storm idalia. she heads out to sea here. now, this area and most of the carolinas are still under a tropical storm warning. schools are closed all the way as far west as raleigh. you can see you just keep having these bands come through here one after the other as we see the remnants of this storm. what they were worried about is a storm surge.

that's something they were warned about. they were told to stay off the roads in places like morehead city last night, but they were spared in large part because the high tide did not coincide with the heaviest rainfall. so they think that they've really moved past the fear of a lot of heavy flooding in areas like this. i'm told there is some localized flooding between here and wilmington and some of the low lying areas. by and large, it could have been much worse here. still about 50,000 people are without power throughout north and south carolina, but crews were able to get to those places more easily than they could in some parts of florida because the damage wasn't so bad, chris. right now they've kind of gotten past the worst of this storm, we're seeing the end of it. by tonight it should be relatively calm. >> julia ainsley, thank you so much for the update. we appreciate it. and coming up, the latest on the deadly fire that burned through a johannesburg apartment building overnight, killing dozens of people, details on what might have started that blaze. plus, the biden

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homeless people overnight. among the victims, at least a dozen children. nbc's matt bradley joins us now. this tragedy is shining a light on a housing crisis in that city. what more can you tell us about what happened? >> yeah, housing crisis among other other crises. this fire, chris, is likely to become an indictment of the state of downtown johannesburg, and south africa. this is one of some 700 quote, hijacked buildings. that's what authorities called them, right in the center of the city's commercial district. this used to be a buzzing area in what is still the richest city in africa. but south africa's economy has been decreasing, and companies that once inhabited these offices spaces have left. at the same time, there's been a huge influx over undocumented migrants in the past decades, that's caused buildings like this one to become so overcrowded. we are hearing from government officials urging their own governments to take action to

stop these actions from happening in the fear. here's what he said. >> it's a wake up call for us to begin to address the situation of housing in the inner city, that a building like this, which i'm told used to be a home for abused women and children, at least it expired, it was then hi jacked. >> the fact that, chris, there was so many homeless people there meant that the entire building was a living areas for squatters, and that's why it's been so difficult for rescue workers. the building, it just hadn't been maintained. it had been abandoned, so the fire escapes, the fire exits, they were no longer functioning. doors had been blocked. nobody knows how the fire started. the building is off the electrical and gas grids, perhaps people were cooking or heating for themselves or their open fires, and that might have

set off this terrible blaze, chris. >> the idea that people are throwing their children out of windows is too horrific to even consider. matt bradley, thank you for that. still ahead, the controversial reason one houston school district is eliminating dozens of school librarians and why some families are calling it a hostile takeover and fighting back. you're watching "chris jansing reports" only on msnbc. you're watching "chris jansing report os"nly on msnbc (ella) fashion moves fast. setting trends is our business. we need to scale with customer demand... ...in real time. (jen) so we partner with verizon to take our operations to the next level. (marquis) with a custom private 5g network. (ella) with verizon business, we get more control of production, efficiencies, and greater agility. (marquis) so our customers get what they want, when they want it. (jen) it's not just a network. it's enterprise intelligence. (vo) learn more. it's your vision, it's your verizon. my frequent heartburn had me taking antacid after antacid all day long but with prilosec otc just one pill a day blocks heartburn for a full 24 hours.

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today angry parents say

there has been a hostile takeover in one of the nation's largest school districts. it's happening in houston where the state of texas has brought in new school leaders with a plan that includes turning libraries into spaces for students who act out. nbc's antonia hylton reports. cherries, blueberries. >> houston mom, jessica campos has spent the entire summer dreading the return to school. >> i feel like i have spent my entire summer fighting. coming here, it kind of, i can breathe. >> ever since her daughter's elementary became one of more than 28 schools in the houston independent school district replacing their library with a center for work and discipline. what's happening to the houston schools? >> it feels like they're being taken apart, dismantled, destroyed. >> reporter: this summer, the state of texas took over hisd, a district of almost 200,000 kids,

a blue city in a red state. they replaced the elected school board members and swapped the superintendent for a charter school owner and former leader of dallas schools. some like houston mayor sylvester turner say it's a hostile takeover. >> let's not be fooled. >> reporter: everyone agrees houston schools needed to change. some were failing. many students fell behind in reading and math. district leaders tried to improve and the state even gave him a b rating in 2022, they took over anyway, and took over libraries in some schools. >> i can't afford a laptop for my kid. books is where we get to travel, you know, to dream. >> reporter: jessica's daughter sophie is starting 5th grade at one of the new education system schools. >> i barely know how to read. i just started reading this

grade because my english teacher helped me a lot. >> reporter: she says the library was a place where she could practice. superintendent mike miles understands families are anxious about change, but he argues books will be available on shelves, and this team centers will help kids like sophie catch up. >> reporter: in a district where there are so many kids who are struggling to read, why disrupt the library of all places? >> so reading is key. we may not have librarians, but even in this room, books are on the shelves. >> reporter: do you believe librarians are important? >> every single position has value. we can't be all things to all people, and we can't have everything we want. >> reporter: so does that mean you're robbing peter to pay paul? >> no, i mean, i wouldn't phrase it that way. what i would say is we're

putting in a bold, different model that works. >> reporter: jessica campos considered bussing sophie to another school, away from her neighborhood and friends. >> i'm not going to do that. because i'm not going to leave those kids there. >> reporter: she says parents aren't going to let their school change without a fight. antonia hylton, nbc news, houston, texas. we have a lot to cover in our second hour of "chris jansing reports." let's get right to it. at this hour, that breaking news. donald trump pleads not guilty in georgia and files to sever his case from 18 other codefendants, a look at what's next in the time line. judgment day for two leaders of the proud boys, the first sentences in, and it's one of the longest of any january 6th case so far. the long clean up from idalia'ser